Pfft, she got even for Edith literally contributing to the Armenian Genocide. Also, need I point out how EVIL Edith was in this scene? Making fun of Mary for losing her man, really? Her man DIED.
I wish Tom had referenced his late wife when confronting Mary. It would’ve been totally in character for him to ask “would you have done this to Sybil? If she’d been engaged to a marquess instead of me, would you have done this to your other sister? Edith is the only sister you have now and yet look at you!” Probably not that exact wording, of course, but something along those lines. Because it’s true. Mary would never have hurt Sybil. It was always Edith who she had to destroy.
“Listen to yourself.” “How many lives are you going to wreck just to smother your own misery?” “Like all bullies, you’re a coward.” BRAVO, Tom! Mary deserved everything he could throw at her and he let her have it!
Looking back on this, I have to say that I am 100% confident that Edith would have told Bertie the truth about Marigold if Mary had kept her mouth shut. We saw that she tried to tell him earlier, and she had a conversation with Cora about it. Not to mention the fact that she had the courage to tell Bertie's mother about it in the series finale. I have seen plenty of Mary stans go on about how Mary would not have said anything if Edith hadn't provoked her, but the fact remains that she was indeed envious over the fact that things were going well for Edith and the fact that she was about to marry a marquess. That tells me that Mary would have found another opportunity to try and expose that secret even if Edith hadn't said what she did before (Side note: I really don't blame Edith at all for saying what she did. While Mary has shown occasional support for Edith, for the most part, she's indifferent toward Edith on her best days and a bully on her worst. I really think she sees Edith as inferior to her, so yeah, she would not be happy about Edith becoming engaged to a marquess). I also loved how Tom called Mary out for her behavior. It would have been even better if Robert and Cora had done so as well, but Tom's words were the words that she needed to hear.
It was a pissing contest ....the opportunity came up for mary to pull one over on edith ....and mary knew it ...she was jealous of ediths happiness ...and that edith would be technically higher in station in life than mary ....cowardly act indeed
Edith knew she had to tell him before they were married if not sooner. It would have come out eventually, too many people already knew about it (Cora, Robert, Violet, Rosamund , Tom, Mr and Mrs Drew). It would have ruined their marriage if Bertie found out after they were married, he would not have been able to fully trust her.
I just watched it last night. Nooo Downton is nearly over 😢. All these years I had no idea I'd love this world, and it's inhabitants so much! Edith! Why did you open your mouth. I would never have risked that cat at the table with my fiance. The script was a bit of a puzzle though. I don't think Edith would have shown the underbelly of the family so unrestrainedly first time him joining them. That would be the cheapest form and totally amateur move on Edith's part. After her being so lovely restrained and elegant. It put her back to episode 1 behaviour. For such a wonderful writer it puzzles me, it was not necessary for Edith to provoke for Mary to posture so. It's her nature. I'd have had Edith with an attitude of trepidation, simply quiet and holding her chair . . building up to the bombshell coming. When he proposed, instead of saying I have to think about it, she should have shown that she wanted it, but said, there's a secret in my life, and I don't know if you coukd cope . . then make a quick exit. After missing her awhile he'd return all girded up to prove to her he could indeed take her past in stride, and has ability to fix all. Then instead of a bald "she has a daughter", which could be any circumstance, she could have said I was engaged, I spent one night with him and the rest of the sad tale. How he vanished, the grief, then finding out there a baby
All the arguments that Edith provoked Mary go out the window because Edith tried to stop Bertie from announcing it in the first place to spare Mary’s feelings. Mary is just a mean vile person. She hardly needs any provocation to ruin Edith’s life
But Carson already knew what Mary was doing to do. 😂SMH. Edith walked right into it. She was too silly 🤪 to see it coming. Edith mocking was too much for Mary. By then Marigold’s background was an open secret 🤐. It was Bertie’s turn to hear about it. He was truly a classy man. He made Edith look good. Behind Bertie, Edith finally developed some dignity. After Edith told off Mary and apologized to Bertie, I finally began to like Edith. The acting 🎭 and writing ✍️ on the show was superb.
Mary’s most vile moment. Shows what a horrible person she was at her core. But then she kind of redeemed herself after that. And Edith winding up with a fancier title was poetic justice.
@@atfeldman123 Well, it is true that Edith wrote to the embassy about Pamuk dying in Mary’s bed…and that was fudged up…but Mary had been so evil to Edith for so long that Edith couldn’t help herself. I guess it was Mary’s payback. LOVE when Tom read Mary for filth!
@Alice JOCKER I suppose you’re correct that the titles lost their value but don’t forget it’s still England and to that lot they still meant something. Don’t pretend otherwise.
Omg seriouslyyyy. So many time Edith tried to extend the Olive Branch to start anew. But Mary was never hopeful and just insistent on having someone to hate. After season 1, Edith ALWAYS had to be the bigger person
The anger then pain then anger again that flashed before his eyes in these moments was beautiful. He said it many times the last season. He loves these women, they were his sisters and didn’t want to see either of them in pain.
“Lower myself to his level” Mary might not realize it, but she’s kinda insulting Tom here. Making the assumption, that lady Sybil lowered her self to marry him..
I absolutely love Allen Leech’s acting in this scene. When Mary first reveals it Tom has this somewhat calm face but at the same time it’s overflowing with disgust and fury. Then when Tom actually comes to Mary and he lets out his disgust and fury at her he looks so legitimately mad and horrified at her. And it’s all Allen Leech’s remarkable acting
That shocked ,,Mary, don't'' is always getting me. It makes this sounds like this is something nobody would expect and no matter what Mary was saying or doing, that one was the most cruel, vile thing she could have done. Alright, yeah, Edith wrote about Pamuk's death, but: 1. That was when both of them were, maybe their age was barely out of teenagers, but their mentality was still very like a teenage, especially when you are spoiled aristocratic kid 2. The truth about Mary meant nothing very quickly, as the war changed almost everything and in the time of this scene it meant absolutely nothing as she was married before 3. Mary was always bullying Edith, since they were children and probably no one was standing by Edith's side. Actually I have a theory that these two had nanny who was like nanny West, who preferred Mary, because she's the first-born and Edith for her was like ,,you are nothing and remember that'', so that's how Mary also started bullying her. 4. Both Mary and Edith were fighting with each other, but since Sybil's death, Edith stopped. She genuinely wanted to stop fighting, stop being against Mary and was ready to start again. She realised she now has only one sister. Mary to the end of the show didn't want to change anything, she still bullies Edith for no reason, sees her not like sister, but like somebody worse. Or maybe deeply she sees her as somebody better than her, as she can handle different tough situations better than her and can see that the true Mary is unsure, stressed and scared? 5. Right then they are after their 30's, they're not children anymore, nor teenagers anymore, nor little innocent birds anymore. They're both grown up women who meets different challenges in their life and when one accepted it and want to stop fighting, the other still didn't
And mary provoked edith. The pamuk thing wouldn't have happened if mary was a nice person. But as always she needed to insult and degrade edith and edith was having none of it
1: yes correct. Teenage squabbles mentality. Though it wasn't fir no reason Edith wrote the letter. She'd grown up psychologically abused by Mary. As she said, "it had to be shown, what you are". She was retaliating
What makes it worse is Mary is willing to use an innocent child to get back at Edith . Even if Marigold had stayed in Switzerland had Mary had the opportunity to discover her existence ( and yes she may have) she would have tried to ruin Edith via Marigold She was willing to use an innocent child to ruin her sister
I disagree with what Mary did and with her reasons for doing it. Yet, Edith was wrong 😑 for not having told Bertie about Marigold. Edith was treacherous in her own way. Marigold was as much of a pawn ♟️ in their cat 🐈 and mice 🐁 game as Pamuk was in an earlier episode.
I wish I had seen this part of the series. Way to go Tom!! I find it no wonder that Edith moved to London and forged her own path away from Mary's nosy, jealous, intrigues.
The fact that she tried to justify what happened by pretending that she had NO IDEA that Edith hadn’t told him and even somehow Even tried go place the blame on Edith Like Tom said, she’s a coward : she didn’t even have the decency to fully acknowledge her fault, to admit that she had been mean and petty or to face her family’s blame
1:28 The moment Mary made a choice and her eyes may as well have went black like a demon's. Edith, never poke that bear. You never really win against Mary for long. 💀
I don’t think Mary would’ve done this if Matthew was alive. He brought out the best in her. It was only when he died that she truly became heartless and borderline demonic in her cruelty.
Esther was just as much at fault. She shouldnt have hid it in the first place, and why was she even goading it over Mary that Henry left? They are both awful.
Comment by Carmencita: Mary was so full of herself, that she could not tolerate anybody to be happy if she was not. Over and over we saw her vicious actions. Too bad.
Everybody is dogging Mary and that was a merciless blow, but Edith never could keep her mouth shut. She always had to leap on any sliver of hope that she could best Mary. Stupid of her, Mary is a savage!
I feel like there is so much hatred toward Mary and I get it. I think Edith certainly grows more but both sisters had moments where they were cruel to each other. Part of what I love about Downton is how nuanced the characters are, but I feel Mary is sometimes judged a bit too harshly. That’s not to excuse some awful things she did- but she also is a character who has done many great things. I think it’s telling that the characters with the purest hearts: Anna, Matthew, Sybil and Tom, are the ones who recognize how compassionate and kind she can be. Aside from Anna (because she is from downstairs) they aren’t afraid to call her out when she is acting wretched, and I think it’s because they know it’s not who she truly is. And so they are disappointed in her when she falls back on being mean.
Everyone mad at Mary, but here is Edith, continually poking her and can't keep her trap shut. She deserves all the unhappiness she gets. Just like others. Everyone knew that Mary was scared, and yet, they continually won't leave her alone, and then wonder why she gets mean.
I can understand Edith was immature and resented her so I'm not condoning what she did. However, after Sybil's death she really wanted to mend her relationship with Mary. After Matthew's death, Mary went back to her old self little by little that Edith learned to be more mindful and cunning against Mary's backlash.
Incomparable…Edith did that bc Mary continuously bullied her. And also Mary got revenge on Edith in the first season by ruining the engagement between her and Sir Strallan. So this was above and beyond unjustified
What Edith did was wrong yes but she truly did try to be better after Sybil died and I also think that Edith wanted a better relationship with Mary after Sybil’s passing but Mary started being mean to her again so it never happened
That would have been unthinkable at that time. It had to take a while to swallow the pill. And per chance, Edith had a daughter. I don't know if Bertie would have accepted her if she had a son.
He wanted to as they talked before he left for the train. He accepted Marigold but it came down to trust and how he felt betrayed and possibly tricked.
@@janettebiggs4550 Thanks, you are right, all good points. I was still hoping that his love for Edith would override his feelings of being tricked. Edith certainly handled it as well as could be expected.
Why would Bertie accept being lied 🤥 and being used as a pawn ♟️ between two bitter, jealous sisters 👯♀️? Bertie was correct ✅ to leave. I respected his character for doing so. When he returned, he did so on his own terms.
Mary has a good heart, very helpful and sensitive to others needs but the only stain on her is how rotten she is to Edith. That’s it. Everyone else she is wonderful to except Edith.
I do agree with Tom, that Mary dealt a cruel cruel blow, but Edith is not beyond reproach either as she wrote to the Turkish Embassy regarding Mary and Farouk, the Turk who died in Mary's bed. I do accept that Edith in the main, retaliated whenever Mary was callous to her, but in her writing to the Turkish Embassy and making it public like that, could have ruined Mary's chance of any future marriage. So is one as bad as the other, or is Edith the one who has been most wronged?
Edith wrote to the Embassador in season 1, when she was at her least confident, disregarded by her parents, not really having anyone truly close to her, except maybe Sybil, who was 16 or 17, and both her and Mary were in their early 20ties. Also didn't she decide to write after she heard her own mother gossip with Mary about her, and being nasty? I may be disremembering this one. After that both Edith and Mary went through a lot of character developement. For me the lowest of Edith was actualy the whole situation with Marigold and the farmer's family, that was just awful to watch. Now both ladies are in their 30ies, and for me, with all the context, Mary was more cruel and immature. Still, the comment about Henry abandoning her was so unnecessary.
@@pativi6643 But even then Edith didn't want to make it public that she was marrying Bertie AT LEAST in that moment. Mary honestly wasn't helping with her mood all over so Edith had to prepare a defensive stance.
@@pativi6643 for me Edith’s lowest is when she cares more about her dress than when their oldest and most loyal servant Carson is having a heart attack.
Everyone is mad at Mary for doing this, but I call this Karma on Lady Edith. Remember, Lady Edith told Mary's secret to the Ambassador so that she would be a pariah, which could have permanently ruined her life. And she told it to the entire world, not just one person, so it would have been permanent damage. No one would let her live it down. But since Edith is such a "sad" story, it's okay.
I really liked Tom ~ I don't think he was ever dishonest or mean to anybody (that I can remember). If I'm wrong, please let me know, so I can watch it. :) But Tom had a sweet heart.
This is the “Downton Abbey”version of “The Sopranos” Tony “Sacred bleu where is me mama”. Siblings can be so cruel. I’m an only child but if I had a sibling that was that insensitive… I would not recognize them as a sibling anymore.
Because she KNEW who Mary was when been defeated and not getting what she wanted. Edith only prepared herself for a vile comment, just didn't expect Mary to be more vile than ever.
Tom est indispensable dans cette famille pour son travail, ses idées modernes et son tempérament à apaiser les tensions familiales... Il les aime vraiment.
She was always rude and terrible and snobbish her being nice to anna or carson was like : look im good towards the help, im nice- but if they dared to show a bit of closeness to her give advice god forbid she would always "put them in their places"
Unpopular opinion because everyone simply feels Edith is the victim here.. but, Edith frequently goes after Mary without thinking of the consequences. Edith not only told the turkish embassy about Famouk but revelled in the knowledge it would hurt Mary. Mary isn’t a saint, but Edith isn’t either. What Mary did here was something Edith deserved, don’t poke the bear expecting not to be bitten.
The one thing that doesn't fit here is Tom saying "now Edith won't be the next Marchioness of Hexham." Tom didn't care about the titles. He should have said "you've ruined Edith's happiness."
He was making the point about Mary’s nose being out of joint at the thought Edith would outrank her among the aristocracy, Tom didn’t care but he knew she did and that was one of the motivations for her cruelty.
Edith deserved it, and even Tom basically told Edith to shut up before Mary outed her about Marigold. Edith had to be forced to tell Bertie about Marigold, (who wouldn’t have been born if she hadn’t gotten pregnant without being married, which was really a scandal for that time period, and Edith hurt the Drew family in the process). Edith wrote the letter to the Turkish embassy tattling about Mary, when she’s no better than her, (don’t forget about Edith kissing the married farmer who she was driving the tractor for-his wife caught them and barred her from the farm. Even the Dowager Countess was loose when she was young, before and after marriage, (don’t forget about the Russian prince and the French Marquis). Sybil wasn’t loose like Mary and Edith though…
Honestly, I think it's karma for Edith....she was all high while writing about Mary but wanted to keep it quiet wen it came to her .. wow! Dats karma served though I believe Mary was nasty .. but Edith had it coming... She can't always play the victim card
@@GoldenRose116 No. That is not the point. Lady Edith attacked Lady Mary in front of Bertie while she has a huge secret that she didn't want to be known to Bertie. Then Mary reveal the truth to Bertie as we all can expect.
As usual, Edith walked right into some 💩 💩 and then she wants to play innocent 😇. She is not. Mary is a b**** but for the longest time Edith really was pathetic. You can be right ✅ and wrong 😑 at the same time.
I always loved Mary’s spunk, while Edith often seemed like milquetoast. But Mary went way over the line on this one. Fox News wouldn’t even have been able to put a positive spin on this.
Excuse me? While Lady Mary indeed can be cold and heartless, she exposed a secret privately to a man who absolutely deserves to know the truth and only because Edith was begging for a fight. Also, Edith exposed her sister’s scandal to the Turkish embassy guaranteeing her ruin.
It wasn't her secret to tell and she did it purely to be vindictive. In the wake of this row Tom seeks back up from Violet who backs him up completely. The two people Mary was closest too telling her straight she was out of order.
The same point can be made about what Edith did with the Pamuk scandal. Back then it was a shameful scandal for the whole family. Edith was no angel. 😇 She had an out of wedlock child by a married man whose wife was locked 🔐 up in an asylum and then lies to her fiancé. Edith disrespected two other women who were kind to her. The farmers’ wives. Marigold was going to be okay ✅. Neither woman is the better. But they are both too old to still be so mean and spiteful.
All she said was the truth. Edith was trying to be sympathetic for Mary basically being dumped, and Mary not wanting to be the victim lashed out. Like she always does.
@@jameslyon2338 Edith was not sympathetic. She literally said, "I'm getting married and you've lost your man" right after Mary was recovering from a shock. They were both honest but honesty is not always appropriate.
@@vaanipapadakis2226 Earlier than that, Edith is being considerate of Mary's feelings by not discussing Edith's engagement, Mary then snipes and Edith snipes back about Mary losing Henry. In the beginning, Edith was being sympathetic and Mary quickly turned it to aggression.
@@jameslyon2338 you can hardly call that chagrined head tilt of Mary an aggressive venomous snipe. Edith’s reaction to try to humiliate her when she’s down was cruel and disproportionate. Then Mary did something disproportionately cruel back to her. She took it too far and immediately regrets it. But what does Edith expect? Don’t poke the bear and be surprised when the claws come out.
The disgust on Tom's face as he realizes where Mary is heading - Allen Leech's acting was so on point!
I always thought it was more shock and disbelief than disgust. Tom loved all of the sisters, but couldn’t believe Mary would sink to this level.
@@wotan10950 I think disgust and disappointment is the right expression.
"You're a coward Mary." "Like all bullies you're a coward."
You know what would really hurt? If Tom said, "Sybil would be disgusted with what you've done."
Pfft, she got even for Edith literally contributing to the Armenian Genocide. Also, need I point out how EVIL Edith was in this scene? Making fun of Mary for losing her man, really? Her man DIED.
@Lorrdd The MAN Edith is referring to in that moment is Henry Talbot, NOT the late Matthew Crawley.
You know you messed up when TOM is mad at you. Thank you for including both scenes together!
Exactly
Tom was perfect here. I really love how he took on the role of brother to Mary and Edith. They needed a brother.
They sure did!
I wish Tom had referenced his late wife when confronting Mary. It would’ve been totally in character for him to ask “would you have done this to Sybil? If she’d been engaged to a marquess instead of me, would you have done this to your other sister? Edith is the only sister you have now and yet look at you!” Probably not that exact wording, of course, but something along those lines. Because it’s true. Mary would never have hurt Sybil. It was always Edith who she had to destroy.
“Listen to yourself.” “How many lives are you going to wreck just to smother your own misery?” “Like all bullies, you’re a coward.”
BRAVO, Tom! Mary deserved everything he could throw at her and he let her have it!
I love Tom. So classy, just putting Mary in her place. Oh how I love Downton. ❤
+Gretchen Koontz Tom is my favourite male character
Tom's the only person Mary and Edith really listen to. His friendship with his sisters-in-law is one I've always admired
I love that all of the things Mary claims about Henry are really so true about HERSELF
Looking back on this, I have to say that I am 100% confident that Edith would have told Bertie the truth about Marigold if Mary had kept her mouth shut. We saw that she tried to tell him earlier, and she had a conversation with Cora about it. Not to mention the fact that she had the courage to tell Bertie's mother about it in the series finale.
I have seen plenty of Mary stans go on about how Mary would not have said anything if Edith hadn't provoked her, but the fact remains that she was indeed envious over the fact that things were going well for Edith and the fact that she was about to marry a marquess. That tells me that Mary would have found another opportunity to try and expose that secret even if Edith hadn't said what she did before (Side note: I really don't blame Edith at all for saying what she did. While Mary has shown occasional support for Edith, for the most part, she's indifferent toward Edith on her best days and a bully on her worst. I really think she sees Edith as inferior to her, so yeah, she would not be happy about Edith becoming engaged to a marquess).
I also loved how Tom called Mary out for her behavior. It would have been even better if Robert and Cora had done so as well, but Tom's words were the words that she needed to hear.
It was a pissing contest ....the opportunity came up for mary to pull one over on edith ....and mary knew it ...she was jealous of ediths happiness ...and that edith would be technically higher in station in life than mary ....cowardly act indeed
Edith knew she had to tell him before they were married if not sooner. It would have come out eventually, too many people already knew about it (Cora, Robert, Violet, Rosamund , Tom, Mr and Mrs Drew). It would have ruined their marriage if Bertie found out after they were married, he would not have been able to fully trust her.
I just watched it last night.
Nooo Downton is nearly over 😢. All these years I had no idea I'd love this world, and it's inhabitants so much!
Edith! Why did you open your mouth. I would never have risked that cat at the table with my fiance.
The script was a bit of a puzzle though. I don't think Edith would have shown the underbelly of the family so unrestrainedly first time him joining them.
That would be the cheapest form and totally amateur move on Edith's part. After her being so lovely restrained and elegant.
It put her back to episode 1 behaviour.
For such a wonderful writer it puzzles me, it was not necessary for Edith to provoke for Mary to posture so. It's her nature.
I'd have had Edith with an attitude of trepidation, simply quiet and holding her chair . . building up to the bombshell coming.
When he proposed, instead of saying I have to think about it, she should have shown that she wanted it, but said, there's a secret in my life, and I don't know if you coukd cope . . then make a quick exit.
After missing her awhile he'd return all girded up to prove to her he could indeed take her past in stride, and has ability to fix all.
Then instead of a bald "she has a daughter", which could be any circumstance, she could have said I was engaged, I spent one night with him and the rest of the sad tale. How he vanished, the grief, then finding out there a baby
There were plenty of times she could have told him but didn’t.. not that it was Mary’s place to.
All the arguments that Edith provoked Mary go out the window because Edith tried to stop Bertie from announcing it in the first place to spare Mary’s feelings. Mary is just a mean vile person. She hardly needs any provocation to ruin Edith’s life
This was the first time that I noticed that even Carson gave her a stern look. He knew she was going to disappoint him.
That’s why she sent him away, because, she didn’t want him to hear what she had to say
But Carson already knew what Mary was doing to do. 😂SMH. Edith walked right into it. She was too silly 🤪 to see it coming. Edith mocking was too much for Mary. By then Marigold’s background was an open secret 🤐. It was Bertie’s turn to hear about it. He was truly a classy man. He made Edith look good. Behind Bertie, Edith finally developed some dignity. After Edith told off Mary and apologized to Bertie, I finally began to like Edith. The acting 🎭 and writing ✍️ on the show was superb.
The way Mary sends Carson away for more coffee tells you that what she was about to say she didn’t want Carson to hear
Yes, this thought struck me as well. It made it all seem much worse...
@@TommyVinyDid you see the look Carson gave her? Even he looked disapproving
Edith said it is not a good time to make an announcement 📣. Edith was right but I don’t think that she expected Mary to go there.
I missed that!
That 1 time she told Carson ‘one day I’ll do something even you can’t forgive’ and he was like oh I doubt that 😂
Tom cared for all of them. He never took a single side with either sister. Always trying to defuse situations or help them
It was Sybil and who did that before Tom. And then he took that part. The show is written fantastically.
@@Dr.SyedSaifAbbasNaqvi😢🥹 yes, for the love of his wife he loves her sisters ❤️🩹
What a beautiful way to honor his wife ❤️🩹
Mary’s most vile moment. Shows what a horrible person she was at her core. But then she kind of redeemed herself after that. And Edith winding up with a fancier title was poetic justice.
Yeah, I LOVE that Edith became Marchioness of Hexham. Take that MARY!
@@atfeldman123 Well, it is true that Edith wrote to the embassy about Pamuk dying in Mary’s bed…and that was fudged up…but Mary had been so evil to Edith for so long that Edith couldn’t help herself. I guess it was Mary’s payback. LOVE when Tom read Mary for filth!
Yes, Edith ended up outranking them in royal terms. Poetic Justice.
@@atfeldman123Mary herself says she doesn't know why she did it.
Plus she already had her revenge for it
@Alice JOCKER I suppose you’re correct that the titles lost their value but don’t forget it’s still England and to that lot they still meant something. Don’t pretend otherwise.
Love Lady Edith. Beautiful, graceful, slender and quietly reserved.
The most divine speech
The singularly cruelest thing Mary ever did.
Tom lacing into Mary is incredible, and anyone should be immensely grateful to have someone as direct and honest to call out their bs like that.
Mary was so cruel to Edith. She really was a bully
Edith started it a lot of times, Mary was just more brutal.
Omg seriouslyyyy. So many time Edith tried to extend the Olive Branch to start anew. But Mary was never hopeful and just insistent on having someone to hate. After season 1, Edith ALWAYS had to be the bigger person
Tom really was a good brother. The look of shock and disgust on his face.
The anger then pain then anger again that flashed before his eyes in these moments was beautiful. He said it many times the last season. He loves these women, they were his sisters and didn’t want to see either of them in pain.
I love Tom's face at 2:20. Just complete, utter disbelief at Mary's cruelty.
Loved it when Tom tore Mary a new one and told her some home truths 👍
I would have forced Tom to marry me..he’s a total babe.
AMEN
I finally noticed the looks Tom gives Mary as soon as she sits down. He knows her that well. He has a pretty good inkling of what she might do.
The way Mary says “…I’m VERY happy for you”.
Me: 👀
😂
I have been waiting so long for this clip to be uploaded! It’s so satisfying to see Tom call Mary out on her BS!
"Don't lie, not to me!"
It's crazy how Tom literally became their brother.
“Lower myself to his level” Mary might not realize it, but she’s kinda insulting Tom here. Making the assumption, that lady Sybil lowered her self to marry him..
I absolutely love Allen Leech’s acting in this scene. When Mary first reveals it Tom has this somewhat calm face but at the same time it’s overflowing with disgust and fury. Then when Tom actually comes to Mary and he lets out his disgust and fury at her he looks so legitimately mad and horrified at her. And it’s all Allen Leech’s remarkable acting
That shocked ,,Mary, don't'' is always getting me. It makes this sounds like this is something nobody would expect and no matter what Mary was saying or doing, that one was the most cruel, vile thing she could have done. Alright, yeah, Edith wrote about Pamuk's death, but:
1. That was when both of them were, maybe their age was barely out of teenagers, but their mentality was still very like a teenage, especially when you are spoiled aristocratic kid
2. The truth about Mary meant nothing very quickly, as the war changed almost everything and in the time of this scene it meant absolutely nothing as she was married before
3. Mary was always bullying Edith, since they were children and probably no one was standing by Edith's side. Actually I have a theory that these two had nanny who was like nanny West, who preferred Mary, because she's the first-born and Edith for her was like ,,you are nothing and remember that'', so that's how Mary also started bullying her.
4. Both Mary and Edith were fighting with each other, but since Sybil's death, Edith stopped. She genuinely wanted to stop fighting, stop being against Mary and was ready to start again. She realised she now has only one sister. Mary to the end of the show didn't want to change anything, she still bullies Edith for no reason, sees her not like sister, but like somebody worse. Or maybe deeply she sees her as somebody better than her, as she can handle different tough situations better than her and can see that the true Mary is unsure, stressed and scared?
5. Right then they are after their 30's, they're not children anymore, nor teenagers anymore, nor little innocent birds anymore. They're both grown up women who meets different challenges in their life and when one accepted it and want to stop fighting, the other still didn't
And mary provoked edith. The pamuk thing wouldn't have happened if mary was a nice person. But as always she needed to insult and degrade edith and edith was having none of it
1: yes correct. Teenage squabbles mentality. Though it wasn't fir no reason Edith wrote the letter. She'd grown up psychologically abused by Mary. As she said, "it had to be shown, what you are". She was retaliating
TOTALLY agree!
You tell her, Branson!!!😏😌
What makes it worse is Mary is willing to use an innocent child to get back at Edith . Even if Marigold had stayed in Switzerland had Mary had the opportunity to discover her existence ( and yes she may have) she would have tried to ruin Edith via Marigold
She was willing to use an innocent child to ruin her sister
I disagree with what Mary did and with her reasons for doing it. Yet, Edith was wrong 😑 for not having told Bertie about Marigold. Edith was treacherous in her own way. Marigold was as much of a pawn ♟️ in their cat 🐈 and mice 🐁 game as Pamuk was in an earlier episode.
When tom says "Mary, don't. 😢😥
I wish I had seen this part of the series. Way to go Tom!! I find it no wonder that Edith moved to London and forged her own path away from Mary's nosy, jealous, intrigues.
It's 9,000 wonders Edith didn't tear that viper's head off.
Mary knew she was going to do something Carson wouldn’t approve of, that’s why she sent him away.
I am so glad Tom really told her off
Carson’s look as he exits: Shit’s about to go down.
The fact that she tried to justify what happened by pretending that she had NO IDEA that Edith hadn’t told him and even somehow Even tried go place the blame on Edith
Like Tom said, she’s a coward : she didn’t even have the decency to fully acknowledge her fault, to admit that she had been mean and petty or to face her family’s blame
Rivalry between siblings has so many layers of misunderstandings.
They are all incredible actors!
Like them or not, Tom and Sybil have always been the ones to keep Mary and Edith in check.
Matthew as well.
Boy could Mary be insanely savage
Vile
1:28 The moment Mary made a choice and her eyes may as well have went black like a demon's. Edith, never poke that bear. You never really win against Mary for long. 💀
I don’t think Mary would’ve done this if Matthew was alive. He brought out the best in her. It was only when he died that she truly became heartless and borderline demonic in her cruelty.
And yet she did win.
She almost ruined an innocent child's life to get back at her sister
I did not remember tom doing that at the end that was good acting !
Mary, that was low. It's like you have to make everyone else miserable just to drown out your own. She is cruel. How did Matthew put up with her?
Esther was just as much at fault. She shouldnt have hid it in the first place, and why was she even goading it over Mary that Henry left? They are both awful.
Comment by Carmencita: Mary was so full of herself, that she could not tolerate anybody to be happy if she was not. Over and over we saw her vicious actions. Too bad.
The plate/utensil sounds add to the delicious tension, especially Mary's cup placement at 1:13.
Everybody is dogging Mary and that was a merciless blow, but Edith never could keep her mouth shut. She always had to leap on any sliver of hope that she could best Mary. Stupid of her, Mary is a savage!
It’s always poor Edith.. she just jabs at Mary just as much. She wrote to the embassy when Pamuk died in Mary’s bed.
Edith was taunting Mary while she was down
Never 👎 poke the bear 🐻!
I feel like there is so much hatred toward Mary and I get it. I think Edith certainly grows more but both sisters had moments where they were cruel to each other. Part of what I love about Downton is how nuanced the characters are, but I feel Mary is sometimes judged a bit too harshly.
That’s not to excuse some awful things she did- but she also is a character who has done many great things. I think it’s telling that the characters with the purest hearts: Anna, Matthew, Sybil and Tom, are the ones who recognize how compassionate and kind she can be. Aside from Anna (because she is from downstairs) they aren’t afraid to call her out when she is acting wretched, and I think it’s because they know it’s not who she truly is. And so they are disappointed in her when she falls back on being mean.
Everyone mad at Mary, but here is Edith, continually poking her and can't keep her trap shut. She deserves all the unhappiness she gets. Just like others. Everyone knew that Mary was scared, and yet, they continually won't leave her alone, and then wonder why she gets mean.
Tom was rather a legacy that Sybil left behind
This was unforgivable. But riding to the Turkish embassy about Mary was pretty unforgivable as well.
I can understand Edith was immature and resented her so I'm not condoning what she did. However, after Sybil's death she really wanted to mend her relationship with Mary. After Matthew's death, Mary went back to her old self little by little that Edith learned to be more mindful and cunning against Mary's backlash.
Incomparable…Edith did that bc Mary continuously bullied her. And also Mary got revenge on Edith in the first season by ruining the engagement between her and Sir Strallan. So this was above and beyond unjustified
What Edith did was wrong yes but she truly did try to be better after Sybil died and I also think that Edith wanted a better relationship with Mary after Sybil’s passing but Mary started being mean to her again so it never happened
these two harpies with their nasty squabbles made me miss Sybil so much
Yeah. But you know when Sybil was alive, how would she feel about being in the middle of their squabbles?
Of course! As Sybil wasn’t ever mean to anybody
"Mary don't"
Bravo Tom! At last someone brave enough to speak up to the bully with a high idea of her poor self!
I was hoping that Bertie would accept Marigold as soon as he found out that she was Edith’s daughter. That would have defeated Mary immediately.
That would have been unthinkable at that time. It had to take a while to swallow the pill. And per chance, Edith had a daughter. I don't know if Bertie would have accepted her if she had a son.
He wanted to as they talked before he left for the train. He accepted Marigold but it came down to trust and how he felt betrayed and possibly tricked.
@@janettebiggs4550 Thanks, you are right, all good points. I was still hoping that his love for Edith would override his feelings of being tricked. Edith certainly handled it as well as could be expected.
Why would Bertie accept being lied 🤥 and being used as a pawn ♟️ between two bitter, jealous sisters 👯♀️? Bertie was correct ✅ to leave. I respected his character for doing so. When he returned, he did so on his own terms.
Mary waited until carson was outside the room
Mary has a good heart, very helpful and sensitive to others needs but the only stain on her is how rotten she is to Edith. That’s it. Everyone else she is wonderful to except Edith.
Their dad can’t even leave the room. Tom stepped in and tried to stop 🛑 it. 😂
I do agree with Tom, that Mary dealt a cruel cruel blow, but Edith is not beyond reproach either as she wrote to the Turkish Embassy regarding Mary and Farouk, the Turk who died in Mary's bed. I do accept that Edith in the main, retaliated whenever Mary was callous to her, but in her writing to the Turkish Embassy and making it public like that, could have ruined Mary's chance of any future marriage. So is one as bad as the other, or is Edith the one who has been most wronged?
Edith wrote to the Embassador in season 1, when she was at her least confident, disregarded by her parents, not really having anyone truly close to her, except maybe Sybil, who was 16 or 17, and both her and Mary were in their early 20ties. Also didn't she decide to write after she heard her own mother gossip with Mary about her, and being nasty? I may be disremembering this one.
After that both Edith and Mary went through a lot of character developement. For me the lowest of Edith was actualy the whole situation with Marigold and the farmer's family, that was just awful to watch.
Now both ladies are in their 30ies, and for me, with all the context, Mary was more cruel and immature. Still, the comment about Henry abandoning her was so unnecessary.
@@pativi6643 But even then Edith didn't want to make it public that she was marrying Bertie AT LEAST in that moment. Mary honestly wasn't helping with her mood all over so Edith had to prepare a defensive stance.
@@pativi6643 for me Edith’s lowest is when she cares more about her dress than when their oldest and most loyal servant Carson is having a heart attack.
Awesome scenes
1:57 "Showed her, didn't I, Tom?"
I detested Mary this entire series. Didn’t even feel sorry for her when Matthew died, just happy he found a way to escape her.
ABBey castle really made our day:
Everyone is mad at Mary for doing this, but I call this Karma on Lady Edith. Remember, Lady Edith told Mary's secret to the Ambassador so that she would be a pariah, which could have permanently ruined her life. And she told it to the entire world, not just one person, so it would have been permanent damage. No one would let her live it down. But since Edith is such a "sad" story, it's okay.
I really liked Tom ~ I don't think he was ever dishonest or mean to anybody (that I can remember). If I'm wrong, please let me know, so I can watch it. :) But Tom had a sweet heart.
Earlier seasons, he tried to pour a messy mixture on some guy eating with the Crawley's.
@@tombstonerforever9374at least he didn’t try to kill him, as the servants thought.
@@12classics39 Yeah but he would have caused chaos and probably lost his job.
Why is this SO SATISFYING???
This is the “Downton Abbey”version of “The Sopranos” Tony “Sacred bleu where is me mama”.
Siblings can be so cruel. I’m an only child but if I had a sibling that was that insensitive… I would not recognize them as a sibling anymore.
I am sorry. I don’t like Edith here. Why add salt to wound? She always does that because she feels insecure
Why did Edith start insulting Mary when she knows Mary can bring her down so easily
Because she KNEW who Mary was when been defeated and not getting what she wanted. Edith only prepared herself for a vile comment, just didn't expect Mary to be more vile than ever.
Mary had that and a lot more coming her way. Mary was always a haughty bully who pushed Edith around. She had those comments from Edith coming!
Tom est indispensable dans cette famille pour son travail, ses idées modernes et son tempérament à apaiser les tensions familiales... Il les aime vraiment.
but Edith really just poked the bear :P
Mary trued to ruin an innocent child's life
She was always rude and terrible and snobbish her being nice to anna or carson was like : look im good towards the help, im nice- but if they dared to show a bit of closeness to her give advice god forbid she would always "put them in their places"
Tom is the truth that Mary needed
oop-
they both should’ve kept quite but Mary took it way too far
I love Michelle, but Mary is unbearable!
Unpopular opinion because everyone simply feels Edith is the victim here.. but, Edith frequently goes after Mary without thinking of the consequences. Edith not only told the turkish embassy about Famouk but revelled in the knowledge it would hurt Mary. Mary isn’t a saint, but Edith isn’t either. What Mary did here was something Edith deserved, don’t poke the bear expecting not to be bitten.
The one thing that doesn't fit here is Tom saying "now Edith won't be the next Marchioness of Hexham." Tom didn't care about the titles. He should have said "you've ruined Edith's happiness."
He was making the point about Mary’s nose being out of joint at the thought Edith would outrank her among the aristocracy, Tom didn’t care but he knew she did and that was one of the motivations for her cruelty.
Yeah it was wrong that lady Mary told him about Edith's child but she should have told him herself, he was probably bound to find out sooner or later
01:58
Sisters 😞
i always hated Mary lmao
Mary and Edith or Dennis and Dee: who's a worse sibling duo?
Which show are Dennis and Dee on?
@@denagustafson6070 it's always sunny in Philadelphia
Edith will always be the more vile one for snitching on Mary about the dead lover in her room now their even im Pretty sure that’s why she did it 😂
And Mary wanted to punish an innocent child to get back at Edith ...
No innocents suffred because of Mary's scandal ...
No innocents suffred in Mary's scandal
Marigold on the other hand
Edith did egg her on. When you poke the bear you feel Mary’s wrath!
Mary > Edith
Well, Edith poked the snake. She should’ve known better.
Edith deserved it, and even Tom basically told Edith to shut up before Mary outed her about Marigold. Edith had to be forced to tell Bertie about Marigold, (who wouldn’t have been born if she hadn’t gotten pregnant without being married, which was really a scandal for that time period, and Edith hurt the Drew family in the process). Edith wrote the letter to the Turkish embassy tattling about Mary, when she’s no better than her, (don’t forget about Edith kissing the married farmer who she was driving the tractor for-his wife caught them and barred her from the farm. Even the Dowager Countess was loose when she was young, before and after marriage, (don’t forget about the Russian prince and the French Marquis). Sybil wasn’t loose like Mary and Edith though…
☺️💙
Marie malheureuse dans sa vie a été cruelle et c'était volontaire de sa part, elle était jalouse du bonheur d'Edith.
Honestly, I think it's karma for Edith....she was all high while writing about Mary but wanted to keep it quiet wen it came to her .. wow! Dats karma served though I believe Mary was nasty .. but Edith had it coming...
She can't always play the victim card
I think this is Lady Edith's fault. We knew Lady Mary is mean, in good way sometimes, and why she attacked her when she's not happy and is weary...
So Edith should just never speak just in case Mary feels like ruining her life
@@GoldenRose116 No. That is not the point. Lady Edith attacked Lady Mary in front of Bertie while she has a huge secret that she didn't want to be known to Bertie. Then Mary reveal the truth to Bertie as we all can expect.
@@yuichirokawamori4204 except Edith had no idea that Mary knew about Marigold
@@GoldenRose116 Obviously Edith felt about what Mary was getting to know, like Tom realized
As usual, Edith walked right into some 💩 💩 and then she wants to play innocent 😇. She is not. Mary is a b**** but for the longest time Edith really was pathetic. You can be right ✅ and wrong 😑 at the same time.
I always loved Mary’s spunk, while Edith often seemed like milquetoast. But Mary went way over the line on this one. Fox News wouldn’t even have been able to put a positive spin on this.
no way !!!
I didn't like this behavior by Mary.
Excuse me? While Lady Mary indeed can be cold and heartless, she exposed a secret privately to a man who absolutely deserves to know the truth and only because Edith was begging for a fight.
Also, Edith exposed her sister’s scandal to the Turkish embassy guaranteeing her ruin.
It wasn't her secret to tell and she did it purely to be vindictive. In the wake of this row Tom seeks back up from Violet who backs him up completely. The two people Mary was closest too telling her straight she was out of order.
The same point can be made about what Edith did with the Pamuk scandal. Back then it was a shameful scandal for the whole family. Edith was no angel. 😇 She had an out of wedlock child by a married man whose wife was locked 🔐 up in an asylum and then lies to her fiancé. Edith disrespected two other women who were kind to her. The farmers’ wives. Marigold was going to be okay ✅. Neither woman is the better. But they are both too old to still be so mean and spiteful.
To be honest Edith is the one who wound Mary up.
All she said was the truth. Edith was trying to be sympathetic for Mary basically being dumped, and Mary not wanting to be the victim lashed out. Like she always does.
@@jameslyon2338 Edith was not sympathetic. She literally said, "I'm getting married and you've lost your man" right after Mary was recovering from a shock. They were both honest but honesty is not always appropriate.
@@vaanipapadakis2226 Earlier than that, Edith is being considerate of Mary's feelings by not discussing Edith's engagement, Mary then snipes and Edith snipes back about Mary losing Henry. In the beginning, Edith was being sympathetic and Mary quickly turned it to aggression.
@@jameslyon2338 you can hardly call that chagrined head tilt of Mary an aggressive venomous snipe. Edith’s reaction to try to humiliate her when she’s down was cruel and disproportionate. Then Mary did something disproportionately cruel back to her. She took it too far and immediately regrets it. But what does Edith expect? Don’t poke the bear and be surprised when the claws come out.
I’m actually on Mary’s side. Considering what Edith did to her by telling the Newspapers about Mr.Pamouk, it’s actually a well deserved payback.
She allready had her payback.
And that was 15 years ago, she didn't to it for revenge but because she was bitter
She almost ruined an innocent child's life