Pertronix Electronic Ignition Upgrade - 1967 Mustang 289 V8
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 ก.ค. 2024
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We want your thoughts and comments below. What kind of project are you working on? What Mustang are you daily driving? I respond to all respectful comments.
Alf's Mustang Garage is not responsible for any mechanical or technical error that you may encounter when working on your own car. You are responsible for your own quality control and your own proper repairs.
Today at Alf's Mustang Garage we remove the old mechanical ignition breaker points and install an electronic conversion kit manufactured my Pertronix. I show you how I test the system to make sure it has enough primary resistance in the circuit and coil to operate this unit, how to install, gap, and wire the unit. This is a complete start to finish how to video.
0:00 Introduction
5:32 Resistance testing your coil and ignition wire
12:31 Removing points & Installing ignitor module
17:01 Wiring ignitor to your coil - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
Never heard of these and you've explained how to do this very well. Might try this on my Aussie Falcon 250 2v. six cylinder.
Thank you. It's a very nice upgrade from mechanical points and they do make them for the 6 cylinders too 👍
That was just about a perfect explanation of the installation process for the electronic ignition. The bit about resistance measurement was very clearly laid out. Thank you.
Thank you I really appreciate it!
I would say that you need to bypass your resistor wire as mentioned in the manual. Your ignitor need full 12V, your resistor wire gives just 6-9V after start-up.
I understand it states that it operates best by bypassing the resistance wire and using their specific coil. But it's simply not necessary as long as you're within their total resistance specifications.
Another great video from you Alf and i alwasy try to share on my FB page to help anyone working on their vehicles and save some $. l love the camera work/detailed testing instructions and i definately need to pickup the professional wire stripping tool and crimping tools you have in this video.-The right tools make the repair go so much easier.-Thanks so much!.-Joe K.-
You're very welcome! Thank you!
What an awesome young fellow. Knowing is a one thing, but explaining is an art form. Thank you and God bless you from Australia.
Oh awesome thank you very much! It's compliments like this that help keep us motivated!
This channel is a freaking gold mine, thanks!
You're very welcome!
Outstanding detailed demonstration and instruction. Good Stuff Boss 🤝
Thank you
Excellent. For most people, it would be easier to learn to speak Chinese or Russian than to understand electricity/electronics. But, you've made this subject understandable by anyone. Thanks for taking the time.
Ha ha that is the truth. Thanks for the comment!
Installed one Sunday in a 1971 Lincoln Continental, beat thing I could have ever done. Great video!!!!
Awesome! Thank you!
I am restoring a '68 GT 390 Fastback, I really appreciate the specifics of your videos, very helpful
Thank you very much! Sounds like an awesome project!
Thank you! What a great step-by-step walk-through.
You're very welcome
Best installation video I have seen
Thank you!
Thanks for the video helped me a lot. So far this video made the most sense to me from a ton of videos on the correct way to install the pertronix.
Oh awesome thanks! And there there is the other way to bypass the resistance wire and use their coil but I'm glad it made sense from a total resistance standpoint.
Great video man. I appreciate your straight to the point, no bullshit style. keep it up!
Thanks Ernie I really appreciate it.
A lot of detail. I will be going this route in the future.
Glad I could help 👍
Great explanation! Love the channel and wish I found it sooner! Finally a channel that works on something I have (67 coupe, lime gold, 289. 3 speed manual). I have this as one of my projects on my list to convert to. Keep the channel like you have it, and not putting turbo's on everything!
Ha ha! Thank you! Ya I probably wont be doing any turbos anytime soon. Good luck on your project! I love those 289's
Another great video 👍
Thank you very much!
Very informative, thank you.
You're very welcome
This is by far the best explanation on this topic! Thank you!!
You're very welcome
@@AlfsMustangGarage Hi Alf! Someone told me I should better supply my Ignitor 1 and the 12V ignition coil with a relay to relieve the ignition switch. Unfortunately this doesn't work at all (the engine keeps running after switching off) so I'm thinking about throwing out the relay and installing it like you without it. Do you think the relay is really necessary? Would the ignition switch really be damaged? Seems like most people install the pertronix without an additional relay. Car is a '70 Galaxie. Would appreciate your thoughts...
It kinda depends mostly on what type of ignition coil you have. It also depends on how much total resistance you have in your circuit and coil. There isn't anything wrong with using the relay. But if it's not turning off, I'm guessing you might have it wired wrong. I would read the information that came with your particular unit and go from there. I talk alot about the resistance in the circuit and that often gets overlooked. I hope that helps.
@@AlfsMustangGarage Thanks for the quick reply! The coil I have is the Flame Thrower with 1,5 ohms. The ignition wire that went to the coil before now goes to 86 to trigger the relay. And 87 goes to + of the coil. 30 to battery + and 85 to ground. You're right I focused more on wiring than the correct resistance. I'll have to check that. Thanks again!
Excellent video. I knew about the resistance having to be correct but no other video that I have seen explained exactly HOW to test for it. I'm installing this on a 1987 OMC 3.0 boat motor. It is a GM 4cyl engine and I know that GM always ran a resistor wire instead of an external ballast resistor but don't know how OMC wired it from the factory. This video will save me a bunch of time and headaches not having to trace wires.
Oh right on! Glad I could help!
Very nice
👍
I love these videos!!
Oh hi Benson its been a while. I was starting to think you got bored of me.
@@AlfsMustangGarage never!! I am a lifer!
Oh good, I thought you might say that.
@@AlfsMustangGarage I hope I spelled that right.... 🤔🥴🤦♀️
Great instructional video.
I had to do a resistance wire bypass after it failed. Upside was I was planning a Pertronix install anyway. Bypass was simple enough just ran a suitable gauge wire from the ignition pigtail (1970 mustang) to the coil, spliced in the brown wire from the solenoid (for 12v cranking). Had to upgrade my coil (due to the 12v run voltage) so used a Pertronix flamethrower suitable for 12v system and Pertronix ignitor. All good.
Great videos from Alfs mustang garage, 👍.
Oh right on! Yup sometimes that's the way to do it and sounds like you did everything right. Good work! Thanks for being here 👍
@@AlfsMustangGarage ,
Thank you for your videos,
You're very welcome
Personally had alot of problems with the I & II versions. Went with the Pertronix III with the Flamethrower III & the relay that ensures you're getting 12v to the ignition. Doesn't have the issue of burning out if you leave the ignition on. Just spend the extra and get the III. Trust me. It will save you so much headache. Get good plug wires also. I went with Pertronix. Pertronix sells the relay on Amazon. Used on a Ford Racing 306 (slightly bored over rebuilt 302 roller motor). Dyno'd at 275 ho @ the rear wheel. 1968 California Special. C4 with Gear Vendors overdrive. 3.93 rear end but 2.72 final gear with od.
Alf, Declan here in Ireland. The shaft in the distributor has some play in it so decided to swap it out with a replacement distributor. Before doing that I ran your recommended resistance tests. On the final test, ignition wire on coil + and other test wire from coil - to battery +, I got a reading of 6.8!! This can’t be good. With everything connected to the coil, a test across both poles have me 3.5. Don’t know if that has any relevance. My head hurts.
Very well done and well explained. Another thing to check is your set of plug wires' resistance, especially if they are old. High resistance in those can adversely impact performance .
Yes absolutely. Thank you!
What is a good range? I have Duralast Gold 7mm Suppression Core wires measuring at about 2,000 ohms per foot. Is that okay?
@@LoneWolfStands357 Interesting, 5K Ohms is about the lowest u can get with suppression wires which is outstanding.
@@supersonique001 oh sweet. I’m glad to hear that. Just curious, I searched for hours on google, is there like a spec sheet that you know of that lists what resistance wires should have? Thanks
@@LoneWolfStands357 Not really, it's just that any good suppression wires should be as low as possible without interfering with radio signals. Zero resistance is usually solid copper which is no longer used because of their interference or wires that have a break in them which are no good to you anyway! At 2k Ohms your good to go!
My 66’ mustang had the red wire of the igniter wired to a 12v ignition source on the starter solenoid with black on coil negative when I brought the car some years ago. I remember moving the red to coil positive and the car would not run. I assumed it needed 12v to the igniter which is why it would not start coil was only getting 7-9v so I left it how it was. The coil resistance was 1.3 ohms I didn’t measure the resistance wire though maybe that’s what the problem was. Resistance wire gets hot with engine running so resistance would be different with the engine running. Was surprised when you wired you clients car that way and it ran my car must have something different in resistance values in the circuit of something.
Could be. One thing I've learned is every car is different and has different history.
Where on the ignition switch do you tap in to get 12V on the ignition feed to the coil? Can you tap into a keyed on 12V source from the fuse box?
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What happens if I haven’t tested resistance and just hooked what can I expect ? up its a 289 in a hot rod
My 289hp has a dual point distributor. Would this work for it? Thank you.
I just saw another video and it said you cant use the positive side of the coil of you are running a resistance wire in your circuit. Do I need to run the positive side of magnetic pickup to a 12 volt source???????
I would recommend reading the information from pertronix thoroughly. I've never heard of not being able to wire that to the coil.
This has been the best video I've found so far. Much better than the PerTronix video! I've had my 69 mustang for 38 years now and decided to make the upgrade. I'm somewhat new to multi meters but performed all of your suggested resistance tests. While the coil was at 1.6 the test between the start wire (red/green) to positive was a whopping 8+. Any ideas why that would be so high and how to correct?
Oh cool thank you very much! I've noticed that no one ever talks about the resistance needed in the circuit so I figured I would address that. So on your car, does it have a tachometer? With a resistance that high it might be worth double checking that value.
@@AlfsMustangGarage No tach, but you may be correct. Probably user error on my part.
Well it's definitely worth a second test I would say. You're old mechanical breaker points can still fire that coil off 5 volts but the electronic trigger definitely would need more. If that reading is real, you may have to start isolating your tests to see if the resistance wire has too much resistance or something. Good luck and let me know what you find.
Don’t you have to make sure that the voltage is 12v and not lowered voltage from ballast resistors?
Hello, I have not read all the comments but in this case the red wire must be connected before the resistor and not on the ignition coil? Otherwise the measured ohms are missing. So I intepriede the drawing at 8min 12 seconds in the video. Or am I wrong? the video is very helpful thank you
So from my understanding of these units, you can install them a couple different ways and there is much debate about it. The way I did it on this particular car is largely based off the resistance values of the circuit for this particular car. Your car may not be this way and you may have to bypass the resistance wire and change your coil. You're far better off to read the instructions carefully and determine what is going to work best for your application.
Hi, according to your video I ordered a Pertronix from US to Europe. Because there is nothing similar available in Europe.
I wanted to install it, but the magnetic ring is bigger than the diameter in the distributor.
Please, do you know what to do now? Is it possible to order a smaller diameter somewhere? Or can the magnetic ring be padded somehow to hold the distributor securely?
Sounds like you have an aftermarket replacement distributor. The pertronix units only fit the factory original distributors. I've come across this before and called them. They did not have any solutions for this sort of thing.
Besides not changing the points every 6000 miles...... what do you benefit from the Pertronix? Does it help the car start easier?
It's probably a little more crisp and gives the coil the appropriate amount of dwell to deliver optimum spark. But the big benefit is not having to mess with points 🤣🤣🤣
It's Jeff I got a question I have a 1968 it has a brain on the side of it that plugs into the protronics coming from the distributor plugs into that box our should I wire it straight to the coil
I would try to figure out what you have and download the instructions online to figure out how to wire it.
Good morning,
I watched your video very knowledgeable, I appreciate it, after I installed the Petronix, that it has a high RPM Miss, have new plugs, wires, cap, rotor, new coil,
the coil is within standards, total Ohms, there it's at 2.8 - 2.9 oms,
with the key on voltage at 6.96, can not find that Ignition resistor,
to unplug it, to bypass it,
To run a separate wire from ignition to coil, the vehicle running at idle it's putting 11.96 V out when I rev it goes to 12.96, haven't put a timing lite in it, any suggestions, thx Mark
What year is your car? The factory resistor wire is the first part of the circuit coming off the ignition switch to the firewall plug. There should be a bullet connector at the ignition switch going to a pink wire wrapped in its own loom.
@@AlfsMustangGarage 66' Mustang, so I put the PNX-2001
Relay, after installing it, still has a miss at high RPM, it fixed the lower RPM miss
What do you do with the wire on the starter solenoid that goes to the coil
Nothing. The wire that you're referencing is the resistance wire bypass circuit. That is what gives the ignition coil its power while the engine is cranking.
is that a standerd coil or a pertronix?
Question. When testing the factory ignition resistance wire for a 1.5 Ohm reading using the disconnected battery cable + terminal to the ignition coil + terminal through the ignition switch in the Run position, would you not have to make sure all other circuits are off or disconnected/inactive that can be powered in the Run position like the heater blower fan, radio, wipers, any interior/exterior lights and switches also through any door jam switches, ammeter, clock etc etc or you would get a false reading because the multimeter would be applying current to any activated but not battery powered circuit in parallel with the coil. Example the tilt away steering relay is energized when the ignition is in the run position providing another resistance path for the multimeter current to take in parallel with the ignition coil resistance wire in the Run position thus giving an inaccurate resistance wire Ohm reading. Would it not be more accurate to go from the ignition switch terminal "C" on the ignition switch harness connector at the back of the ignition switch directly to the coil + wire bypassing any other potentially unknown activated circuit to get the most accurate reading.
You may be correct. Its best to test resistance directly off the ignition harness connector. However, based off my understandings of electricity, you're simply testing the continuity between two points. Even though there are multiple paths for electricity to flow, There is ultimately only one path for electricity to flow to get from point A and point B and that is what is being measured. Keep in mind, electricity will take the path of least resistance.
@@AlfsMustangGarage You're correct. The ignition coil resistance wire is isolated based on where the multimeter leads are attached. The negative multimeter lead isolates that circuit. Not sure what I was thinking or over thinking.
Hey Alf,
I just installed a pertronix distributor and coil on my 65 mustang. I have an electric fan and eclectic choke wire I ran to the previous coil for 12v key on.
I need to move those elsewhere to get that power now. Where do you recommend? Will the heater wire work?
I typically wire aftermarket things that need 12 volt switched power directly to the accessory post on the ignition switch. Its a little extra work but that is what that post is made for. It's a far better solution than taping into another circuit.
@@AlfsMustangGarage thanks. Also, I have an aftermarket auto gage tac and flamethrower 2 coil with the pertronix distributor.
I know they don’t want any wires going to the coil besides the distributor wires and the pink ford power wire. My tach calls to put one of the wires on the negative terminal on coil. Have you seen any problems with the pertronix stuff by doing that?
I haven't but I would always check with the manufacturer of the coil and distributor first.
Do you have any suggestions on how to bench test Petronix igniter two? I’ve been tested everything else in the ignition system and it all checks out OK. I’ve done all voltage and resistance checks. I’m convinced this unit is bad but I don’t know how to positively identify if it is, can you help?
I'm afraid I don't have any suggestions other than to call pertronix and talk to tech assist.
@@AlfsMustangGarage Thanks for the response. I was number 26 in line when I tried to call tech support. Lol. I’ll try again another time.
Lol one of those unfortunate things.
Thanks for video. I'm looking to install on '66 Mustang 289. What is your take on the Pertronix III? It looks like it requires a new Pertronix III coil and ignition power relay kit to provide 12 volts. Trying to decide between the two and would appreciate your thoughts.
Well to be honest with you, I've never installed a Pertronix III. Most the stuff I work on are stock engines/daily driver/cruisers. So with that being said, I tend to keep things as simple as possible. However, I'm sure the ignitor III unit is far superior to the basic ignitor. I would probably go for it and see how it works. But I would also run their coil and relay unit to get optimum performance.
@@AlfsMustangGarage Thanks for the reply. I have a daily driver. Maybe the P III is more than I need? It seems a little more complicated of an install than what you show. Excellent video. Thanks!
Ya it's definitely a little more than what this video demonstrates. So if it's just a daily/cruiser, you definitely don't need to get too crazy with it. Just keep in mind those resistance checks of your system and if things are not within specs, you'll want to bypass the resistance wire and use the actual pertronix coil.
The Pertronix III needs additional components removed from the distributor at the vacuum advance.
Advantage of the ignitor (first gen) and ignitor II (which has an additional circuit protection if you leave your key on) is that you can carry a spare set of points. In the unlikely event of a Pertronix ignitor failing or whatever, you can easily go back to points simply and quickly.
Timing. I have been fighting getting my 68 mustang 289 started, just bought it. I think it’s a timing issue. When stabbing the distributor in, where should the Rotor be pointing when the crank is right at 0 TDC #1 Compression? Thanks for the awesome videos. Also, I can’t use a circuit light to set static timing with a Ignitor 2, correct?
The position of the rotor is quite irrelevant as long as it's pointed at #1 spark plug wire and the proper firing order follows. However, I typically place #1 at the 1 o'clock position. Rotor spins counter clockwise so you would follow the firing order after that.
@@AlfsMustangGarage Right on, thanks again.
con este kit hay que darle el adelanto de encendido ? o lo hace automaticamente ?
Este kit seguirá funcionando con su avance de vacío normal. La forma en que se avanza el encendido no cambia.
I have a petronix that has been sitting in it's case for about 4 years, do u think it's still good?
I would imagine it would be just fine of you had it stored indoors. Luckily they are easy to swap if it's not.
The manual states that you should use RFI suppression wires to the sparkplugs, is this really necessary?
Yes. But have you seen any spark plug wires sold that are not RFI suppression?
@@AlfsMustangGarage didn't dive too much into that before and don't know how old my cables are
Can someone clarify? I always thought these systems need to be connect to 12V key-on power, not the 6V at the coil, no?
Well it's more like 10 volts at the coil. But no Pertronix will say it runs best with 12 volts but it doesn't necessarily need it as long as the resistance is in spec. I mean the resistance has to be there regardless but there is that range that people never talk about 👍
@@AlfsMustangGarage Excellent, I have a set to go in my 71 cougar so I wanted to make sure I had the correct connection. Much easier connecting the the coil rather than tapping in at the fuse box. Great vid!
Right on, you still need to check your resistance though to make sure you're within specifications. I wouldn't advise to just hook it up and call it good. Read the pertronix instructions, it tells you everything you need to know.
I have a 65' with a 289 and am looking to do this upgrade and did your test. At first, it was reading about 26.5 ohms. I then warmed the car up for about 5 minutes and getting 3.7 ohms. Not sure if that's what changed things or I did the original test incorrectly, but I used both methods and had come up with 26.5 the first go around. Coil came it at 1.3 ohms before and after warm up. Also, I'm using a cheapie Harbor Freight gauge, which may not be perfect. What do you think of the 3.7?
Well technically the 3.7 is above the maximum resistance. So if that number is correct and accurate, you would want correct that. But it sounds like you may want to triple check your test and if possible with another meter just to be on the safe side.
@@AlfsMustangGarage I called Pertronix and they said I need a 1.5 ohm coil, such as their Flamethrower and to connect into the ignition wires prior to the pink resistance wire. They said the unit needs to be supplied with a full 12 volts or causes issues with the car running properly and not enough juice to the unit. Not sure how to make that connection, but apparently there's a red/green wires prior to the pink and supposed to crimp on to that? Have you ever had to do that?
I have had to do that on certain cars. However, Pertronix wants to sell you their coil and have you re-wire your ignition circuit. Which works and is all fine and dandy. However, not entirely necessary if you can find the un-wanted resistance in your circuit. According to their printed instructions you can do it both ways.
@@AlfsMustangGarage any tips on finding the unwanted resistance? The guy also mentioned they have some type of relay you can run directly off the battery to the unit and not hassle with the wiring bypass. Thanks again...
Sometimes, its easier to just purchase the coil and relay kit because with over 50 years of history, you never know if the old wire itself has extra resistance or what is going on. If you're confident that you have 3.7 ohms total on your circuit, then getting the coil and relay is by far going to be the easiest and safest route in my opinion.
Awesome video, you do a great job explaining! I have a question though, it says in the instructions that it needs a 12v keyed source but when I measure the voltage on the positive side of the coil I am only getting around 6 and some change which I am guessing is due to the ballast resistor? I have seen other folks say you have to bypass the resistor in order to get the full 12v. What are your thoughts?
So I find this topic rather strange because I get asked this a lot and I also see a lot of people talk about it in forums and on Facebook and more often than not, people are just given the wrong advice. You do not need to bypass your resistor in order to run the Pertronix IF your total resistance values are in specifications. Its more about the total resistance in the circuit than the voltage to the coil. This is why I focused my video a large part by measuring the total resistance of your coil and factory resistance wire. If if there is too much total resistance, then you will need to by pass the resistance wire or ballast resistor in order to bring that down to a normal level. I hope that makes sense and clears things up.
@@AlfsMustangGarage Thank you so much for taking the time to answer my question and yes it makes sense. I have a 67 Mustang of my own that I am thinking about doing this too so it makes the process so much easier! Thanks again for the help!
You're very welcome! Glad I could help.
@@AlfsMustangGarage So I went home last night after watching you video and measured the resistance on my coil and it is reading 1.5 ohm, I also measured the resistance of the circuit and I got around 2.5 ohm without the coil. When I measure total resistance of the circuit including the coil it is 4 ohm which puts it outside the parameters. Just curious what you would do in this situation?
Is there an extra ballast resistor on this by chance? These cars have that resistance wire which is typically 1.3 ohms. I would be curious as to why you have extra resistance but ultimately you have to get that down which would likely be bypassing the original resistance wire. But I would be trying to see if someone added an extra resistor first.
Do I need 12 volts for flame thrower 3 do I need to bypass the resisting wire?
More than likely you need full 12 volts. I would read the instructions for that specific application.
@@AlfsMustangGarage I bypass it and I'm getting 12.57 volts to coil but still won't run my timing chain is not tight got a timing chain cover and timing chain, would that be the reason why it also wouldn't run
@@AlfsMustangGarage I had it running and it was running fine and I couldn't put the vacuum advance vacuum line on it would kill the motor
@@AlfsMustangGarage it would kill the motor and it was with the other distributor that's what I put the flamethrower 3in and bypass the ignition and the timing is on time also the flamethrower three does it need a brainbox
I think you would be better off contacting pertronix tech support for this one.
How do you test the ignition switch to see if it is bad .is your shop in Florida?
One way to test without removing it from the car would be with the ignition switch in the "run" position, you should see voltage on the positive side of the ignition coil. With it in the "start" position, you should see voltage on the "S" terminal of the starter solenoid.
Thank you also is your shop here in Florida or what state are you in I'd love to take my car and bring it to you
We are in Utah
I put a new ignition in and I'm getting a very weak light on the positive side of the coil is that about right
Would the regulator box have everything to do with no power or less power to the coil
Would this work with a dynamo and not an alternator ?
I have a 64½
Are you referring to a generator?
Yes,
You know, I'm not really sure. I would probably get with Pertronix and see if there is a kit specifically for the early generator cars or if the alternator ones work.
How did the petronix distributor worked? I have the same year and generator
Great content and learning tool but it was a bit too detailed. I would probably just use the second method on measuring ohms and resistance to make it short and sweet. Great video!