Nicely covered. The _Yamashiro_ is usually only mentioned in passing, not covered as you have done. I'm likely in the minority, but I sincerely like her final superstructures. They are very unapologetically utilitarian in a very Japanese way, which to me is aesthetically pleasing in and of itself. I am a fan of function over form.
Nagano had unique 6 pole mast as opposed to tripods on all others. Nagato's tower was effectively immune to collapse it would require 3 direct hits on the poles as opposed to one. I like Yamashiros fighting top over Fuso's. Either way in heavy seas they must have been a nightmare. Not really that much higher than the US battleships of the same period but the Japanese and longer narrower hulls the the American standards. In the days before radar the pagoda masts had very practical value. Separating control functions to reduce confusion. The idea was for their time very solid.
The fusō class BB is one of my favorite looking BBs. Super sleek and a cool and easy to recognize profile. Definitely not the best ship layout design, but still pretty cool.
True, but the number of guns were an intentional design choice on both these and their cruisers. It was thought that since the Japanese were likely to end up outnumbered, then at least they could split the fire efficiently and engage multiple targets simultaneously with at least some degree of success. Whether that thought had any merit or not cannot really be said as it was never tested in the time period it was designed for.
You missed the final torpedo hit that was corrected by the navy in the mid 2000's. It was attributed to the USS Bennion and may have been the last hit she took, I can't remember since it was years since I have read that. An interesting note on that is that the USS Bennion was named after the captain of the USS West Virginia at Pearl Harbor. The Captain was posthumously recognized with the Medal of Honor for his actions.
The Surigao wrecks are all located in very rough waters. The currents were bad enough that Petrel barely surveyed them, outside Mogami. Not saying they *haven’t* been looted, but they’re safer than other wrecks at that depth.
@@manveerparmar6570 The thing is that those grave robbers hadn’t actually used a diver these days. They just dropped a bomb onto the wreck to blast it to pieces before using the crane to steal said pieces scattered around sea floor. Last year, Malaysian authority has raided one of those thieves’ hideouts and found lots of twists metal pieces from Prince of Wales and Repulse with an evidence that they have been blown off the wreckage rather than being cut off. They also found heavy duty cranes, ROVs, and lots of explosives.
@@skyneahistory2306 You have a good point there. It may not even be worth for those robbers to do it in such areas. I’m just a little concerned given what happened to many wrecks around these areas (one of them was my great grandfather’s tomb and those imbeciles literally tore the wreck apart and left basically nothing).
A very unique design. Perhaps when I was in high school, I would have designed such a battleship with six turrets instead of the standard three, and with a towering pagoda superstructure. The loss of lives (ten survivors) was catastrophic. Too bad. She fought well.
Whatever her shortcomings may have been, she sure put up a good fight. A testament to the Japanese shipbuilders, she took a great deal of punishment before finally sinking. So many other battleships went under with much less damage.
I always saw the Fuso and Yamashiro as the 'Tragic Twins'. Both have service tied to the Great Kanto Earthquake, both were lost in similarly violent final act, and they both had only ten of their respective crew survive. I have my own personal theory about Fuso during her final moments, but I'll save that comment for the vid about her. While the Fuso class of Battleships certainly look the part for a meme ship, but I think they are also Titans of the Jutland era of Dreadnaught class ships. Something like Yamashiro would have likely obliterated most of her competitors in a similar style engagement, but by the second world war, she was just out of the times. I didn't comment on the Albatross vid, but I really like seeing those come back! I had admittedly overlooked the Austro-hugarian Airforce as a factor during the First world war, so thank you for helping to shed some light on that field of study for me. Always love seeing new vids from you and hope you're feeling better!
Yamashiro and Fuso were good fits for the Japanese home defense. Ground based aircraft, with destroyers, torpedo boats and cruisers. Nagoto was supposed to be there defending the home islands as well. Japan had this weird conception that the American forces were going to spearhead straight for Japan instead of struggling through the pacific Island to Island. When we started the island hoping campaign the US forces started systematically destroying the Japanese navy until the home fleet was called upon to help deliver the absolute victory the Japanese were looking for. They believed one battle could draw in the US navy to complete destruction but it was a unfeasible plan. The closest they got was hitting taffy 3 and they got turned away.
Island hopping was only made possible by US superiority in the air. When the US seriously went on the offensive (Central Pacific drive, notably attack on the Marianas) they did so with massed seapower, just as the Japanese assumed they would. Unfortunately the US produced too strong a navy for them to defeat.
@@VersusARCH well sir, I’m a American so that’s not a “unfortunate thing” for me. The Japanese were incredibly skilled adversaries who relied upon preconceived notion’s that proved faulty. The victory in 6 months proposition was a unprecedented assumption considering the United States had never sued for peace with a aggressor nation in its history. So the idea that we were just going to surrender was not a logical assumption. The Philippines were also a US territory at the time and we were still obligated to go liberate them. We granted the Philippines independence after the war because of everything that they had been through. When the United States acquired the Philippines from Spain we inherited the civil war Spain had been waging within their colony. There were serious considerations though to grant the Philippines statehood throughout the early 1930’s. So Japan seriously underestimated the United States obligations to their territories. We had been investing 5% of our GDP, prior to the Wall Street crash to modernize the Philippines. Resulting in Manila being one of the most prosperous cities in the Asian Pacific. Japan miss understood what they were up against and the resolve that would see through to absolute victory.
If you want a challenge buy the 1/350 Fujimi kit IJN Yamashiro. The pagoda tower was certainly interesting to build. It’s a great kit. The Japanese are superior in manufacturing kits of great detail. I’m just finishing painting the model. Some of the parts are fiddly like assembling the 25mm anti aircraft guns.
And that's one thing that gets me riled up about those kits. Everything, and nearly every smallest feature is broken down into multiple parts just so (a) you can lose your mind trying to assemble them and (b) lose many to the "shoot out of the tweezers and into the ether" effect. It holds me back from building more of those kits than I would like.
@@mikeynth7919 Ow yes. I’ve searched the floor many times while building this kit. And I’ve got 1/350 kits of Kongo, Kaga, Nagato, and four other Fujini , Hasegawa kits. But they are worth it.
If you want a challenge try scratch building, or kit bashing. I had to expand my 1/600 airfix RN fleet somehow after collecting them all, so an extra Nelson & Hood combined to make a G3 plus an extra ArkRoyal became Unicorn. The results totally depend on your own imagination & ability, very rewarding if you are really into that one ship that just ain’t available otherwise.
@@mikeynth7919I have, and enjoy building those kits too. I learned to not grip the tweezers too hard when holding the small parts, found that worked better in the long run. Instinctively I would grip too hard at first.
The Japanese used Junyo and Ryujo in the invasion of the Aleutians. Junyo and Yamashiro had similar maximum speeds (as did, later in the war, the escort carriers and battlewagons of the 7th Fleet). The Kongo class were fast enough to steam with the IJN's fleet carriers.
They were dreadnoughts that were comparable to dreadnoughts in the navies of their adversaries. Certainly they were outclassed by new and progressively improved construction, but they were still useful for certain operations. As with the elderly dreadnoughts in US and Royal Navies, they lacked the speed to operate with the front line carrier strike forces. I noted that Rear Admiral Samuel Eliot Morrison states in his excellent naval history series that Yamashiro lacked radar during her engagement in the Battle of the Surigao Straight, however other sources indicate she had by then been fitted with Type 21, Type 22, and Type 13 radars.
Very interesting .Being Engish not familiar with Japanese warships but now living the USA and reading about The Pacific War had no idea how extensive their fleet was.Must be some good illustrated books that someone could enlighten one on them..good stuff
I never understood why they didn't remove the two amidship turrets and install a more powerful power plant for the engines, similar to how the Italians modernized their WWI battleships effectively making the class fast battlecruisers like the Kongos.
The Japanese favored offense above all else - the turrets would stay. She was roughly comparable in speed to almost all pre-war US battleships so upgrading her speed was never a serious discussion/option - at least after her 30's reconstruction.
The IJN really should have removed one amidships turret on the Fusos and Ises and used the space for additional machinery to get to ~28 knots during the 1930s refit. They would have made for subpar fast battleships but at least they could escort Kaga.
That would be a huge refit and it'd almost be better and more efficient for them to scrap them and replace them with new ones. Either a new design or just replacing them with Kongō type ships - unless they wanted to break the treaty early.
@@Joshua-fi4ji Indeed they would have been huge refits but I think they would have proved a little more worthwhile than the equally huge Kongo refits. A modernized Ise probably would have survived the encounter that doomed Hiei. I'd argue the Fuso/Ise modernizations as they were proved *perfectly* wasteful. Their 1930s refits got them up to 24/25 knots- leaving them barely too slow for carrier escort. Neither class did anything of note until the Japanese sacrificed the Fusos at Surigao Strait. They would have been better off leaving the Kongos with a less intensive engine refit and focusing their efforts on getting the Fusos/Ises up to 27/28 knots (removing one turret on each). That way by 1939 their entire battle line would have had 16 16" guns and 72 14" guns sailing at 25 knots- with all the 14" ships capable of going a few knots faster. This would have easily been the world's fastest battle line capable of dictating the terms of engagement in line with their decisive battle doctrine.
I would say yes and no. It is more Japan never really put them in a place where they could be useful. Yes, they were too slow to really play the cat-and-mouse games that faster battleships could, but the IJN didn't think battleships should be doing that anyway. Their doctrine called for battleships to remain together in reserve to sortie against weakened enemy fleets, to be the killing blow as it were after other IJN assets did their work. The problem is the IJN's other forces were so good at wrecking enemy forces early on in the war that the IJN never found a fleet they thought justified sending the battleships after, and so the battleships stayed idle until it was too late for them to make a big difference. For most of 1942 and 1943, when the IJN actually had more battleships and carriers in the Pacific than the USN and Royal Navy, the IJN mostly waited for the US Navy to make a big strike into the Central Pacific from Hawaii. By 1944, when the IJN realized the real threat was the slow grind of American forces from the south, the USN already had more battleships and carriers than the IJN.
I would argue that the 2 Fusos & the 2 Ises would have been better utilized protecting Kondo's invasion force at Midway instead of hanging around in the Aleutians area doing nothing. Doing so would have freed up Kongo & Hiei to be more properly utilized protecting Kido Butai. It doesn't change the historical battle but if things had gone to Yamamoto's plan the 4 old battleships would have been far more useful in that position. You could also make a case that the Fusos, Ises & the 2 Nagatos could have been a nice follow up to Kondo's bombardment of Henderson field at Guadacanal. For all their talk of offense the Japanese were just too passive in general around that island. Certainly by the end of 1942 the general usefulness of all 6 of those BB's was essentially over.
The "P" & "Q" turrets had their pros and cons. Rangefinding and angles of fire were not as good as the fire and aft turrets. However, from an attack point of view, there was better survivability with more turrets in a battle. It would be a dream come true if some billionaire built a full scale replica of Fuso or Yamashiro for a Japanese war memorial. I have a feeling seeing either ship would draw more emotional response and pride from the Japanese than the Yamatos, believe it or not.
How did I miss that one until now, that is some awkward-looking warship. Nothing like Yamato, Bismarck or Hood. I'll ask Google for those afore-mentioned Pagoda Mast memes right after finishing this video, already looking forward to some surely amusing stuff now :-D
Still, a great video on Yamashiro, Skynea! Yamashiro is definitely my third favorite Japanese BB because of her status as a slightly altered Fuso Class battleship, while also participating in the last Battleship on Battleship battle in history, while my second fav is Hiei, and my first fav is Musashi.
The pagoda superstructire itself has gotta be at least 3000 tons. It's inconceivable that naval architects then (and even now) would design a ship to be so top heavy. In moderate seas, sailors on the pagoda decks would be throwing up all over. In heavy seas, it's downright hazardous to be up there.
Well ... between the two of them ... they had 24 x 14" guns. *_IF_* they'd just had those two battleships against the half dozen American Standards - it could have been an interesting fight but the supporting ships the Americans had were just over whelming. That and the Americans had gotten their Torpedoes sorted. So - it just ended up being a slaughter. Still - in the grand scheme of things - the Southern Force had attracted the attention of the bombardment force American battleships - so they would at least not be present when the Center Force came through San Bernadino Strait. That - and Halsey had taken the bait and gone after the Carriers - so the main heavy ship formations of the Americans had been taken out of play and the Japanese plan had worked. The Trouble was - this was supposed to be the Death Ride of the Japanese Navy. That is what it was *_SUPPOSED_* to be. The trouble is - some things die hard. The Japanese had time and again - NOT - fully committed their ships because they were preserving them for the Decisive Battle and/or because they couldn't replace them. So - here's Kurita - and - he's already had his flag ship sunk out from under him - literally - putting him IN the water - and he orders a General Attack - and loses control of his ships. So ... he ends up getting them back together - and then retreating ... to what purpose? The Japanese ships in Japan could be armed and maintained - but they had no fuel. The ones in Indonesia had fuel but they couldn't be armed and maintained. Kurita should have kept pressing forward and gone after the Invasion Fleet - until all his ships were sunk - but - he didn't and they retreated to be sunk ignominiously, in some cases in port. So - the _Fuso's_ did their part. That's all they could do. Kurita threw away their sacrifice and the sacrifice of the Northern Force when he retreated to preserve his fleet - to no purpose. Some things die hard. .
Outstanding. Please do a video on the IJN'S .25 mm AA weapons? I have heard from pundits I trust that this weapon was junk. Nobody has yet to explain why?
Can anyone explain the US numbering or lettering as I'm confused . A carrier I thought would be AC and battleships B with Frigates being F and Destroyers D with Cruisers being C . But obviously I'm well off the mark.
Fleet carrier CV Escort carrier CA Battleship BB Battle cruiser BC Heavy cruiser CA Light cruiser CL Destroyer DD Submarine SS I don't know the rest tbh
You know, I would like to think what the Japanese were doing when they designed Fuso and Yamashiro, because this is one of the wackiest yet recognizable battleship designs I have ever seen. I mean, how could the Japanese look at the Kongo Class, and say: "We need more guns" and they do this? Thank god they improved the design with the Ise and Hyuga, because Fuso's design is out write wacky, but I can see that they tried to improve on Yamashiro by rotating around the ships forward center turret to face toward the stern, instead of facing toward the bow. But then again, I like Yamashiro more then Fuso because her design is more reasonable and complex.
@@jcwoodman5285 Your initial comment leads one to believe you are saying they should not have been put in the ships. Hence my comment. Having said that, a British tripod was just as good, with far less weight penalty aloft.
I keep hearing about how the 25 mm having such a bad reputation Drachinfel has mention it a few dozen times and has yet to do a video explaining why it was so terrible can you please explain why it was so terrible...
Very powerful battleships when they came out, however outdated by the 1940's. Too slow to keep up with carriers, makes sense the Japanese only used them in combat as a last resource. An outdated battleship is better than no battleship after all.
The pagoda masts look ugly for me. I have no idea why they designed it that way. As I see it there's no advantage in building pagoda masts. One should keep the top as light as possible. And in heavy seas, it's no fun being on the top decks.
She is a dreadnout class. Like Texas only they had those inboard side mounted guns. I didnt know other navys used drednoughts. I thought Texas was the only one. Well learn something new everday.
She has the honor of being part of the last all big gun naval combat in history.
I hope I'm never honored like that.
Many honours sent her way
Nicely covered. The _Yamashiro_ is usually only mentioned in passing, not covered as you have done.
I'm likely in the minority, but I sincerely like her final superstructures. They are very unapologetically utilitarian in a very Japanese way, which to me is aesthetically pleasing in and of itself. I am a fan of function over form.
I love the pagodas as well
Pagoda masts were awesome!
I enjoy them too, though I have to say that I prefer Fuso's and Nagto's ever so slightly.
Nagano had unique 6 pole mast as opposed to tripods on all others. Nagato's tower was effectively immune to collapse it would require 3 direct hits on the poles as opposed to one.
I like Yamashiros fighting top over Fuso's. Either way in heavy seas they must have been a nightmare. Not really that much higher than the US battleships of the same period but the Japanese and longer narrower hulls the the American standards.
In the days before radar the pagoda masts had very practical value. Separating control functions to reduce confusion. The idea was for their time very solid.
The fusō class BB is one of my favorite looking BBs. Super sleek and a cool and easy to recognize profile. Definitely not the best ship layout design, but still pretty cool.
True, but the number of guns were an intentional design choice on both these and their cruisers. It was thought that since the Japanese were likely to end up outnumbered, then at least they could split the fire efficiently and engage multiple targets simultaneously with at least some degree of success.
Whether that thought had any merit or not cannot really be said as it was never tested in the time period it was designed for.
I think the Fuso's are some of the best looking battleships out there. It was a mighty ship in her time, unfortunately the weakest during the war.
Fuso got the ugliest pagoda ever created though :D
Only the Japanese navy could the business like command tower of a battle ship and make it look like a Shinto shrine.
Cant disagree, i really love the crazy ass pagoda masts
You missed the final torpedo hit that was corrected by the navy in the mid 2000's. It was attributed to the USS Bennion and may have been the last hit she took, I can't remember since it was years since I have read that.
An interesting note on that is that the USS Bennion was named after the captain of the USS West Virginia at Pearl Harbor. The Captain was posthumously recognized with the Medal of Honor for his actions.
When built, the Fuso and Yamashiro were the most powerful battleships in the world, also being amongst the fastest, due to their length.
For her wreck being only 200 meters deep is quite concerning that those illegal salvagers may have get to her.
Divers can’t reach her only experienced divers at worst
The Surigao wrecks are all located in very rough waters. The currents were bad enough that Petrel barely surveyed them, outside Mogami.
Not saying they *haven’t* been looted, but they’re safer than other wrecks at that depth.
@@manveerparmar6570 The thing is that those grave robbers hadn’t actually used a diver these days. They just dropped a bomb onto the wreck to blast it to pieces before using the crane to steal said pieces scattered around sea floor.
Last year, Malaysian authority has raided one of those thieves’ hideouts and found lots of twists metal pieces from Prince of Wales and Repulse with an evidence that they have been blown off the wreckage rather than being cut off. They also found heavy duty cranes, ROVs, and lots of explosives.
@@skyneahistory2306 You have a good point there. It may not even be worth for those robbers to do it in such areas.
I’m just a little concerned given what happened to many wrecks around these areas (one of them was my great grandfather’s tomb and those imbeciles literally tore the wreck apart and left basically nothing).
@@thinaphonpetsiri9907 Disgusting. Zero honor.
A very unique design. Perhaps when I was in high school, I would have designed such a battleship with six turrets instead of the standard three, and with a towering pagoda superstructure. The loss of lives (ten survivors) was catastrophic. Too bad. She fought well.
Every battleship I doodled in elementary school looked like Fuso!😄
Whatever her shortcomings may have been, she sure put up a good fight. A testament to the Japanese shipbuilders, she took a great deal of punishment before finally sinking. So many other battleships went under with much less damage.
I always saw the Fuso and Yamashiro as the 'Tragic Twins'. Both have service tied to the Great Kanto Earthquake, both were lost in similarly violent final act, and they both had only ten of their respective crew survive. I have my own personal theory about Fuso during her final moments, but I'll save that comment for the vid about her. While the Fuso class of Battleships certainly look the part for a meme ship, but I think they are also Titans of the Jutland era of Dreadnaught class ships. Something like Yamashiro would have likely obliterated most of her competitors in a similar style engagement, but by the second world war, she was just out of the times.
I didn't comment on the Albatross vid, but I really like seeing those come back! I had admittedly overlooked the Austro-hugarian Airforce as a factor during the First world war, so thank you for helping to shed some light on that field of study for me. Always love seeing new vids from you and hope you're feeling better!
Yamashiro and Fuso were good fits for the Japanese home defense. Ground based aircraft, with destroyers, torpedo boats and cruisers. Nagoto was supposed to be there defending the home islands as well. Japan had this weird conception that the American forces were going to spearhead straight for Japan instead of struggling through the pacific Island to Island. When we started the island hoping campaign the US forces started systematically destroying the Japanese navy until the home fleet was called upon to help deliver the absolute victory the Japanese were looking for. They believed one battle could draw in the US navy to complete destruction but it was a unfeasible plan. The closest they got was hitting taffy 3 and they got turned away.
Island hopping was only made possible by US superiority in the air. When the US seriously went on the offensive (Central Pacific drive, notably attack on the Marianas) they did so with massed seapower, just as the Japanese assumed they would. Unfortunately the US produced too strong a navy for them to defeat.
@@VersusARCH well sir, I’m a American so that’s not a “unfortunate thing” for me. The Japanese were incredibly skilled adversaries who relied upon preconceived notion’s that proved faulty. The victory in 6 months proposition was a unprecedented assumption considering the United States had never sued for peace with a aggressor nation in its history. So the idea that we were just going to surrender was not a logical assumption. The Philippines were also a US territory at the time and we were still obligated to go liberate them. We granted the Philippines independence after the war because of everything that they had been through. When the United States acquired the Philippines from Spain we inherited the civil war Spain had been waging within their colony. There were serious considerations though to grant the Philippines statehood throughout the early 1930’s. So Japan seriously underestimated the United States obligations to their territories. We had been investing 5% of our GDP, prior to the Wall Street crash to modernize the Philippines. Resulting in Manila being one of the most prosperous cities in the Asian Pacific. Japan miss understood what they were up against and the resolve that would see through to absolute victory.
If you want a challenge buy the 1/350 Fujimi kit IJN Yamashiro. The pagoda tower was certainly interesting to build. It’s a great kit. The Japanese are superior in manufacturing kits of great detail. I’m just finishing painting the model. Some of the parts are fiddly like assembling the 25mm anti aircraft guns.
And that's one thing that gets me riled up about those kits. Everything, and nearly every smallest feature is broken down into multiple parts just so (a) you can lose your mind trying to assemble them and (b) lose many to the "shoot out of the tweezers and into the ether" effect.
It holds me back from building more of those kits than I would like.
@@mikeynth7919 Ow yes. I’ve searched the floor many times while building this kit. And I’ve got 1/350 kits of Kongo, Kaga, Nagato, and four other Fujini , Hasegawa kits. But they are worth it.
If you want a challenge try scratch building, or kit bashing. I had to expand my 1/600 airfix RN fleet somehow after collecting them all, so an extra Nelson & Hood combined to make a G3 plus an extra ArkRoyal became Unicorn. The results totally depend on your own imagination & ability, very rewarding if you are really into that one ship that just ain’t available otherwise.
@@mikeynth7919I have, and enjoy building those kits too. I learned to not grip the tweezers too hard when holding the small parts, found that worked better in the long run. Instinctively I would grip too hard at first.
I built the 1/200 fuss paper kit from Angraf, it's an absolute masterpiece of a model.
Among the destroyers fired torpedoes at Yamashiro was Heywood L.E. who ironically served in Japan as Ariake after the war.
The Japanese used Junyo and Ryujo in the invasion of the Aleutians. Junyo and Yamashiro had similar maximum speeds (as did, later in the war, the escort carriers and battlewagons of the 7th Fleet). The Kongo class were fast enough to steam with the IJN's fleet carriers.
Have you done one of these on IJN Nagato? A true survivor until the US dropped two nukes on her.
They were dreadnoughts that were comparable to dreadnoughts in the navies of their adversaries. Certainly they were outclassed by new and progressively improved construction, but they were still useful for certain operations. As with the elderly dreadnoughts in US and Royal Navies, they lacked the speed to operate with the front line carrier strike forces. I noted that Rear Admiral Samuel Eliot Morrison states in his excellent naval history series that Yamashiro lacked radar during her engagement in the Battle of the Surigao Straight, however other sources indicate she had by then been fitted with Type 21, Type 22, and Type 13 radars.
Very interesting .Being Engish not familiar with Japanese warships but now living the USA and reading about The Pacific War had no idea how extensive their fleet was.Must be some good illustrated books that someone could enlighten one on them..good stuff
The mast looks like a good place for a restaurant.
This video is interesting
I never understood why they didn't remove the two amidship turrets and install a more powerful power plant for the engines, similar to how the Italians modernized their WWI battleships effectively making the class fast battlecruisers like the Kongos.
The Japanese favored offense above all else - the turrets would stay. She was roughly comparable in speed to almost all pre-war US battleships so upgrading her speed was never a serious discussion/option - at least after her 30's reconstruction.
Has anyone properly surveyed the wreck? I'd love to see more detailed images.
The IJN really should have removed one amidships turret on the Fusos and Ises and used the space for additional machinery to get to ~28 knots during the 1930s refit. They would have made for subpar fast battleships but at least they could escort Kaga.
That would be a huge refit and it'd almost be better and more efficient for them to scrap them and replace them with new ones. Either a new design or just replacing them with Kongō type ships - unless they wanted to break the treaty early.
@@Joshua-fi4ji Indeed they would have been huge refits but I think they would have proved a little more worthwhile than the equally huge Kongo refits. A modernized Ise probably would have survived the encounter that doomed Hiei.
I'd argue the Fuso/Ise modernizations as they were proved *perfectly* wasteful. Their 1930s refits got them up to 24/25 knots- leaving them barely too slow for carrier escort. Neither class did anything of note until the Japanese sacrificed the Fusos at Surigao Strait. They would have been better off leaving the Kongos with a less intensive engine refit and focusing their efforts on getting the Fusos/Ises up to 27/28 knots (removing one turret on each).
That way by 1939 their entire battle line would have had 16 16" guns and 72 14" guns sailing at 25 knots- with all the 14" ships capable of going a few knots faster. This would have easily been the world's fastest battle line capable of dictating the terms of engagement in line with their decisive battle doctrine.
great content, as always 👍
They were just way too slow for WWII
Faster then the rebuilt US battleships....
I would say yes and no. It is more Japan never really put them in a place where they could be useful. Yes, they were too slow to really play the cat-and-mouse games that faster battleships could, but the IJN didn't think battleships should be doing that anyway. Their doctrine called for battleships to remain together in reserve to sortie against weakened enemy fleets, to be the killing blow as it were after other IJN assets did their work.
The problem is the IJN's other forces were so good at wrecking enemy forces early on in the war that the IJN never found a fleet they thought justified sending the battleships after, and so the battleships stayed idle until it was too late for them to make a big difference.
For most of 1942 and 1943, when the IJN actually had more battleships and carriers in the Pacific than the USN and Royal Navy, the IJN mostly waited for the US Navy to make a big strike into the Central Pacific from Hawaii.
By 1944, when the IJN realized the real threat was the slow grind of American forces from the south, the USN already had more battleships and carriers than the IJN.
I would argue that the 2 Fusos & the 2 Ises would have been better utilized protecting Kondo's invasion force at Midway instead of hanging around in the Aleutians area doing nothing. Doing so would have freed up Kongo & Hiei to be more properly utilized protecting Kido Butai. It doesn't change the historical battle but if things had gone to Yamamoto's plan the 4 old battleships would have been far more useful in that position.
You could also make a case that the Fusos, Ises & the 2 Nagatos could have been a nice follow up to Kondo's bombardment of Henderson field at Guadacanal. For all their talk of offense the Japanese were just too passive in general around that island. Certainly by the end of 1942 the general usefulness of all 6 of those BB's was essentially over.
@@robertdickson9319 What can I say: My comment regarding Henderson Field was removed straight from TH-cam. It was about the IJN.
I reckon the Fusos with the epic pagoda look amazing.
The "P" & "Q" turrets had their pros and cons. Rangefinding and angles of fire were not as good as the fire and aft turrets. However, from an attack point of view, there was better survivability with more turrets in a battle. It would be a dream come true if some billionaire built a full scale replica of Fuso or Yamashiro for a Japanese war memorial. I have a feeling seeing either ship would draw more emotional response and pride from the Japanese than the Yamatos, believe it or not.
How did I miss that one until now, that is some awkward-looking warship. Nothing like Yamato, Bismarck or Hood. I'll ask Google for those afore-mentioned Pagoda Mast memes right after finishing this video, already looking forward to some surely amusing stuff now :-D
Still, a great video on Yamashiro, Skynea! Yamashiro is definitely my third favorite Japanese BB because of her status as a slightly altered Fuso Class battleship, while also participating in the last Battleship on Battleship battle in history, while my second fav is Hiei, and my first fav is Musashi.
The pagoda superstructire itself has gotta be at least 3000 tons. It's inconceivable that naval architects then (and even now) would design a ship to be so top heavy. In moderate seas, sailors on the pagoda decks would be throwing up all over. In heavy seas, it's downright hazardous to be up there.
again another fine piece.
... because of the "Pagoda's" ... most of their wrecks are upside down on the bottom ....
Well ... between the two of them ... they had 24 x 14" guns. *_IF_* they'd just had those two battleships against the half dozen American Standards - it could have been an interesting fight but the supporting ships the Americans had were just over whelming. That and the Americans had gotten their Torpedoes sorted. So - it just ended up being a slaughter.
Still - in the grand scheme of things - the Southern Force had attracted the attention of the bombardment force American battleships - so they would at least not be present when the Center Force came through San Bernadino Strait.
That - and Halsey had taken the bait and gone after the Carriers - so the main heavy ship formations of the Americans had been taken out of play and the Japanese plan had worked.
The Trouble was - this was supposed to be the Death Ride of the Japanese Navy. That is what it was *_SUPPOSED_* to be. The trouble is - some things die hard. The Japanese had time and again - NOT - fully committed their ships because they were preserving them for the Decisive Battle and/or because they couldn't replace them. So - here's Kurita - and - he's already had his flag ship sunk out from under him - literally - putting him IN the water - and he orders a General Attack - and loses control of his ships. So ... he ends up getting them back together - and then retreating ... to what purpose?
The Japanese ships in Japan could be armed and maintained - but they had no fuel. The ones in Indonesia had fuel but they couldn't be armed and maintained. Kurita should have kept pressing forward and gone after the Invasion Fleet - until all his ships were sunk - but - he didn't and they retreated to be sunk ignominiously, in some cases in port.
So - the _Fuso's_ did their part. That's all they could do. Kurita threw away their sacrifice and the sacrifice of the Northern Force when he retreated to preserve his fleet - to no purpose. Some things die hard.
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Thanks for another good “no nonsense” informative video. 👍
I never realized US destroyers had such a successful battle with their torpedoes. Never really heard of this. Thanks
My grandfather ship USS Killen, torpedoed her.
Floating around with the Eiffel Tower
Outstanding. Please do a video on the IJN'S .25 mm AA weapons? I have heard from pundits I trust that this weapon was junk. Nobody has yet to explain why?
Magnificent ships! But sent into a naval "Banzai!" charge with no hope of success.
As far as I’ve read, at least one of them was in the non aircraft carrier portion of the Midway fleet.
Great video
Can anyone explain the US numbering or lettering as I'm confused .
A carrier I thought would be AC and battleships B with Frigates being F and Destroyers D with Cruisers being C . But obviously I'm well off the mark.
Fleet carrier CV
Escort carrier CA
Battleship BB
Battle cruiser BC
Heavy cruiser CA
Light cruiser CL
Destroyer DD
Submarine SS
I don't know the rest tbh
Sad- like a former championship boxer hanging on past his prime.
What doesn’t kill us, makes our bridge stronger.
I was thinking the 500-foot pagoda mast should have had a turret on top, then I noticed they had put one in the middle. Hilarious!
You know, I would like to think what the Japanese were doing when they designed Fuso and Yamashiro, because this is one of the wackiest yet recognizable battleship designs I have ever seen. I mean, how could the Japanese look at the Kongo Class, and say: "We need more guns" and they do this? Thank god they improved the design with the Ise and Hyuga, because Fuso's design is out write wacky, but I can see that they tried to improve on Yamashiro by rotating around the ships forward center turret to face toward the stern, instead of facing toward the bow. But then again, I like Yamashiro more then Fuso because her design is more reasonable and complex.
Enterprise's and Hornet's GTHO speed was about 8 Kn faster than Yamashiro's top speed, possibly more if Yamashiro wasn't in tip-top shape.
Love the content. Cheers from Estonia
0:15 Not gonna lie, that caught me off guard.
At quick glance Fuso has her "c" turret facing forward. Yamashiro has her c turret facing aft. F for Fuso f for forward.
Japanese Gin Palace
Radar made these tower masts & pagodas very heavy useless mass...
Radar barely existed at the time the pagodas were installed.
@@brucesim2003 That's my point. Before radar it was this, or scout planes.
@@jcwoodman5285 Your initial comment leads one to believe you are saying they should not have been put in the ships. Hence my comment.
Having said that, a British tripod was just as good, with far less weight penalty aloft.
I wonder if their is any written history of the 10 men that survived.
Would it have been more beneficial to have turned the Fusos into carriers completely?
I keep hearing about how the 25 mm having such a bad reputation Drachinfel has mention it a few dozen times and has yet to do a video explaining why it was so terrible can you please explain why it was so terrible...
Gee for a supposed weak ship. It certainly put up a proud fight.
I firmly believe the shape of Godzilla was influenced by pagoda masts
I like these ships
I wonder how much asbestos were in these ships ??
And I sometimes wonder, living in fibro houses.
The naval base is pronounced "Yō kūs ka". Good work overall.
ああ、私の魚雷の膨らみ!
Compared to her original lines the final silhouette was appalling.
Both versions look great.
It gave it far more character at least. The early version couldn't be more generic.
Very powerful battleships when they came out, however outdated by the 1940's. Too slow to keep up with carriers, makes sense the Japanese only used them in combat as a last resource. An outdated battleship is better than no battleship after all.
Hard to believe they weren’t Top Heavy ? 🤔
Most of the weight was placed low, the pagoda despite being tall didn't have much mass to create imbalances
All that work - Good Money after Bad ? Pride ? 🤔
The pagoda masts look ugly for me. I have no idea why they designed it that way. As I see it there's no advantage in building pagoda masts. One should keep the top as light as possible. And in heavy seas, it's no fun being on the top decks.
Thumbnail depicts battleship Fuso not Yamashiro.
Fuso's third turret faces forwards. The ship in the thumbnail has its turret facing backwards, that's the Yamashiro
Good piece. BTW it's pronounced "YO-KOOS-KA".
Thank you. You beat me to it.
😮
Yokosuka is actually pronounced "Ya-co-ska"
Them towers look like a bunch of McDonalds hamburgers stacked on top of one another lmao!
I didn’t do it.
Hardly much inferior to U.S. standards or British ‘R’s? significantly faster in fact.
She is a dreadnout class. Like Texas only they had those inboard side mounted guns. I didnt know other navys used drednoughts. I thought Texas was the only one. Well learn something new everday.