I hope it is easier to get to than the rear main. The way that engine was rocking, I would say motor mounts as well. Does that car have the oil-filled ones?
@@calholli Err, lots of old cars have headlight wipers too? It's a legal requirement to have some kind of cleaning system (usualy just high pressure water jet) in the EU if you have HID or LED headlights.
The new rear main seal comes with a removable plastic clip that holds the seal in the correct place for installation . You just have to make sure the engine is at TDC . I would charge the 6 hours spent to diagnose.
It's easy to mount the reluctor ring without the special tool, all you have to do is time the front pulley (small notch with the arrow from timing cover and camshaft in the right position).After that gearbox off , 3 screws for removing the main seal with the ring, put the new ring with the Orange clip in place and press it carefully! It will be eniugh for the car to be in sync! After that adjust the torque setting from the three screws from the camshaft sproket, 0degrees KW but depends on the car mileage, my Best rezultă where between 1 degree 2 degrees positive deviation. Best wishes!!🎉
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics yes it would probably have been the first question i would have asked the customer. But thats just because of experience, we see these engines alot more over here than you do. In the end you figured it out! Great job as always Ivan
Im happy to see that you got some direction from Keith, Chris, and Hans, but if you read the comments from part 1 some of the comments suggested that the rear main was the culprit. A lot of us out here do know a thing or two also, granted we may not have TH-cam channels for whatever reason. And I can assure you, in this trade you have never seen it all, there will always be something to surprise you and to learn by.
He did all of this in one straight day dude. He just broke the video up into two segments after he was finished. He wouldn't have seen the comments in time even of he did read them.
@@mandytuning yeah not still wearing a winter jacket but I think the problem video before this he was.. this could be the end of April for all we know... I never heard of that.. I would have still thought that it would chug a bit anyway and he never shot it with starting fluid.. it was an interesting problem I wonder how far off timing actually was
I like your comment " A lot of us out here do know a thing or two also, granted we may not have a You Tube channels for whatever reason". I can relate to that.
Commentors on part 1 nailed it! And they even said it should start with the cam sensor disconnected if the crank sensor was timed correctly. Well it wasn't, and it didn't. Of course you shot parts 1 and 2 at the same time and didn't have the benefit of the comments. Another entertaining detective story from you, Ivan! Thanks!
There was a comment in part 1 video that you needed to check that very scenario. There are some really smart people that make comments to your videos and I learned a lot from them as well!! Nice work Ivan and thanks to Keith and his support people !!!!!
If im not familiar with a system. I would of charged what I believe it would have taken if I understood the system going into before hand. In a situation like you were in where you weren’t familiar, i treat it as a learning experience. Yeah, sure im at a loss on that job because of the amount of time, but i learned something, not only will that help me on future diagnostics and to think a little more outside the box when im stuck in some other situation. But me personally i absolutely love the hardest diags to solve. They maybe not the best sometimes for profitability, but i love that feeling after figuring it out.
If you made a special trip just for them, you should have a pre-agreed upon price for that. You spent 6 hours figuring out their problem, charge them for the 6 hours. The bottom line is that the issue is figured out, and they know what needs to be done to get the car to run.
Basically VW should be charged for the whole issue. But this also tells us that anything done to the engine before installation should be listed so each point could be checked for relevance. Then I definitely question the decision to have a crank position sensor on the rear main seal. To me it would make more sense to have the position sensor at the other end of the engine in a more accessible location like on the timing belt crank sprocket since sensors sometimes goes bad.
@@ehsnils VW is part of Audi. Some Audi engines put the timing chain on the back of the engine so you have to pull the engine to change the timing chain. Can you think of a worse idea than that?
@@NotFastEddieFord did the same thing on the 4.6 engine for a while. They mirrored and flipped the passenger-side cylinder head so you had one coming chain in the front on the passenger side and one on the back of the driver side. I had a customer who didn't time the driver side correctly when he did timing chains and couldn't figure out why it didn't run well. I promise you it's not engineers, it's bean counters. Ford only had to make one camshaft and 1 cylinder head for both sides. I'm sure Audi had a cost cutting reason why LOL
Nice work man! Major kudos for you coming in on the second half of these jobs, not knowing what has been messed with before you even got there. Excellent case study for the old adage of “my labor rate is higher if you worked on it first!” 😂
Mind blown 🤯 Right now! , I just watched Eric O spend hours on a Mini back up light issue just to find out the car only is made to just have one backup light
Yes, that idea was completely lame by Mini. All those stupid engineers (writers of service manuals) had to do was to have a footnote ONLY ONE BU LIGHT, RT REAR.
Someone said that was the problem in part 1 in the comment section.Hey you can't be expected to fix all situations all of the time you perservered & actually finally found what the problem was albeit with some help from experts. Alot of people would have thrown their hands up & walked away you mate (asI have said previously) the consumate professional Cheers & be proud.
Just to be fair...he couldn't have read the comments in Part 1 in time to stop and check on the Rear Main Seal. He did this all I'm one day then went back and split up the video in two days for us.
@@TheFrenchPug True plus he was at it for six hours most of us would at the end of our ropes by then I know I would be I would have had to stop & unfry my brain for at least 12 hours then do some research.Cheers.
What do you mean, "How do you charge for this?" Dude, you are going to need to quit agonizing over charging people. It's simple: 6 x $150.00 plus your windshield time. Don't forget to treat Keith and those other people to a nice dinner. GREAT VIDEO!
As I said. Crankshaft inductor/sealant wheel wast installed properly with special tools and in DTC blocked with special tools 😄😁😂 next time feel free to write me. I working with V.A.G vehicles a lot😉 but great job. 👌🏻👍🏻
Bingo 😂😂, first time for me with the same issue, was a vw polo 1.4. At that time I worked at the dealership in 2000, i had to replace a engine. Under warranty. A stripped engine without pistons, seals, etc. Crank no start 😂😂, took me a lot of time to figure out what was going on. Good job Iwan! 👌👍
I feel that spark keeping such people out of giving up. Actually I wouldn’t sleep properly when a diagnostic ain’t done. That keeps me thinking over and over until I figure an issue out. It’s kinda an addiction 😁
I saw that comment yesterday. I discounted it as it seemed ludicrous that a rear main seal was anything but that and had no sway over timing. I am truly astounded. A fing electronic plug on a rear main seal housing. ?? Wow… German engineering is one bizarre experiment.
Wow. Great video. Gotta call this one a "Training Day", same as if you went to a seminar. Charge as you would the day AFTER the training day; probably 1. travel time, 2. an hour to run the cam/crank waveform on the Pico, 3. lunch.
Ha almost every day is "training day" at PHAD! People often bring quirky cars with quirky problems that no one has been able to figure out, often for several months or years, with thousands of dollars and countless hours already invested! If I didn't charge by the hour on these bizarre cases, I couldn't sustain my business 😅
You have to have people you can call on! Great find Ivan! Do you have access to the pico library or the IATN waveform library? Good to have access to their libraries of waveforms for times like these! As far as what to bill?…Bill it all out! Travel time too! Shoot, $800-1000 in diagnostic to be spot on the money is oh so often cheaper than the parts cannon! BILL IT OUT! This car may have rotted in the grass if it weren’t for you! And my gosh VW does some weird-ass shiz!😂✌️
Ivan. I am also blown away by your fix. Who "wodda thunk it!" ha, ha, a. That was certainly weird. Enjoyed it - all the way through. And, yes, "that poor starter." :-)
Leave it up to German technology to screw up a simple way for the crank sensor to pick up the signal! This is why I don't own a German vehicle! Thank you Ivan for this video.
Having seen the comments about the rear main seal in part 1 this was extremely frustrating to watch!! If only he unplugged the crank sensor and tried cranking. That would have gotten him on the right track.
I was frustrated that he had the glow plug out but didn't put a pressure sensor on there which would have shown where actual TDC was in relation to the cam and crank. This would have given the game away too.
I'm honestly surprised that the guy that replaced the rear main seal didn't even mention that it had a sensor. I figured that would be a good piece of information to give you. Lol
@@LesReeves I could understand not knowing how it works or what it's used for. That said, a rear main seal with wires attached to it is pretty abnormal and worth mentioning. Especially since they replaced it. Lol
@@RK-kn1ud I understand that but without the exact information they figured there was no special way it had to be placed it happens when you are DIYing things & VWs are notorious for not having manuals readily available. Just an observation. Cheers.
@@LesReeves I totally understand not installing it correctly as well... especially because that isn't exactly common knowledge. I figured the guy could have just said "BTW, the rear main seal was replaced and we thought it was strange that it had wires attached to it...just worth noting". That probably would have reduced the diagnostic time by 80%!
I think there's a few Japanese engines like that with the rear main seal too. Pretty sure this has been discussed on the Iatn. But once you know, you know. Next time the question will be asked, did you use the required tool to replace that seal? If the answer is no, a lot of time will be saved by everybody involved.
Helo Ivan As you just showed Diagnostics can be very humbling. You stuck with it and appear to have found the probable cause of the no start. Charge accordingly. If the replacement of the rear main seal does not correct the no start condition offer a partial refund. You might want to lower your usual rate a little. When I checked for the P0341 code it came back clearly indicating both Camshaft and Crankshaft position sensors as possible causes.Very interesting case keep the great videos coming. PS. Even with all your diagnostic skill it is nice to have friends and colleagues willing to share their knowledge.
Since your not familiar with vw your first move with the code p0341 it's get a know good wave form , that better for saving a starter! No matter what here was about infos (what been done when they make the swap and knowing all about the timing on 1.9 tdi ) We call that learning & experience .
hi are them boys names youtubers...i have to say very well done on the volkwagen i have one to. thanks for the tip. it doesent matter who you got the info of at the end of the day you fixed the car. i sure if your friends ran into a bit of trouble you be there for them. Well done
Learned a lot from this video as pine hollow always says always do a full health report, always study wireing Diagrams, always check tsb And the blogs on line before Starting the diag lots of info In the blogs about this problem great job great video excellence is not easy 👍👍👍👍👍👍
Take the front timing cover Off to install a special tool On the front gear at TDC. Take the transmission out. Put a special tool on the new rear main use a micrometer to make sure the gear is in the right position and then put it all back together. Crazy just crazy the installer is going 🤪 nuts😫😫😫😫 almost forgot drop the oil pan too!
Im still suprized at the guy who instaled the rear main seal,having an electrical connection/marks on the rear main seal did not ring a single bell in him
This is why people should question getting involved with the car repair world. Never in a million years would I ever think a rear main seal would cause an engine to not start. Crazy times indeed.
Vw is very picky on timing,both cam and crank,in the first video you said they replaced the fly wheel,my it’s thoughts were ,I hope they did not disturb the timing wheel,and it was,and it needs to be spot on,interesting video,you learned something today,I learned something from you also,I’m going to start using the scope before I touch any timing jobs,so I have it’s reference in case it won’t start after.
Another reason a shop needs service info. This all could have been avoided if instructions were read and understood. Also, even a DIY might have looked at that seal and thought this is way different, maybe I better check into this.
Ivan, I've done dozens of cambelt changes on the 1.9 & 2.0 TDI VAG engines and had to time the injection pump sprocket with the crank and camshaft sprockets especially on the common rail injection systems. I recollect the older 1.9 TDI also had to have the injection pump in time. Put # 1 cylinder on TDC and check that the injection pump is actually in time against VAG assembly instructions. Good luck!
if they (owner not shop) waited 4years they can definitely pay you for all your time since it was their install that made a working engine stop working. Definitely a learning experience to ask about everything they mucked about with no matter how unlikely the issue when everything else was on spec the weirdness is the answer. Great digging as always!
Well this is some good knowledge to have if/when I need to replace the rear seal in my TDI. Finally replaced the timing belt after car sat in corner of shop, going on nearly two years..fired up as quickly as I turned the key! Total relief there were no bent valves! Excellent videos! 👍👍💯🇺🇸
What a complete ball ache. I'm surprised there wasn't stuff online about this. Is this type of set up unique to VW? A lot of mechanics would have given up, well done for persevering.
Ivan, about charging, I would say it depends on the circumstances; what agreement you have with the customer, what communication you had with the customer, how things went down, etc. For example, if you at some point told the customer that it is taking a long time and will be expensive and the customer told you to continue, then just charge the diagnostics time. Another example, sometimes I have worked on diagnosing an issue (not cars) and then being stubborn and curios and not wanting to admit defeat I spent a lot of hours on it, a lot more than I should have done before at least informing the customer and giving them a chance to make a decision on how to proceed. On those occasions the customer got a very significant discount. What I am saying is that you should charge what is fair and that you have to be the judge of what that is.
Well done ivan had similar on Mazda done a cambelt change would not start after hours wasted it was my fault the stater plate could go on in two ways. Before I had a scope all these new ideas are not helpful all looking good for future mechanic clad my time is coming to the end. great videos thank you
You earned every bit of time spent diagnosing that car !! Even Ross Tech had little information. However a big red flag to the installer would be the design of the crank sensor. I've never done a rear main or sensor on that particular engine but looking at that crazy setup would make me take a look at service data
Great perseverance, Ivan! I am very curious how you ended up charging the customer. I think I would split the cost with the customer (3 hours diagnosis, 3 hours "education" for yourself.) Looking forward to possible follow-up! 😊
yeah I agree, some sort of update... i feel like we got left hangin... he should have fixed the seal timing for us, this is a youtube show you know, making money on the episodes, not off the customers ;0)
Ahh yes, had a friend of mine run into the same issue and had to check timing and installation of the rear main seal but keep in mind it was in a VW Amarok, so sure enough VW uses this style of seal in many other products.
How to Bill for this???? Easy....Charge your regular rate, per hour. And charge the travel fee. BUT, TO BE REALISTIC, SUBTRACT FROM THE TOTAL, THE COST TO REMOVE AND REPLACE THE STARTER. The Original work on the rear seal was done neither carefully nor correctly......Hard to blame anyone.....Goofy Design.....Sad but true. You are the BEST, because you Never Give In! You are a shining example of how everyone should perform. "Poor Starter" omggg!
Well, I admire your persistence Ivan. Euro cars and Japanese cars are getting more and more complicated. All we can hope to do, is to keep learning. You did everything right for a less technical vehicle, but these Euro manufacturers will always throw a spanner in the works. Good to have Euro experts on call, otherwise you may have been stumped, who woulda thunk it, a timed rear main seal LOL. I have a BMW 330D SE 2010 and a glow plug failed, and immediately threw a blocked DPF code, and would not perform a regen. So I replaced the glow plug, but the blocked DPF code persisted, and no regen. I had to buy BMW software to reset the adaptations and reset the DPF fault before a regen could take place. But, even so, I do love my Beemer.Good luck with the knowledge gained.
Range Rover uses the exact same type of tone ring for the abs sensors found on the bearing wheel bearing seals, Install one backwards NO ABS signal, Much easier because timing isn't involved but still needs to be installed correctly, It's cheaper to build shit this way meaning without actual mechanical steel teeth, Just a pain in the Ass for unsuspecting Techs. This By far the most useful You Tube Car repair Channel for people who are TOTALLY stumped potentially 🇺🇸👍
An add on to my first comment I worked on ONE VW & had to buy a SST just to remove the brake pedal from the booster thats when I decided never again to work on newer VWs.
Oh my gosh rear main seal timing. I would not have considered or even believed it, except Ivan thought, the magnet is the only secret sauce of timing? Well no you have to time the rear main seal. I still disbelieve this scenario. But was done. I want to hear this run.
I would charge a full day no doubt and at that it is a screaming deal for the customer. That car has been down for 4 years? That starter is an MVP. Also, you had to engage your life line (Keith) and extended team to solve this.
"The rear main seal wasn't timed correctly" - something I never thought I'd hear
All the respect for that starter !
Yeah! Poor thing stood all that cranking without a glitch.
I hope it is easier to get to than the rear main. The way that engine was rocking, I would say motor mounts as well. Does that car have the oil-filled ones?
😆😆😆
@@lvsqcsl no they're not. It's rocking due to pd engine's high compression ratio once it gets running it smooths out
I hate it when I forget to time my rear main seal.... VW sure knows how to make something over complicated.
In five years we will checking for powers and grounds to your rear main seal
When you shower tonight, check your shower head timing, could have bad or no flow. LOL.
I've seen euro trash with literal wipers on their headlights/ blinkers assembly.
They took the "blinker fluid" joke and made it a reality. smh.
@@calholli Err, lots of old cars have headlight wipers too? It's a legal requirement to have some kind of cleaning system (usualy just high pressure water jet) in the EU if you have HID or LED headlights.
@@calholli that's a tiiiiiiny bit ignorant
The new rear main seal comes with a removable plastic clip that holds the seal in the correct place for installation . You just have to make sure the engine is at TDC .
I would charge the 6 hours spent to diagnose.
They should get the money back spent diagnosing the car from the engine installer. It's not the customer's fault or Ivan's.
Lack of reading on the guy who installed it! Yes. I'd like to know how he charges!
@@TheFrenchPug agree👍
Is there a way to confirm the seal timing signal without pulling the tranny?
It's easy to mount the reluctor ring without the special tool, all you have to do is time the front pulley (small notch with the arrow from timing cover and camshaft in the right position).After that gearbox off , 3 screws for removing the main seal with the ring, put the new ring with the Orange clip in place and press it carefully! It will be eniugh for the car to be in sync! After that adjust the torque setting from the three screws from the camshaft sproket, 0degrees KW but depends on the car mileage, my Best rezultă where between 1 degree 2 degrees positive deviation. Best wishes!!🎉
Mr. Keith the magician came through. This needs to be put on the book of knowledge in RED LETTERS!
Ha ha classic. Experience is key here. You'll never forget Ivan.
Absolutely right Dan! Have you seen this issue in your shop on the TDI?
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics yes it would probably have been the first question i would have asked the customer. But thats just because of experience, we see these engines alot more over here than you do. In the end you figured it out! Great job as always Ivan
Im happy to see that you got some direction from Keith, Chris, and Hans, but if you read the comments from part 1 some of the comments suggested that the rear main was the culprit. A lot of us out here do know a thing or two also, granted we may not have TH-cam channels for whatever reason. And I can assure you, in this trade you have never seen it all, there will always be something to surprise you and to learn by.
He did all of this in one straight day dude. He just broke the video up into two segments after he was finished. He wouldn't have seen the comments in time even of he did read them.
Probably he did the video a month ago
@@mandytuning yeah not still wearing a winter jacket but I think the problem video before this he was.. this could be the end of April for all we know... I never heard of that.. I would have still thought that it would chug a bit anyway and he never shot it with starting fluid.. it was an interesting problem I wonder how far off timing actually was
SMH. You think this is all live?
I like your comment " A lot of us out here do know a thing or two also, granted we may not have a You Tube channels for whatever reason".
I can relate to that.
Commentors on part 1 nailed it! And they even said it should start with the cam sensor disconnected if the crank sensor was timed correctly. Well it wasn't, and it didn't.
Of course you shot parts 1 and 2 at the same time and didn't have the benefit of the comments.
Another entertaining detective story from you, Ivan! Thanks!
What a crazy situation. Glad you had access to a community of repair gurus. Thanks for posting your amazing vids.
There was a comment in part 1 video that you needed to check that very scenario. There are some really smart people that make comments to your videos and I learned a lot from them as well!!
Nice work Ivan and thanks to Keith and his support people !!!!!
@@DaveSender66Exactly!
If im not familiar with a system. I would of charged what I believe it would have taken if I understood the system going into before hand. In a situation like you were in where you weren’t familiar, i treat it as a learning experience. Yeah, sure im at a loss on that job because of the amount of time, but i learned something, not only will that help me on future diagnostics and to think a little more outside the box when im stuck in some other situation. But me personally i absolutely love the hardest diags to solve. They maybe not the best sometimes for profitability, but i love that feeling after figuring it out.
If you made a special trip just for them, you should have a pre-agreed upon price for that.
You spent 6 hours figuring out their problem, charge them for the 6 hours.
The bottom line is that the issue is figured out, and they know what needs to be done to get the car to run.
Basically VW should be charged for the whole issue.
But this also tells us that anything done to the engine before installation should be listed so each point could be checked for relevance.
Then I definitely question the decision to have a crank position sensor on the rear main seal. To me it would make more sense to have the position sensor at the other end of the engine in a more accessible location like on the timing belt crank sprocket since sensors sometimes goes bad.
@@ehsnils VW is part of Audi. Some Audi engines put the timing chain on the back of the engine so you have to pull the engine to change the timing chain. Can you think of a worse idea than that?
@@NotFastEddie Starter in the intake valley where it gets heat baked like the Cadillac Northstar?
@@NotFastEddieFord did the same thing on the 4.6 engine for a while. They mirrored and flipped the passenger-side cylinder head so you had one coming chain in the front on the passenger side and one on the back of the driver side. I had a customer who didn't time the driver side correctly when he did timing chains and couldn't figure out why it didn't run well. I promise you it's not engineers, it's bean counters. Ford only had to make one camshaft and 1 cylinder head for both sides. I'm sure Audi had a cost cutting reason why LOL
@@crashoverride328those are good paying jobs lol. I've done quite a few of those.
Nice work man! Major kudos for you coming in on the second half of these jobs, not knowing what has been messed with before you even got there.
Excellent case study for the old adage of “my labor rate is higher if you worked on it first!” 😂
Been there for six hours, and that guy STILL hasn't finished mowing the lawn...😆
Mind blown 🤯 Right now! , I just watched Eric O spend hours on a Mini back up light issue just to find out the car only is made to just have one backup light
Are you freaking serious? That has to be an ass kicker once he found out.
Quite common on European cars to have a rear fog on one side and reverse on the other.
🤣🤣🤣
LOL. I saw that one also... The other light was a rear fog light. Once you know, you know!!
Yes, that idea was completely lame by Mini. All those stupid engineers (writers of service manuals) had to do was to have a footnote ONLY ONE BU LIGHT, RT REAR.
yikes, what a pain..yes in part 1 someone commented on the rear seal timing..glad you solved the puzzle and we got to see the journey..
Charge accordingly for your time! Do not sell yourself short!
Someone said that was the problem in part 1 in the comment section.Hey you can't be expected to fix all situations all of the time you perservered & actually finally found what the problem was albeit with some help from experts. Alot of people would have thrown their hands up & walked away you mate (asI have said previously) the consumate professional Cheers & be proud.
Just to be fair...he couldn't have read the comments in Part 1 in time to stop and check on the Rear Main Seal. He did this all I'm one day then went back and split up the video in two days for us.
@@TheFrenchPug True plus he was at it for six hours most of us would at the end of our ropes by then I know I would be I would have had to stop & unfry my brain for at least 12 hours then do some research.Cheers.
@@LesReeves Good point. 6 hours battling with your scanner...no way!!!
What do you mean, "How do you charge for this?" Dude, you are going to need to quit agonizing over charging people. It's simple: 6 x $150.00 plus your windshield time. Don't forget to treat Keith and those other people to a nice dinner. GREAT VIDEO!
That's INSANE!!! Great diagnosis, Ivan! Glad you called in reinforcements!
I checked multiple times awaiting this part 2, you didn’t disappoint me!
This was wackier than I could have imagined!
It's a taste of what's to come in modern cars, but years earlier from the Germans :)
Part was a kicker! 👻
There is only one way to describe this.....
GOT FUCKING DAMN!!!!!!
Ivan, your perseverance is admirable.
As I said. Crankshaft inductor/sealant wheel wast installed properly with special tools and in DTC blocked with special tools 😄😁😂 next time feel free to write me. I working with V.A.G vehicles a lot😉 but great job. 👌🏻👍🏻
Bingo 😂😂, first time for me with the same issue, was a vw polo 1.4. At that time I worked at the dealership in 2000, i had to replace a engine. Under warranty. A stripped engine without pistons, seals, etc. Crank no start 😂😂, took me a lot of time to figure out what was going on. Good job Iwan! 👌👍
Every day's a school day Ivan - great work
I feel that spark keeping such people out of giving up. Actually I wouldn’t sleep properly when a diagnostic ain’t done. That keeps me thinking over and over until I figure an issue out. It’s kinda an addiction 😁
Oh dear, every day is a school day Ivan 💪💪💪
You are the Great mechanic I ever seent but finally u find the problem I wish the best
I saw that comment yesterday. I discounted it as it seemed ludicrous that a rear main seal was anything but that and had no sway over timing.
I am truly astounded.
A fing electronic plug on a rear main seal housing. ??
Wow…
German engineering is one bizarre experiment.
Hans is the best vw guy I know of. He goes above and beyond to collect data
Unreal, this is where we lose our tail end when it comes to diagnoses fee.... At least you found the answers :)
Love to get 1 hour of him and his computer and 5 questions ❤
Wow! Wow! That is enough to blow your mind!
I love the journey to get to this point, learned a lot!!! Glad you got it running
Even tho you were there for 6 hours, you still properly diagnosed it. Crazy what the issues was lol.
Well, we hope he diagnosed it. Did the installer say he didn't pay attention when he installed the seal?
Wow. Great video. Gotta call this one a "Training Day", same as if you went to a seminar. Charge as you would the day AFTER the training day; probably 1. travel time, 2. an hour to run the cam/crank waveform on the Pico, 3. lunch.
Ha almost every day is "training day" at PHAD! People often bring quirky cars with quirky problems that no one has been able to figure out, often for several months or years, with thousands of dollars and countless hours already invested! If I didn't charge by the hour on these bizarre cases, I couldn't sustain my business 😅
Just when you thought you couldn't despise an engineer anymore than you already do.
You have to have people you can call on! Great find Ivan! Do you have access to the pico library or the IATN waveform library? Good to have access to their libraries of waveforms for times like these!
As far as what to bill?…Bill it all out! Travel time too! Shoot, $800-1000 in diagnostic to be spot on the money is oh so often cheaper than the parts cannon! BILL IT OUT! This car may have rotted in the grass if it weren’t for you!
And my gosh VW does some weird-ass shiz!😂✌️
Good man Keith without him you would be lost everyone would be lost I've never ever heard of a rubber seal being a pickup for a sensor that's crazy.
Fascinating, thank goodness you had the kind of access you did to specialized expertise!
Wow, the stuff that throws you. Kinda like those keyless crankshafts and their tricks. Good one Ivan. Thanks!
Ivan. I am also blown away by your fix. Who "wodda thunk it!" ha, ha, a. That was certainly weird. Enjoyed it - all the way through. And, yes, "that poor starter." :-)
Excellent job I am proud of you and your work keep going life is short your wife needs a shout-out also thanks to friends that support !!!
Leave it up to German technology to screw up a simple way for the crank sensor to pick up the signal! This is why I don't own a German vehicle!
Thank you Ivan for this video.
Having seen the comments about the rear main seal in part 1 this was extremely frustrating to watch!! If only he unplugged the crank sensor and tried cranking. That would have gotten him on the right track.
I was frustrated that he had the glow plug out but didn't put a pressure sensor on there which would have shown where actual TDC was in relation to the cam and crank. This would have given the game away too.
You do realise he didn't get to read the comments in part 1 whilst he was on this job, right? This was all videoed in one day.
Thanks for sharing your knowledge! People don’t understand how important sharing is ! Keep up the good work ☮️Houston Texas
I'm honestly surprised that the guy that replaced the rear main seal didn't even mention that it had a sensor. I figured that would be a good piece of information to give you. Lol
He most likely didn't know.
@@LesReeves I could understand not knowing how it works or what it's used for. That said, a rear main seal with wires attached to it is pretty abnormal and worth mentioning. Especially since they replaced it. Lol
@@RK-kn1ud I understand that but without the exact information they figured there was no special way it had to be placed it happens when you are DIYing things & VWs are notorious for not having manuals readily available. Just an observation. Cheers.
@@LesReeves I totally understand not installing it correctly as well... especially because that isn't exactly common knowledge.
I figured the guy could have just said "BTW, the rear main seal was replaced and we thought it was strange that it had wires attached to it...just worth noting". That probably would have reduced the diagnostic time by 80%!
@@RK-kn1ud Yeah a relavent point but I think in part 1 they told Ivan it had been replaced I might be wrong I would have to re-watch part 1.
I think there's a few Japanese engines like that with the rear main seal too. Pretty sure this has been discussed on the Iatn. But once you know, you know. Next time the question will be asked, did you use the required tool to replace that seal? If the answer is no, a lot of time will be saved by everybody involved.
Make sure to time the muffler bearing on your Volkswagen!!!!
...whahaha 😝 . These Vührer Wagens are something. 🙈
Helo Ivan As you just showed Diagnostics can be very humbling. You stuck with it and appear to have found the probable cause of the no start. Charge accordingly. If the replacement of the rear main seal does not correct the no start condition offer a partial refund. You might want to lower your usual rate a little. When I checked for the P0341 code it came back clearly indicating both Camshaft and Crankshaft position sensors as possible causes.Very interesting case keep the great videos coming. PS. Even with all your diagnostic skill it is nice to have friends and colleagues willing to share their knowledge.
Since your not familiar with vw your first move with the code p0341 it's get a know good wave form , that better for saving a starter! No matter what here was about infos (what been done when they make the swap and knowing all about the timing on 1.9 tdi ) We call that learning & experience .
This car would of been a good car to get ahold of Charles aka The Humble Mechanic. All he does is VW and is extremely knowledgeable about them.
My guess was something with the glow plugs. Boy was I wrong!
VW
I'd never ever come close to a guess like that - crazy stuff !
Just amazes me even more you found the problem
hi are them boys names youtubers...i have to say very well done on the volkwagen i have one to. thanks for the tip. it doesent matter who you got the info of at the end of the day you fixed the car. i sure if your friends ran into a bit of trouble you be there for them. Well done
Probably a flat rate fee would be fair. You truly earned every minute with this mystery! Good job hanging in there!
That's a new one for me, thanks for sharing Ivan.
Learned a lot from this video as pine hollow always says always do a full health report, always study wireing
Diagrams, always check tsb
And the blogs on line before
Starting the diag lots of info
In the blogs about this problem great job great video excellence is not easy
👍👍👍👍👍👍
oh for the days of points and spark plugs and "No" sensors... exc job as always
Thank you for share your knowledge!
Very well tried sir ..but of no joy ..but hats of respect for hard trying ....and gaining knowledge....for us too ..thks
Always great video for the mechanic world and we all learned something. Pls post a short video with it running, thx Ivan.
Take the front timing cover
Off to install a special tool
On the front gear at TDC.
Take the transmission out.
Put a special tool on the new rear main use a micrometer to make sure the gear is in the right position and then put it all back together. Crazy just crazy the installer is going
🤪 nuts😫😫😫😫 almost forgot drop the oil pan too!
Im still suprized at the guy who instaled the rear main seal,having an electrical connection/marks on the rear main seal did not ring a single bell in him
Exactly. I guess some people aren't curious enough to question anything.
This is why people should question getting involved with the car repair world. Never in a million years would I ever think a rear main seal would cause an engine to not start. Crazy times indeed.
crayz ill keep this in the back of my head for future ref thanks Ivan
Invaluable having a "GROUP Network" to troubleshoot and diagnose these types of issues!! Team effort!! Merci
Vw is very picky on timing,both cam and crank,in the first video you said they replaced the fly wheel,my it’s thoughts were ,I hope they did not disturb the timing wheel,and it was,and it needs to be spot on,interesting video,you learned something today,I learned something from you also,I’m going to start using the scope before I touch any timing jobs,so I have it’s reference in case it won’t start after.
These are the jobs you learn the most from......sometimes you bite the 🐻🐻 and sometimes the🐻🐻bites you. Kudos for sticking it out to the end.
What a great lesson VW ...
Another reason a shop needs service info. This all could have been avoided if instructions were read and understood. Also, even a DIY might have looked at that seal and thought this is way different, maybe I better check into this.
You can always read your Haynes Workshop manual!
You just blow my mind mate excellent!
Amazing find! I would charge travel time plus hours spent. Without your work there is no direction..
That's just crazy! But we learn something new every day, and man, was this one a learning experience. I hope we get to hear it run.😂
Ivan, I've done dozens of cambelt changes on the 1.9 & 2.0 TDI VAG engines and had to time the injection pump sprocket with the crank and camshaft sprockets especially on the common rail injection systems. I recollect the older 1.9 TDI also had to have the injection pump in time. Put # 1 cylinder on TDC and check that the injection pump is actually in time against VAG assembly instructions. Good luck!
This is a PD engine, no injection pump. Unit injectors operated by camshaft
No injectiection pump on this one,the injectors are the injection pump for each cilinder
@@mentalmechanic 😄
I saw a few guys call this in the comments of the last video, major props to them!
if they (owner not shop) waited 4years they can definitely pay you for all your time since it was their install that made a working engine stop working. Definitely a learning experience to ask about everything they mucked about with no matter how unlikely the issue when everything else was on spec the weirdness is the answer. Great digging as always!
You never give up that was mind bending. Never miss your videos Bill N LI NY
Bill, did you ever work in Nascar?
@@rickrogers2649 yes
@@billneu9520 We may have a mutual friend... Alan Christiansen.
I think thats my problem as well, will check tomorrow 🙏🙏🙏
Well this is some good knowledge to have if/when I need to replace the rear seal in my TDI.
Finally replaced the timing belt after car sat in corner of shop, going on nearly two years..fired up as quickly as I turned the key! Total relief there were no bent valves!
Excellent videos! 👍👍💯🇺🇸
what a crazy way of timing using the rear mains to time the engine probably do stop backyard home mechanics!
What a complete ball ache. I'm surprised there wasn't stuff online about this. Is this type of set up unique to VW? A lot of mechanics would have given up, well done for persevering.
Ivan, about charging, I would say it depends on the circumstances; what agreement you have with the customer, what communication you had with the customer, how things went down, etc. For example, if you at some point told the customer that it is taking a long time and will be expensive and the customer told you to continue, then just charge the diagnostics time. Another example, sometimes I have worked on diagnosing an issue (not cars) and then being stubborn and curios and not wanting to admit defeat I spent a lot of hours on it, a lot more than I should have done before at least informing the customer and giving them a chance to make a decision on how to proceed. On those occasions the customer got a very significant discount. What I am saying is that you should charge what is fair and that you have to be the judge of what that is.
Well done ivan had similar on Mazda done a cambelt change would not start after hours wasted it was my fault the stater plate could go on in two ways. Before I had a scope all these new ideas are not helpful all looking good for future mechanic clad my time is coming to the end. great videos thank you
You earned every bit of time spent diagnosing that car !!
Even Ross Tech had little information. However a big red flag to the installer would be the design of the crank sensor.
I've never done a rear main or sensor on that particular engine but looking at that crazy setup would make me take a look at service data
Wow , incredible 🤯
Great perseverance, Ivan! I am very curious how you ended up charging the customer. I think I would split the cost with the customer (3 hours diagnosis, 3 hours "education" for yourself.) Looking forward to possible follow-up! 😊
You can always read your Haynes Workshop manual!
yeah I agree, some sort of update... i feel like we got left hangin... he should have fixed the seal timing for us, this is a youtube show you know, making money on the episodes, not off the customers ;0)
Incredible diag Ivan !
I was waiting patiently for part 2
Ahh yes, had a friend of mine run into the same issue and had to check timing and installation of the rear main seal but keep in mind it was in a VW Amarok, so sure enough VW uses this style of seal in many other products.
Good to know about it as I'm looking into a potential tdi swap
How to Bill for this???? Easy....Charge your regular rate, per hour. And charge the travel fee. BUT, TO BE REALISTIC, SUBTRACT FROM THE TOTAL, THE COST TO REMOVE AND REPLACE THE STARTER. The Original work on the rear seal was done neither carefully nor correctly......Hard to blame anyone.....Goofy Design.....Sad but true. You are the BEST, because you Never Give In! You are a shining example of how everyone should perform. "Poor Starter" omggg!
that is mind blowing for sure
Well, I admire your persistence Ivan. Euro cars and Japanese cars are getting more and more complicated. All we can hope to do, is to keep learning. You did everything right for a less technical vehicle, but these Euro manufacturers will always throw a spanner in the works. Good to have Euro experts on call, otherwise you may have been stumped, who woulda thunk it, a timed rear main seal LOL. I have a BMW 330D SE 2010 and a glow plug failed, and immediately threw a blocked DPF code, and would not perform a regen. So I replaced the glow plug, but the blocked DPF code persisted, and no regen. I had to buy BMW software to reset the adaptations and reset the DPF fault before a regen could take place. But, even so, I do love my Beemer.Good luck with the knowledge gained.
All cars are getting more complex, including American brands.
Range Rover uses the exact same type of tone ring for the abs sensors found on the bearing wheel bearing seals, Install one backwards NO ABS signal, Much easier because timing isn't involved but still needs to be installed correctly, It's cheaper to build shit this way meaning without actual mechanical steel teeth, Just a pain in the Ass for unsuspecting Techs. This By far the most useful You Tube Car repair Channel for people who are TOTALLY stumped potentially 🇺🇸👍
Thanks, Jan Jørgensen!
Good job
An add on to my first comment I worked on ONE VW & had to buy a SST just to remove the brake pedal from the booster thats when I decided never again to work on newer VWs.
Oh my gosh rear main seal timing. I would not have considered or even believed it, except Ivan thought, the magnet is the only secret sauce of timing? Well no you have to time the rear main seal. I still disbelieve this scenario. But was done. I want to hear this run.
You found the answer, that’s good for 6 hours I’m sure!
BTW…just received a Teslong endoscope…replacing an older Snap-On.
I would charge a full day no doubt and at that it is a screaming deal for the customer. That car has been down for 4 years? That starter is an MVP. Also, you had to engage your life line (Keith) and extended team to solve this.