That's a good theory, and fits in a bit with The Traveler's statements in "Where No One Has Gone Before". Just as long as it isn't interpreted in such a way that the power of love is actually what holds the galaxy together or something.
@@bjorn00000 didn't it physically destroy their ship and they had to use spacemagic to reinforce the enterprise to pass through? Idk tos was all over the place plot wise that episode felt like they included the "love" barrier because half way through writing about beings from another galaxy they realized they wrote in an impenetrable barrier in season 1 and had to figure something out lol also want to add the entire theme of tos is love conquers all it's their solution when facing any superior being showing them that the loss of compassion is the negative trade off to power. Star trek has always been about space hippies don't doubt the love barrier idea lol
did you ever notice that more often than not the phenomenon that seemed to be most able to cause their high technology damage or to be unusable (all based on the "standard model" we are all taught) is/was electromagnetic in nature?
All Star Trek techno babble and plot McGuffins aside, there actually probably is the galactic version of our own Solar system's termination shock. The region where all the stellar matter ejected by all the stars in the Milky way meet all the stellar matter pushing in from the universe all around. The bubbles shown in Discovery (though extremely exaggerated) are also based in real science, voyager 2 has passed through several floating in what astrophysicists are calling "magnetic foam".
My head canon is that it was created by ancient civilizations to keep out the intergalactic super-intelligent AIs responsible for both V'Ger and the more recent second season of Discovery and first season of Picard; it contains elements designed to augment the minds of organic beings passing through it, so that they can withstand encounters with the otherwise vastly superior entities outside the Milky Way that have formed a type 3+ civilization but still haven't gotten over issues with organic life forms.
All Star Trek techno babble and plot McGuffins aside, there actually probably is the galactic version of our own Solar system's termination shock. The region where all the stellar matter ejected by all the stars in the Milky way meet all the stellar matter pushing in from the universe all around. The bubbles shown in Discovery (though extremely exaggerated) are also based in real science, voyager 2 has passed through several floating in what astrophysicists are calling "magnetic foam".
@@dabrams84 This is a great video on our fleet of probes used to monitor solar wind and earth magnetic field interactions, plus the Heliopause and Terminations shock: th-cam.com/video/1oDUN74yzuo/w-d-xo.html
Another piece of trivia is that "The Star Gazer" actually has a commemorative plaque in the background that suggests Uhura was the captain of an exploratory mission to the Small Magellanic Cloud (which would require a crossing of the barrier). This would actually not make that much sense, as the SMC is about 200,000 light years away and would involve crossing a huge void, but it's an interesting tidbit. However, that extreme distance is why it probably wasn't covered in TNG/DS9/Voyager. Simply put, under current canon the trip would be impractical, and it wouldn't have really mattered if there was a barrier there. Even without intergalactic threats or a dangerous interface that turned you into a god, extragalactic space would have few or no accessible stars, meaning that refueling would be challenging and there would be few planets available for supplies or support. There's also probably not that much to explore either with crewed vessels. It would be like an ocean voyage in a rowboat. My take on the science has been that the galactic barrier seems very equivalent to the termination shock at the edge of our solar system (and others) or even just surface tension at the interface of two different types of liquids. However, what's been missing from that explanation is that if the galactic barrier is really just a natural interface between intra- and extragalactic space, there must be some fundamental differences in space outside of the galaxy to cause that interface. That wasn't really discussed in "By Any Other Name" or "The Galactic Barrier"/"Rosetta", but would be an important piece of context.
I mean, it's only really extreme distance in canon if it really is only around the rim of the galaxy, but that doesn't make any sense fundamentally regardless of its origin. The Star Charts explanation is really the only thing that makes any sense irrespective of what was literally stated, since there isn't any reason the Kelvans would have approached _or_ departed along the galactic plane. If they were leaving the Milky Way for Andromeda starting from somewhere within a few hundred light years of Earth in a straight line, they wouldn't be leaving anywhere near the rim of the Milky Way. And even if they were, they were talking about a travel time measured in hundreds of millennia; taking a few years to go up and around the barrier would be nothing. Edit: Oh, I'm dumb; I just realized you didn't mean the extreme distance _to the galactic rim,_ you meant the extreme distance _to another galaxy._ Whoops, sorry about that. :P
bjornooo I'm glad you put in the statement "My take on the science has been that the galactic barrier seems very equivalent to the termination shock at the edge of our solar system (and others) " Is it possible things will change when we enter ...... I don't know what to call it. When our ships crossed into interstellar space, we received a surprised. (Sorry I don't have enough information or knowledge to do this topic justice) You have brought up a number of points on this. I hope others hop in and add to your observations. I know it won't be cannon but it would be a wonderful excersie in attempting to interpret the universe.
Travel to other galaxies might be feasible if there is a naturally occurring traversable wormhole with one end in our galaxy and the other end in the other galaxy. Perhaps Captain Uhura's exploratory mission to the Small Magellanic Cloud was via such a wormhole. If so, then the mission would not have required crossing the galactic barrier. In 1995, a theory was proposed that suggested there may be many wormholes in the universe if cosmic strings with negative mass were generated in the early universe since if a tiny wormhole held open by a negative mass cosmic string had appeared around the time of the Big Bang, it could have been inflated to macroscopic size by cosmic inflation. In the article Morris, Michael S.; Thorne, Kip S.; Yurtsever, Ulvi (1988). "Wormholes, Time Machines, and the Weak Energy Condition" Physical Review Letters. 61 (13): 1446-1449. Bibcode:1988PhRvL..61.1446M , and subsequent work by others, it was shown that negative matter could be used to stabilize a wormhole. Cramer et al. argue that such wormholes might have been created in the early universe, stabilized by negative-mass loops of cosmic string. [John G. Cramer; Robert L. Forward; Michael S. Morris; Matt Visser; Gregory Benford & Geoffrey A. Landis (1995). "Natural Wormholes as Gravitational Lenses". Physical Review D. 51 (6): 3117-3120. arXiv:astro-ph/9409051.] In the Star Trek TNG episode "The Loss," the USS Enterprise-D was nearly destroyed after an encounter with a cosmic string fragment 107 kilometers in length. So macroscopic cosmic strings are consistent with Star Trek canon.
I think its a fine plot device if handled properly. The fact that it was pretty much not mentioned in the later series is curious. I like the idea that the 'Q' made it to protect something from something else. However, its not something I have never found to be a problem, and having something unexplained by science in the show is sort of satisfying. Maybe one could argue that the Q put it in place to be a final test for humanity in the universe. It could, ultimately be used as a goal post device, where if the federation can prove its peaceful intent within the galaxy, then it earns the privilege of expanding its message outside of the galaxy, in a few thousand years, and people getting ESPer powers is an indication of what will be needed in other parts of the universe, when they are ready... sort of like a galactic leaving home... Or some other plot device. Either way I don't mind it at all.
I know exposure to the barrier can awaken psionic abilities in humans with a high esper rating. Humans in star trek have psychic potential but lack the neural structure to use them.
@@john.premose no, its sci fi myth. Its myth, and can be anything the writers want, as shown by decades of contradictory writing. Sounds a bit like its a sacred thing to you?
@@maarkaus48 not if it wants to have any credibility. The Q might portray themselves as “gods” but it’s to the credit of captain Picard and the other crew that they dismiss that entirely. The idea of the Q “creating” parts of the galaxy is like some kind of myth which is not scientific at all
@@john.premose Very little about star trek is really scientific at the end of the day. Some of it is grounded, but much of it is science fantasy. I love the show, at least up to the Rick Berman years, and especially the TOS as its called, but I can recognize that its largely a fantasy or modern myth. And myth can be something to inspire, not explain. Science explains, myths inspire. There can be room for both. As for the barrier, I don't mind it, and that was my point. Its part of the canon now, and so there it is. I have had many issues with things from TNG and later Star Trek, but if its set as canon, then so be it... until the writers decide its not again. Star Trek Voyager, for example has had many moments of near death experiences for Janeway. Weird evolutionary salamander moments, and many other things that were not thrown out later, and so are canon... as much as its cringe. I don't care that much about the barrier, if 'Q' invented it, or if they just claimed it to promote themselves, or if its completely natural. Its a plot device first, explanation second. Star Trek is modern myth, and at times not very well done, because of many writers. That is fine, because its entertainment which is meant to provoke the mind and challenge us to reflect, and that it does well. I have real issues with some of Voyager, but love the series as a whole.
A short trip just up or down relative to the galactic plane get you to the barrier. Meaning it’s even closer to Earth than, say, Vulcan. So I’m surprised we don’t hear about it more often in the series.
The galactic barrier up-or-down is still much farther than Vulcan. Vulcan is 16 light-years away, the galactic barrier would be at least 500 to 1000 light-years.
Yes, I thought the same thing until I realized the Barrier was like a squished bubble enveloping the entire galaxy, and that it's just thicker along the edges which it why you can see it more clearly from there.
The idea that the barrier is thinner above and below the galactic plane than the full extent at the rim reminds me of the trajectory that Apollo missions took to avoid the most intense regions of the Van Allen Belts on their way to the Moon.
Ironically that's the argument the moon landing deniers use to say why we couldn't go to the moon. The belt would cook humans. They don't know Apollo went through the thinnest part at high speed.
My brother subbed right away after I showed him a Mass Effect video of yours He was surprised by the level of lore knowledge To which I was like, Yeah he knows his shit 🙄
I was thinking about the plot hole in ST V about galactic center just being near. They should've added some kind of wormhole that appears at the long time interval, 10.000 years maybe. They could added a bit of character development about Spock's and Sybok's past, his rebellion against teaching of Surak about pure logic and against abstract. That makes him finding some Vulcan scrolls in forbidden part of the library, a history about light that appears every 10.000 years in some constellation. As wormhole opens it carries a message and visions about Sha Ka Ree. Then he travels on other worlds find some clues, but finds out that those worlds with telepathically sensitive species have more conclusive and clearer clues like same descriptions of messages, visions and map of same constellation of stars where bright wormhole appears. Then Sybok calculated and found time is near for wormhole to appear. When it appeared Sybok got the visions, but the God told him he needs a powerful ship to get through the barrier. He needed a Starfleet grade ship. It would explain why Sybok was in such a hurry to get a fast flagship, why they were able to fast travel to the center of the Galaxy and find God. Also I would add Spock's wits to pull out history facts how 10.000 ago years some civilizations near wormhole waged religious wars that led their civilizations near or to total extinction. It could show that Entity of Sha Ka Ree is total chaos, and if his mere presence could destroy civilizations through manipulating minds, driving basic instincts to the surface, his freedom would be devastating to entire Galaxy.
@@robertcampbell6349 it was weird as hell, but very much a send-off of the old series. Where else but old fashioned Star Trek would you go to the center of the galaxy to fight god?
@@tsm688 in spite of its many flaws, i see three major qualities about Star Trek V: (1) the "fighting god" plot, or as Bones put it, "ask the Almighty for His ID". That someone (just why is it Kirk alone) at last did question that being feels like a satisfaction for me. (2) another thing i like is how the movie dives into the rich and intimate kirk-spock-mccoy friendship (just why did the rest of the crew not get so much nuance, too). (3) also we get the important psycho-philosophical lesson that you should not get rid of your painful memories but carry them. When Kirk declines Sybok's brainwashing tricks, he rightfully points out that our shortcomings make us who we are.
If I remember correctly, the barrier was used in ST 5 The Final Frontier. Since humans have not traveled to space, we cannot say for certainty if the barrier actually exists. Unless the Voyager probes have left the milky way.
I always felt the character reaction to the barrier is that it was an unexplained/unexpected phenomena that shouldn't be there. Like it was placed there by some force to keep something in or to keep something out. Maybe like many mature races were fearful of young races first starting out on inter-planetary travel. Maybe the barrier is aimed at races just starting out on intergalactic travel. It did work like this for the Kelvins.
It's been a long time since I read it, but if I remember correctly, the TNG book trilogy called the Continuum states that it is basically a prison for a powerful being
I dig the galactic barrier, kinda old god vibes. I'd love to see the results of a galaxy without it through andromeda refugees or something. Like the dark forest is legit and our galaxy is surprisingly peaceful.
Should be noted too by the 26th century starfleet would develop a highly advanced transwarp that would alow them to travel beyond the milkyway and bypass the barrier without issue that's why ships like enterprise j were so massive to house the new warp core and alow comfortable travel during the extended exploration missions
This is a very interesting subject. It can be wacky if the subject of the galactic barrier is not approached right. It is fascinating to think that it was made, rather than a natural phenomena.there is a lot of thought, and research goes into these videos.I really enjoy these videos.
All Star Trek techno babble and plot McGuffins aside, there actually probably is the galactic version of our own Solar system's termination shock. The region where all the stellar matter ejected by all the stars in the Milky way meet all the stellar matter pushing in from the universe all around. The bubbles shown in Discovery (though extremely exaggerated) are also based in real science, voyager 2 has passed through several floating in what astrophysicists are calling "magnetic foam".
You did a great job of explaining a dificult subject. This is the kind of thing that makes your channel stand out and makes it worth subscribing to. Thanks.
The toroidal shape of the Great Barrier also explains why its at the center of the galaxy (in Star Trek V) as well as at the edge of the galaxy in the TOS episodes. I've heard before that there were two Great Barriers but, this makes a lot more sense. There's also some weird apocrypha about the "God" being found at the center of the Galaxy in Star Trek V. Though a lot of people probably don't like or like to think much about Star Trek V. It also seems like the Enterprise travelled a rather long distance to get there in that movie in too short a time. The whole psionic "esper" thing is a little silly. But its a sci fi thing I guess and there are telepaths and empaths across the ST universe. Though there being human "espers" is just kind of dropped. There is a running theme of people encountering the Great Barrier and surviving it developing grand delusions in addition to their mental powers and thinking they're like gods. Sybok was drawn to the barrier and developed his delusions for some reason before encountering it. The creature at the center may have something to do with all this. Maybe it was mentally influencing Sybok and trying to draw him, someone or anyone really, in to be useful in its plans. There are also the Venturi from the game Starfleet Academy, who go from being kind of generic pirates to a weird religious cult when their leader encounters the Barrier. Though Starfleet Academy is itself not canon and the story is part of an Academy simulation even within the game's universe itself.
Don't worry I have subscribed, started watching your videos yesterday, and watched 3 videos in a row and then subscribed this morning watching my 4th video.
There are two Barriers, the Galactic Barrier "Where No Man Has Gone Before," and the Great Barrier "Star Trek: The Final Frontier." The Galactic Barrier encircles the Milky Way galaxy completely and is a pinkish purple color, while the Great Barrier encircles the Galactic core and is a bluish white color. The Great Barrier was clearly made to imprison the God-like entity, but the Galactic Barrier was either made to keep us in or something out.
I don’t often quote Men in Black but in it, Kay said “Human thought is so primitive it's looked upon as an infectious disease by the rest of the universe.” There could be something to that! 😂
In one of the Star Trek novels Q accidently opened a portal to an other universe. Several powerfull beings crossover. One of them is the "God" from the Star Trek movie "Final Frontier" and one called "Zero". It takes the Q's a lot of power too defeat this beings. The "God" is improsent and "Zero" is cast out of the Milkyway. Because Zero cann't travel faster than the speed of light a barrier was created too keep him out of your Milkyway for thousends/millions of years.
I wonder if our galaxy doesn't have a Dark Energy barrier. A point outside the galaxy in which the effects of galactic gravity shrinks so low that Dark Energy effects over whelm gravity.
There is a book that describes the barrier as a means of keeping a rogue Q out. Along with the head of another rogue placed in the middle of the galaxy at Sha Ka Ree needing help getting back into the galaxy so he could heal and cause mayhem again.
I like the idea of it. It is a mystery to solve, an obstacle to overcome and a frontier to explore. It also helps contain story telling to the local galactic scene. It would be quicker to travel to the next closest galaxy at TNG era speeds than it would to travel from Ocampa to the alpha quadrant.
Real world: There was a "barrier" that voyager passed through. Cosmic "stuff" being pushed ahead of our planetary system. So why wouldn't the galaxy have the same. A sort of space wake and bulge in space time. Like a boat pushing water in front and behind.
I always liked the Star Trek X-men crossover that tied it in with the Phoenix force. To be honest I figure it only exists so both Doctor McCoys could respond to the same question.
@@josephgauthreaux8926 Ya it was an extra-dimensional being that Q actually brought into our galaxy and he destroyed a major empire; which could not go unanswered and he had 2 entities that he brought with him. They trapped one at the centre of the galaxy as well and destroyed his body hence the giant head in Star Trek V
@@josephgauthreaux8926 That's true. I only remember because I read these books last year, but ya Q created it by accident. He was also responsible for a huge planetary body colliding with Earth which caused the formation of the moon--as a punishment for that he was charged with overseeing all life on Earth for the enture history of the planet 😂 The battles the Q had with 0 also led to so many ancient civilizations and empires mentioned in TOS going extinct like Sargon's species--the consciousnesses they encountered in that underground chamber, etc. It was kind of cool how they explained everything. The Guardian of Forever was how Q brought 0 into our galaxy. The Guardian said it was forbidden, but Q overpowered it and he also implied that the ancient Q built the Guardian. They also mentioned the Oregonians watching all the havoc of the Q-0 battle and not getting involved, but they considered the Oregonians younger than them having only transitioned into a higher plane of existence more recently.
When you mention the idea to flood the warp nacelles with positive energy, you should for sarcasms sake put in some quick clips of the "hippies" from Return to Eden
I read in a novel called MUTE that the galactic barrier caused strange mutations in humans and children born from people exposed to the barrier had psychic abilities. And.. that these psychics were able to navigate through lightspeed. So the barrier was a boon or catalyst to space travel. A strange gift from the universe. I thought star trek should have done something like this.
While "Where No Man Has Gone Before" is good, I always thought the idea of a galactic barrier is stupid, especially since it doesn't seem to work. The Enterprise made it out, and the Andromedans made it in. And there seem to be plenty of dangerous species in the galaxy anyway.
I like the concept of a protective barrier around the galaxy but yeah it doesn't make much sense. I like the idea of a higher tier civilization establishing it to protect against even greater external horrors.
One might speculate that all the Beings encountered by Kirk (et al.) exhibiting 'god-like' powers -- such as those who aided Charlie X, the 'parents' of Trelayne, the Organians, the ones who tested Kirk and the Gorn, etc. -- were ordinary-level humanoid creatures who, upon achieving a warp-capable culture, ventured out far enough to encounter the Barrier, and then got 'zapped' like Gary Mitchell and survived to become 'transcendent' Beings who, of course, can still take on a humanoid form when it suits them. By the way, STAR TREK STAR CHARTS (pg. 10-11) has the Great Barrier's galactic plane inner-and-outer radial length extending from ~ 40,000 LY to just over 50,000 LY from the galactic center, with the UFP being located at ~ 25,000 LY from the galactic center -- NOT at 40,000 LY, as is asserted in this video (at 6:30ff), with the screenshot of page 10 clearly showing UFP's location about halfway between 20,000 and 30,000 LY from the galactic center. In fact, on page 8 of STSC, there's an overhead view of the Milky Way Galaxy with the distance from the galactic center to the UFP (just under a corresponding side-view) stating that the distance is 25,800 LY, which seems to have been the estimated distance then known when STSC was published in 2002. A better estimate done within the past year has the distance being about 25,600 LY or about 99.2248062% the 2002 estimate. The map on page 81 -- depicting the route of the USS VOYAGER from the Delta Quadrant back to the UFP -- shows the UFP just past the 5th grid square from the galactic center, where each grid square has a side 5,000 LY long or just over a total of 25,000 LY (i.e. the 25,800 LY figure given earlier on page 8), so I don't know where OrangeRiver is getting this supposed 'mistake' regarding the distance of the UFP from the Center as 40,000 LY in STSC.
I think the barrier was a simple tool writers used to make a single episode and was intended to be forgotten. Since it hasn't been forgotten, I think it could be explained away saying it is a natural consequence around galaxies, much like the heliopause surrounding our solar system or the aurora borealis around the Earth. In short, the barrier is the condensation of intergalactic energies being buffeted (and built up) near the edge of our galaxy.
It's a good element. In the dawn of nautical exploration there were monsters drawn on the edge of the map to warn people from going too far out to sea. In air travel there was a barrier you could not go past with normal wings or you would tear them off. There was also an altitude you could not past. In space you can not get too high above the protective barrier of the planet or solar radiation would cook you. In all these cases, once a better understanding of the environment was had... technology was advanced sufficiently enough to break these barriers.
There could be a barrier of antimatter. It was postulated that the birth of the universe would have a lot of antimatter to matter ratio and the two cannot coexist so one would repulse the other out to the edge as a bubble around oil and water. If this is true then some galaxies could be made of antimatter and the outer barrier is positive matter, which would be THEIR anti matter and just as deadly to pass through for them.
Little known scientific fact: there is a barrier surrounding our solar system composed of radiation from our sun and other inter-solar magnetic fields. (Or that's my non-astrophysics understanding) because this barrier does exist, it's not too far to theorize a similar barrier exists at the edge of our galaxy.
Actually, I got a theory about the galactic barrier myself it could’ve been created by primitive warp drive systems and actually created value to the negative particles left in space Since technically one drive supposed to separate space-time, it would make sense if I was negative particles was flying back into the past to create the barrier
Honestly... We need more. The idea of the Galactic Barrier is not unique to Star Trek (Star Wars has something similar though not the same), but it has so much untapped potential.
I actually felt the Galactic Barrier theory to be quite probable, especially since we know about the Van Allen's belt of the earth for example or the Heliosheath & Heliopause of the Solar System, which we now know about thanks to Voyager 1 and 2. So basically there's several protective layers in the universe in various sizes and densities. I do not think that a galactic barrier would be as dangerous and hard to penetrate from within but who knows? We can't say for sure yet. But the existence alone could not be entirely ruled out.
In the Q continuum series of books it is suggested the Q put the barrier in place to keep out a 'similar' entity named 'D'. The Q entity 'we' are most familiar with admitted in the books that he was responsable for 'D' being out there to Picard, this was due to him (Q) being an unruly youngster and making a mistake.
Now that, " Where No Man Has Gone Before ", would make for a good continuation movie. Neither one of those people died. The male could fake his own death. Remember that scene in the sick bay where he pretended to be dead and all the monitors went to zero. He came back from it. And the female. It just showed her passing out.
By analogy of the solar system barrier - heliosphere, there could be similar milky way's radiation outflow colliding with the ambient radiation of other galaxies ...
I remember reading somewhere an idea that the Galactic Barrier was more of some kind of space disruption localized around our side of the galaxy for reasons. I'm not a huge fan, either, but it's not too big a deal for me. You're wrong about Espers, though. I just went back and watched TOS Season 3 "Is There in Truth no Beauty?" and Dr. Miranda Jones (Diana Muldaur's first appearance in Trek I think) is clearly established to have been both human and born telepathic.
Not knowing what the barrier was and not being able to detect anything in Where No Man Has Gone Before, and saying it's negative energy in By Any Other Name are NOT mututally exclusive. It simply means they had no idea what it was when they first encountered it, and the sensors were not equipped to detect it. After encounting it and analyzing the readings they did have, Spock eventually determined it was negative energy, and between the two episodes the sensors were either modified or enhanced to be able to detect it.
I know it was dropped for a long time (until Discovery) but how terrifying would it be if the Borg was able to make ESPERS and some how integrate them into the standard drones?
If the barrier surrounds the entire galaxy, or even just the rim, I would think of it as a natural phenomenon. But maybe that's just me. Personally, I'm fine with the barrier just as I am fine with Tom Bombadil in LOTR. Sometimes an unexplained weirdness can be good in storytelling.
While the negative energy aspect is unusual the notion of a hazardous extra-galactic event horizon isn't unexpected. Even within our local interstellar neighborhood we have the Kuiper Belt causing physical hazards to anything entering or exiting our system and recent stydies in cosmic radiation show that we live in an unusually low irradiation pocket so travel beyond our solar system is incredibly hazardous. If we scale that up there's every likelihood that the lack of matter between galaxies means radiation levels are no doubt even higher in extragalactic space and the outermost rim will be a massive field of debris very much like the Kuiper Belt.
What is its relationship to the barrier at the galactic centre..? Are they related..? One seemed to be used to keep 'god' away from the rest of the galaxy, and there's a discussion that the one on the edge might keep something out.. Shocked it wasn't also discussed..
The Galactic Barrier is an example of bad writing which haunts a lot of early Trek, though they at least referenced it again in a later TOS episode unlike many world-shattering phenomena introduced back then and then memory-holed forever.
It's also entirely possible it was designed to keep us in. Possible that one too many milky way species caused problems in neighbouring galaxies and someone just decided to quarantine us all
They cleverly brought Khan back. They could've done the same with Gary Mitchell. The only problem is that he would be so powerful that they couldn't bring him back as a direct antagonist.
It is a silly idea, although their is potential for a good story there, if writer's in the current Trek series, Discovery in particular, could do a multiple episode, say 3 or 4, deep dive. It would be as Spock would say
Because you are the owner of Star Trek right??? Because the older Trek shows are faithful to canon and by the way, they are not. This video post even points out some canon issues within the older series. When people make these sort of stupid comments, I wonder which Star Trek they have been watching before DSCO was released.
Compare the Galactic Barrier with the phenomenon encountered by the Traveler in TNG. What is the difference, where are they located from one another, or is the Traveler's version an updated Galactic Barrier? Also, in each of the two episodes a human gains special powers. TOS has two people gain powers, an antagonist and one to counter that. In TNG, Wesley Crusher gains powers to help resolve the plot. Perhaps another rendition on Esper ratings - or even a hint that not everyone that gains powers at these locales gain the same power. As for Star Trek V, I always had in my mind that "God" was an exiled, insane Cytherian. He works exactly the same way as the Cytherians in TNG do; instead of them flying throughout the galaxy, they make others come to them. It could be possible that despite how advanced they may be, they never bothered with space faring vessels. The exiled Cytherian "God" would then have no clue how to build one, but they are obviously capable of taking over someone's mind. Barclay in TNG and Sybok in TOS, though Sybok was part Vulcan and his mental faculties far harder to gain absolute control over - still easily manipulated however.
at 00:14 I always get a good kick out of how Macho Gary Mitchell is supposed to be in this episode, but silently in this scene he wants his Ma Ma!! reaching out hoping someone will hold his hand in his quiet fear moment. He reaches back and Unknown(hot) yeoman looks down like a mother would to their child, and holds his hand.. Always cracks me up! I don't care I know what it is "supposed" to look like, but re-watch it a few times. You'll change your perspective and never see it the same again. Just like you'll never see the (hot) blonde yeoman the same again either. Janice Rand another blonde, (in TOS time there were a lot of blondes...the brunettes were red-shirts or evil) took her place.
Was it created and put in place by the Q to keep something out, as the central barrier keeps that something in which claimed to be God an wanted kirks ship
It’s reasonable that even at warp, inter-galactic travel would never be practical. But yeah, a barrier of superpower-granting energy is a silly solution to that problem.
What i think is interesting is our own solar system was only recently discovered by Voyager to have not quite a barrier bur some region of very high temperature -- this region is not dense so i do nor think it had any destructive effects on the probe. that Trek guessed about the galaxy many years before the discovery is remarkable. Swift guessed that Mars had two moons long (MT a century) before their actual discovery and I think made guesses also about their size and orbits.
Kinda? How about extremely goofy? And as far as there being no further mention of espers, we can just credit that to James T Kirk's disdain for the Psi Corps' gag rule. 😉
In your description of Hawking Radiation, you confuse antimatter and negative energy. There is no negative energy in a particle-antiparticle pair - it's all positive energy. Most physicists believe that negative energy (more specifically negative mass) doesn't exist, because if it did, it would be possible to create a perpetual motion machine.
I have nothing against either the Galactic Barrier or the Great Barrier. I wish that the powers that be would bother to explain a little something about them. At least tell us what the point of them is... or whats the backstory behind them... I dunno. just give us... something, hell anything.
My thoughts are section 31 tried creating gods of their own by taking espers across the galactic boundary. This failed horribly as such beings were not easily controlled or stable. After that, three things occurred. #1 it became illegal for espers to join star fleet(Or at least any espers in star fleet were carefully watched and placed in positions that were very unlikely to ever see the galaxy's edge). #2 all information about the barrier became carefully controlled information. #3 any intergalactic research//travel programs were quietly shot down.
Since the Barrier affects psi ability, maybe it's a mental phenomenon, and not a physical one, which explains its weirdness.
That's a good theory, and fits in a bit with The Traveler's statements in "Where No One Has Gone Before". Just as long as it isn't interpreted in such a way that the power of love is actually what holds the galaxy together or something.
Beyond the barrier is where the care bear kingdom lies
@@bjorn00000 didn't it physically destroy their ship and they had to use spacemagic to reinforce the enterprise to pass through? Idk tos was all over the place plot wise that episode felt like they included the "love" barrier because half way through writing about beings from another galaxy they realized they wrote in an impenetrable barrier in season 1 and had to figure something out lol also want to add the entire theme of tos is love conquers all it's their solution when facing any superior being showing them that the loss of compassion is the negative trade off to power. Star trek has always been about space hippies don't doubt the love barrier idea lol
What a fun way of proposing the possibility that Star Trek is a prequel to 40k
did you ever notice that more often than not the phenomenon that seemed to be most able to cause their high technology damage or to be unusable (all based on the "standard model" we are all taught) is/was electromagnetic in nature?
The galactic barrier was a weird plot device the TOS writers room cooked up. The central barrier felt extra silly in ST V.
Bah, that was just a prison for the creature that was being held there :P
All Star Trek techno babble and plot McGuffins aside, there actually probably is the galactic version of our own Solar system's termination shock. The region where all the stellar matter ejected by all the stars in the Milky way meet all the stellar matter pushing in from the universe all around. The bubbles shown in Discovery (though extremely exaggerated) are also based in real science, voyager 2 has passed through several floating in what astrophysicists are calling "magnetic foam".
My head canon is that it was created by ancient civilizations to keep out the intergalactic super-intelligent AIs responsible for both V'Ger and the more recent second season of Discovery and first season of Picard; it contains elements designed to augment the minds of organic beings passing through it, so that they can withstand encounters with the otherwise vastly superior entities outside the Milky Way that have formed a type 3+ civilization but still haven't gotten over issues with organic life forms.
All Star Trek techno babble and plot McGuffins aside, there actually probably is the galactic version of our own Solar system's termination shock. The region where all the stellar matter ejected by all the stars in the Milky way meet all the stellar matter pushing in from the universe all around. The bubbles shown in Discovery (though extremely exaggerated) are also based in real science, voyager 2 has passed through several floating in what astrophysicists are calling "magnetic foam".
@@dabrams84 Here is a NASA video explaining the situation: th-cam.com/video/suo7_u18C_s/w-d-xo.html
@@dabrams84 This is a great video on our fleet of probes used to monitor solar wind and earth magnetic field interactions, plus the Heliopause and Terminations shock: th-cam.com/video/1oDUN74yzuo/w-d-xo.html
Discovery and picard ain't part of my head cannon.
@@StinkyGreenBud You need to get out of your head, see the world.
Another piece of trivia is that "The Star Gazer" actually has a commemorative plaque in the background that suggests Uhura was the captain of an exploratory mission to the Small Magellanic Cloud (which would require a crossing of the barrier). This would actually not make that much sense, as the SMC is about 200,000 light years away and would involve crossing a huge void, but it's an interesting tidbit.
However, that extreme distance is why it probably wasn't covered in TNG/DS9/Voyager. Simply put, under current canon the trip would be impractical, and it wouldn't have really mattered if there was a barrier there. Even without intergalactic threats or a dangerous interface that turned you into a god, extragalactic space would have few or no accessible stars, meaning that refueling would be challenging and there would be few planets available for supplies or support. There's also probably not that much to explore either with crewed vessels. It would be like an ocean voyage in a rowboat.
My take on the science has been that the galactic barrier seems very equivalent to the termination shock at the edge of our solar system (and others) or even just surface tension at the interface of two different types of liquids. However, what's been missing from that explanation is that if the galactic barrier is really just a natural interface between intra- and extragalactic space, there must be some fundamental differences in space outside of the galaxy to cause that interface. That wasn't really discussed in "By Any Other Name" or "The Galactic Barrier"/"Rosetta", but would be an important piece of context.
I mean, it's only really extreme distance in canon if it really is only around the rim of the galaxy, but that doesn't make any sense fundamentally regardless of its origin. The Star Charts explanation is really the only thing that makes any sense irrespective of what was literally stated, since there isn't any reason the Kelvans would have approached _or_ departed along the galactic plane. If they were leaving the Milky Way for Andromeda starting from somewhere within a few hundred light years of Earth in a straight line, they wouldn't be leaving anywhere near the rim of the Milky Way. And even if they were, they were talking about a travel time measured in hundreds of millennia; taking a few years to go up and around the barrier would be nothing.
Edit: Oh, I'm dumb; I just realized you didn't mean the extreme distance _to the galactic rim,_ you meant the extreme distance _to another galaxy._ Whoops, sorry about that. :P
bjornooo I'm glad you put in the statement "My take on the science has been that the galactic barrier seems very equivalent to the termination shock at the edge of our solar system (and others) " Is it possible things will change when we enter ...... I don't know what to call it. When our ships crossed into interstellar space, we received a surprised. (Sorry I don't have enough information or knowledge to do this topic justice) You have brought up a number of points on this. I hope others hop in and add to your observations. I know it won't be cannon but it would be a wonderful excersie in attempting to interpret the universe.
Travel to other galaxies might be feasible if there is a naturally occurring traversable wormhole with one end in our galaxy and the other end in the other galaxy. Perhaps Captain Uhura's exploratory mission to the Small Magellanic Cloud was via such a wormhole. If so, then the mission would not have required crossing the galactic barrier.
In 1995, a theory was proposed that suggested there may be many wormholes in the universe if cosmic strings with negative mass were generated in the early universe since if a tiny wormhole held open by a negative mass cosmic string had appeared around the time of the Big Bang, it could have been inflated to macroscopic size by cosmic inflation. In the article Morris, Michael S.; Thorne, Kip S.; Yurtsever, Ulvi (1988). "Wormholes, Time Machines, and the Weak Energy Condition" Physical Review Letters. 61 (13): 1446-1449. Bibcode:1988PhRvL..61.1446M , and subsequent work by others, it was shown that negative matter could be used to stabilize a wormhole. Cramer et al. argue that such wormholes might have been created in the early universe, stabilized by negative-mass loops of cosmic string. [John G. Cramer; Robert L. Forward; Michael S. Morris; Matt Visser; Gregory Benford & Geoffrey A. Landis (1995). "Natural Wormholes as Gravitational Lenses". Physical Review D. 51 (6): 3117-3120. arXiv:astro-ph/9409051.]
In the Star Trek TNG episode "The Loss," the USS Enterprise-D was nearly destroyed after an encounter with a cosmic string fragment 107 kilometers in length. So macroscopic cosmic strings are consistent with Star Trek canon.
I think its a fine plot device if handled properly. The fact that it was pretty much not mentioned in the later series is curious.
I like the idea that the 'Q' made it to protect something from something else.
However, its not something I have never found to be a problem, and having something unexplained by science in the show is sort of satisfying.
Maybe one could argue that the Q put it in place to be a final test for humanity in the universe.
It could, ultimately be used as a goal post device, where if the federation can prove its peaceful intent within the galaxy, then it earns the privilege of expanding its message outside of the galaxy, in a few thousand years, and people getting ESPer powers is an indication of what will be needed in other parts of the universe, when they are ready... sort of like a galactic leaving home...
Or some other plot device.
Either way I don't mind it at all.
I know exposure to the barrier can awaken psionic abilities in humans with a high esper rating. Humans in star trek have psychic potential but lack the neural structure to use them.
Don't be totally rubbish. The "Q" didn't "make" anything. This is Star Trek not some tribal creation myth smh
@@john.premose no, its sci fi myth. Its myth, and can be anything the writers want, as shown by decades of contradictory writing.
Sounds a bit like its a sacred thing to you?
@@maarkaus48 not if it wants to have any credibility. The Q might portray themselves as “gods” but it’s to the credit of captain Picard and the other crew that they dismiss that entirely. The idea of the Q “creating” parts of the galaxy is like some kind of myth which is not scientific at all
@@john.premose Very little about star trek is really scientific at the end of the day. Some of it is grounded, but much of it is science fantasy. I love the show, at least up to the Rick Berman years, and especially the TOS as its called, but I can recognize that its largely a fantasy or modern myth.
And myth can be something to inspire, not explain. Science explains, myths inspire.
There can be room for both.
As for the barrier, I don't mind it, and that was my point. Its part of the canon now, and so there it is.
I have had many issues with things from TNG and later Star Trek, but if its set as canon, then so be it... until the writers decide its not again.
Star Trek Voyager, for example has had many moments of near death experiences for Janeway. Weird evolutionary salamander moments, and many other things that were not thrown out later, and so are canon... as much as its cringe.
I don't care that much about the barrier, if 'Q' invented it, or if they just claimed it to promote themselves, or if its completely natural. Its a plot device first, explanation second.
Star Trek is modern myth, and at times not very well done, because of many writers. That is fine, because its entertainment which is meant to provoke the mind and challenge us to reflect, and that it does well.
I have real issues with some of Voyager, but love the series as a whole.
A short trip just up or down relative to the galactic plane get you to the barrier. Meaning it’s even closer to Earth than, say, Vulcan. So I’m surprised we don’t hear about it more often in the series.
I never thiught of that.. I always visualised it as a huge sphere around the galaxy and nit just a sheet over the galaxy...
The galactic barrier up-or-down is still much farther than Vulcan. Vulcan is 16 light-years away, the galactic barrier would be at least 500 to 1000 light-years.
I always wondered why they couldn't just go over it. But if it surrounds the entire Galaxy I guess that answers that.
Yes, I thought the same thing until I realized the Barrier was like a squished bubble enveloping the entire galaxy, and that it's just thicker along the edges which it why you can see it more clearly from there.
The idea that the barrier is thinner above and below the galactic plane than the full extent at the rim reminds me of the trajectory that Apollo missions took to avoid the most intense regions of the Van Allen Belts on their way to the Moon.
Ironically that's the argument the moon landing deniers use to say why we couldn't go to the moon. The belt would cook humans. They don't know Apollo went through the thinnest part at high speed.
@@cb-gz1vl You are correct.
@@cb-gz1vl A little bit of shielding could even easily make it through the thickest parts as well.
@@mrspaceman2764 Yeah they were going through fast enough. I think you take more rads on a plane than they did.
Nice try but they didn't. It is a well known fact they had no idea the Van Allen Belt was there and this is an evidence they never went to the Moon.
My brother subbed right away after I showed him a Mass Effect video of yours
He was surprised by the level of lore knowledge
To which I was like, Yeah he knows his shit 🙄
I've been waiting for this one. Thanks Tyler.
I was thinking about the plot hole in ST V about galactic center just being near. They should've added some kind of wormhole that appears at the long time interval, 10.000 years maybe.
They could added a bit of character development about Spock's and Sybok's past, his rebellion against teaching of Surak about pure logic and against abstract. That makes him finding some Vulcan scrolls in forbidden part of the library, a history about light that appears every 10.000 years in some constellation. As wormhole opens it carries a message and visions about Sha Ka Ree. Then he travels on other worlds find some clues, but finds out that those worlds with telepathically sensitive species have more conclusive and clearer clues like same descriptions of messages, visions and map of same constellation of stars where bright wormhole appears. Then Sybok calculated and found time is near for wormhole to appear. When it appeared Sybok got the visions, but the God told him he needs a powerful ship to get through the barrier. He needed a Starfleet grade ship. It would explain why Sybok was in such a hurry to get a fast flagship, why they were able to fast travel to the center of the Galaxy and find God.
Also I would add Spock's wits to pull out history facts how 10.000 ago years some civilizations near wormhole waged religious wars that led their civilizations near or to total extinction. It could show that Entity of Sha Ka Ree is total chaos, and if his mere presence could destroy civilizations through manipulating minds, driving basic instincts to the surface, his freedom would be devastating to entire Galaxy.
Star Trek V was a real turd in the punch bowl of Star Trek movies
@@robertcampbell6349 it was weird as hell, but very much a send-off of the old series. Where else but old fashioned Star Trek would you go to the center of the galaxy to fight god?
@@tsm688 Very true!
@@tsm688 in spite of its many flaws, i see three major qualities about Star Trek V: (1) the "fighting god" plot, or as Bones put it, "ask the Almighty for His ID". That someone (just why is it Kirk alone) at last did question that being feels like a satisfaction for me. (2) another thing i like is how the movie dives into the rich and intimate kirk-spock-mccoy friendship (just why did the rest of the crew not get so much nuance, too). (3) also we get the important psycho-philosophical lesson that you should not get rid of your painful memories but carry them. When Kirk declines Sybok's brainwashing tricks, he rightfully points out that our shortcomings make us who we are.
If I remember correctly, the barrier was used in ST 5 The Final Frontier. Since humans have not traveled to space, we cannot say for certainty if the barrier actually exists. Unless the Voyager probes have left the milky way.
They haven't and they won't do so until far, far, far after we've either gone extinct or visited the edge of the galaxy ourselves.
@@danic_c agreed
I always felt the character reaction to the barrier is that it was an unexplained/unexpected phenomena that shouldn't be there. Like it was placed there by some force to keep something in or to keep something out.
Maybe like many mature races were fearful of young races first starting out on inter-planetary travel. Maybe the barrier is aimed at races just starting out on intergalactic travel. It did work like this for the Kelvins.
It's been a long time since I read it, but if I remember correctly, the TNG book trilogy called the Continuum states that it is basically a prison for a powerful being
You made a Mistake.
Garry Mitchell and humans with Psionic abilities was mentioned and referenced in Star Trek Lower Decks
This is true :D
I thought there was at least one other TOS episode with a psychic human, Dr Polaski. Or at least the same actress.
i love the barrier. It adds a bit of mystery to the galaxy and makes me wonder about what might be lurking outside
I dig the galactic barrier, kinda old god vibes. I'd love to see the results of a galaxy without it through andromeda refugees or something. Like the dark forest is legit and our galaxy is surprisingly peaceful.
Should be noted too by the 26th century starfleet would develop a highly advanced transwarp that would alow them to travel beyond the milkyway and bypass the barrier without issue that's why ships like enterprise j were so massive to house the new warp core and alow comfortable travel during the extended exploration missions
This is a very interesting subject. It can be wacky if the subject of the galactic barrier is not approached right. It is fascinating to think that it was made, rather than a natural phenomena.there is a lot of thought, and research goes into these videos.I really enjoy these videos.
All Star Trek techno babble and plot McGuffins aside, there actually probably is the galactic version of our own Solar system's termination shock. The region where all the stellar matter ejected by all the stars in the Milky way meet all the stellar matter pushing in from the universe all around. The bubbles shown in Discovery (though extremely exaggerated) are also based in real science, voyager 2 has passed through several floating in what astrophysicists are calling "magnetic foam".
You did a great job of explaining a dificult subject. This is the kind of thing that makes your channel stand out and makes it worth subscribing to. Thanks.
I got way too excited that you were talking about this.
The toroidal shape of the Great Barrier also explains why its at the center of the galaxy (in Star Trek V) as well as at the edge of the galaxy in the TOS episodes. I've heard before that there were two Great Barriers but, this makes a lot more sense. There's also some weird apocrypha about the "God" being found at the center of the Galaxy in Star Trek V. Though a lot of people probably don't like or like to think much about Star Trek V. It also seems like the Enterprise travelled a rather long distance to get there in that movie in too short a time.
The whole psionic "esper" thing is a little silly. But its a sci fi thing I guess and there are telepaths and empaths across the ST universe. Though there being human "espers" is just kind of dropped.
There is a running theme of people encountering the Great Barrier and surviving it developing grand delusions in addition to their mental powers and thinking they're like gods. Sybok was drawn to the barrier and developed his delusions for some reason before encountering it. The creature at the center may have something to do with all this. Maybe it was mentally influencing Sybok and trying to draw him, someone or anyone really, in to be useful in its plans.
There are also the Venturi from the game Starfleet Academy, who go from being kind of generic pirates to a weird religious cult when their leader encounters the Barrier. Though Starfleet Academy is itself not canon and the story is part of an Academy simulation even within the game's universe itself.
Don't worry I have subscribed, started watching your videos yesterday, and watched 3 videos in a row and then subscribed this morning watching my 4th video.
Haha nice!
People! If you haven't Subscribed, you need to. I love this channel and the videos are very well researched.
Thank you so much James!
Honestly I hear it enough from the channel owners. I don't need random people telling me to sub. Settle down.
There are two Barriers, the Galactic Barrier "Where No Man Has Gone Before," and the Great Barrier "Star Trek: The Final Frontier." The Galactic Barrier encircles the Milky Way galaxy completely and is a pinkish purple color, while the Great Barrier encircles the Galactic core and is a bluish white color. The Great Barrier was clearly made to imprison the God-like entity, but the Galactic Barrier was either made to keep us in or something out.
Or it was made to keep us, away from the rest of the universe. We are the danger the barrier keeps locked up.
I don’t often quote Men in Black but in it, Kay said “Human thought is so primitive it's looked upon as an infectious disease by the rest of the universe.” There could be something to that! 😂
It's keeping a whole galaxy locked. It's pride that makes us special enough to warrant a barrier.
Funny. I thought the same thing!
In one of the Star Trek novels Q accidently opened a portal to an other universe. Several powerfull beings crossover. One of them is the "God" from the Star Trek movie "Final Frontier" and one called "Zero". It takes the Q's a lot of power too defeat this beings. The "God" is improsent and "Zero" is cast out of the Milkyway. Because Zero cann't travel faster than the speed of light a barrier was created too keep him out of your Milkyway for thousends/millions of years.
I wonder if our galaxy doesn't have a Dark Energy barrier. A point outside the galaxy in which the effects of galactic gravity shrinks so low that Dark Energy effects over whelm gravity.
There is a book that describes the barrier as a means of keeping a rogue Q out. Along with the head of another rogue placed in the middle of the galaxy at Sha Ka Ree needing help getting back into the galaxy so he could heal and cause mayhem again.
I like the idea of a Galactic Barrier, it's a good plot device that can always be revisited.
I like the idea of it. It is a mystery to solve, an obstacle to overcome and a frontier to explore. It also helps contain story telling to the local galactic scene. It would be quicker to travel to the next closest galaxy at TNG era speeds than it would to travel from Ocampa to the alpha quadrant.
Real world: There was a "barrier" that voyager passed through. Cosmic "stuff" being pushed ahead of our planetary system. So why wouldn't the galaxy have the same. A sort of space wake and bulge in space time. Like a boat pushing water in front and behind.
2:19 If you ever wondered how the magical marshmallow bits in Lucky Charms cereal are made...
I always liked the Star Trek X-men crossover that tied it in with the Phoenix force. To be honest I figure it only exists so both Doctor McCoys could respond to the same question.
It started as a silly idea, but it was dealt with well and in a really interesting way in the Q Continuum books.
I remember those books, the barrier was meant to keep a Q like being out of our galaxy.
@@josephgauthreaux8926 Ya it was an extra-dimensional being that Q actually brought into our galaxy and he destroyed a major empire; which could not go unanswered and he had 2 entities that he brought with him. They trapped one at the centre of the galaxy as well and destroyed his body hence the giant head in Star Trek V
@Stads If I remember it also gave the explanation of Q being the one to form the nexus when he ripped a hole in space time to save another Q.
@@josephgauthreaux8926 That's true. I only remember because I read these books last year, but ya Q created it by accident. He was also responsible for a huge planetary body colliding with Earth which caused the formation of the moon--as a punishment for that he was charged with overseeing all life on Earth for the enture history of the planet 😂 The battles the Q had with 0 also led to so many ancient civilizations and empires mentioned in TOS going extinct like Sargon's species--the consciousnesses they encountered in that underground chamber, etc. It was kind of cool how they explained everything. The Guardian of Forever was how Q brought 0 into our galaxy. The Guardian said it was forbidden, but Q overpowered it and he also implied that the ancient Q built the Guardian. They also mentioned the Oregonians watching all the havoc of the Q-0 battle and not getting involved, but they considered the Oregonians younger than them having only transitioned into a higher plane of existence more recently.
When you mention the idea to flood the warp nacelles with positive energy, you should for sarcasms sake put in some quick clips of the "hippies" from Return to Eden
The Lower Decks had a whole episode about Psionic powers and even references Gary Mitchell.
It made for a very effective second pilot. I am with the idea that a super race created it to keep something horrid out.
I read in a novel called MUTE that the galactic barrier caused strange mutations in humans and children born from people exposed to the barrier had psychic abilities. And.. that these psychics were able to navigate through lightspeed. So the barrier was a boon or catalyst to space travel. A strange gift from the universe. I thought star trek should have done something like this.
interesting to think our galaxy could have a barrier around it when theoretically it is currently colliding with the andromeda galaxy
Sweet video Tyler! Keep it up.
Thanks Worf!
While "Where No Man Has Gone Before" is good, I always thought the idea of a galactic barrier is stupid, especially since it doesn't seem to work. The Enterprise made it out, and the Andromedans made it in. And there seem to be plenty of dangerous species in the galaxy anyway.
Interestingly, modern science does predict a fairly substantial "dark matter halo" I think, so who knows if that would be a "barrier"?
I like the concept of a protective barrier around the galaxy but yeah it doesn't make much sense. I like the idea of a higher tier civilization establishing it to protect against even greater external horrors.
Or protecting themselves from us
One might speculate that all the Beings encountered by Kirk (et al.) exhibiting 'god-like' powers -- such as those who aided Charlie X, the 'parents' of Trelayne, the Organians, the ones who tested Kirk and the Gorn, etc. -- were ordinary-level humanoid creatures who, upon achieving a warp-capable culture, ventured out far enough to encounter the Barrier, and then got 'zapped' like Gary Mitchell and survived to become 'transcendent' Beings who, of course, can still take on a humanoid form when it suits them.
By the way, STAR TREK STAR CHARTS (pg. 10-11) has the Great Barrier's galactic plane inner-and-outer radial length extending from ~ 40,000 LY to just over 50,000 LY from the galactic center, with the UFP being located at ~ 25,000 LY from the galactic center -- NOT at 40,000 LY, as is asserted in this video (at 6:30ff), with the screenshot of page 10 clearly showing UFP's location about halfway between 20,000 and 30,000 LY from the galactic center. In fact, on page 8 of STSC, there's an overhead view of the Milky Way Galaxy with the distance from the galactic center to the UFP (just under a corresponding side-view) stating that the distance is 25,800 LY, which seems to have been the estimated distance then known when STSC was published in 2002. A better estimate done within the past year has the distance being about 25,600 LY or about 99.2248062% the 2002 estimate. The map on page 81 -- depicting the route of the USS VOYAGER from the Delta Quadrant back to the UFP -- shows the UFP just past the 5th grid square from the galactic center, where each grid square has a side 5,000 LY long or just over a total of 25,000 LY (i.e. the 25,800 LY figure given earlier on page 8), so I don't know where OrangeRiver is getting this supposed 'mistake' regarding the distance of the UFP from the Center as 40,000 LY in STSC.
I think the barrier was a simple tool writers used to make a single episode and was intended to be forgotten. Since it hasn't been forgotten, I think it could be explained away saying it is a natural consequence around galaxies, much like the heliopause surrounding our solar system or the aurora borealis around the Earth. In short, the barrier is the condensation of intergalactic energies being buffeted (and built up) near the edge of our galaxy.
There was a Next Gen episode where they were transported out of the edge. Purple clouds and white streaming lights.
It's a good element. In the dawn of nautical exploration there were monsters drawn on the edge of the map to warn people from going too far out to sea. In air travel there was a barrier you could not go past with normal wings or you would tear them off. There was also an altitude you could not past. In space you can not get too high above the protective barrier of the planet or solar radiation would cook you.
In all these cases, once a better understanding of the environment was had... technology was advanced sufficiently enough to break these barriers.
"The galactic barrier is kinda... stupid, isn't it?" THANK YOU! lol I never understood why Star Trek and Star Wars have these
Does anyone know what background music he uses? And no, the links in the description which link to 100s of songs don't help
There could be a barrier of antimatter. It was postulated that the birth of the universe would have a lot of antimatter to matter ratio and the two cannot coexist so one would repulse the other out to the edge as a bubble around oil and water. If this is true then some galaxies could be made of antimatter and the outer barrier is positive matter, which would be THEIR anti matter and just as deadly to pass through for them.
Little known scientific fact: there is a barrier surrounding our solar system composed of radiation from our sun and other inter-solar magnetic fields. (Or that's my non-astrophysics understanding) because this barrier does exist, it's not too far to theorize a similar barrier exists at the edge of our galaxy.
Actually, I got a theory about the galactic barrier myself it could’ve been created by primitive warp drive systems and actually created value to the negative particles left in space Since technically one drive supposed to separate space-time, it would make sense if I was negative particles was flying back into the past to create the barrier
Honestly... We need more. The idea of the Galactic Barrier is not unique to Star Trek (Star Wars has something similar though not the same), but it has so much untapped potential.
I liked the barrier. Everyone seems to assume that it is keeping something out but why not someone in?
I actually felt the Galactic Barrier theory to be quite probable, especially since we know about the Van Allen's belt of the earth for example or the Heliosheath & Heliopause of the Solar System, which we now know about thanks to Voyager 1 and 2. So basically there's several protective layers in the universe in various sizes and densities. I do not think that a galactic barrier would be as dangerous and hard to penetrate from within but who knows? We can't say for sure yet. But the existence alone could not be entirely ruled out.
In the Q continuum series of books it is suggested the Q put the barrier in place to keep out a 'similar' entity named 'D'.
The Q entity 'we' are most familiar with admitted in the books that he was responsable for 'D' being out there to Picard, this was due to him (Q) being an unruly youngster and making a mistake.
Now that, " Where No Man Has Gone Before ", would make for a good continuation movie. Neither one of those people died. The male could fake his own death. Remember that scene in the sick bay where he pretended to be dead and all the monitors went to zero. He came back from it. And the female. It just showed her passing out.
By analogy of the solar system barrier - heliosphere, there could be similar milky way's radiation outflow colliding with the ambient radiation of other galaxies ...
I remember reading somewhere an idea that the Galactic Barrier was more of some kind of space disruption localized around our side of the galaxy for reasons. I'm not a huge fan, either, but it's not too big a deal for me. You're wrong about Espers, though. I just went back and watched TOS Season 3 "Is There in Truth no Beauty?" and Dr. Miranda Jones (Diana Muldaur's first appearance in Trek I think) is clearly established to have been both human and born telepathic.
Not knowing what the barrier was and not being able to detect anything in Where No Man Has Gone Before, and saying it's negative energy in By Any Other Name are NOT mututally exclusive. It simply means they had no idea what it was when they first encountered it, and the sensors were not equipped to detect it. After encounting it and analyzing the readings they did have, Spock eventually determined it was negative energy, and between the two episodes the sensors were either modified or enhanced to be able to detect it.
mistake as kirk only had 1 5 year mission, the enterprise had 3 others Robert April had 1 and Pike had 2.
I know it was dropped for a long time (until Discovery) but how terrifying would it be if the Borg was able to make ESPERS and some how integrate them into the standard drones?
If the barrier surrounds the entire galaxy, or even just the rim, I would think of it as a natural phenomenon. But maybe that's just me.
Personally, I'm fine with the barrier just as I am fine with Tom Bombadil in LOTR. Sometimes an unexplained weirdness can be good in storytelling.
It's the way into the Star Wars universe
"I call it a Hawking Hole." 😅
While the negative energy aspect is unusual the notion of a hazardous extra-galactic event horizon isn't unexpected. Even within our local interstellar neighborhood we have the Kuiper Belt causing physical hazards to anything entering or exiting our system and recent stydies in cosmic radiation show that we live in an unusually low irradiation pocket so travel beyond our solar system is incredibly hazardous. If we scale that up there's every likelihood that the lack of matter between galaxies means radiation levels are no doubt even higher in extragalactic space and the outermost rim will be a massive field of debris very much like the Kuiper Belt.
I like your video, and I also like the galactic barrier.
What is its relationship to the barrier at the galactic centre..? Are they related..? One seemed to be used to keep 'god' away from the rest of the galaxy, and there's a discussion that the one on the edge might keep something out.. Shocked it wasn't also discussed..
The Galactic Barrier is an example of bad writing which haunts a lot of early Trek, though they at least referenced it again in a later TOS episode unlike many world-shattering phenomena introduced back then and then memory-holed forever.
It's also entirely possible it was designed to keep us in. Possible that one too many milky way species caused problems in neighbouring galaxies and someone just decided to quarantine us all
The galactic barrier-i feel-was created as an "oh its just turtles all the way down" escape clause.
They cleverly brought Khan back. They could've done the same with Gary Mitchell. The only problem is that he would be so powerful that they couldn't bring him back as a direct antagonist.
Pop Quiz: What has a mass of approximately 125.35 GeV?
*Frantically Googles* uh uh...the Higgs boson? :D
It is a silly idea, although their is potential for a good story there, if writer's in the current Trek series, Discovery in particular, could do a multiple episode, say 3 or 4, deep dive. It would be as Spock would say
it was the atlantians... :D
Discovery is not cannon. You need to quit bringing it up.
Oh shut up. I don't like it either but people really need to stop saying this, it's just not true.
@@rhodrage I was was going to say this too.
Because you are the owner of Star Trek right???
Because the older Trek shows are faithful to canon and by the way, they are not.
This video post even points out some canon issues within the older series.
When people make these sort of stupid comments, I wonder which Star Trek they have been watching before DSCO was released.
Oh please. You don't determine what is "canon" for everyone else, and the representation in Discovery is consistent with what was in TOS.
I thought it was cannon just in a different time line than the main universe.
I thought it made for great storytelling in the Q Continuum novels.
Compare the Galactic Barrier with the phenomenon encountered by the Traveler in TNG. What is the difference, where are they located from one another, or is the Traveler's version an updated Galactic Barrier? Also, in each of the two episodes a human gains special powers. TOS has two people gain powers, an antagonist and one to counter that. In TNG, Wesley Crusher gains powers to help resolve the plot. Perhaps another rendition on Esper ratings - or even a hint that not everyone that gains powers at these locales gain the same power.
As for Star Trek V, I always had in my mind that "God" was an exiled, insane Cytherian. He works exactly the same way as the Cytherians in TNG do; instead of them flying throughout the galaxy, they make others come to them. It could be possible that despite how advanced they may be, they never bothered with space faring vessels. The exiled Cytherian "God" would then have no clue how to build one, but they are obviously capable of taking over someone's mind. Barclay in TNG and Sybok in TOS, though Sybok was part Vulcan and his mental faculties far harder to gain absolute control over - still easily manipulated however.
at 00:14 I always get a good kick out of how Macho Gary Mitchell is supposed to be in this episode, but silently in this scene he wants his Ma Ma!! reaching out hoping someone will hold his hand in his quiet fear moment. He reaches back and Unknown(hot) yeoman looks down like a mother would to their child, and holds his hand.. Always cracks me up! I don't care I know what it is "supposed" to look like, but re-watch it a few times. You'll change your perspective and never see it the same again. Just like you'll never see the (hot) blonde yeoman the same again either. Janice Rand another blonde, (in TOS time there were a lot of blondes...the brunettes were red-shirts or evil) took her place.
Was it created and put in place by the Q to keep something out, as the central barrier keeps that something in which claimed to be God an wanted kirks ship
It’s reasonable that even at warp, inter-galactic travel would never be practical. But yeah, a barrier of superpower-granting energy is a silly solution to that problem.
What i think is interesting is our own solar system was only recently discovered by Voyager to have not quite a barrier bur some region of very high temperature -- this region is not dense so i do nor think it had any destructive effects on the probe. that Trek guessed about the galaxy many years before the discovery is remarkable. Swift guessed that Mars had two moons long (MT a century) before their actual discovery and I think made guesses also about their size and orbits.
Maybe the barrier was put there to keep something in.
Kinda? How about extremely goofy? And as far as there being no further mention of espers, we can just credit that to James T Kirk's disdain for the Psi Corps' gag rule. 😉
In your description of Hawking Radiation, you confuse antimatter and negative energy. There is no negative energy in a particle-antiparticle pair - it's all positive energy. Most physicists believe that negative energy (more specifically negative mass) doesn't exist, because if it did, it would be possible to create a perpetual motion machine.
Amazing in TOS they have been from the edge to the center of the galaxy for banter. Yet Voyager would take 70 years to get home.
I always thought it was created by the Q for some reason only known to them.
I have nothing against either the Galactic Barrier or the Great Barrier. I wish that the powers that be would bother to explain a little something about them. At least tell us what the point of them is... or whats the backstory behind them... I dunno. just give us... something, hell anything.
So to overcome excessive exposure to purple haze, one simply needs an excess of speed and good vibes....umm, what year was this all written?
nobody ever seems to consider the possibility that the barrier was constructed to keep something IN ...
The barrier was made to keep humans in. I wouldn't want us invading my galaxy!
Star Trek and Star Wars, both share this concept, that a barrier surrounds their galaxies.
I thought the people that got effected by the barrier was augmented in some way to have psi ability
In the startrek universe I believe the galactic barrier is some thing most if not all galaxy's have its just a universal fact with 8m rhe STU .
did lower decks not cover espers and make reference to the TOS doctor
I think it's an interesting idea that wasn't properly explored
My thoughts are section 31 tried creating gods of their own by taking espers across the galactic boundary. This failed horribly as such beings were not easily controlled or stable. After that, three things occurred. #1 it became illegal for espers to join star fleet(Or at least any espers in star fleet were carefully watched and placed in positions that were very unlikely to ever see the galaxy's edge). #2 all information about the barrier became carefully controlled information. #3 any intergalactic research//travel programs were quietly shot down.
Barrier isn't goofy at all if you consider the "bubble" concept for our universe.
So if the barrier is ignored then what is to stop travel to other galaxies?