In my opinion it is evident that a game designed for an audience of ten years and older has simplified rules. I played Heroquest when I was 13, in 1989, and the simple rules quickly got me hooked on a game that, at the time, added a 3D aspect to completely "imaginary" D&D games. In a very short time my best friend and I combined the world of D&D with Heroquest, starting from those extremely simple rules and improving them, and at the same time simplifying some aspects of D&D: halfway through we found our winning formula... An example on all: the mind points of the monsters correspond to the experience points earned after each kill, and with a table created by us, every few experience points our hero can level up. The undead have mind 0, so pain in the ass without reward... and so on. Great video about your personal experience with Heroquest! Thanks!
I still have the original HeroQuest and every time I open the closet and see that box I realize how much I miss those afternoons with my friends like 900 years ago.
Those are the times that make nostalgia games worth revisiting, for sure! It's the same reason why I still love games like Talisman. Playing Talisman teleports me back to great times.
As an 80’s kid I loved Steve Jackson & Ian Livingstones Fighting Fantasy books along with the iconic Arcade game Gauntlet. When Hero Quest was released I was about 17 years old but unfortunately missed out on playing it due to sporting opportunities. Now at the age of 52 I’ve recently purchased the Hero Quest Game System and am thoroughly enjoying playing it with my 6 year old grandson, especially with your recommendation of the Hero Quest APP, acting as Zargon.
My uncle had an original box of Heroquest long after it was out of print in the early 00s. Used to play it all the time with him and my dad. He eventually gave me the game while he was cleaning out his closet a few years later. I wish I could find it and restore the box like it deserves. RIP to both of them. Some of my fondest memories.
When I first saw the box when I was a kid, I was a bit intimidated by the art of the skeleton and the mummy and I couldn't get them out of my head. 3 days later I asked my grandma of I could have HeroQuest for my birthday.
This was my first entry to deeper board games and as a 10 year old back in 1990, the rules felt really deep and complex to me. I loved it. Of course, by today's standards it is quaint. I still love the grim fantasy setting and the art presentation a lot though. I think few dungeon crawlers since have been able to capture it as well.
I love your videos and value your reviews on so many games. Look forward to your content with every new vid. That said, I’m also a big HeroQuest fan and have played continually throughout the decades, introducing new people to it even before Avalon Hill’s revival. I’d really like to see you review it after playing it with a group of friends or family… at least a few quests or a full campaign. It really is a “beer and pretzels” game and shines when you have a group that just wants to chuck some dice, tell some stories, have some laughs and perhaps throw back some adult beverages. Your take on it may change when it’s played in that context. Your approach may have been to review it with a modern understanding of dungeon crawls, but I feel like many of your comments about what they “should have done” don’t take into account the time in which this game was designed and the unique place it has in the development of dungeon crawl games. Avalon Hill and Hasbro went the route of doing a straight reprint rather than a modern update and I think most fans appreciate it. Many more would be up in arms if they tried to modernize it or make major changes. For this reason, it really needs to be seen in the context of the time it was designed. Furthermore, modern gamers may complain that it lacks modern sensibilities, but I’ve introduced it to dozens of non gamers and they always have a blast. They aren’t complaining about “move to roll” or a limited bestiary. It still really excels at introducing tabletop miniature gaming to people who otherwise have no experience with it. Anyway, I’ve ranted long enough. I really do enjoy your channel. I’d love to hear your thoughts after playing HeroQuest with some friends or family.
And I like roll to move! Many of my favorite games have roll to move. My main criticisms are lack of variety and a dull bestiary. But I’ve fixed both of those issues for solo play! I also LOVE old games. So that’s not the issue as well. :) Talisman is in my top 10 of all time, and that’s older than HQ. You’ll like what I have to say about it in episode 3. That’s where I talk about the things I like. :)
I also missed the original release of HeroQuest back in the day - I’m pretty sure I saw it in a toy store but for whatever reason passed on it. And it would have been right up my alley - I loved D&D, CRPG’s like Wizardry and the Bard’s Tale and Ultima. It wasn’t until many many years later I saw people online praising it and I got interested. And when I did finally get a copy…just loved it. Have gone all in on the new Hasbro release, love playing it with the kids and on the app.
I *think* my mother's boyfriend had a copy in the early 90s but I have little to no memory of playing, or it sticking with me. I did remember simplified rules. I was playing an inordinate amount of Ultima IV at the time. Fast forward well over 30 years and I was looking at a Dungeon Crawler (or adjacent) to play with my son (7). Most were too complex, and I almost settled on Zombiecide 2nd ed Then I remembered HeroQuest. It looked a bit too simple. However, the community, home-brews, and modifications sealed the deal. Picked up a copy of the revised ed for £71.00 as a Christmas present for my son
I'm sure I'll get a little flack for not really liking RAW HQ, but that's OK. I just don't have the nostalgia for it that most people do! I do really love the new Hasbro version though. They just nailed it.
I have no experience with the game, but I was eager to hear your thoughts on it since it’s one of the old warhorses. Glad to hear the new version is an improvement!
I wouldn't say it's an improvement, at least not in terms of game play. It's 99% the same game. They just did a really great job producing it, and it's very cool that it's now available for people to buy new again.
I'm a 90's kid but I also never saw this growing up. I own it now but have not yet played it. I can't wait for my daughter to be old enough to play it with me XD
They did start introducing "advanced" versions of the monsters in the HeroQuest app to introduce some variation in play. So far they did the goblins and the skeletons. Advanced goblins can move, attack, and then finish their remaining movement, allowing for some hit and run tactics. Advanced skeletons can attack diagonally, giving them some flexibility in how to attack through doors or whatever. Those are the only official variant abilities for the original HeroQuest monsters I've seen so far. I hope they continue that trend in the app, and I'd love to see official cards of those advanced monsters.
Oh nice! Hopefully we get some "advanced" upgrade packs of cards. I'd love to see the classic heroes get a treatment like the knight in the latest expansion, and the upcoming monk hero. A deck of skill cards would be great.
You say you really wish they had updated some things, changing the original. One reason you hint at.... because for the last 30 years everybody has been changing rules as written and adding complexity and variety to the game. When you talked about this I began to think about the fact that the game, in it's original format, has been around for 30 years. It has been enjoyed by a couple of generations of gamers. It's original format made it inspirational and quite easy to adjust to the user's appetite. In that aspect, the original game wasn't broken. Why fix it? I would imagine the good folks at Avalon Hill had quite an internal debate about how to proceed with the relaunch of HeroQuest. I'm sure they quickly realized that they would not please everybody. Step away from simplicity and "clean up" rules. Add some of the house-rules people have been using for years. Then many of the fans of the original would have been unhappy because they messed with it. Leave it the same, and many would say it's too simple and they just should have added these things that I added to my old copy years ago. In the end, I am quite happy with what they are doing. They started with a near-exact copy. Warts and all. And now as they are adding content most older and newer players never saw, they are adding complexity. Personally, I think they are headed in a great direction. I wouldn't be surprised if they eventually come out with a major expansion that goes along the lines of what the original Advanced Heroquest did. I enjoyed both videos, and look forward to the 3rd in your series.
Thanks for this very informative video, what a great job. Storing games is often an issue. I like to use glass display cabinets for games with many expansions. Talisman 4th edition revised with all 13 expansions is a feast for the eyes, when on display, such great artwork. I'm doing the same for HeroQuest as we already have nine expansions with more on the way. I would also recommend to sleeve the cards in games you wish to keep for a long time, tedious I know, but worth the investment. Looking forward to watching your Runebound videos next. Do you ever paint your miniatures? I find it very relaxing and rewarding. Thanks again, and happy gaming to everyone out there!!!
Right on! Thanks! I do not paint minis. I'm good at it, but I don't like it, and I'm very slow at it. :) I have 30 hours a week to devote to the channel, and painting is the last thing I want to do. That's why I prefer good quality standees and good art. I also don't like sleeving cards. I've been playing hobby games since the mid 80s, and have never really felt the need to. My copy of talisman with paper quality cards from the 80s still looks great. I don't like how sleeved cards take up more space, stacks slide over, and I don't like the way they feel. Also, plastic is terrible for the environment and our bodies! I have a few games sleeved but I'm actually in the process of removing the sleeves and donating them to a local MTG group for their use. I keep some sleeves around from when I DIY cards, as you can see in the subsequent HeroQuest videos. :)
I had a copy in Fresno! (Maybe the last one?) I loved it when I was a kid, it's a big part of what got me into hobby gaming and fantasy stuff in general
Still one of most favorite board games when we talk about art style although I don't play it anymore. I am lucky that I still have my copy of the master edition in excellent condition. Sometimes I take it from the shelf and only look and feel the box cover and the material. It is always a time travel to former childhood days. Actually, I played StarQuest much more than HQ as we were more in SciFi as kids. But HQ looks much better on the board than SQ
Man just wanna say your content is some of the best for ttrpgs and boardgames. Love the Mork Borg stuff, Started collecting and picked up the endless demon deck from Drive-thru Rpg, and looking at more Mork Borg stuff like Fisk Borg, completely addicted! Just waiting on Pirate Borg to be released 🤟👽🤟
I was given a Amazon voucher for my work 10yr anniversary. Just bought the core box, kelars keep and return of the witch lord. Which is exactly the same amount of old school HQ stuff I gad when I was younger. Doubt my kids will want to play, but I'm thinking of mixing some of the Dungeon Saga board pieces and minis and going solo. Either way I'm going to have fun with it
Really cool to get your take on this as someone who did not grow up playing it! As someone who DID (and almost never stopped!), I definitely agree that it needs a good amount of tweaking to have appeal for the modern adult dungeon-crawl gamer. Looking forward to the rest of this series! -Paeter
The basic set up of Heroquest has actually ended up being a boon to the game because it allows everybody to add so much to it that they want. You can add your own rules, your own minis, your own furniture, create your own unique quests, your own heros. You can add unique skills, spells, monsters, literally your imagination is the only limit on what you can do. That and finding some other people to play with. You can create your own add ons to the map. Go anywhere with it. I loved this game as a kid. I still own the entire set of originals as well as the expansions and everytime I pull it out I fondly remember better days as a child. Some people see only a limited game but I see a game with endless possibilities. Nothing stopping you from adding to it. I bought the mythic tier and have all the expansions for that too except for the Dread Moon which I currently can't afford. It is the perfect game to introduce your children to role playing board games and I will be ever greatful to my dad for surprising me with it one day out of the blue as a present way back in 1989.
They definitely had it in California, I bought mine when it first came out at Toys “R” Us in East San Jose, California. Every Toys “R” Us that I visited had a copy at the time and they even had the expansions right next to it on the shelf. This was our D&D and we played it every single day for about six years straight
I only never saw it in Fresno. Can’t make any claims about California at large. :) What did you do with the game to get enough game play for every day for 6 years?
@@TheDungeonDive after we went through all of the campaigns, I began using the provided empty map sheet (in the back of the rule book at the time) to fashion my own campaigns as I was always the GM. We would always have classical music playing, usually the harpsichord and violin sonatas of Bach to liven up each session. We also had a little help from herbal stimulation at the time 😂 which made every session an adventure to say the least. (A little older and wiser now 🤦♂️) Ah the good old days, I believe I was 14 at the time we started playing and I was 21 when I moved out of the neighborhood. I do remember it was by Milton Bradley and not Avalon Hill. Oh and yes, it was well known that Advanced Hero Quest was an expansion and you could only find it in dedicated gaming shops. Bought my copy in a place called The Game Gallery inside of Valley Fair Mall in San Jose California. I don’t think the game store exists anymore but they were the hottest game place at the time.
@@TheDungeonDive it was indeed, but as I’m watching your review on Cartograph, I do completely agree that we are in an incredible time at the moment especially where a lot of OSR style games are resurfacing but with a modern feel. There are just so many great games at the moment, both board and book.
Not sure. I'll put it up on eBay when I do. It's an investment game that I'd like to get some actual good money for to offset the cost of other stuff for the channel.
I assembled together a copy of Heroquest years ago, only missing the board (which I still intend to print in neoprene), Zargon's screen and the box. When news came out of a new edition I was really excited, until I saw the new art. I _don't_ like that _at all._ I understand what they went for, but I seriously thought they missed the ball on that. The minis are great, though, and the Abomination is way cooler than the Fimirs, IMO.
Yeah. Art is totally subjective. I love the old art, and really love the new art. I was surprised because Gary Chalk is my favorite fantasy artist. The new art just has a great vibrancy and energy to it. Totally pops.
Nice! I'm sure it existed in the central valley, I just never saw it or knew of anyone who had it. Even at the early conventions in the area I never saw it. I lived in a HQ void. :)
Yes! HQ with the Dungeon Dive's perspective! Great introduction and looking forward to the next episodes. Btw, being the owner of an original European version, be sure the US is way better (in EU to name a few: no chaos spells, monsters all have 1 body point, less artifacts). There are good videos listing all the differences and evaluating both versions. I ended up printing the US cards and playing with the US rules as a base (and then incorporating many variants, homebrew, enemies etc). Still on my top 5 as an amazing base. I play it regularly solo!
Oh wow! The changes were a lot bigger than I imagined! Do you just work through the quests in the quest books without worrying about "spoiling" things?
@@TheDungeonDive yes many changes indeed. The European version however already had the equipment cards. But not enough in my opinion to compensate for what was missing. I personally play using rolling tables to be found on BGG or using an amazing 2.0 version (in French only) that introduces cards for a new bestiary, traps, locked doors, events, statuses, level up system and even modular dungeons as an option!
I agree about AHQ. I think it's meant to be an add-on for the base game to flesh it out and fix the rules. On its own it's more of a novelty. But the most fun I had with Heroquest was making my own campaigns and running my friends through them. And I make it a lot of fun by adding treasure and mechanics to the game, and improvising a lot of flavortext to make it feel less like a bare bones dungeon crawl.
Oh man, Hero Quest... a game that I would've loved to have grown up with, but by the time I was aware of its existence, it had been out of print for like... 15 years. Sad face. I've still never played it, but I've filled the void with many other games that I've spent far too much money on. Still, you have a pretty fresh perspective, and I think I'll enjoy watching the rest of series. Thanks, Daniel; this wasn't even on my radar, but as a predominantly solo gamer, that might have to be rectified.
I got this for Christmas last year and enjoyed it. We often have time for game late at night when we're already a bit sleepy so having some easy games like this work great. My criticisms of the game are the same as yours, can't wait to homebrew some stuff with my new printer and check out what others have made. I do actually like the roll to move aspect because I feel it simulates the chaos of real battle. Running into things, slipping, using agility, nerves, etc. In a real battle things are not so precise and you need to improvise and adapt. Flawed mechanic in general but works well here IMO. Also leaves room to add more throwing weapons or abilities as a backup plan for when you roll poorly.
Great overview! Have they sorted the issue with the minis being squashed by the packaging (I.e. the Dread Warrior maces and doors were getting bent as the tray was too tight)?
Hero Quest as well as Axis and Allies are intended to be play with 5 people. When more people make bad choices, or are unlucky. The experience playing is shared, and the choice to play can be justified.
I wish they would also release the original skaven minis for purchase. I do like the original chaos warrior and sorcerer also though the new ones do look good also.
Advanced Heroquest is so good, those tiles, the art and the rules. Anyone with minis from other games can enjoy it, their idea was to sell other minis separately, because there are a bunch of monster cards in the game. To me it feels way better than Heroquest. Anybody that is put off by how basic HQ is, should definitely give AHQ a try :)
Enhanced Advanced Heroquest is definitely the way to go with AHQ. Really good compilation of rules. My complaints about AHQ were, as specifically stated, only about the core box as a product. It’s absolutely terrible and not worth the money. You don’t even get enough stuff to play the included adventures. It’s crazy.
Yes I agree, it feels like the purest dungeon crawler, I also really like the character progression, how tight the economy is. Having to pay rent, to buy ingredients for spells and arrows. Just feels so gritty.
Just a heads up. I just bought the new version on Amazon today. It was on sale for $70 something. Seemed like a pretty good deal. Im not sure how long the sale is going on for though.
For our group I've added my own custom evil wizard deck, or what I call the Dread Influence deck. This balances the game a bit and gives Zargon some interesting little events, powers, etc to keep the heroes on their toes.
@@TheDungeonDive The Overlord deck! You know I picked up a copy of Descent 2e about a year ago and going through the Overlord deck I realized a lot of the powers I came up with for HQ is exactly what they had already done. So yes! Just like Descent! 😅
My theory is that the art for advanced HeroQuest was proposed by GW to be the cover of HeroQuest and MB rejected it. So GW went "fine we'll use it for the advanced version."
I don't know somebody converted the hero Quest regular quest to advance heroquest I don't know if they did it for the expansions I think I'm going to work on that project and make tiles from the expansions to fit with the heroquest modular dungeon system and try and get something going there to be able to play all in expansion solo will see
I've never played HeroQuest but I have played a whole lot of HeroScape, which I believe is derived from it. We tried in various ways to make HeroScape more narratively focused over the years. I feel bad because people will see it and ask how they can get it and all I can tell them is that as much as I love it, it's not worth it to acquire anymore. The prices are too high and the terrain inevitably breaks down. I look back at the Target/Walmart prices and weep a little.
Hey Daniel, I have put all the heroquest stuff in the base box (first print big box). Everything fit fine execpt the last expansion, but with your second print edition I think you're gonna have a hard time...
@@TheDungeonDive Ah, my bad. I guess I was too eager to skip to the part where you had unboxed all the goodies from the original set. This was my portal into serious RPGs, as with many other people :)
I have both the original and rerelease versions of this game (and expansions). I haven’t played them yet (well since I was a kid) but I must say I’ll be playing the original version. I really like the quality of the rerelease, but I just cannot get on with the new minis and the way the monsters look. I much prefer the character and aesthetic of the original monsters. And those Abominations have been named well, because that’s exactly what they are! I do prefer the ruleset of the US version of Heroquest. I’m in the UK and I really don’t like that all monsters have just 1 body point (including the Gargoyle!) and there are no Chaos Spells. I’m currently in the process of printing out the booklets and cards for the original US version so I can play with that ruleset.
Nice! Hope you have fun. I'm just the opposite. Even though I am a HUGE fan of Gary Chalk and old school art, as is evident with how much I talk about both in many videos, I'll be selling my original HQ stuff and keeping / playing only the Hasbro version. For me it's just better in every way.
This is a sacred game that brought most of us to the hobby. In my opinion the art of the MB release is superior and not comparable at all with the new one
For me that game was D&D and Talisman. I think most people agree with you on the art. I like both, but I think I actually prefer the new one. It's just such a well produced product. I'm going to sell my original copy. There's just no need for it now.
I actually just traded my entire super complete set of Blackstone Fortress for a copy of Advanced hero Quest with a copy of regular old heroquest and a few expansions the older one Keller's keep Return of the witch Lord but I also came with a bunch of Miniatures to represent the tokens that came in advance heroquest I actually got the Miniatures for them too so I think it's a pretty good deal and also got some cash I can't wait to try it out also I didn't back the new hero Quest and I have all the new expansions I tell you what I bought one of them neoprene boards they're actually a lot bigger and I could never go back to the original boards that are questioning with but anyways I'm just rambling now LOL
tl;dr; I really wish they updated the rules and this wasn't simply a reprint. I should've skipped this because I have many better dungeon crawlers. However, with many mods that are available, maybe this can be on par or better than other dungeon crawlers. I remembering asking my parents to buy this game for me when I was 13 or 14 years old. Having 4 other siblings, this was just too much for them to buy at that time. Fast forward to a year ago, when I heard they were reprinting it and I purchased it immediately. Brought it home, started reading the rules because I had never read the rules before. I completely based my new purchase on how I felt as a teenager and boy do I have some buyer's remorse not doing some more research on it before I bought it. I had played many other dungeon crawlers like Descent 2nd Ed, Massive Darkness, Village Attacks, Sword & Sorcery, etc... There are so many better dungeon crawlers, especially if you are a solo player. I'll stay tuned for your part 3 video with your thoughts on how you like the new version and/or if you'll be adding in community mods.
@@TheDungeonDive oh I see. I get that. A lot of people act not serious enough when in a game. I am thinking about starting it with my son, he is 10. I think we will have a great time with it.
There’s a fine line between streamlined and basic, and I think RAW HQ falls on the wrong side. And I am a HUGE champion for effortless fun and simplistic games, as is evident by so many of my videos.
I am all about effortless fun, for sure! I just want a couple more layers on top of the HQ foundation, and luckily those are out there to employ. One of the main things I look for is variety, and for me, HQ is lacking in that department out of the box.
Gary Chalk is my favorite artist. I love old school art. I also like new art. I think the new look of HQ is fantastic. It’s ok to like both. No need to pick a team.
Imagine trying to get someone into modern Dungeon Diving and breaking out this antiquated junk. That would be like trying to get someone into modern boardgames with a roll-and-move game...oh wait....
That's why it fell flat when I played it with a group, RAW. There are just so many better games now, and since none of us had the nostalgia it just didn't do much. However, I still love games like Talisman, but that's because I do have nostalgia for it. Nostalgia is a powerful, wonderful, and troubling thing for sure.
I’ve played HQ consistently throughout the years with groups of non-gamers, folks with no previous experience in tabletop games or preconceived “modern game sensibilities” and everyone always has a blast. It remains a great introduction to the tabletop dungeon crawl.
I'll be honest, I've never got the fuss of Heroquest. I bought it when it first came out, from a Games Workshop store in Manchester UK. me and my friend pooled our pocket money. We couldn't wait to get it home to try it....and we were completely underwhelmed. I'm pretty sure I basically binned it a few months later. Pity I didn't keep it. Would be worth a fortune now.
Love this game but due to a lack of a good solo option (and I don’t mean an app, may as well play a pc game) I no longer own any Heroquest. But it’s still a classic that I have fond memories of
I share the same feeling with you. As someone with no nostalgia with Heroquest, there really isn’t much to the base game and the 1 vs many design means it is not playable by myself using the original rules. Warhammer Quest 95 on the other hand managed to provide the gaming experience I was looking for and imo did almost everything better. That said, my copy of Heroquest was the UK version which was also the simplified version (no armoury card, monster weaker, less cards etc) so probably contributed to the lacking experience.
In my opinion it is evident that a game designed for an audience of ten years and older has simplified rules. I played Heroquest when I was 13, in 1989, and the simple rules quickly got me hooked on a game that, at the time, added a 3D aspect to completely "imaginary" D&D games. In a very short time my best friend and I combined the world of D&D with Heroquest, starting from those extremely simple rules and improving them, and at the same time simplifying some aspects of D&D: halfway through we found our winning formula... An example on all: the mind points of the monsters correspond to the experience points earned after each kill, and with a table created by us, every few experience points our hero can level up. The undead have mind 0, so pain in the ass without reward... and so on. Great video about your personal experience with Heroquest! Thanks!
I still have the original HeroQuest and every time I open the closet and see that box I realize how much I miss those afternoons with my friends like 900 years ago.
Those are the times that make nostalgia games worth revisiting, for sure! It's the same reason why I still love games like Talisman. Playing Talisman teleports me back to great times.
As an 80’s kid I loved Steve Jackson & Ian Livingstones Fighting Fantasy books along with the iconic Arcade game Gauntlet. When Hero Quest was released I was about 17 years old but unfortunately missed out on playing it due to sporting opportunities. Now at the age of 52 I’ve recently purchased the Hero Quest Game System and am thoroughly enjoying playing it with my 6 year old grandson, especially with your recommendation of the Hero Quest APP, acting as Zargon.
My uncle had an original box of Heroquest long after it was out of print in the early 00s. Used to play it all the time with him and my dad. He eventually gave me the game while he was cleaning out his closet a few years later. I wish I could find it and restore the box like it deserves. RIP to both of them. Some of my fondest memories.
Thanks for sharing! I love how games like these can create so many great memories.
Just found this video, and I really enjoyed it. Thanks for making it, I can't wait to watch the next two.
Well I did just post it yesterday! :)
@@TheDungeonDive haha yeah, I realized that right after I commented. Oops
When I first saw the box when I was a kid, I was a bit intimidated by the art of the skeleton and the mummy and I couldn't get them out of my head. 3 days later I asked my grandma of I could have HeroQuest for my birthday.
This was my first entry to deeper board games and as a 10 year old back in 1990, the rules felt really deep and complex to me. I loved it.
Of course, by today's standards it is quaint. I still love the grim fantasy setting and the art presentation a lot though. I think few dungeon crawlers since have been able to capture it as well.
This game brings a lot of nostalgia. Thank you for covering this game.
Oh man, this takes me back! My friend still has our shared copy from the 90s 😃 Great video as always!
I love your videos and value your reviews on so many games. Look forward to your content with every new vid. That said, I’m also a big HeroQuest fan and have played continually throughout the decades, introducing new people to it even before Avalon Hill’s revival.
I’d really like to see you review it after playing it with a group of friends or family… at least a few quests or a full campaign. It really is a “beer and pretzels” game and shines when you have a group that just wants to chuck some dice, tell some stories, have some laughs and perhaps throw back some adult beverages. Your take on it may change when it’s played in that context.
Your approach may have been to review it with a modern understanding of dungeon crawls, but I feel like many of your comments about what they “should have done” don’t take into account the time in which this game was designed and the unique place it has in the development of dungeon crawl games. Avalon Hill and Hasbro went the route of doing a straight reprint rather than a modern update and I think most fans appreciate it. Many more would be up in arms if they tried to modernize it or make major changes. For this reason, it really needs to be seen in the context of the time it was designed.
Furthermore, modern gamers may complain that it lacks modern sensibilities, but I’ve introduced it to dozens of non gamers and they always have a blast. They aren’t complaining about “move to roll” or a limited bestiary. It still really excels at introducing tabletop miniature gaming to people who otherwise have no experience with it.
Anyway, I’ve ranted long enough. I really do enjoy your channel. I’d love to hear your thoughts after playing HeroQuest with some friends or family.
Doubt I’ll ever play it with other people. It just doesn’t work for me. I don’t like 1 v many games. I do enjoy it solo though!
And I like roll to move! Many of my favorite games have roll to move. My main criticisms are lack of variety and a dull bestiary. But I’ve fixed both of those issues for solo play!
I also LOVE old games. So that’s not the issue as well. :) Talisman is in my top 10 of all time, and that’s older than HQ.
You’ll like what I have to say about it in episode 3. That’s where I talk about the things I like. :)
I also missed the original release of HeroQuest back in the day - I’m pretty sure I saw it in a toy store but for whatever reason passed on it. And it would have been right up my alley - I loved D&D, CRPG’s like Wizardry and the Bard’s Tale and Ultima.
It wasn’t until many many years later I saw people online praising it and I got interested. And when
I did finally get a copy…just loved it. Have gone all in on the new Hasbro release, love playing it with the kids and on the app.
The new release is really nice. Great production.
I *think* my mother's boyfriend had a copy in the early 90s but I have little to no memory of playing, or it sticking with me. I did remember simplified rules.
I was playing an inordinate amount of Ultima IV at the time.
Fast forward well over 30 years and I was looking at a Dungeon Crawler (or adjacent) to play with my son (7). Most were too complex, and I almost settled on Zombiecide 2nd ed
Then I remembered HeroQuest.
It looked a bit too simple. However, the community, home-brews, and modifications sealed the deal.
Picked up a copy of the revised ed for £71.00 as a Christmas present for my son
Even though sometimes the games you cover don’t interest me enough to buy them, I still love hearing you talk about games!
Thank you.
Looking forward to all content on this!
This has been in and out of my shopping cart so many times. Looking forward to hearing your thoughts on, and methods of, solo play.
I have been waiting for this since you announced it! Thanks for the review!
I'm sure I'll get a little flack for not really liking RAW HQ, but that's OK. I just don't have the nostalgia for it that most people do! I do really love the new Hasbro version though. They just nailed it.
I have no experience with the game, but I was eager to hear your thoughts on it since it’s one of the old warhorses. Glad to hear the new version is an improvement!
I wouldn't say it's an improvement, at least not in terms of game play. It's 99% the same game. They just did a really great job producing it, and it's very cool that it's now available for people to buy new again.
I'm a 90's kid but I also never saw this growing up. I own it now but have not yet played it. I can't wait for my daughter to be old enough to play it with me XD
They did start introducing "advanced" versions of the monsters in the HeroQuest app to introduce some variation in play.
So far they did the goblins and the skeletons. Advanced goblins can move, attack, and then finish their remaining movement, allowing for some hit and run tactics. Advanced skeletons can attack diagonally, giving them some flexibility in how to attack through doors or whatever.
Those are the only official variant abilities for the original HeroQuest monsters I've seen so far. I hope they continue that trend in the app, and I'd love to see official cards of those advanced monsters.
Oh nice! Hopefully we get some "advanced" upgrade packs of cards. I'd love to see the classic heroes get a treatment like the knight in the latest expansion, and the upcoming monk hero. A deck of skill cards would be great.
Wow, you’re from Fresno! I grew up in Modesto. I had HeroQuest. Great game!
You say you really wish they had updated some things, changing the original. One reason you hint at.... because for the last 30 years everybody has been changing rules as written and adding complexity and variety to the game. When you talked about this I began to think about the fact that the game, in it's original format, has been around for 30 years. It has been enjoyed by a couple of generations of gamers. It's original format made it inspirational and quite easy to adjust to the user's appetite. In that aspect, the original game wasn't broken. Why fix it? I would imagine the good folks at Avalon Hill had quite an internal debate about how to proceed with the relaunch of HeroQuest. I'm sure they quickly realized that they would not please everybody. Step away from simplicity and "clean up" rules. Add some of the house-rules people have been using for years. Then many of the fans of the original would have been unhappy because they messed with it. Leave it the same, and many would say it's too simple and they just should have added these things that I added to my old copy years ago. In the end, I am quite happy with what they are doing. They started with a near-exact copy. Warts and all. And now as they are adding content most older and newer players never saw, they are adding complexity. Personally, I think they are headed in a great direction. I wouldn't be surprised if they eventually come out with a major expansion that goes along the lines of what the original Advanced Heroquest did.
I enjoyed both videos, and look forward to the 3rd in your series.
Thanks for this very informative video, what a great job. Storing games is often an issue. I like to use glass display cabinets for games with many expansions. Talisman 4th edition revised with all 13 expansions is a feast for the eyes, when on display, such great artwork.
I'm doing the same for HeroQuest as we already have nine expansions with more on the way. I would also recommend to sleeve the cards in games you wish to keep for a long time, tedious I know, but worth the investment.
Looking forward to watching your Runebound videos next.
Do you ever paint your miniatures? I find it very relaxing and rewarding.
Thanks again, and happy gaming to everyone out there!!!
Right on! Thanks!
I do not paint minis. I'm good at it, but I don't like it, and I'm very slow at it. :) I have 30 hours a week to devote to the channel, and painting is the last thing I want to do. That's why I prefer good quality standees and good art.
I also don't like sleeving cards. I've been playing hobby games since the mid 80s, and have never really felt the need to. My copy of talisman with paper quality cards from the 80s still looks great. I don't like how sleeved cards take up more space, stacks slide over, and I don't like the way they feel. Also, plastic is terrible for the environment and our bodies!
I have a few games sleeved but I'm actually in the process of removing the sleeves and donating them to a local MTG group for their use. I keep some sleeves around from when I DIY cards, as you can see in the subsequent HeroQuest videos. :)
I had a copy in Fresno! (Maybe the last one?)
I loved it when I was a kid, it's a big part of what got me into hobby gaming and fantasy stuff in general
Maybe the only one! Lol. I never even saw it at any of the gaming conventions at the Ramada.
Cool. Gotta get me one.
Still one of most favorite board games when we talk about art style although I don't play it anymore. I am lucky that I still have my copy of the master edition in excellent condition. Sometimes I take it from the shelf and only look and feel the box cover and the material. It is always a time travel to former childhood days.
Actually, I played StarQuest much more than HQ as we were more in SciFi as kids. But HQ looks much better on the board than SQ
Played this as a kid and loved it. Bought the rerelease version and have played it with my son. Good times! Fun video, thanks! 👍👏😁
"my elf's sword is slightly bent"
*shoves elf into box aggressively*
Man just wanna say your content is some of the best for ttrpgs and boardgames. Love the Mork Borg stuff, Started collecting and picked up the endless demon deck from Drive-thru Rpg, and looking at more Mork Borg stuff like Fisk Borg, completely addicted! Just waiting on Pirate Borg to be released
🤟👽🤟
Thanks! Appreciate. Mork Borg is so fun to collect, read and get play. So many great books!
I was given a Amazon voucher for my work 10yr anniversary. Just bought the core box, kelars keep and return of the witch lord. Which is exactly the same amount of old school HQ stuff I gad when I was younger. Doubt my kids will want to play, but I'm thinking of mixing some of the Dungeon Saga board pieces and minis and going solo. Either way I'm going to have fun with it
Nice! Have fun! What a great little gift.
Really cool to get your take on this as someone who did not grow up playing it! As someone who DID (and almost never stopped!), I definitely agree that it needs a good amount of tweaking to have appeal for the modern adult dungeon-crawl gamer. Looking forward to the rest of this series! -Paeter
I’m sure there are a bunch of people out there who feel the same way as I do about HQ about Talisman.
The basic set up of Heroquest has actually ended up being a boon to the game because it allows everybody to add so much to it that they want. You can add your own rules, your own minis, your own furniture, create your own unique quests, your own heros. You can add unique skills, spells, monsters, literally your imagination is the only limit on what you can do. That and finding some other people to play with. You can create your own add ons to the map. Go anywhere with it. I loved this game as a kid. I still own the entire set of originals as well as the expansions and everytime I pull it out I fondly remember better days as a child. Some people see only a limited game but I see a game with endless possibilities. Nothing stopping you from adding to it. I bought the mythic tier and have all the expansions for that too except for the Dread Moon which I currently can't afford. It is the perfect game to introduce your children to role playing board games and I will be ever greatful to my dad for surprising me with it one day out of the blue as a present way back in 1989.
This is just part 1 of 5 in an ongoing series. I have nearly 2-3 hours of house rule and DIY discussion!
They definitely had it in California, I bought mine when it first came out at Toys “R” Us in East San Jose, California.
Every Toys “R” Us that I visited had a copy at the time and they even had the expansions right next to it on the shelf.
This was our D&D and we played it every single day for about six years straight
I only never saw it in Fresno. Can’t make any claims about California at large. :)
What did you do with the game to get enough game play for every day for 6 years?
@@TheDungeonDive after we went through all of the campaigns, I began using the provided empty map sheet (in the back of the rule book at the time) to fashion my own campaigns as I was always the GM. We would always have classical music playing, usually the harpsichord and violin sonatas of Bach to liven up each session. We also had a little help from herbal stimulation at the time 😂 which made every session an adventure to say the least. (A little older and wiser now 🤦♂️)
Ah the good old days, I believe I was 14 at the time we started playing and I was 21 when I moved out of the neighborhood. I do remember it was by Milton Bradley and not Avalon Hill.
Oh and yes, it was well known that Advanced Hero Quest was an expansion and you could only find it in dedicated gaming shops. Bought my copy in a place called The Game Gallery inside of Valley Fair Mall in San Jose California. I don’t think the game store exists anymore but they were the hottest game place at the time.
Sounds like good times. :)
@@TheDungeonDive it was indeed, but as I’m watching your review on Cartograph, I do completely agree that we are in an incredible time at the moment especially where a lot of OSR style games are resurfacing but with a modern feel. There are just so many great games at the moment, both board and book.
Yay! It’s here! Man I loved this game. I have a few pieces left and use them for when I play D&D. I would love to find this game in my house again.
Just get the new version - it's amazing. I'm actually going to be selling my original. There's just no need for it now.
I was really surprised by what a quality product it is.
@@TheDungeonDive how much are you selling it for, if you do?
Not sure. I'll put it up on eBay when I do. It's an investment game that I'd like to get some actual good money for to offset the cost of other stuff for the channel.
I assembled together a copy of Heroquest years ago, only missing the board (which I still intend to print in neoprene), Zargon's screen and the box. When news came out of a new edition I was really excited, until I saw the new art. I _don't_ like that _at all._ I understand what they went for, but I seriously thought they missed the ball on that. The minis are great, though, and the Abomination is way cooler than the Fimirs, IMO.
Yeah. Art is totally subjective. I love the old art, and really love the new art. I was surprised because Gary Chalk is my favorite fantasy artist. The new art just has a great vibrancy and energy to it. Totally pops.
We had it in Visalia back when it first came out!
Nice! I'm sure it existed in the central valley, I just never saw it or knew of anyone who had it. Even at the early conventions in the area I never saw it. I lived in a HQ void. :)
Yes! HQ with the Dungeon Dive's perspective! Great introduction and looking forward to the next episodes. Btw, being the owner of an original European version, be sure the US is way better (in EU to name a few: no chaos spells, monsters all have 1 body point, less artifacts). There are good videos listing all the differences and evaluating both versions. I ended up printing the US cards and playing with the US rules as a base (and then incorporating many variants, homebrew, enemies etc). Still on my top 5 as an amazing base. I play it regularly solo!
Oh wow! The changes were a lot bigger than I imagined! Do you just work through the quests in the quest books without worrying about "spoiling" things?
@@TheDungeonDive yes many changes indeed. The European version however already had the equipment cards. But not enough in my opinion to compensate for what was missing. I personally play using rolling tables to be found on BGG or using an amazing 2.0 version (in French only) that introduces cards for a new bestiary, traps, locked doors, events, statuses, level up system and even modular dungeons as an option!
Man I remember this as kid… great times.
I agree about AHQ. I think it's meant to be an add-on for the base game to flesh it out and fix the rules. On its own it's more of a novelty. But the most fun I had with Heroquest was making my own campaigns and running my friends through them. And I make it a lot of fun by adding treasure and mechanics to the game, and improvising a lot of flavortext to make it feel less like a bare bones dungeon crawl.
HQ is, if anything, a great sandbox to create and play in.
Oh man, Hero Quest... a game that I would've loved to have grown up with, but by the time I was aware of its existence, it had been out of print for like... 15 years. Sad face. I've still never played it, but I've filled the void with many other games that I've spent far too much money on. Still, you have a pretty fresh perspective, and I think I'll enjoy watching the rest of series. Thanks, Daniel; this wasn't even on my radar, but as a predominantly solo gamer, that might have to be rectified.
Thanks! Hopefully in episode 3 I'll show some cool ways to play it solo.
I got this for Christmas last year and enjoyed it. We often have time for game late at night when we're already a bit sleepy so having some easy games like this work great. My criticisms of the game are the same as yours, can't wait to homebrew some stuff with my new printer and check out what others have made. I do actually like the roll to move aspect because I feel it simulates the chaos of real battle. Running into things, slipping, using agility, nerves, etc. In a real battle things are not so precise and you need to improvise and adapt. Flawed mechanic in general but works well here IMO. Also leaves room to add more throwing weapons or abilities as a backup plan for when you roll poorly.
I don’t mind roll to move either.
@@TheDungeonDive I think a lot of people just have PTSD from Monopoly lol.
Hahah. True.
I played it once (it was amazing) and pulled such an amazing move that i don't think i could ever top it. I loved the game tho
Great overview! Have they sorted the issue with the minis being squashed by the packaging (I.e. the Dread Warrior maces and doors were getting bent as the tray was too tight)?
The trays are definitely tight, but nothing in mine was damaged.
I think this problem was worse with the initial copies of the reprint.
I think they did a fantastic job with the re-release.
I completely agree!
Hero Quest as well as Axis and Allies are intended to be play with 5 people. When more people make bad choices, or are unlucky. The experience playing is shared, and the choice to play can be justified.
I wish they would also release the original skaven minis for purchase. I do like the original chaos warrior and sorcerer also though the new ones do look good also.
Advanced Heroquest is so good, those tiles, the art and the rules. Anyone with minis from other games can enjoy it, their idea was to sell other minis separately, because there are a bunch of monster cards in the game. To me it feels way better than Heroquest. Anybody that is put off by how basic HQ is, should definitely give AHQ a try :)
Enhanced Advanced Heroquest is definitely the way to go with AHQ. Really good compilation of rules. My complaints about AHQ were, as specifically stated, only about the core box as a product. It’s absolutely terrible and not worth the money. You don’t even get enough stuff to play the included adventures. It’s crazy.
@@TheDungeonDive yep they totally missed the opportunity on that one, it would have been way more popular.
The core rules make for an amazing dungeon crawl experience. Almost a dungeon simulation.
Yes I agree, it feels like the purest dungeon crawler, I also really like the character progression, how tight the economy is. Having to pay rent, to buy ingredients for spells and arrows. Just feels so gritty.
The economy is SUPER tight. You need every single piece of gold, and the numbers rarely get out of hand like they can in WHQ95.
Just a heads up. I just bought the new version on Amazon today. It was on sale for $70 something. Seemed like a pretty good deal. Im not sure how long the sale is going on for though.
That’s a great deal!
For our group I've added my own custom evil wizard deck, or what I call the Dread Influence deck. This balances the game a bit and gives Zargon some interesting little events, powers, etc to keep the heroes on their toes.
Kind of like the decks from Descent!
@@TheDungeonDive The Overlord deck! You know I picked up a copy of Descent 2e about a year ago and going through the Overlord deck I realized a lot of the powers I came up with for HQ is exactly what they had already done. So yes! Just like Descent! 😅
That deck was so much fun! :)
There are 4 models of orc... one of the orcs has a saber with a circular notch out of it. I think there was 1 of them and 3 of the others.
Cool.
LOVE ME SOME HEROQUEST!!
My theory is that the art for advanced HeroQuest was proposed by GW to be the cover of HeroQuest and MB rejected it. So GW went "fine we'll use it for the advanced version."
Pretty much. And GW expected players to own HQ to complete the core box.
I don't know somebody converted the hero Quest regular quest to advance heroquest I don't know if they did it for the expansions I think I'm going to work on that project and make tiles from the expansions to fit with the heroquest modular dungeon system and try and get something going there to be able to play all in expansion solo will see
There are rules in AHQ for using everything in HQ.
Palladium! What was your favorite setting? Man, I miss The Game Preserve.
After the Bomb and Robotech were our main games. :)
I've never played HeroQuest but I have played a whole lot of HeroScape, which I believe is derived from it. We tried in various ways to make HeroScape more narratively focused over the years. I feel bad because people will see it and ask how they can get it and all I can tell them is that as much as I love it, it's not worth it to acquire anymore. The prices are too high and the terrain inevitably breaks down.
I look back at the Target/Walmart prices and weep a little.
woah just started watching your stuff today and we're both from fresno ca(technically clovis). odd man
I lived in Clovis as well. :)
Still own mine! Best game ever.
It’s definitely an important one to the development of the hobby.
Hey Daniel, I have put all the heroquest stuff in the base box (first print big box). Everything fit fine execpt the last expansion, but with your second print edition I think you're gonna have a hard time...
I was able to get everything in except the furniture, but that all fits in one of the small expansion boxes. So that's what I have now. :)
The original US and the new versions of Heroquest is markedly different to the UK/Euro original.
Yep!
So what do you think is the best thing about HeroQuest?
I said in the first few minutes of the video!
@@TheDungeonDive Ah, my bad. I guess I was too eager to skip to the part where you had unboxed all the goodies from the original set. This was my portal into serious RPGs, as with many other people :)
No worries! :) Definitely a great gateway into that world. For sure!
I have both the original and rerelease versions of this game (and expansions). I haven’t played them yet (well since I was a kid) but I must say I’ll be playing the original version. I really like the quality of the rerelease, but I just cannot get on with the new minis and the way the monsters look. I much prefer the character and aesthetic of the original monsters. And those Abominations have been named well, because that’s exactly what they are!
I do prefer the ruleset of the US version of Heroquest. I’m in the UK and I really don’t like that all monsters have just 1 body point (including the Gargoyle!) and there are no Chaos Spells. I’m currently in the process of printing out the booklets and cards for the original US version so I can play with that ruleset.
Nice! Hope you have fun. I'm just the opposite. Even though I am a HUGE fan of Gary Chalk and old school art, as is evident with how much I talk about both in many videos, I'll be selling my original HQ stuff and keeping / playing only the Hasbro version. For me it's just better in every way.
This is a sacred game that brought most of us to the hobby. In my opinion the art of the MB release is superior and not comparable at all with the new one
For me that game was D&D and Talisman. I think most people agree with you on the art. I like both, but I think I actually prefer the new one. It's just such a well produced product. I'm going to sell my original copy. There's just no need for it now.
It brought a few into the hobby, but it far from drew "most" of us in.
Oh, youre american. Maybe then
Haha other Daniel 😂
I actually just traded my entire super complete set of Blackstone Fortress for a copy of Advanced hero Quest with a copy of regular old heroquest and a few expansions the older one Keller's keep Return of the witch Lord but I also came with a bunch of Miniatures to represent the tokens that came in advance heroquest I actually got the Miniatures for them too so I think it's a pretty good deal and also got some cash I can't wait to try it out also I didn't back the new hero Quest and I have all the new expansions I tell you what I bought one of them neoprene boards they're actually a lot bigger and I could never go back to the original boards that are questioning with but anyways I'm just rambling now LOL
Oh nice!
tl;dr; I really wish they updated the rules and this wasn't simply a reprint. I should've skipped this because I have many better dungeon crawlers. However, with many mods that are available, maybe this can be on par or better than other dungeon crawlers.
I remembering asking my parents to buy this game for me when I was 13 or 14 years old. Having 4 other siblings, this was just too much for them to buy at that time. Fast forward to a year ago, when I heard they were reprinting it and I purchased it immediately. Brought it home, started reading the rules because I had never read the rules before. I completely based my new purchase on how I felt as a teenager and boy do I have some buyer's remorse not doing some more research on it before I bought it. I had played many other dungeon crawlers like Descent 2nd Ed, Massive Darkness, Village Attacks, Sword & Sorcery, etc... There are so many better dungeon crawlers, especially if you are a solo player. I'll stay tuned for your part 3 video with your thoughts on how you like the new version and/or if you'll be adding in community mods.
I'm considering getting this still what would you recommend as the best alternative?
Why do you play it solo and not with some friends or family?
Because I don't like playing games with other people most of the time.
@@TheDungeonDive oh I see. I get that. A lot of people act not serious enough when in a game. I am thinking about starting it with my son, he is 10. I think we will have a great time with it.
That sounds great! I'm sure you'll have fun. :)
Yeah I don't think of it as basic, more like "streamlined". The dungeon crawl boiled down to it's core essence.
There’s a fine line between streamlined and basic, and I think RAW HQ falls on the wrong side. And I am a HUGE champion for effortless fun and simplistic games, as is evident by so many of my videos.
"this one is priced for adults" - No, that's just inflation I'm afraid.
It's a number of factors. Inflation is one. It's also priced for the hobby market and not the mass market. Two very different markets.
I loved the re release..games are just too rules heavy now in my opinion
I am all about effortless fun, for sure! I just want a couple more layers on top of the HQ foundation, and luckily those are out there to employ. One of the main things I look for is variety, and for me, HQ is lacking in that department out of the box.
They always had female versions of the characters if you bought the expansions
That’s awesome! Now it’s even better because we get some diversity in the base game.
The cover is Les Edwards and the card art is Gary Chalk- it's a crime it has been replaced in the new version : 0
Gary Chalk is my favorite artist. I love old school art. I also like new art. I think the new look of HQ is fantastic. It’s ok to like both. No need to pick a team.
I never understood what the big deal was about Heroquest until I watched this:
m.th-cam.com/video/Cx8sl2uC46A/w-d-xo.html
Classic bit of nerd comedy, for sure.
8:21 And Daniel is challenging the Bard, because his best thing ist not on the Bards List!
I hope Daniel says “Fire of Wroth” in an upcoming HQ video.
Imagine trying to get someone into modern Dungeon Diving and breaking out this antiquated junk. That would be like trying to get someone into modern boardgames with a roll-and-move game...oh wait....
That's why it fell flat when I played it with a group, RAW. There are just so many better games now, and since none of us had the nostalgia it just didn't do much. However, I still love games like Talisman, but that's because I do have nostalgia for it. Nostalgia is a powerful, wonderful, and troubling thing for sure.
I’ve played HQ consistently throughout the years with groups of non-gamers, folks with no previous experience in tabletop games or preconceived “modern game sensibilities” and everyone always has a blast. It remains a great introduction to the tabletop dungeon crawl.
I'll be honest, I've never got the fuss of Heroquest. I bought it when it first came out, from a Games Workshop store in Manchester UK. me and my friend pooled our pocket money. We couldn't wait to get it home to try it....and we were completely underwhelmed. I'm pretty sure I basically binned it a few months later. Pity I didn't keep it. Would be worth a fortune now.
Had you already been playing other fantasy games?
@@TheDungeonDive D&D, Warhammer.
Love this game but due to a lack of a good solo option (and I don’t mean an app, may as well play a pc game) I no longer own any Heroquest. But it’s still a classic that I have fond memories of
I’ve found a good way to play solo. Stay tuned next week for episode 3!
I share the same feeling with you. As someone with no nostalgia with Heroquest, there really isn’t much to the base game and the 1 vs many design means it is not playable by myself using the original rules.
Warhammer Quest 95 on the other hand managed to provide the gaming experience I was looking for and imo did almost everything better.
That said, my copy of Heroquest was the UK version which was also the simplified version (no armoury card, monster weaker, less cards etc) so probably contributed to the lacking experience.
The UK version sounds like it was seriously lacking. I'm really surprised so many people got to bat for it, and claim they prefer it. Kind of wild.