The lack of static pictures at the end of the vid showing the handle with its bend might suggest a few tears were subsequently shed. 😉 Nice job as usual Joe. 👍
Surprised that you did not make a circular bore segment , 90 degrees to the locking axis for the locking plug instead of the circumferential chamfer for the contact point on the ram. The chamfer will cause divots on the ram (point contact), and the 90 degree in-line bore clamp configuration would lock better, and not cause damage through repeated clampings. Just a thought, and it is still retro-fitable if you like the idea! Mel
If this was a daily use machine the cross cylinder notch would be much better but this is totally functional for this operational scale model. I wonder how many viewers understand the 2 piece split plug design that "requires" the cylindrical cross notch.
@@chuckinwyoming8526 Hi Chuck. Yes, for micro scale models, the "KISS" method Joe used is probably better. More interesting is that you may be the only reader that even knew what I so porely described (upon later re-reading!).
Other options would be a softer material for the "washer" aka plug, brass or even Delrin. One could also use grinding compound in the a jig to grind the mating chamfered surface to a matching radius. I originally though of grinding in actual tails stock assembly but realized that would also grind the main bore. But as others have note for a scale model this likely will last well over expected lifetime use cycles.
I thought so too but,when you consider the diameter of the ram and,the size of the locking screw,it is more than adequate. I have to rethink my sense of scale when watching the videos
Joe, Your mastery of skills and innovative methods of solving problems really shows and comes out in this last clip. Rather than just go along with the "norm and accepted" you always think of can I improve this; not only how by the machining methods but the in the most pleasing view for the eyes. Can't wait to sit and just chat over dinner at Papadeaux's.
Clever design change. Love it. This series is very interesting. I have such a hard time imagining just how small those parts really are. Fantastic work Joe.
In the beginning of the video when you described your approach, I assumed the slug would be coped to match the radius of the tailstock spindle in order to maximize surface area of contact and to prevent denting the surface of the spindle. Minor detail that I doubt will make a significant difference. I love all of these videos and learn something from every one. Keep 'em coming! -Kurt
Awe, Joe, it's 2021, THANK YOU, for holding back ~Potential Tears~ ! ! ! As for me, watching you for YEARS NOW, I remember "Arachnid" we once knew . . . You didn't cry Then !!!! Thanks for the teaser video, (A full Video ~Woulda/Coulda~ have had a Single Frame shot of that Bent Locking Lever) !!!!!
I’m wondering if pulling the washer up from below the spindle would have been better so when the handle is unscrewed the washer would fall downward and not rest on the spindle.
Well done. After studying the plans , thats what I came up with too. On my mini mill , I had to split the lead screw nut and add the chamfer washer to clear the threads. When you were making the feet I thought they were oil cups at first.. Just for ffun , I started a second 4 jaw chuck ! Ahh
I have built several PM Research kits and I fully agree with Joe's comments about using different bolts and other minor changes. I have talked to the people at PM , and they fully understand the changes people want to make, but they are under a lot of constraints to keep the cost of there kits down and changes and upgraded fasteners add to the cost. There goal is to provide a quality product that can be built as is or be the basis for a nice custom model.
If you go to the PM Research website you will see a picture of a miniature line shaft machine shop, with all of their miniature machine tools. I sure hope Joe goes that far with this project. He could even build a steam engine to power the whole thing.
@@joepie221 I know I watched the whole thing. I just wasn’t sure if that engine would be strong enough to run a whole machine shop. So I guess you’re going to do it then. A whole line shaft machine shop. I can’t wait.
There is a big disadvantage of your solution, be it a hypothetical one: using one slug will force the quill out of alignment, rendering it ever so slightly from the axis in two directions. One toward the man to operate this lathe, two downward. Using two slugs would yield only one deflection, while using the slit will not result in deflection in any direction. But you will not run the machine like a real one, so it all is hypothetical.
As I see it, the split method can still impart deflection unless you can guarantee equal forces on both sides of the split from the clamping, which looking at the casting would be very difficult to achieve due to the web and the draft angles. The reality is that at this sort of scale the limiting factor will almost certainly be the fit of the spindle to the bore - there's no benefit to having a sub 1 thou alignment on the nose if the tail can float +/- 1 thou in any direction because the spindle will still be off true.
I like your design a lot. Makes a lot more sense than putting stress on the part from clamping down on the slit I hope you do more models from PMR, I’d really like to see you do a shaper next if you do!
You made right decision. If you slit the part it would've ended up stretching and bending since it's made from that softer aluminum. Can I suggest that you make the washer out of brass? That way if it is seen around the OD if the handle it will have a little color contrast. So, did you end up crying?
@@joepie221 Nice. That's one of the reasons why I like and respect you and your channel. You don't take suggestions or constructive criticism as a personal insult and ban people.
@@bradyoung6663 To be honest, nobody knows everything, and sometimes even the simplest thing gets overlooked. I do occasionally ban people from this channel, but its because their remarks stray too far off track and get personally offensive. I'm only human. :) I appreciate your comment. Thanks.
I think thats a better solution overall .. as much as this lathe is only for looks, i think your deaign will hold better than the split called for when one considers the size of threads that would be doing all the clamping work if it was split. Thanks for sharing 🇨🇦
Oh man! Believe it or not, there are some super small bearings out there for relatively cheap! I've used a few in metric, not sure if they come in imperial as well. Joe consider giving this a shot!
@@ferrumignis That would be totally out of character for this lathe. I have a 14" similar in design to this model. About the only differences are a two speed back gear and a quick change gearbox on the lead screw. That and 1800 lbs LOL
Hi Joe, Your design change was a good decision. I think it is the best option. Just wondering if you cried when you bent the handle. :-) You and the family stay safe.
As small as the tail stock ram is, I think you made a wise choice. I am curious whether you are going to use a tapered reamer in the tail stock ram or,throw us a wild and unexpected curve.😎
My Leblond 19x48in lathe has a split bore clamping mechanism for the quill in the tailstock, and it works great. The issue with what you did is its a smaller bearing area, and could deform the quill over time. then again, how much wear is this lathe going to get.
The more I looked at that half hole dig in the front of the tail stock casting, the more it bugged me. I am actually repairing that and installing the split bushing this morning. I'll post a video of the repair that should answer your question.
Another project that can make good use of split cotters rather than splitting the casting is the Quorn (the model engineers holy grail!!). There is a version of the Quorn tool and cutter grinder called the Bonelle which is made from bar stock, no castings! Have a look at it, it would be a great project for you!!
G’day Joe. Awesome project, I don’t know how you can see half of what you are doing, so small. That little handle looks like it will twist off the first time the grandkids or the son-in-law gets anywhere near it. Cheers Peter
PM Research is getting a great deal by giving you these models to build. I hope they are acting on your videos.It will make things much easier for anyone who builds one of these kits.
Hey Joe.... I may be the only one, but I'd be really interested in how you fill in the half hole.... Could you do a video when you do it? Thanks in advance!
Hi Joe. My full size Colchester (1941) split clamp due to wear doesn't work anymore. I may modify it to your design with a bronze "washer" The alternative will be to make a new spindle I suppose. I imagine it will move the tailstock centre down every time I clamp. I will think about the double washer design. Will that help keep the alignment ?
Joe, this is the first time I've disagreed with your decision. If you had made those two slugs like you mentioned, with the bottom one tapped, you would have avoided the drill through that's going to bug you. Perhaps you wouldn't have been able to clock the handle exactely, but that's pretty minor IMO. Best Regards
Are you going to put a slight groove in the tailstock spindle for the washer to locate into so you're not clamping onto an arc with the corner of the washer? Or is the washer chamfered to suit the spindle?
Instead of filling the half hole, maybe just contour it a little and then blast the surface. If you aren't happy with how that turns out, you can still fill it.
A two piece clamping slug could have prevented the half hole, but i do not know how much thread there would be left in the bottom slug. It would be mandatory to give it the shape of the quill to prevent it from turning when locked.
I'm completely blown away! I like the change. It puts the "TEXAS" adjustment spin on it. There is nothing more fun than making it better!
The lack of static pictures at the end of the vid showing the handle with its bend might suggest a few tears were subsequently shed. 😉 Nice job as usual Joe. 👍
No tears. Be sure to watch the next video I post.
A little aluminum Devcon epoxy and a trip through the glass beader will hide that.
Great video, as usual.
Keep 'em coming, Joe.
Ah! There it is! @10:44 “Let’s unloosen the handle” Double the entertainment and a very clever albeit simple locking technique.
Nicely done! And I think you made the right decision. That's not only easier but is far cleaner looking than a split housing
Much nicer than splitting the casting, Good Call ! 😊
I agree Joe - much neater than slitting it. Thanks for the video.
Much better design. Good luck on the bend.
Thanks for yet more entertainment in the high level works. Note the work with footage, and editing.
Surprised that you did not make a circular bore segment , 90 degrees to the locking axis for the locking plug instead of the circumferential chamfer for the contact point on the ram. The chamfer will cause divots on the ram (point contact), and the 90 degree in-line bore clamp configuration would lock better, and not cause damage through repeated clampings. Just a thought, and it is still retro-fitable if you like the idea!
Mel
If this was a daily use machine the cross cylinder notch would be much better but this is totally functional for this operational scale model. I wonder how many viewers understand the 2 piece split plug design that "requires" the cylindrical cross notch.
@@chuckinwyoming8526 Hi Chuck. Yes, for micro scale models, the "KISS" method Joe used is probably better. More interesting is that you may be the only reader that even knew what I so porely described (upon later re-reading!).
Other options would be a softer material for the "washer" aka plug, brass or even Delrin. One could also use grinding compound in the a jig to grind the mating chamfered surface to a matching radius. I originally though of grinding in actual tails stock assembly but realized that would also grind the main bore.
But as others have note for a scale model this likely will last well over expected lifetime use cycles.
HI Joe that is a far better solution the the tail stock lock, wish I thought of that when I did mine.
I like that solution Joe - very elegant and certainly demonstrates the value of appropriate calculations too.
I was expecting you to scallop the washer to match the radius of the quill. A chamfer seems like a cop out 😆!
I thought so too but,when you consider the diameter of the ram and,the size of the locking screw,it is more than adequate. I have to rethink my sense of scale when watching the videos
To be honest, it was a time constraint driven decision. I may remake the parts in brass and scallop them accordingly.
Yes Joe, your design change is awesome 👌. Instead of putting a slot on the locking tail stock. It looks so much cleaner 😀.
Joe, Your mastery of skills and innovative methods of solving problems really shows and comes out in this last clip. Rather than just go along with the "norm and accepted" you always think of can I improve this; not only how by the machining methods but the in the most pleasing view for the eyes. Can't wait to sit and just chat over dinner at Papadeaux's.
Clever design change. Love it. This series is very interesting. I have such a hard time imagining just how small those parts really are. Fantastic work Joe.
In the beginning of the video when you described your approach, I assumed the slug would be coped to match the radius of the tailstock spindle in order to maximize surface area of contact and to prevent denting the surface of the spindle. Minor detail that I doubt will make a significant difference.
I love all of these videos and learn something from every one. Keep 'em coming!
-Kurt
Superb solution Joe! That's a much better look and realistic as well. This thing is going to be a real 'beaut!
I'll smile every time I look at it.
Awe, Joe, it's 2021, THANK YOU, for holding back ~Potential Tears~ ! ! !
As for me, watching you for YEARS NOW, I remember "Arachnid" we once knew . . . You didn't cry Then !!!!
Thanks for the teaser video, (A full Video ~Woulda/Coulda~ have had a Single Frame shot of that Bent Locking Lever) !!!!!
Tears - The lubricant of learning. Nice job.
Excellent work!
Great idea to use a locking washer, looks much better and probably much easier than getting a nice cut with a slitting saw.
your change looks nicer than the split would look, great job
Clever solution, and it looks great.
To time the handle you can simply make the bushing long and shave it down based on the pitch to get the angle you want at the torque you like.
Thats true to 'Time' any threaded component.
Hi Joe. I have been watching your channel and having been enjoying your videos. I love what you teach in every video. Keep up the great work.
I liked that idea on the tail stock. Much cleaner for sure.
I’m wondering if pulling the washer up from below the spindle would have been better so when the handle is unscrewed the washer would fall downward and not rest on the spindle.
A 2 piece would be better.
It is very humbling to see your work Joe. I've got a long way to go in my hobby, watching your videos confirms it! Thank you Joe, regards from Wales
Thanks. Stick with it.
I like your change much better than the slot
Well done. After studying the plans , thats what I came up with too. On my mini mill , I had to split the lead screw nut and add the chamfer washer to clear the threads. When you were making the feet I thought they were oil cups at first.. Just for ffun , I started a second 4 jaw chuck ! Ahh
Wonderful Joe, thanks as ever Sir
P.s i would fill the half hole 👍
I have built several PM Research kits and I fully agree with Joe's comments about using different bolts and other minor changes. I have talked to the people at PM , and they fully understand the changes people want to make, but they are under a lot of constraints to keep the cost of there kits down and changes and upgraded fasteners add to the cost. There goal is to provide a quality product that can be built as is or be the basis for a nice custom model.
I can agree with that.
Good idea with the slug. I would have done this the same way.
If you go to the PM Research website you will see a picture of a miniature line shaft machine shop, with all of their miniature machine tools. I sure hope Joe goes that far with this project. He could even build a steam engine to power the whole thing.
He already did.
@@joepie221 the whole machine shop, or the steam engine, or what?
@@barryfields2964 The steam engine build was my last series.
@@joepie221 I know I watched the whole thing. I just wasn’t sure if that engine would be strong enough to run a whole machine shop.
So I guess you’re going to do it then. A whole line shaft machine shop. I can’t wait.
I like it. A much more elegant solution and no worries about failure of the casting if it is ever over torqued.
If the threads ever pull out, I can add the lower slug. Its a safety net at this time.
Nice job, Joe. And definitely a better idea than a slot.
Thanks for the video Joe.
Good change and well done to boot!
If we don't see you until after next week end, may the Fourth be with you!
Woody
Maybe brass for the lock piece....?
Good thought
The soft brass would prevent dents on the TS- quill.
There is a big disadvantage of your solution, be it a hypothetical one: using one slug will force the quill out of alignment, rendering it ever so slightly from the axis in two directions. One toward the man to operate this lathe, two downward. Using two slugs would yield only one deflection, while using the slit will not result in deflection in any direction.
But you will not run the machine like a real one, so it all is hypothetical.
As I see it, the split method can still impart deflection unless you can guarantee equal forces on both sides of the split from the clamping, which looking at the casting would be very difficult to achieve due to the web and the draft angles. The reality is that at this sort of scale the limiting factor will almost certainly be the fit of the spindle to the bore - there's no benefit to having a sub 1 thou alignment on the nose if the tail can float +/- 1 thou in any direction because the spindle will still be off true.
*Unloosen* the handle? Darn you sir! Darn you ! Irregardless (see what I did there!) , this is a really enjoyable series Joe ! Very cool stuff.
I prefer your custom solution for this. Looking great👍🏻
Nice wee tidbit for us today. Thanks Joe.
Love your work Joe. Cheers from Perth Australia
I like your design a lot. Makes a lot more sense than putting stress on the part from clamping down on the slit
I hope you do more models from PMR, I’d really like to see you do a shaper next if you do!
I already have the kit. It came in the mail as a gift from a subscriber.
@@joepie221 cool! Can’t wait!
Hi Joe,
Nice work... I hope did not end up crying...
Take care.
Paul,,
You made right decision. If you slit the part it would've ended up stretching and bending since it's made from that softer aluminum. Can I suggest that you make the washer out of brass? That way if it is seen around the OD if the handle it will have a little color contrast. So, did you end up crying?
Good call. Brass it is.
@@joepie221 Nice. That's one of the reasons why I like and respect you and your channel. You don't take suggestions or constructive criticism as a personal insult and ban people.
@@bradyoung6663 To be honest, nobody knows everything, and sometimes even the simplest thing gets overlooked. I do occasionally ban people from this channel, but its because their remarks stray too far off track and get personally offensive. I'm only human. :) I appreciate your comment. Thanks.
I also thought a brass washer.. I think it would grip better.
Dale in Canada
@@joepie221 Fair enough.
Beautiful work! Thanks for sharing and putting the video together
My pleasure.
Wow works just like the spindle lock on a micrometer,,,nice touch Joe,,Bear.
The only word I have is"OUTSTANDING " thanks for all your efforts.😎🤗😎🤗
superb craftsmanship
I think thats a better solution overall .. as much as this lathe is only for looks, i think your deaign will hold better than the split called for when one considers the size of threads that would be doing all the clamping work if it was split. Thanks for sharing 🇨🇦
Hope the bend went well.
Much better design than a split.
Great change a thinking result
Thanks Joe
Beautiful detail work.Thank you.
Thanks for posting Joe! Always a pleasure to watch your skill n listen to your tips, stay well. TFS, GB :)
Great work on a great project! Thanks for sharing!
As usual, very nicely done!
Hey Joe thank you sir !!!
Still waiting for that miniature live center ;)
Oh man! Believe it or not, there are some super small bearings out there for relatively cheap! I've used a few in metric, not sure if they come in imperial as well. Joe consider giving this a shot!
And the quick change toolpost :D
@@ferrumignis That would be totally out of character for this lathe.
I have a 14" similar in design to this model. About the only differences are a two speed back gear and a quick change gearbox on the lead screw. That and 1800 lbs LOL
Hi Joe,
Your design change was a good decision. I think it is the best option. Just wondering if you cried when you bent the handle. :-) You and the family stay safe.
I'm bending it this morning. I'll let ya know.
Actually, a Cotter... Love It!
As small as the tail stock ram is, I think you made a wise choice. I am curious whether you are going to use a tapered reamer in the tail stock ram or,throw us a wild and unexpected curve.😎
I may actually bore that taper in.
Really? That boring bar must be a needle.
I remember that boring bar you showed in a previous video.My wife has sewing machine needles larger than that
My Leblond 19x48in lathe has a split bore clamping mechanism for the quill in the tailstock, and it works great. The issue with what you did is its a smaller bearing area, and could deform the quill over time. then again, how much wear is this lathe going to get.
Could you describe the “split plug” idea on the white board? I didn’t understand how it worked
The more I looked at that half hole dig in the front of the tail stock casting, the more it bugged me. I am actually repairing that and installing the split bushing this morning. I'll post a video of the repair that should answer your question.
@@joepie221 Joe, I like the change in design, but I did not like the half hole either. I will look forward to how you will address this.
Many thanks for the ideas in that.
👍👍😎👍👍 thanks for another valuable lesson.
That modification looks much better
10:38 Joe, you made my day.
Excellent Joe, much better than the slot, and after 5 yrs of heavy use you won't have a fatigued casting to deal with. 🤣 Top drawer stuff. Cheers, Jon
I think I’ll go unloosen something. 😁
Thanks,
John
Thanks for sharing!
Another project that can make good use of split cotters rather than splitting the casting is the Quorn (the model engineers holy grail!!). There is a version of the Quorn tool and cutter grinder called the Bonelle which is made from bar stock, no castings! Have a look at it, it would be a great project for you!!
love your work Joe but mate did you BREAK it as there was no photo showing the bend
Of course you are going to make a live center for that tail stock?
I already have the ball bearings.
G’day Joe. Awesome project, I don’t know how you can see half of what you are doing, so small. That little handle looks like it will twist off the first time the grandkids or the son-in-law gets anywhere near it.
Cheers
Peter
The guard dogs will get them long before they reach it.
PM Research is getting a great deal by giving you these models to build. I hope they are acting on your videos.It will make things much easier for anyone who builds one of these kits.
Actually, Joe paid for this set. This is not a paid sponsorship.
My mistake
Hey Joe.... I may be the only one, but I'd be really interested in how you fill in the half hole.... Could you do a video when you do it? Thanks in advance!
Nice work! I like the idea, as apposed to spitting the casting.🤙
Thanks Chui 👍
Would you mind giving us a Whiteboard explanation of the two slug configuration and how you would machine that differently please.
Thank you Joe!
Great way to do the lock
I see (actually hear) that it took you more than 10 minutes into the video to find something you could unloosen. Way to build suspense!
Very cool alternative. Looks better too I think. Just out of curiosity how would you fill the 1/2 hole?
JB weld with aluminum filings mixed in.
How did you come up with the height of the slug? Was it just trial and error? Would this have worked with a blind hole?
The problem with a blind hole is that it would be hard to tap to the bottom and/or get the travel on the slug. Could possibly be done but much harder.
Is this spindle lock not going to score the spindle and cause it to jam / be less smooth? Or is it a softer metal? Amateur here, just curious.
The chamfer on the edge of the 'washer' means that it is a fairly wide contact patch, not a sharp one.
I'll remake the contact part out of brass to avoid that.
Hi Joe.
My full size Colchester (1941) split clamp due to wear doesn't work anymore.
I may modify it to your design with a bronze "washer"
The alternative will be to make a new spindle I suppose.
I imagine it will move the tailstock centre down every time I clamp.
I will think about the double washer design. Will that help keep the alignment ?
Great series 👍🏻
Glad you like them!
is it gonna clamp if the tread is in bouth opper and lower hole
He milled the upper thread out to house the bushing. Pay attention! (Joke)
Joe, this is the first time I've disagreed with your decision. If you had made those two slugs like you mentioned, with the bottom one tapped, you would have avoided the drill through that's going to bug you. Perhaps you wouldn't have been able to clock the handle exactely, but that's pretty minor IMO. Best Regards
I agree with you.
@@joepie221 Having you agree with me made my day!
PS the 1/2 hole does let down your fabulous work standards
Good thinking.
Bet Joe didn't cry, he's far too cool.
Are you going to put a slight groove in the tailstock spindle for the washer to locate into so you're not clamping onto an arc with the corner of the washer? Or is the washer chamfered to suit the spindle?
The chamfer was done to match the radius chord.
Great, I think that is a better way to go...
Simple and clean. Very clever 👏
Instead of filling the half hole, maybe just contour it a little and then blast the surface. If you aren't happy with how that turns out, you can still fill it.
I could setup and mill the entire front surface back and re-radius the edges. You'd never know it was ever there. I may just head in that direction.
Is there a taper to the washer inside the locking mechanism?
I'd still opt for a leverlock for the tailstock clamp . .. whatever works is 'good enough' ?
Fantastic, i think PM research is going to revise there drawings 😀
That would be rewarding if they did.
A two piece clamping slug could have prevented the half hole, but i do not know how much thread there would be left in the bottom slug. It would be mandatory to give it the shape of the quill to prevent it from turning when locked.