Mega dittoes brother! I’ve replaced many switches and receptacles burned to a crisp from backstabbed connections. None of them tripped AFCI breakers. But I’ve seen the breakers nuisance trip from a radio being plugged in. Faulty technology shoved down our throats by overzealous authorities and greedy manufacturers.
If you search, you should find documentation stating something to the effect that it takes 70amps (or more) of load to detect arcing with these devices. Ironically, as I’m sure you’re privy to… regular 15-20amp breakers do a really good job of tripping at this current level too 🤨. However, I think it would be interesting for you to do a comparison with a high inrush- like a motor load from standard breaker vs afci…
That is insane the moment is started arching it should have tripped that's what it's for it says to prevent arcing for homes Etc don't catch on fire I'm electrician residential and Commercial as of lately that's all we've been doing is putting those in I already didn't like them putting them on a GFI makes no sense to me but they are making us do it thank you I appreciate the video
Somewhat. Arcing produces sparks, but might require a microscope to see. Continuous arcing inside a receptacle at the worn-out loose contacts that barely hold the plug, powering a space heater, will smell, buzz, but with sparking very localized. The spark we all see when plugging in electronic equipment is very short and harmless... because it is short and not sustained.
But is this a true test based on the devices specifications. You’re not talking about what are the specifications that the device is built and listed under what you are the time/arc loads that actually tripped the device and what are you doing in reference to that are the arcs that you are creating within the realm of what was designed and listed. What is the UL listing and testing for these devices Unfortunately I feel what you are doing here is sensationalism to a degree
Secondly again this is sensationalism without performance of what you’re doing. If you plug in an AFCI tester I’m sure your device will trip. But what you are not showing is what kind of an arc in milliamps are you actually drawing so if you don’t own one go rent a couple thousand dollar tester the contract the continuous number of arcs you are producing and what their actual peaks are on a chart
To a degree yes. But my only point in this video is if you have this going on in your walls, you certainly would want this to work immediately. I don't care about the little insignificant arcs that have no consequence. I think you're missing the point of the instruction.
If I put my engineer’s hat on, then I would say that the product is performing as designed. If I put my consumer / homeowner hat on, I would say what good is this product? Mt. Stark is an educator and he is teaching that AFCI technology does not function and protect as consumers and homeowners think it should. Lesson taught. Lesson learned. Thank you Mr. Stark.
@@ericstark6183 trust me I get the insinuation of what you’re trying to prove, I’ve been an electrician for 50 years, and everything from a damn shed to a 20 story building. Better yet why don’t you see what kind of sparks those parking maneuvers you are performing wood light with typical building materials how about showing if that would actually even happen and you still didn’t answer the question of why the breaker didn’t trip to the real testing get the real gear show what’s really happening and why this won’t trip the breaker
@@J-Jim did I or did you ever see some sort of video or message from any agency or group that says the AFCI breaker will protect you from this I don’t think I ever caught that. Now I guess the average consumer might think this but I don’t know I haven’t asked any of them, And I’ve never had one of my customers even ask me. This is sensationalism pure and simple. He’s not proving that the breaker is bad he’s showing things that can happen and he is not showing what the breakers design covers. See my response to him above
It’s been a while since I’ve looked, but I haven’t seen any manufacturer’s specific breaker tripping arc profiles. I do know that results very widely. Arc fault testers from Amprobe, Ideal, and Klein do state their test methodology of number of pulses per second (arcs) of a certain load / amperage. These are fixed pulses per second. I’ve always thought that AFCI equipment looked for pulses (arcs) that were in a random pattern within a specific time frame. Perhaps the AFCI equipment manufacturers have released this information for their breakers and receptacles by now.
Mega dittoes brother! I’ve replaced many switches and receptacles burned to a crisp from backstabbed connections. None of them tripped AFCI breakers. But I’ve seen the breakers nuisance trip from a radio being plugged in. Faulty technology shoved down our throats by overzealous authorities and greedy manufacturers.
If you search, you should find documentation stating something to the effect that it takes 70amps (or more) of load to detect arcing with these devices. Ironically, as I’m sure you’re privy to… regular 15-20amp breakers do a really good job of tripping at this current level too 🤨. However, I think it would be interesting for you to do a comparison with a high inrush- like a motor load from standard breaker vs afci…
That is insane the moment is started arching it should have tripped that's what it's for it says to prevent arcing for homes Etc don't catch on fire I'm electrician residential and Commercial as of lately that's all we've been doing is putting those in I already didn't like them putting them on a GFI makes no sense to me but they are making us do it thank you I appreciate the video
How is the best way to figure out a nuisance trip on a afci siemens breaker.
To prove your point why did you not compare other brand arc breakers to sell your findings?
Stay tuned in. G.E. will be next
is an arc the same as a spark?
No, an arc is electric current jumping a gap between 2 conductors. Arcs produce sparks.
Somewhat. Arcing produces sparks, but might require a microscope to see. Continuous arcing inside a receptacle at the worn-out loose contacts that barely hold the plug, powering a space heater, will smell, buzz, but with sparking very localized.
The spark we all see when plugging in electronic equipment is very short and harmless... because it is short and not sustained.
But is this a true test based on the devices specifications. You’re not talking about what are the specifications that the device is built and listed under what you are the time/arc loads that actually tripped the device and what are you doing in reference to that are the arcs that you are creating within the realm of what was designed and listed. What is the UL listing and testing for these devices Unfortunately I feel what you are doing here is sensationalism to a degree
Secondly again this is sensationalism without performance of what you’re doing. If you plug in an AFCI tester I’m sure your device will trip. But what you are not showing is what kind of an arc in milliamps are you actually drawing so if you don’t own one go rent a couple thousand dollar tester the contract the continuous number of arcs you are producing and what their actual peaks are on a chart
To a degree yes. But my only point in this video is if you have this going on in your walls, you certainly would want this to work immediately. I don't care about the little insignificant arcs that have no consequence. I think you're missing the point of the instruction.
If I put my engineer’s hat on, then I would say that the product is performing as designed. If I put my consumer / homeowner hat on, I would say what good is this product? Mt. Stark is an educator and he is teaching that AFCI technology does not function and protect as consumers and homeowners think it should. Lesson taught. Lesson learned. Thank you Mr. Stark.
@@ericstark6183 trust me I get the insinuation of what you’re trying to prove, I’ve been an electrician for 50 years, and everything from a damn shed to a 20 story building. Better yet why don’t you see what kind of sparks those parking maneuvers you are performing wood light with typical building materials how about showing if that would actually even happen and you still didn’t answer the question of why the breaker didn’t trip to the real testing get the real gear show what’s really happening and why this won’t trip the breaker
@@J-Jim did I or did you ever see some sort of video or message from any agency or group that says the AFCI breaker will protect you from this I don’t think I ever caught that. Now I guess the average consumer might think this but I don’t know I haven’t asked any of them, And I’ve never had one of my customers even ask me. This is sensationalism pure and simple. He’s not proving that the breaker is bad he’s showing things that can happen and he is not showing what the breakers design covers. See my response to him above
It’s been a while since I’ve looked, but I haven’t seen any manufacturer’s specific breaker tripping arc profiles. I do know that results very widely. Arc fault testers from Amprobe, Ideal, and Klein do state their test methodology of number of pulses per second (arcs) of a certain load / amperage. These are fixed pulses per second. I’ve always thought that AFCI equipment looked for pulses (arcs) that were in a random pattern within a specific time frame. Perhaps the AFCI equipment manufacturers have released this information for their breakers and receptacles by now.