The hairpins ride and serve their purpose well. In my opinion, the straight tube Twenty is just a nicer design to look at and perhaps customise. Having said that, I am buying & picking up a hairpin at the weekend 😊
I have a few too many 20s including A Hercules Compact that I won on eBay for £1.20! The longest ride I’ve done was around 30 miles, my only issue was that having a low seat post gave me a bit of a bad back. But it’s a cool bike and I do have fun. But my favourite bike I have is a Kingpin.
I like my Kingpin. Folding to stow away ,go in the car and on the train is useful . Unfolded it takes up less space than a full size bike.The step through frame is easier to mount than my cross bar bike, a very useful feature over the years when recovering from medical operations. Not the best bike for long distances I will agree but good fun for shorter trips. Best of all it was free as I saved it from the skip many years ago.
I have 5 Twenties, none of them folders. One is a 'U' frame, as I refer to them. To me at least, this version illustrates how to build a 'Twenty' in a less labor intensive way and with less materials (but not by much). The original configuration was, I believe, brazed not welded. The permanently attached rack is a bit naff. As you say, both types are perfectly functional for the intended use. It would be interesting to see how the seat tube section was dramatically 'necked' down in diameter. About the same time the 'Safety Bicycle' was introduced, with the early diamond frame, cycles were popular with frames very similar to the first 'Twenty', so historically the type has some pedigree. Lest we forget, it was Rleigh's RSW16 that set the family trend as the 'Twenty's' were derived from that bikes layout. Reynolds, the famous tube manufacturer had a very accomplished designer named Ken Sprayson who would prototype/custom build racing motorcycle frames, normally based around a large diameter tube 'spine' section, not dissimilar to the 'Twenty' in concept. This was primarily done to reduce weight, yet be extremely strong. Thank you Rowan for your candid honesty with your assessment of the breed.
A while back I used one of these and found it to be quite reasonable. It was branded Barbican, in a pleasing blue. There was definitely flex, but nothing too alarming. I agree that they are perfectly fine for the intended purpose and are wrongly dismissed at times. If this was the only bike available to me for whatever reason, I would be be quite happy. Best wishes👍🚲
I saved a very rusty copy of one of these from the farm I work on, and I thought it was great fun! I didn't know they were looked down upon by some. After I repainted it, I put some new tyres on (didn't bother with the brakes or gears, rack or mudguards for the test ride), and spent ages bombing around the garden, bumping over tree stumps etc, it felt like a BMX!
Back in the 80s (at least in my part of the Netherlands) they were used as an alternative for bmx/cross bikes by kids since a lot of People had one in the shed they bought in the 60s and 70s and didnt use em anymore. But kids jumping these thing really shows that even though the bikes look weak that they're actually pretty solid.
Hi Rowan, only just caught up with these videos on the Hercules. Interesting and always enjoy Twenty content. I’ve never owned one of these, they aren’t as aesthetically pleasing to me so just overlooked them. But that one in that colour has made me consider keeping my eye out for one from now on, the lower step thru could be a bonus with my arthritic knees as well. Out of interest, do you know the maximum weight these old folders will carry (rider and luggage)? I noticed looking at modern folders some are only around 100kg which isn’t much for us six foot ‘blokes’ of a non athletic physique 😅 Regards, Frank.
Mike Burrows was one of many who understood the benefits of increased diameter tubing for bicycles. Double the diameter equals quadruple the stiffness. At the same time, you can make the walls thinner and end up with a lighter frame. This is why modern frames, especially aluminium frames, tend to be oversized. AL is around one third as stiff as steel, so one inch diameter tubes would have to be solid so as not to bend, and thus heavier.
@@another3997 as for aluminium, I’ve always liked how cannondale dit it, before hydro and vac forming. I like that aspect of my excellent Koga Miyata frame.
Totally random question. I have what looks like the same style of work stand you have outside. Mine is a little shorter and appears to be made for BMX racing here in the USA and I bought it from a former racer. It is powdercoated in hot pink and white. Its a really nice stand i would love to know more about it if you have any information. It would be nice to know if i can get any replacement parts such as the pads for the clamp. Right now I am just using old pieces of bicycle tire and it works but not ideal. Thanks in advance!
I’m in the same situation as you. This was donated to the bike/youth charity that I foinded, and was being scrapped after Kestrel donated us a dozen awesome stands. I tend to use a cloth as padding. Again, not ideal!
My Mongoose iboc 26 mountain bike has similar features, like the loop tail and thicker tubing. After pointing out weak spots,if you had the welding skills, a person could add gussets and the like to make it a very hardy bike. With that said, steel frames seem to look more aesthetic for some reason. Maybe our artistic instinct of thinner is better mentality. Not sure.
I have a Hercules Compact in brownish bronze, white handlebars, white seat and white pedals with a sturmey archer 3 speed and it's one of the best bikes i've ever had! I've had it folded up in the car, on the bus, on the train. Been all over the country in it.
Bought one a couple of months ago for £30, very good condition. 20" wheels, 1.75 tyres certainly helps with absorbing some of the bumps. Probably the ideal for a folding bike although 2" tyres might be a touch better. Mine is the same bent frame version although I've no idea how it was branded because it's been (expertly) resprayed. Longest ride I've done is 25 miles, it was perfectly fine. I fitted a HUGE 20 tooth sprocket because I have to deal with many hills. Certainly a lot of fun to ride, nippy and agile.
You’ve changed my opinion slightly but I still wouldn’t have one. They took an excellent bike in the original Raleigh 20 and cheapened every single aspect they possibly could. They just look awful.
Snobbery in action. 😂 They took one bike and made it easier and more economical to produce, yet at the same time there are almost no practical downsides. It's often the case that people dislike change, simply because they are used to something, even when later versions are demonstrably better. Aesthetics aside, and of course the varying specs between the numerous Raleigh sub brands, both bikes are functionally the same. Had this come first, people would complain the straight tube version was a step backwards. Double the diameter of a tube, quadruple the stiffness. The tube walls can be thinner and a frame can be lighter, yet stiffer.
Aesthetics are important and I still think the bendy frame models look awful. I wouldn’t necessarily say that if the ‘bendies’ had come first then I would have preferred them to the conventional Twenty. Having said that I do have great affection for the original Twenty as it was what I was given to ride around the huge Raleigh factory when I worked in the design office as a ‘gofor’ through the early 1970’s. I won’t argue with the practical aspects of your comment. I dare say that in the saddle there’s nothing to choose between them.
Would really appreciate a video on this bike's drivetrain. Been considering something of the sort for a touring bike. Like to know how those double cogs were fitted to an AW. Wonder if the same could be done with a Nexus 7? Could the former owner who engineered it make an appearance?
@@Velocipedium Thanks for that, Rowan. What I recall is that you showed it to us. What I'm asking for is more granular. How did he attach 2 cogs to the AW? Perhaps it's perfectly simple. If so, I'd like to know how. The double chainring is self-evident. Much appreciated.
I had a 3 speed (hub) Puch of very similar design in the 70s, it was fine except once when I tried to ride it down a steep sided quarry and it folded up on me. Looking back I'm not surprised. Other than that it was great.
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Hello Rowan it's an ideal short trip shopping bike. Spot on as usual. 🚲👍👍
The hairpins ride and serve their purpose well. In my opinion, the straight tube Twenty is just a nicer design to look at and perhaps customise. Having said that, I am buying & picking up a hairpin at the weekend 😊
That’s great, I hope you enjoy it. Please report!
I have a few too many 20s including A Hercules Compact that I won on eBay for £1.20! The longest ride I’ve done was around 30 miles, my only issue was that having a low seat post gave me a bit of a bad back. But it’s a cool bike and I do have fun. But my favourite bike I have is a Kingpin.
I like my Kingpin. Folding to stow away ,go in the car and on the train is useful . Unfolded it takes up less space than a full size bike.The step through frame is easier to mount than my cross bar bike, a very useful feature over the years when recovering from medical operations. Not the best bike for long distances I will agree but good fun for shorter trips. Best of all it was free as I saved it from the skip many years ago.
I actually like the look of the bike...
I have 5 Twenties, none of them folders. One is a 'U' frame, as I refer to them.
To me at least, this version illustrates how to build a 'Twenty' in a less labor intensive way and with less materials (but not by much). The original configuration was, I believe, brazed not welded. The permanently attached rack is a bit naff.
As you say, both types are perfectly functional for the intended use. It would be interesting to see how the seat tube section was dramatically 'necked' down in diameter.
About the same time the 'Safety Bicycle' was introduced, with the early diamond frame, cycles were popular with frames very similar to the first 'Twenty', so historically the type has some pedigree.
Lest we forget, it was Rleigh's RSW16 that set the family trend as the 'Twenty's' were derived from that bikes layout.
Reynolds, the famous tube manufacturer had a very accomplished designer named Ken Sprayson who would prototype/custom build racing motorcycle frames, normally based around a large diameter tube 'spine' section, not dissimilar to the 'Twenty' in concept. This was primarily done to reduce weight, yet be extremely strong.
Thank you Rowan for your candid honesty with your assessment of the breed.
Thank you too for taking the time to contribute your knowledge. Appreciated.
A while back I used one of these and found it to be quite reasonable. It was branded Barbican, in a pleasing blue. There was definitely flex, but nothing too alarming. I agree that they are perfectly fine for the intended purpose and are wrongly dismissed at times.
If this was the only bike available to me for whatever reason, I would be be quite happy.
Best wishes👍🚲
I saved a very rusty copy of one of these from the farm I work on, and I thought it was great fun! I didn't know they were looked down upon by some. After I repainted it, I put some new tyres on (didn't bother with the brakes or gears, rack or mudguards for the test ride), and spent ages bombing around the garden, bumping over tree stumps etc, it felt like a BMX!
Back in the 80s (at least in my part of the Netherlands) they were used as an alternative for bmx/cross bikes by kids since a lot of People had one in the shed they bought in the 60s and 70s and didnt use em anymore. But kids jumping these thing really shows that even though the bikes look weak that they're actually pretty solid.
A Gazelle Kwikstep is on my want list!
Hi Rowan, only just caught up with these videos on the Hercules. Interesting and always enjoy Twenty content.
I’ve never owned one of these, they aren’t as aesthetically pleasing to me so just overlooked them. But that one in that colour has made me consider keeping my eye out for one from now on, the lower step thru could be a bonus with my arthritic knees as well.
Out of interest, do you know the maximum weight these old folders will carry (rider and luggage)? I noticed looking at modern folders some are only around 100kg which isn’t much for us six foot ‘blokes’ of a non athletic physique 😅
Regards, Frank.
Mike Burrows was one of many who understood the benefits of increased diameter tubing for bicycles. Double the diameter equals quadruple the stiffness. At the same time, you can make the walls thinner and end up with a lighter frame. This is why modern frames, especially aluminium frames, tend to be oversized. AL is around one third as stiff as steel, so one inch diameter tubes would have to be solid so as not to bend, and thus heavier.
@@another3997 I remember reading his article in Bike Culture Quarterly. I was reminded of it with this bike.
@@another3997 as for aluminium, I’ve always liked how cannondale dit it, before hydro and vac forming. I like that aspect of my excellent Koga Miyata frame.
Totally random question. I have what looks like the same style of work stand you have outside. Mine is a little shorter and appears to be made for BMX racing here in the USA and I bought it from a former racer. It is powdercoated in hot pink and white. Its a really nice stand i would love to know more about it if you have any information. It would be nice to know if i can get any replacement parts such as the pads for the clamp. Right now I am just using old pieces of bicycle tire and it works but not ideal. Thanks in advance!
I’m in the same situation as you. This was donated to the bike/youth charity that I foinded, and was being scrapped after Kestrel donated us a dozen awesome stands. I tend to use a cloth as padding. Again, not ideal!
My Mongoose iboc 26 mountain bike has similar features, like the loop tail and thicker tubing. After pointing out weak spots,if you had the welding skills, a person could add gussets and the like to make it a very hardy bike. With that said, steel frames seem to look more aesthetic for some reason. Maybe our artistic instinct of thinner is better mentality. Not sure.
I have a Hercules Compact in brownish bronze, white handlebars, white seat and white pedals with a sturmey archer 3 speed and it's one of the best bikes i've ever had! I've had it folded up in the car, on the bus, on the train. Been all over the country in it.
Bought one a couple of months ago for £30, very good condition. 20" wheels, 1.75 tyres certainly helps with absorbing some of the bumps. Probably the ideal for a folding bike although 2" tyres might be a touch better. Mine is the same bent frame version although I've no idea how it was branded because it's been (expertly) resprayed. Longest ride I've done is 25 miles, it was perfectly fine. I fitted a HUGE 20 tooth sprocket because I have to deal with many hills.
Certainly a lot of fun to ride, nippy and agile.
That’s a handy bike, where can I get one ?
They are usually all over eBay or marketplace. Most have low mileage and are in good condition.
@@Velocipedium thank you.
You’ve changed my opinion slightly but I still wouldn’t have one. They took an excellent bike in the original Raleigh 20 and cheapened every single aspect they possibly could. They just look awful.
Snobbery in action. 😂 They took one bike and made it easier and more economical to produce, yet at the same time there are almost no practical downsides. It's often the case that people dislike change, simply because they are used to something, even when later versions are demonstrably better. Aesthetics aside, and of course the varying specs between the numerous Raleigh sub brands, both bikes are functionally the same. Had this come first, people would complain the straight tube version was a step backwards. Double the diameter of a tube, quadruple the stiffness. The tube walls can be thinner and a frame can be lighter, yet stiffer.
Aesthetics are important and I still think the bendy frame models look awful. I wouldn’t necessarily say that if the ‘bendies’ had come first then I would have preferred them to the conventional Twenty. Having said that I do have great affection for the original Twenty as it was what I was given to ride around the huge Raleigh factory when I worked in the design office as a ‘gofor’ through the early 1970’s.
I won’t argue with the practical aspects of your comment. I dare say that in the saddle there’s nothing to choose between them.
Would really appreciate a video on this bike's drivetrain. Been considering something of the sort for a touring bike. Like to know how those double cogs were fitted to an AW. Wonder if the same could be done with a Nexus 7? Could the former owner who engineered it make an appearance?
I explain the same drivetrain on the 20 a couple of videos before this one. Alex doesn’t want to be on video
@@Velocipedium Thanks for that, Rowan. What I recall is that you showed it to us. What I'm asking for is more granular. How did he attach 2 cogs to the AW? Perhaps it's perfectly simple. If so, I'd like to know how. The double chainring is self-evident. Much appreciated.
I had a 3 speed (hub) Puch of very similar design in the 70s, it was fine except once when I tried to ride it down a steep sided quarry and it folded up on me. Looking back I'm not surprised. Other than that it was great.
Yes I don’t think that qualifies as regular use!😀
Hello, do you think 1.75 wide bmx tyres would firt one of those bikes? thinking of one for my partner. bye bye for now,
1.75 is probably the maximum. I haven’t tried yet
thanks, @@Velocipedium
Your regular reminder that Rowan needs our help if this channel is to continue.
Please become a Velocipedian to thank him and allow him to continue sharing his knowledge and passion with us.
Current number of members as percentage of total subscribers = 0.171%