I like the maintenance job on the Proto Elite 194, I have Gp -7’s, SD 50’s & BL-2’sin Proto series that definitely need a good going over, thanks for the great tips.👍. 👋😎🛤🚂
Well explained. I've also had to replace the gears before and the small hole to reduce the pressure is a good idea. What primer did you use for the bogies and the weight? In which video do they throw out the weight and glue lead into the shell, I'd like to see that. Thank you!
I like Ace Hardware ruststop primer for everything because its super easy to paint over! We are coming up on a video where I'm using lead in a Blue Box Trainmaster to shim the motor. I can't think off hand about which one I did where I got rid of the weights and used just lead, but it's in the library somewhere! I think about 3-4 videos from now is where the motor gets lead weight. The next 2 videos are uploading now and then we'll mount the motor using lead!
it is the same as the 2 part video I did on March 3, 2023 for the Proto 2000 SD60 - you can see the things you need to do to remove the shell and where the tabs and screws are located!
I also have a GP 18 here now, same problem... The blue cable that was attached to the weight is no longer attached? That was only for earthing the weight, wasn't it?
Great content! Thank you so much for putting these videos out. I have a question, what are you using to power the motor when it's not connected or wired to anything? Is this just a dc pack with some alligator clips on the end?
I have a Tech 2 under the work bench and a bench top power supply along side the work bench. When I do those motor testing videos and show the amp draw - that's the bench power supply.
Looks like I have some work to do to pmcs some running gear. I bet the increase in temperature during heavy operation, is what cause the trapped air to expand enough to split the gear.
yes DA 2404 PMCS - what I really think is that the tiny bit of air pressure over time bursts the axle. You can't just keep that pressure forever. Even if you never run it, that pressure is still going to find a way out. Somewhere back a few videos, I compared these axles to an old Athearn axle and found that the old axles have a tiny notch that lets out the pressure and these axles don't have that. So someone just copied the axles and didn't make a notch. Since I started making the tiny holes I've noticed that the test models have had no further problems, but that's less than 1 year so it may not be proof yet. Using the Tacky Glue, I have had no problems at all and this locomotive is one of the most used engines on my layout.
@@elite194 very well could be a time issue. I just figured with brass friction bearings and loss of lube, the compressed air becomes super compressed when it warms up. Either way, it's still probably good practice to make a relief hole. Like stopping a crack in metal by drilling it before you repair the weld.
yes, I haven't done any tests for heat, but I should put the circle back into operation and see what happens after 12 hour of continuous running... that could be very interesting
I've bought a lot of lightly used or NOS proto locomotives the last couple years. I only have a very short test track as I haven't begun my layout yet. But for as old as all of them are, I've only run I to a few with cracked gears, usually the more used ones. That said, I did just come into some very nice white pine and red pine logs I've started milling with my chain saw. Should finally be able to start in on my bench work soon. Going heavy duty, timber legs and a waney (live edge) facia.
I am 100% for using huge logs as legs for benchwork. I use 4x4 because they are cheap here. But if you got access to logs, use them for sure!! Heavier legs allow for less annoying braces all over the place. When you see people with tiny legs and spider web braces - good indication that they have an academic engineering background without real world experience! So for all those people who read this who are armchair engineers - ball busting is a legit method of training, Bigger benchwork legs allow longer spans without a bunch of craziness supporting, dust collecting, spider hosting business going on... log legs are the highest form of excellence!
I did not follow your reasoning in regards to the motor not running. I have installed these and other trucks countless times (backwards) as well and all it ever did was drive the locomotive in the opposite direction of normal operation. Not once have I ever encountered a motor that completely stopped running after reversing the trucks as these motors are bi-directional and will turn in the direction the polarity dictates. Yet, it seems to me that you returned to the same polarity as you were attempting to correct by crisscrossing the wires after re-installation of the trucks and the locomotive ran very well. Did I miss something?
yes the frame and motor setup on this are the same from the GP7 which is long hood forward and for some reason the frame itself has has an opening for the long arm on the trucks that is not centered and is too small to just turn the trucks around. When the trucks on these are turned the other way you get a hard short where the spring steel on the gear tower is in contact with the frame. So I did a bunch of milling and coating with liquid electrical tape to fix all the shorts. Then with the trucks oriented the direction for short hood forward, the motor is facing backwards so that's why the wires are crossed. The frame is a terrible design with openings much too small. If all the openings were uniform, you could just swap trucks around for either long hood or short hood forward with no hassle.
I noticed something else present in the before pictures I took... there was a wire that was connected to the bottom that came from the wrong side. I hadn't noticed this when first looking and I simply disassembled it once I doubled checked to see if it would run. I did confirm against the old video and pictures of the GP7 with long hood forward that they are identical. It's this OCD about having the arms facing away from me when oriented to the right that causes such extensive extra work!
@@elite194 Just consider the OCD part of your determination to achieve a better running locomotive. I own two GP18's in BN livery myself. I have run them extensively without shorting issues. I looked at one to see if the problem could be recreated but no success. Perhaps I just got lucky.
I picked up 2 more GP18s 1 GP7 1 RS2 and 1 GP30 at the train show and all of them had a shorting problem so the club that was selling them gave me the lot for about $40. All they kept were the motors and axles. I've noticed a few times that the red wire arm has been in contact with the black wire arm and that was due to loose rivets.
I don’t understand why you skipped the wiring of the engine? Did you reverse one truck for opposite rail pickup? How did you solder onto terminals? Solder onto the board??
I think I did that because I was also doing the special on the SD40T-2 and I had just finished a GP9 - the unusual thing about this one was that it came from a club where they couldn't figure out why it didn't work. someone turned around the trucks and shorted it. A few months earlier than this one is an SD7 in the 5 locomotives in 30 days playlist that shows how I wired the proto2000. In this one, what I did was rebuilt it just like an Athearn Blue Box and then I brought all the wires to the top where I put a copper clad pc board. because its a DC locomotive, to get it to move in the direction that was indicated on the shell by the letter F, I swapped the wires to the motor on that pc board. That way if anyone wanted to change it back , they could just put the red and black wires on the same sides as the other red and black wires.
it was by examining the old Athearn axles that I found the defect and through numerous repairs that I finally figured out how to release the pressure. But, I always try to show a way that doesn't cost you money.... so we had to figure out how to solve the problem!
That’s a pretty poor job on the brushes how can you stick that pathetic little bit in and call it good after doing so much work to the rest of it shame on you
I know! I could have put in a new one, but I normally replace the whole motor with a better motor. I did that just to show it was possible, that doesn't mean it's recommended!!
I like the maintenance job on the Proto Elite 194, I have Gp -7’s, SD 50’s & BL-2’sin Proto series that definitely need a good going over, thanks for the great tips.👍. 👋😎🛤🚂
SD50!! I knew there was a project I was forgetting - time to make another GIANT
elite194 👍go for it, interesting to see for sure! 😎
You do EXCELLENT Work.
thank you! I hope you enjoy your rebuilds as much as I like making them!
Well explained. I've also had to replace the gears before and the small hole to reduce the pressure is a good idea.
What primer did you use for the bogies and the weight?
In which video do they throw out the weight and glue lead into the shell, I'd like to see that. Thank you!
I like Ace Hardware ruststop primer for everything because its super easy to paint over! We are coming up on a video where I'm using lead in a Blue Box Trainmaster to shim the motor. I can't think off hand about which one I did where I got rid of the weights and used just lead, but it's in the library somewhere! I think about 3-4 videos from now is where the motor gets lead weight. The next 2 videos are uploading now and then we'll mount the motor using lead!
@@elite194 Thanks very much!
Wow nice upload you put together. Hope there more to come soon.
there's a huge supply of more stuff to fix!
@@elite194 Great and thanks very much for replying to my comment. Have a Great Christmas and Happy New year. Take Care & Stay Safe.
this year's xmas special is probably going to be a dual motor Golden Eagle Super C630 with DCC, should be pretty cool I think
@@elite194 Sound's great
Please show remove and install of outer body shell.
it is the same as the 2 part video I did on March 3, 2023 for the Proto 2000 SD60 - you can see the things you need to do to remove the shell and where the tabs and screws are located!
@@elite194 thanks!
I also have a GP 18 here now, same problem...
The blue cable that was attached to the weight is no longer attached? That was only for earthing the weight, wasn't it?
Seems to me it was part of the lighting system which I always remove!
@@elite194 why do you remove the lights?
@@jurgenihlau4052 I replace all the lights with LED and SMD instead of the old ones!
Great content! Thank you so much for putting these videos out. I have a question, what are you using to power the motor when it's not connected or wired to anything? Is this just a dc pack with some alligator clips on the end?
I have a Tech 2 under the work bench and a bench top power supply along side the work bench. When I do those motor testing videos and show the amp draw - that's the bench power supply.
Looks like I have some work to do to pmcs some running gear. I bet the increase in temperature during heavy operation, is what cause the trapped air to expand enough to split the gear.
yes DA 2404 PMCS - what I really think is that the tiny bit of air pressure over time bursts the axle. You can't just keep that pressure forever. Even if you never run it, that pressure is still going to find a way out. Somewhere back a few videos, I compared these axles to an old Athearn axle and found that the old axles have a tiny notch that lets out the pressure and these axles don't have that. So someone just copied the axles and didn't make a notch. Since I started making the tiny holes I've noticed that the test models have had no further problems, but that's less than 1 year so it may not be proof yet. Using the Tacky Glue, I have had no problems at all and this locomotive is one of the most used engines on my layout.
@@elite194 very well could be a time issue. I just figured with brass friction bearings and loss of lube, the compressed air becomes super compressed when it warms up. Either way, it's still probably good practice to make a relief hole. Like stopping a crack in metal by drilling it before you repair the weld.
yes, I haven't done any tests for heat, but I should put the circle back into operation and see what happens after 12 hour of continuous running... that could be very interesting
I've bought a lot of lightly used or NOS proto locomotives the last couple years. I only have a very short test track as I haven't begun my layout yet. But for as old as all of them are, I've only run I to a few with cracked gears, usually the more used ones.
That said, I did just come into some very nice white pine and red pine logs I've started milling with my chain saw. Should finally be able to start in on my bench work soon. Going heavy duty, timber legs and a waney (live edge) facia.
I am 100% for using huge logs as legs for benchwork. I use 4x4 because they are cheap here. But if you got access to logs, use them for sure!! Heavier legs allow for less annoying braces all over the place. When you see people with tiny legs and spider web braces - good indication that they have an academic engineering background without real world experience! So for all those people who read this who are armchair engineers - ball busting is a legit method of training, Bigger benchwork legs allow longer spans without a bunch of craziness supporting, dust collecting, spider hosting business going on... log legs are the highest form of excellence!
I did not follow your reasoning in regards to the motor not running. I have installed these and other trucks countless times (backwards) as well and all it ever did was drive the locomotive in the opposite direction of normal operation. Not once have I ever encountered a motor that completely stopped running after reversing the trucks as these motors are bi-directional and will turn in the direction the polarity dictates. Yet, it seems to me that you returned to the same polarity as you were attempting to correct by crisscrossing the wires after re-installation of the trucks and the locomotive ran very well. Did I miss something?
yes the frame and motor setup on this are the same from the GP7 which is long hood forward and for some reason the frame itself has has an opening for the long arm on the trucks that is not centered and is too small to just turn the trucks around. When the trucks on these are turned the other way you get a hard short where the spring steel on the gear tower is in contact with the frame. So I did a bunch of milling and coating with liquid electrical tape to fix all the shorts. Then with the trucks oriented the direction for short hood forward, the motor is facing backwards so that's why the wires are crossed. The frame is a terrible design with openings much too small. If all the openings were uniform, you could just swap trucks around for either long hood or short hood forward with no hassle.
I noticed something else present in the before pictures I took... there was a wire that was connected to the bottom that came from the wrong side. I hadn't noticed this when first looking and I simply disassembled it once I doubled checked to see if it would run. I did confirm against the old video and pictures of the GP7 with long hood forward that they are identical. It's this OCD about having the arms facing away from me when oriented to the right that causes such extensive extra work!
@@elite194 Just consider the OCD part of your determination to achieve a better running locomotive. I own two GP18's in BN livery myself. I have run them extensively without shorting issues. I looked at one to see if the problem could be recreated but no success. Perhaps I just got lucky.
I picked up 2 more GP18s 1 GP7 1 RS2 and 1 GP30 at the train show and all of them had a shorting problem so the club that was selling them gave me the lot for about $40. All they kept were the motors and axles. I've noticed a few times that the red wire arm has been in contact with the black wire arm and that was due to loose rivets.
I don’t understand why you skipped the wiring of the engine? Did you reverse one truck for opposite rail pickup? How did you solder onto terminals? Solder onto the board??
I think I did that because I was also doing the special on the SD40T-2 and I had just finished a GP9 - the unusual thing about this one was that it came from a club where they couldn't figure out why it didn't work. someone turned around the trucks and shorted it. A few months earlier than this one is an SD7 in the 5 locomotives in 30 days playlist that shows how I wired the proto2000. In this one, what I did was rebuilt it just like an Athearn Blue Box and then I brought all the wires to the top where I put a copper clad pc board. because its a DC locomotive, to get it to move in the direction that was indicated on the shell by the letter F, I swapped the wires to the motor on that pc board. That way if anyone wanted to change it back , they could just put the red and black wires on the same sides as the other red and black wires.
I am curious about what you use for cleaning solution in your ultrasonic cleaner.
I get Mean Green from Menards in gallons for about $5 - cheaper than Simple Green and has no odor
I’d rather use athearn axles instead of going through all that work for repair
it was by examining the old Athearn axles that I found the defect and through numerous repairs that I finally figured out how to release the pressure. But, I always try to show a way that doesn't cost you money.... so we had to figure out how to solve the problem!
That’s a pretty poor job on the brushes how can you stick that pathetic little bit in and call it good after doing so much work to the rest of it shame on you
I know! I could have put in a new one, but I normally replace the whole motor with a better motor. I did that just to show it was possible, that doesn't mean it's recommended!!