Yeah, such a good gacha system that will literally obliterate "lucky-unlucky" people. Cant wait to lose 3 50\50 in 30 pulls, because the actuall guarantee is only at 120, so even if i get lucky and get 3 5* characters(i do not care for your dogshit naming, six star my ass), none of them will even be guaranteed to be limited. In WuWa, i got 3 standard and 3 limited characters in my first 120 pulls In AK:E, i will get 5 standard characters and 1 limited. Thats it. End of discussion. its a dogshit system that preys on "lucky-unlucky" people, who get early 5*, but always lose 50\50. And since dupes arent worth shit in your dog AK games, you wont even feel a little bit good about getting a constellation for your standard character. This system takes the most unlucky person into the "heaven"(not at all), while completely obliterating half of the lucky players. Also, the rates are still worse then in WuWa. It is a mathematical fact. Add up the probabilities, and WuWa will come out by about 10-13 pulls better on average for a limited 5*.
Did bro even watch the video? First of all, 5 star isn't the highest rarity in the game. It's 6 star. It's shown very clearly in the video. Secondly, the rate-up operator whose portrait is shown on the banner is a 6 star, which is of the highest rarity. The "guaranteed in every 10 pull" is for the 5 star rarity. Besides, if you were to compare hard pity, Endfield's is at 120 pulls while Wuwa is 160 pulls. Use actual numbers stated in the game to make arguments instead of personal experience since it will not be the same for everyone. Lastly, why even complain about having multiple chances of getting a 5 star? Even if it's 50/50, it is very unlikely that you won't pull the rate up 5 star operator at some point. If you were to actually commit 120 pulls, the chances for that to happen is 0.5^12, which is 0.024%. Again, I can't emphasize this enough, but the highest rarity is 6 star, not 5 star. I'm not sure if you lack reading comprehension or just ignorant.
@@tbyte_ what he is trying to say is : there is no guarantee that u will get the on banner 6 star if u got 2 6* in one 10 pull or even 3 They all still could be standard. The lucky - unlucky players. While in other game if u get 2 S rank in 1 10 pull u are guaranteed to get atleast one on banner S RANK.
Actual end of discussion should be at the moment when you mention getting 5 standard and 1 limited character, because you're missing one tiny little detail - unlike both WuWa and Genshin, vast majority of 6* characters ARE standard characters. In this case you're getting 6 standard characters, just one of them being rate-up, why it's so important? Do you think I want another fucking qiqi or Diluc dupe? Like sure buddy, they maybe do get something from those constellations, but lmao you'll never use them either way, the only 5* that got added over 4,5 years are Tighnari (pretty decent as far as I remember) and Dehya (lmao), when in AKE almost every character gets added to a standard pool after their respective banner ends. The real kicker here tho is that we don't know how they'll handle actual limited characters, but if we assume they're using the same system as for current standard banner rate-ups (50/50, 120 pulls rate-up guarantee) if you're actually getting 6 6* in 120 and 5 of them are standard characters, chances are at least one of them is new, and might even be on par or better than limited, unlike aforementioned Qiqi or Diluc who'll just keep gathering dust, but now with the ability to reduce atk of enemies hit by her skill by 15% or whatever when you're probably not even using her for the past 4 years, it's extremely useful right I'm not even going to entertain the idea of "lucky-unlucky" concept you're having, since in AKE you're actively encouraged to save exactly because most of the banners are standard, so unless you want that specific unit so badly that getting them on rate-up is your best bet, you're better off saving for limited banner with decently high chance of getting someone you missed down the line
@@Millesimia weapon banner is worse than WuWa tho? The youtuber mentioned WUWA but didnt include WuWa on weapon banner since its guaranteed and his points would be nonesense.
Weapon banner is also worse than arknights. Which doesn't have any... I'm so tired of games insisting on equipment banners, even worse when they have less than 50/50 odds
Big surprise that the low IQ gacha streamers, who depend upon getting high dupes and blasting through the game on easy mode, are unhappy with how discouraged pulling for dupes is in this game. More gambling means more content for their streams.
Seeing some people complaining about the 25/75 weapon gacha rates without factoring in the 4% chance, thinking it's worse than hoyo's system, reminds me of this: "In 1980, A&W tried to compete with McDonald's Quarter Pounder by selling a 1/3 pound burger at lower cost. The product failed, because most customers thought the 1/4 was bigger."
A lot of tourist complaning about the gacha system most of them didn't play Arknights so they were confused. it's hard to watch kinda, so it's better if they watch someone who played both games like you who fully understand between both games.
@@ghiffaribara2949 I don't want to be that guy, but Talos planet is a giant gas planet, you're sending people into jupiter basically, a raging gas storm, we're on talos-II it's moon
@@doommaker4000 I thought so. PGR has the best system but why Kuro didn't use that in Wuwa instead "better version" of hoyo? Because it didn't bring much money. Endfield use better system compared to their OG version; Arknights
That's exactly the approach I take to every gacha I've played. All my profile greetings are me letting people know I'm just a functional idiot in a more polite way.
As of how things are currently worded in the banner, I'd like to add/correct a few things. Firstly, the 120 guarantee resets with every new banner. This is true. But your progress towards the 80 pull pity for a 6* does not. Secondly. The weapon banner. Not only can you get arsenal tickets by pulling, but also from the rougelike weekly mode. On top of that, there is a guarantee of a 6* weapon every 40 pulls, and a guarantee of the rate up at 80. But both the character and weapon guarantees are 1-time only. So... I personally think it's a good system, but I do understand why there is some hesitation/frustration.
is the 120 guaranteed is like sparking where you buy the character with the 120 pull count like ak limited ops banner or the rate up character appear at 120 pulls?
The rate up is guaranteed at 120 pulls, the spark system is the gold certificate, where you can exchange gold cert for character, for AK it's usually a collect a bunch and just exchange it for a character to plug the holes you missed
@roach1898 I don't think so. I managed to get Laevatein before the 120 guarantee. But I *think* it's just a 100% guarantee that your 120th pull will be the rate-up, regardless of your current 6* pity. Sorry if that's a bit confusing. I'm not really sure how to word it properly. Also, one thing I don't think anyone has mentioned at all is that currently, you can purchase 3 different 6*s characters in the shop with certs. They're expensive, but they're available.
@@Kazenarakayeah, why everyone forget that this game too have yellow certs and you can exchange standart characters for that. 120 pulls - 1 6* and 12 5* (worst case) - 170 certs, character price is 500!
@ Yea, the 120 pulls is just to ensure you get the rate up char, if you get it before, the 120 guaranteed disappear and that's what get people miffed, because now you have to rely on 80 50/50 that you can farm to carry over to next banner for a chance to get early RNG guaranteed anyway
we defend the dijiang with this one. really tho, with every freakin hours i only saw gacha endfield doomposting in my recommendation for the past 4 days. thanks for every hot water kettle that clarify them cheers o7
What I'm getting from the arguments all around lately: "Easier to get one copy of the banner character? Not limited? F2P friendly?! Where do I get my gacha dopamine then?! They should just copy hoyo and LET ME GAMBLE ALL MY MONEY RAAAHHHH!!! Story and gameplay? Who even cares about them" At first I thought the gacha community are mainly chill f2p poeple with probably ~5% whales, but now I'm thinking A LOT of you guys actually do have gambling addiction
If people wanted stories, they'd read a book. Gacha games these days are just glorified slot machines, with cute anime art to manipulate and soften the blow.
@@Riskofrain-n9f I started playing gacha games because they're free and can be played anywhere, nowadays I stay for the stories. If I really like a character I spend my extra money on their merch and figurine (if there is any) instead of their dupes. "You play gacha which means you are a gambler" "You like anime so you must be a pedo" "You a gamer? Must be one of those basement dwellers" Sure, sure.
Funny how tourist hated the Arknights gacha system they didn't know or read, they just take twitter or reddit out of context. Remember the 120 pull is like the AK collab (Dungeon Meshi is coming up) And yes, HG still hates $$$
Look, as someone who have played a decent amount of gachas, I can say *kinda* get it. Being able to "build pity" means that you *may* be able to get the newest meta breaking waifu (because it is always waifu), which means you won't have to worry about the newer content that depend on the newest unit doing Close Beta Test on you. Not all games can be based like AK where I can see a new unit and not care if I get it or not because I can still use older units perfectly fine (though not all, obviously). Still, I won't complain. If they add all new ops to the common poll and keep the 4 limites per year thing (which them being part of future limited banners) it will more than make up for not being able to "build pity"
@@Dadan-dan you have point I can guarantee that HG still doing their gacha system in Arknights so someone will will be confused had used to Genshin or WuWa gacha system, Enfield itself for me leave that G or W system rather stick on their roots on OG itself But tbh, FGO banner still the worst
I don't give a fuck about the gacha system, I give a fuck about the dupe system. Which Endfield so far has been shown to be very lenient and OG Arknights in essence which makes me extremely happy as a hoyoverse refugee (Genshin up to Sumaru release, HSR up to Argenti release) and GFL2 player (whose dupes on some characters change ENTIRE MECHANICS with their kit and synergy, and are TREMENDOUS power boosts). I don't care about pity systems or whatever the fuck, I just roll when I feel like it and if I don't get limited rate up that's fine it's how I've been dealing with Arknights since 2020.
@@okboi5723 That's a skill issue. Attack from the side that is opposite to Makiatto and leave her for last. She barely moves and wastes her turn constantly just like QJ. You bait the V1 Suomi out of cover on their turn 2 at max range, override her ult with your own Suomi's and kill her. You can also flank with Vepley to kill Tololo/Sabrina/Lotta (whichever they're bringing) or start poking down QJ with your own sniper. WIth a bit of practice you'll win every time. Team comp: Suomi V1 (she was guaranteed even if you lost every 50/50), Vepley, any sniper, any dps that ignores cover (Lotta, Papasha were both free)
That's the thing that wuwa and hoyo players don't understand. Once the banner ends 6* characters automatically move to the standard pool so they are not limited. So basically you save up 120 pulls to guarantee and even if you lose 50-50 then you might get someone you skipped. Also keep in mind just like AK you can just buy the characters from the token you accumulated overtime so if that skipped characters is in the shop you just literally buy and the same applies for the weapon. One thing to keep in mind that we might get 2 or 3 limited banners per year which is still better than anything other big gaccha games are offering.
That's not necessarily a good thing chief. I play Granblue Fantasy. Our SSR pool is completely saturated at this point, there are far more SSRs than R and SR characters combined. It may sound cool to be spooked by a unit that you wanted and missed but once the pool becomes gigantic, chances of getting a max rarity character that you missed or dupes of a character that you want to max or even the character you want themselves only get more and more slim. If you played Blue Archive you know, while not all characters go into the general pool, it still feels like total ass to get a dupe for a max rarity character that you already have maxed, a character that you skipped or having to go for full pity to get the character that you want while getting showered with SSRs that you don't want or need.
@@ayuvir No, that is necessarily a good thing. The chances to max a character you want with a massive pool are extremely slim, the chances to max a character you want with a pool that doesn't have said character are exactly zero. Making the bigger pool better. There's a fair chance you'll eventually max laevatein in Arknights even if you never pull for her. However you're GUARANTEED to never even get A SINGLE DUPE of The Herta in HSR unless you go for her banner. Bigger standard pool = better chances to max the unit, because above zero is better, period. If you really want dupes you pull for rate-ups or you buy in the shop anyway, so counting on the standard spook is kinda silly (and you generally don't want dupes in arknights anyway, you want actual units, we're not talking hoyo games where half the character's strength is locked behind dupes here)
@ayuvir Whats the alternative? To have a handful of 6 stars in the permanent pool that almost never grows bigger? That will probably also be among the weaker 6 stars? Not sure how that would be better for not getting spooked by an operator you already have. Plus it's not like we need to look to other gachas for comparison. The OG arknights has been out for more than 5 years now and has always had this system. If they didn't add new operators I would still be getting old operators from off rate like some other games when I don't get rate up. Which are useless to me as I already have nearly all of them and also don't need most of them even if I didn't have them. Over the years I've gotten plenty of operators I decided to skip or missed out on, that I was happy to get instead of rate up on future banners. Plus of worst case they can just redo what they did with Kernel banners in arknights. After a while they moved all year 1 operators to a separate banner that you can't get spooked by on regular banners. They've kept moving more over time and now all year 2 six stars are also in that banner. So at the very least I can only get spooked by year 3 and later operators. For new players who want a specific older operator they can just save up and buy them from the shop when the rotate in, since Kernel banners have a separate 6 star and 5 star rotation. Or I guess pull on that banner but that isn't recommended since overall the newer operators are better and it's a better idea to just target the strong older operators from the shop.
@@vvey4523 The chances aren't zero, as you rightly pointed out, you can pull for characters in their banners and you'd have a much higher chance to max them out over having an increasingly larger pool of characters that are always available. After two years, new players that want specific characters are going to sweat. Listen, I read quite a bit of urgency in your post any I get that you may be upset at reading someone that disagrees with the op's statement. Here's the thing: 1. I'm hyped up and very much wanting to play Enfield, like you. I am not your enemy. 2. I am merely stating my experience with this system. I've played many games in the past that used it. It's not new. Maybe the odds are higher, but the system itself isn't anything that you can't find around. 3. You don't ever need dupes in these kinds of games. There's an entire cult around CCs that "do the math" and try to spin you to pull for dupes. That's true for HSR, it's true for BA, it's true for NIKKE, true for AK and will be true for Enfield. 4. Hoyo designs characters around being exponentially better with dupes, but they are very much not required. There's channels on youtube made around beating all the high level content as weakly as possible. One of which the dude was against even using the standard pulls or eidolons. I know shitting on the big boys is fun but curb your bias and be fair, if you even know what you're talking about. I'm sorry you didn't have luck on your Herta pulls. 5. Having dupes of characters often times makes them exponentially stronger in any game where the mechanic is implemented, this'll be true even for Enfield. I repeat, I am not your enemy, I merely stated that this system sounds really good on paper but it's neither better nor worse. I know this from prior experience with games that have the same system. What is better is how generous they made the number of pulls for pity. 120 is quite low. Now we need to see how much currency we get outside of the starting month.
Overall tourists have no perception about how good Endfield is overall. The gacha is honestly good, the weapon banner not even needing the same materials as character pulls and a re pretty affordable and forgiving and also Tourists have no idea how good the combat dor example is because they play it like a hack and slash game. It's a world different to see someone utilize mechanics over "just Surtr it". Just hope we will get reality check events like CC#
Integrated Strategies has been a god send to Arknights, i hope they can do the same to Endfield. IS mode is still a hot cake to me and i keep playing it, i wonder how will they make an Innovative end game content like IS mode....
I actually wanted to think that the 120 guaranteed pull is like pulling for a collab character in og arknights. Just wanted to remind everyone that dungeon meshi is near.
the reason most of people think gacha system in endfield is bad because the only gacha game they play is from hoyo or wuwa where they have similar gacha mechanics, where the currency you get per patch are limited, dupe that can change the mechanics of char, the existence of weapon banner making decisions of pulling become harder, and the biggest one the 120 pity on endfield not carry over is bad because they fear once they miss the banner they have to wait for rerun and i know this is not confirmation but from the banner it says "rate-up char" not "limited time char" so chance are high that once the char banner is off they will put it on standard banner. and i just do rough calculation on worse case scenario you need, 220 pull to guarantee character and its weapon and comparison to genshin/hsr/zzz you need 360 pull for character and sig weapon
They forgot about how Endfield character gacha system only give you a CHARACTER. Gosh I hate those game where you got more shitty weapon than the actual character in CHARACTER banner....
After talking with my AK comrades, I too agree this gacha system is pretty good since dupes aren't a must in AK so probably the same in ENDfield. This makes u become a hoarder.
Isn't that just you assuming dupe isn't important. It beta, everything can change. If they willing change the rate then it wouldn't be out of quesrion for them to make dupe more impactful.
@@applel2.043 I mean, they could change it, yes. But they kept the same system in OG arknights for 5 years. Even after 5 years of powercreep potential mean very little there, so I think there's little reason they would do that in Endfield now.
@pedrohenrique-db3xd it a different team. You never know what will change. People approach a 2d tower defense and 3d exploration game very differently.
Endfield's gacha is geared towards getting the one rateup, once, and probably it's weapon, each patch, the question is, how many pulls will you get as f2p, monthly and monthly + BP.
@@PlasuMinasulol look at how the gacha design, you can already tell that it'll be 70-90 roll per patch, cause that how this system work, it's nothing new they just combine the gacha system from the old gacha jp era and genshin in the worst way 😂 instead of yeah here 2% rate 120 pity can carry over guys
@@minhtringuyen8467 The unenlightened masses They cannot make the judgement call Give up free will forever their voices won't be heard at all Display obedience While never stepping out of line And blindly swear allegiance Let your country control your mind
@@PlasuMinasu lol, too bad that I'm right and i gonna bet they will do exactly that. The best thing about old gacha system is its high rate so you can yolo, the best thing about genshin gacha is pity can be carry over. They're not combined the best but instead the worst, what can be said lol. People justified this system always assumes the worst but do remember the rate to get banner char is 50/50 which mean you can just fish for the 50 win every banners, if not then you move on. With this system, you can't and it's even created more fomo when you just have to get to 120, which like 40 pulls worst case
400 currency for daily only, so multiply that by 13 days you get 5.200 which cover 10 pulls (this is only daily, not exploration rewards), for weapon i dont have the exact value, but in the rogue like mode you can get approx 20 pulls every weekly reset
Great video! Was thinking of my own when my og AK emulator decides to actually work *REEEEEEE* to show what *could* be endfield limited banners and how it works in og ak.
One big issue enfield has is that with only 0.8% chance for a 6* it's going to be absolute hell if you want more copies of them past the first one, yes just like in AK the extra copies in endfield have almost no impact on performance but it's still hell if you do want more copies
@ in AK it’s a lot better to go after dupes because the base chance is 2% so you’re more likely to get 6* while in endfield after the first 6* you can only rely on the 0.8%
@ if you ever get to 65 pulls in AK you’re really fucking unlucky and most of the 6* will come before that, it’s more than 3 times easier to get a 6* in AK than in endfield which makes hunting dupes easier
The concept of building pity on a banner you're not serious about is a joke but I still see a lot of Genshin players do this. Yeah I get that a lot of them are children and Genshin is their first gacha but god damn. If you "got lucky" on that banner you're gonna have to rebuild pity on the banner you actually want.
Tbh in og arknights, you literally can't go for hard pity if you are f2p unless you skip like 1 or 2 limited banners, but I mean we have 2% so fuck it we gambling
Okay, but hear me out. What if I want to "build pity" on a banner that I like anyways? So that either I luck out and manage to get the character on said banner, have built the pity without getting anything yet (so no "harm" done), or get an off-rate thus the very next one I get would be guranteed anyway regardless of what banner I pull next?
@@Shadow6OO I'm not gonna deny it's a good thing to have pity carry over banners but if I have to choose between having to spend more pulls to guarantee versus lesser pulls to guarantee I would definitely choose the latter as a low spender/f2p with bad luck. Besides, even if you want to drop pulls on two banners but fail to get the rate-up of the one you're building pity on and get the next banner instead, the end result is you still only got to pull one rate-up of those two banners you're pulling on. If you had to guarantee it then it'd mean you just spent 160-180 pulls for one character. On the other hand, with endfield gacha system, as long as you don't gamble knowing the risk, you'd only spend 120 pulls to get one character in a worst case scenario.
Tbf, in games that copy Hoyo's model, dupes of characters tend to be really important. Like just getting a 4* isn't enough, gotta get another 6 copies of them, so often times you feel forced to "build pity", because otherwise you might never get the 4* you need. But, since dupes seem insignificant in Endfield, this won't be nearly as big of a concern, so you can probably live with just getting the various 4 and 5* operators here and there from standard or lost 5* 50/50's.
I want to add things to set expectation for the gacha The rate-up banner (like Laevatain now) character will be put into the standard banner as rate-off after their banner finished. So, if you in the future pull on other rate-up banner (for other, newer, characters) and you lose 50/50, you might get Laevatain (and other non-limited characters). Also, in OG Arknights, there's a rotation banner where older characters are put into new banner in pair, one of them can be bought in the shop directly using a currency that you got when you got a dupe (yellow certs). As far as I know only Arknights do this, in Wuwa you can only buy dupes not the characters themselves. I'm assuming that Laevatain is not a limited character here since there is no wording of her being Limited. We don't know yet how Limited banner will be implemented. Assuming it works like in OG Arknights, Limited banner only come every anniversary. Any other character banners are rate-up and goes into the standard banner. Also, in OG Arknights, Limited character strength is not always higher than standard characters, it's all dependent on the characters' kit. But, one might value a Limited character higher by virtue of being Limited regardless of the character's strength. One more, there is no rerun for Limited banner in OG Arknights, but just like standard banner characters, at the time of Limited banner is up, you can straight up buy the previous Limited characters using currency you get from pulling on the Limited banner currently up. - copied from my reply to other comment. - once again, the whole paragraphs assume Hypergryph will implement the gacha system in Endfield to be similar to the gacha system in OG Arknights
Hot damn! I thought I'd been going crazy with people repeating the lie that the Endfield weapon gacha is bad. It's objectively the best weapon system that gacha games have ever seen by a wide margin. It's like watching people say that 2 + 2 = 5 and getting a crowd to repeat it over and over again. The math is not hard guys. 25% of 4% is 1%. 1% > 0.7%. Even Wuwa is still a 0.8% rate - Endfield beats that too. The rates in every game are listed and easily available, but CCs for those games ought to know wtf the rates in their own games are that they spend thousands of hours and dollars playing for a living. The amount of absolute misinformation that's been going on around this has been ridiculous.
I think this is the first yt video about this were I see some sensible people. This issue is driving me insane xD Big problem from what I understand is a lot of gacha players (Mihoyo players mostly from what i noticed) just expect mihoyo rates and complain if a system differs. Whether good or bad doesn't even factor into the decision.
You missing the obious fact that you aren't guranteed the 6* Weapon you want. You can potentially pull thousand of time and still not get the weapon you want. This is staff of homa all over again.
@ That mostly depends on how many rate up weapons they put into one weapon banner. So far one seems likely. and if they listen to feedback it'd be ncie if they implement it like Genshin where you can just select one preferred rate up weapon if there are multiple on one banner. Also with the amount of weapon pulls you'll constantly be getting this doesnt seem too much of an issue ngl. (I am aware however unlikely that you could potentially not get a 2nd rate up weapon in a banner tho)
@baylordeo3636 why would that be likely ? The details of the gacha literally mention "...guarantees the rate-up weapons, or one of them if there are multiple 6*" They clearly have plan for it.
@@applel2.043 You're right. I was actually assuming on that one since the shown weapon/character banners so far has been single file. That's my bad. My hope would be with enough feedback they either change that or they could implement that you get a rate-up guarantuee every 80 weapons, not just the first one. This is tbh on the more easy end to improve. Do we know if weapons actually can be boosted with duplicates btw?
I've had more fun obtaining characters in Arknights than any other gacha. Characters I passed over in the past showing up as off-rates is legitimately welcome.
I wanted to skip texas alter and just get penance once, didnt work out for me. I got texas back then and got penance months later off-banner. You really cant complain 😊
Yeah, such a good gacha system that will literally obliterate "lucky-unlucky" people. Cant wait to lose 3 50\50 in 30 pulls, because the actuall guarantee is only at 120, so even if i get lucky and get 3 5* characters(i do not care for your dogshit naming, six star my ass), none of them will even be guaranteed to be limited. In WuWa, i got 3 standard and 3 limited characters in my first 120 pulls In AK:E, i will get 5 standard characters and 1 limited. Thats it. End of discussion. its a dogshit system that preys on "lucky-unlucky" people, who get early 5*, but always lose 50\50. And since dupes arent worth shit in your dog AK games, you wont even feel a little bit good about getting a constellation for your character. This system takes the most unlucky person into the "heaven"(not at all), while completely obliterating half of the lucky players. Also, the rates are still worse then in WuWa. It is a mathematical fact. Add up the probabilities, and WuWa will come out by about 10-13 pulls better on average for a limited 5*.
Speculation is the big thing now on pull income. Here's what I've put together from watching beta information and comparing it to what HG is already doing in AK. Current OG AK pull income is 28 pulls a month from regular sources (dailies, weeklies, monthlies, green cert shop). 40 with the $5 daily pass. On average HG gives another 35 pulls a month through events, lotteries, and bonuses. Endfield known pulls so far: 24 pulls a month from dailies. 7 pulls a month from Algorithmic Memories. ~5 pulls a month from the factory outpost shop. So that's at least 36 known pulls a month before any events - already 30% up from what we have in AK today from repeatable sources. For the events, personally I don't see HG getting less generous than they are in Arknights - if anything I'd anticipate them giving more pulls because of the lower rates. If you think they'll leave that about the same as AK, we'd be at around 70 pulls a month. Personally I think that would be pretty good. The thing with the 120 guarantee is that it's an absolute worst-case scenario - over half the time you aren't going to hit it and you'll get the rate up with way less pulls than that. A redditor ran the Endfield system through 500,000 simulated pulls and the average number of pulls to get the rate-up was 81. Curiously, if you took that estimated 70 pulls from above and added another 11 pulls from buying a $5 monthly card, you also would get 81 pulls a month. I don't believe in coincidence when it comes to the math around huge money-making systems like this - HG has control of every angle of this system they've designed. "Oh, but this is just speculation!" Well.... yeah. I never said otherwise. But extrapolation using actual data as a starting point often tends to get fairly close, and I think we do have a fair bit of data at this point.
120 is the best case scenario for standard banner, where if you lose 50/50 then each 6* would worth exactly 60 pulls. This will only be an issue on limited banners because the guarantee would be way higher.
70 is pulls is absolutely not good lmao. That's horrible. I'd expect at least 80 pulls per version / every 2 banners. More would be ideal, but I don't think we're getting too much more, since I can't imagine we'll be allowed to guarantee a rate up unit every patch.
we are so brainrotted by Genshin Impact, Honkai Star Rail, Zenless Zone Zero, and Wuthering Waves. We can't stand the peak gacha banner system that Arknights Endfield has 😭
Never play Arknights, didn't participate in CBT, too damn lazy to do proper research.. and then doomposting. Literally tourist behavior. HG has a different system compared to other big gacha games and it works fine in Arknights for 5 years. So stupid to use wuwa or genshin sysyem in Endfield. Ofc it will be bad because these games work or operate very differently. Different system, different rule, and so different strategy needed.
Yeah. Not to long ago, they added it on the standard banner too just a little different (150 instead of 120, & does not spark at 150 but instead the next 6star after passing 150.)
I hate people only saw one line about the 120 Guerantee not being carried over and started to juge the entire system. I really hope HG don't change much to make it similar to Genshin, even now it's already good since it's just AK gacha system. I take that one over yet another Hoyoverse system. For Limited Banners, I think HG will employ a similar system but just tweak the 300 pull Spark to just 200 pulls like they have started doing for Arknights (One by one).
when i saw people paniking about the pity system, i was like we have that on the OG AK what are they paniking about? now that this guy did the math i can honestly say its basically the same but little better with the guaranteed 5 star every 10 for me that good if i dont wanna invest too much on the banner like in OG AK u atleast get something new every new banner
Only og players understand how generous HG is with f2p player. With just base grinds (smoking rockss and devices, and yes, you are basically a drugs dealer if you go this way) you are basically having a month pass (month pass gives you 400 a day include daily, while a good base and good materials grind can give you 500 a days include daily if you are an olbie). So if you are an oldbie and doing month passes, you can literally pull any Op you want with lower risk than other gacha games, even though A9 doesnt have the guaruantee pity except the limited banner, having 300 pity cap. And i heard that they are trying to improve the base building mechanics and improve the grinding system in Endfield. Basically paradise for f2p players if they keep the same "rock grinding" ahh system lmfao.
Even when you get the worst case scenario, you basically get two 6 star characters minimum in 120 pulls ( a spook and the guaranteed rate up). That's on average 1 in 60 pulls. You don't get what you want but the game compensates with good averages. Then there's the weapon banner and cert shop as even more compensation.
For context, Epic Seven had a similar system (hard pity at 121, no carryover) and you could earn enough in game currency to hit pity on every single banner character just from playing. Now, I doubt Endfield will be as generous, but it'll at least be better than what we've been getting with the Hoyo games.
"You can get Weapon Currency from Weekly mode for 10-20 pull" on Month that mean you already have your signature weapon. also from daily alone currency 1 day 400 oru * 30 days = 12000 oru plus Weekly mode 800 * 4 weeks = 3200 oru, that mean 30,4 Character Pull per month alone.
They just need to add the pity carry over everything else feels fine, Many people arnt going to be saving for so long to get a 6*, it wont feel like your pull currency has disappeared in thin air. It adds some sort of progression to it.
The pity system is carried over dude, What is not carried over is the rate up guarantee 120 Let me explain a little bit. There are 2 pity systems here, soft pity and hard pity, Soft pity is at 65 pulls while hard pity is at 80 pulls, in hard pity you will definitely get a character guarantee *6, and If you lose after 80 pulls, then the guarantee will be active as (80/120), While the pity will be (0/80), If you continue the pulls, then all the systems will increase the numbers like (90/120) Followed (10/80), If there is a reset scenario, then the ones affected by the reset are (90/120) while (10/80) will still be carried over to the next banner. Note, this applies if the banner is not a limited character banner
based 👏IN "ALL" WE TRUST" Most of spanish-speakers creators (most of them hoyo centered) and hoyoplayers can´t understand it, but deep down it's because they're used to the disgusting hoyo system that makes you go for 50% nerfed characters in need for dupes and artifacts. Another thing I've seen in these parts is that they complain that there's no farming for items with rng stats lol! Endfield gives them a factory and they want to go back to manual labor in the rng quarry.
I feel like we need considering how easy and how stable you can get Gacha currency in the game on daily/Weekly, but since Endfield still in Beta we won't know the rate we getting the gacha curency yet.
I mean, if there is even a pity system at all, it's already a non issue. I'm sure there are some ppl here who played gachas without any pity systems. Raise yall hands up.
I've done some Monte Carlo simulations of the system, on average you'll get about 12.3k wep banner certs per rate up you get which is just slightly over 4 10x, just enough to get 1 guaranteed 6* wep. You'll probably get 1 rate up wep for every 2 rate ups.. for basically free.
This is perfect gacha system. It at the same time more FTP friendly and P2W costly at the same time. 120 pity is god's blessing for every FTP player, but it happens only once per banner, so whales will spend more, and from whales perspective that's good, cause limbus company was too free and failed. The only ones complaining are hoyofans, cause they cant understand basic math.
As generous as it is with only needing 120, I hope they don’t give less premium currency on release. Zzz gives less but they drop so many events for the game to balance it out.
even tourist will figure it out, the first time they fail the 50/50 twice and don't get the rate up. and get filtered. its a new system, we'll see how generous it is in practice. personally .8% to get the rate up early is not making me happy.
TH-camrs with these videos aren't much better. This guy doesn't know other systems well enough and he's talking like 180 pulls is the standard. Which is, in fact, a misinformation. After 73rd pull on the character banner, 0.6% per pull becomes increasingly higher, with about +5% more per each pull. Generally speaking, most players obtain 5-stars within 79 - 83 pulls range, with more lucky ones finishing in 74 - 78 pulls, and very unlucky players getting all the way to 84 - 86. While 87 - 88 is extremely rare and 89 seems more like a reason for a good laugh (it's comically rare), I have never EVER seen anyone showing a history of 90 pulls, let alone 90 + 90 double disaster. It's a mathematically miserable chance. But that's not what I wanted to highlight in the first place. If you analyze a history of 2000+ pulls (whale accounts), a LIMITED 5-star takes about 120 - 130 pulls on average, counting not only pity but also "early drops". And that's where things become interesting, since we don't have the data big enough from Endfield. If their supposedly increased 0.8% chance per pull actually manifests in more early drops, it will translate to 6-stars hitting your account every < 100 pulls on average, which would still make Endfield better on paper. That's what I'd love these videos to say. But instead they're blabbering about the officially written rules. What's the point, everybody can read the rules. If you make a video then take your time and get down to the very core of it.
Stop blaming people for playing different games man. Its like one of those dumbasses that played FGO and keeps telling "this system is better because you dont have to do thousands of pulls to get SSR" instead you played Arknights and you think this is better. Its the dumbest take that any person could have. You literally play different kind of games to know which is the best and generous of them all. It's literally how studying works or enhancing your skills or profession. Like when Gordon Ramsay travels the world to learn different kinds of cooking, in his way of doing, he learns what's best and what's not. I could literally say so much more on why this take is the dumbest bullshit I have ever heard. I played many gacha games including Arknights. The only thing I can say is, why the hell would you tell a person who eats good food that its fine to eat shit just because you have been eating shit for years? You literally put yourself in FIRE for years and you blame people because they dont want to be in the fire? So dumb.
-no immediate powerful dupes -no limited as of now -far lower guarantee if you’re not greedy -weapon banner that’s actually almost free. I understand you’d be a bit piss if you are a whale trying to get dupes in this game, but F2P have it way easier in this game. People are way too used to Hoyo gacha system that they can’t even fathom to save instead of building pity.
I think this banner system is good for F2P, but shit for whales. Lets compare this to WuWa (from a WuWa player) which has the best system that follows Genshin's as a baseline (Other ones are HSR and ZZZ). Base 5 (6 star for AKEN) star drop rate - 0.8% WuWa vs. 0.8% AKEN Base 4 star (5 star in AKEN) drop rate - 6% WuWa vs. 8% AKEN (it is to be noted that there is no guarantee for the desired 4 star in WuWa as there are 3 rate ups at a time) 5 star guarantee (6 star in AKEN) - 160 WuWa vs. 120 AKEN If you lose 50/50 and don't have 120 pulls saved up - 80 WuWa vs. 120 AKEN That means you should pull on the character banner only and only if you have 120 pulls whereas in WuWa you can pull anytime. So for smart players AKEN is better. Weapon banner - 80 pity WuWa vs. 40 pity but has 25/75, 80 guarantee AKEN (in AKEN you will get the 40 pulls if you pull 120 times on character banner) Base rates for weapon - 0.8*1 = 0.8% WuWa vs. 4*0.25 = 1% AKEN "Refund currency" - In AKEN you get refund currency only for weapon banner but the plus side is that you get a lot (30 pulls for 1 10 pull on weapon banner). In WuWa... Its complicated. You get 70 Afterglow corals for 120 pulls (guaranteed). That is ~ 9 pulls which can be both for character or weapon. But in WuWa you can buy 5 star character dupes and also 4 star characters. Also you get 7 pulls of each type per patch as well from your refund currency. WuWa has an advantage though, i.e you need only 3 characters per team vs. 4 for AKEN. So, it seems AKEN is better in terms of F2P players. Well, we don't know yet. If AKEN's pulls per patch is equal to or higher than WuWa then yes. Also, how much do you need the 5 stars (6 stars in AKEN)? How many teams do you need (In WuWa you need 2 fully built ones for tower)? Also powercreep. WuWa so far has no powercreep in terms of damage potential. Eg. When Xiangli Yao came out (free unit Btw), he powercreeped Calcharo but not in terms of damage but rather ease of use. Calcharo deals equal or even more damage than XY but is way harder to use optimally. Shorekeeper feels like she powercrept Verina, but many teams use Verina more than SK and their power difference is not that high. For whales WuWa is way better. Also saying dupes don't do much in AKEN is not an argument as you don't need them in WuWa ZZZ and Genshin either (HSR powercreep is built different tough). For whales S0R1 is enough for any character but they go overkill cause they want to. I think AKEN will be more F2P friendly than WuWa but we cannot know yet. I personally am very excited for this game!
I have ran simulations comparing pulls needed to get the first rateup character, Endfield is just cheaper by at least 20 pulls. not to mention that the weapons are basically free. According to CN testers, the weapons are much more important than the character stacks. Even if you want stats amp dupes, you should go for weapons, transferrable and much bigger numbers, which is at astonishing 4% for 6 stars weapons with farmable currencies. But apparently the gacha players don't deserve this smh.
don't mind me as I go back gamblin on getting the correct Face Cards, Highest Damage Roll for each cards used, getting enemy to kill the correct ally, and praying debuffs to land in 7 consecutive turns in FGO minturns/TA instead of gamblin my real money on hoyo gacha system :'v
Hey yall! AK player here, and I understand the significance of dupes is not worth it or attractive. But I think there will be still whales trying to get max potential for who knows they like the character a lot or for some other purposes. So I hope to suggest an improvement to the current spark system. The suggestion is to improve the spark after the first 120 spark to be perpectually at an arbitary number say 160, 180 or even 200. But not more than 200. I think if they do 300 spark in non collab AK limited event with 0.8% rate is going to be really tough for the people who want to whale. This isn't 2% like AK. Even at 200 spark, it is still at worst 1120 pulls to max out the character. In AK terms of 185 ori per pack without double bonus or 55.5 pulls, that is a more than a whooping 20 packs. It is unrealistic to miss a few rate ups with that many pulls, but that is just a worst case scenario. For expensively developed 3D games such as their closest competitor, correct me if I am wrong that it takes roughly a ball spark figure of $2000 to max out the constellation or dupes? With this proposed system of 200 perpectual sparks, that is similar in terms of money spent in Endfield. Again I want to emphasize that spending that much in gacha games is horrible idea. But whales are also the players that support a great deal of the game not only because of personal gratification, but also to support the game's cause and to help fund them to create even better content and updates. All in all people who love the game from f2p to dolphins and whales can achieve together and make the game better. Hence I sincerely hope Hypergryph to further improve on the current system. It will be beautiful to side on both the f2p/dolphin and whales, with the current 120 spark + free rate up weapon and the perpectual spark.
The amount of videos ive swen in og Arknights of people having to do 120-300 pulls just to get the main focus character is wild. A 120 system gives people something to fall back on especially if they want two operators back to back. We still dont know what the average rewards will be so its better to have the gacha system in order now rather than later and the 120 garuntee us my only gripe despite being an Arknights player. I was talking to someone else on another video and they had a pretty good idea for what to do with the garuntee. Allow the 120 garuntee to carry over, however with however many pulls that are left once you get the character you lose the garuntee and anything after that is just a 50/50 So lets say you do Latvernia's banner at 119/120 Yvonne's banner comes up and you only need one pull to get her. The garuntee for the banner dissappears until whatever banner after that. So basically Latvernia: 119/120 Yvonne: 120/120 and then everything after that is 50/50 pity The banner after: 0/120 Wash rinse and repeat. Ilm bad at explaining but if i find the comment again l'll put it under this
Example Laevatain Banner: 119/120 Yvonne Banner: 119/120+ 1 = Guaranteed Yvonne.+ 10 pulls = 0. No building up Guarantee amount Banner after Yvonne's: 0/120 Explanation: lf players do get Laevatain, then they would not get anymore 120 Guarantee until Yvonne's Banner, and they start at 0/120 Guarantee, which is like how the Banner is right now. However if players did not get Laevatain, the Guarantee would Carry Over but they can only Guarantee Yvonne once and the Guarantee is gone, then they would start at 0/120 Guarantee starting the next banner. SO, if you get Laevatain, you basically have 2, 120 Guarantees in the version, 1 for Laevatain's Banner and 1 for Yvonne's Banner. However, if you fail to get Laevatain, the Guarantee carries over, but you technically only have 1 Guarantee for the version, Yvonne's Banner. This seems like a positive improvement for me. Players gain Guarantee Carry Over, in
The CN community has run multiple simulations for this pity system. The result is, at 119 pulls (right before the hard pity), the chance of you getting the featured UP 6 star character is only 65.7%. For 6 star characters in general, at 73 pulls you have a cumulative probability of 94% to have hit at least one 6 star. In contrast, in Arknight, that probability is at 91% at 60 pulls.
For featured UP 6 star character in Arknight normal single UP pool, at 119 pulls the chance of you getting the featured UP 6 star character is around 86%.
You forgot to point out something important, that is even if the 120 pull guarantee only occurs once per banner, it only concerns whales. So, it's friendly for f2p and low spender who are only concerned about getting a single copy, but offers no safety net for whales who wanted to get 6 copies. Also, dupes in Endfield doesn't offer as much power ups like Genshin, which is similiar in OG Arknights where dupes are pretty much useless except for a very few situation and operators. If nothing changed from beta, Endfield would be more generous and less predatory than most competitors in gacha ARPG. Unless you want to max out your waifus. Combine all of those, you'll instead be wondering whether HG is trying to start a charity or a new gacha live service. Of course, we still don't know how much the gacha currency that players can get for free per week in released version so we can't really confirm. However, the doomposting of people who is so used to Genshin gacha mechanics become less and less funny at this point.
And mihoyo also has done similar things. Don't think too hard about these PR campaigns. It's still comparing a very exploitative form of separating money from the wallet, and while I'll agree that Endfield's gacha is better, it's still saying you'd prefer to poop normally rather than poop liquid. This is coming from someone who has been through the early FGO Experience and lived to witness Andiragate.
@@DrmChsr0 no shit bro, I'm just making a joke building from an ongoing inside joke of Arknights community. is that me defending the company? I guess I can see why it'll look like it but no
easy explain - 120 guarantee cannot carry to next banner, each banner will reset 120 guarantee to get the rate up character - Pity system at 80 pull if you get the rate up or not it's will carry to the next banner and continue to count like normal gacha you know (if you get the rate up the 120 guarantee will gone) - Weapon banner will take 40 pull to get 1 6* and if you lucky each 10 pull you will have 1 to 2 or more 6* weapon because the rate 4% drop (original arknights just got 2% but still get 3 6* operator)
The thing I hate about the comparison video is the fact that people often ignore the dupe system, is it worth to have dupes, approximate the difference between dupe and no dupe, I (used to) and my friends play hoyo games often have to plan ahead, to get specific dupe of one char on their debute but also reruns to get certain char to their potential but with AK, limbus and endfield, their IS planing for getting char but no pressure to get another dupe, even if the mathematical total rate is worse, It release the burden of pulling for dupe to enjoy the char as f2p or low spender
If Hoyo players had a brain, Endfield would be the end of Genshin. Doubt it will though because they're in too deep. They're not gonna stop at this point even if you held a gun to their head. That and the fact that Hypergryph still made Endfield require brain activation to play with the whole factory stuff, the main reason that people don't play Arknights.
I would also love to address the potential/constellarion system in Endfield: they are meaningful baffs, such as -10% energy cost or +10% crit rates, as well as other gimmicks. But so far i have seen nothing that gamebreaking as constellations for some Genshin characters. So you are encouraged to pull for copies, but operatots without them are not unplayable.
It is quite simple, banner & pity system is subject to the consistent pull income. HSR 80 pity banner with 50/50 with abundant pull income sound appealing to some VS PGR 60 pull guarantee new unit but with very strict pull income. Looking forward to seeing how consistent the pull income in endfield would be
@pedrohenrique-db3xd That's the beta though. Beta currency is subject to change, since they want players to get a lot of currency right away in the beta so they can show off more characters to wider audiences, drumming up interest in the game.
It's honestly the only thing the system is missing, a failsafe for whales. (as a F2P player, it's crazy to say a gacha system is not good enough for whales) If they fix that it will be insane for everyone
I mean, it is pretty fair. In fgo the chance for a 5 star is 0.2%, it doesnt have the carry over to the next banner, and the garantee is at 330 pulls (900 sq). If you are a f2p is basically impossible to get to that amount of sq. As an fgo player seeing hoyo and the others gacha system doesnt scare me.
Yeah, such a good gacha system that will literally obliterate "lucky-unlucky" people.
Cant wait to lose 3 50\50 in 30 pulls, because the actuall guarantee is only at 120, so even if i get lucky and get 3 5* characters(i do not care for your dogshit naming, six star my ass), none of them will even be guaranteed to be limited.
In WuWa, i got 3 standard and 3 limited characters in my first 120 pulls
In AK:E, i will get 5 standard characters and 1 limited.
Thats it. End of discussion. its a dogshit system that preys on "lucky-unlucky" people, who get early 5*, but always lose 50\50. And since dupes arent worth shit in your dog AK games, you wont even feel a little bit good about getting a constellation for your standard character.
This system takes the most unlucky person into the "heaven"(not at all), while completely obliterating half of the lucky players.
Also, the rates are still worse then in WuWa. It is a mathematical fact. Add up the probabilities, and WuWa will come out by about 10-13 pulls better on average for a limited 5*.
Did bro even watch the video?
First of all, 5 star isn't the highest rarity in the game. It's 6 star. It's shown very clearly in the video.
Secondly, the rate-up operator whose portrait is shown on the banner is a 6 star, which is of the highest rarity. The "guaranteed in every 10 pull" is for the 5 star rarity.
Besides, if you were to compare hard pity, Endfield's is at 120 pulls while Wuwa is 160 pulls. Use actual numbers stated in the game to make arguments instead of personal experience since it will not be the same for everyone.
Lastly, why even complain about having multiple chances of getting a 5 star? Even if it's 50/50, it is very unlikely that you won't pull the rate up 5 star operator at some point. If you were to actually commit 120 pulls, the chances for that to happen is 0.5^12, which is 0.024%.
Again, I can't emphasize this enough, but the highest rarity is 6 star, not 5 star. I'm not sure if you lack reading comprehension or just ignorant.
@@tbyte_ what he is trying to say is : there is no guarantee that u will get the on banner 6 star if u got 2 6* in one 10 pull or even 3
They all still could be standard. The lucky - unlucky players.
While in other game if u get 2 S
rank in 1 10 pull u are guaranteed to get atleast one on banner S RANK.
Actual end of discussion should be at the moment when you mention getting 5 standard and 1 limited character, because you're missing one tiny little detail - unlike both WuWa and Genshin, vast majority of 6* characters ARE standard characters. In this case you're getting 6 standard characters, just one of them being rate-up, why it's so important? Do you think I want another fucking qiqi or Diluc dupe? Like sure buddy, they maybe do get something from those constellations, but lmao you'll never use them either way, the only 5* that got added over 4,5 years are Tighnari (pretty decent as far as I remember) and Dehya (lmao), when in AKE almost every character gets added to a standard pool after their respective banner ends.
The real kicker here tho is that we don't know how they'll handle actual limited characters, but if we assume they're using the same system as for current standard banner rate-ups (50/50, 120 pulls rate-up guarantee) if you're actually getting 6 6* in 120 and 5 of them are standard characters, chances are at least one of them is new, and might even be on par or better than limited, unlike aforementioned Qiqi or Diluc who'll just keep gathering dust, but now with the ability to reduce atk of enemies hit by her skill by 15% or whatever when you're probably not even using her for the past 4 years, it's extremely useful right
I'm not even going to entertain the idea of "lucky-unlucky" concept you're having, since in AKE you're actively encouraged to save exactly because most of the banners are standard, so unless you want that specific unit so badly that getting them on rate-up is your best bet, you're better off saving for limited banner with decently high chance of getting someone you missed down the line
@@bikerhomi I wish people knew the feeling of getting an off-banner Thorns, Mudrock or Młynar
@@bikerhomi so limited will get added to standard? Thats crazy good ✨
Only OG AK and number analyst can understand how good what they présented in the beta is
Truth.
@Reldan it was better to compare to genshin for all those hoyo fan xD. As everything looks related to their scale.
True
@@Millesimia weapon banner is worse than WuWa tho? The youtuber mentioned WUWA but didnt include WuWa on weapon banner since its guaranteed and his points would be nonesense.
Weapon banner is also worse than arknights. Which doesn't have any... I'm so tired of games insisting on equipment banners, even worse when they have less than 50/50 odds
Before Enfield: "EN doesn't read"
After Endfield: "Tourist can't read"
Big surprise that the low IQ gacha streamers, who depend upon getting high dupes and blasting through the game on easy mode, are unhappy with how discouraged pulling for dupes is in this game.
More gambling means more content for their streams.
Ist @tectone also tourist
@@HATSE2357NAGAZIhe aint a tourist he got deported
Seeing some people complaining about the 25/75 weapon gacha rates without factoring in the 4% chance, thinking it's worse than hoyo's system, reminds me of this:
"In 1980, A&W tried to compete with McDonald's Quarter Pounder by selling a 1/3 pound burger at lower cost. The product failed, because most customers thought the 1/4 was bigger."
...I really do have questions about how education works over there...
tbh yeah lots of people who participate in gambling games don't really know how math works
@@natchu96 it doesn’t, that’s the thing.
Hoyo's GI weapon banner system is the worst and is straight up a scam
Literally guarantee in 80 pulls, no need to use our gacha currency, and we can farm the Tickets weekly. The worst they said 😂😂
A lot of tourist complaning about the gacha system most of them didn't play Arknights so they were confused.
it's hard to watch kinda, so it's better if they watch someone who played both games like you who fully understand between both games.
Watching the gacha animation makes me want to spread Endfield democracies
FOR SUPER EARTHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH !!!!!!!!!!
@@noname-jr5jf FOR SUPER TALOOOOSSSSS !!!!
@@ghiffaribara2949 I don't want to be that guy, but Talos planet is a giant gas planet, you're sending people into jupiter basically, a raging gas storm, we're on talos-II it's moon
@@Kazenaraka Talos II, Talosthu. We'll liberate them all the same.
For Rock and Stone!
oops wrong planet
HYPERGRYPH HATES MONEY
Proven time and time again
Just like the hoyoverse fans
@@Sergazz They just hate their own money the most.
Fr tho
Always has been🔫👨🚀
People really have hoyo-system stockholm syndrome
I hate the fact WuWa adopted it despite having PGR as template. More gacha should move away from Hoyo model
@@doommaker4000 I thought so. PGR has the best system but why Kuro didn't use that in Wuwa instead "better version" of hoyo? Because it didn't bring much money. Endfield use better system compared to their OG version; Arknights
Both are garbage. Snowbreak has 100% after 100 pulls. There is no better system than that.
@@robertnomok9750Counter point: Snowbreak is Snowbreak
@@doommaker4000 It’s all about familiarity. Like the saying, “If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.”
See, I'm an idiot, I will play Enfield anyway without understanding any numbers
You're so real for this 😂
That's exactly the approach I take to every gacha I've played. All my profile greetings are me letting people know I'm just a functional idiot in a more polite way.
As of how things are currently worded in the banner, I'd like to add/correct a few things.
Firstly, the 120 guarantee resets with every new banner. This is true. But your progress towards the 80 pull pity for a 6* does not.
Secondly. The weapon banner. Not only can you get arsenal tickets by pulling, but also from the rougelike weekly mode. On top of that, there is a guarantee of a 6* weapon every 40 pulls, and a guarantee of the rate up at 80.
But both the character and weapon guarantees are 1-time only. So... I personally think it's a good system, but I do understand why there is some hesitation/frustration.
is the 120 guaranteed is like sparking where you buy the character with the 120 pull count like ak limited ops banner or the rate up character appear at 120 pulls?
The rate up is guaranteed at 120 pulls, the spark system is the gold certificate, where you can exchange gold cert for character, for AK it's usually a collect a bunch and just exchange it for a character to plug the holes you missed
@roach1898 I don't think so. I managed to get Laevatein before the 120 guarantee. But I *think* it's just a 100% guarantee that your 120th pull will be the rate-up, regardless of your current 6* pity.
Sorry if that's a bit confusing. I'm not really sure how to word it properly.
Also, one thing I don't think anyone has mentioned at all is that currently, you can purchase 3 different 6*s characters in the shop with certs. They're expensive, but they're available.
@@Kazenarakayeah, why everyone forget that this game too have yellow certs and you can exchange standart characters for that. 120 pulls - 1 6* and 12 5* (worst case) - 170 certs, character price is 500!
@ Yea, the 120 pulls is just to ensure you get the rate up char, if you get it before, the 120 guaranteed disappear and that's what get people miffed, because now you have to rely on 80 50/50 that you can farm to carry over to next banner for a chance to get early RNG guaranteed anyway
we defend the dijiang with this one.
really tho, with every freakin hours i only saw gacha endfield doomposting in my recommendation for the past 4 days.
thanks for every hot water kettle that clarify them
cheers o7
We need to spread democracy
What I'm getting from the arguments all around lately:
"Easier to get one copy of the banner character? Not limited? F2P friendly?! Where do I get my gacha dopamine then?! They should just copy hoyo and LET ME GAMBLE ALL MY MONEY RAAAHHHH!!! Story and gameplay? Who even cares about them"
At first I thought the gacha community are mainly chill f2p poeple with probably ~5% whales, but now I'm thinking A LOT of you guys actually do have gambling addiction
If people wanted stories, they'd read a book.
Gacha games these days are just glorified slot machines, with cute anime art to manipulate and soften the blow.
@@sushimuncher282You do know story isn't exclusice to book right?
Even advertisement thia day have story to hook people to buy.
Playing gachas, to begin with, is a gambling addiction. If you play too, then you have it as well. Don't be a hypocrite.
@@Riskofrain-n9f I started playing gacha games because they're free and can be played anywhere, nowadays I stay for the stories. If I really like a character I spend my extra money on their merch and figurine (if there is any) instead of their dupes.
"You play gacha which means you are a gambler"
"You like anime so you must be a pedo"
"You a gamer? Must be one of those basement dwellers"
Sure, sure.
@@sushimuncher282 Arknights is my book (series). Stories are more fun when you can somewhat take part with them, imo.
Funny how tourist hated the Arknights gacha system they didn't know or read, they just take twitter or reddit out of context.
Remember the 120 pull is like the AK collab (Dungeon Meshi is coming up)
And yes, HG still hates $$$
It's hard to believe that anyone could beat us at the not reading allegation
@@PlasuMinasu i cry 😭😭
Look, as someone who have played a decent amount of gachas, I can say *kinda* get it.
Being able to "build pity" means that you *may* be able to get the newest meta breaking waifu (because it is always waifu), which means you won't have to worry about the newer content that depend on the newest unit doing Close Beta Test on you.
Not all games can be based like AK where I can see a new unit and not care if I get it or not because I can still use older units perfectly fine (though not all, obviously).
Still, I won't complain. If they add all new ops to the common poll and keep the 4 limites per year thing (which them being part of future limited banners) it will more than make up for not being able to "build pity"
@@Dadan-dan you have point I can guarantee that HG still doing their gacha system in Arknights so someone will will be confused had used to Genshin or WuWa gacha system, Enfield itself for me leave that G or W system rather stick on their roots on OG itself
But tbh, FGO banner still the worst
I don't give a fuck about the gacha system, I give a fuck about the dupe system. Which Endfield so far has been shown to be very lenient and OG Arknights in essence which makes me extremely happy as a hoyoverse refugee (Genshin up to Sumaru release, HSR up to Argenti release) and GFL2 player (whose dupes on some characters change ENTIRE MECHANICS with their kit and synergy, and are TREMENDOUS power boosts). I don't care about pity systems or whatever the fuck, I just roll when I feel like it and if I don't get limited rate up that's fine it's how I've been dealing with Arknights since 2020.
Me getting zonned in arena by dups 1 makiato
@@okboi5723 bro the ai is brain dead, doesnt matter if they have p2w full stack comp, you can still outsmart them
@@okboi5723 That's a skill issue. Attack from the side that is opposite to Makiatto and leave her for last. She barely moves and wastes her turn constantly just like QJ. You bait the V1 Suomi out of cover on their turn 2 at max range, override her ult with your own Suomi's and kill her. You can also flank with Vepley to kill Tololo/Sabrina/Lotta (whichever they're bringing) or start poking down QJ with your own sniper. WIth a bit of practice you'll win every time.
Team comp: Suomi V1 (she was guaranteed even if you lost every 50/50), Vepley, any sniper, any dps that ignores cover (Lotta, Papasha were both free)
based 👏👏👏👏
That's the thing that wuwa and hoyo players don't understand. Once the banner ends 6* characters automatically move to the standard pool so they are not limited.
So basically you save up 120 pulls to guarantee and even if you lose 50-50 then you might get someone you skipped. Also keep in mind just like AK you can just buy the characters from the token you accumulated overtime so if that skipped characters is in the shop you just literally buy and the same applies for the weapon.
One thing to keep in mind that we might get 2 or 3 limited banners per year which is still better than anything other big gaccha games are offering.
That's not necessarily a good thing chief.
I play Granblue Fantasy. Our SSR pool is completely saturated at this point, there are far more SSRs than R and SR characters combined. It may sound cool to be spooked by a unit that you wanted and missed but once the pool becomes gigantic, chances of getting a max rarity character that you missed or dupes of a character that you want to max or even the character you want themselves only get more and more slim.
If you played Blue Archive you know, while not all characters go into the general pool, it still feels like total ass to get a dupe for a max rarity character that you already have maxed, a character that you skipped or having to go for full pity to get the character that you want while getting showered with SSRs that you don't want or need.
@@ayuvir people like you were never get satisfied huh?
@@ayuvir No, that is necessarily a good thing. The chances to max a character you want with a massive pool are extremely slim, the chances to max a character you want with a pool that doesn't have said character are exactly zero. Making the bigger pool better.
There's a fair chance you'll eventually max laevatein in Arknights even if you never pull for her. However you're GUARANTEED to never even get A SINGLE DUPE of The Herta in HSR unless you go for her banner. Bigger standard pool = better chances to max the unit, because above zero is better, period.
If you really want dupes you pull for rate-ups or you buy in the shop anyway, so counting on the standard spook is kinda silly (and you generally don't want dupes in arknights anyway, you want actual units, we're not talking hoyo games where half the character's strength is locked behind dupes here)
@ayuvir Whats the alternative? To have a handful of 6 stars in the permanent pool that almost never grows bigger? That will probably also be among the weaker 6 stars?
Not sure how that would be better for not getting spooked by an operator you already have.
Plus it's not like we need to look to other gachas for comparison. The OG arknights has been out for more than 5 years now and has always had this system. If they didn't add new operators I would still be getting old operators from off rate like some other games when I don't get rate up. Which are useless to me as I already have nearly all of them and also don't need most of them even if I didn't have them.
Over the years I've gotten plenty of operators I decided to skip or missed out on, that I was happy to get instead of rate up on future banners.
Plus of worst case they can just redo what they did with Kernel banners in arknights. After a while they moved all year 1 operators to a separate banner that you can't get spooked by on regular banners. They've kept moving more over time and now all year 2 six stars are also in that banner.
So at the very least I can only get spooked by year 3 and later operators. For new players who want a specific older operator they can just save up and buy them from the shop when the rotate in, since Kernel banners have a separate 6 star and 5 star rotation. Or I guess pull on that banner but that isn't recommended since overall the newer operators are better and it's a better idea to just target the strong older operators from the shop.
@@vvey4523 The chances aren't zero, as you rightly pointed out, you can pull for characters in their banners and you'd have a much higher chance to max them out over having an increasingly larger pool of characters that are always available. After two years, new players that want specific characters are going to sweat.
Listen, I read quite a bit of urgency in your post any I get that you may be upset at reading someone that disagrees with the op's statement. Here's the thing:
1. I'm hyped up and very much wanting to play Enfield, like you. I am not your enemy.
2. I am merely stating my experience with this system. I've played many games in the past that used it. It's not new. Maybe the odds are higher, but the system itself isn't anything that you can't find around.
3. You don't ever need dupes in these kinds of games. There's an entire cult around CCs that "do the math" and try to spin you to pull for dupes. That's true for HSR, it's true for BA, it's true for NIKKE, true for AK and will be true for Enfield.
4. Hoyo designs characters around being exponentially better with dupes, but they are very much not required. There's channels on youtube made around beating all the high level content as weakly as possible. One of which the dude was against even using the standard pulls or eidolons. I know shitting on the big boys is fun but curb your bias and be fair, if you even know what you're talking about. I'm sorry you didn't have luck on your Herta pulls.
5. Having dupes of characters often times makes them exponentially stronger in any game where the mechanic is implemented, this'll be true even for Enfield.
I repeat, I am not your enemy, I merely stated that this system sounds really good on paper but it's neither better nor worse. I know this from prior experience with games that have the same system.
What is better is how generous they made the number of pulls for pity. 120 is quite low. Now we need to see how much currency we get outside of the starting month.
Overall tourists have no perception about how good Endfield is overall. The gacha is honestly good, the weapon banner not even needing the same materials as character pulls and a re pretty affordable and forgiving and also
Tourists have no idea how good the combat dor example is because they play it like a hack and slash game. It's a world different to see someone utilize mechanics over "just Surtr it". Just hope we will get reality check events like CC#
Integrated Strategies has been a god send to Arknights, i hope they can do the same to Endfield. IS mode is still a hot cake to me and i keep playing it, i wonder how will they make an Innovative end game content like IS mode....
was reading comments... yup, i'm glad this system will filter out those type of players.
Oh no.. what are they saying? Isn't it good that the rates are better?
@@monotechnicif rates is better it's always good thing. But lots of toxicity and doomposting is not helping any situation but makes things worse
@@mtg8968 guess people will find anything to complain about
I actually wanted to think that the 120 guaranteed pull is like pulling for a collab character in og arknights.
Just wanted to remind everyone that dungeon meshi is near.
the reason most of people think gacha system in endfield is bad because the only gacha game they play is from hoyo or wuwa where they have similar gacha mechanics, where the currency you get per patch are limited, dupe that can change the mechanics of char, the existence of weapon banner making decisions of pulling become harder, and the biggest one the 120 pity on endfield not carry over is bad because they fear once they miss the banner they have to wait for rerun and i know this is not confirmation but from the banner it says "rate-up char" not "limited time char" so chance are high that once the char banner is off they will put it on standard banner.
and i just do rough calculation on worse case scenario you need,
220 pull to guarantee character and its weapon and comparison to genshin/hsr/zzz you need 360 pull for character and sig weapon
They are not prepared and they do not adapt
The Arknights Endfield Gacha system situation is insane
5:34 actually the soft pity for guaranteed 6 star weapon is 40 pulls, while the hard pity, the guaranteed rate up is on 80.
They forgot about how Endfield character gacha system only give you a CHARACTER. Gosh I hate those game where you got more shitty weapon than the actual character in CHARACTER banner....
After talking with my AK comrades, I too agree this gacha system is pretty good since dupes aren't a must in AK so probably the same in ENDfield. This makes u become a hoarder.
Isn't that just you assuming dupe isn't important. It beta, everything can change.
If they willing change the rate then it wouldn't be out of quesrion for them to make dupe more impactful.
@@applel2.043 I mean, they could change it, yes. But they kept the same system in OG arknights for 5 years. Even after 5 years of powercreep potential mean very little there, so I think there's little reason they would do that in Endfield now.
@pedrohenrique-db3xd it a different team. You never know what will change. People approach a 2d tower defense and 3d exploration game very differently.
actually, the ones in charge of endfield are the OG team of arknights @@applel2.043
@@applel2.043you make fair judgement. Let's hope they keep the dupes irrelevant 👍
Endfield's gacha is geared towards getting the one rateup, once, and probably it's weapon, each patch, the question is, how many pulls will you get as f2p, monthly and monthly + BP.
Yeah that's pretty much my final conclusion, we can just speculate. If they're as generous as in AK, then we will eat really good
@@PlasuMinasulol look at how the gacha design, you can already tell that it'll be 70-90 roll per patch, cause that how this system work, it's nothing new they just combine the gacha system from the old gacha jp era and genshin in the worst way 😂 instead of yeah here 2% rate 120 pity can carry over guys
@@minhtringuyen8467
The unenlightened masses
They cannot make the judgement call
Give up free will forever their voices won't be heard at all
Display obedience
While never stepping out of line
And blindly swear allegiance
Let your country control your mind
@@PlasuMinasu lol, too bad that I'm right and i gonna bet they will do exactly that. The best thing about old gacha system is its high rate so you can yolo, the best thing about genshin gacha is pity can be carry over. They're not combined the best but instead the worst, what can be said lol. People justified this system always assumes the worst but do remember the rate to get banner char is 50/50 which mean you can just fish for the 50 win every banners, if not then you move on. With this system, you can't and it's even created more fomo when you just have to get to 120, which like 40 pulls worst case
400 currency for daily only, so multiply that by 13 days you get 5.200 which cover 10 pulls (this is only daily, not exploration rewards), for weapon i dont have the exact value, but in the rogue like mode you can get approx 20 pulls every weekly reset
Great video!
Was thinking of my own when my og AK emulator decides to actually work *REEEEEEE* to show what *could* be endfield limited banners and how it works in og ak.
One big issue enfield has is that with only 0.8% chance for a 6* it's going to be absolute hell if you want more copies of them past the first one, yes just like in AK the extra copies in endfield have almost no impact on performance but it's still hell if you do want more copies
tbf that didn't stop the AK whales
@ in AK it’s a lot better to go after dupes because the base chance is 2% so you’re more likely to get 6* while in endfield after the first 6* you can only rely on the 0.8%
@@Storn_no, you rely on 65 onward rate pull while hoping winning 50-50, just like AK
@ if you ever get to 65 pulls in AK you’re really fucking unlucky and most of the 6* will come before that, it’s more than 3 times easier to get a 6* in AK than in endfield which makes hunting dupes easier
@@Storn_ kinda makes me think its intentional to compensate how f2p it will be.
Correction, the AK guarantee is not st 150, but on the first 6" after that.
@@WymarSane oh yeah, you're absolutely right
Isn't it both?
gambling addicts when you can't "build pity" and have to actually manage your resources instead of impulsing every banner 😂
The concept of building pity on a banner you're not serious about is a joke but I still see a lot of Genshin players do this. Yeah I get that a lot of them are children and Genshin is their first gacha but god damn. If you "got lucky" on that banner you're gonna have to rebuild pity on the banner you actually want.
Tbh in og arknights, you literally can't go for hard pity if you are f2p unless you skip like 1 or 2 limited banners, but I mean we have 2% so fuck it we gambling
Okay, but hear me out. What if I want to "build pity" on a banner that I like anyways? So that either I luck out and manage to get the character on said banner, have built the pity without getting anything yet (so no "harm" done), or get an off-rate thus the very next one I get would be guranteed anyway regardless of what banner I pull next?
@@Shadow6OO I'm not gonna deny it's a good thing to have pity carry over banners but if I have to choose between having to spend more pulls to guarantee versus lesser pulls to guarantee I would definitely choose the latter as a low spender/f2p with bad luck.
Besides, even if you want to drop pulls on two banners but fail to get the rate-up of the one you're building pity on and get the next banner instead, the end result is you still only got to pull one rate-up of those two banners you're pulling on. If you had to guarantee it then it'd mean you just spent 160-180 pulls for one character. On the other hand, with endfield gacha system, as long as you don't gamble knowing the risk, you'd only spend 120 pulls to get one character in a worst case scenario.
Tbf, in games that copy Hoyo's model, dupes of characters tend to be really important. Like just getting a 4* isn't enough, gotta get another 6 copies of them, so often times you feel forced to "build pity", because otherwise you might never get the 4* you need.
But, since dupes seem insignificant in Endfield, this won't be nearly as big of a concern, so you can probably live with just getting the various 4 and 5* operators here and there from standard or lost 5* 50/50's.
actually you get 6* weapon in Endfield with just 40pulls, 80 is the guarantee rate up
I want to add things to set expectation for the gacha
The rate-up banner (like Laevatain now) character will be put into the standard banner as rate-off after their banner finished. So, if you in the future pull on other rate-up banner (for other, newer, characters) and you lose 50/50, you might get Laevatain (and other non-limited characters). Also, in OG Arknights, there's a rotation banner where older characters are put into new banner in pair, one of them can be bought in the shop directly using a currency that you got when you got a dupe (yellow certs). As far as I know only Arknights do this, in Wuwa you can only buy dupes not the characters themselves.
I'm assuming that Laevatain is not a limited character here since there is no wording of her being Limited. We don't know yet how Limited banner will be implemented. Assuming it works like in OG Arknights, Limited banner only come every anniversary. Any other character banners are rate-up and goes into the standard banner. Also, in OG Arknights, Limited character strength is not always higher than standard characters, it's all dependent on the characters' kit. But, one might value a Limited character higher by virtue of being Limited regardless of the character's strength. One more, there is no rerun for Limited banner in OG Arknights, but just like standard banner characters, at the time of Limited banner is up, you can straight up buy the previous Limited characters using currency you get from pulling on the Limited banner currently up.
- copied from my reply to other comment.
- once again, the whole paragraphs assume Hypergryph will implement the gacha system in Endfield to be similar to the gacha system in OG Arknights
Hot damn! I thought I'd been going crazy with people repeating the lie that the Endfield weapon gacha is bad. It's objectively the best weapon system that gacha games have ever seen by a wide margin. It's like watching people say that 2 + 2 = 5 and getting a crowd to repeat it over and over again.
The math is not hard guys. 25% of 4% is 1%. 1% > 0.7%. Even Wuwa is still a 0.8% rate - Endfield beats that too. The rates in every game are listed and easily available, but CCs for those games ought to know wtf the rates in their own games are that they spend thousands of hours and dollars playing for a living. The amount of absolute misinformation that's been going on around this has been ridiculous.
I think this is the first yt video about this were I see some sensible people. This issue is driving me insane xD
Big problem from what I understand is a lot of gacha players (Mihoyo players mostly from what i noticed) just expect mihoyo rates and complain if a system differs. Whether good or bad doesn't even factor into the decision.
You missing the obious fact that you aren't guranteed the 6* Weapon you want. You can potentially pull thousand of time and still not get the weapon you want. This is staff of homa all over again.
@ That mostly depends on how many rate up weapons they put into one weapon banner. So far one seems likely. and if they listen to feedback it'd be ncie if they implement it like Genshin where you can just select one preferred rate up weapon if there are multiple on one banner. Also with the amount of weapon pulls you'll constantly be getting this doesnt seem too much of an issue ngl. (I am aware however unlikely that you could potentially not get a 2nd rate up weapon in a banner tho)
@baylordeo3636 why would that be likely ? The details of the gacha literally mention "...guarantees the rate-up weapons, or one of them if there are multiple 6*"
They clearly have plan for it.
@@applel2.043 You're right. I was actually assuming on that one since the shown weapon/character banners so far has been single file. That's my bad. My hope would be with enough feedback they either change that or they could implement that you get a rate-up guarantuee every 80 weapons, not just the first one. This is tbh on the more easy end to improve.
Do we know if weapons actually can be boosted with duplicates btw?
I've had more fun obtaining characters in Arknights than any other gacha. Characters I passed over in the past showing up as off-rates is legitimately welcome.
I wanted to skip texas alter and just get penance once, didnt work out for me. I got texas back then and got penance months later off-banner. You really cant complain 😊
i got my first mylnar in pepe’s banner lol
@@Eclin Your “bad” luck left you better off. 😆
must protect
It's a good gacha system.
don't let them change it
Yeah, such a good gacha system that will literally obliterate "lucky-unlucky" people.
Cant wait to lose 3 50\50 in 30 pulls, because the actuall guarantee is only at 120, so even if i get lucky and get 3 5* characters(i do not care for your dogshit naming, six star my ass), none of them will even be guaranteed to be limited.
In WuWa, i got 3 standard and 3 limited characters in my first 120 pulls
In AK:E, i will get 5 standard characters and 1 limited.
Thats it. End of discussion. its a dogshit system that preys on "lucky-unlucky" people, who get early 5*, but always lose 50\50. And since dupes arent worth shit in your dog AK games, you wont even feel a little bit good about getting a constellation for your character.
This system takes the most unlucky person into the "heaven"(not at all), while completely obliterating half of the lucky players.
Also, the rates are still worse then in WuWa. It is a mathematical fact. Add up the probabilities, and WuWa will come out by about 10-13 pulls better on average for a limited 5*.
"1 Minus beat 100 Plus"
Aw man they (Tourist) need to Googling
1. How To Read,
2. How to Count,
3. How to Thank You, and
4. How to Apologize
😅
"Someone dared to step forth with the banner of innovation"
Onmyoji: hold my beer
Speculation is the big thing now on pull income. Here's what I've put together from watching beta information and comparing it to what HG is already doing in AK.
Current OG AK pull income is 28 pulls a month from regular sources (dailies, weeklies, monthlies, green cert shop). 40 with the $5 daily pass. On average HG gives another 35 pulls a month through events, lotteries, and bonuses.
Endfield known pulls so far:
24 pulls a month from dailies.
7 pulls a month from Algorithmic Memories.
~5 pulls a month from the factory outpost shop.
So that's at least 36 known pulls a month before any events - already 30% up from what we have in AK today from repeatable sources. For the events, personally I don't see HG getting less generous than they are in Arknights - if anything I'd anticipate them giving more pulls because of the lower rates. If you think they'll leave that about the same as AK, we'd be at around 70 pulls a month.
Personally I think that would be pretty good. The thing with the 120 guarantee is that it's an absolute worst-case scenario - over half the time you aren't going to hit it and you'll get the rate up with way less pulls than that. A redditor ran the Endfield system through 500,000 simulated pulls and the average number of pulls to get the rate-up was 81. Curiously, if you took that estimated 70 pulls from above and added another 11 pulls from buying a $5 monthly card, you also would get 81 pulls a month. I don't believe in coincidence when it comes to the math around huge money-making systems like this - HG has control of every angle of this system they've designed.
"Oh, but this is just speculation!" Well.... yeah. I never said otherwise. But extrapolation using actual data as a starting point often tends to get fairly close, and I think we do have a fair bit of data at this point.
120 is the best case scenario for standard banner, where if you lose 50/50 then each 6* would worth exactly 60 pulls.
This will only be an issue on limited banners because the guarantee would be way higher.
70 is pulls is absolutely not good lmao. That's horrible. I'd expect at least 80 pulls per version / every 2 banners. More would be ideal, but I don't think we're getting too much more, since I can't imagine we'll be allowed to guarantee a rate up unit every patch.
Well, you know what they say, there are 2 types of people: Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data.
Can anyone beat this tho?
🟦🟦🟦🟦🟦
🟦🟦🟦🟦🟨
💀ahh hell nah
Aronaaa💢💢
No way XD
What that
Arona no
Mihoyo fans are like abuse victims. They stay because they're sweet talked with pity carrying over and 75% weapon rate up.
Tourists hating endfield’s system, when ak fans have been eating good 😂
we are so brainrotted by Genshin Impact, Honkai Star Rail, Zenless Zone Zero, and Wuthering Waves.
We can't stand the peak gacha banner system that Arknights Endfield has
😭
Nice, funny & easy to understand presentation, next time I see someone making false info about the gacha system I'll slap this in the comment.
The game is not even out yet and it's already fucking over the tourists. Slay, HG.
Never play Arknights, didn't participate in CBT, too damn lazy to do proper research.. and then doomposting. Literally tourist behavior.
HG has a different system compared to other big gacha games and it works fine in Arknights for 5 years. So stupid to use wuwa or genshin sysyem in Endfield. Ofc it will be bad because these games work or operate very differently. Different system, different rule, and so different strategy needed.
Tourist will never read
so... aren't that just the "guaranteed on 120th pull" pity system in Collab headhunting banner from Ak.
Yeah. Not to long ago, they added it on the standard banner too just a little different (150 instead of 120, & does not spark at 150 but instead the next 6star after passing 150.)
That's exactly how I see it.
Basically just a (possibly standard?) banner with collab limited pity, albeit at the slightly lower rate
yooo your dokutah design is sick
help us from addiction with gatekeeping xD
I hate people only saw one line about the 120 Guerantee not being carried over and started to juge the entire system.
I really hope HG don't change much to make it similar to Genshin, even now it's already good since it's just AK gacha system. I take that one over yet another Hoyoverse system.
For Limited Banners, I think HG will employ a similar system but just tweak the 300 pull Spark to just 200 pulls like they have started doing for Arknights (One by one).
As a person who play multiple gacha, this is a normal thing 😂
Also, tourists can't read 😂
when i saw people paniking about the pity system, i was like we have that on the OG AK what are they paniking about? now that this guy did the math i can honestly say its basically the same but little better with the guaranteed 5 star every 10 for me that good if i dont wanna invest too much on the banner like in OG AK u atleast get something new every new banner
Only og players understand how generous HG is with f2p player. With just base grinds (smoking rockss and devices, and yes, you are basically a drugs dealer if you go this way) you are basically having a month pass (month pass gives you 400 a day include daily, while a good base and good materials grind can give you 500 a days include daily if you are an olbie). So if you are an oldbie and doing month passes, you can literally pull any Op you want with lower risk than other gacha games, even though A9 doesnt have the guaruantee pity except the limited banner, having 300 pity cap.
And i heard that they are trying to improve the base building mechanics and improve the grinding system in Endfield. Basically paradise for f2p players if they keep the same "rock grinding" ahh system lmfao.
Even when you get the worst case scenario, you basically get two 6 star characters minimum in 120 pulls ( a spook and the guaranteed rate up). That's on average 1 in 60 pulls. You don't get what you want but the game compensates with good averages. Then there's the weapon banner and cert shop as even more compensation.
You forgot to mention that in the weapon banner you actually get 2 6* weapons on the way to 80(the 25/75 on 40 and the guaranteed on 80)
For context, Epic Seven had a similar system (hard pity at 121, no carryover) and you could earn enough in game currency to hit pity on every single banner character just from playing.
Now, I doubt Endfield will be as generous, but it'll at least be better than what we've been getting with the Hoyo games.
The better online casino for a gambling addict
Man, now I'm afraid HG will listen to the genshin players' feedback and change it for the worse ...
Stay save brother, you know what happen to Marco right
1:53 oh my god everytime I see him 😢
if this gets implemented then only ever doing single pulls, what a pain
"You can get Weapon Currency from Weekly mode for 10-20 pull" on Month that mean you already have your signature weapon. also from daily alone currency 1 day 400 oru * 30 days = 12000 oru plus Weekly mode 800 * 4 weeks = 3200 oru, that mean 30,4 Character Pull per month alone.
They just need to add the pity carry over everything else feels fine, Many people arnt going to be saving for so long to get a 6*, it wont feel like your pull currency has disappeared in thin air. It adds some sort of progression to it.
The pity system is carried over dude, What is not carried over is the rate up guarantee 120
Let me explain a little bit.
There are 2 pity systems here, soft pity and hard pity, Soft pity is at 65 pulls while hard pity is at 80 pulls, in hard pity you will definitely get a character guarantee *6, and If you lose after 80 pulls, then the guarantee will be active as (80/120), While the pity will be (0/80), If you continue the pulls, then all the systems will increase the numbers like (90/120) Followed (10/80), If there is a reset scenario, then the ones affected by the reset are (90/120) while (10/80) will still be carried over to the next banner. Note, this applies if the banner is not a limited character banner
based 👏IN "ALL" WE TRUST" Most of spanish-speakers creators (most of them hoyo centered) and hoyoplayers can´t understand it, but deep down it's because they're used to the disgusting hoyo system that makes you go for 50% nerfed characters in need for dupes and artifacts. Another thing I've seen in these parts is that they complain that there's no farming for items with rng stats lol! Endfield gives them a factory and they want to go back to manual labor in the rng quarry.
lol I loved the Endfield Gacha system, it shows how many people doesn't know how to read or do maths
I feel like we need considering how easy and how stable you can get Gacha currency in the game on daily/Weekly, but since Endfield still in Beta we won't know the rate we getting the gacha curency yet.
I mean, if there is even a pity system at all, it's already a non issue. I'm sure there are some ppl here who played gachas without any pity systems. Raise yall hands up.
Nice cook man
I've done some Monte Carlo simulations of the system, on average you'll get about 12.3k wep banner certs per rate up you get which is just slightly over 4 10x, just enough to get 1 guaranteed 6* wep. You'll probably get 1 rate up wep for every 2 rate ups.. for basically free.
Good Heavens, just look at the time!
.time
I came from "I'm sick of enfield glazing"
@@sehrish1837
We all knew Hypergryph hates money they could easily print more money by giving us those unreleased great costumes but they chose not to 😭😭
I'm just happy that we can get currencies from the character gacha, makes decision making less of a burden.
This is perfect gacha system. It at the same time more FTP friendly and P2W costly at the same time. 120 pity is god's blessing for every FTP player, but it happens only once per banner, so whales will spend more, and from whales perspective that's good, cause limbus company was too free and failed. The only ones complaining are hoyofans, cause they cant understand basic math.
Nope, the best gacha system is from snowbreak
@Mathseq why?
@@Ubolg well, It has two banners.
50/50 banner with 80 pity (It carries over)
100% banner with 100 pity (It carries over)
how exactly has limbus failed? its still around, the player numbers are steadily increasing and so is its monthly profit
As generous as it is with only needing 120, I hope they don’t give less premium currency on release. Zzz gives less but they drop so many events for the game to balance it out.
even tourist will figure it out, the first time they fail the 50/50 twice and don't get the rate up. and get filtered.
its a new system, we'll see how generous it is in practice. personally .8% to get the rate up early is not making me happy.
They only need to further refine this system and I am all in for the game.
Gacha tourists are the worst kind: they are loud and proud of staying ignorant while believing their gacha of origin has the best system blah blah.
TH-camrs with these videos aren't much better. This guy doesn't know other systems well enough and he's talking like 180 pulls is the standard. Which is, in fact, a misinformation. After 73rd pull on the character banner, 0.6% per pull becomes increasingly higher, with about +5% more per each pull. Generally speaking, most players obtain 5-stars within 79 - 83 pulls range, with more lucky ones finishing in 74 - 78 pulls, and very unlucky players getting all the way to 84 - 86. While 87 - 88 is extremely rare and 89 seems more like a reason for a good laugh (it's comically rare), I have never EVER seen anyone showing a history of 90 pulls, let alone 90 + 90 double disaster. It's a mathematically miserable chance. But that's not what I wanted to highlight in the first place. If you analyze a history of 2000+ pulls (whale accounts), a LIMITED 5-star takes about 120 - 130 pulls on average, counting not only pity but also "early drops". And that's where things become interesting, since we don't have the data big enough from Endfield. If their supposedly increased 0.8% chance per pull actually manifests in more early drops, it will translate to 6-stars hitting your account every < 100 pulls on average, which would still make Endfield better on paper. That's what I'd love these videos to say. But instead they're blabbering about the officially written rules. What's the point, everybody can read the rules. If you make a video then take your time and get down to the very core of it.
Stop blaming people for playing different games man. Its like one of those dumbasses that played FGO and keeps telling "this system is better because you dont have to do thousands of pulls to get SSR" instead you played Arknights and you think this is better. Its the dumbest take that any person could have. You literally play different kind of games to know which is the best and generous of them all. It's literally how studying works or enhancing your skills or profession. Like when Gordon Ramsay travels the world to learn different kinds of cooking, in his way of doing, he learns what's best and what's not.
I could literally say so much more on why this take is the dumbest bullshit I have ever heard. I played many gacha games including Arknights. The only thing I can say is, why the hell would you tell a person who eats good food that its fine to eat shit just because you have been eating shit for years? You literally put yourself in FIRE for years and you blame people because they dont want to be in the fire? So dumb.
-no immediate powerful dupes
-no limited as of now
-far lower guarantee if you’re not greedy
-weapon banner that’s actually almost free.
I understand you’d be a bit piss if you are a whale trying to get dupes in this game, but F2P have it way easier in this game. People are way too used to Hoyo gacha system that they can’t even fathom to save instead of building pity.
exactly
I think this banner system is good for F2P, but shit for whales.
Lets compare this to WuWa (from a WuWa player) which has the best system that follows Genshin's as a baseline (Other ones are HSR and ZZZ).
Base 5 (6 star for AKEN) star drop rate -
0.8% WuWa vs. 0.8% AKEN
Base 4 star (5 star in AKEN) drop rate -
6% WuWa vs. 8% AKEN (it is to be noted that there is no guarantee for the desired 4 star in WuWa as there are 3 rate ups at a time)
5 star guarantee (6 star in AKEN) -
160 WuWa vs. 120 AKEN
If you lose 50/50 and don't have 120 pulls saved up -
80 WuWa vs. 120 AKEN
That means you should pull on the character banner only and only if you have 120 pulls whereas in WuWa you can pull anytime. So for smart players AKEN is better.
Weapon banner -
80 pity WuWa vs. 40 pity but has 25/75, 80 guarantee AKEN (in AKEN you will get the 40 pulls if you pull 120 times on character banner)
Base rates for weapon -
0.8*1 = 0.8% WuWa vs. 4*0.25 = 1% AKEN
"Refund currency" -
In AKEN you get refund currency only for weapon banner but the plus side is that you get a lot (30 pulls for 1 10 pull on weapon banner).
In WuWa... Its complicated. You get 70 Afterglow corals for 120 pulls (guaranteed). That is ~ 9 pulls which can be both for character or weapon. But in WuWa you can buy 5 star character dupes and also 4 star characters. Also you get 7 pulls of each type per patch as well from your refund currency.
WuWa has an advantage though, i.e you need only 3 characters per team vs. 4 for AKEN.
So, it seems AKEN is better in terms of F2P players. Well, we don't know yet. If AKEN's pulls per patch is equal to or higher than WuWa then yes. Also, how much do you need the 5 stars (6 stars in AKEN)? How many teams do you need (In WuWa you need 2 fully built ones for tower)?
Also powercreep. WuWa so far has no powercreep in terms of damage potential. Eg. When Xiangli Yao came out (free unit Btw), he powercreeped Calcharo but not in terms of damage but rather ease of use. Calcharo deals equal or even more damage than XY but is way harder to use optimally. Shorekeeper feels like she powercrept Verina, but many teams use Verina more than SK and their power difference is not that high.
For whales WuWa is way better. Also saying dupes don't do much in AKEN is not an argument as you don't need them in WuWa ZZZ and Genshin either (HSR powercreep is built different tough). For whales S0R1 is enough for any character but they go overkill cause they want to.
I think AKEN will be more F2P friendly than WuWa but we cannot know yet. I personally am very excited for this game!
I’d had no problems with these rates or rules for pulling.
I just wish It didn’t give me a headache trying to decipher it.😅
I have ran simulations comparing pulls needed to get the first rateup character, Endfield is just cheaper by at least 20 pulls. not to mention that the weapons are basically free. According to CN testers, the weapons are much more important than the character stacks. Even if you want stats amp dupes, you should go for weapons, transferrable and much bigger numbers, which is at astonishing 4% for 6 stars weapons with farmable currencies. But apparently the gacha players don't deserve this smh.
Might be good for those who doesn't care about dupes, unless Endfield 6* has broken upgrade behind the dupes.
don't mind me as I go back gamblin on getting the correct Face Cards, Highest Damage Roll for each cards used, getting enemy to kill the correct ally, and praying debuffs to land in 7 consecutive turns in FGO minturns/TA
instead of gamblin my real money on hoyo gacha system :'v
Hey yall! AK player here, and I understand the significance of dupes is not worth it or attractive. But I think there will be still whales trying to get max potential for who knows they like the character a lot or for some other purposes. So I hope to suggest an improvement to the current spark system.
The suggestion is to improve the spark after the first 120 spark to be perpectually at an arbitary number say 160, 180 or even 200. But not more than 200.
I think if they do 300 spark in non collab AK limited event with 0.8% rate is going to be really tough for the people who want to whale. This isn't 2% like AK. Even at 200 spark, it is still at worst 1120 pulls to max out the character. In AK terms of 185 ori per pack without double bonus or 55.5 pulls, that is a more than a whooping 20 packs. It is unrealistic to miss a few rate ups with that many pulls, but that is just a worst case scenario.
For expensively developed 3D games such as their closest competitor, correct me if I am wrong that it takes roughly a ball spark figure of $2000 to max out the constellation or dupes? With this proposed system of 200 perpectual sparks, that is similar in terms of money spent in Endfield.
Again I want to emphasize that spending that much in gacha games is horrible idea. But whales are also the players that support a great deal of the game not only because of personal gratification, but also to support the game's cause and to help fund them to create even better content and updates. All in all people who love the game from f2p to dolphins and whales can achieve together and make the game better. Hence I sincerely hope Hypergryph to further improve on the current system. It will be beautiful to side on both the f2p/dolphin and whales, with the current 120 spark + free rate up weapon and the perpectual spark.
And even without being a whale
There's just people who pull less characters and prefer to go for dupes for their fav ones...
The amount of videos ive swen in og Arknights of people having to do 120-300 pulls just to get the main focus character is wild. A 120 system gives people something to fall back on especially if they want two operators back to back. We still dont know what the average rewards will be so its better to have the gacha system in order now rather than later and the 120 garuntee us my only gripe despite being an Arknights player.
I was talking to someone else on another video and they had a pretty good idea for what to do with the garuntee.
Allow the 120 garuntee to carry over, however with however many pulls that are left once you get the character you lose the garuntee and anything after that is just a 50/50
So lets say you do Latvernia's banner at 119/120
Yvonne's banner comes up and you only need one pull to get her. The garuntee for the banner dissappears until whatever banner after that. So basically
Latvernia: 119/120
Yvonne: 120/120 and then everything after that is 50/50 pity
The banner after: 0/120
Wash rinse and repeat. Ilm bad at explaining but if i find the comment again l'll put it under this
Example Laevatain Banner: 119/120 Yvonne Banner: 119/120+ 1 = Guaranteed Yvonne.+ 10 pulls = 0. No building up Guarantee amount Banner after Yvonne's: 0/120
Explanation: lf players do get Laevatain, then they would not get anymore 120 Guarantee until Yvonne's Banner, and they start at 0/120 Guarantee, which is like how the Banner is right now. However if players did not get Laevatain, the Guarantee would Carry Over but they can only Guarantee Yvonne once and the Guarantee is gone, then they would start at 0/120 Guarantee starting the next banner.
SO, if you get Laevatain, you basically have 2, 120 Guarantees in the version, 1 for Laevatain's Banner and 1 for Yvonne's Banner. However, if you fail to get Laevatain, the Guarantee carries over, but you technically only have 1 Guarantee for the version, Yvonne's Banner.
This seems like a positive improvement for me. Players gain Guarantee Carry Over, in
Change 1 thing on the gacha animation:
Sync it up more with the music.
omg you're right that would be so cool
The CN community has run multiple simulations for this pity system. The result is, at 119 pulls (right before the hard pity), the chance of you getting the featured UP 6 star character is only 65.7%. For 6 star characters in general, at 73 pulls you have a cumulative probability of 94% to have hit at least one 6 star. In contrast, in Arknight, that probability is at 91% at 60 pulls.
For featured UP 6 star character in Arknight normal single UP pool, at 119 pulls the chance of you getting the featured UP 6 star character is around 86%.
You forgot to point out something important, that is even if the 120 pull guarantee only occurs once per banner, it only concerns whales. So, it's friendly for f2p and low spender who are only concerned about getting a single copy, but offers no safety net for whales who wanted to get 6 copies.
Also, dupes in Endfield doesn't offer as much power ups like Genshin, which is similiar in OG Arknights where dupes are pretty much useless except for a very few situation and operators. If nothing changed from beta, Endfield would be more generous and less predatory than most competitors in gacha ARPG. Unless you want to max out your waifus.
Combine all of those, you'll instead be wondering whether HG is trying to start a charity or a new gacha live service.
Of course, we still don't know how much the gacha currency that players can get for free per week in released version so we can't really confirm. However, the doomposting of people who is so used to Genshin gacha mechanics become less and less funny at this point.
They literally giveaway their player's money into food for less developing region's of schools in China, they are absolutely hate money dude 😂😂
And mihoyo also has done similar things.
Don't think too hard about these PR campaigns. It's still comparing a very exploitative form of separating money from the wallet, and while I'll agree that Endfield's gacha is better, it's still saying you'd prefer to poop normally rather than poop liquid.
This is coming from someone who has been through the early FGO Experience and lived to witness Andiragate.
@@ilnoyou the type of person who think charity make a person good.
@@DrmChsr0 no shit bro, I'm just making a joke building from an ongoing inside joke of Arknights community. is that me defending the company? I guess I can see why it'll look like it but no
@@applel2.043 and you're the type of person that assuming everyone is as horrible as you
easy explain
- 120 guarantee cannot carry to next banner, each banner will reset 120 guarantee to get the rate up character
- Pity system at 80 pull if you get the rate up or not it's will carry to the next banner and continue to count like normal gacha you know (if you get the rate up the 120 guarantee will gone)
- Weapon banner will take 40 pull to get 1 6* and if you lucky each 10 pull you will have 1 to 2 or more 6* weapon because the rate 4% drop (original arknights just got 2% but still get 3 6* operator)
The thing I hate about the comparison video is the fact that people often ignore the dupe system, is it worth to have dupes, approximate the difference between dupe and no dupe, I (used to) and my friends play hoyo games often have to plan ahead, to get specific dupe of one char on their debute but also reruns to get certain char to their potential but with AK, limbus and endfield, their IS planing for getting char but no pressure to get another dupe, even if the mathematical total rate is worse, It release the burden of pulling for dupe to enjoy the char as f2p or low spender
wow plus, didnt know you were into CBT...
Oh noooo
If Hoyo players had a brain, Endfield would be the end of Genshin. Doubt it will though because they're in too deep. They're not gonna stop at this point even if you held a gun to their head. That and the fact that Hypergryph still made Endfield require brain activation to play with the whole factory stuff, the main reason that people don't play Arknights.
I would also love to address the potential/constellarion system in Endfield: they are meaningful baffs, such as -10% energy cost or +10% crit rates, as well as other gimmicks. But so far i have seen nothing that gamebreaking as constellations for some Genshin characters. So you are encouraged to pull for copies, but operatots without them are not unplayable.
The 'limited' status of operator (s) is also matters.
honestly its so much better; im always way "luckier" in arknights than genshin
idk, I love this system especially weapon baner. I wonder if they will add a system for creating currency from stone in the base like in arknights
It is quite simple, banner & pity system is subject to the consistent pull income. HSR 80 pity banner with 50/50 with abundant pull income sound appealing to some VS PGR 60 pull guarantee new unit but with very strict pull income.
Looking forward to seeing how consistent the pull income in endfield would be
So far, daily pull income is very good, about 1 pull per day just from dailies
@pedrohenrique-db3xd That's the beta though. Beta currency is subject to change, since they want players to get a lot of currency right away in the beta so they can show off more characters to wider audiences, drumming up interest in the game.
Finally! People that CAN read.
I don't like it because I pull dupes and want the ease of mind. Does not mean I like genshin's system
It's honestly the only thing the system is missing, a failsafe for whales. (as a F2P player, it's crazy to say a gacha system is not good enough for whales) If they fix that it will be insane for everyone
@@pedrohenrique-db3xd
Going for dupes =/= whale
I mean, it is pretty fair. In fgo the chance for a 5 star is 0.2%, it doesnt have the carry over to the next banner, and the garantee is at 330 pulls (900 sq). If you are a f2p is basically impossible to get to that amount of sq. As an fgo player seeing hoyo and the others gacha system doesnt scare me.