Tip Tip Tip Take the master cylinders out of the equation and check that the softness is not mechanical instead of hydraulic. Put a plug in the outlet of the master cylinders so they can only be rock hard then see if the pedal is still soft.
It's not air , it is metal flexing . Your front rear bias adjustment is flexing and your bolt on one side rose joint needs to be replaced with a forked clevis joint . Love your work .
I think I saw on one of your previous videos that there where some flex on the bracket that holds the master cylinders. Had the same problem when I made a bracket for my motorcycle. Swampy rear brake because of my bracket wasnt firm enough. Love your videos and your enthusiasm. Keep up the good work.
7:09 I concur. The old brass fitting was used on many British cars without trapping air. That bias setup has too much flex. Add a couple of clevis forks and a proper pivot and remove the flex
Hey Jeff …. Try this if the brakes give you a headache in the future….. If you have rubber brake lines, clamp all 4. If the pedal is still soft = master cylinder. If it is hard, get a helper and release each corner one at a time. The pedal should only move a small amount if it is ok. Re-clamp and do the next corner - if a corner you release moves the pedal a lot then that is your culprit.
This is why the HBBJ comment section is great, it’s genuinely educational. I’ll second the master cylinder diameter to calliper ratio being important for brake feel. Had that issue on a bike before.
If the pedal does not firm up when pumping, then I don't think its air in the system. A soft pedal can be more than just air. Master cilinder sizing vs caliper piston surface area for example is critical for pedal feel. Certain brake pads even influence pedal feel. Caliper flex or spindle flex can cause soft pedals. On my car I re-inforced the mounting of the pedal since the firewall was flexing when braking. With the hood off you could see the master cilinder moving
I've talked to Jeff before about MC sizes and it seems to be pretty good. As he said though the pedal ratio is HUGE. Most people don't understand MC sizing and just upgrade from single to 4 piston calipers without changing MC. It worries me because the extra surface area can completely drain the reservoir!
As for pad feel, that's a good point. However I think he's talking about a soft pedal when the car is stationary. Being race brakes they'll likely feel like shit when cold and there'll be very little initial bite. But they'll come on much later. I changed from the stock aggressive pad on my wife's AMG brakes to a low dust pad and it was almost scary at first because it felt like you had no brakes! The stock Brembo pads had huge initial bite but dropped off. They also ate rotors every 50,000. The Bendix pads took more travel to bite but came on stronger as you applied more pedal and obviously braking distances were identical since the limit was physics! Disconcerting though.
@@1one3_Racing sounds familiar indeed. I had Carbon Lorraine RC5+ on a street car and the pedal was rock hard. When I switched back to OEM brake pads (the squealing was driving me crazy) the pedal was a lot softer. A shame, because no pads brake as good when cold as the RC5+
Just a comment on the motivation Jeff. We all want to see the fruits of your labour, not just on the road, but in your vision. We are here with you until its done. Cant wait to see it at cars and coffee soon, will drive down from the Shire to see it!
Jeff, got to say, the success in yr videos isn't so much the content ( which is fascinating " it's the way you present them, just like the bloke next door! So many of us can relate to you and " do it twice and get it right" type of sayings. I love yr humble mistakes. We can all relate certainly to that. I often point westward ( to Aussie) and laugh and say bugger you Jeff, you're got me all enthusiastic over restoring my car. Cheers mate.
Jeff, regarding the soft brakes, please make sure you ONLY have hardlines installed (except last points from chassis to calipers), any long runs of braided hoses WILL flex with pressure as they try to straighten up. Love the series, just watch all episodes over the past week!
For the front brake/bearing set up there is way too much drag, as theres no front drive shafts the wheels should spin very freely. Back the bearings off so you have just detectable play (less than a mm) at the tyre but you should just detect a very slight clunk… if that doesn’t work, take out the pads and see if that frees up the wheels to spin freely… something is definitely a miss there and will cause damage/over heat things.
25 วันที่ผ่านมา +16
Is the soft pedal a mechanical rather than hydraulic issue. Flex in the pedal and mechanical linkage somewhere causing the soft pedal and the not pumping up?
Fingers crossed on your trip Jeff, hope you make it and the engineers are happy with the outcome. The last 10% feels like it takes nearly as much work as the first 90% did. Happy you are so close, bravo!
One thing that helped me bleeding brakse on my own was getting some of those self bleeders with the one-way ball valve that have some kind of thread sealant. The big thing is the gooey thread sealant! prevents air from coming back through there and helps a ton. It doesn't fix everything but every little advantage helps.
A thought on your brakes locking up - if your MC wasn't able to absolutely fully retract the piston in the bore you will both have trouble bleeding and not allow the brakes to release. Pretty sure this is going on, been there. Love the builds, keep up the great work!
Jeff how come Mrs Jeff gets better looking every video and you don't😁.The Alfarrari is coming along extremely well , your engineer is doing great job of looking after you✌
How you maintain any form of motivation for a build like this where you have literally done every single thing possible (custom dry sump, custom steering, custom gearbox adaptor, complicated brakes, complicated paint process, all the interior yourself), it’s an insane amount of work, I’d treat yourself to more simpler stuff after this.
Just waited to make my comment on the back of your comment about going for the test. Well done on getting the car legal for the road. Keep the videos coming on all projects
Jeff - I think Howardsway is on the right track about your brakes. Your brake cylinder connecting rod could be bending along with the other issues mentioned by Howard. In my experience, the brake master cylinder is directly connected to the brake pedal, with no connecting rod, especially in a push configuration. Try a larger diameter connecting rod along with what Howard recommends. Another thing I recommend is you move the battery disconnect switch to somewhere inside the car where you can easily access it from the driver's seat. Three reasons for this: 1) If you are ever in an accident, you can quickly disconnect the battery and that should stop any chance of an electrical spark from lighting off gasoline fumes if they are present; 2) This is a simple anti-theft device if you place it in a "hidden" spot in the driver's seat area. I have this in my MGB and switch it to the off position every time I park the car; and 3) By switching to the off position when not driving, you eliminate the chance of stray discharge occurring which can drain the battery. This is very helpful in sustaining battery life for cars that are not daily driven.
Love your work Jeff, I'm about 6 months behind you in my build and all the little bits and pieces you have been doing for the engineering approval have been very helpful, hopefully reducing the amount of work i have to redo.
If your front calipers have a piston area which is very different to the originals you may need to use a different dia master cylinder. I would also remove the calipers while bleeding put a block of wood in to stop the pistons moving and point the bleed nipples straight up . Ive seen calipers trap air
In the early aircooled VW world I live in, the soft pedal problems happen for us as well. When we have these issues, it seems to come down to the unchangable physics of the multiple bore sizes throughout the system. Certain combinations just won’t give you that rock hard pedal you want. My 58 Beetle with 4 wheel disc brakes has the same soft pedal that is nowhere near as good as the original single circuit, 4 wheel drum brakes the car used to have. I also have switched to the pressure bleeder, Teflon brake hoses, independent adjustable proportioning valve, etc. NOTHING changes the way my car pedal feels. It all started when I switched to the “correct” 4 wheel disc master cylinder. If you can get your brakes to feel more firm without changing caliper or master bore sizing, I’d love to see it so I can also improve my car. Great work on your car!
Jeff sometimes the rubber flex lines can expand with pressure and give your pedal a soft feel.. you may want to change them to hi pressure braided lines
Hi Jeff, could your pedal feel be a symptom of mechanical flex in the linkage? Just a thought as you seem to have exhausted all hydraulic possibilities.
It’s so incredibly watching how patient you are with the final bits of this project. The last 10% of every project is as big a production as the first 90% 😢😢 Keep going!!! You’re almost done and nobody builds cars from stratch like this- you’re taking on what teams of engineers do when designing a car. It’s just amazing how great your work and knowledge is!!!
Can¨t wait for you and Mrs Jeff to take the car out for proper use! You are both worth a gold medal for stamina and stubbornes (I think that is a proper word, english is not as easy as my teachers said it is) to get the car to the finnish line. Great job!
For your brake bleed. The master cylinder is same height or below the brake calipers because of its floor mounting. Could be the reason for trapped air. I would try the same system I use on motorcycle when bleeding after new components fitted. I take a very large syringe body filled brake fluid with a hose attached to the brake caliper. Raise the syringe body above the handle bars (master cylinders) so you have gravity feed back thru the master cylinder. (Sometimes on a bike I use a rubber band to slightly depress the brake lever ) To get a gravity bleed. You will find the best height Vs flow to get the brake line bled. Good luck. Also buy some "Speed bleed nipples" to fit your caliper. It may also help bleeding with other pressure methods. 👍
Brake master cylinder may not have enough capacity if you have upgraded caliper size; may need a bigger master for front circuit. Also, I have found on some cars over the years that if brakes aren't adjusted properly, it can cause a soft pedal.
Bleeding the brakes with a pressure bleeder and start at the rear most and work your way to the front, finish at the closest to the master cylinder. Any linkages with slight play or movement will feel worse at the pedal. Good luck Jeff
Good work on the power steering, that kind of wiring frustration is so difficult to track down. Funny enough my newest project is a Datsun Roadster and it's brake lines are also SAE.
The soft brake pedal may be due to the fact that you essentially have zero miles on the brakes and the pads/disks haven't been bedded in yet . Casting flash and the inaccuracies in the pad friction surface mean that until they've bedded in , can leave a soft pedal in the same way a crownwheel and pinion are fitted as matched sets that have been lapped in together .
A couple of last ditch things you can try on the brake bleeding is to unbolt the callipers and hang them so the callipers and bleed nipples are lower and can gravity bleed a little and if that doesn’t work try back bleeding through the bleed nipple.
Metro turbo 4pots that were a popular upgrade on minis back in the day, had to be bled simultaneously. bleed pipe or catch pipe depending which way you're doing it, a tee and a pipe to each nipple. crack both nipples, bleed and nip up. worth a shot
Hey Jeff, you are experiencing a common motorcycle calliper issue, especially Brembos. The way to fix this is to remove the calliper and turn it 90 degrees then bleed it. Hopefully that solves it for you.
Jeff, from what I saw at the start when you were playing with the underfloor brake linkage, I think your spongey brakes are just due to linkage flex, because it's a "push" on a long, reasonably small diameter rod.
There is occasionally a problem with multi part calipers where air gets trapped in and around the seals and wont bleed out. disassembling the calipers and bathing the seals in break fluid and squeezing out any air pockets while assembling is about the only option other than using high vacuum . this problem is made worse by thick greasy assembly lubricant . In many cases the problem self corrects once enough heat cycles have occurred . Flushing brake lines with methanol helps. If you're going to use vacuum wrap the bleeders in teflon tape or even candle wax or bubble gum to seal the threads from sucking in air.
Hey Jeff You might have to try and put the brake fluid reservoir back in the engine bay so that is the highest point in the system like the factory one was.
I pointed out last time you were under the brake box that your balance bar is twisting and forcing the short pushrods into angles rather than a straight "push". I can still see them doing this in this video This is the likely cause of the soft pedal. As someone else has pointed out, you need to put Mrs Jeff in the car while you're under it so you can watch what's going on when she presses the pedal. Jim from Alfaholics
@@HomeBuiltByJeff ours has the balance bar in a tube so it can't move BUT if the lock nut isn't tight it will twist and cause a spongey pedal like you're getting. I've had to put a strong warning in the fitting guide about this!
I've been following this build for a while, and started thinking about power steering on my own 105. So i started googling and found your latest video😂.
I suspect your master cylinder piston size is too small for the size of calipers. Will require more pedal effort but a larger piston will give increased fluid volume for a given pedal movement and this improves the feel. I would put the pressure switch back in for the brake lights as it isnt that.
Floor mounted pedals Alfa cars are tricky to bleed. I've bled, driven around for a week, pressure bled and droved around for a month and I intend to bleed again as it's still not 100% right. Another brake issue that I have seen in the past and could be causing your issues are weak callipers structurally. I have seen these aftermarket calipers flex with pressure. From reputable sellers. Try pointing a camera to the caliper and brake and check for movement.
G’day mate, Firstly, love the show, the crazy cars that you create are absolutely amazing. Secondly, when I was a mechanic in the army, we had the land rover 6x6’s, they were an absolute pain in the butt to bleed. We tried everything, but the way we were able to bleed them was to leave the front wheels on the ground and jack the rear as high as we could. Then go through the normal way of bleeding the brakes. With the ass so high the air would definitely come out of the rear brake line. Hope this helps. Mouse
Maybe its the camera angle but it looks like the upper rod is at an angle to the other rod instead of being straight. If thats the case it could be slowing down the brake travel and making the pedal feel softer.
For the brakes, I have often found it the new brake pad material that can improve after bedding in. You could replace all the pads with solid metal just to try the static pedal feel first? Otherwise I would focus on the master cylinder. Is it new? Good luck tomorrow mate 🤞🏼
Ditto mechanical flex, you need someone to push the pedal HARD so you can observe what is happening underneth there. Also as another poster said, bung the master at the outlet, then try other 4 corners, isolating one corner, then another then another etc. Also , the angle of incidence where the rod interacts with the little idler arm at the master cylinder end of the mech.
Presented with such a spongy brake pedal, I would look at trying to pin point whether the sponginess is present in the front, rear or both brake circuits. I would do this by isolating (disabling) the rear brakes to see if the sponginess remains present with only the front brakes being active and then repeat by disabling the front brakes to see if the sponginess continues with the active rear brakes.
One thing I ran into with building new brake lines at the t valve u have the flare nut could be a short thread one and you might need a long thread one, that would get air into the system
Gday jeff Love the videos Try a line locker clamp on each brake hose to see if the pedel changes if it goes hard remove 1 clamp at a time to see if it goes soft again then that might narrow it down to which area Ive had the bleed nipple tapper leak before A $4.50 bleed nipple arrr took me about 2 days to work that out haha Take it easy mate Byron from WA 👍
G'day Jeff, A great video! You're so close now. About your brakes. I have a 63 VW Beetle. After finishing the front disc brake conversion, I could not get a firm pedal no matter what I tried. Eventually, it was recommended to me to install a 2psi residual valve from Wilwood on the rear brake circuit at the master cylinder. I did that, and it did the job. ✌️ Peace.
If the pedal softness is due to excessive mechanical advantage, you could try to alter the hydraulic ratio by going to a larger diameter master cylinder.
I have a 73 alfa spider which has the same standing pedal arrangement and redundant brake line system and the same t piece. I am not sure how much you have varied from the same system, but, I can tell you these brakes are notoriously hard to bleed. I power bleed mine and still get a soft feel pedal. I also thought it was the t piece , but no it isn't. I'm sure its the standing pedal arrangement. While the brakes feel a bit soft they do stop the car really well. I live down from the road from you, you can take my car for a spin to see if you get the same feel if you wish.
Do you need motivation Jeff??? Only look that beautiful car you made!!! A second reason: this is one of the best hobbies ever! Yes, the last 10% needs 90% of you time, but if restoring and modifying old cars were easy, everybody will do it, and there would be no reasons at all to see this kind of channels. Keep motoring!
Throw an action cam under the car watching the master cylinder linkage mess. See if there is flex in any of that. Also, maybe there is bulkhead flex adding to the squishy feeling.
Have you considered the fact that the brake master cylinder is positioned quite low in comparison to the calipers? Most master cylinders are higher up in the car. Just something to think about.
I'm happy you fixed the power steering, it's a bit different from my son's Mitsubishi which had no power steering at idle. There the issue was that the alternator was worn out while the power steering only worked from 13 Volts and up.
One thing I noticed you've not checked on your brakes, is the crossover pipe on the front calipers. I understand the pitfall of assuming they're brand new and should be fine, but they would have been tested and then sat with fluid I them for ages and maybe an o-ring is weeping! You could disconnect an individual caliper and plug the line and check to see if you get pedal. I had a brand new set of Stop Tech calipers many years ago that had bad seals out of the box.
Well done, think for the brakes you need 4 friends and bleed all the callipers at once Could it not be the master cylinder that is broken ? Oh and you better let us know the outcome of the engineer on Monday 🤪
Hi Jeff, Re brakes; in my experience, until new pads (especially big ones) are really, really bedded in, they often feel spongy. It’s like the bedding-in actually hardens up the pad material. Maybe the master cylinder bore is incorrect too (although I’m sure you thought of that at the time, I don’t remember)?? Sterling work as usual!!!
i had the problem once with the brake pedal feeling soft , spongeé ,, on a jaguar with a big brake kit , and we found out when pressing the brakes the caliper would expand as if they where made of plastic you could even see the calipers expand !! , took the brake calipers off , put on the original brake calipers and no more problems !!
Hi Jeff! About the brakes - maybe somebody already mentionded, but - if you have a rubber brake line in the system - it may be soft - when stepping on the brake pedal, instead of going firm, you are stretching a line. I cant think of anything else really that could cause that. Wishing the best and thank you for sharing all of your work here!
Great work Jeff! Mate I would definitely replace that battery isolation red switch! They are totally unreliable. Have a look at the Moroso type switch or equivalent, they are a heavier duty reliable switch 👍🏻
Blooper Princess reaches new heights We believe every word Mrs Jeff speaks so we would happily change every detail of any model 😂 Brakes only stop you so you don’t need the “ fun stoppers” 🏴
Have you consider master cylinder piston size? if the big brake kit caliper piston swept area is increased, then the master cylinder needs to displace more fluid for a given pressure, that will cause a "long soft" pedal. Just a few MM increase in cylinder size can make a big difference. Ask me how I know.
Mike I had a similar situation in a 66 A100 that we did an LS transplant on. We re engineered the mechanical design between the pedal and the MC. The angles of pivot made the breaking soft. We changed the leverage and the breakers were strong. Also a superheat question but your breaks are not vacuumed to the engine right? Many modern brake systems use vacuumed from the engine. Great project and probably the best AR I have ever scene brother!!
Try bleeding the brakes by doing the front and rear of the same side at the same time , you have a biased brake system and the rears are probably not bottomed out at full stroke and trapping some air or reset the biased box so both front and rear bottom out at full stroke bleed then reset the biased
Tip Tip Tip
Take the master cylinders out of the equation and check that the softness is not mechanical instead of hydraulic.
Put a plug in the outlet of the master cylinders so they can only be rock hard then see if the pedal is still soft.
@@anomamos9095 Did I hear Jeff say it was a long pedal. Could it be the pedal bending?
@@twcmaker bending or deflecting is what I was thinking.
It's not air , it is metal flexing . Your front rear bias adjustment is flexing and your bolt on one side rose joint needs to be replaced with a forked clevis joint . Love your work .
Came here to say this 👍
I think I saw on one of your previous videos that there where some flex on the bracket that holds the master cylinders. Had the same problem when I made a bracket for my motorcycle. Swampy rear brake because of my bracket wasnt firm enough. Love your videos and your enthusiasm. Keep up the good work.
7:09 I concur. The old brass fitting was used on many British cars without trapping air. That bias setup has too much flex. Add a couple of clevis forks and a proper pivot and remove the flex
Hey Jeff ….
Try this if the brakes give you a headache in the future…..
If you have rubber brake lines, clamp all 4. If the pedal is still soft = master cylinder.
If it is hard, get a helper and release each corner one at a time. The pedal should only move a small amount if it is ok. Re-clamp and do the next corner - if a corner you release moves the pedal a lot then that is your culprit.
Also check if the master cylinder and the calipers are compatible.
The diameter of the piston in the master cylinder is really important.
This is why the HBBJ comment section is great, it’s genuinely educational. I’ll second the master cylinder diameter to calliper ratio being important for brake feel. Had that issue on a bike before.
I was thinking similar. @@Jonathan_Doe_
If the pedal does not firm up when pumping, then I don't think its air in the system. A soft pedal can be more than just air. Master cilinder sizing vs caliper piston surface area for example is critical for pedal feel. Certain brake pads even influence pedal feel.
Caliper flex or spindle flex can cause soft pedals. On my car I re-inforced the mounting of the pedal since the firewall was flexing when braking. With the hood off you could see the master cilinder moving
This, time for the maths.
I've talked to Jeff before about MC sizes and it seems to be pretty good.
As he said though the pedal ratio is HUGE.
Most people don't understand MC sizing and just upgrade from single to 4 piston calipers without changing MC. It worries me because the extra surface area can completely drain the reservoir!
As for pad feel, that's a good point. However I think he's talking about a soft pedal when the car is stationary. Being race brakes they'll likely feel like shit when cold and there'll be very little initial bite. But they'll come on much later. I changed from the stock aggressive pad on my wife's AMG brakes to a low dust pad and it was almost scary at first because it felt like you had no brakes!
The stock Brembo pads had huge initial bite but dropped off. They also ate rotors every 50,000. The Bendix pads took more travel to bite but came on stronger as you applied more pedal and obviously braking distances were identical since the limit was physics!
Disconcerting though.
@@1one3_Racing sounds familiar indeed. I had Carbon Lorraine RC5+ on a street car and the pedal was rock hard. When I switched back to OEM brake pads (the squealing was driving me crazy) the pedal was a lot softer. A shame, because no pads brake as good when cold as the RC5+
Just a comment on the motivation Jeff. We all want to see the fruits of your labour, not just on the road, but in your vision. We are here with you until its done. Cant wait to see it at cars and coffee soon, will drive down from the Shire to see it!
Jeff, got to say, the success in yr videos isn't so much the content ( which is fascinating " it's the way you present them, just like the bloke next door! So many of us can relate to you and " do it twice and get it right" type of sayings. I love yr humble mistakes. We can all relate certainly to that. I often point westward ( to Aussie) and laugh and say bugger you Jeff, you're got me all enthusiastic over restoring my car. Cheers mate.
Jeff, regarding the soft brakes, please make sure you ONLY have hardlines installed (except last points from chassis to calipers), any long runs of braided hoses WILL flex with pressure as they try to straighten up. Love the series, just watch all episodes over the past week!
I knew a mechanic that was addicted to brake fluid Jeff…. but he said you can stop anytime you want 😂 So close now hope it all passes last few tests!!
Mrs Jeff is so smooth in the fun facts section. Who'd have guessed she struggles as much as she does!!
Good luck on getting it signed off Monday! Congrats on making it this far!! Looks really good
Oh Jeff. She loves you so much. Mrs Jeff's face as you're closing the video ❤️❤️❤️ bless you two.
For the front brake/bearing set up there is way too much drag, as theres no front drive shafts the wheels should spin very freely. Back the bearings off so you have just detectable play (less than a mm) at the tyre but you should just detect a very slight clunk… if that doesn’t work, take out the pads and see if that frees up the wheels to spin freely… something is definitely a miss there and will cause damage/over heat things.
Is the soft pedal a mechanical rather than hydraulic issue. Flex in the pedal and mechanical linkage somewhere causing the soft pedal and the not pumping up?
Fingers crossed on your trip Jeff, hope you make it and the engineers are happy with the outcome.
The last 10% feels like it takes nearly as much work as the first 90% did.
Happy you are so close, bravo!
One thing that helped me bleeding brakse on my own was getting some of those self bleeders with the one-way ball valve that have some kind of thread sealant.
The big thing is the gooey thread sealant! prevents air from coming back through there and helps a ton. It doesn't fix everything but every little advantage helps.
A thought on your brakes locking up - if your MC wasn't able to absolutely fully retract the piston in the bore you will both have trouble bleeding and not allow the brakes to release. Pretty sure this is going on, been there. Love the builds, keep up the great work!
Jeff how come Mrs Jeff gets better looking every video and you don't😁.The Alfarrari is coming along extremely well , your engineer is doing great job of looking after you✌
How you maintain any form of motivation for a build like this where you have literally done every single thing possible (custom dry sump, custom steering, custom gearbox adaptor, complicated brakes, complicated paint process, all the interior yourself), it’s an insane amount of work, I’d treat yourself to more simpler stuff after this.
Love your keyring…
It’s a good way to remind you that sometiles things are just a thread
Just waited to make my comment on the back of your comment about going for the test. Well done on getting the car legal for the road. Keep the videos coming on all projects
Jeff - I think Howardsway is on the right track about your brakes. Your brake cylinder connecting rod could be bending along with the other issues mentioned by Howard. In my experience, the brake master cylinder is directly connected to the brake pedal, with no connecting rod, especially in a push configuration. Try a larger diameter connecting rod along with what Howard recommends.
Another thing I recommend is you move the battery disconnect switch to somewhere inside the car where you can easily access it from the driver's seat. Three reasons for this: 1) If you are ever in an accident, you can quickly disconnect the battery and that should stop any chance of an electrical spark from lighting off gasoline fumes if they are present; 2) This is a simple anti-theft device if you place it in a "hidden" spot in the driver's seat area. I have this in my MGB and switch it to the off position every time I park the car; and 3) By switching to the off position when not driving, you eliminate the chance of stray discharge occurring which can drain the battery. This is very helpful in sustaining battery life for cars that are not daily driven.
You look so happy with the steering! Excellent to see.
Love your work Jeff, I'm about 6 months behind you in my build and all the little bits and pieces you have been doing for the engineering approval have been very helpful, hopefully reducing the amount of work i have to redo.
beautifully done, the car will steer so well.
Good luck with the inspection, I hope he can hit the road soon 🤞🏻🍀
If your front calipers have a piston area which is very different to the originals you may need to use a different dia master cylinder. I would also remove the calipers while bleeding put a block of wood in to stop the pistons moving and point the bleed nipples straight up . Ive seen calipers trap air
Still enjoying the alfa content!
From this side of the youtubes your awesome persistence is obvious and inspiring. 👍 Almost there.
Jeff, looks like the steering wheel is not centered to the steering column, cause you see the steering wheel go up and down as you spin it around.
In the early aircooled VW world I live in, the soft pedal problems happen for us as well. When we have these issues, it seems to come down to the unchangable physics of the multiple bore sizes throughout the system. Certain combinations just won’t give you that rock hard pedal you want. My 58 Beetle with 4 wheel disc brakes has the same soft pedal that is nowhere near as good as the original single circuit, 4 wheel drum brakes the car used to have. I also have switched to the pressure bleeder, Teflon brake hoses, independent adjustable proportioning valve, etc. NOTHING changes the way my car pedal feels. It all started when I switched to the “correct” 4 wheel disc master cylinder. If you can get your brakes to feel more firm without changing caliper or master bore sizing, I’d love to see it so I can also improve my car. Great work on your car!
Jeff sometimes the rubber flex lines can expand with pressure and give your pedal a soft feel.. you may want to change them to hi pressure braided lines
Hi Jeff, could your pedal feel be a symptom of mechanical flex in the linkage? Just a thought as you seem to have exhausted all hydraulic possibilities.
Mrs Jeff in the car, Jeff under to watch the linkages.
It’s so incredibly watching how patient you are with the final bits of this project. The last 10% of every project is as big a production as the first 90% 😢😢
Keep going!!! You’re almost done and nobody builds cars from stratch like this- you’re taking on what teams of engineers do when designing a car. It’s just amazing how great your work and knowledge is!!!
Might need a bigger bore master cylinder to reduce the mechanical advantage of the pedal.
Use a brake light switch from the rear brake of the motorcycles, they are usualy spring loaded so they are hard to destroy and waterproof.
Can¨t wait for you and Mrs Jeff to take the car out for proper use!
You are both worth a gold medal for stamina and stubbornes (I think that is a proper word, english is not as easy as my teachers said it is) to get the car to the finnish line.
Great job!
For your brake bleed. The master cylinder is same height or below the brake calipers because of its floor mounting. Could be the reason for trapped air.
I would try the same system I use on motorcycle when bleeding after new components fitted.
I take a very large syringe body filled brake fluid with a hose attached to the brake caliper. Raise the syringe body above the handle bars (master cylinders) so you have gravity feed back thru the master cylinder.
(Sometimes on a bike I use a rubber band to slightly depress the brake lever ) To get a gravity bleed.
You will find the best height Vs flow to get the brake line bled.
Good luck.
Also buy some
"Speed bleed nipples" to fit your caliper. It may also help bleeding with other pressure methods.
👍
Brake master cylinder may not have enough capacity if you have upgraded caliper size; may need a bigger master for front circuit. Also, I have found on some cars over the years that if brakes aren't adjusted properly, it can cause a soft pedal.
Bleeding the brakes with a pressure bleeder and start at the rear most and work your way to the front, finish at the closest to the master cylinder.
Any linkages with slight play or movement will feel worse at the pedal.
Good luck Jeff
I hear that 90% thing. That last 10% is such a drag - probably why I have so many nearly finished projects!
Good work on the power steering, that kind of wiring frustration is so difficult to track down.
Funny enough my newest project is a Datsun Roadster and it's brake lines are also SAE.
Love the Ferrari belt key ring. Must remind you of that stressful time😂👍 good luck on the trip!
The soft brake pedal may be due to the fact that you essentially have zero miles on the brakes and the pads/disks haven't been bedded in yet . Casting flash and the inaccuracies in the pad friction surface mean that until they've bedded in , can leave a soft pedal in the same way a crownwheel and pinion are fitted as matched sets that have been lapped in together .
You better post Monday night and let us all know 😊
A couple of last ditch things you can try on the brake bleeding is to unbolt the callipers and hang them so the callipers and bleed nipples are lower and can gravity bleed a little and if that doesn’t work try back bleeding through the bleed nipple.
Metro turbo 4pots that were a popular upgrade on minis back in the day, had to be bled simultaneously. bleed pipe or catch pipe depending which way you're doing it, a tee and a pipe to each nipple. crack both nipples, bleed and nip up. worth a shot
Hey Jeff, you are experiencing a common motorcycle calliper issue, especially Brembos. The way to fix this is to remove the calliper and turn it 90 degrees then bleed it. Hopefully that solves it for you.
Could the brake issue be hardware rather than air? Maybe flex in the pedal mount somewhere or rod system or something like that
Jeff, from what I saw at the start when you were playing with the underfloor brake linkage, I think your spongey brakes are just due to linkage flex, because it's a "push" on a long, reasonably small diameter rod.
There is occasionally a problem with multi part calipers where air gets trapped in and around the seals and wont bleed out. disassembling the calipers and bathing the seals in break fluid and squeezing out any air pockets while assembling is about the only option other than using high vacuum . this problem is made worse by thick greasy assembly lubricant .
In many cases the problem self corrects once enough heat cycles have occurred .
Flushing brake lines with methanol helps.
If you're going to use vacuum wrap the bleeders in teflon tape or even candle wax or bubble gum to seal the threads from sucking in air.
If you have long runs of rubber brake lines check for expansion/ballooning. Replace with hardline or at least braided
BLEVE!!!
Good luck tomorrow morning, Jeff
Your RH side exhaust flex joint looks like it's under a lot of stress - it may not last long at that angle?
90% done, and 90% left to go. Did Mrs. Jeff her hair done??? Looks fabulous!
Hey Jeff
You might have to try and put the brake fluid reservoir back in the engine bay so that is the highest point in the system like the factory one was.
Re brakes, the linkage at the master cylinder end looked a little flexible when you were manipulating it. Could that be the issue?
I pointed out last time you were under the brake box that your balance bar is twisting and forcing the short pushrods into angles rather than a straight "push". I can still see them doing this in this video
This is the likely cause of the soft pedal.
As someone else has pointed out, you need to put Mrs Jeff in the car while you're under it so you can watch what's going on when she presses the pedal.
Jim from Alfaholics
I think that is definitely part of my issue and next time I will work on rectifying that similarly to how you guys have.
@@HomeBuiltByJeff ours has the balance bar in a tube so it can't move BUT if the lock nut isn't tight it will twist and cause a spongey pedal like you're getting. I've had to put a strong warning in the fitting guide about this!
I've been following this build for a while, and started thinking about power steering on my own 105. So i started googling and found your latest video😂.
I suspect your master cylinder piston size is too small for the size of calipers. Will require more pedal effort but a larger piston will give increased fluid volume for a given pedal movement and this improves the feel. I would put the pressure switch back in for the brake lights as it isnt that.
Nice work! If you look at the last episode of Retro power you csn see what the did change to the Alfa rear axle a couple off years ago
Commenting for the algorithm……..Battery trickle charger wiring? Love your work….
Floor mounted pedals Alfa cars are tricky to bleed. I've bled, driven around for a week, pressure bled and droved around for a month and I intend to bleed again as it's still not 100% right.
Another brake issue that I have seen in the past and could be causing your issues are weak callipers structurally. I have seen these aftermarket calipers flex with pressure. From reputable sellers. Try pointing a camera to the caliper and brake and check for movement.
G’day mate,
Firstly, love the show, the crazy cars that you create are absolutely amazing.
Secondly, when I was a mechanic in the army, we had the land rover 6x6’s, they were an absolute pain in the butt to bleed. We tried everything, but the way we were able to bleed them was to leave the front wheels on the ground and jack the rear as high as we could. Then go through the normal way of bleeding the brakes. With the ass so high the air would definitely come out of the rear brake line. Hope this helps.
Mouse
Same with my VW. Raise the rear to a semi absurd angle and manual bleed for the win.
I build furniture and it’s the same…the last 10% is a slow, patience testing endeavor. It’s a beautiful car dude!😊
Maybe its the camera angle but it looks like the upper rod is at an angle to the other rod instead of being straight. If thats the case it could be slowing down the brake travel and making the pedal feel softer.
For the brakes, I have often found it the new brake pad material that can improve after bedding in. You could replace all the pads with solid metal just to try the static pedal feel first?
Otherwise I would focus on the master cylinder. Is it new?
Good luck tomorrow mate 🤞🏼
Ditto mechanical flex, you need someone to push the pedal HARD so you can observe what is happening underneth there. Also as another poster said, bung the master at the outlet, then try other 4 corners, isolating one corner, then another then another etc.
Also , the angle of incidence where the rod interacts with the little idler arm at the master cylinder end of the mech.
Presented with such a spongy brake pedal, I would look at trying to pin point whether the sponginess is present in the front, rear or both brake circuits. I would do this by isolating (disabling) the rear brakes to see if the sponginess remains present with only the front brakes being active and then repeat by disabling the front brakes to see if the sponginess continues with the active rear brakes.
Hello Jeff! I would inspect the need of a bigger brake master cylinder due to the bigger brake caliper upgrade.
One thing I ran into with building new brake lines at the t valve u have the flare nut could be a short thread one and you might need a long thread one, that would get air into the system
Gday jeff
Love the videos
Try a line locker clamp on each brake hose to see if the pedel changes if it goes hard remove 1 clamp at a time to see if it goes soft again then that might narrow it down to which area
Ive had the bleed nipple tapper leak before
A $4.50 bleed nipple arrr took me about 2 days to work that out haha
Take it easy mate Byron from WA 👍
G'day Jeff,
A great video! You're so close now.
About your brakes. I have a 63 VW Beetle. After finishing the front disc brake conversion, I could not get a firm pedal no matter what I tried. Eventually, it was recommended to me to install a 2psi residual valve from Wilwood on the rear brake circuit at the master cylinder. I did that, and it did the job.
✌️ Peace.
Always one of my top 3 or 4 channels Jeff. THANK YOU.
If the pedal softness is due to excessive mechanical advantage, you could try to alter the hydraulic ratio by going to a larger diameter master cylinder.
pedal pressure check piston seal on master cylinder or bleed with rear on the ground and front wheels as high as you can get, then bleed.
I have a 73 alfa spider which has the same standing pedal arrangement and redundant brake line system and the same t piece. I am not sure how much you have varied from the same system, but, I can tell you these brakes are notoriously hard to bleed. I power bleed mine and still get a soft feel pedal. I also thought it was the t piece , but no it isn't. I'm sure its the standing pedal arrangement. While the brakes feel a bit soft they do stop the car really well. I live down from the road from you, you can take my car for a spin to see if you get the same feel if you wish.
Do you need motivation Jeff??? Only look that beautiful car you made!!! A second reason: this is one of the best hobbies ever! Yes, the last 10% needs 90% of you time, but if restoring and modifying old cars were easy, everybody will do it, and there would be no reasons at all to see this kind of channels. Keep motoring!
Throw an action cam under the car watching the master cylinder linkage mess. See if there is flex in any of that. Also, maybe there is bulkhead flex adding to the squishy feeling.
Have you considered the fact that the brake master cylinder is positioned quite low in comparison to the calipers? Most master cylinders are higher up in the car. Just something to think about.
I ended up using a banjo bolt switch, all integrated in one instead of the old switch like yours
I'm happy you fixed the power steering, it's a bit different from my son's Mitsubishi which had no power steering at idle. There the issue was that the alternator was worn out while the power steering only worked from 13 Volts and up.
You are soooooooo right about the last 10% and the motivation.
When the master cylinder is mounted low it the vehicle. You should put a 10 lb. Residual valve in line. Especially with the front brakes…
Good luck with the engineer
Good job fella, awesome work.
That's wheelie 😂good Jeff
One thing I noticed you've not checked on your brakes, is the crossover pipe on the front calipers.
I understand the pitfall of assuming they're brand new and should be fine, but they would have been tested and then sat with fluid I them for ages and maybe an o-ring is weeping!
You could disconnect an individual caliper and plug the line and check to see if you get pedal.
I had a brand new set of Stop Tech calipers many years ago that had bad seals out of the box.
Well done, think for the brakes you need 4 friends and bleed all the callipers at once
Could it not be the master cylinder that is broken ?
Oh and you better let us know the outcome of the engineer on Monday 🤪
Hi Jeff,
Re brakes; in my experience, until new pads (especially big ones) are really, really bedded in, they often feel spongy. It’s like the bedding-in actually hardens up the pad material.
Maybe the master cylinder bore is incorrect too (although I’m sure you thought of that at the time, I don’t remember)??
Sterling work as usual!!!
Almost there big fella 🎉
Getting on top of it now , hope all goes well with engineer. As you said its all the small things. keep with it! Bill Mc
i had the problem once with the brake pedal feeling soft , spongeé ,, on a jaguar with a big brake kit , and we found out when pressing the brakes the caliper would expand as if they where made of plastic you could even see the calipers expand !!
, took the brake calipers off , put on the original brake calipers and no more problems !!
Hi Jeff!
About the brakes - maybe somebody already mentionded, but - if you have a rubber brake line in the system - it may be soft - when stepping on the brake pedal, instead of going firm, you are stretching a line. I cant think of anything else really that could cause that.
Wishing the best and thank you for sharing all of your work here!
Great job Jeff…
Great work Jeff! Mate I would definitely replace that battery isolation red switch! They are totally unreliable. Have a look at the Moroso type switch or equivalent, they are a heavier duty reliable switch 👍🏻
Blooper Princess reaches new heights
We believe every word Mrs Jeff speaks so we would happily change every detail of any model 😂
Brakes only stop you so you don’t need the “ fun stoppers” 🏴
Have you consider master cylinder piston size? if the big brake kit caliper piston swept area is increased, then the master cylinder needs to displace more fluid for a given pressure, that will cause a "long soft" pedal. Just a few MM increase in cylinder size can make a big difference. Ask me how I know.
Try to run a larger front master cylinder. The feel perception could be an incorrectly sized Mc.
Mike I had a similar situation in a 66 A100 that we did an LS transplant on. We re engineered the mechanical design between the pedal and the MC. The angles of pivot made the breaking soft. We changed the leverage and the breakers were strong. Also a superheat question but your breaks are not vacuumed to the engine right? Many modern brake systems use vacuumed from the engine. Great project and probably the best AR I have ever scene brother!!
Try bleeding the brakes by doing the front and rear of the same side at the same time , you have a biased brake system and the rears are probably not bottomed out at full stroke and trapping some air or reset the biased box so both front and rear bottom out at full stroke bleed then reset the biased
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