I actually didn't hate him in this episode. Because Ketil, who supposedly hates violence, understood his role and, sadly, was forced to hit the kid. He also did it as an act of mercy, because Thorgill would almost certainly have killed the kid. Of course, Ketil later reveals himself to be something much more sinister.
I agree, but still he does give the vast majority of the slaves he buys the opportunity to free themselves, while also treating them with kindness. The chances of any other slave owner to even think of giving an option for their slaves to free themselves in near zero, and basic farm work and labor is what many of his slaves had done in the past anyway. So while Arnheid is the exception to his group, the rest of them would have been worse off with any other owner 99% of the time
It's not like it's a rare occurrence, slavery was totally widespread in Norse society, especially at the peak of raiding. Basically everyone owned slaves if they could afford it.
@@ryanpalyo8181 but that doesn’t really matter because he still owns them and have restricted them from their freedom even if he says that he will give them freedom at that very moment he has control over them
yeah but you forget that they were already captured from a separate 3rd party right? They were gonna get sold to someone regardless. Not like slave traders are gonna go, "oops, this one didn't sell for a couple days, guess I'm just gonna let them go free." Which is why I said the chances are VERY high that a different owner besides Ketil would have treated them way worse overall.@@jospinmeshe6667
@@jospinmeshe6667That does matter though if any slaves were given the choice to choose their master, Almost all of them would choose to be Ketil’s slaves.
At first, I kinda liked Ketil, flaws and all. His character really reflected the societal pressure that is being put on male leaders, especially in a time where violence and ruthlessness was celebrated and kindness/mercy was seen as "weak". But yeah, since she already finished season 2, I totally get why she doesn't look back fondly on this guy.
Ohh, I would mostly disagree. I think that his portrayal is starkly negative and is kind of an answer to "what if there were *good* slave owners?", which is "no, there aren't good slave owners". He has that pressure aspect, and he might even be tragic, in a way, but I would go to Olmar for the "flaws and all but I like him". Ketil is just...pathetic.
I think Ketil is an interestingly written character. He feels like a real person we would encounter in real life. Decent guy at most times, but behind closed doors he can get abusive. Lots of domestic violence cases involve men like Ketil who aren’t “evil” in a conventional sense, but have flawed traits and views about things. In this case, Ketil still subscribes to the idea that slaves are his property, and that he is also insecure about his possessions being taken away. The author wants to show that even if a person is a “good slave owner”, ultimately slavery is evil precisely because the slaves are still treated as property that can be used and abused whenever by the master.
@@loquens5060 If Ketil didnt brake down and go mad after Kings betrayal he would be considered a good person. If guy like that is born in society they lived he would be like top 99% good guy in there. Even though in our standards he is still a slave owner etc. We need to understand context of their world.
@@Martyyri thank you exactly. people still hated him in the end becauae he was a "slave owner" and for what he did to Arnhied but people dont realize that what he did was still within his right as her owner. Also its not like he does that to every slave in his farm we did not see him do that to any slave. We have seen Einar for example get beat up and punished for his escape but no one seems to remember that.
I remember actually feeling moved by this episodes ending, bc I felt sympathy for Ketil at the end. But yeah, a few episodes later my opinion on the man changed drastically.
I actually like that the author didn't go the route of the "good slave master" that's everywhere in anime, at the end of the day Ketil is still a slave owner, and when a slave owner's property (i.e. his land and his slaves) are taken away from him, we see just what kind of man those sorts of people are
@@grey_f98I have never seen any slave master in any anime be good, they are all the stereotypical physical abusers that beat their slaves like animals. Ketil might be the first one that seemed nice for long enough to make you think he’s good at first glance. What happens later well… he had us in the first half.
The more you get to know Ketil, the less you want to get to know Ketil. In fact, in the manga, Arnheid's naked as she comforts him, heavily implying what just happened between them, and by extension, the non-consensual nature of it.
For me ketil its a very good character because for the age of the story in vinland saga thing like the Cruelty are so common and he its like a mix of all because is Humble, sensitive, weak and fragile without being able to make decisions and when they do they have been either very kind as a thorfinn, einar or "trying" to soften the punishment of children or also horrible decisions such as those that many people have madeHumble, sensitive, weak and fragile without being able to make decisions and when they do they have been either very kind as a thorfinn, einar or "trying" to soften the punishment of children or also horrible decisions like the ones that many already know xd
I feel like Ketil is a man who is naturally kind, but is also weak. He demonstrates why strength is also a very important thing to have. Since he is weak in a world full of evil and strong people, he cannot stand up for himself. But you don’t really see how that weakness is very very destructive until you get to a certain episode where you really see the depth of his weakness, that he seeks comfort and dependence from others because he is unable to seek strength from within.
This is the true understanding of Ketil. Those who don't realize his actual weakness just see Ketil as evil. He's not evil, he's weak, and succumbed to society.
@@silversrayliegh5924 He beat a pregnant woman so bad that she ended up dying from the injuries he gave her. He’s 100% an evil person lol. I’m sorry but there ain’t no excuse for that. He didn’t even show any regret either. Dude is a straight scumbag. 💀
@@shade8569 Yes there's no doubt there. But he's not inherently evil, or should I say, he didn't wish to be evil. But his weakness led him to his downfall.
I remember sympathising with Ketil, he is a genuine kind person who doesnt like violence, in world that punishes weakness. However 10 episodes later...
If Ketil didnt brake down and go mad after Kings betrayal he would be considered a good person. If guy like that is born in society they lived he would be like top 99% good guy in there. Even though in our standards he is still a slave owner etc. We need to understand context of their world. We can still see him as a bad person in our modern standards, but its factual that he was a good guy in their world until he went mad.
Ketil is a good lad in the worst times to be a good lad. Its just some people cant think properly about everything that surrounds him and became a big issue while trying to hold and manage.
@@ArtesMatt also he didnt just hit her, he beat her to death and caused her to have a miscarriage? vinland saga is all about pacifism and non-violence and yet you're questioning someone for thinking abuse is horrible oh lord make it make sense
I just watched the movie of Fruits Basket, cause it completely went past me I´d like a reaction to FB but Idk. When Winland already wrecks her like this. She might die with FB, of dehydration, we can´t have that. So stay hydrated everyone
You cannot just say "stand up" To Ketil, like he had this street cred he had to keep up with, and on that period, Man must be violent or be considered weak. He's the owner of a big farm, he needs to be respected to not be taken advantage of. He doesn't want to, but he has to because of the society of that time
I mean Ketil doesn't "have to", but felt pressured to do so. We see that his son Olmar later sees he doesn't have to and rejects the pressure after some time with personal development. Something his father couldn't do. So Ketil still had a choice, just surcome to the pressure, even if understandable.
He didn’t have to tho… He’s just a coward who can’t handle any sort of pressure. No one will stop respecting him if he doesn’t punish them with violence. As far as everyone is aware, he was a legendary warrior who has worked hard to gain a tremendous amount of wealth. He had a choice, he could have said “No we aren’t beating them because I think working on my farm is punishment enough and if you don’t agree then tough shit I’m Iron fist Ketil and the owner of the farm.”
I knew Ketil wasn’t that good of a person when he told Thorfinn and Einar they had to “Earn their freedom. The right way.” As if freedom is something that has to be earned in the first place. 💀
That's just how things were during this period, him giving them a chance to work for their freedom is actually one of the few good things he does, considering what other land owners would have done. His weakness and repulsive nature starts to show from his later actions.
@@michaelchristopher1426 Yeah I understand that but the way he says it has always rubbed me the wrong way. Definitely was a sign of what was to come from him. After all there’s no such thing as a “good” or “nice” slave owner. They’re all the same when comes down to it. They don’t see their slaves as humans, they see them as property and Ketil is no different.
I honestly never liked Ketil even when he showed Einar and thorfinn kindness. And every time someone says they liked him at any point I look at them a lil weird lmao I shouldn’t but I do. It’s because the first thing we knew about this man was the fact he was a slave owner and people said “well he’s not that bad” and ok but he’s still a slave owner
I mean in the series we had the fan favorite Askeladd who ordered villagers to be killed with families and children. In the context of the series in general, it's understandable why someone could like Ketil initially. Got killers as characters people like in this series in general for most characters with blood on their hands, so a slave owner like how he presented himself initially seems more tame in comparison. The context of morality has always been a spectrum of different shades early on.
@@shade8569 if ur responding to me, I actually do not like Askeladd for the reasons mentioned by @raec5426 😂 crazy how u assumed that lmao but he’s a good character that I can’t deny. No one in Vinland saga is completely good or completely bad so I get the idea of a spectrum. It really comes down to personal values and beliefs. Askeladd ordered the deaths of innocent people and Ketil is a slave owner both terrible people and to defend either of them is kinda crazy in my opinion but I’ll hear it out so no I do not love Askeladd nor will I defend him 💀
and the ketil hate train begins haha yay 😴 AGHHHHH
You'll hate him more in the future episode's
I actually didn't hate him in this episode. Because Ketil, who supposedly hates violence, understood his role and, sadly, was forced to hit the kid. He also did it as an act of mercy, because Thorgill would almost certainly have killed the kid. Of course, Ketil later reveals himself to be something much more sinister.
@@hollywoodshokil8171 She finished Season 2 already, so I don't blame her for being mad ^^
@@adrianwagner8202 ohh she already finished I didn't know that
@@adrianwagner8202 but this is not her future knowledge if i recall right she does not know yet
“A kind slave owner is still a slave owner” is pretty much ketil
I agree, but still he does give the vast majority of the slaves he buys the opportunity to free themselves, while also treating them with kindness. The chances of any other slave owner to even think of giving an option for their slaves to free themselves in near zero, and basic farm work and labor is what many of his slaves had done in the past anyway. So while Arnheid is the exception to his group, the rest of them would have been worse off with any other owner 99% of the time
It's not like it's a rare occurrence, slavery was totally widespread in Norse society, especially at the peak of raiding. Basically everyone owned slaves if they could afford it.
@@ryanpalyo8181 but that doesn’t really matter because he still owns them and have restricted them from their freedom even if he says that he will give them freedom at that very moment he has control over them
yeah but you forget that they were already captured from a separate 3rd party right? They were gonna get sold to someone regardless. Not like slave traders are gonna go, "oops, this one didn't sell for a couple days, guess I'm just gonna let them go free." Which is why I said the chances are VERY high that a different owner besides Ketil would have treated them way worse overall.@@jospinmeshe6667
@@jospinmeshe6667That does matter though if any slaves were given the choice to choose their master, Almost all of them would choose to be Ketil’s slaves.
At first, I kinda liked Ketil, flaws and all. His character really reflected the societal pressure that is being put on male leaders, especially in a time where violence and ruthlessness was celebrated and kindness/mercy was seen as "weak". But yeah, since she already finished season 2, I totally get why she doesn't look back fondly on this guy.
Ohh, I would mostly disagree. I think that his portrayal is starkly negative and is kind of an answer to "what if there were *good* slave owners?", which is "no, there aren't good slave owners". He has that pressure aspect, and he might even be tragic, in a way, but I would go to Olmar for the "flaws and all but I like him". Ketil is just...pathetic.
I think Ketil is an interestingly written character. He feels like a real person we would encounter in real life. Decent guy at most times, but behind closed doors he can get abusive. Lots of domestic violence cases involve men like Ketil who aren’t “evil” in a conventional sense, but have flawed traits and views about things.
In this case, Ketil still subscribes to the idea that slaves are his property, and that he is also insecure about his possessions being taken away. The author wants to show that even if a person is a “good slave owner”, ultimately slavery is evil precisely because the slaves are still treated as property that can be used and abused whenever by the master.
@@loquens5060 If Ketil didnt brake down and go mad after Kings betrayal he would be considered a good person. If guy like that is born in society they lived he would be like top 99% good guy in there. Even though in our standards he is still a slave owner etc. We need to understand context of their world.
@@loquens5060 your opinion seems biased. There are good slave owners and Ketil is a manifestation of a good master.
@@Martyyri thank you exactly. people still hated him in the end becauae he was a "slave owner" and for what he did to Arnhied but people dont realize that what he did was still within his right as her owner. Also its not like he does that to every slave in his farm we did not see him do that to any slave. We have seen Einar for example get beat up and punished for his escape but no one seems to remember that.
I remember actually feeling moved by this episodes ending, bc I felt sympathy for Ketil at the end. But yeah, a few episodes later my opinion on the man changed drastically.
Relatable lol
I actually like that the author didn't go the route of the "good slave master" that's everywhere in anime, at the end of the day Ketil is still a slave owner, and when a slave owner's property (i.e. his land and his slaves) are taken away from him, we see just what kind of man those sorts of people are
he's a "nice guy"
@@grey_f98I have never seen any slave master in any anime be good, they are all the stereotypical physical abusers that beat their slaves like animals. Ketil might be the first one that seemed nice for long enough to make you think he’s good at first glance. What happens later well… he had us in the first half.
8 and 9 masterpiece
This man ketil really made some of us sympathize for him with the good guy act, that changed really fast later on the series
8:58 Your cat made me jump lmao
I enjoy watching your videos! I like your opinions and breakdowns, keep up the great work 👍 ❤
The more you get to know Ketil, the less you want to get to know Ketil. In fact, in the manga, Arnheid's naked as she comforts him, heavily implying what just happened between them, and by extension, the non-consensual nature of it.
Just being in bed and understanding that she is a slave is enough.
that was clear in the anime too
For me ketil its a very good character because for the age of the story in vinland saga thing like the Cruelty are so common and he its like a mix of all because is Humble, sensitive, weak and fragile without being able to make decisions and when they do they have been either very kind as a thorfinn, einar or "trying" to soften the punishment of children or also horrible decisions such as those that many people have madeHumble, sensitive, weak and fragile without being able to make decisions and when they do they have been either very kind as a thorfinn, einar or "trying" to soften the punishment of children or also horrible decisions like the ones that many already know xd
I feel like Ketil is a man who is naturally kind, but is also weak. He demonstrates why strength is also a very important thing to have. Since he is weak in a world full of evil and strong people, he cannot stand up for himself. But you don’t really see how that weakness is very very destructive until you get to a certain episode where you really see the depth of his weakness, that he seeks comfort and dependence from others because he is unable to seek strength from within.
tmi
This is the true understanding of Ketil. Those who don't realize his actual weakness just see Ketil as evil. He's not evil, he's weak, and succumbed to society.
@@silversrayliegh5924 He beat a pregnant woman so bad that she ended up dying from the injuries he gave her. He’s 100% an evil person lol. I’m sorry but there ain’t no excuse for that. He didn’t even show any regret either. Dude is a straight scumbag. 💀
@@silversrayliegh5924He is still an awful person though.
@@shade8569 Yes there's no doubt there. But he's not inherently evil, or should I say, he didn't wish to be evil. But his weakness led him to his downfall.
I remember sympathising with Ketil, he is a genuine kind person who doesnt like violence, in world that punishes weakness.
However 10 episodes later...
When Miso jumped up at 9:04 I lurched forward to catch him like he was going to fall out of my monitor. 🤦♀😆
If Ketil didnt brake down and go mad after Kings betrayal he would be considered a good person. If guy like that is born in society they lived he would be like top 99% good guy in there. Even though in our standards he is still a slave owner etc. We need to understand context of their world.
We can still see him as a bad person in our modern standards, but its factual that he was a good guy in their world until he went mad.
If you put slavery aside, he is better than half the people that hated him, even in our modern standards.
It's funny how Thorkell and Thorgil are pretty much the same guy in so many ways but it's so easy to hate one and like the other.
The feeling she will have towards ketil in the later episodes will be worse that what she felt when she first met toji iyk 😂
Ketil is a good lad in the worst times to be a good lad.
Its just some people cant think properly about everything that surrounds him and became a big issue while trying to hold and manage.
1 more episode and peakest episode is cominnn
Oh boy, I remember how bad and sympathetic I felt for Ketil in this episode... Needless to say that that changed later in the series.
@@ArtesMatt this is a craaaaazy comment and i actually can't believe you wrote this out
@@ArtesMatt also he didnt just hit her, he beat her to death and caused her to have a miscarriage? vinland saga is all about pacifism and non-violence and yet you're questioning someone for thinking abuse is horrible oh lord make it make sense
@@AlanaMisako
I can't see this guy's comments, but oh boy it looks like it was bad. Wasn't expecting that when I wrote my comment.
@@AlanaMisakobruh now I'm curious. What did he sayyyy??
@@bendover7841 bro said "does hitting a woman, or a slave, seem that horrible? its funny how women are seen as precious stones even today" 💀
Uffff, cada ves se pone mas buenooooo
Tienes razón esto solo comienza...
I just watched the movie of Fruits Basket, cause it completely went past me
I´d like a reaction to FB but Idk. When Winland already wrecks her like this.
She might die with FB, of dehydration, we can´t have that.
So stay hydrated everyone
I cried more watching Vinland than fb
You had a pretty good read on Ketil in this episode already,
but I bet you didn't expect it would get this much worse.
Peakland saga
I know you love snake but if it wasn't for pater he would have got that kid killed 🤷🏻♂️
He literally says "go easy on them"
@@whyoowhyHe still would’ve beaten them up
@@shade8569 sure
You cannot just say "stand up" To Ketil, like he had this street cred he had to keep up with, and on that period, Man must be violent or be considered weak. He's the owner of a big farm, he needs to be respected to not be taken advantage of. He doesn't want to, but he has to because of the society of that time
I mean Ketil doesn't "have to", but felt pressured to do so. We see that his son Olmar later sees he doesn't have to and rejects the pressure after some time with personal development. Something his father couldn't do. So Ketil still had a choice, just surcome to the pressure, even if understandable.
He didn’t have to tho…
He’s just a coward who can’t handle any sort of pressure. No one will stop respecting him if he doesn’t punish them with violence. As far as everyone is aware, he was a legendary warrior who has worked hard to gain a tremendous amount of wealth. He had a choice, he could have said “No we aren’t beating them because I think working on my farm is punishment enough and if you don’t agree then tough shit I’m Iron fist Ketil and the owner of the farm.”
iron first
I knew Ketil wasn’t that good of a person when he told Thorfinn and Einar they had to “Earn their freedom. The right way.” As if freedom is something that has to be earned in the first place. 💀
That part is actually good of him, cause he paid for them and at that time other people dont even let their slave to earn their freedom at all
so real, looking back im like🤨
That's just how things were during this period, him giving them a chance to work for their freedom is actually one of the few good things he does, considering what other land owners would have done. His weakness and repulsive nature starts to show from his later actions.
@@michaelchristopher1426 Yeah I understand that but the way he says it has always rubbed me the wrong way. Definitely was a sign of what was to come from him. After all there’s no such thing as a “good” or “nice” slave owner. They’re all the same when comes down to it. They don’t see their slaves as humans, they see them as property and Ketil is no different.
Those who Thorfin helped enslaving may not have been so lucky
Will Alana start solo leveling? (It’s really good )
I honestly never liked Ketil even when he showed Einar and thorfinn kindness. And every time someone says they liked him at any point I look at them a lil weird lmao I shouldn’t but I do. It’s because the first thing we knew about this man was the fact he was a slave owner and people said “well he’s not that bad” and ok but he’s still a slave owner
I mean in the series we had the fan favorite Askeladd who ordered villagers to be killed with families and children. In the context of the series in general, it's understandable why someone could like Ketil initially. Got killers as characters people like in this series in general for most characters with blood on their hands, so a slave owner like how he presented himself initially seems more tame in comparison. The context of morality has always been a spectrum of different shades early on.
I bet you love Askeladd and even try to defend him lmao
@@raec5426It’s hypocrisy at best
@@raec5426 true
@@shade8569 if ur responding to me, I actually do not like Askeladd for the reasons mentioned by @raec5426 😂 crazy how u assumed that lmao but he’s a good character that I can’t deny. No one in Vinland saga is completely good or completely bad so I get the idea of a spectrum. It really comes down to personal values and beliefs. Askeladd ordered the deaths of innocent people and Ketil is a slave owner both terrible people and to defend either of them is kinda crazy in my opinion but I’ll hear it out so no I do not love Askeladd nor will I defend him 💀
Will you watch solo levelling
Tokyo revengers season3????
can you start watching solo levelling ,its absolute hype
she isnt ready for episode 9 yall