Hey all. Just a few details I want to clarify: 1. Technically, the first version of the puzzle given at the beginning of the video (using an open domain) can be solved by a simple diagonal line since it attains its maximum and minimum at the domain's endpoints, which are excluded in this case. While that is true, I was trying to avoid that solution since it feels like one of those "technically correct" but not very interesting solutions since the graph is still bounded (yes, I could exclude this solution by using the term "supremum" instead of "maximum", but that's a term many viewers won't know and I didn't want to distract from the main point by explaining it). There's actually a footnote about this in the bottom-right corner at 0:54, but it flashed by quickly, so I don't blame you if you missed it. 2. Many have suggested using a constant function like f(x) = 3 as a solution to the second version of the puzzle (with a closed domain), but strictly speaking, a constant function DOES have both a maximum and a minimum: it's the value of the constant itself (e.g. 3). This is because the technical definition of "max" in math is the function's output that is greater than OR EQUAL TO all other output values, and likewise for "min". 3. At 10:24 I mentioned that a compact set can't have any "holes". This was meant to be casual speak for "single point gaps" and not large missing shapes in the interior. It's possible for sets to have "large holes" in them and still be compact. For example, as some have pointed out in the comments, an annulus (a disk with a smaller disk cut out of it) can be compact as long as it includes the entirety of both its inner and outer boundaries.
@@LB-qr7nv Ah, I should have said "fail to converge *to a point in the set*". Yes, if the sequence approaches a single point gap, it will still converge to that point (assuming you're including that gap point as part of the larger ambient space), but the set won't be sequentially compact since the limit point is outside the set.
@@JarekHardysz It actually can't be solved using a straight line. The extreme value theorem tells us that on a closed interval [a,b] there must be one maximum and one minimum. It is never stated that one point can't be both a min and a max at the same time, as the theorem only fails when there is either a higher or a lower point than our original point. If you find that a bit hard to believe, then imagine a function f(x) = 2. This function is always constant, right? You can ask yourself the following "What is the lowest possible value for f?" you can instantly realize that "Well, I can't go lower than 2, therefore it is the lowest possible value". The same reasoning works for the maximum value.
It's been a while since I learned about continuous functions, so maybe this just isn't continuous, but what about 1/|x-0.5|. It would rise to infinity at 0.5, then drop back down without the break in the center of the line
Hi. i am the one who wrote the paper cited here. Wow, I had no idea you had made a cartoon version of my master's thesis (more or less). Both humbled and amazed at how it has come to life. Wonderful job! ❤
@@Alrightmira I am an associate professor of math education. I wrote this paper on which this is based (to a large extent?) as my master's thesis from UC Berkeley.
@@Alrightmira yeah, also cool that something you write as a student actually gets read, and that it helps people. I can't tell you how gratifying it is to read all these comments.
I've been exposed to compactness in 3 different math classes, and I have to say this video has given me more clarity than anything else by an enormous margin
I've had this experience a lot with math and math TH-cam. It's really a consequence of the fact that in school, doing the math is paramount. If you can do the math, it doesn't matter so much whether you have any good intuition for the concepts. Not saying that's a good thing, but it's definitely the principle many schools operate under. (Also, had you not done so much math involving compactness, would this intuitive revelation have really been such a revelation?)
@@kruksog I think you're absolutely right that if not for hours spent wrestling the definition into proofs that felt obscene, this video wouldn't have been so powerful. I guess I should really say I'm so lucky to be learning in a time when we have youtubers like morphocular to augment normal education!
There is much truth to this. Basically every theorem where compactness is required is a generalization of a property of finite sets, including the example in the video.
I think this is a very good way to think about compactness. One very useful conceptualization I've come across is to think of finiteness as being a property that is made up of two smaller concepts: discreteness and compactness.
This is an unbelievably clear description of arguably one of the most abstruse concepts in mathematics. People who have not encountered compactness before are not going to appreciate just how special this video is. Absolutely stellar.
Back when I first heard the definition, my reaction was "wtf is this thing, and why is this random property interesting?" It wasn't long before it was proven that these sets have magical properties... but I still didn't have much of an intuition for why aside from all the gears magically fitting into place.
@samueldeandrade8535 I kind of understood it from the get go. But that is because before we had topology we had real analysis. And the definition in a metric space is very intuitive(bounded and closed space). In a general topological space, the definition gets a little dicey for your intuition. But when it clicks you realise how clever the cover-subcover definition is. It's like the epsilon delta click.
"... a sequence of points that endlessly explores all the infinitely many coordinate axes of the infinite-dimensional space while always staying a fixed distance away from the origin" is one of the best explanations I've heard. For some reason, that line made me really tie it together.
Glad you pointed out Seqential Compactness =/= Compactness in all topological spaces (metric spaces yes, others not necessarily). For those curious, there's an analogous idea to seqences called nets that *does* apply to all topological spaces: A topological space is compact iff every -bounded- net has a convergent subnet. Good intro to Compactness! It's definitely a weird one to wrap your head around initially, took me a good year of study before I was really comfortable with it and picking out when it'd be useful.
You say "A topological space is compact iff every bounded net has a convergent subnet." This is correct if you drop the word "bounded". In fact, boundedness is not even defined in general topological spaces.
I had a question which I answered in the process of writing it down. I'm leaving it here in case somebody else is wondering the same thing. We have the [0, 1] interval and an infinite open cover consisting of balls where each consecutive ball gets smaller. More precisely the first covers [0, 0.5]; the second [0.5, 0.75]; the third [0.75, 0.875], etc. The first ball would have radius 0.25 + ε; the second 0.125 + ε/2; etc. What is the finite subcover? answer: This is not a cover because the point at 1 is not covered. If you try to cover 1, the new ball would cover some points near 1 and the remaining part of the line segment can be covered with finitely many balls.
One of the big revelations for me when I was learning about covering spaces was that the bulk of the proofs were just compactness arguments. You're given a path in a space and some complicated local property for the points on that path. The proofs seem complicated, but they're just multiple iterations of "use compactness of the path to cut down open covers to finite subcovers where we can handle compatibility on overlapping sets".
You have got to have one of the best math channels on TH-cam (or anywhere, for that matter). I know a lot of us (including myself) have been introduced to your channel via 3blue1brown's SoME challenges over the last couple of years, which puts you in some pretty stellar company, but this is truly top-tier stuff, man. This channel is equally as good and offers a much different approach as well as covers different topics at various levels of difficulty. Your ability to make such rigorous and counterintuitive concepts seem so natural is incredible. You are an awesome educator. Thank you for this.
I honestly think this is the best new math youtube channel. Its like 3b1b yet has its own style and isn’t like those hundreds of 3b1b knock off channels that exist
Compactness always kind of baffeled me. In the finite-dimensional real numbers, it simply means 'closed and bounded', which I could wrap my head around. But in other domains, it means a little something extra that I could never really grasp. I am through with analysis already, but it was super nice to revisit this and get a better understanding for it!
You may already know this, but in fact your statement that (compactness in finite dimensional euclidean space) (closed and bounded) can be further generalised to: (compactness in finite dimensional normed space) (closed and bounded).
@@Graham_Wideman It doesn't talk about open sets that are compact there :) What it does talk about is how you can cover a compact set with a, let's call it patchwork of little open sets. But this patchwork itself isn't compact. It just covers something compact.
@@efi3825 No doubt you are right, in which case the statement at 4:16 "The important sets to pay attention to regarding compactness are the open sets." is highly misleading.
Thank you for this excellent video ! I'm a self-learner and compactness was NEVER explained intuitively so with time I just accepted it to be the generalization of "close and bounded" (like open sets with open balls) without any motivation to the definition. Now, with this new point of view, the sequential approach make me understand a bit more the WHY
Such a sophisticated domain and so lightly exposed with such thoroughness. Never had the chance to meet the beast before, just heard of it. Not so frightening after all 😅😉
It's one of those things that are super useful but also mysteriously technical and playing a background role, usually nothing flashy enough to get much attention. Same for for much of point set topology.
I think it’s fun that you can strengthen the boundedness claim to the full extreme value theorem straightforwardly with a second application of compactness, by showing that continuous images of compact sets are compact, and thus in particular closed (so the function’s range contains the minimum and maximum values) 🙂
Indeed the proof is quite short: Suppose f: X \to Y is continuous and surjective (for ease, if it isnt we can replace Y with f(X)) and X is a compact space. Let U_\lambda be an open cover of Y. Consider the collection of the preimage of each of those U_\lambda 's. This is a open cover of X, and must have a finite subcover, say f^{-1}(U_1), ..., f^{-1}(U_n). Then U_1,...U_n is a finite cover of Y.
At 3:57, I just want to add one comment. Open and closed are not opposites in topology. It is possible for a set to have no boundary points and be both open and closed.
The proof of the Heine-Borel theorem is actually really nice, if you compare it to how transfinite induction works, you'll notice that it's basically like a topological version of induction for the real numbers. Edit: I'll expand on this: In the natural numbers, induction can be described by this idea: suppose you have a set S ⊂ ℕ, and it satisfies the following two conditions: - S contains 0 - if S contains all numbers lower than n, then S contains n. Then it follows that S must be the entirety of ℕ. Obviously this wouldn't directly work on the real numbers, but you can modify, it. Let's say you have a set S ⊂ [0, ∞), where [0, ∞) are all the nonnegative real numbers, and it satisfies the following two properties: - S contains an open set containing 0 - if S contains all numbers lower than n ∈ ℝ, then S contains an open set containing n Then it follows that S must be the entirety of [0, ∞). This can be verified to actually work through a simple least upper bound argument. If you replace [0, ∞) by a set of the form [0, x], you get a similar result that x must be contained in S. Now let's say you have an open cover U of the set [0, 1], and let S be the set of all numbers x such that [0, x] can be covered by a finite amount of sets from U. Then, - Clearly S contains an open set containing 0, as the cover must have an open set containing 0 and that single set forms a finite subcover of [0, e] for any sufficiently small e - if S contains all numbers lower than n, then find any open set A from the cover which contains n, by definition of open sets, you can find a number e such that (n-e, n+e) is contained in A, then by the assumption, we can find a finite subcover of [0, n-e] and by adding A to that finite subcover, we get a finite subcover of [0, n+e/2], therefore, an open set containing n, (n-e, n+e/2) is in S. Since we fulfilled the two conditions, we get that S contains 1, and therefore [0, 1] has a finite subcover.
@@dogedev1337 If this was the more clear version.... I don't even understand what you're trying to say, let alone how you got to saying it. You had me, tho, all the way up until the 3rd paragraph.
@@kindlin Have you taken a real analysis or topology class? Not that you necessarily would need it but there's a bit of assumed background. If you like I can reply with some "get there as fast as possible" ideas for this specific proof
My classmates always wonder why I seem to get concepts so quickly in class, little do they know that I essentially watch hours of extra math lectures a week
Loved the video! I've struggled with compactness in real analysis and just automatically translated it to "closed and bounded". Animations and topology are a perfect match.
I cannot understate the value of what you are doing. I’ve always thought my brain was wired but math, but have struggled translating the concepts into language and vice versa; you do this masterfully. Thank you and subbed!
College professor here. I LOVED this video. Real analysis or functional analysis would be so much easier starting the class with content such as this Kudos kudos kudos
This is an excellent video, and just in time for my Analysis II exam! In Analysis I, I was introduced to compactness (together with the extreme value theorem and some other important concepts) only through sequential compactness in the context of metric spaces, and in Analysis II was stumped with the general definition of compactness, together with a (horrendously large) proof that it is equivalent to sequential compactness and also completeness and total boundedness on metric spaces. It's really hard to get an intuition for what it really does, I got a sense of the same kind of "reduction to finiteness" meaning when i spend hours picking apart the equivalence proof, but still until now compactness (at least the "finite subcover" version) was just some (pretty hard to understand) concept floating around in my head, and in not even 20 minutes you have given it a really good general meaning to keep with it! You've earned a new subscriber.
I was rewarded by rewatching some segments of this video before moving onto the next ones. Very cool to learn how a topic I have been introduced to, analysis in one variable, is a special case of something much vaster.
In calculating space requirements for wiring in commercial airplanes, we used a standard calculation (which included a small fudge factor to allow for space between wire/cable circumferences. We had used the same formula for almost 40 years until I found an issue with a case where the formula gave a smaller circumference for a two conductor scenario than the combined diameters of the two cables side by side. I submitted a correction to the formula to check for this condition and return the sum of the two diameters where appropriate. Fun stuff!
Ohh Jesus Christ my favourite channel's video just premiered..close all the doors, switch off all the lights..put on the headphone...ohh yes don't forget all other thoughts in your mind...take a deep breadth..enjoy the ride like no other!! Yes..yes..yes...
The example and the counter example of compactness in terms of open cover in the intervals [0, 1] and (0, 1) help me a lot in grasping the definition of compact space in terms of open cover. I understand both rigorously and intuitively about the sequential compactness since long ago, but I couldn't get the intuitive sense of open cover compactness even though I know its formal definition, right until I watched your presentation in the example in [0, 1] and the counter example in (0, 1). Thanks a lot! Keep up your brilliant work, Sir!
what a fantastic video! i've had topology in class last year and i still learned something new! will be recommending this to my friends. keep up the great work! it's really appreciated
Wow oh wow! When I first learned about Taylor and Maclaurin series (some 50 years ago) I was exposed merely to the mechanics of the functions and theorems. This actually gives insight to the behaviour of the functions on various domains. Thank you very much.
An unbounded sequence can definitely have convergent subsequence, and chaotic sequence may neither converge nor diverge, yet not contain any cycle and thus would have no convergent subsequence.
I remember a tiny, dense tome by Michael Spivac, I believe it was titled, Calculus on Manifolds, whose first chapter dealt with compactness, in all the frugal clarity that the printed page offers to illuminating math concepts. Needless to say, I did not get past page 2. That was back in 1988. Now, a return of Compactness via this video, and a part of my soul can now rest.
I'm not sure what the target audience for this video is, since I dont think most people would understand it if they had never taken intro real analysis with proofs before. That being said, I WISH this video had been around when I was taking undergrad real analysis and struggling with the concepts of compactness and point set topology. This is easily the best and most clear treatment of this subject i have ever seen. This video condenses entire proofs into intuitive visualizations. It wouldve made my midterm easier :)
I like to think of compact spaces as spaces which, while potentially infinite they still don't provide enough space to cram an infinite amount of points in there that stay at a "minimal distance" from each other (that is, without clustering somewhere). Its super nice to have a notion of "finite volume-ish set" without even thinking of measuring volume.
I was quite happy to see the technicality remark in the beginning, I was about to sperg out on stuff you'd most likely talk about later in the vid. Yes I like topology(not the knot subset, more the 'yes it is compact therefore the proof is done') Edit: there are ways of proving that compactness works differently In infinite dimensions spaces that don't require the choice axiom, and I've been thaught to use it as little as possible since it can lead to weird results. I recognise that using a base makes the proof simpler than sequences of continuous functions, but I prefer when people say they're bringing the big guns.
I have my bachelor’s and master’s in math, though I spent the last year studying statistics, and not analysis, so I am officially subscribing as this was a good review of what I spent years learning (and then a year forgetting in exchange for skills in quantitative methods)
One of the things that drives me crazy about higher math education goes something like this: I've encountered all of these thought experiments and challenges in classes before but they've never told me why I'm learning them or what use they have to people above me. It's not until I read about something I'm not familiar with or listen to a random TH-cam video that I recognize why they were asking me these questions in the first place. Like, I get that I should be trying to figure them out but I can't go 10 weeks with 3 classes 4 days/wk all exploring results experimentally. Same with novel proofs. I only have so much time.
I really like the characterization of compactness from nonstandard analysis (equivalent to open cover definition): a set S is compact if and only if every point in the nonstandard extension of S, S*, is infinitely close to a standard point that’s in S. So the open interval is not compact because .999… is in (0,1)* (it’s less than 1 by an infinitesimal), but the point it’s infinitely close to (1) is not in the set. Makes the idea of compactness as ‘almost finite’ more apparent.😊
@jash21222im using it as shorthand. One could add a hyperfinite number of 0s and then 1 to get 0.0_1 where the underscore indicates a hyperfinite number of zeros. Easier to just say .99 for simple explanation
Nonstandard analysis is genius for storing sequences into the points themselves. There is clearly something wrong with teaching topology with so many sequential concepts, but it's way easier to approach that way at the same time. While nonstandard analysis requires much more background, it makes perfect sense of the way we introduce topological notions with sequences and help a lot to develop a topological intuition imo
for the computationally inclined: there are very nice interpretations of many topological concepts for programs (in particular, types can be seen as topological spaces with terms of those types as points). in this view, compact turns out to mean (roughly) "searchable in finite time" and some pretty surprising types are compact! check out Martín Escardo's work and his blog post "seemingly impossible functional programs" for an intro
This was pretty much my first introduction to topology so I definitely needed to pause the video and do some thinking for myself to wrap my head around some of these topics, but I thought this was such a great video!
Something odd to note. When considering a set X on the discrete metric, every subset is simultaneously open and closed. You can have sets in a metric space that are open and are closed. It’s weird, but it’s because of how we define “open” and “closed”. A closed set is such that the closure of the set is the initial set itself, while an open set is one where all every point is an interior point. The reason it gets weird on the discrete metric is because for every subset of X, the set of all boundary points is the empty set, so it contains all of its boundary, yet every point in the set is an interior point. Anyway, just something I thought I’d point out.
I can understand why something like compactness is a gate-keeper concept. But I think there are a lot of professors who don't do a good job explaining it. This video was excellent and was infinitely better than my own analysis teacher in college, who basically just wrote out the greek definitions and expected us to grasp why this was so important and how it applied to example cases. Examples are vital to grasping topics like this. I think with videos like this available to us all now, a far greater number of people will be able to progress in advanced math than before. There have always been a lot of bad math teachers! Many of them just assumed some subset of their students were talented enough to pass their class, but a lot of those students had better resources for learning math (such as a mathematically inclined parent or friend). It is also makes me smirk at the idea of trying to learn this in college, which is super expensive and far poorer in quality! TH-cam may make a degree obsolete sooner than later, we'll just need to do like comp sci and have certs.
This compactness has some relation to Noetherian topological spaces like Noetherian schemes and other objects like presheaves, sheaves, coherent sheaves. Also of note is that locally compact topological groups have the averaging Haar measure and are used in harmonic analysis.
This seems like a good frame work to conceptualize consciousness. The observer is the open set. The infinite sub covers are dimensional configurations of how we interpret data points. We can use less dimensions to make up our model or more. We swim through the universe seeking sequential compactness, changing our cover in the space of dimensions. Each cover pattern having its own viewpoint.
Somewhere around 9:00, the pivot from topological spaces to metric spaces seems to be complete. 'More unusual topological spaces' includes at least non-first-countable spaces and maybe all non-metrisable spaces. Even for metric spaces, the equivalence between compactness and sequential compactness may depend on a countable choice principle. I still like the way that I was introduced to compactness. In my first Analysis course, we proved the extreme value theorem and some other results with a minimum of topology. I suspected that the theorems we had proved by bisection were somehow related to each other, and it all fit together in my second Analysis course, in which we used compactness to prove generalisations of the same theorems.
Great video! But just pointing a few things: 1. Talking about dimensions (in the usual sense) in metric spaces does not make sense, since it is a concept which you loose when you jump from normed spaces to metric spaces (noticing you used a norm instead of a metric when you showed the sequence in an infinite dimension space) 2. In metric spaces (even R^n with a given metric), closed and bounded is not enough for compactness, I can show a few examples if you want. Heine-Borell theorem only works with Euclidean (or equivalent) metrics. 3. There are topological spaces where you can fin compact sets that are not closed. The correct way to say it is: For a topological T2 space, compact implies closed. In metric spaces compact always implies closed since every metric space is T2. Sorry if my English isnt too good. Nice video!!
Can’t one define a notion of the dimension in a metric space by using like, the scaling of “smallest number of balls of radius epsilon needed to cover a ball of radius r”? Like... hm, well, I guess there are a bunch of different variations on this idea, but, for a given base point x, if you look at f(r,epsilon) = (minimum number of balls of radius epsilon which cover the ball centered at x of radius r) and find what constant n makes (r/epsilon)^n comparable to f(r,n) asymptotically as (some specific way to to take epsilon and r asymptotically) Like, if the larger space has infinite diameter (and not just because of disjoint components. I mean, the supremum of distances between points that are finitely far away is infinite) you might want to take the limit as r goes to infinity (and I think this could give a notion of dimension even if topologically the space is just a countably infinite set of discrete points) Or, if you are more interested in the space locally, you could take the limit as r goes to zero, and where epsilon goes to zero proportionally. I think this kind of thing is used to define fractal dimension? ... Or, also, there is, iirc, a topological definition of dimension? Based on like, what patterns of intersection and non-intersection are possible among open subsets? Idr exactly
@@drdca8263 Im talking about the usual notion of dimension in vector spaces, you keep that notion with norms but you loose it with metrics, also you even loose the notion of metric balls with topologies
@@pedrillowsgates6961 ok, but there are still notions of (integer-valued) dimension in general topological spaces, which, in any topological vector space over R, should, I think, agree with the vector space definition. So, I don’t see why we should say that we lose the notion of dimension when no longer talking about a subset of a vector space? Like, sure, it is no longer defined by the cardinality of a basis. ...So? We still have an appropriate notion of dimension.
@@drdca8263 sure you are right, I changed my comment to clarify that im talking about the "usual way" to define dimensions (number of elements of a basis) Also note that with the "covering definition" dimension can change between two spaces (R^n, d1) and (R^n, d2) when d1 and d2 are different metrics, but using the usual definition with two finite-dimensional normed spaces (R^n, n1) and (R^n, n2) does not change the dimension (since all n-dimensional metric spaces are equivalent). Note: n is always the same number I those cases Noticing the covering definition is equivalent to the usual one if we are talking about normed spaces.
Have you heard of Trajectoids? Shapes that, when rolled, trace out a particular trajectory. I saw a bit of information on them and they just seemed to fit into your "rolling shapes on surfaces" series so well.
Is it true that in reality mathematical concepts go inverse way from explanation - first a mathematician glances an intuition of what "that" is, and then refines and refines it to the point of definition, so "grasping it" (however vague) comes first, and definition actually comes last?
You can use Dirichlets function to make a function that has no minimum or maximum, touches the points 0|0 and 1|0, and is defined everywhere. But the function is also discontinuous everywhere. Let D(x) be similar to the Dirichlets function: 1 for each irrational number, -1 for each rational number. Define T(x) = D(x) * x. T(x) now touches the point 0|0. As x gets closer to 0, so does the function value. Define S(x) = T(x) * (x-1). S(x) now touches the point 1|0 and 0|0. As x gets closer to 0 or 1 the function value gets closer to 0. Define R(x) = S(x) / x - 0.5. R(x) now has no maximum or minimum. As x gets closer to 0.5, its function value tends to infinity for irrational numbers and -infinity for rational numbers. But it is also not defined at x=0.5. So finally define Z(x) = R(x) for x!=0.5 and Z(x) = 0 for x=0.5. Z(x) is now defined everywhere, has no minimum or maximum and touches 0|0 and 1|0. q.e.d.
I like to think of compact topological spaces as the "globally closed" sets. In general the notion of closed set is defined with respect to a topological space, but actually a topological space is compact if it remains closed in any topological space that entends its topology. Sometimes this definition is not of much use but sometimes it really makes a lot of sense! This also gives a nice relationship with completeness: a metric space is complete if and only if it is closed in any metric space.
5:54 So I guess you could define compactness like this? "No matter how you 'divide' a space that covers the set, I can cover the set in finite time by choosing pieces reasonably"
Intuitively, I've always thought of compactness more as the opposite of *non*-compactness, which is a kind of "endlessness". But it's tricky, since this is a non-metric concept of endlessness: it can be squished into what seems like a finite space, just with some of the boundary removed. It can just be endless because you took away some piece of the end. It's kind of fascinating that, for spaces with a concept of continuity, you can define something that's like the difference between "finitely big" and "infinitely big" without actually having a definite concept of size. (It's not the literal size of the set, since of course a compact space can have an uncountable number of points.) When you cited the topological definition at the beginning of the video, it blew off some cobwebs in my brain--been so long since I had occasion to use that.
Hey all. Just a few details I want to clarify:
1. Technically, the first version of the puzzle given at the beginning of the video (using an open domain) can be solved by a simple diagonal line since it attains its maximum and minimum at the domain's endpoints, which are excluded in this case. While that is true, I was trying to avoid that solution since it feels like one of those "technically correct" but not very interesting solutions since the graph is still bounded (yes, I could exclude this solution by using the term "supremum" instead of "maximum", but that's a term many viewers won't know and I didn't want to distract from the main point by explaining it). There's actually a footnote about this in the bottom-right corner at 0:54, but it flashed by quickly, so I don't blame you if you missed it.
2. Many have suggested using a constant function like f(x) = 3 as a solution to the second version of the puzzle (with a closed domain), but strictly speaking, a constant function DOES have both a maximum and a minimum: it's the value of the constant itself (e.g. 3). This is because the technical definition of "max" in math is the function's output that is greater than OR EQUAL TO all other output values, and likewise for "min".
3. At 10:24 I mentioned that a compact set can't have any "holes". This was meant to be casual speak for "single point gaps" and not large missing shapes in the interior. It's possible for sets to have "large holes" in them and still be compact. For example, as some have pointed out in the comments, an annulus (a disk with a smaller disk cut out of it) can be compact as long as it includes the entirety of both its inner and outer boundaries.
10:35 if a sequence approaches a single gap-point, doesn't is converge to this point even if the point is not in the set?
@@LB-qr7nv Ah, I should have said "fail to converge *to a point in the set*". Yes, if the sequence approaches a single point gap, it will still converge to that point (assuming you're including that gap point as part of the larger ambient space), but the set won't be sequentially compact since the limit point is outside the set.
I was thinking more the absolute value of a tangent.
@@JarekHardysz It actually can't be solved using a straight line. The extreme value theorem tells us that on a closed interval [a,b] there must be one maximum and one minimum. It is never stated that one point can't be both a min and a max at the same time, as the theorem only fails when there is either a higher or a lower point than our original point. If you find that a bit hard to believe, then imagine a function f(x) = 2. This function is always constant, right? You can ask yourself the following "What is the lowest possible value for f?" you can instantly realize that "Well, I can't go lower than 2, therefore it is the lowest possible value". The same reasoning works for the maximum value.
It's been a while since I learned about continuous functions, so maybe this just isn't continuous, but what about 1/|x-0.5|. It would rise to infinity at 0.5, then drop back down without the break in the center of the line
Hi. i am the one who wrote the paper cited here. Wow, I had no idea you had made a cartoon version of my master's thesis (more or less). Both humbled and amazed at how it has come to life. Wonderful job! ❤
r u a math major?
@@Alrightmira I am an associate professor of math education. I wrote this paper on which this is based (to a large extent?) as my master's thesis from UC Berkeley.
@@manyapajama that’s so cool!
@@Alrightmira yeah, also cool that something you write as a student actually gets read, and that it helps people. I can't tell you how gratifying it is to read all these comments.
Well this is a fun little addition to a wonderful video!
I've been exposed to compactness in 3 different math classes, and I have to say this video has given me more clarity than anything else by an enormous margin
I've had this experience a lot with math and math TH-cam. It's really a consequence of the fact that in school, doing the math is paramount. If you can do the math, it doesn't matter so much whether you have any good intuition for the concepts. Not saying that's a good thing, but it's definitely the principle many schools operate under. (Also, had you not done so much math involving compactness, would this intuitive revelation have really been such a revelation?)
I've seen it in a few classes and had no idea what it really was outside the formal definition
OP Agreed!
@@kruksog I think you're absolutely right that if not for hours spent wrestling the definition into proofs that felt obscene, this video wouldn't have been so powerful. I guess I should really say I'm so lucky to be learning in a time when we have youtubers like morphocular to augment normal education!
Open or close margins?
Back in university, a professor told me that compactness was an analysis/topology-friendly generalisation of finiteness. That has stuck with me since.
There is much truth to this. Basically every theorem where compactness is required is a generalization of a property of finite sets, including the example in the video.
I think this is a very good way to think about compactness. One very useful conceptualization I've come across is to think of finiteness as being a property that is made up of two smaller concepts: discreteness and compactness.
This is an unbelievably clear description of arguably one of the most abstruse concepts in mathematics. People who have not encountered compactness before are not going to appreciate just how special this video is. Absolutely stellar.
Back when I first heard the definition, my reaction was "wtf is this thing, and why is this random property interesting?" It wasn't long before it was proven that these sets have magical properties... but I still didn't have much of an intuition for why aside from all the gears magically fitting into place.
I don't think compactness is an abstruse concept at all.
@@pierrecurie man, closed intervals are different from open intervals. That's the motivation. Then you can extract intuition from closed intervals.
@samueldeandrade8535 I kind of understood it from the get go. But that is because before we had topology we had real analysis. And the definition in a metric space is very intuitive(bounded and closed space).
In a general topological space, the definition gets a little dicey for your intuition. But when it clicks you realise how clever the cover-subcover definition is. It's like the epsilon delta click.
@@pierrecuriecompactness is topological finiteness
Happy to see Topological concepts being explained so visually and intuitively :)
Ha, that sounds contradictory 😂
"... a sequence of points that endlessly explores all the infinitely many coordinate axes of the infinite-dimensional space while always staying a fixed distance away from the origin" is one of the best explanations I've heard. For some reason, that line made me really tie it together.
Glad you pointed out Seqential Compactness =/= Compactness in all topological spaces (metric spaces yes, others not necessarily). For those curious, there's an analogous idea to seqences called nets that *does* apply to all topological spaces: A topological space is compact iff every -bounded- net has a convergent subnet.
Good intro to Compactness! It's definitely a weird one to wrap your head around initially, took me a good year of study before I was really comfortable with it and picking out when it'd be useful.
You say "A topological space is compact iff every bounded net has a convergent subnet." This is correct if you drop the word "bounded". In fact, boundedness is not even defined in general topological spaces.
@@twwc960Thanks for the correction, yep I mistyped :)
≠ key exists
@@jeffbrownstain You have an unusual keyboard. I actually prefer the composition of `!=`, `!
@@twwc960Yes! Only in bornological spaces, if I am not mistaken.
I had a question which I answered in the process of writing it down. I'm leaving it here in case somebody else is wondering the same thing.
We have the [0, 1] interval and an infinite open cover consisting of balls where each consecutive ball gets smaller. More precisely the first covers [0, 0.5]; the second [0.5, 0.75]; the third [0.75, 0.875], etc. The first ball would have radius 0.25 + ε; the second 0.125 + ε/2; etc. What is the finite subcover?
answer: This is not a cover because the point at 1 is not covered. If you try to cover 1, the new ball would cover some points near 1 and the remaining part of the line segment can be covered with finitely many balls.
Wow, thank you! I was wondering about EXACTLY this "cover," and your succinct answer shows me my error :D
So the open set (0, 1) is not compact?
@@electricengine8407 Yes. (0, 1) [0, 1) (0, 1] are all not compact. Only [0, 1] is compact.
MOM NOT RIGHT NOW! I'M BUSY, NEW MORPHOCULAR VIDEO JUST DROPPED
Yeah, yeah, yeah!!! True, true, very true!)
Math God has chosen the moment
content is golden but his voice... damn why is it so irritating🙁
facts fr fr
@@FloppaTheBasedyeah, I feel horrible for saying this, but his voice is the epitome of 🤓
One of the big revelations for me when I was learning about covering spaces was that the bulk of the proofs were just compactness arguments. You're given a path in a space and some complicated local property for the points on that path. The proofs seem complicated, but they're just multiple iterations of "use compactness of the path to cut down open covers to finite subcovers where we can handle compatibility on overlapping sets".
After 3 years I have finally understood what "compact" means. Thank you
You have got to have one of the best math channels on TH-cam (or anywhere, for that matter). I know a lot of us (including myself) have been introduced to your channel via 3blue1brown's SoME challenges over the last couple of years, which puts you in some pretty stellar company, but this is truly top-tier stuff, man. This channel is equally as good and offers a much different approach as well as covers different topics at various levels of difficulty. Your ability to make such rigorous and counterintuitive concepts seem so natural is incredible. You are an awesome educator. Thank you for this.
Wow! Thanks so much for the kind words! It really means a lot to me.
It is the best channel for me.
wish i could send this video to myself 25 years ago! seriously, thank you for the intuitive explanation with excellent visuals
I honestly think this is the best new math youtube channel. Its like 3b1b yet has its own style and isn’t like those hundreds of 3b1b knock off channels that exist
Compactness always kind of baffeled me. In the finite-dimensional real numbers, it simply means 'closed and bounded', which I could wrap my head around. But in other domains, it means a little something extra that I could never really grasp.
I am through with analysis already, but it was super nice to revisit this and get a better understanding for it!
You may already know this, but in fact your statement that (compactness in finite dimensional euclidean space) (closed and bounded) can be further generalised to: (compactness in finite dimensional normed space) (closed and bounded).
@@robbie979Yeah, you're absolutely right. But those are always isomorphic to R^n, if I remember correctly? Don't ask me how to prove that, though :D
But doesn't "closed and bounded" contradict this video at 4:10 and on which discusses open sets that are compact?
@@Graham_Wideman It doesn't talk about open sets that are compact there :) What it does talk about is how you can cover a compact set with a, let's call it patchwork of little open sets. But this patchwork itself isn't compact. It just covers something compact.
@@efi3825 No doubt you are right, in which case the statement at 4:16 "The important sets to pay attention to regarding compactness are the open sets." is highly misleading.
Thank you for this excellent video ! I'm a self-learner and compactness was NEVER explained intuitively so with time I just accepted it to be the generalization of "close and bounded" (like open sets with open balls) without any motivation to the definition.
Now, with this new point of view, the sequential approach make me understand a bit more the WHY
Such a sophisticated domain and so lightly exposed with such thoroughness. Never had the chance to meet the beast before, just heard of it. Not so frightening after all 😅😉
It's one of those things that are super useful but also mysteriously technical and playing a background role, usually nothing flashy enough to get much attention. Same for for much of point set topology.
I think it’s fun that you can strengthen the boundedness claim to the full extreme value theorem straightforwardly with a second application of compactness, by showing that continuous images of compact sets are compact, and thus in particular closed (so the function’s range contains the minimum and maximum values) 🙂
You can in fact show that continuous functions preserve compactness for any topological spaces, no subsequences needed :D
Indeed the proof is quite short: Suppose f: X \to Y is continuous and surjective (for ease, if it isnt we can replace Y with f(X)) and X is a compact space. Let U_\lambda be an open cover of Y. Consider the collection of the preimage of each of those U_\lambda 's. This is a open cover of X, and must have a finite subcover, say f^{-1}(U_1), ..., f^{-1}(U_n). Then U_1,...U_n is a finite cover of Y.
But why would that be a "second application"? Isnt that a complete replacement of a proof. And a way stronger one too? Or am i misunderstanding.
At 3:57, I just want to add one comment. Open and closed are not opposites in topology. It is possible for a set to have no boundary points and be both open and closed.
The corner note does mention "clopen" sets :3
@@askyleExcellent! I didn't see it since it flashed by quickly
he doesn't say that they are opposites, but he does say that a closed set includes all of its boundary, when it doesn't in the case of clopen sets
@@leave-a-comment-at-the-door a clopen set _does_ include all of its (empty) boundary tho.
@@askyle eeh, maybe I'm misunderstanding the wikipedia article then. it's pretty late now so I'll look at it later
The proof of the Heine-Borel theorem is actually really nice, if you compare it to how transfinite induction works, you'll notice that it's basically like a topological version of induction for the real numbers.
Edit: I'll expand on this:
In the natural numbers, induction can be described by this idea: suppose you have a set S ⊂ ℕ, and it satisfies the following two conditions:
- S contains 0
- if S contains all numbers lower than n, then S contains n.
Then it follows that S must be the entirety of ℕ.
Obviously this wouldn't directly work on the real numbers, but you can modify, it. Let's say you have a set S ⊂ [0, ∞), where [0, ∞) are all the nonnegative real numbers, and it satisfies the following two properties:
- S contains an open set containing 0
- if S contains all numbers lower than n ∈ ℝ, then S contains an open set containing n
Then it follows that S must be the entirety of [0, ∞). This can be verified to actually work through a simple least upper bound argument. If you replace [0, ∞) by a set of the form [0, x], you get a similar result that x must be contained in S.
Now let's say you have an open cover U of the set [0, 1], and let S be the set of all numbers x such that [0, x] can be covered by a finite amount of sets from U. Then,
- Clearly S contains an open set containing 0, as the cover must have an open set containing 0 and that single set forms a finite subcover of [0, e] for any sufficiently small e
- if S contains all numbers lower than n, then find any open set A from the cover which contains n, by definition of open sets, you can find a number e such that (n-e, n+e) is contained in A, then by the assumption, we can find a finite subcover of [0, n-e] and by adding A to that finite subcover, we get a finite subcover of [0, n+e/2], therefore, an open set containing n, (n-e, n+e/2) is in S.
Since we fulfilled the two conditions, we get that S contains 1, and therefore [0, 1] has a finite subcover.
When you use the letter n you still mean reals, right?
Awesome, thank you!
@@Galinaceo0 yes, ill make it more clear
@@dogedev1337 If this was the more clear version.... I don't even understand what you're trying to say, let alone how you got to saying it. You had me, tho, all the way up until the 3rd paragraph.
@@kindlin Have you taken a real analysis or topology class? Not that you necessarily would need it but there's a bit of assumed background. If you like I can reply with some "get there as fast as possible" ideas for this specific proof
i knew nothing about compactness, topology and next to nothing about analysis. Now I understand. Thank you.
My classmates always wonder why I seem to get concepts so quickly in class, little do they know that I essentially watch hours of extra math lectures a week
Loved the video! I've struggled with compactness in real analysis and just automatically translated it to "closed and bounded". Animations and topology are a perfect match.
Thanks so much! Glad it was helpful!
I cannot understate the value of what you are doing. I’ve always thought my brain was wired but math, but have struggled translating the concepts into language and vice versa; you do this masterfully. Thank you and subbed!
College professor here. I LOVED this video. Real analysis or functional analysis would be so much easier starting the class with content such as this
Kudos kudos kudos
This is an excellent video, and just in time for my Analysis II exam! In Analysis I, I was introduced to compactness (together with the extreme value theorem and some other important concepts) only through sequential compactness in the context of metric spaces, and in Analysis II was stumped with the general definition of compactness, together with a (horrendously large) proof that it is equivalent to sequential compactness and also completeness and total boundedness on metric spaces. It's really hard to get an intuition for what it really does, I got a sense of the same kind of "reduction to finiteness" meaning when i spend hours picking apart the equivalence proof, but still until now compactness (at least the "finite subcover" version) was just some (pretty hard to understand) concept floating around in my head, and in not even 20 minutes you have given it a really good general meaning to keep with it! You've earned a new subscriber.
I was rewarded by rewatching some segments of this video before moving onto the next ones. Very cool to learn how a topic I have been introduced to, analysis in one variable, is a special case of something much vaster.
Amazing introduction to compactness. I consider myself already quite familiar with the concept, but this made it even more tangible and visual
I love how you start out with an example of how it is useful
16:30 onwards is just Genius. Finally Made me see what motivates the definition of compactness
Great content, as usual. Please keep making such valuable videos, the quality of your work is amazing.
This is the most satisfying explanation of compactness I have ever gotten, brilliantly done!
It's been many years since I took Analysis but this is the first time I've understood the motivation behind compactness.
Its amazing how we can have these quality of videos explaning the most complex ideas and we can access free in any place at any time. Thanks a lot
Babe not now, a new morphocular video just dropped.
Dude I love you, thank you for building it up so well but also send us off with more questions! You are a good teacher.
I never really understood this concept when I took Real Analysis. Thanks for making it clear to me!
In calculating space requirements for wiring in commercial airplanes, we used a standard calculation (which included a small fudge factor to allow for space between wire/cable circumferences. We had used the same formula for almost 40 years until I found an issue with a case where the formula gave a smaller circumference for a two conductor scenario than the combined diameters of the two cables side by side. I submitted a correction to the formula to check for this condition and return the sum of the two diameters where appropriate. Fun stuff!
Ohh Jesus Christ my favourite channel's video just premiered..close all the doors, switch off all the lights..put on the headphone...ohh yes don't forget all other thoughts in your mind...take a deep breadth..enjoy the ride like no other!! Yes..yes..yes...
This is the BEST exposition of the extreme value theorem I have ever seen.
This is crazy, I learned compactness in the context of models for formal languages-and the parallels are clear!
The example and the counter example of compactness in terms of open cover in the intervals [0, 1] and (0, 1) help me a lot in grasping the definition of compact space in terms of open cover.
I understand both rigorously and intuitively about the sequential compactness since long ago, but I couldn't get the intuitive sense of open cover compactness even though I know its formal definition, right until I watched your presentation in the example in [0, 1] and the counter example in (0, 1).
Thanks a lot!
Keep up your brilliant work, Sir!
what a fantastic video! i've had topology in class last year and i still learned something new! will be recommending this to my friends. keep up the great work! it's really appreciated
Wow oh wow! When I first learned about Taylor and Maclaurin series (some 50 years ago) I was exposed merely to the mechanics of the functions and theorems. This actually gives insight to the behaviour of the functions on various domains. Thank you very much.
An unbounded sequence can definitely have convergent subsequence, and chaotic sequence may neither converge nor diverge, yet not contain any cycle and thus would have no convergent subsequence.
COMPACTNESS looks like a cool new SNES title the way you formatted the concept.
Very clearly explained as always, Morph!
Your way of explaining mathematics is compact , literally
I remember a tiny, dense tome by Michael Spivac, I believe it was titled, Calculus on Manifolds, whose first chapter dealt with compactness, in all the frugal clarity that the printed page offers to illuminating math concepts. Needless to say, I did not get past page 2. That was back in 1988. Now, a return of Compactness via this video, and a part of my soul can now rest.
I'm not sure what the target audience for this video is, since I dont think most people would understand it if they had never taken intro real analysis with proofs before.
That being said, I WISH this video had been around when I was taking undergrad real analysis and struggling with the concepts of compactness and point set topology. This is easily the best and most clear treatment of this subject i have ever seen. This video condenses entire proofs into intuitive visualizations. It wouldve made my midterm easier :)
This video is so good, I appreciate the efforts in both the explanation and the visuals
The time spent to make this must have been crazy
I like to think of compact spaces as spaces which, while potentially infinite they still don't provide enough space to cram an infinite amount of points in there that stay at a "minimal distance" from each other (that is, without clustering somewhere). Its super nice to have a notion of "finite volume-ish set" without even thinking of measuring volume.
Though that intuition is tripped up a bit by the fact that you can often take a non-compact set and turn it compact by adding something.
3:58 in line with the terminology for doors, I propose a set that contains some of its boundary is called “ajar”
Makes sense: a jar is open at the top and closed at the bottom😊
I was quite happy to see the technicality remark in the beginning, I was about to sperg out on stuff you'd most likely talk about later in the vid.
Yes I like topology(not the knot subset, more the 'yes it is compact therefore the proof is done')
Edit: there are ways of proving that compactness works differently In infinite dimensions spaces that don't require the choice axiom, and I've been thaught to use it as little as possible since it can lead to weird results.
I recognise that using a base makes the proof simpler than sequences of continuous functions, but I prefer when people say they're bringing the big guns.
This is possibly the best math video on TH-cam. Well done!
I have my bachelor’s and master’s in math, though I spent the last year studying statistics, and not analysis, so I am officially subscribing as this was a good review of what I spent years learning (and then a year forgetting in exchange for skills in quantitative methods)
Wow that came full circle, also I got flash-backs to my intro to differential calculus class haha. Great video mate!
One of the best math channels in the galaxy
One of the things that drives me crazy about higher math education goes something like this:
I've encountered all of these thought experiments and challenges in classes before but they've never told me why I'm learning them or what use they have to people above me. It's not until I read about something I'm not familiar with or listen to a random TH-cam video that I recognize why they were asking me these questions in the first place.
Like, I get that I should be trying to figure them out but I can't go 10 weeks with 3 classes 4 days/wk all exploring results experimentally. Same with novel proofs. I only have so much time.
“Suppose every continuous function f: X -> R is bounded. Prove that X is compact.” was a question on our analysis midterm.
I really like the characterization of compactness from nonstandard analysis (equivalent to open cover definition): a set S is compact if and only if every point in the nonstandard extension of S, S*, is infinitely close to a standard point that’s in S. So the open interval is not compact because .999… is in (0,1)* (it’s less than 1 by an infinitesimal), but the point it’s infinitely close to (1) is not in the set. Makes the idea of compactness as ‘almost finite’ more apparent.😊
@jash21222im using it as shorthand. One could add a hyperfinite number of 0s and then 1 to get 0.0_1 where the underscore indicates a hyperfinite number of zeros. Easier to just say .99 for simple explanation
Nonstandard analysis is genius for storing sequences into the points themselves. There is clearly something wrong with teaching topology with so many sequential concepts, but it's way easier to approach that way at the same time.
While nonstandard analysis requires much more background, it makes perfect sense of the way we introduce topological notions with sequences and help a lot to develop a topological intuition imo
it is really frustrating in a way that I was able to pass classes like real analysis without ever really grasping the concepts intuitively
for the computationally inclined: there are very nice interpretations of many topological concepts for programs (in particular, types can be seen as topological spaces with terms of those types as points). in this view, compact turns out to mean (roughly) "searchable in finite time" and some pretty surprising types are compact!
check out Martín Escardo's work and his blog post "seemingly impossible functional programs" for an intro
This was pretty much my first introduction to topology so I definitely needed to pause the video and do some thinking for myself to wrap my head around some of these topics, but I thought this was such a great video!
amazing video !!
I loved the way you explained this concept
This video explained to me why ford circles are important for N, and I am quite happy about that.
Something odd to note. When considering a set X on the discrete metric, every subset is simultaneously open and closed. You can have sets in a metric space that are open and are closed. It’s weird, but it’s because of how we define “open” and “closed”. A closed set is such that the closure of the set is the initial set itself, while an open set is one where all every point is an interior point. The reason it gets weird on the discrete metric is because for every subset of X, the set of all boundary points is the empty set, so it contains all of its boundary, yet every point in the set is an interior point. Anyway, just something I thought I’d point out.
Another interesting fact: A space is connected if and only if the only clopen sets it has are the empty set and the whole space
This was straight up better than my Real Analysis and Topology classes
For humanity's sake, you need to make more videos like this one. Great job! I applaud you,
I can understand why something like compactness is a gate-keeper concept. But I think there are a lot of professors who don't do a good job explaining it. This video was excellent and was infinitely better than my own analysis teacher in college, who basically just wrote out the greek definitions and expected us to grasp why this was so important and how it applied to example cases. Examples are vital to grasping topics like this. I think with videos like this available to us all now, a far greater number of people will be able to progress in advanced math than before.
There have always been a lot of bad math teachers! Many of them just assumed some subset of their students were talented enough to pass their class, but a lot of those students had better resources for learning math (such as a mathematically inclined parent or friend).
It is also makes me smirk at the idea of trying to learn this in college, which is super expensive and far poorer in quality! TH-cam may make a degree obsolete sooner than later, we'll just need to do like comp sci and have certs.
This compactness has some relation to Noetherian topological spaces like Noetherian schemes and other objects like presheaves, sheaves, coherent sheaves. Also of note is that locally compact topological groups have the averaging Haar measure and are used in harmonic analysis.
This seems like a good frame work to conceptualize consciousness. The observer is the open set. The infinite sub covers are dimensional configurations of how we interpret data points. We can use less dimensions to make up our model or more. We swim through the universe seeking sequential compactness, changing our cover in the space of dimensions. Each cover pattern having its own viewpoint.
Somewhere around 9:00, the pivot from topological spaces to metric spaces seems to be complete. 'More unusual topological spaces' includes at least non-first-countable spaces and maybe all non-metrisable spaces. Even for metric spaces, the equivalence between compactness and sequential compactness may depend on a countable choice principle.
I still like the way that I was introduced to compactness. In my first Analysis course, we proved the extreme value theorem and some other results with a minimum of topology. I suspected that the theorems we had proved by bisection were somehow related to each other, and it all fit together in my second Analysis course, in which we used compactness to prove generalisations of the same theorems.
This was EXTREMELY helpful! Thank you so much!!
This genre of TH-cam videos marks a golden age for the bedraggled but stoic armies of mathematics enthusiasts out there.
congrats on nearly 100k, fully deserved
A set that contains only part of its boundary is called "ajar"
At least, that's what I called it when I took point set topoology in college.;-)
Great video! But just pointing a few things:
1. Talking about dimensions (in the usual sense) in metric spaces does not make sense, since it is a concept which you loose when you jump from normed spaces to metric spaces (noticing you used a norm instead of a metric when you showed the sequence in an infinite dimension space)
2. In metric spaces (even R^n with a given metric), closed and bounded is not enough for compactness, I can show a few examples if you want. Heine-Borell theorem only works with Euclidean (or equivalent) metrics.
3. There are topological spaces where you can fin compact sets that are not closed. The correct way to say it is: For a topological T2 space, compact implies closed. In metric spaces compact always implies closed since every metric space is T2.
Sorry if my English isnt too good. Nice video!!
Can’t one define a notion of the dimension in a metric space by using like, the scaling of “smallest number of balls of radius epsilon needed to cover a ball of radius r”?
Like...
hm, well, I guess there are a bunch of different variations on this idea, but,
for a given base point x, if you look at f(r,epsilon) = (minimum number of balls of radius epsilon which cover the ball centered at x of radius r)
and find what constant n makes (r/epsilon)^n comparable to f(r,n) asymptotically as (some specific way to to take epsilon and r asymptotically)
Like, if the larger space has infinite diameter (and not just because of disjoint components. I mean, the supremum of distances between points that are finitely far away is infinite) you might want to take the limit as r goes to infinity (and I think this could give a notion of dimension even if topologically the space is just a countably infinite set of discrete points)
Or, if you are more interested in the space locally, you could take the limit as r goes to zero, and where epsilon goes to zero proportionally.
I think this kind of thing is used to define fractal dimension?
...
Or, also, there is, iirc, a topological definition of dimension?
Based on like, what patterns of intersection and non-intersection are possible among open subsets? Idr exactly
@@drdca8263 Im talking about the usual notion of dimension in vector spaces, you keep that notion with norms but you loose it with metrics, also you even loose the notion of metric balls with topologies
@@pedrillowsgates6961 ok, but there are still notions of (integer-valued) dimension in general topological spaces,
which, in any topological vector space over R, should, I think, agree with the vector space definition.
So, I don’t see why we should say that we lose the notion of dimension when no longer talking about a subset of a vector space?
Like, sure, it is no longer defined by the cardinality of a basis. ...So? We still have an appropriate notion of dimension.
@@drdca8263 sure you are right, I changed my comment to clarify that im talking about the "usual way" to define dimensions (number of elements of a basis)
Also note that with the "covering definition" dimension can change between two spaces (R^n, d1) and (R^n, d2) when d1 and d2 are different metrics, but using the usual definition with two finite-dimensional normed spaces (R^n, n1) and (R^n, n2) does not change the dimension (since all n-dimensional metric spaces are equivalent). Note: n is always the same number I those cases
Noticing the covering definition is equivalent to the usual one if we are talking about normed spaces.
Have you heard of Trajectoids? Shapes that, when rolled, trace out a particular trajectory. I saw a bit of information on them and they just seemed to fit into your "rolling shapes on surfaces" series so well.
Ooo. I may have to bookmark that.
Did you also hear about trajectoids in 'Up and Atom' shorts?
@@deep45789 maaaaybeee
Literally studying topology rn. This is perfect timing 🎉🎉
Is it true that in reality mathematical concepts go inverse way from explanation - first a mathematician glances an intuition of what "that" is, and then refines and refines it to the point of definition, so "grasping it" (however vague) comes first, and definition actually comes last?
*[**01:16**]:* Another fun gray-area answer...
y = lim(t → x⁺) (1 / t)
Thank you so much for producing this clear and helpful video!!!
That's the essence of maths to me. Intuitive understanding.
You can use Dirichlets function to make a function that has no minimum or maximum, touches the points 0|0 and 1|0, and is defined everywhere.
But the function is also discontinuous everywhere. Let D(x) be similar to the Dirichlets function: 1 for each irrational number, -1 for each rational number.
Define T(x) = D(x) * x. T(x) now touches the point 0|0. As x gets closer to 0, so does the function value.
Define S(x) = T(x) * (x-1). S(x) now touches the point 1|0 and 0|0. As x gets closer to 0 or 1 the function value gets closer to 0.
Define R(x) = S(x) / x - 0.5. R(x) now has no maximum or minimum. As x gets closer to 0.5, its function value tends to infinity for irrational numbers and -infinity for rational numbers. But it is also not defined at x=0.5. So finally define Z(x) = R(x) for x!=0.5 and Z(x) = 0 for x=0.5.
Z(x) is now defined everywhere, has no minimum or maximum and touches 0|0 and 1|0. q.e.d.
Brilliant explanation of one of Real Analysis' most challenging concepts. Well done!
this is actually making me start to understand some stuff we were just supposed to assume in my intro linear algebra
I like to think of compact topological spaces as the "globally closed" sets. In general the notion of closed set is defined with respect to a topological space, but actually a topological space is compact if it remains closed in any topological space that entends its topology. Sometimes this definition is not of much use but sometimes it really makes a lot of sense!
This also gives a nice relationship with completeness: a metric space is complete if and only if it is closed in any metric space.
Can't wait to have a deeper grasp on compactness.
you are singlehandedly saving my advanced calc grade
5:54 So I guess you could define compactness like this?
"No matter how you 'divide' a space that covers the set, I can cover the set in finite time by choosing pieces reasonably"
One of the most beautiful and useful concept in analysis
this is so well done. i'm not sure if i know any other words that can describe how good this video is
As analyst, this video deserve 30k likes by mentioning sequential compactness, infinite dimension and total boundedness.
Hi Morph!
I hope I can fully understand compactness in the near future. My next semester starts on Monday!
Good luck and best wishes to you.
@@efi3825C's make degrees. LET'S GO.
Keep the topology videos coming! They are awesome
11:07 4-dimensional games are cool and all, but now I want an _infinite_-dimensional game.
More videos like this, please! To illustrate important math concepts.
Extreme Value this channel is
Intuitively, I've always thought of compactness more as the opposite of *non*-compactness, which is a kind of "endlessness". But it's tricky, since this is a non-metric concept of endlessness: it can be squished into what seems like a finite space, just with some of the boundary removed. It can just be endless because you took away some piece of the end.
It's kind of fascinating that, for spaces with a concept of continuity, you can define something that's like the difference between "finitely big" and "infinitely big" without actually having a definite concept of size. (It's not the literal size of the set, since of course a compact space can have an uncountable number of points.)
When you cited the topological definition at the beginning of the video, it blew off some cobwebs in my brain--been so long since I had occasion to use that.