Indexing with a dividing head and creating a mathematical solution, through use of gears, to solve an issue of not having the correct number of holes in a holeplate.
I have read about this in several different publications and understand in basics how to do this. It is in the Machinists Bible/ Machineries Handbook. This is the first video tutorial I have seen and I find it VERY helpful, thanks for a wonderful explanation. When I need to use this I will be better prepared, Cheers from John Australia.PS I have a Brown and Sharp Universal Miller (2A) with the Dividing head and all change gears to go with it. Made in about 1913 or so, very advanced design from a company the Machining world owes a huge amount of respect to. John.
Hi John, sorry for the slow reply I've just found your note in my spam folder. Silly people at TH-cam! I agree, I'm totally in awe at the engineering when I work with tools like this that often pre-date CNC. Sadly tools like this are becoming rare due to CNC. I have very dear friends in Melbourne, love your Country and people. Brad, Canada.
All good Brad, I wish you well. I like to know where things come from and as a result I think to myself about those that made the first machine tool. They are True Craftsmen! Thanks for your reply and enjoy your warmer months, it will become cooler here, however not as cool as you have in your Winter All the best from John Australia.
great explanation. I'm cutting a 96 tooth gear and picking the gears from the charts is nice but not knowing how they arrived at them had me scratching me head. Those men from yesteryear were so smart it amazes me. thank you for bridging the time gap.
Thanks brother for this differential indexing video. I didn't know differential indexing before so after watching this video I can now do differential indexing so thank you so much.
Excellent video. Numerous other YT producers have detailed indexing, but only mentioned differential, never giving any indication of what it is or how it's done. Does your indexer have a unique name? The other indexers I've seen don't appear to have the extension to connect to the table or to link to the chuck. Thanks again.
Hello again :) , can i ask if there is a way to find the helix angle of a damaged helical gear , if you have just the damaged gear , i did use my Universal Bevel protractor but the result was not accurate.
+machiningmoments Yes I have , The number of teeth is 15 tooth , and the outside diameter is about 54 , and this is a pic of it i.imgur. com / 0YMlizT . jpg
Ok, take the OD and subtract the depth of the tooth (this will get you close to pitch diameter(PD) unless you know the DP (in your case Normal Diametral Pitch)). Once you have pitch diameter multiply by pie(3.14) to get circumference. Now divide the number of teeth by the circumference this will give you circular pitch (distance from one tooth to the next at the PD) this is side opposite. Next measure the gears thickness at the tooth, this is side adjacent. The helix angle is only a trig function away. Note: both gears in mesh will have the angle and NDP. Good Luck!
machiningmoments ... Thank you again! I just watched this again after a few years, and found it just as fascinating as the first time. Actually, hi schoo shop class was the first time I was able to understand the geometry I was also studying. I became a wiz at making gears.
im about to pick up a brown and sharp head like this one and silly me I diden't even know this was a possbility thanks for the info does your mill have the capability of cutting helix gears? I would love to know about gearing a universal head in to the table of my universal mill .
+Chris Anderson Hi Chris, differential indexing is not that common but kind of neat. Yes I cut helical gears. I use a horizontal mill with a table that swivels (universal) and a bore mounted full form involute gear cutter. You need to know the gear tooth's DP and number (tooth size and number of teeth per inch of pitch diameter) to select the proper cutter. You also need to know the lead of the helix and the lead of the machine to calculate the gearing between the milling machines lead screw and the dividing head. Finally you need the helix angle of the gear to swivel the table to the angle. If your cutting a pair of gears and they are different diameters the lead of helix will change. Also if your gears are on parallel shafts one will be cut with the table swiveled right the second will need the table swivelled to the left (you also need to add a gear so the dividing head turns in the opposite rotation)(right and left hand helix). Crossing shafts have the same helix. Thanks for your question and comment.
Great question. With the gear blank in the dividing head I will either touch a square sitting on the table to the OD of the gear blank and measure from the square to the cutter. Repeat the procedure on the other side of the blank. I've also seen pinching a straight edge (rule) between gear blank top and cutter. If the cutter is centered the length of rule will be horizontal. You could measure to the table on both sides to straight edge.
Good video. You mentioned compound gears on back. I’m going over questions for making calculations for 53, 59, 101, and 175 divisions. I think I need more than two gears on back. How do I do the math?
Hi Dana, sorry for the slow reply busy weekend. So I assume you have your gear ratio fraction worked out. For argument sake let's say that ratio is 1/4 and you can't find two gears to satisfy this fraction. 1/4 is the same as 1/2 x 1/2 now look for gears to satisfy each fraction the first 1/2 gears are 24/48 and the second fraction is 32/64. The 24 gear is on the spindle it meshes with the 48 tooth gear. Stack the 32 gear on top of the 48 tooth gear (compound) the 32 gear meshes with the 64 tooth gear that is on the worm shaft. This is compound gearing satisfying the original 1/4 gear ratio. I hope this makes sense. Good luck.
machiningmoments didn’t get things worked out. Even if you did the 53 divisions and showed the math would be great. I tried different scenarios for factor A and just got confused using (A-N)x40/N.
Hi Dana, the formula is (A-N)x40/A. I assume you don't have a 53 hole plate, you could simple index 40 spaces on a 53 hole plate and ignore the gears. So, I choose 60 for an approximate (A) (60-53) x 40/60...if you work that out it 14/3 as an improper fraction (your gear ratio). 14/3 is the same thing as 7/3x 2/1. Now we look for a multiple of each fraction that will give us the gears we need. 7/3 x 8 will give us the first two gears 56/24...The other fraction 2/1 x 24 will give us the last two gears 48/24. 56 goes to the spindle and meshes with 24, 48 goes on top of the 24 (compound) and 48 meshes with 56 on the worm shaft. Your indexing is 40/A 40/60 or 2/3 find a multiple of this that works with a hole plate you have...30 as an example. The indexing is 20 spaces on a 30 hole plate. Note! the index plate has to rotate (driven by the gear train you created) make sure it is unlocked. Clear as mud? ;)
Okay. I worked out pretty much the same thing as you said only I had to use a 33 holes plate which would be 22 spaces on a 33 holes plate. Only thing is I’m not sure of the meshing of the gears. I’m a visual person so if you could draw the gears in contact with each other would be great. vintagemachinery.org/pubs/2185/5863.pdf this is a link to instruction manual to brown and sharp dividing head. It has some good info.
Hi Blair, great question. This requires differential indexing so (A-N)40/A Try A=120 (120 - 127)40/120 your indexing 40/120 becomes 1/3 not sure which dividing head you have but lets say 11 spaces on a 33 hole plate. Now used the full formula for the gear train which works out to -7/3. Multiple this fraction by 8 and you get -56/24 so your gears are 56 (driver) and 24 (driven). You need two idlers to satisfy the negative fraction (opposite rotation). Good Luck!
@@machiningmoments Thanks My Mill is a Parkson 2N Universal, with the 12" Parkson Universal Dividing Head, Only Problem now is all the Change Gears are Missing. I am going to get a price on a set of gears made by 3D printing, they should be fine for Indexing. It also came with a Cam Milling Attachment, that is quite a piece of equipment, today you just need to write a program and push Rum My Plate is double sided with the holes 1st Side 24,25,28,30,34,37,38,39,41,42,43. 2nd Side 46,47,49,51,53,54,57,58,59,62,66, The list of Change Gears Listed is 24,28,32,40,44,48,56(2),64,72,86,88,100 Teeth Do you have any suggestion's on extra change gears I should get besides what's listed? I can use 22 spaces on my 66 hole plate Thanks Blair
I have question Mr,, How to select gear train for making helical gear in fact I searched for this issue on net but no one covered this issue. Thanks from now.
Honestly Rico the answer is it was what fit in between. The number on teeth on the idle means nothing, it could be 10,000 teeth, all it does is provide a drive between the driver and driven gears. Good question!
Great explanation, only one nitpick, when you are doing the math in some cases you multiply the fraction by a number and multiply the nominator and denominator, other times you multiply only one. The issue is simply that when you are multiplying both you are really multiplying by one in the form of 2/2, 3/3, 4/4. I think it would be much more clear if you showed this in the video. For Example at 03:22 in the video the 4/7 * 3 should really be 4/7 * 3/3 = 12/21 The same for the 12/7 * 4/4 = 48/28 for the gear ratio below. This is not to be confused with the (3) * 4/7 on the second equation line which is really 3/1 * 4/7. Anyways I found the video very useful, Thank you!
@@machiningmoments It is a fantastic video, you did a great job explaining it. I am just getting started in machining and have much to learn, people like you are what will make it possible to learn this new skill.
It is more about creating a ratio that will allow the hole plate to move so it can mathematically correct an error introduced allowing use of the device. On a side note the 127 T gear can be used for metric conversion.
Hello sir :) I have this question, what is the right formula to calculate the module (metric) with this details I have [OD, Helix Angle, and Number of teeth ] ,
+Nacer Ziani The formula is for metric spur gears which is the "module" same as addendum...if you have OD and teeth you should be able to calculate the module with this formula. The helix angle allows you to set the cutter angle (table).
Ok so 87 teeth is what you require. This needs to be done with differential indexing (in the video). A = approximate number and N = your actual number. The formula is (A-N)x40/A I chose 90 as my A...So (A-N)x40/A = (90-87)x40/90 = (3)x4/9 = 12/9 Your indexing is 40/90 or 4/9 and your gear train 12/9 (lowest common denominator 4/3. Indexing first, find a holeplate that is a multiple of the demoninator of the 4/9 fraction. A 27 or a 54 holeplate will work, assume you use a 27 holeplate 3x9=27 you need to use the same multiple for the numerator 3x4=12. So your indexing is 12 spaces on a 27 hole plate. Next you need the gear train, the ratio calculated above 4/3 multiply numerator and denominator by 8 and you get 32/24. These are your gears. The 32 tooth gear goes on the spindle and the 24 tooth gear goes on the other shaft (back into the wormshaft). There will be an idler in between these two gears (any gear will do you don't care how many teeth it has). Remember to unlock the holeplate it has to turn, that's why you made the gear train. I hope this makes sense. Good luck!
120 can be done with simple indexing. 40/N ...40/120 or 1/3. Look at your hole plate and choose the diameter that is a multiple of 3. Example let's say you have a 30 hole plate, your indexing would be 10 spaces on a 30 hole plate for 120 divisions.
Hello sir..may i asked a lil favor..can you make a video on how to set up up a full differential gear driven into the automatic movement o the table of a milling machine? In making a helical gear for example..it will be very helpful to us sir..hope you will do..ty
It is not possible to gear a dividing head to the table and differential index. The gear I would have from the dividing head to the milling machine table is used to gear to the dividing head spindle instead. If you want to gear the dividing head to the milling machine you have to use simple indexing. Please have a look at my Cam Milling video. If you can't find it I'll send you a link. If question arise please let me know.
+Nacer Ziani Short answer, it's a guess (an educated guess). When I "guess" a number I'm considering how it will factor into my hole plate selection and my gear selection. Some numbers you pick will not work with the hole plates and gears you have. It is a bit of trial and error but with practice you will get it.
+Nacer Ziani This is one of the videos I want to make. Sorry I don't have a timeline but it is in the back of my mind. Life gets in the way. Thanks for your posts.
All the idler gear is doing is moving power from the driver to the driven. It could be 12 teeth or 100 teeth. The ratio is determined by the number of teeth between the first and last gear. This is known as simple gearing...a simple gear train not a compound gear train. Thanks for your question and watching.
Sorry for the slow reply, busy day. The number of teeth on the idler is irrelevant, all it does is move the power from the driver to the driven. I likely used 44 teeth because the gap was close to that size and I wouldn't have to adjust the setup much. It could have been any number of teeth for the idler.
machiningmoments thanks for the reply. Do you have any video about cutting helical gear? Do you have any good reference books to read about gear and its theory?
I have cut helical gears and have often thought about making a video. I don't have one yet. The problem is it is a very involved topic. The book I like to use is Technology of Machine Tools by Steven Krar. If you would like to leave me your email address I have a power point on helical gear cutting I can send you.
Hello Anup, helical gears are possible if you gear the dividing head to the table lead screw. You also need to be able to swivel the milling machine table.
Sorry for the slow reply, busy weekend. I would leave your work in a fractional form. Your example 40/70 is the same as 4/7 find a multiple of the denominator that matches with a hole plate you have. Example assume you have a 28 hole plate. 4 times 7 is 28 so it satisfies the denominator. Numerator and denominator use the same multiple. So your solution would be 16 spaces on a 28 hole plate (assuming you have a 28 hole plate). I hope that makes sense. Good Luck!
This is an old video, but I will hail Mary it anyway. I want to buy a dividing head that can do this feedback process to move the hole plate. Is there a name or modifier I should search for when looking for dividing heads? Thanks!
No, I think it's just a standard dividing head. Make sure you are able to engage the worm shaft (move the dividing head by turning the index crank) also you want a shaft to come off the worm shaft on the back of the dividing head to add gears to. Thanks for the "hail Mary"1
Thanks for the explanation. Can you do a video on how to mount this change gears directly on a milling machine. I would love to see the step by step procedures of this on a milling machine.
If you watch my video on Cam Milling you will see the dividing head geared to the milling machine table with an explanation of how it works. Sorry for the slow reply. Thank you for watching.
As long as it satisfies the fraction it works so 22/66 is 1/3rd same as 10/30 is 1/3rd. So they both work. Good practice is to choose the multiple on the largest diameter. Thanks you for watching and your message.
I have read about this in several different publications and understand in basics how to do this. It is in the Machinists Bible/ Machineries Handbook. This is the first video tutorial I have seen and I find it VERY helpful, thanks for a wonderful explanation. When I need to use this I will be better prepared, Cheers from John Australia.PS I have a Brown and Sharp Universal Miller (2A) with the Dividing head and all change gears to go with it. Made in about 1913 or so, very advanced design from a company the Machining world owes a huge amount of respect to. John.
Hi John, sorry for the slow reply I've just found your note in my spam folder. Silly people at TH-cam! I agree, I'm totally in awe at the engineering when I work with tools like this that often pre-date CNC. Sadly tools like this are becoming rare due to CNC.
I have very dear friends in Melbourne, love your Country and people. Brad, Canada.
All good Brad, I wish you well. I like to know where things come from and as a result I think to myself about those that made the first machine tool. They are True Craftsmen! Thanks for your reply and enjoy your warmer months, it will become cooler here, however not as cool as you have in your Winter All the best from John Australia.
Thank you for the video.Great explaination.Finally I understood what the bevel gears in my book diagram were for.
Bevel gears are great for going around corners! Thanks for watching and commenting.
great explanation. I'm cutting a 96 tooth gear and picking the gears from the charts is nice but not knowing how they arrived at them had me scratching me head. Those men from yesteryear were so smart it amazes me. thank you for bridging the time gap.
I'm continuously amazed by the knowledge of people I perceive to have basic tools. Very inspirational! Glad the video was useful. Thank you!
Just excellent - simple and clear explanation of a "mystery-technique"
Glad it was helpful.
Thanks brother for this differential indexing video. I didn't know differential indexing before so after watching this video I can now do differential indexing so thank you so much.
I'm glad it was helpful and appreciate you saying so.
This is excellent stuff!!!!
Thank you
helped a lot!! Thanks for the demonstration
Glad to, thanks for taking the time to say so!
Very impressive video I learned alot thanks Mr.
I'm glad to hear you learned something from it. Thank you.
very much clear. thanking you in advanced.
My pleasure, that you for your post.
Got me through my finals for this topic! Great explanation!
I'm glad it helped. Congratulations on your exam. Thanks for taking the time to let me know.
Excellent video. Numerous other YT producers have detailed indexing, but only mentioned differential, never giving any indication of what it is or how it's done.
Does your indexer have a unique name? The other indexers I've seen don't appear to have the extension to connect to the table or to link to the chuck. Thanks again.
+Morris Gallo It is called a universal dividing head
Thanks alot sir for making us crystal clear about indexing 😍
My pleasure, thank you for watching.
From Tanzania thank for good explaining
I'm glad it was helpful. Thank you for watching and leaving a note.
Thank you sir. The way u explained was superb
Thank you!
thank you so much it helped in my manufacturing process-1 subject.....thank you soooo much..
+do or die Glad it helped!
Thanks for the video.. very easy to understand..
My pleasure, I'm glad it was easy for you to understand.
really helped a lot ty
I'm glad it helped, I think this is one of those concepts that is helpful to see. Thanks for posting.
That was great
Thank you ❤
Glad you liked it, thanks for watching. I appreciate you taking the time to leave a message.
thanks for sharing!
My pleasure, thank you for watching and your post.
Rajeev Singh Sir Audience >>>>>>>>>
Thank you for watching.
Hello again :) , can i ask if there is a way to find the helix angle of a damaged helical gear , if you have just the damaged gear , i did use my Universal Bevel protractor but the result was not accurate.
+Nacer Ziani Do you have enough of the gear left to get a diameter and number of teeth
+machiningmoments Yes I have , The number of teeth is 15 tooth , and the outside diameter is about 54 , and this is a pic of it i.imgur. com / 0YMlizT . jpg
Ok, take the OD and subtract the depth of the tooth (this will get you close to pitch diameter(PD) unless you know the DP (in your case Normal Diametral Pitch)). Once you have pitch diameter multiply by pie(3.14) to get circumference. Now divide the number of teeth by the circumference this will give you circular pitch (distance from one tooth to the next at the PD) this is side opposite. Next measure the gears thickness at the tooth, this is side adjacent. The helix angle is only a trig function away.
Note: both gears in mesh will have the angle and NDP. Good Luck!
machiningmoments ... Thank you again! I just watched this again after a few years, and found it just as fascinating as the first time. Actually, hi schoo shop class was the first time I was able to understand the geometry I was also studying. I became a wiz at making gears.
Hi Brad great presentation. Is the Dividing Head in the video a Walter or a Zeatz.
Regards
Henri
Thank you Henri, nice to hear from you. I believe it is a Walter.
im about to pick up a brown and sharp head like this one and silly me I diden't even know this was a possbility thanks for the info does your mill have the capability of cutting helix gears? I would love to know about gearing a universal head in to the table of my universal mill .
+Chris Anderson Hi Chris, differential indexing is not that common but kind of neat. Yes I cut helical gears. I use a horizontal mill with a table that swivels (universal) and a bore mounted full form involute gear cutter. You need to know the gear tooth's DP and number (tooth size and number of teeth per inch of pitch diameter) to select the proper cutter. You also need to know the lead of the helix and the lead of the machine to calculate the gearing between the milling machines lead screw and the dividing head. Finally you need the helix angle of the gear to swivel the table to the angle. If your cutting a pair of gears and they are different diameters the lead of helix will change. Also if your gears are on parallel shafts one will be cut with the table swiveled right the second will need the table swivelled to the left (you also need to add a gear so the dividing head turns in the opposite rotation)(right and left hand helix). Crossing shafts have the same helix.
Thanks for your question and comment.
I am also stumped as how you would center the part .can you demonstrate how you would setup a job like this haven't found one on TH-cam.
Great question. With the gear blank in the dividing head I will either touch a square sitting on the table to the OD of the gear blank and measure from the square to the cutter. Repeat the procedure on the other side of the blank. I've also seen pinching a straight edge (rule) between gear blank top and cutter. If the cutter is centered the length of rule will be horizontal. You could measure to the table on both sides to straight edge.
I Don't quite understand
Sorry Chris, I will try to put a short video together for you.
great video sir, really helped a lot. Thank you.
I'm glad it helped. Thank you for your note.
Good video. You mentioned compound gears on back. I’m going over questions for making calculations for 53, 59, 101, and 175 divisions. I think I need more than two gears on back. How do I do the math?
Hi Dana, sorry for the slow reply busy weekend. So I assume you have your gear ratio fraction worked out. For argument sake let's say that ratio is 1/4 and you can't find two gears to satisfy this fraction. 1/4 is the same as 1/2 x 1/2 now look for gears to satisfy each fraction the first 1/2 gears are 24/48 and the second fraction is 32/64. The 24 gear is on the spindle it meshes with the 48 tooth gear. Stack the 32 gear on top of the 48 tooth gear (compound) the 32 gear meshes with the 64 tooth gear that is on the worm shaft. This is compound gearing satisfying the original 1/4 gear ratio. I hope this makes sense. Good luck.
machiningmoments didn’t get things worked out. Even if you did the 53 divisions and showed the math would be great. I tried different scenarios for factor A and just got confused using (A-N)x40/N.
Hi Dana, the formula is (A-N)x40/A. I assume you don't have a 53 hole plate, you could simple index 40 spaces on a 53 hole plate and ignore the gears. So, I choose 60 for an approximate (A) (60-53) x 40/60...if you work that out it 14/3 as an improper fraction (your gear ratio). 14/3 is the same thing as 7/3x 2/1. Now we look for a multiple of each fraction that will give us the gears we need. 7/3 x 8 will give us the first two gears 56/24...The other fraction 2/1 x 24 will give us the last two gears 48/24. 56 goes to the spindle and meshes with 24, 48 goes on top of the 24 (compound) and 48 meshes with 56 on the worm shaft. Your indexing is 40/A 40/60 or 2/3 find a multiple of this that works with a hole plate you have...30 as an example. The indexing is 20 spaces on a 30 hole plate. Note! the index plate has to rotate (driven by the gear train you created) make sure it is unlocked. Clear as mud? ;)
machiningmoments I’ll do the math too on paper and see if I work it out. Thanks.
Okay. I worked out pretty much the same thing as you said only I had to use a 33 holes plate which would be 22 spaces on a 33 holes plate. Only thing is I’m not sure of the meshing of the gears. I’m a visual person so if you could draw the gears in contact with each other would be great. vintagemachinery.org/pubs/2185/5863.pdf this is a link to instruction manual to brown and sharp dividing head. It has some good info.
I am having trouble with the math figuring out the gears to index for 127 tooth gear, could you show this example?
Thanks Blair
Hi Blair, great question. This requires differential indexing so (A-N)40/A
Try A=120 (120 - 127)40/120 your indexing 40/120 becomes 1/3 not sure which dividing head you have but lets say 11 spaces on a 33 hole plate. Now used the full formula for the gear train which works out to -7/3. Multiple this fraction by 8 and you get -56/24 so your gears are 56 (driver) and 24 (driven). You need two idlers to satisfy the negative fraction (opposite rotation). Good Luck!
@@machiningmoments Thanks My Mill is a Parkson 2N Universal, with the 12" Parkson Universal Dividing Head, Only Problem now is all the Change Gears are Missing. I am going to get a price on a set of gears made by 3D printing, they should be fine for Indexing. It also came with a Cam Milling Attachment, that is quite a piece of equipment, today you just need to write a program and push Rum
My Plate is double sided with the holes
1st Side 24,25,28,30,34,37,38,39,41,42,43. 2nd Side 46,47,49,51,53,54,57,58,59,62,66,
The list of Change Gears Listed is 24,28,32,40,44,48,56(2),64,72,86,88,100 Teeth
Do you have any suggestion's on extra change gears I should get besides what's listed?
I can use 22 spaces on my 66 hole plate
Thanks
Blair
thank you for making life simple!
+Rasheed Senior My pleasure, I like things simple!
thank you sir this. was really helpful
+Aswin Narayanan Glad it helped, thanks for the note and watching!
I have question Mr,,
How to select gear train for making helical gear in fact I searched for this issue on net but no one covered this issue. Thanks from now.
You need to know the lead of the helix on the gear, in other words how long would the gear be if one tooth made a 360 deg rotation.
Where did the idler 44 came from? Does it affect the ratio?
Honestly Rico the answer is it was what fit in between. The number on teeth on the idle means nothing, it could be 10,000 teeth, all it does is provide a drive between the driver and driven gears. Good question!
So what stops the hole plate from turning while cutting?
+Jeremy Hall Once the crankpin is dropped back in the holeplate nothing moves.
Great explanation, only one nitpick, when you are doing the math in some cases you multiply the fraction by a number and multiply the nominator and denominator, other times you multiply only one. The issue is simply that when you are multiplying both you are really multiplying by one in the form of 2/2, 3/3, 4/4.
I think it would be much more clear if you showed this in the video. For Example at 03:22 in the video the 4/7 * 3 should really be 4/7 * 3/3 = 12/21
The same for the 12/7 * 4/4 = 48/28 for the gear ratio below.
This is not to be confused with the (3) * 4/7 on the second equation line which is really 3/1 * 4/7.
Anyways I found the video very useful, Thank you!
One thing I learned when I started this is it easy to miss something. Thanks for catching the inconsistency. I appreciate you watching and posting.
@@machiningmoments It is a fantastic video, you did a great job explaining it. I am just getting started in machining and have much to learn, people like you are what will make it possible to learn this new skill.
Thank you for your kind words. Welcome to machining you are going to love this trade!
Please, How do you use the traction gears if the gear is spiral and at the same time differential?
It is connected to a gear train inside the device.
@@machiningmoments Thank you very much
Can you explain to me the way?
after four times watching this vedio i got the intuition
Thank you
Thank you for watching and making the time to leave a message.
is this the way to do prime numbers like a 127 tooth gear? thanks
It is more about creating a ratio that will allow the hole plate to move so it can mathematically correct an error introduced allowing use of the device. On a side note the 127 T gear can be used for metric conversion.
Hello sir :)
I have this question, what is the right formula to calculate the module (metric) with this details I have [OD, Helix Angle, and Number of teeth ] ,
+Nacer Ziani OD = (N+2)M So, outside diameter divided by (number of teeth plus 2) should give you the module.
+machiningmoments Thanks for responding , but i think this equation works just with metric spur gears , or am i wrong ?
+Nacer Ziani The formula is for metric spur gears which is the "module" same as addendum...if you have OD and teeth you should be able to calculate the module with this formula. The helix angle allows you to set the cutter angle (table).
+machiningmoments thanks man for your help
+Nacer Ziani Glad to, good luck!
I have a question why you use 70? can we use another like 68? And if I use deferent hole plate it will change the gear ratio?
Absolutely, as long as the solution works with available gears and holeplate.
Thank you sir for your video.
And reply to my question.
I am confuse,can you help me how to get the gear ratio for 87T spur gear. Thank you again sir,
Ok so 87 teeth is what you require. This needs to be done with differential indexing (in the video). A = approximate number and N = your actual number. The formula is (A-N)x40/A I chose 90 as my A...So (A-N)x40/A = (90-87)x40/90 = (3)x4/9 = 12/9 Your indexing is 40/90 or 4/9 and your gear train 12/9 (lowest common denominator 4/3. Indexing first, find a holeplate that is a multiple of the demoninator of the 4/9 fraction. A 27 or a 54 holeplate will work, assume you use a 27 holeplate 3x9=27 you need to use the same multiple for the numerator 3x4=12. So your indexing is 12 spaces on a 27 hole plate. Next you need the gear train, the ratio calculated above 4/3 multiply numerator and denominator by 8 and you get 32/24. These are your gears. The 32 tooth gear goes on the spindle and the 24 tooth gear goes on the other shaft (back into the wormshaft). There will be an idler in between these two gears (any gear will do you don't care how many teeth it has). Remember to unlock the holeplate it has to turn, that's why you made the gear train. I hope this makes sense. Good luck!
Thank you sir, this will help me.
sir i want to know weather 120 will be possible in that table.like24,28 etc same way does 120 can come in that table of spindle value after solving
120 can be done with simple indexing. 40/N ...40/120 or 1/3. Look at your hole plate and choose the diameter that is a multiple of 3. Example let's say you have a 30 hole plate, your indexing would be 10 spaces on a 30 hole plate for 120 divisions.
@@machiningmoments Thanks a lot now i get it.😊😊😊
I'm glad, thanks for letting me know. Good luck!
Very nice video sir
Thank you
Hello sir..may i asked a lil favor..can you make a video on how to set up up a full differential gear driven into the automatic movement o the table of a milling machine? In making a helical gear for example..it will be very helpful to us sir..hope you will do..ty
It is not possible to gear a dividing head to the table and differential index. The gear I would have from the dividing head to the milling machine table is used to gear to the dividing head spindle instead. If you want to gear the dividing head to the milling machine you have to use simple indexing. Please have a look at my Cam Milling video. If you can't find it I'll send you a link. If question arise please let me know.
nicely explained
Thank you
thanks for the vid , but when we will see how to cut a helical gear on a milling machine ?
+Nacer Ziani and I have another Q, how should we choose the A value ? is it random and always bigger then the right cuttings ?
+Nacer Ziani Short answer, it's a guess (an educated guess). When I "guess" a number I'm considering how it will factor into my hole plate selection and my gear selection. Some numbers you pick will not work with the hole plates and gears you have. It is a bit of trial and error but with practice you will get it.
+Nacer Ziani This is one of the videos I want to make. Sorry I don't have a timeline but it is in the back of my mind. Life gets in the way. Thanks for your posts.
+machiningmoments Thanks a lot mate , I really learned a lot from your vids
nicely videos
How come your idler is 44? Would that not be a compound gearing, or at least change your gear ratio? Shouldn't it be 48-48-28?
All the idler gear is doing is moving power from the driver to the driven. It could be 12 teeth or 100 teeth. The ratio is determined by the number of teeth between the first and last gear. This is known as simple gearing...a simple gear train not a compound gear train. Thanks for your question and watching.
Hm, very interesting to learn, thank you for that insight. I would have thought it would change the gearing ratio.
Thanks a lot sir 😍
Thank you for watching.
Hi, may I know why would you choose 44 as the idle gear?
Sorry for the slow reply, busy day. The number of teeth on the idler is irrelevant, all it does is move the power from the driver to the driven. I likely used 44 teeth because the gap was close to that size and I wouldn't have to adjust the setup much. It could have been any number of teeth for the idler.
machiningmoments thanks for the reply. Do you have any video about cutting helical gear? Do you have any good reference books to read about gear and its theory?
I have cut helical gears and have often thought about making a video. I don't have one yet. The problem is it is a very involved topic. The book I like to use is Technology of Machine Tools by Steven Krar. If you would like to leave me your email address I have a power point on helical gear cutting I can send you.
machiningmoments thanks for your reply. Look forward to the ppt slides :)
machiningmoments received your mail. Thanks a lot.
how do you get number of tooth in idler my friend
The number of teeth on the idler are irrelevant. All the idler does is move power from driver to driven gear.
Can we cut helical gear also
Hello Anup, helical gears are possible if you gear the dividing head to the table lead screw. You also need to be able to swivel the milling machine table.
Thank you for the wonderful video sir, may I ask, what reference textbook can we find these kinds of lessons?
Hi Mark a textbook I use a great deal is Technology of Machine Tools. I believe the author is Steven Krar.
I have one something like that I would like to make spiral flute reamers on but I don't have the gears that go to the mill ,
That's too bad, spiral fluting on a mill is really neat!
If you have the mill you can make the gears!
+J800613 where could I get information on what size gears to make ? i also have 8 of the involuted gear cutters that came with it .
A Google search on involute gear calculations may be helpful...here is one I found. www.engineersedge.com/gears/involute-gear-design.htm
+machiningmoments thanks , that is very helpful,
why 44 teeth gear is used as idler .. won't it change the gear ratio?
No, Gear ratio in this case will be (48/44)*(44/28)
idler gear teeth cancel out
It doesn't matter how many (or few) teeth are on the idler, it is only used to move the power from the first gear to the last.
In simple gear train number of idlers and teeth on idler do not affect the gear ratio.
Idlers are used to transmit the from from driver to driven.
Sooo helpful. Thanks!
I'm glad to hear it was helpful. Thank you
Exam tomorrow! Thank you so much. :) Milling Machines contains 22% weightage in the exam. You're a legend!
:) Good Luck!
❤
Thanks for watching and leaving a note.
Good
Thank you
😊
Sir... 12 / 21= 0.571428 turn × 28= 16 / 48= 0.3 turn spindle
40 / 67= 0.597 turn spindle ??
The problem with 67 is there is not a 67 hole plate so it becomes difficult...not impossible but difficult.
@@machiningmoments Are the distribution results right ?
40 / 70 / 40= 0.014 turn spindle rigth ??
0.014 × 48 / 28= 0.024 turn plate indexing rigth ??
Sorry for the slow reply, busy weekend. I would leave your work in a fractional form. Your example 40/70 is the same as 4/7 find a multiple of the denominator that matches with a hole plate you have. Example assume you have a 28 hole plate. 4 times 7 is 28 so it satisfies the denominator. Numerator and denominator use the same multiple. So your solution would be 16 spaces on a 28 hole plate (assuming you have a 28 hole plate). I hope that makes sense. Good Luck!
very informative. I don't yet have a dividing head so I will have to store that away for possible later use. thanks for the video.
+cerberus Thanks for watching and commenting.
This is an old video, but I will hail Mary it anyway.
I want to buy a dividing head that can do this feedback process to move the hole plate. Is there a name or modifier I should search for when looking for dividing heads? Thanks!
No, I think it's just a standard dividing head. Make sure you are able to engage the worm shaft (move the dividing head by turning the index crank) also you want a shaft to come off the worm shaft on the back of the dividing head to add gears to.
Thanks for the "hail Mary"1
After rajeev sir recommendation 🤩🤩
I'm glad you liked it.
thank u frnd!! very good demonstration
Thank you, I appreciate you posting.
44 picth
67pitch
82pitch
110pitch
126pitch
150pitch
All picthc dividing head gear set kaise change kare
Raghav yadu SSITM ka engineer very nice video
Thank you
Thanks for the explanation. Can you do a video on how to mount this change gears directly on a milling machine. I would love to see the step by step procedures of this on a milling machine.
If you watch my video on Cam Milling you will see the dividing head geared to the milling machine table with an explanation of how it works. Sorry for the slow reply. Thank you for watching.
A means
Why cant it be 1 revolution 10 in a 30 hole plate instead of 1 revolution 22 holes in a 66 hole plate.
As long as it satisfies the fraction it works so 22/66 is 1/3rd same as 10/30 is 1/3rd. So they both work. Good practice is to choose the multiple on the largest diameter. Thanks you for watching and your message.
A means 70 what's
I'm sorry I don't understand the question.
A 70 Outdia
Telll me all about this name
Name? I'm not sure I understand what you would like to know.
Sucses
Great!
Working remaining
?
machiningmoments job cutting
Like direct indexing
Sip plz no do apka
Humare theory wale sir bheje he
मुझे यकीन नहीं है कि मैं आपकी पोस्ट को समझता हूं। देखने के लिए धन्यवाद।
muje to kuch samaj nhi aaya
kya main aap ko samajhane mein madad kar sakate hain?
yeah Sir