I'm sorry Fox but your definition of "behind" must be different than everyone else's. You're behind on levels but not gold and shyvana is one of the best early duelists in the game. Maybe you could've explained what you could do if you're behind instead of doing a play by play in this video where you are NOT behind on kills, gold and towers. I mean, you were 2/0/1 whereas shyvana was 0/0/0. You didnt give any kills nor did you cause a lane to lose by feeding it.
Zeke Malex Score isn't everything - I was most certainly "behind" in the sense that I'm under an appropriate level of power. Yes I wasn't level 2 30 minutes in to the game, but I was still having to adapt my play to accommodate for my weaknesses.
foxdropLoL - Be a Better League Player Thanks for the reply, Fox. I understand now what you mean about being behind. It's not all about the numbers. Adapting to the situation can be hard for many players, me especially. I'm a Silver player and still trying to fight my way up the ranks. I learn a lot from your videos and I appreciate the time and effort you do for all of us! Keep up the awesome job!
I also kinda agree but more so what if the enemy jungler gets ganks on all lanes (Its a rammus and I was Zac) overall my team is behind so I try to go for objectives like Dragon and Herald but still my team is losing and I can do too much about the rammus ganks because my team was always pushing their lanes and I couldn't correctly predict where he would gank(Even though I purposely gave rift Herald pressure so I could counter gank but then he thanks bot lane so my ploy was absolutely moot) so I couldn't counter gank. Overall what should be my focus when I'm behind in farm,ganks, and not being able to do much? Should I just keep focusing on objs because by the time we reached 20 everyone decided to surrender
how do you get 1st blood and say your behind? i mean u were behind in lv's but ahead in gold. I think when people feel behind is when a shaco invades them and their 0-1 instead of 1-0
MagicalMonsrer5000 He himself as a jungler is behind, because he ganked. Yes Vayne is ahead in lane now, but that doesn't help him, as Lee Sin, in the jungle.
Luis Melendez He's behind in levels, which matters for Lee Sin. Had he continued playing like normal he'd be further behind. You need to do damage control before it gets out of hand.
Not sure if I'd call this being behind. Shyvana had a one level advantage on you during your invade attempt, but you had an item advantage due to your kills/assists for most of the this clip. Being behind in farm, especially against a late game jungler like Shyvana, isn't really anything to worry about if you're still able to create pressure and plays for your team. If you could show us how to come back from a disadvantage of deaths or even your team losing lane, I think that would be more informative.
Scott M Agreed! I wish I could call 2-0-1 at 11 minutes "behind". If that first gank did not result in a kill and Shyvana killed him then took his camps, then he would have been behind (it seems that Shyvana took his blue when she saw him gank bot lane...or they just invaded).
Really not behind most people when they say I'm behind are been constantly counter jungled by the opponent jungler and have lost control of their jungle.. No offense but this was like when people complain they have lag when their ping jumps up to like 30 from being 10. This video is a bit of a cop out.
Oli F No, that's when you've been behind for 10 minutes and haven't done anything about it. As Fox said, your priority is to not get further behind, which is what he was doing in the video. Had he continued like normal he'd be even further behind, which is what you're talking about. People don't identify that they're behind until it's too late and they're losing the game.
Losing and being behind in goals and gold differ, to losing one's games. Once you go behind in farm or tart up an enemy you don't play the same as before. Now the game is about getting back and not losing.
Machine Herald valid point. But my initial point still stands as the video wasn't what I expected and seemed to be the best case scenario of "being behind" and so made coming back very easy this isn't the situation most people would describe themselves as being behind.
Oli F That's the thing, when people identify that they're "behind" they're already losing. Fox knew he was going to be really behind if he continued playing like normal, so he changed it up. You don't wait for gangrene to claim your entire leg before you cut it off, you need to identify it as soon as possible so you only need to sacrifice a toe. THAT'S what people need to learn.
I like how people are complaining about how his not far behind enough, when he states, not even a minute into the video yet, that you should make it a clear goal to not fall further behind. The obvious issue is people dont seem to understand that they're behind, or are in denial of it, until the fact is blatant and they're straight up losing. TLDR, identify the fact you've fallen behind sooner and commence with the damage control.
Thanks, all too often you only see games where people are dominating (or at least going even) its refreshing to see how it can still work when you are behind.
When I fall behind as a jungler I start to think of myself as a secondary support. I have to make of my limited resources what I can and so I play the same way I would if I played support (maybe this is because I mained support for a lang time before changing to jungle). I play the vision game (very important !) and try to react to the enemy jungler instead of forcing plays, since he is stronger than me I try to avoid a confrontation and counterjungle him when he shows in a lane, which helps getting me ahead and slowing him down.
Would love to see a video about invading the enemy jungle and punishing the enemy jungler. I became a jungle main a few months ago, and this topic was by far the hardest thing for me to master. Nice video btw :D
There are different ways of being "behind" when you're a jungler. You can be behind when no ganks work, when you're being heavily counter jungled, when your lanes constant pings for assistance cause you to lose farm, etc. I'd say a big thing I do when I'm behind is cover a lane when my allies are gone and shove it when the enemies are as well. I also play a lot of farming/counter jungling focused junglers so heading into the enemy jungle is a good way to put them behind and you ahead if you do it right. Also, wards and communication with allies are the only sure fire way to stop the enemy from counter jungling you.
***** " Would know instinctively to farm jungle to get back on levels..." Who do you think watches this kind of vids? Experienced junglers?! Nope, new players who struggle to get into the game! The points explained in this vid can be really useful if you actually apply them, and there are A LOT, in case you somehow didn't notice. Farming the jungle is just a simple one of them, its not necessarily the best option everytime and you have to do a bit more then just farming if you actually want to win, as foxdrop said. The reason this vid didn't "mimic" other people's situations is because they're nowhere near as experienced as him and kept playing normaly even though they were behind!
if i`m behind as a jnglr i try to help others as much as possible .... farming up is the safe path, but loosing valuable time in the jungle leaves much time for enemy jungler to make plays. So my best advice is - pick 1-2 lanes that can carry your team and help them out. Deep warding is very good (buy pinks) , cause it doesnt only protect your lanes from ganks, but can get you a counter gank - double kill + drake can swing things in your favor very quickly. Also minions > jungle farm so if your laner is base and his lane is pushing soak that XP. Build paths are also to be adjusted - if you are 0/5 full damage builds are no good etc.
Im trying to main jungle, also with lee sin. I find this a very very very usefull video as im not that high ELO. So thanks for that, you make great videos. These tips will help me out, alot.
Fox since you were behind at the start in this game, you should of gone trailblazer as it would of given you the quicker clear speed in the jungle as well as you wouldn't of needed to go back to get health after a gank, as the trailblazer would of given you enough.
hey fox if you wouldn't mind covering "how to save a lost lane" as to what a jungler should be doing/ not doing when faced with team mates falling horrifically behind?
You make some good points but can you demonstrate on a game when you are 0/3/0 at 10 min or when all 3 lanes 0/2? These sort of games can be salvage but may well require different tactics than what you describe. For example, getting kills when really behind seems pretty unreasonable, with towers and possibly dragon being better options.
AlyMewGaming I think jungler is the funniest role in league. Mid and bot are so boring and with 0 diversity (you always see the same champions playing the same way), the only lane I like to play other than jungle is top.
Catoon It's too standard and you have too much pressure on yourself. The outcome of the game is almost everytime determined by the outcome of the bot lane and if you fall behind you have little chance to catch up, since AD items are really expensive.
TheXCross "little chance to catch up?" just dunk a bitch and u get money. "ad item are expensive?" all you need is buy a pickaxe with first blood money and you already one shot squishy bot laners.
I would argue that going the farming route is the better option when you fall extremely behind since the extra exp mechanic of jungle is less risky with good reward.
Sean Snyder There will never be a clearcut answer to this. For example, if I were playing something like Fizz or Vi jungle with enough damage, I might try ganking a losing lane. If I'm Seju and their bot lane has a BF sword 6 minutes in, I will avoid going there unless we can get both mid and jungle down there at the same time. In any case, a 2 man gank rather than just a jungler will be a bigger investment, but also comes with bigger rewards. Towers also help immensely with their global gold.
Just a thought, it's kinda annoying that your fox logo on the lower right covers the minimap. Might wanna change that if possible. love your vids like always, Yue
Sir foxdrop i need some advice.. I main jungle and have studied most of your videos. Is it possible f or you to make a video about handling 2 enemy junglers? i once battled an enemy team with no supp but 2 junglers... what sucks is that my carries doesn't even come to help
I was wondering if you could make a vid on knowing what to build and when vs other builds. It seems no matter how much health or armor I build it doesn't matter when facing a crit build. I know that every match's build should be specific to that match but I have trouble counter building a lot of times.
I had this one ranked game where I was playing as jungle Amumu and I was getting counter jungled right from the start by an actually decent Lee Sin. He killed me three times in the first seven minutes and I fell way behind. To make matters worse every, single lane was losing badly by ten minutes in. Despite all that I kept my composure and stayed focused trying to farm as best I could and encouraged my team to keep trying. Not to give up. I felt really good about myself because when the going got tough I stayed cool and kept gutting through it.
I have a serious question out for anyone to answer as it has been occurring fairly frequently especially in my ranked games. As a jungler what can you do to bring a game back if all of your laners are losing and or most dying already by the five minute mark. I have this problem so often and when you aren't playing a champion with good early ganks whatsoever (at the five minute mark people generally aren't pushed up enough to be able to gank being an immobilize champion early per say Shyvana for example). I'm always the center or blame for every lane and it's becoming quite the nuisance and I haven't quite been able to fix this one flaw in my gameplay for ages. So to summarize, everyone loses lane, what can you do for your laners at that point to help everyone win, otherwise I basically get flamed the whole game creating lots of tilt pressure, and just toxicity in general. Thanks for your time to anyone who answers, it's truly appreciated.
If you fall behind really hard early on as a jungler, you simply need to go for risky ganks hoping it will put you laners ahead and they can carry the game. When falling behind hard as a strong early game jungler, immediately look for gank opportunities even if it's 50/50. When falling behind as level 6 reliant jungler (malphite/fiddlesticks/evelynn), go afk farm until level 6 and start ganking afterwards.
Dear Foxmaster . This video is helpful , especially to lower elo players (myself silver 1) but you could also argue that a reason you caught up was because the enemy jungler didn't capitalise on the mistakes you made . Would like to see something about being behind because you are being counter jungled or even just out classes and played by them . How do you beat someone who is better than you ? -The student Fox
Not a very helpful video for me personally, as I feel playing from behind is one of my stronger skills; nothing new to see here for me, but it was a helpful video for those who are not so good at jungling or playing from behind! So good video, nicely done. Although I really want to see some videos where your entire team is playing from behind, and what your options are in solo queue to get your team back into the game.
@gold7oo Lee doesn't need the sustain from Trailblazer. Fox explained he Wanted to Go for kills to get back in the Game. That's Why he bought Blue smite. Source: Diamond Lee Main
Allyournexus Rbelongtome Cast Magic Missile on your mid-laner, then a Haste spell. I also like to use Summon Fire Elemental so I can get something to help me.
wtf is magic missile ClassicalByMetal ? and did they add Summon Fire Elemental to the game? Shit mages aren't boring anymore :D also, good thing one person seriously answered my question, Bloody Apple
Who do you think is better in the current meta, Kha'Zix or Rengar? I've seen countless of Rengar's lately, and hardly any Kha'Zix but I rarely have games where I don't have at least 10 kills, Kha'Zix is so strong o.O
rowinwan1 Kha'zix relies on isolated enemies for his burst. Whereas Rengar's burst is much more reliable. I feel Rengar's ganks are much better as well.
Stanley I don't really agree on the ganks though, Rengar's ganks are rather useless when he doesn't have his ult, where as Kha'Zix can gank without it easily. Also, Rengar's ult can be easily pinked out lategame, which makes him useless in the next fight, even though good Rengar players will know how to avoid that.
Bloody Apple The thing is though, if Rengar misses his bola theres a high chance the gank will fail, where as Kha'Zix can miss his W and still leap on the target. Also, if you get the laner away from the minions, I'm fairly sure Kha'Zix deals more damage.
rowinwan1 I play both rengar and kha and the biggest problem I see people do is build them full damage, as a rengar it can be a good thing since his W give him insane resistance and he just need 1 defensive item to be hard to kill, while kha on the other side need at least 2 defensive items to be able to do his damage without being blown up. damage wise rengar can do more since he doesn't invest too much gold into his resistances while kha need to get his defenses. the best way to play them is to play rengar as a semi-assassin were he goes in kill someone or get them out of the fight , on the other hand, kha is best played as a brusier who can do great damage (not as great as rengar's) and in the same time he can tank alot of stuff. for kha getting hydra,cdr boot or mr boot,LW ,omen,black clever,the last item depends of the game but I like ga
Not a bad video, but I think most experienced junglers can come back from a level behind after a "bad" gank, even if they couldn't take the kill. The situation here wasn't ideal, but wasn't bat at all either, the lanes were keeping even on their own and that chase with Rek'sai was great, she kept the attention of three people on her own for quiet a long time and managed to get away. I think for me personally the problem starts when at least two of the lanes are loosing hard, to the point when they need jungler intervention to keep even. I can never keep both of them afloat long enough to go farm myself or help enough that they can handle their opponent alone after a while and with the advantage under their belt, their enemy laners will start to roam way too soon. If I choose to farm instead of ganking, it ends the same most of the time, because the jungle can give only so much exp and the enemy team will get a massive gold/lvl lead from the kills and the free farm. It usually ends with our outer towers broken, the loosing laners farming my jungle because why not and crying in the allchat to get me reported. At this point I have no means of clawing back, as I can't gank because I'm at least two or three levels behind the winning enemy laners, can't farm my jungle because it's taken and can't even dream of taxing a lane because it's either pushed out too far or someone's already there.
This is good video/tips but poor example. There's a match from C9 Rush which is much better; he gets counter ganked, dies, dies to LeBlanc; 0-2 he starts his comeback w/ a gank on top. I cannot link the twitch directly it seems, but the match was on 11/22/2015 (and is the first of his 9 hour stream!) Again, info in Foxdrop video seems spot on, just needed a "worse" start to bring home the mesg.
So many people in this comment section that don't understand that Foxdrop was behind in levels and probably barely even in gold due to the fact that he spent so much time wandering and not killing camps. The end result was he was actually very behind, despite first blood and helping his teammates.
foxdrop, i realy apreciate ur videos, but can you make video how to carry or win a game when you are ahead (maybe even a huge lead) but 2 out of 3 lanes are losing hard, how to transfer that game into victory? Im having those troubles as diana quite often, im trying to let them kills but when we're around 30 - 40min it just all goes wrong, usually. btw - if you did such video already, link pls, thanky ou very much! :)
Nějakej Plaesant if you play a carry jungle, be selfish, as diana you can oneshot adc or apc, that's all that matters. Just focus on getting yourself fed, try to get picks (so ward) and you should be able to transit that into turret / drake / baron kills.
Catoon I usualy do that, but in lategame it all goes wrong when my bot lane is just useless and as diana its usualy max 2 kills before u die (no return basicly ..), and they are so unbelievably weak they wont be able to kill the rest 3 :/ Well, thank you for tip anyway :)
Nějakej Plaesant if your team is too weak to teamfight, don't teamfight, just get picks and spam ping obejtives, your objective gonna be to turn the 5v5 into a 3v5, and survive so you can kill baron or something :p
Catoon Sounds legit, will try, thank you :) btw - would u suggest me nidale or shyvana? IM deciding between those 2, im mainly solO Q player, aka preparing because new acc :)
Foxdrop: i hope you notice the trend here, that a lot of people want to see more actual "come back from behind" videos. I've noticed the same problem with some other popular LoL youtubers; they post "come back from behind" videos, that ARENT actually significantly behind. Unless you want to explicitly tell us, "if you're behind more than 1 tower, and/or 5 kills, then just give up", then please, please post videos where your team, and particularly YOU, are behind, in all aspects, yet make a comeback because of good planning rather than other team throwing it. My suggested criteria: at least two towers behind at least 5 team kills behind no one on your team particularly fed after all, if your team is "behind", but you have some super-carry champ with 10 kills on your side, it isnt particularly educational or helpful to us "little people" out there who want to learn how to turn things around.
Depends. If u don't plan on coming back, kill a little one (xp) and the big one(gold). However, when u plan on continuously counterjungling, kill the whole happy family so u get the icon to serve as your timer to commit some more genocide.
If your mid laner is doing better than you, absolutely. It's much better for someone doing well to have the buffs than someone who might lose it to an enemy.
Also I think his most recent vi jungle gameplay he talks a lot about keeping / giving away buffs. He got pretty fed but he didn't want to cause strife by not giving away his blue so he did.
I want to see the 4 man late invade where you give first blood and the enemy top sion takes your blue. That is behind. This was more like, "How to come back from a bad invade" than actually being behind. It was a minor point, not really game changing. This is like loosing the 12 minute dragon fight. Yes, you are 'behind' compared to if you won, but rarely is that what sub plat would call behind.
What should a person do when the opponent jungler kept on counter jungling you? This will lead to no or very little experience earned and also very little gold to buy items. This also results in 'no dmg' done in ganks and even so ur opponent might kill u if u try to gank. pls make a video about this. and how to make a comeback if possible :)
If I fall back AND the champ im having can buy a static shiv. I always buy the component wnd just farm safely After some while I get alot of gold + the extra 600-900 gold from the passive is insane It really stacks up
Dude, i have problem about the other Bronce people not understanding that the junglers jungle. We go into the jungle, and farm, but they just want ganks, and idk what to do! No matter what there is someone blaming you, becasue you are the jungle guy... What can i do? I can´t carry in ranked, and there is always a troll or an afk or a laggy one. I was bronce 1 when I started ranks, and now cause many people like I tell you, now I´m bronce 5... Most of times I´m a jg 70% of games I can play like I do.. or idk; plz help!
+Diego Urréjola Just tell your laners that you will need time to get your core finished. What I see way too often, is that when I'm at my first clear, usually bot lane dies with double kill to opponents adc, gets back to lane and dies again and I'm not even finished my first clear so the flaming starts. I simply say that you need to hug turret and ward when possible so I can come later with more G's on me so I won't give them triples by being behind versus their bot. Just remember that you will be blamed alot for "not ganking" while it should be their job to not die constantly, it's just people tilting and not finding anything else to blame.
Kevin Vardanian Pretty much, the reason he's played is because of his playmaking potential. His damage spikes pretty well mid game, though, if he gets ahead.
NorthernRedStar +Kevin Vardainian I agree. It sucks because back a few seasons ago, around season 2 and season 3, I got into jungle and I spent MANY hours trying to learn lee. Now, by the time my mechanics are actually really decent, he isn't much of a viable champ anymore. He's so much fun, and I find comfort in picking him, but I lose often to meta champs.
Yep. This is tank central in season 5. Although, he is starting to make more appearances, because many junglers want to go sated now, and sated + botrk takes a while to build, so using lee correctly you can make a lot of plays while they are just farming, and feed your lanes in preparation to their sated jungler. Plus, Lee has really raw damage, and with a good combo with his ult, sated junglers like yi, shyv, and ww are nearly dead by then.
This video doesn't talk to the Sliver players trying too get Gold. What do you do when you get invaded and die level one or If you're being counter jungled by the enemy jungle and the top lane smiter.
Im obviously not quite at this level bronze ftw but succesful lvl 2 gank and first blood sounds like a great start to me hell if i got that id be commenting im off to a good start not that im behind. Behind to me sounds like a shacco invading me on my first buff killing me and taking it then the first gank getting me killed through a countergank or similar
Aaron Van Breugel Another Bronzie agreeing with you! The games where I fall the furthest behind are when I am constantly trying to help out struggling laners, but never getting any kills or assists. If you stick to farming your jungle so you can be strong for teamfights, you might be 6 towers down at 15 minutes and the rest of your team is useless in fights.
Hey foxdrop, this vid was really helpful as this is a problem I've been having recently. One question I've had for a lot of league players is, how do you keep calm while playing ranked? I'm not talking about getting mad, I'm more talking about not getting nervous. I have this problem in a lot of games, even some that don't have a ranking system, where I'll just freak myself out. So how do YOU relax yourself?
next can u teach me what to do as a top laner when jungler lacks brain cells and gets me behind by towerdiving level 2 solo and feeding double buff or by pinging on the way but does not show up in 3 minutes while enemy is still overextended.
Recently been doing jungle more often than ever (silver 3 here) Its a no brianer if your behind then farm of course but in the lower elos, this does happen with higher ranked people even diamonds on my team bust their tits for not having a gank at 5 minutes in, These people don't seem to realise that you need to do farm rotations or camp certain lanes because you have a high win chance or the enemy top laner desperately needs someone to bully someone like riven or renekton. It annoys me when other lanes get jealous and complain because im not ganking their lane and busy bullying, killing top or mid lane all the time. I've done stuff before like warding the river waiting to bait a sucker in but most mid laners I see don't roam through the river they normally go through your jungle or their own jungle. the amount of times I've seen cheeky mid laners thinking they can sneak past my red or blue jungle without me noticing it. they are very much mistaken.
You were ahead Ill tell you what you did wrong early and that was not getting golems after first blood when you had smite and lots of health and also trying to kill fizz/shyvana instead of taking raptors. If you wouldve done that you wouldve saved time and snowballed
Just play Amumu. Not even joking, Amumu's the champ you can play and go 0/4/1 an as soon as you get your ult and can line up some clear ganks and put your ult to use then you can easily get kills and assists
I'm sorry Fox but your definition of "behind" must be different than everyone else's. You're behind on levels but not gold and shyvana is one of the best early duelists in the game. Maybe you could've explained what you could do if you're behind instead of doing a play by play in this video where you are NOT behind on kills, gold and towers. I mean, you were 2/0/1 whereas shyvana was 0/0/0. You didnt give any kills nor did you cause a lane to lose by feeding it.
Zeke Malex Score isn't everything - I was most certainly "behind" in the sense that I'm under an appropriate level of power. Yes I wasn't level 2 30 minutes in to the game, but I was still having to adapt my play to accommodate for my weaknesses.
foxdropLoL - Be a Better League Player Thanks for the reply, Fox. I understand now what you mean about being behind. It's not all about the numbers. Adapting to the situation can be hard for many players, me especially. I'm a Silver player and still trying to fight my way up the ranks. I learn a lot from your videos and I appreciate the time and effort you do for all of us! Keep up the awesome job!
Zeke MalexAaahw, so cute! :)
I also kinda agree but more so what if the enemy jungler gets ganks on all lanes (Its a rammus and I was Zac) overall my team is behind so I try to go for objectives like Dragon and Herald but still my team is losing and I can do too much about the rammus ganks because my team was always pushing their lanes and I couldn't correctly predict where he would gank(Even though I purposely gave rift Herald pressure so I could counter gank but then he thanks bot lane so my ploy was absolutely moot) so I couldn't counter gank. Overall what should be my focus when I'm behind in farm,ganks, and not being able to do much? Should I just keep focusing on objs because by the time we reached 20 everyone decided to surrender
8:05 that reksai is a god ^^
Stroppi93 I wish we could have seen that chase. Just watching the minimap was exciting in itself haha.
sandau44 they chased her for almost a minute lol
Hahahaha he was like "cya neeerds"
Stroppi93 its called being good at rek sai and you say cant toutch this
Nic Austin can't touch her
how do you get 1st blood and say your behind? i mean u were behind in lv's but ahead in gold. I think when people feel behind is when a shaco invades them and their 0-1 instead of 1-0
Luis Melendez in the early game a jungler like lee flourishes and is more dependent on early levels to have the abilities and power he need to gank
Luis Melendez Yeah i was expecting this video to be a 0-2 start and a 10-2 finish and no a First Blood being 1 level behind :/
MagicalMonsrer5000 He himself as a jungler is behind, because he ganked. Yes Vayne is ahead in lane now, but that doesn't help him, as Lee Sin, in the jungle.
Luis Melendez He's behind in levels, which matters for Lee Sin. Had he continued playing like normal he'd be further behind. You need to do damage control before it gets out of hand.
The level drop for the amount of gold he had was not even close in being worth.
Not sure if I'd call this being behind. Shyvana had a one level advantage on you during your invade attempt, but you had an item advantage due to your kills/assists for most of the this clip. Being behind in farm, especially against a late game jungler like Shyvana, isn't really anything to worry about if you're still able to create pressure and plays for your team. If you could show us how to come back from a disadvantage of deaths or even your team losing lane, I think that would be more informative.
Scott M Agreed! I wish I could call 2-0-1 at 11 minutes "behind". If that first gank did not result in a kill and Shyvana killed him then took his camps, then he would have been behind (it seems that Shyvana took his blue when she saw him gank bot lane...or they just invaded).
Really not behind most people when they say I'm behind are been constantly counter jungled by the opponent jungler and have lost control of their jungle.. No offense but this was like when people complain they have lag when their ping jumps up to like 30 from being 10. This video is a bit of a cop out.
Oli F No, that's when you've been behind for 10 minutes and haven't done anything about it. As Fox said, your priority is to not get further behind, which is what he was doing in the video. Had he continued like normal he'd be even further behind, which is what you're talking about. People don't identify that they're behind until it's too late and they're losing the game.
Losing and being behind in goals and gold differ, to losing one's games. Once you go behind in farm or tart up an enemy you don't play the same as before. Now the game is about getting back and not losing.
Machine Herald valid point. But my initial point still stands as the video wasn't what I expected and seemed to be the best case scenario of "being behind" and so made coming back very easy this isn't the situation most people would describe themselves as being behind.
Oli F That's the thing, when people identify that they're "behind" they're already losing. Fox knew he was going to be really behind if he continued playing like normal, so he changed it up.
You don't wait for gangrene to claim your entire leg before you cut it off, you need to identify it as soon as possible so you only need to sacrifice a toe.
THAT'S what people need to learn.
Oli F Well he is high elo and being a few lvls behind sucks in high diamond. But yeah i get your point.
I like how people are complaining about how his not far behind enough, when he states, not even a minute into the video yet, that you should make it a clear goal to not fall further behind. The obvious issue is people dont seem to understand that they're behind, or are in denial of it, until the fact is blatant and they're straight up losing. TLDR, identify the fact you've fallen behind sooner and commence with the damage control.
Content like this is why you're my favorite TH-camr. Keep up the good work Foxie!
Thanks, all too often you only see games where people are dominating (or at least going even) its refreshing to see how it can still work when you are behind.
Nice vid man!I watch some videos every day and they reallt seem to help.Thx alot!
When I fall behind as a jungler I start to think of myself as a secondary support. I have to make of my limited resources what I can and so I play the same way I would if I played support (maybe this is because I mained support for a lang time before changing to jungle). I play the vision game (very important !) and try to react to the enemy jungler instead of forcing plays, since he is stronger than me I try to avoid a confrontation and counterjungle him when he shows in a lane, which helps getting me ahead and slowing him down.
Would love to see a video about invading the enemy jungle and punishing the enemy jungler. I became a jungle main a few months ago, and this topic was by far the hardest thing for me to master. Nice video btw :D
First of ur vids I ever see. Subscribing for the epic start of ur vid.
One of the best videos from you foxdropLoL - Be a Better League Player lately. Keep up the good work. Thank you.
There are different ways of being "behind" when you're a jungler. You can be behind when no ganks work, when you're being heavily counter jungled, when your lanes constant pings for assistance cause you to lose farm, etc. I'd say a big thing I do when I'm behind is cover a lane when my allies are gone and shove it when the enemies are as well. I also play a lot of farming/counter jungling focused junglers so heading into the enemy jungle is a good way to put them behind and you ahead if you do it right. Also, wards and communication with allies are the only sure fire way to stop the enemy from counter jungling you.
Funny how literally no one understood the point of this video and completely ignored everything foxie explained...Lol.
***** " Would know instinctively to farm jungle to get back on levels..." Who do you think watches this kind of vids? Experienced junglers?! Nope, new players who struggle to get into the game! The points explained in this vid can be really useful if you actually apply them, and there are A LOT, in case you somehow didn't notice. Farming the jungle is just a simple one of them, its not necessarily the best option everytime and you have to do a bit more then just farming if you actually want to win, as foxdrop said. The reason this vid didn't "mimic" other people's situations is because they're nowhere near as experienced as him and kept playing normaly even though they were behind!
if i`m behind as a jnglr i try to help others as much as possible .... farming up is the safe path, but loosing valuable time in the jungle leaves much time for enemy jungler to make plays. So my best advice is - pick 1-2 lanes that can carry your team and help them out. Deep warding is very good (buy pinks) , cause it doesnt only protect your lanes from ganks, but can get you a counter gank - double kill + drake can swing things in your favor very quickly. Also minions > jungle farm so if your laner is base and his lane is pushing soak that XP. Build paths are also to be adjusted - if you are 0/5 full damage builds are no good etc.
Im trying to main jungle, also with lee sin. I find this a very very very usefull video as im not that high ELO. So thanks for that, you make great videos. These tips will help me out, alot.
That helps me alot! I didn't managed to farm on lanes as a jungler when nobody was there^^
Fox since you were behind at the start in this game, you should of gone trailblazer as it would of given you the quicker clear speed in the jungle as well as you wouldn't of needed to go back to get health after a gank, as the trailblazer would of given you enough.
hey fox if you wouldn't mind covering "how to save a lost lane" as to what a jungler should be doing/ not doing when faced with team mates falling horrifically behind?
You make some good points but can you demonstrate on a game when you are 0/3/0 at 10 min or when all 3 lanes 0/2? These sort of games can be salvage but may well require different tactics than what you describe. For example, getting kills when really behind seems pretty unreasonable, with towers and possibly dragon being better options.
illan731Also taxing lanes can put your laners in significant danger especially considering you can't counter gank well when behind.
Fox could you do a video where it shows all your lanes are losing and see where the jungler puts the game back in balance?
Love the vids btw!
I don't like falling behind has a jungler especially since I don't like to jungle.
AlyMewGaming I think jungler is the funniest role in league. Mid and bot are so boring and with 0 diversity (you always see the same champions playing the same way), the only lane I like to play other than jungle is top.
TheXCross same, but because i suck at bot, and i have no mid champs (besides fizz)
TheXCross I guess you never played jarvan support then :P. Bot is the funniest lane imo.
Catoon It's too standard and you have too much pressure on yourself. The outcome of the game is almost everytime determined by the outcome of the bot lane and if you fall behind you have little chance to catch up, since AD items are really expensive.
TheXCross "little chance to catch up?" just dunk a bitch and u get money.
"ad item are expensive?" all you need is buy a pickaxe with first blood money and you already one shot squishy bot laners.
Fox, it would be great if you could also talk about how to come back if you're being heavy counter jungled. Great video, anyways ^^
I would argue that going the farming route is the better option when you fall extremely behind since the extra exp mechanic of jungle is less risky with good reward.
When top and mid both feed should you just camp bot? Or should you make an effort to gank lanes like that and try to shut the enemy laner down?
Sean Snyder There will never be a clearcut answer to this. For example, if I were playing something like Fizz or Vi jungle with enough damage, I might try ganking a losing lane. If I'm Seju and their bot lane has a BF sword 6 minutes in, I will avoid going there unless we can get both mid and jungle down there at the same time. In any case, a 2 man gank rather than just a jungler will be a bigger investment, but also comes with bigger rewards. Towers also help immensely with their global gold.
Just a thought, it's kinda annoying that your fox logo on the lower right covers the minimap. Might wanna change that if possible.
love your vids like always,
Yue
Sir foxdrop i need some advice..
I main jungle and have studied most of your videos. Is it possible f or you to make a video about handling 2 enemy junglers? i once battled an enemy team with no supp but 2 junglers... what sucks is that my carries doesn't even come to help
how do you record this? Can you record a game on league, from in the game? Like you can move the map ectra
I was wondering if you could make a vid on knowing what to build and when vs other builds. It seems no matter how much health or armor I build it doesn't matter when facing a crit build. I know that every match's build should be specific to that match but I have trouble counter building a lot of times.
I had this one ranked game where I was playing as jungle Amumu and I was getting counter jungled right from the start by an actually decent Lee Sin. He killed me three times in the first seven minutes and I fell way behind. To make matters worse every, single lane was losing badly by ten minutes in. Despite all that I kept my composure and stayed focused trying to farm as best I could and encouraged my team to keep trying. Not to give up. I felt really good about myself because when the going got tough I stayed cool and kept gutting through it.
I have a serious question out for anyone to answer as it has been occurring fairly frequently especially in my ranked games. As a jungler what can you do to bring a game back if all of your laners are losing and or most dying already by the five minute mark. I have this problem so often and when you aren't playing a champion with good early ganks whatsoever (at the five minute mark people generally aren't pushed up enough to be able to gank being an immobilize champion early per say Shyvana for example). I'm always the center or blame for every lane and it's becoming quite the nuisance and I haven't quite been able to fix this one flaw in my gameplay for ages. So to summarize, everyone loses lane, what can you do for your laners at that point to help everyone win, otherwise I basically get flamed the whole game creating lots of tilt pressure, and just toxicity in general. Thanks for your time to anyone who answers, it's truly appreciated.
Does anyone know what software fox uses to record his games? I wanna be able to record games like this video.
Hey! Does anyone know what Foxdrop used to record this gameplay?
If you fall behind really hard early on as a jungler, you simply need to go for risky ganks hoping it will put you laners ahead and they can carry the game. When falling behind hard as a strong early game jungler, immediately look for gank opportunities even if it's 50/50. When falling behind as level 6 reliant jungler (malphite/fiddlesticks/evelynn), go afk farm until level 6 and start ganking afterwards.
Hey Foxie, who are the best cinderhulk junglers right now?
fox what program u use to save the games?
can u give us your opinion on the sated jglers, e.g. yi, shyvana, xin zhao
Why didnt he get lvl 3 before first back? 400-500 hp should be just enough to do it right?
Dear Foxmaster . This video is helpful , especially to lower elo players (myself silver 1) but you could also argue that a reason you caught up was because the enemy jungler didn't capitalise on the mistakes you made . Would like to see something about being behind because you are being counter jungled or even just out classes and played by them . How do you beat someone who is better than you ?
-The student Fox
Amazing video dude, nice job
Great =) Asked it Phy after one of his last videos! It´s great that you answer :D
Not a very helpful video for me personally, as I feel playing from behind is one of my stronger skills; nothing new to see here for me, but it was a helpful video for those who are not so good at jungling or playing from behind! So good video, nicely done. Although I really want to see some videos where your entire team is playing from behind, and what your options are in solo queue to get your team back into the game.
Hey Drop The Fox, it was usefull! Thanks bro.
Full lee sin gameplay commentary plz. Trying to learn lee sin and would find it very helpful.
What to do when you fall behind as a Jungler?
The same thing you should do as any laner. DDOS the enemy team :P
@gold7oo Lee doesn't need the sustain from Trailblazer. Fox explained he Wanted to Go for kills to get back in the Game. That's Why he bought Blue smite. Source: Diamond Lee Main
So how do you feel about Shyvana jungle?
Liked this video a lot, very informative
Thanks for the video Foxy!
Hey, Foxdrop, can you do me a favour and make a fizz game with the new Devourer? It is batshit OP once you get sated and Botrk
Give us a vid about champions working well with the new jungle item. Like a tier list
when you are jungling as lee sin, what rotation of spells do you use while clearing?
Allyournexus Rbelongtome Cast Magic Missile on your mid-laner, then a Haste spell. I also like to use Summon Fire Elemental so I can get something to help me.
Doesn't matter but it's best to use q last simply due to execute
wtf is magic missile ClassicalByMetal ? and did they add Summon Fire Elemental to the game? Shit mages aren't boring anymore :D
also, good thing one person seriously answered my question, Bloody Apple
Bloody Apple Only problem with that is there isn't that much time to complete your q lol
Bloody Apple I'm saying you can't physically weave that many autos and still finish the q.
How to watch replays without any programs just with LoL client? Is it possible?
Foxdroplol best league youtuber great video m8 8/8
Who do you think is better in the current meta, Kha'Zix or Rengar? I've seen countless of Rengar's lately, and hardly any Kha'Zix but I rarely have games where I don't have at least 10 kills, Kha'Zix is so strong o.O
rowinwan1 Kha'zix relies on isolated enemies for his burst. Whereas Rengar's burst is much more reliable. I feel Rengar's ganks are much better as well.
Stanley I don't really agree on the ganks though, Rengar's ganks are rather useless when he doesn't have his ult, where as Kha'Zix can gank without it easily. Also, Rengar's ult can be easily pinked out lategame, which makes him useless in the next fight, even though good Rengar players will know how to avoid that.
Bloody Apple The thing is though, if Rengar misses his bola theres a high chance the gank will fail, where as Kha'Zix can miss his W and still leap on the target. Also, if you get the laner away from the minions, I'm fairly sure Kha'Zix deals more damage.
Conclusion: With everything up Rengar is probably better, or at least more reliable, with ults not up Kha'Zix is? Guess that's fair.
rowinwan1 I play both rengar and kha and the biggest problem I see people do is build them full damage, as a rengar it can be a good thing since his W give him insane resistance and he just need 1 defensive item to be hard to kill, while kha on the other side need at least 2 defensive items to be able to do his damage without being blown up.
damage wise rengar can do more since he doesn't invest too much gold into his resistances while kha need to get his defenses.
the best way to play them is to play rengar as a semi-assassin were he goes in kill someone or get them out of the fight ,
on the other hand, kha is best played as a brusier who can do great damage (not as great as rengar's) and in the same time he can tank alot of stuff.
for kha getting hydra,cdr boot or mr boot,LW ,omen,black clever,the last item depends of the game but I like ga
How does he get the replay from his game?
My thoughts... Exactly
superguitarmaniac100 One of the dozens of replay programs like LoLReplay, SkinSpotlight Replays (which i use), Baron replays, etc
Not a bad video, but I think most experienced junglers can come back from a level behind after a "bad" gank, even if they couldn't take the kill. The situation here wasn't ideal, but wasn't bat at all either, the lanes were keeping even on their own and that chase with Rek'sai was great, she kept the attention of three people on her own for quiet a long time and managed to get away.
I think for me personally the problem starts when at least two of the lanes are loosing hard, to the point when they need jungler intervention to keep even. I can never keep both of them afloat long enough to go farm myself or help enough that they can handle their opponent alone after a while and with the advantage under their belt, their enemy laners will start to roam way too soon. If I choose to farm instead of ganking, it ends the same most of the time, because the jungle can give only so much exp and the enemy team will get a massive gold/lvl lead from the kills and the free farm.
It usually ends with our outer towers broken, the loosing laners farming my jungle because why not and crying in the allchat to get me reported. At this point I have no means of clawing back, as I can't gank because I'm at least two or three levels behind the winning enemy laners, can't farm my jungle because it's taken and can't even dream of taxing a lane because it's either pushed out too far or someone's already there.
hey, can anyone tell me the program he uses to record the match?
This is good video/tips but poor example. There's a match from C9 Rush which is much better; he gets counter ganked, dies, dies to LeBlanc; 0-2 he starts his comeback w/ a gank on top. I cannot link the twitch directly it seems, but the match was on 11/22/2015 (and is the first of his 9 hour stream!) Again, info in Foxdrop video seems spot on, just needed a "worse" start to bring home the mesg.
So many people in this comment section that don't understand that Foxdrop was behind in levels and probably barely even in gold due to the fact that he spent so much time wandering and not killing camps. The end result was he was actually very behind, despite first blood and helping his teammates.
How much would you rate black cleaver on lee mid?
Fere Far the same he would rate lee mid. dumb.
K You clearly didn't play on S2-S3
TheLegendaryVakita
You clearly don't play in S5
You're better off going warrior into LW over cleaver as a second item if you are ahead.
you clearly don't know shit about lee or anything about the game if you go lee mid you fucking dumbass uninstall the game you noob
your videos are realy helping, well i hope you can make a video on how to make rune page and masteries.
foxdrop, i realy apreciate ur videos, but can you make video how to carry or win a game when you are ahead (maybe even a huge lead) but 2 out of 3 lanes are losing hard, how to transfer that game into victory? Im having those troubles as diana quite often, im trying to let them kills but when we're around 30 - 40min it just all goes wrong, usually. btw - if you did such video already, link pls, thanky ou very much! :)
Nějakej Plaesant if you play a carry jungle, be selfish, as diana you can oneshot adc or apc, that's all that matters. Just focus on getting yourself fed, try to get picks (so ward) and you should be able to transit that into turret / drake / baron kills.
Catoon I usualy do that, but in lategame it all goes wrong when my bot lane is just useless and as diana its usualy max 2 kills before u die (no return basicly ..), and they are so unbelievably weak they wont be able to kill the rest 3 :/ Well, thank you for tip anyway :)
Nějakej Plaesant if your team is too weak to teamfight, don't teamfight, just get picks and spam ping obejtives, your objective gonna be to turn the 5v5 into a 3v5, and survive so you can kill baron or something :p
Catoon Sounds legit, will try, thank you :) btw - would u suggest me nidale or shyvana? IM deciding between those 2, im mainly solO Q player, aka preparing because new acc :)
Nějakej Plaesant both are good imo, but shiv is fairly strong at the moment because of the devorer up ;)
Foxdrop: i hope you notice the trend here, that a lot of people want to see more actual "come back from behind" videos. I've noticed the same problem with some other popular LoL youtubers; they post "come back from behind" videos, that ARENT actually significantly behind.
Unless you want to explicitly tell us, "if you're behind more than 1 tower, and/or 5 kills, then just give up", then please, please post videos where your team, and particularly YOU, are behind, in all aspects, yet make a comeback because of good planning rather than other team throwing it.
My suggested criteria:
at least two towers behind
at least 5 team kills behind
no one on your team particularly fed
after all, if your team is "behind", but you have some super-carry champ with 10 kills on your side, it isnt particularly educational or helpful to us "little people" out there who want to learn how to turn things around.
Can someone please tell me if it is better to kill the whole camp when counter jungling or if you should only kill the big one and a small one.
Depends. If u don't plan on coming back, kill a little one (xp) and the big one(gold). However, when u plan on continuously counterjungling, kill the whole happy family so u get the icon to serve as your timer to commit some more genocide.
Thanks, most of the time I will kill the whole family as udyr because I normally continually counter jungle.
Hey, the music at the end is Skyworld by Two Steps From Hell.
If I'm jungling and fell behind, should I give my blue buff to my mid laner?
If your mid laner is doing better than you, absolutely. It's much better for someone doing well to have the buffs than someone who might lose it to an enemy.
Jurani I see, okay /.\
Also I think his most recent vi jungle gameplay he talks a lot about keeping / giving away buffs. He got pretty fed but he didn't want to cause strife by not giving away his blue so he did.
How are there no comments? Good vidja. I hate getting behind, but this helps. =)
I want to see the 4 man late invade where you give first blood and the enemy top sion takes your blue. That is behind. This was more like, "How to come back from a bad invade" than actually being behind. It was a minor point, not really game changing. This is like loosing the 12 minute dragon fight. Yes, you are 'behind' compared to if you won, but rarely is that what sub plat would call behind.
Only me who notices that Foxdrop always says "really"? :D
Axel Reuterwall really?
Did he really say that?
Ermergerd, like, really?
JohnnY ye weally
Axel Reuterwall he said that a crap ton of times
What should a person do when the opponent jungler kept on counter jungling you? This will lead to no or very little experience earned and also very little gold to buy items. This also results in 'no dmg' done in ganks and even so ur opponent might kill u if u try to gank. pls make a video about this. and how to make a comeback if possible :)
Ong Hong Xuan Ward
If I fall back AND the champ im having can buy a static shiv. I always buy the component wnd just farm safely
After some while I get alot of gold + the extra 600-900 gold from the passive is insane
It really stacks up
Funny how the smites of the mini-side-champ-thingies are already coloured at the start of the game
Dude, i have problem about the other Bronce people not understanding that the junglers jungle. We go into the jungle, and farm, but they just want ganks, and idk what to do! No matter what there is someone blaming you, becasue you are the jungle guy... What can i do? I can´t carry in ranked, and there is always a troll or an afk or a laggy one. I was bronce 1 when I started ranks, and now cause many people like I tell you, now I´m bronce 5... Most of times I´m a jg 70% of games I can play like I do.. or idk; plz help!
+Diego Urréjola Just tell your laners that you will need time to get your core finished. What I see way too often, is that when I'm at my first clear, usually bot lane dies with double kill to opponents adc, gets back to lane and dies again and I'm not even finished my first clear so the flaming starts.
I simply say that you need to hug turret and ward when possible so I can come later with more G's on me so I won't give them triples by being behind versus their bot.
Just remember that you will be blamed alot for "not ganking" while it should be their job to not die constantly, it's just people tilting and not finding anything else to blame.
Lee Sin can't really outduel any popular junglers anymore.
NorthernRedStar He's like a damage oriented Support in the jungle. He doesn't duel anyone just helps his lanes usually.
Kevin Vardanian Pretty much, the reason he's played is because of his playmaking potential. His damage spikes pretty well mid game, though, if he gets ahead.
NorthernRedStar +Kevin Vardainian I agree. It sucks because back a few seasons ago, around season 2 and season 3, I got into jungle and I spent MANY hours trying to learn lee. Now, by the time my mechanics are actually really decent, he isn't much of a viable champ anymore. He's so much fun, and I find comfort in picking him, but I lose often to meta champs.
NerdyKidNick And he doesn't do anything to tankier champs either really since his abilities are his killing tools, mostly.
Yep. This is tank central in season 5. Although, he is starting to make more appearances, because many junglers want to go sated now, and sated + botrk takes a while to build, so using lee correctly you can make a lot of plays while they are just farming, and feed your lanes in preparation to their sated jungler. Plus, Lee has really raw damage, and with a good combo with his ult, sated junglers like yi, shyv, and ww are nearly dead by then.
This video doesn't talk to the Sliver players trying too get Gold. What do you do when you get invaded and die level one or If you're being counter jungled by the enemy jungle and the top lane smiter.
Im obviously not quite at this level bronze ftw but succesful lvl 2 gank and first blood sounds like a great start to me hell if i got that id be commenting im off to a good start not that im behind. Behind to me sounds like a shacco invading me on my first buff killing me and taking it then the first gank getting me killed through a countergank or similar
Aaron Van Breugel Another Bronzie agreeing with you! The games where I fall the furthest behind are when I am constantly trying to help out struggling laners, but never getting any kills or assists. If you stick to farming your jungle so you can be strong for teamfights, you might be 6 towers down at 15 minutes and the rest of your team is useless in fights.
Yeah that's the other way to and that's what we really need a video on
so u explained how to comback when u are behind.. but can u please make a vid about "how to fall behind" in first place? ;)
the cc for 'i screwed myself over' in this is
'ice cream us is fire'
Another video idea- how to deal with a really fed assasin as a low-mobility adc(say jinx against a fed talon)
Please make a gank guide for s5!
Hey foxdrop, this vid was really helpful as this is a problem I've been having recently. One question I've had for a lot of league players is, how do you keep calm while playing ranked? I'm not talking about getting mad, I'm more talking about not getting nervous. I have this problem in a lot of games, even some that don't have a ranking system, where I'll just freak myself out. So how do YOU relax yourself?
next can u teach me what to do as a top laner when jungler lacks brain cells and gets me behind by towerdiving level 2 solo and feeding double buff or by pinging on the way but does not show up in 3 minutes while enemy is still overextended.
foxxy saw the duck in the river at the start. it was destined to be a good game.
you had chilling smite and shyvana had the red smkte since the begining of the game, is that a new hack?
for those who didnt understand, I'm joking
Recently been doing jungle more often than ever (silver 3 here)
Its a no brianer if your behind then farm of course but in the lower elos, this does happen with higher ranked people even diamonds on my team bust their tits for not having a gank at 5 minutes in, These people don't seem to realise that you need to do farm rotations or camp certain lanes because you have a high win chance or the enemy top laner desperately needs someone to bully someone like riven or renekton.
It annoys me when other lanes get jealous and complain because im not ganking their lane and busy bullying, killing top or mid lane all the time.
I've done stuff before like warding the river waiting to bait a sucker in but most mid laners I see don't roam through the river they normally go through your jungle or their own jungle.
the amount of times I've seen cheeky mid laners thinking they can sneak past my red or blue jungle without me noticing it. they are very much mistaken.
Season 5 lee sin guide? :p or just items for lee sin jungle :p
Takes gromp. Then blue, Walks over to red. Sees shaco steal red. Disappears. - Quits game & uninstalls and rethinks life
That Draven player = Jax top while you were discussing baiting.
You were ahead Ill tell you what you did wrong early and that was not getting golems after first blood when you had smite and lots of health and also trying to kill fizz/shyvana instead of taking raptors. If you wouldve done that you wouldve saved time and snowballed
0:30 that double duck top right
Just play Amumu. Not even joking, Amumu's the champ you can play and go 0/4/1 an as soon as you get your ult and can line up some clear ganks and put your ult to use then you can easily get kills and assists
To be fair shyvana should have had alot more cs out of her position
What is that sonic wave at 4:02 lol
The video a lot of people are requesting here is one based entirely on luck, not something Foxy can pull out of a magic hat..
A wild Duck has appeared! RNG river
As a diamond jungler I approve this video
ur such a hunky fox ykno
that ending was sooooo slooooooooooooooooow