but its obvious that the plate is really well handled by airy and bessel points :). otherwise the coffee cup is not level and that causes marriage stress ;) . at least from my perspective. I am getting grumpy if my coffee is out of level : ) , so I am out of flex and level , my wife gets into physical stress and out of level , at the end we both are totally out of level , and stressed, and I have to pay the bill.
A chance to see this level of precision demonstrated by the man who built the machine is a rare treat. Thank you for letting us look over your shoulder. I was impressed with the machinists that could hit less than 1/2 thou but this so much more precise. 👍
That must mean I'm still using rock and copper chisel....~¿@ Thank You Dan Gelbart for sharing this great build!! The compression bolt was quite brilliant! Curious what material you used for it? ~PJ
Dan Gelbart Thanks very much! I'm quite sure you took all of this into account but I would have thought maybe something closer to the granite for thermal expansion...Tungsten maybe? Curious if this unit is used in a controlled environment and the mild steel expanding by maybe ~.0001/2ºC around room temp. When I think of all the materials & mechanisms working in harmony to achieve these tolerances for
pjsalchemy because od the air gap matching the expansion is not critical, will just change the air bearing gap. Where steel has to be bonded to the granite (headstock and cross-slide parallels) attention has to be paid to allow some differential expansion without bending.
Not me, I couldn't watch the whole thing because of his accent, I don't know why, but it's just grating to my brain. Especially when he says "bearing" a thousand times in the span of 2 minutes, over and over and over again, air bearing air bearing. Sounds like he has a razor in his throat everytime he pronounces an R. I do have pretty severe misophonia though. Although I can't say it's even been triggered by an accent, I think it's the accent plus repeating annoyingly pronounced words every 2 seconds.
@@rosewhite--- No it isn't. Look up what misophonia actually is. To compare that to whatever you're talking about is just wrong. It's different form of synesthesia. Where sense have extra pathways and create different experiences. Instead of sight being linked to taste, sound is linked to the emotional centre of the brain
Many thanks Dan for sharing this beautiful creation. There is a serious problem with it however - it is way too short! Please please make this just Part 1 of many. We need to see the headstock and the carriage in detail, and more turning operations and more... well just MORE!
Truly a testimony to what mankind can achieve when focused on high levels of order. You have made an amazing machine, which is certainly a reflection of your character, sir, refined, humble, talented, skillful, courageous, inventive and a host of qualities yet out of reach of my understanding. Thank you very much for taking the time to make this wonderful machine and to produce the very well done video for all to enjoy. Kudos!
It's not everyday that someone as successful as Dan shows his inner sanctum (home workshop) on youtube.. even his life story and philosophy of Creo is interesting.. I've been developing tech and machines in my basement for years now (since I was 23) and i'm close to finally go commercial soon so hopefully I can make money to buy bigger machines because the chattering and weak mini mills and lathes will soon be the death of me.. can't take in anymore to be honest!.. anyway cheers Dan, you're an inspiraton to us!
This man's work is so beautiful I tend to hold my breath when looking at it. As an amateur machinist, I have never hold any tolerance tighter than a thousandth. This has been good enough for small o-ring grooves, heat-shrink fits, seals, seats for (commercial) ball-bearings, and so on. I have a professional machinist bro who typically does not have to hold any tolerance tighter than a "tenth". Dan, you are on a level so beyond what I am familiar with it is beyond my ken.
a tenth is same order of magnitude, this is a luxury machine. you can get same results from inferior machinery it just takes time. in dan gelbarts case time happens to be worth millions of dollars. The part is what matters
Dan, one of the biggest inspirations on this subject! In all your series i never heard you mention the use of metal filled epoxy for casting precision surfaces (on metals, ultra high performance concrete, epoxy granite or any other reasonably stiff and stable material). As someone else mentioned, a "perfect" flat, parallel or square surface could easily be formed by using special epoxy like Moglice or DHT, a surface plate and standard measuring equipment. Or to match a bore to a shaft and so on. For mating or bearing surfaces , but especially for air bearings, as there is no contact between surfaces, so the bearing properties between the materials are mostly irrelevant. Also you can mold in pockets, orifices, restrictors with dissolvable materials like wax or even 3d printed plastics. For example, experiments were made for mating a nut including all the air channels to a precision acme screw with Moglice, which were lapped to each other afterwards for a defined clearance, with some promising results. I'm just pondering what you could achieve with this method, with reduced or even without the hassle of scraping, lapping, grinding or machining surfaces. Also your choice of materials and methods of forming structures would greatly improve. I plan to make a couple of experiments, so i would love to hear your experience or opinion about it. Thank you so much for your content, saved me many years of unnecessary try and error, but also gives me even more inspiration for years of experimentation! much love from switzerland :)
You raised a good point, but epoxy granite can only be used where there is no wear, such as air bearings or non moving parts. It scratches too easily for all other applications. I considered it for the lathe, but the way wipers collect grinding dust and chips and would have worn out the ways. Even is the ways are air bearings you need to wipe them. BTW, it is a Swiss invention, introduced by the Studer AG grinder maker under the name Granitan.
+kubeek Re air bearings, just google the subject. If tools sharp and you take a finishing cut, the cutting forces are surprisingly small and air bearing with a large area deflect very little, sub micron. the carriage of this lathe runs on large area air bearings.
Yeah it becomes pretty obvious in these videos you could learn more in a week following this guy around than in 4yrs of engineering classes. I really wish I could download his brain, parallel to my own. That would be so useful.
Totally transfixed on the video. Man this has got to be the best video i've seen all month! Beautiful machine, masterfully manufactured, excellent explanation of the workings. This is what true craftmanship is all about! Thank you so much for uploading!
Hey Dan loved working on projects for you at Creo! My first engineering co-op was there & did several more. Loved getting around people like yourself & others. My favorite time of the day was around the lunch tables listening in on rediculous engineering debates where each party was deeply intrenched on their hypothesis and would defend it to the bitted end 😂. The results in the labs were the only way to settle it!
Hi Dan, I couldn't say how many times I have watched your videos and read all the comments and replys now. every time I do though I discover another titbit of genius. Because of you at the age of 50ish I have been inspired to go back to school and study engineering to gain a better understanding of the things you talk about. I also have the Moore tool books on your recommendation, they are pure gold. I look forward to when you have time to go into detail on your lathe chuck. Cheers Andrew
I can't even believe you built this yourself. I've been building mills and lathes for about a year now, trying to get my own design worked out; never thought to use granite as surface material..... you've given me some inspiration. I ran an od grinder years ago, and I always loved how precise it was. I even considered building a grindef instead. I'm definitely building a grinder now, and I'll be using granite thanks to you!
I have a picture in my designs folder of an enormous machine made primarily out of granite... likely no less than 4 tonnes of stone in that machine... the parts appear to be both epoxy bound and stud retained with anchors of some sort... quite akin to the classic 4way split concrete anchors, but i cant say for sure from a single picture... Its a great material, hard, stable, durable, great for air bearings especially, but yeah, its not such an uncommon thing... it is rare in general, but not in the industry and specialized worksites...
It´s great that you are back. Your videos are brilliant. Please keep them coming. BTW: I can't believe that some of your videos only have one or two thousand views. It is very important that you enter lots of tags and keywords to your videos so that TH-cam can find them and suggest them to the viewers of videos with a similar subject. Thank you so much for sharing yor incredible knowledge.
Dan, I'm not sure if you're still reading these comments, but I'd like to thank you for sharing this knowledge. I've just finished your video series, and, well, let's just say it got the cogs turning. I'm building a DIY CNC router, and your insights have already led to several design changes. Best regards, John. AvE sent me.
Hi John: I'm reading all the comments and they inspire me to make more videos. At the moment I'm busy with a new metal 3D printing company, Rapidia, which leaves me no time to make more videos, but I will.
+Mathew Copeland I think what he means is that nothing about this machine is really revolutionary. Other than the chuck , all the components are just the best parts for this use, bearings? use the most precise bearings, use the most precise bed and make the assembly ultra stiff. not saying that is isn't impressive, but it's just many little things done very well
Great Video course, thank you. A couple of questions; are the air bearings porous media or orifice? How do you prevent chips from clogging them? Do the slides move on threaded rods or linear motors? Be great to see the machine in greater detail; its one of the wonders of the western world. Congratulations. Edward
Air bearings are orifice+pocket type, porous media will absorb coolant and plug up. The air pushes the dust out, chips cannot get into the 10um gap. Slides are driven by high-grade ball screws, rotated by stepper motors.
7 21 24 that demo of the cylinder / piston and on-off air valve was an ingenious idea to aid understanding. it was just this month reading t. clancy's novel " the sum of all fears " that i became aware of machine tools using air bearings. and their ability to grind metal on the inside or outside surface to a mirror smooth finish. and that led to searching u-tube for a video on the a-b subject. a curiousity is how much of a layer of metal , millimeters or microns , an a-b lathe can remove at a time. my thought is too much will cause the rotating shaft to tilt off-center. and possibly lead to vibration. also curious if hi - precision microgram scales rest on some sort of an air cushion . to damp out ground vibrations. and that it is this air - damping engineering that makes them so costly
I'm just imagining what kind of thoughts can be put into reality with such a tool just in a few minutes. Dan, please, keep posting a videos about your work. I even urge you to put a camera in your shop and make it live streaming without even thinging about how it will look like))))
This is so cool! I think air bearings in general are very underrated, maybe also because they cant take that big loads. But this is quite a nice machine, and I'm relieved to see coolant for the grinder. I thought that it would spray grinding dust everywhere, which could potentially ruin the bed
this is the kind of things that make precision mechanics a superior sience! No doubt your machine can be mentioned among great names like SIP or Hauser
Dr. Gelbart you are truly a role model, our society could desperately use more like yourself for children instead of the common celebrity who is famous simply for being famous.
I've watched this video many times and still not Bored. I wish I had this Mans Shop Set-Up. The Dreams that could be Brought to Fortition with this Equipment is Mind Boggling.
1 micron is still 10000 times bigger than an atom. So I wonder how much air is escaping per minute? If you leave it close how many days does it take for air to completely escape the cylinder?
Hi here from Germany ..... I don´t know what i can say ..... Best what i´ve seen in the last Years .... Respect man unbeliveable i wish i can work with you! Thanks a lot for showing this, ever i have said that some machine are like this, cause the technic solution is ready to build things like your m. they told me words like daydreamer and never in small shops will this be reality .... So thank you very much You made my year!!!!
I salute your incredible practical knowledge Mr Gelbard. Two or three people with your passion and experience and attitude could transform my countries vassal economy. Please keep posting!
I recall learning about air bearings in high school....early 1960's...I was impressed by the clearances (recording studio turntable)....take the shaft out...put a fingerprint on it....you could barely force it back in....and it wouldn't turn....
The oil from a fingerprint would not take a lot of force to shear from the surface of a shaft. Possibly more likely is the heat from your finger expanded the shaft to take it from air-bearing fit to a press fit?
I am curious what kind of linear motion control you use for something this precise? is there a certain type of ballscrew or servo you used to build this? And are your hand controls digital so that the computer can compensate for backlash in the ballscrews even while manually jogging? Love the build btw!!!
Hi Dan, it is amazing to see how you talk about such levels of precision as if it is nothing! Very humbling experience, but what a joy to watch your video. Thanks so much for sharing, and of course I have signed on to your channel. Kind regards, Donald
It's an amazing lathe. I only try to make air bearings once, when i build a Tesla turbine, and i fail miserably. The tolerances have to be very tight. You had a very clever solution to build the bed, does the viscosity of the epoxy affect the aligment of the parallels during the glueing? do you have to press the pieces with high pressure?
Noneed for pressure, the weight of the granite pushes out the excess epoxy. The parallels are kept in alignment during curing via a matched pair of precision steel spacers. Very slow setting epoxy is used.
+Dan Gelbart So it flows naturally. Thanks for sharing this video. It's an awesome lathe. I too like to engineer everything my self. Today I test a homemade forging die to make thick aluminum cones. And I didn't miss my calculations by much! Sometimes manufacturers make everything look like, but there is always some sort of way to do it yourself.
I just found this channel and already I'm in LOVE with the information and the presentation OF the information! Thank you for posting such interesting information! (I've already subbed and will of course thumb UP every video as I watch them!)
Hi, Dan, amazing machine, thanks for shareing. I wonder if it is easier to build this type of lathe based on an existing precision manual lathe, by replacing the spindle with air bearing spindle, and reuse other existing parts on the lathe, if so, can you recommend a good manual lathe to start with? thanks,
The bed and cross slide of an existing lathe is not accurate enough. You need 1um straightness and squareness. . What you can do is buy a used Moore #3 Jig Borer (under $3000 on Ebay) and mount the spindle instead of column. Several companies who needed high accuracy machines did that.
Thanks, Dan, do you know any place I could source a nice air bearing spindle? I would like to turn max 200mm OD part on this lathe. Also, any requirements on the maximum spindle speed? the higher the better? Thanks.
Under 10 grand. The granite is from precisiongraniteusa.com, about $2500. Motors and sppeed controls from goldenmotor.com, about $500. Ball screws (C0) and air bearings are surplus, from Ebay. All electronis (stepper and microstepper drivers , power supplies, switches etc) from Ebay. A regular chuck shold be under $1000, mine is very specialized, all parts lapped to 1um.
Someone else mentioned this, so I came back and read it again. I am surprised to see you are using steppers. It seems to me that something more analogue would have suited your surface finish requirements better. I am a real fan of servos + resolvers (at eBay prices, I should add).
that air bearing is very interesting. 🤔 there is nothing like watching the air bearing in action compared to someone explaining the concept. 🥰 thanks smart Dan.
@@dgelbart Hi Dan thank you very much for sharing. Is the spindle like a dover air bearing spindle that you mounted with an additional thrust air bearing? I assume you had to machine a custom mount for your chuck as well? It would be neat to see more information about the spindle. Thanks for sharing what you have regardless!
Keeping machines clean, well lubricated and gib strips tightly adjusted ensures accuracies. In my 50 years of engineering I never saw anyone but myself adjust the gib strips on the sliding parts of machine tools. This however is carried out every six months on machines in Japanese machine shops.
Hi Dan, In one of your (fantastic) tutorial-videos, "part 16 of 18 Machining" th-cam.com/video/a_E-tYRxBkU/w-d-xo.html#t=8m40s , you mention adding a groove to the tip of a tight-fitting shaft to aid with self-aligning. How are you able to fit the piston in the cylinder at 0:48 without having made such a groove?
+Aditya Mehendale Very good observation. The cylinder bore has a bit of a lead in taper in this demo, but this is not always allowed. The groove is the right way of doing it, leaving a 1-2mm wide ring at tip. One other factor that helps on the demo is that both parts are very hard, this makes insertion much easier.
@@dgelbart Hello Dan, a colleague of mine has recently built a nice EDM machine as a side-project. He discusses a nice tip to get a wrapping-angle of >360 degree on a pulley here: th-cam.com/video/us3KhT7r01g/w-d-xo.html (Channel-name: TH-cam --> BAXEDM). I think you'll really like it (and the rest of his video-series too, if you have the time - Mike has 5 videos in the series thus far). Regards!
In rare occasions I’ve machined to tight tolerances like that on my Taiwanese machines. You know it’s right when it compresses air and floats like that. Those air bearings are beautifully quiet. Would love to have a build sheet for this where to locate the parts you’ve purchased.
I screwed up and retired without a lathe or mill, too busy doing repairs on the house and friends vehicles to invest the time and money you have here. It sure is something to aspire too, if I ever catch up with what this house needs, this project looks like the one.
Dan Gelbart good point. Just curious,I am attempting to build myself a lathe (it doesn't have to be as accurate as the lathe you built) and I was wondering if epoxy granite could be substituted for the granite parallels that you used. Seeing as it's my first lathe build,I am bound to make mistakes,and getting expensive pieces of granite parallels would be very costly mistakes to make. Sorry for taking up so much of your time, and thanks for putting these videos on youtube, I have learned so much already.
wow, just wow.. what does one have to do to get a skill set like that? And how much you've shared within 10 minutes is just mind-blowing. This is just.. wow..
+Dan Gelbart Thank you for the reply. My formal education is along the lines of femtosecond laser micromachining, so now I'm trying to pick up mechanical design skills on my own. I hope you're right, but it will surely take a lot of time.. and expensive attempts.
I can visualize this gentleman on the stage of an ampitheater full of toolmakers, tool & diemakers and general machinists, all listening raptly to one of his educational lectures about how to make a lunar vehicle that would fit on the head of pin.
Hi Dan, My name is Dale Derry. I have a youtube channel called Metal tips and tricks. About a month ago I mentioned you to my followers as a must see channel. Im so glad you did a new video please keep them coming. P.s. Here is the name to the video I mentioned you in."How I learn Metal Working"
With this technology, you are dealing with accuracy/tolerances of almost the peaks and troughs of the atoms in a metalic lattice. I want one for my home. Lol
@@CBRFFan what do you mean with resolution? The reason I ask is that resulotion and actual accuracy are different things. After looking at their site for one of their modern machines the resolution on the glass scales is 0.01 micron, drives are 0.1 micron and it results in a accuracy of 2-3.5 micron in X/Z
@@CBRFFan I don't think so. Make a part with your lathe and then compare it on a AA surface plate with gauge blocks. See if you're within 0.1micron. My cheap caliper shows down to 10micron but the accuracy is 25micron (1thou). My micron glass scale has an accuracy of 2microns. So what you see on your display is not what you get
Micrometers that read in 0,01mm are sometimes calibrated with 0,001mm accuracy. Something that is reading in 0,001 or better may as well be 10 times worse than the reading. At any rate that accuracy requires flooding the whole machine body and screws especially with temp controlled cooling oil. If it doesn't have that, it's impossible to be so accurate consistently
Thank you for your videos Dan! You have a great deal of knowledge and the fact that you are willing to share that with others on a ‘not for profit’ basis is very inspiring! Only thing I regret is that didn’t find your videos about 4 years ago when I started on my prototype/manufacturing journey!! Well done my friend and please keep uploading these very informative videos if you can manage to fit them into your busy schedule. Thank you 🙏
A masterpiece of ingenuity and excellence! At 6:18 you show your internal grinding adaptors, on which there seems to be a number of fast helical patterns in the stone surface, what advantage does this bring to the work and how is it made?
I wasn't getting the accuracy I wanted (sub micron) and I suspected that coolant needed escape channels as wheel OD was close to ground ID. Not sure if it helped, chnnels put in by hand with diamond wheel.
Just ball screws. In these kind of jobs the main thing is the geometry (squareness, parallelism etc). Exact position less critical, unless you cut tapers and spheres.
I'm impressed. I also design myself a lathe CNC machine but with a cast iron bed. It is a pity that I can not come to visit and see everything with my own eyes.
This takes DIY to a new level. How do you make the precision inner bore of the air bearing cylinder? I understand the grinder for outer surfaces, but how do you do inner surfaces if the grinder wheel doesn't fit inside the bore? Do you have a small inner grinder wheel attachment that works with this lathe?
if you had another female cylinder at the other end of the rod (nipple could be on the female ones) and kept them moderately compressed would the air leek out eventually, because it seemed trapped?
thought so. There is a seal made by levitex I wonder if that could aid a sealed air bearing?? would be a first! Great videos btw, always interesting ++
I can't express my joy in words. I hope we can convince you to do a more detailed design overview of the different components. I could listen to you discuss building machines to micron accuracy for a year straight!
Hi Mr. Gelbart, thx for this awesome video, too. I'd like to see more videos about this lathe, more so I'd like to build my own. Couple of questions: 1. What's the inner/outer diameter of your spindle shaft? Stainless steel? 2. Did you use thrust bearings for the spindle/tailstock? If not, what did you use to limit axial motion? 3. How is the cross slide fixed in position? Radial air bearings from both sides? Vacuum preloaded ones? 4. I understand all of the air bearing components have to be made to very tight tolerances. How does it react to temperature fluctuations?
Spindle air bearing about 100mm dia x150mm long, plus trust bearing (double sided) about 150mm diameter. spindle is 440 stainless, about Rc 45, mating bearing bronze. About 100 air orifices.
legend has it that this guys house is on a giant surface plate for foundation.
It rides on air bearings.
RingingResonance earthquakeproof🤣
but its obvious that the plate is really well handled by airy and bessel points :). otherwise the coffee cup is not level and that causes marriage stress ;) . at least from my perspective. I am getting grumpy if my coffee is out of level : ) , so I am out of flex and level , my wife gets into physical stress and out of level , at the end we both are totally out of level , and stressed, and I have to pay the bill.
Bahhhhhhhhhhhh.....funny
I wish I could share this joke with friends but they would have no idea! haha
A chance to see this level of precision demonstrated by the man who built the machine is a rare treat. Thank you for letting us look over your shoulder. I was impressed with the machinists that could hit less than 1/2 thou but this so much more precise. 👍
OMG now I feel that I have been machining with a pic-ax and a sledge hammer. What a great piece. THANK YOU for sharing.... Back to my cave..... Fred
That must mean I'm still using rock and copper chisel....~¿@ Thank You Dan Gelbart for sharing this great build!! The compression bolt was quite brilliant! Curious what material you used for it? ~PJ
pjsalchemy Regular mild steel.
Dan Gelbart
Thanks very much! I'm quite sure you took all of this into account but I would have thought maybe something closer to the granite for thermal expansion...Tungsten maybe? Curious if this unit is used in a controlled environment and the mild steel expanding by maybe ~.0001/2ºC around room temp. When I think of all the materials & mechanisms working in harmony to achieve these tolerances for
pjsalchemy because od the air gap matching the expansion is not critical, will just change the air bearing gap. Where steel has to be bonded to the granite (headstock and cross-slide parallels) attention has to be paid to allow some differential expansion without bending.
When you realise the nice new mazak in the shop is as accurate as a potato......such sadness!
"It's not that difficult to build a machine like this". Perhaps not if you have an accent like yours, it just radiates precision and ingenuity.
Not me, I couldn't watch the whole thing because of his accent, I don't know why, but it's just grating to my brain. Especially when he says "bearing" a thousand times in the span of 2 minutes, over and over and over again, air bearing air bearing. Sounds like he has a razor in his throat everytime he pronounces an R. I do have pretty severe misophonia though. Although I can't say it's even been triggered by an accent, I think it's the accent plus repeating annoyingly pronounced words every 2 seconds.
@@PBMS123 Your misophonia is learned just like that of the younger generation who get physically upset at being forced to listen to classical music.
@@rosewhite--- No it isn't.
Look up what misophonia actually is. To compare that to whatever you're talking about is just wrong.
It's different form of synesthesia. Where sense have extra pathways and create different experiences. Instead of sight being linked to taste, sound is linked to the emotional centre of the brain
Tyvär, det finns sona idioter som du överallt!
@@PBMS123 , русские, немцы, евреи и индийцы благодарны автору, потому что этот акцент понятен каждому из них. Для тебя существуют субтитры.
Many thanks Dan for sharing this beautiful creation. There is a serious problem with it however - it is way too short!
Please please make this just Part 1 of many. We need to see the headstock and the carriage in detail, and more turning operations and more... well just MORE!
3:38 Love how those pins sound coming out of the slots - much precision achieved
Did you hear the little pop when the first one came out!? Perfection!
@@joeldix923 CNC porn
@@joeldix923 That was at 3:35 though - erikig's time stamp missed the best one.
@@denismilic1878 ohhh yeahhhhhh
And we are talking about a chuck-jaws and a clamping pin.
Truly a testimony to what mankind can achieve when focused on high levels of order. You have made an amazing machine, which is certainly a reflection of your character, sir, refined, humble, talented, skillful, courageous, inventive and a host of qualities yet out of reach of my understanding. Thank you very much for taking the time to make this wonderful machine and to produce the very well done video for all to enjoy. Kudos!
0:54 “It completely loose fit”
Me: so what?
Then closes the air vent …
Me: wow!
jup. same here. very impressive.
legit blew my mind off this universe
wow indeed...I think I said "wow" 5 or 6 times...
It's not everyday that someone as successful as Dan shows his inner sanctum (home workshop) on youtube.. even his life story and philosophy of Creo is interesting.. I've been developing tech and machines in my basement for years now (since I was 23) and i'm close to finally go commercial soon so hopefully I can make money to buy bigger machines because the chattering and weak mini mills and lathes will soon be the death of me.. can't take in anymore to be honest!.. anyway cheers Dan, you're an inspiraton to us!
This man's work is so beautiful I tend to hold my breath when looking at it. As an amateur machinist, I have never hold any tolerance tighter than a thousandth. This has been good enough for small o-ring grooves, heat-shrink fits, seals, seats for (commercial) ball-bearings, and so on. I have a professional machinist bro who typically does not have to hold any tolerance tighter than a "tenth". Dan, you are on a level so beyond what I am familiar with it is beyond my ken.
A micron is about half a tenth. Machining within a tenth without a machine like this is impressive!
a tenth is same order of magnitude, this is a luxury machine. you can get same results from inferior machinery it just takes time. in dan gelbarts case time happens to be worth millions of dollars. The part is what matters
Dan, one of the biggest inspirations on this subject! In all your series i never heard you mention the use of metal filled epoxy for casting precision surfaces (on metals, ultra high performance concrete, epoxy granite or any other reasonably stiff and stable material). As someone else mentioned, a "perfect" flat, parallel or square surface could easily be formed by using special epoxy like Moglice or DHT, a surface plate and standard measuring equipment. Or to match a bore to a shaft and so on. For mating or bearing surfaces , but especially for air bearings, as there is no contact between surfaces, so the bearing properties between the materials are mostly irrelevant. Also you can mold in pockets, orifices, restrictors with dissolvable materials like wax or even 3d printed plastics. For example, experiments were made for mating a nut including all the air channels to a precision acme screw with Moglice, which were lapped to each other afterwards for a defined clearance, with some promising results. I'm just pondering what you could achieve with this method, with reduced or even without the hassle of scraping, lapping, grinding or machining surfaces. Also your choice of materials and methods of forming structures would greatly improve. I plan to make a couple of experiments, so i would love to hear your experience or opinion about it. Thank you so much for your content, saved me many years of unnecessary try and error, but also gives me even more inspiration for years of experimentation! much love from switzerland :)
You raised a good point, but epoxy granite can only be used where there is no wear, such as air bearings or non moving parts. It scratches too easily for all other applications. I considered it for the lathe, but the way wipers collect grinding dust and chips and would have worn out the ways. Even is the ways are air bearings you need to wipe them. BTW, it is a Swiss invention, introduced by the Studer AG grinder maker under the name Granitan.
Hi Folks, you may enjoy watching something else I built: th-cam.com/video/ccjTMQwKWNs/w-d-xo.html
+Dan Gelbart Could you please explain how the linear air bearings on the ways work and how do they achieve accuracy with respect to tool pressure?
+kubeek Re air bearings, just google the subject. If tools sharp and you take a finishing cut, the cutting forces are surprisingly small and air bearing with a large area deflect very little, sub micron. the carriage of this lathe runs on large area air bearings.
when can I become your apprentice?
Yeah it becomes pretty obvious in these videos you could learn more in a week following this guy around than in 4yrs of engineering classes. I really wish I could download his brain, parallel to my own. That would be so useful.
Sr it's a masterpiece glad there is people like you in this World with the entellect to do these things.
Totally transfixed on the video. Man this has got to be the best video i've seen all month! Beautiful machine, masterfully manufactured, excellent explanation of the workings. This is what true craftmanship is all about!
Thank you so much for uploading!
Hey Dan loved working on projects for you at Creo! My first engineering co-op was there & did several more. Loved getting around people like yourself & others. My favorite time of the day was around the lunch tables listening in on rediculous engineering debates where each party was deeply intrenched on their hypothesis and would defend it to the bitted end 😂. The results in the labs were the only way to settle it!
Hi Dan,
I couldn't say how many times I have watched your videos and read all the comments and replys now. every time I do though I discover another titbit of genius. Because of you at the age of 50ish I have been inspired to go back to school and study engineering to gain a better understanding of the things you talk about. I also have the Moore tool books on your recommendation, they are pure gold. I look forward to when you have time to go into detail on your lathe chuck.
Cheers
Andrew
Dear Diary, today, I learned that air bearings exist.
The bearing at the beginning would be a cool desk toy.
I can't even believe you built this yourself. I've been building mills and lathes for about a year now, trying to get my own design worked out; never thought to use granite as surface material..... you've given me some inspiration. I ran an od grinder years ago, and I always loved how precise it was. I even considered building a grindef instead.
I'm definitely building a grinder now, and I'll be using granite thanks to you!
I have a picture in my designs folder of an enormous machine made primarily out of granite... likely no less than 4 tonnes of stone in that machine... the parts appear to be both epoxy bound and stud retained with anchors of some sort... quite akin to the classic 4way split concrete anchors, but i cant say for sure from a single picture... Its a great material, hard, stable, durable, great for air bearings especially, but yeah, its not such an uncommon thing... it is rare in general, but not in the industry and specialized worksites...
It´s great that you are back. Your videos are brilliant. Please keep them coming.
BTW: I can't believe that some of your videos only have one or two thousand views. It is very important that you enter lots of tags and keywords to your videos so that TH-cam can find them and suggest them to the viewers of videos with a similar subject.
Thank you so much for sharing yor incredible knowledge.
I can't handle this amount of flexing on my broke ass.
ⵉⵜⵔⵓⵏⴰⵓⵜ Scratch built!! 😵
No flexing, it's got a granite bed ;-)
@@gregfeneis609 granite will flex as does cast iron and all the other materials
@@MF175mp Issa joke
@@gregfeneis609 no problem I figured but some people watching these might take it literally
Air bearings are very noisy, he switches the machine on and it is hardly audible.
I think he was referring to that hissing noise
the air compressor is in another room...and he doesn't get his fittings from harbor frieght...
Dan, I'm not sure if you're still reading these comments, but I'd like to thank you for sharing this knowledge. I've just finished your video series, and, well, let's just say it got the cogs turning. I'm building a DIY CNC router, and your insights have already led to several design changes. Best regards, John.
AvE sent me.
Hi John:
I'm reading all the comments and they inspire me to make more videos. At the moment I'm busy with a new metal 3D printing company, Rapidia, which leaves me no time to make more videos, but I will.
"It's not that difficult to build a machine like this" lol.
+Mathew Copeland I think what he means is that nothing about this machine is really revolutionary. Other than the chuck , all the components are just the best parts for this use, bearings? use the most precise bearings, use the most precise bed and make the assembly ultra stiff. not saying that is isn't impressive, but it's just many little things done very well
Nothing to it... when you have a few spare minutes, start by knocking up a planet, then just follow your nose from there! ;o)
I had a good chuckle with that one too. LOL
He has the modesty angle covered!
It's not really that difficult... for a guy with Dan's talent and knowledge.
Dan, please make more videos if you have time. They are inspiring
Great Video course, thank you. A couple of questions; are the air bearings porous media or orifice? How do you prevent chips from clogging them? Do the slides move on threaded rods or linear motors? Be great to see the machine in greater detail; its one of the wonders of the western world. Congratulations. Edward
Air bearings are orifice+pocket type, porous media will absorb coolant and plug up. The air pushes the dust out, chips cannot get into the 10um gap. Slides are driven by high-grade ball screws, rotated by stepper motors.
7 21 24
that demo of the cylinder / piston and on-off air valve was an ingenious idea
to aid understanding.
it was just this month reading t. clancy's novel " the sum of all fears " that i
became aware of machine tools using air bearings. and their ability
to grind metal on the inside or outside surface to a mirror smooth finish.
and that led to searching u-tube for a video on the a-b subject.
a curiousity is how much of a layer of metal , millimeters or microns ,
an a-b lathe can remove at a time.
my thought is too much will cause the rotating shaft
to tilt off-center. and possibly lead to vibration.
also curious if hi - precision microgram scales rest on some sort
of an air cushion . to damp out ground vibrations. and that it is
this air - damping engineering that makes them so costly
I'm just imagining what kind of thoughts can be put into reality with such a tool just in a few minutes.
Dan, please, keep posting a videos about your work.
I even urge you to put a camera in your shop and make it live streaming without even thinging about how it will look like))))
please post more videos of this wonderful machine in use! I and many others would watch them all. Thanks for your inspiring work, Dan!
Teacher: what do you want to be when you grow up?
Me: Dan Gelbart
I need more!!!! This was brilliant and the fact you built it yourself, with micron accuracy? Amazing. Id live to learn from you, brilliant work.
This is so cool! I think air bearings in general are very underrated, maybe also because they cant take that big loads. But this is quite a nice machine, and I'm relieved to see coolant for the grinder. I thought that it would spray grinding dust everywhere, which could potentially ruin the bed
This is an amazing piece of equipment, being able to work to these tolerances on a lathe, boggles the mind.
Probably the 20th time I have watched this video in full. I never get sick of it! When are we going to see some new videos Dan!!
Thanks for putting this up Dan, I immensely enjoy your videos and learn a lot from them and hope you can be encouraged to share more.
That is the coolest machine i have ever seen. And i have seen alot.
this is the kind of things that make precision mechanics a superior sience! No doubt your machine can be mentioned among great names like SIP or Hauser
Dr. Gelbart you are truly a role model, our society could desperately use more like yourself for children instead of the common celebrity who is famous simply for being famous.
Glad to see you back Dan, I have learned a lot from your videos
Hope you can find the time to share more.
all the best.
Absolutely brilliant Dan, as usual, and you make it sound so easy. You sir a a professionals professiionial!
Phil
UK
I've watched this video many times and still not Bored. I wish I had this Mans Shop Set-Up. The Dreams that could be Brought to Fortition with this Equipment is Mind Boggling.
1 micron is still 10000 times bigger than an atom. So I wonder how much air is escaping per minute? If you leave it close how many days does it take for air to completely escape the cylinder?
+GodsLoveMinistry About a day for air to escape. If you really want to, you can make a cylinder with a better fit, like 0.1um, by adding some lapping.
@@dgelbart live lapped finishes.
Hi here from Germany .....
I don´t know what i can say .....
Best what i´ve seen in the last Years ....
Respect man unbeliveable i wish i can work with you!
Thanks a lot for showing this, ever i have said that some machine are like this, cause the technic solution is ready to build things like your m. they told me words like daydreamer and never in small shops will this be reality ....
So thank you very much You made my year!!!!
Fantastic! I would love to see more about this build.
Peace!
I salute your incredible practical knowledge Mr Gelbard. Two or three people with your passion and experience and attitude could transform my countries vassal economy. Please keep posting!
Mr. Miller and I share the same sentiment!!
That to date is the coolest thing I seen in the machining community!
Thank you so much for sharing!
Razor!
I recall learning about air bearings in high school....early 1960's...I was impressed by the clearances (recording studio turntable)....take the shaft out...put a fingerprint on it....you could barely force it back in....and it wouldn't turn....
The oil from a fingerprint would not take a lot of force to shear from the surface of a shaft. Possibly more likely is the heat from your finger expanded the shaft to take it from air-bearing fit to a press fit?
Awesome machine you made here. Using the granite plates is a great idea , just dont drop anything on them.
I don't believe Dan is that sort of Dolt.
What an incredible machine. Thank you for explaining the engineering behind it.
@0:22 - Shots fired, look at him try to hold the smile back
@gacekky1 because he is working in metric and had to convert his measurements for for a special country to understand.
Wow, impressive precision! I've seen a lot of amazing travel destinations in my years of exploring, but I've never seen anything quite like this!
I am curious what kind of linear motion control you use for something this precise? is there a certain type of ballscrew or servo you used to build this? And are your hand controls digital so that the computer can compensate for backlash in the ballscrews even while manually jogging? Love the build btw!!!
Hi Dan, it is amazing to see how you talk about such levels of precision as if it is nothing! Very humbling experience, but what a joy to watch your video. Thanks so much for sharing, and of course I have signed on to your channel. Kind regards, Donald
It's an amazing lathe. I only try to make air bearings once, when i build a Tesla turbine, and i fail miserably. The tolerances have to be very tight.
You had a very clever solution to build the bed, does the viscosity of the epoxy affect the aligment of the parallels during the glueing? do you have to press the pieces with high pressure?
Noneed for pressure, the weight of the granite pushes out the excess epoxy. The parallels are kept in alignment during curing via a matched pair of precision steel spacers. Very slow setting epoxy is used.
+Dan Gelbart So it flows naturally. Thanks for sharing this video. It's an awesome lathe. I too like to engineer everything my self. Today I test a homemade forging die to make thick aluminum cones. And I didn't miss my calculations by much! Sometimes manufacturers make everything look like, but there is always some sort of way to do it yourself.
I just found this channel and already I'm in LOVE with the information and the presentation OF the information! Thank you for posting such interesting information! (I've already subbed and will of course thumb UP every video as I watch them!)
Like my Harbor Freight lathe, tight tolerance 😂😂😂
I think he did it just to make the rest of us look bad. That bastard! 😉
@@robertaugust7425 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Thanks,I am now suffering a debilitating case of lathe envy and the fact you built it from scratch. In total awe over here
Hi, Dan, amazing machine, thanks for shareing. I wonder if it is easier to build this type of lathe based on an existing precision manual lathe, by replacing the spindle with air bearing spindle, and reuse other existing parts on the lathe, if so, can you recommend a good manual lathe to start with? thanks,
The bed and cross slide of an existing lathe is not accurate enough. You need 1um straightness and squareness. . What you can do is buy a used Moore #3 Jig Borer (under $3000 on Ebay) and mount the spindle instead of column. Several companies who needed high accuracy machines did that.
Thanks, Dan, do you know any place I could source a nice air bearing spindle? I would like to turn max 200mm OD part on this lathe. Also, any requirements on the maximum spindle speed? the higher the better? Thanks.
Ebay. New ones cost a fortune. No need for high speed.
Dan, I watched this video again and I am again amazed, thrilled and delighted. And for some reason everything appears green!
Hi Dan
Do you have plans available?
Thanks Peter
I stumbled across this by looking up air bearings to better understand how Hyperloops would theoretically work. That is one hell of a DIY project!
That's a really nice machine. Would you care to estimate build cost?
Under 10 grand. The granite is from precisiongraniteusa.com, about $2500. Motors and sppeed controls from goldenmotor.com, about $500. Ball screws (C0) and air bearings are surplus, from Ebay. All electronis (stepper and microstepper drivers , power supplies, switches etc) from Ebay. A regular chuck shold be under $1000, mine is very specialized, all parts lapped to 1um.
Someone else mentioned this, so I came back and read it again. I am surprised to see you are using steppers. It seems to me that something more analogue would have suited your surface finish requirements better. I am a real fan of servos + resolvers (at eBay prices, I should add).
+andy pugh A stepper in microstepping mode, with a large number of microsteps per step, is as smooth as any brushless or synchronous motor.
That was very interesting, the build in particular is extremely impressive. What a clever man! More please.
3:36 - the sound...
pooop ....that was awesome
lol not normal toilet things
Lmaoooooo it's so satisfying
that air bearing is very interesting. 🤔 there is nothing like watching the air bearing in action compared to someone explaining the concept. 🥰 thanks smart Dan.
Hi Dan,
How do you take the axial load with radial air bearings?
There is also a thrust air bearing inside the headstock. It is a disc with air bearings on both sides.
thanks for the response! if you don't mind me asking are there any plans for more youtube videos?
@@chiquinhoreydelas Yes! One coming soon on metal 3D printing.
That's truly great news Dan, thank you so much for showing and teaching us these things that most of us would never been able to see in person!
@@dgelbart Hi Dan thank you very much for sharing. Is the spindle like a dover air bearing spindle that you mounted with an additional thrust air bearing? I assume you had to machine a custom mount for your chuck as well? It would be neat to see more information about the spindle. Thanks for sharing what you have regardless!
Keeping machines clean, well lubricated and gib strips tightly adjusted ensures accuracies.
In my 50 years of engineering I never saw anyone but myself adjust the gib strips on the sliding parts of machine tools.
This however is carried out every six months on machines in Japanese machine shops.
Hi Dan,
In one of your (fantastic) tutorial-videos, "part 16 of 18 Machining" th-cam.com/video/a_E-tYRxBkU/w-d-xo.html#t=8m40s , you mention adding a groove to the tip of a tight-fitting shaft to aid with self-aligning. How are you able to fit the piston in the cylinder at 0:48 without having made such a groove?
+Aditya Mehendale Very good observation. The cylinder bore has a bit of a lead in taper in this demo, but this is not always allowed. The groove is the right way of doing it, leaving a 1-2mm wide ring at tip. One other factor that helps on the demo is that both parts are very hard, this makes insertion much easier.
@@dgelbart Hello Dan, a colleague of mine has recently built a nice EDM machine as a side-project. He discusses a nice tip to get a wrapping-angle of >360 degree on a pulley here: th-cam.com/video/us3KhT7r01g/w-d-xo.html (Channel-name: TH-cam --> BAXEDM). I think you'll really like it (and the rest of his video-series too, if you have the time - Mike has 5 videos in the series thus far). Regards!
@@dgelbart Dan, I must absolutely implore you to watch this video (flextures cut on a homebrew-EDM) th-cam.com/video/CcTQoy_tBp4/w-d-xo.html
In rare occasions I’ve machined to tight tolerances like that on my Taiwanese machines. You know it’s right when it compresses air and floats like that. Those air bearings are beautifully quiet. Would love to have a build sheet for this where to locate the parts you’ve purchased.
I am now officially jealous.
I screwed up and retired without a lathe or mill, too busy doing repairs on the house and friends vehicles to invest the time and money you have here.
It sure is something to aspire too, if I ever catch up with what this house needs, this project looks like the one.
Just curious why didn't you use epoxy granite for the lathe bed? Is it less accurate?
How will you get it flat and straight to 1um?
Dan Gelbart www.precisionepoxy.com/PlateHome.htm
I was thinking something like this could be used.
airsoftsniper108 How do you get the vertical sidewalls? Also the spec on the epoxy you measured is 8um, not 1.
Dan Gelbart good point. Just curious,I am attempting to build myself a lathe (it doesn't have to be as accurate as the lathe you built) and I was wondering if epoxy granite could be substituted for the granite parallels that you used. Seeing as it's my first lathe build,I am bound to make mistakes,and getting expensive pieces of granite parallels would be very costly mistakes to make. Sorry for taking up so much of your time, and thanks for putting these videos on youtube, I have learned so much already.
airsoftsniper108 Lowest cost way to get a lathe is not building one but getting an old one on Ebay or Craigslist and fixing it up.
wow, just wow.. what does one have to do to get a skill set like that? And how much you've shared within 10 minutes is just mind-blowing. This is just.. wow..
+Tadas K. 10 minutes? ;) I'd recommend all 18 episodes, three times over, to make sure you don't miss any detail..
+Tadas K. If you have the interest, the skills will come over time. I didn't have the skills either when I was your age.
+Aditya Mehendale Did watch them all immediately, but this one still tops it :)
+Dan Gelbart Thank you for the reply. My formal education is along the lines of femtosecond laser micromachining, so now I'm trying to pick up mechanical design skills on my own. I hope you're right, but it will surely take a lot of time.. and expensive attempts.
skookum as frig
quick insert lion king quote "you have no idea"
Kawawaymog - A Cockford Ollie of the 21st century :D Also if some evil genius takes over the world I want him to sound just like this dude :D
AvE club
I see that you watch AVE
AvE
I can visualize this gentleman on the stage of an ampitheater full of toolmakers, tool & diemakers and general machinists, all listening raptly to one of his educational lectures about how to make a lunar vehicle that would fit on the head of pin.
Hi Dan, My name is Dale Derry. I have a youtube channel called Metal tips and tricks. About a month ago I mentioned you to my followers as a must see channel. Im so glad you did a new video please keep them coming.
P.s. Here is the name to the video I mentioned you in."How I learn Metal Working"
Hi Dale:
Thanka for mentioning me and for the good info on your channel.
Build Something Cool is this spam? Are you trying to make money?
Dan do you know someone who has a machine like this that could build a bearing like the one you show at the beginning of your video?
With this technology, you are dealing with accuracy/tolerances of almost the peaks and troughs of the atoms in a metalic lattice. I want one for my home. Lol
"Air bearings are very noisy"
Hmmhmm :D
We are so lucky to have this video, hopefully forever!
I thought my lathe was good..
Omg! Woow! Making repeatition of accuracy looking so much easy! Thank you for the big motivation!!
Totally porn .. I m jaleus with this machine, comparing to my hardinge lathe..
@@CBRFFan what do you mean with resolution? The reason I ask is that resulotion and actual accuracy are different things. After looking at their site for one of their modern machines the resolution on the glass scales is 0.01 micron, drives are 0.1 micron and it results in a accuracy of 2-3.5 micron in X/Z
@@CBRFFan I don't think so. Make a part with your lathe and then compare it on a AA surface plate with gauge blocks. See if you're within 0.1micron. My cheap caliper shows down to 10micron but the accuracy is 25micron (1thou). My micron glass scale has an accuracy of 2microns. So what you see on your display is not what you get
Micrometers that read in 0,01mm are sometimes calibrated with 0,001mm accuracy. Something that is reading in 0,001 or better may as well be 10 times worse than the reading. At any rate that accuracy requires flooding the whole machine body and screws especially with temp controlled cooling oil. If it doesn't have that, it's impossible to be so accurate consistently
Thank you for your videos Dan!
You have a great deal of knowledge and the fact that you are willing to share that with others on a ‘not for profit’ basis is very inspiring!
Only thing I regret is that didn’t find your videos about 4 years ago when I started on my prototype/manufacturing journey!!
Well done my friend and please keep uploading these very informative videos if you can manage to fit them into your busy schedule.
Thank you 🙏
I am dazzled by this mans brilliance. What an amazing machine!
Thanks again Dr Gelbart - for this and all your vids. Awe inspiring and full of knowledge, so refreshing! Thank you!
Unbelievable. Thank you for the window into your shop and mind
This is the first time I have seen or heard of air bearings. Thank you for the video
I would love to know more detail of the spindle bearings in the headstock (i.e. model no.) to give some idea of what to look for. Amazing machine!
Just place a permanent search on Ebay for "air bearing". They show up all the time. You need a large one, at least 5"x5"x5". The larger the better.
@@dgelbart thank you Dan, appreciate the reply.
More videos on this would be awesome! Making an air bearing part would make my day!
A masterpiece of ingenuity and excellence!
At 6:18 you show your internal grinding adaptors, on which there seems to be a number of fast helical patterns in the stone surface, what advantage does this bring to the work and how is it made?
I wasn't getting the accuracy I wanted (sub micron) and I suspected that coolant needed escape channels as wheel OD was close to ground ID. Not sure if it helped, chnnels put in by hand with diamond wheel.
What position feedback technology are you using, with ball screws, piezoelectrics, linear motors or other? What drove the selection?
Just ball screws. In these kind of jobs the main thing is the geometry (squareness, parallelism etc). Exact position less critical, unless you cut tapers and spheres.
I'm impressed. I also design myself a lathe CNC machine but with a cast iron bed. It is a pity that I can not come to visit and see everything with my own eyes.
I had a bunch of questions but I'm distracted at the moment finding my jaw after it hit the floor. Wow, what a machine!
You Mr.Gelbart , are one amazing man. Thank You for sharing some of your knowledge and expertise.
Extraordinary, thank you very much for the true definition of precision-exceptionally well done✅
Crazy awesome! Great to see there are so many others that appreciate your work here. Good job!- Outstanding
Wow, I didn't even know grinding wheels on a lathe where a thing. IT makes so much sense!
This takes DIY to a new level. How do you make the precision inner bore of the air bearing cylinder? I understand the grinder for outer surfaces, but how do you do inner surfaces if the grinder wheel doesn't fit inside the bore? Do you have a small inner grinder wheel attachment that works with this lathe?
Yes, the smaller grinding wheels are shown in the video,
That air bearing at the beginning was just sealed in air. Super simple, why is this frictionless bearing not available in smaller format from a shop?
They are, but they are expensive and need a supply of compressed air.
if you had another female cylinder at the other end of the rod (nipple could be on the female ones) and kept them moderately compressed would the air leek out eventually, because it seemed trapped?
@@cyber_Dean Yes.
thought so. There is a seal made by levitex I wonder if that could aid a sealed air bearing?? would be a first! Great videos btw, always interesting ++
I can't express my joy in words. I hope we can convince you to do a more detailed design overview of the different components. I could listen to you discuss building machines to micron accuracy for a year straight!
Hi Mr. Gelbart, thx for this awesome video, too. I'd like to see more videos about this lathe, more so I'd like to build my own. Couple of questions:
1. What's the inner/outer diameter of your spindle shaft? Stainless steel?
2. Did you use thrust bearings for the spindle/tailstock? If not, what did you use to limit axial motion?
3. How is the cross slide fixed in position? Radial air bearings from both sides? Vacuum preloaded ones?
4. I understand all of the air bearing components have to be made to very tight tolerances. How does it react to temperature fluctuations?
Spindle air bearing about 100mm dia x150mm long, plus trust bearing (double sided) about 150mm diameter. spindle is 440 stainless, about Rc 45, mating bearing bronze. About 100 air orifices.
Mating bearing? What's that for?
I meant the actual sleeve the shaft rides in.
What a thing of beauty! Thank you so much for sharing! Great ideas on the implementation!