I've been producing for a very long time yet, I never really gave this a thorough look-through. Really useful information, thank you Seamless! You are making me feel like I should really start questioning why a sound does what it does and really pick it apart.
I think you're misunderstanding a few concepts. A flanger is the effect that mirrors a comb filter, not a phaser, because they are literally the same thing, a very short delay like the guy in the chat was talking about. The only difference is a flanger has built in modulation of the delay time (aka "cutoff" of the comb filter). A flanger with positive feedback, and a comb filter with an lfo on the cutoff are literally the same thing. The reason it appeared to be multiple notches in your stereo enhancer example is because you didn't have any feedback, adding feedback creates the peaks you expect from a comb. A phaser works a little bit differently. The sound is processed through a series of allpass filters (this is the number of "stages" in a phaser). An allpass does what you'd think it would, passes the entire sound through. However, like all filters, the phase around the cutoff is pretty heavily altered despite the frequency response remaining the same. By itself, you don't really hear allpass filtering. However when you combine the allpassed signal with the dry, huge amounts of phase cancellation occurs at the cutoff point (this is where the name "phaser" comes from). This results in a notch, and is also a 1-stage phaser with no feedback. Add feedback, and the result is a narrower notch followed by a peak. Add more allpass filters (stages), and you have the notch-peak thing repeating, this is why it can kinda sound like a flanger/comb filter, but is actually achieved in a much different way. Also in regards to the scream filter, it works by feeding some of the output of the filter back into the input. This is a really crude approximation of the behavior of certain kinds of analog filters. So conceptually it's similar to a comb filter/flanger (very short delay with feedback, the "scream" knob is the feedback amount), only it's being low-passed at each stage, and possibly saturated. That's why as you noticed it's similar to a comb filter. It does self oscillate, in fact a number or really common dubstep sounds work by feeding 1-2 sine waves (a few octaves apart) into the scream filter and modulating the self oscillation with the 3 parameters.
Flanger works by fast delay, Phaser is combining a signal with an all-passed version of itself. All-pass filters don't change the frequency response but change the phase of different frequencies differently. So at a very high level they are similar, but result in slightly different sounds. Flanger peak frequencies are all multiples of the inverse of the delay length, and phaser peak frequencies are some insane voodoo depending on the implementation of the allpass filter.
SeamlessR Claryfying. Allpass filter doesn't actually filter anything, it just outputs the input. The thing there is resonance, though. Flanger works by copying the incoming signal, delaying it a little bit, and mixing it together with the original. Chorus works by creating multiple copies of the signal that are slightly detuned. Phaser works much like flanger, but it's shifting the phase of the copy.
+Geez Help actually, a phaser is: double signals, but 1 inverted by 180 degrees and that second signal is going thru an eq with high peaks (feedback) and deep notches. Also, a comb filter is "a phaser", but with flanger characteristics. So NO phasing, but delaying. From all the modulating fx, the phaser is the only one without a delay.
I use the stereo shaper on some percussion stuff sometimes to give it a different sound quality (with mono-ing ofc) ^^ pretty sure I heard that being done in some house tracks as well, like on the kick here? soundcloud.com/de-hofnar/sophie-hunger-le-vent-nous not 100% sure but I think so, with the delay value being automated so the top end of the kick sounds a bit different each time (and the phase value maybe)
Saw and Triangle Waves seem like great waves to use for basses when you apply these effects, problem is, in my environment (Headphones) if I play straight saw or triangle waves for a long time while designing, my ears start to go deaf for a little while
Dusty Shane Yeah, but it's weird, if I highpass saw or triangle waves then my ears don't get tired of it, and any other wave I can play for hours just fine, however sub for any wave doesn't affect me, only high frequency rich sounds in the 5Khz+ range with saw or triangle waves hurt my ears, and only those two
Last night i was messing around in EQUO and i by mistake automated one filter knob but they do not move left and right only up and down? If you know about this sorry but i thought it was cool.
If you are automating them left and right you are automating the frequency of the EQ. If you are automating them up and down you are automating the gain of that EQ knob.
hi, mister #SeamlessR. in this video you`v just used a #phaser right quick before the #parametricEQ. So that can be possible in effect chanel or this is an other type of #rankmount,,,THANKs as usual have a nc day.
You seriously don't know what a COMB is? It LOOKS like a comb, and so the filter uses the same name. You've got visual and auditory information and you can't put the two together? :(
@@goo894 I think that is stretching it with that line of thought. You could argue that a bath tub is a trough in a sine wave made of ceramic material instead. Again, stretching reality there.
@@lucidityofpower807 Bro chill out i just suck at English. I've always thought that comb is pronounced as "coom" just like tomb is pronounced toom. That misled me.
@@goo894 Well, okay. Nothing about English is consistent. English is my third language and I struggle with some things in it because of the aforementioned inconsistency in pronunciation. Don't worry about it. This stuff reminds me of the pronunciation of words like "caulk" that sounds a lot like something else if not said correctly :P
The whole comb filter thing needs a lot more elaboration. A comb ""filter"" is a result and not a tool. It's a sound("exciter") passed through a super short delay line, and filtered on a per-stage basis. That's the Karplus-Strong technique, and it's the building block of all modal synthesis.
thanks you seamless, my music would be nothing without you.
I've been producing for a very long time yet, I never really gave this a thorough look-through. Really useful information, thank you Seamless! You are making me feel like I should really start questioning why a sound does what it does and really pick it apart.
I think you're misunderstanding a few concepts. A flanger is the effect that mirrors a comb filter, not a phaser, because they are literally the same thing, a very short delay like the guy in the chat was talking about. The only difference is a flanger has built in modulation of the delay time (aka "cutoff" of the comb filter). A flanger with positive feedback, and a comb filter with an lfo on the cutoff are literally the same thing. The reason it appeared to be multiple notches in your stereo enhancer example is because you didn't have any feedback, adding feedback creates the peaks you expect from a comb. A phaser works a little bit differently. The sound is processed through a series of allpass filters (this is the number of "stages" in a phaser). An allpass does what you'd think it would, passes the entire sound through. However, like all filters, the phase around the cutoff is pretty heavily altered despite the frequency response remaining the same. By itself, you don't really hear allpass filtering. However when you combine the allpassed signal with the dry, huge amounts of phase cancellation occurs at the cutoff point (this is where the name "phaser" comes from). This results in a notch, and is also a 1-stage phaser with no feedback. Add feedback, and the result is a narrower notch followed by a peak. Add more allpass filters (stages), and you have the notch-peak thing repeating, this is why it can kinda sound like a flanger/comb filter, but is actually achieved in a much different way. Also in regards to the scream filter, it works by feeding some of the output of the filter back into the input. This is a really crude approximation of the behavior of certain kinds of analog filters. So conceptually it's similar to a comb filter/flanger (very short delay with feedback, the "scream" knob is the feedback amount), only it's being low-passed at each stage, and possibly saturated. That's why as you noticed it's similar to a comb filter. It does self oscillate, in fact a number or really common dubstep sounds work by feeding 1-2 sine waves (a few octaves apart) into the scream filter and modulating the self oscillation with the 3 parameters.
Flanger works by fast delay, Phaser is combining a signal with an all-passed version of itself. All-pass filters don't change the frequency response but change the phase of different frequencies differently. So at a very high level they are similar, but result in slightly different sounds. Flanger peak frequencies are all multiples of the inverse of the delay length, and phaser peak frequencies are some insane voodoo depending on the implementation of the allpass filter.
SeamlessR Claryfying. Allpass filter doesn't actually filter anything, it just outputs the input. The thing there is resonance, though. Flanger works by copying the incoming signal, delaying it a little bit, and mixing it together with the original. Chorus works by creating multiple copies of the signal that are slightly detuned. Phaser works much like flanger, but it's shifting the phase of the copy.
+Geez Help actually, a phaser is: double signals, but 1 inverted by 180 degrees and that second signal is going thru an eq with high peaks (feedback) and deep notches.
Also, a comb filter is "a phaser", but with flanger characteristics. So NO phasing, but delaying. From all the modulating fx, the phaser is the only one without a delay.
Thank you Seamless. This was very informative. I also found out today that my first track was just a shit ton of formant filters.
Comb filters also sound like running a pencil or whatever over a comb. Bonus points if you can find a metal comb to do this with.
This was video was very very helpful, thanks alot seamless!
I use the stereo shaper on some percussion stuff sometimes to give it a different sound quality (with mono-ing ofc) ^^ pretty sure I heard that being done in some house tracks as well, like on the kick here? soundcloud.com/de-hofnar/sophie-hunger-le-vent-nous not 100% sure but I think so, with the delay value being automated so the top end of the kick sounds a bit different each time (and the phase value maybe)
thanks as always!
From my old comment on another video, nevermind, I found some videos like this that will teach me how to Reese. Lol. Thanks SeamlessR!
How did u get massive filters? And the massive in fruity wrapper.. I'm not able to do the same.. And not able to find massive too
Massive is a seperate plugin
Saw and Triangle Waves seem like great waves to use for basses when you apply these effects, problem is, in my environment (Headphones) if I play straight saw or triangle waves for a long time while designing, my ears start to go deaf for a little while
*****
I don't get it for any other wave, and it's mostly higher frequency sounds that do it, really low sub doesn't affect me in any wave
Dusty Shane
Yeah, but it's weird, if I highpass saw or triangle waves then my ears don't get tired of it, and any other wave I can play for hours just fine, however sub for any wave doesn't affect me, only high frequency rich sounds in the 5Khz+ range with saw or triangle waves hurt my ears, and only those two
Last night i was messing around in EQUO and i by mistake automated one filter knob but they do not move left and right only up and down? If you know about this sorry but i thought it was cool.
He does indeed know this. It just depends on what you automate
If you are automating them left and right you are automating the frequency of the EQ. If you are automating them up and down you are automating the gain of that EQ knob.
Yes why tho? lol why the fuck would i wan tto auto mate a freq band only up and down lol no filter? WTF
Moses
I didn't get a word of what you said. Are you a troll or is your english just really bad? No offense, just wondering
Can you explain SVF (State Variable Filters)?
initially i was gonna be a smartass about how a phaser isn't a comb filter, but the chat seems to have taken care of that
Correction: A comb filter is a combination of a bunch of NOTCH filters, not peak filters ... and all the notches are harmonically related
hi, mister #SeamlessR. in this video you`v just used a #phaser right quick before the #parametricEQ. So that can be possible in effect chanel or this is an other type of #rankmount,,,THANKs as usual have a nc day.
Nice
very useful!
10:37 a good time to detach your stuff :P
Is it just me or does the audio kind of delay half way of the video??
So how many people have already pre-ordered the new EP? I know I have :)
A what? A Coouuume-Filter? O.o How is it written?
You seriously don't know what a COMB is? It LOOKS like a comb, and so the filter uses the same name. You've got visual and auditory information and you can't put the two together? :(
@@lucidityofpower807 I heard it as "cone". You know it kinda looks like a bunch of cones too.
@@goo894 I think that is stretching it with that line of thought. You could argue that a bath tub is a trough in a sine wave made of ceramic material instead. Again, stretching reality there.
@@lucidityofpower807 Bro chill out i just suck at English. I've always thought that comb is pronounced as "coom" just like tomb is pronounced toom. That misled me.
@@goo894 Well, okay. Nothing about English is consistent. English is my third language and I struggle with some things in it because of the aforementioned inconsistency in pronunciation. Don't worry about it. This stuff reminds me of the pronunciation of words like "caulk" that sounds a lot like something else if not said correctly :P
''Beand-peass eas better myean''
The whole comb filter thing needs a lot more elaboration.
A comb ""filter"" is a result and not a tool. It's a sound("exciter") passed through a super short delay line, and filtered on a per-stage basis.
That's the Karplus-Strong technique, and it's the building block of all modal synthesis.
SeamlessR estoteric isn't a food..
First. Sorry, needed to do it.
It had to be done
Dislike. Sorry, needed to do it.
GoDnEzZTV Dislikes dont even work lol
FlutterShades
I noticed that...