I was a huge client user and I've been banned 37 times due to it, but since I have matured since then when I look back at what did. I feel ashamed of most things I did such as ripping avatars. I know there's not much of excuse if I only ripped public avi's and such but seeing most children use clients just to be annyoing gets my blood boiling
They banned client mods because people were using them for stuff like this, but people are still doing this stuff and people who used mods for accessibility got screwed
Hmmm. So Kanna is able to essentially “move” some vertex data from the mesh data to the shader by encrypting/randomizing the mesh and storing the key in the shader. Then doing some other stuff probably to make it harder to reverse engineer. And because shader decompiling is a very niche problem, it raises the skill required to rip significantly. Okay, that’s really interesting. I wonder if VRChat could integrate that themselves, but at the same time I worry that it would be defeated easily if *everyone* had the exact same approach. Maybe they can do something similar with some driver shenanigans to make it harder.
Dawg eac was added to keep the investors happy. Not to get rid of client modding. Adding an anti cheat doesn’t stop anything. If I wanna mod the game i can. Just requires a bit more work now.
I'd say banning mods was really successful since 90 percent of client users are gone, it's a lot more rare now to be seeing people using clients flying around
See this is why when it comes to model ripping, I only rip models from games where the artist has already been paid for their work anyways from a product I purchased myself, hence why I see no issue ripping models from say PS2, Gamecube and even more modern PC games and etc, but ripping models from an indie creator who personally made their avatar or when the models are specifically supposed to be private, it really hurts especially to see talented creators who sell their models have them stolen, ripping isn't a solely bad practice, but a lotta people abuse that power and use it with more sinister intentions
The philosophy of ripping intrigues me, honestly... there's times where I've wanted to yoink someone's avatar for working purposes because they pulled off an effect I didn't understand or I wanted to spend time studying prop/texture tech, but that's something I could just as well ask nicely about or go sniffing for online. People who steal the work and owned property of others for what I can only see from the outside as a sadistic pleasure in getting on people's nerves and/or ungainfully having access to higher-quality avatars than what's typically public access... it reeks of a childish mindset. Of someone who never realized the emotional hurt of having someone sneak their weekly allowance out of their pocket or letting an acquaintance borrow a game only for it to come back with your years-long save file gone. Sure, it sounds petty to be upset by such violations on a surface level, but one could have just as easily been afforded the respect and dignity of being a fellow human being-the simple act of holding up a civilized society. It's the intent and motive to go against that natural conduct to benefit selfishly that deplores the people that do this kind of thing. Pickpockets, shoplifts, conmen... rippers.
Ik it's bad But like Just bc i love it and use it all the time i don't like getting harassed that its ripped idrc its sad But it's not my problem just bc i use it doesn't mean I support it nor am one
You can't stop ripping. VRChat is right to not even try. Ultimately, the client has to be able to display the avatar. So no matter how you try to encrypt or convolute the avatar data, the method for correctly decoding it is right there in the client to be reverse engineered. You mention an anti-ripping tool that you imagine would stop ripping if VRChat just incorporated it. But if they did, hackers would just make a better tool to defeat it within days. The only reason such a tool will work at all right now is because it's not been popular enough to be worth the effort to defeat. But if VRChat incorporated it, it suddenly would be. What you're talking about is a form of DRM. And just look at the decades of history of how well DRM hasn't been able to stop or even slow down piracy. All efforts to implement DRM have ever done is hindered legitimate users, and that's the same way it would work with efforts to block rippers. So as much as I hate rippers, too, I'm glad that VRChat refuses to go down that path.
I am a coding technician for a game company and i play vr chat a lot. In my free time mainly. Ive only discovered about ripping about a year ago and now that im looking into how people rip avis, its very concerning. Truth is the way people rip is simply either hacking your acc, finding an avatars pipeline id, using 3rd party software that bypasses the default coding of an avatar projection or they will just buy an avatar from payhip or whatever and then upload the files to ripperstore or vrmodels.
would this antirip prevent the ripper from getting ahold of your textures? because if they already have the model and just liked your textures, all they would have to do is rip the avatar and just apply the textures onto the working model.
@@KannaKamui Thank you, after i posted the comment i ended up seeing that it has been answered by someone elses comment. just got lazy on deleting mine. but again, thank you!
Its nice, but using it makes updating avatars take 10 times the time and effort, it also completely breaks some Osc protols, such as haptic vests etc. Also, it doesnt support any android buildable shaders
Honestly been working on my personal avi for a week or 2 now and I'm afraid of someone ripping my avi so I was going to put my username on the forearm like a tattoo lol I'm trying out Kanna Protecc rn!!!
The problem is that "3D artists" like you want 60$ for an avatar that is outdated and doesn't even work, and you'll have to spend 8h to try to fix something just to make it halfway usable. So I understand all people who rip avatars. Sell a quality product, get quality pay. Sell shitty product, get ripped.
What kind of excuse to rip is that. Learn about what you're buying and make an informed decision whether or not your money is worth spending. It's so easy to check if a model is updated frequently, if not you can even just contact the seller.
I haven't been to vrchat in a while. So ppl are "ripping" off of creators of a model the original creator created and it's been a big problem. But you can prevent someone from stealing your model and doing whatever to it, but it can be prevented by using this person named "kanna protecc " who has a code that the original creator of a model can use for their work so whenever someone else tries to steal the model it will turn out to be messed up. Did i get that right? If so then i would need this when I try to make my own model
truth is you cant stop ripping... if game developers could stop piracy if it was even possible i bet they would... you just gonna live and except ripping has been apart of life since the first console game and be happy not a lot of people do it. another problem is people who dont read terms of service and still trade and give away made models and stuff. so even if ripping did go away all it takes is a "hey you bought that model ill buy it off you for the files for a lesser price" tupper is right it cant be solved fully people would just make a new ripper and your right most rippers are smooth brains but all it takes is to ask a non smooth brain ripper to "take out kanna" and most do before posting your content online they have there own little market places (just like most game devs have anti piracy tactics but people still by pass them and post them on there piracy sites)
Sadly this will never not be possible Its vrchat wer talking about....and they sadly dont want to do much about this.,.. Even if the store is "down" this dosnt mean that ppl are out there still doing it. Dont get me wrong i know its a bad thing to do, but sadly you cant stop it.
Ripping isn’t just a VRChat thing. People rip shit from Overwatch, csgo, and many many other games. There are programs like NinjaRipper that will rip and export whatever is rendered on your screen at the time of the rip. It’s how I got the 3D model for the firecat from Wizard 101 a while back. I used ninja ripper
@@BabyT1 stealing hours of work for profit? you know some people dont want to share avatars, so yes, you are horrible, you are not respecting other people and commiting what is basically digital identity theft.
@@sleep_deprived_stormworker did i say i was ripping? i dont do that also its just a avatar, it gets ripped so what, u act like ur gonna die the minute it gets ripped and turned into a VRCA
@@updatedotexe The VRChat API used by the website and game client. Anyone can literally just download avatars from the game's backend with no authentication.
@@dandykong321incorrect. There is authentication required. Just not as strict as you’d like it to be. The server’s api does log when a user downloads the avatar file and they can tell if it was downloaded by the game itself or externally. Just don’t be stupid with the downloading and you’re fine. Also most people are getting the avatar download link from logged avatar data. VRChat never deletes anything uploaded. So the asset urls don’t expire even if it’s “removed” from the game. Each version uploaded gets a new asset url and the old one sits to rot forever. Never deleted.
Im just confused how "ripping" is a problem like okay u use the same Avatar as me and? Maybe Im to used to modding and how open that community is and how aggressive it is against paid mods.
Models =/= mods A mod is when you modify an existing property, therefore most people distribute it freely because they understand the assets are not theirs. When you create a model, it is fully yours. You spent time and your own creativity modeling your character. It is not a "mod" for VRChat. I fully understand people not wanting to distribute their art for free (folks gotta eat.)
Coming across this video now and kanna's arrogance and ego is above and beyond. They would literally beg/insult people to show them faults. Not sure why this is a good alternative, They took over somebody else's work and added onto it and renamed it. As glorified as this is, Your avatar will be ripped if somebody has the knowledge and skill to do so. This is not neccesarily a deterrent, more like a proxy against easy swaps and rips. But anyone can find somebody skilled enough to gpu load or rip hotloaded avi's. Most of these people are nobodies, and nobody wants your avatar as much as you think you do. Just putting a deterrent will make people want to take it even more funnily enough. Either way this is vrchat's problem and they are at fault, Not the rippers. It's obvious they can't make a somewhat comprehendable system to negate ripping cause of investors.
Multiple pieces of misinformation here. I did not take over someone elses work. I'm openly visibly a co-dev of the original repo. I was blatant to you as you gave misinformation on the secure-ness of my work. If one is skilled enough to undo this, they must be megamind. There's so many little gotcha's in place along with mesh encryption with 32+ keys and randomized shadercode that easily would take over 180 years to even get slight progress in working around. GPU memdumping does not bypass this. It is POST-Buffer, memdumping also only gives a static mesh, not one with bones or weights. Why do malicious people always resort to slander? I'm not fully implying you're one of them, but I see it is common, and this is a repeating time I've seen you try to use misinformation against my free work.
@@KannaKamui werent you called Plague before? Your repo at least indicates so. I remember that name from VRC Anti Crash mod and Realfeel or however it was called.
Half year pass and avatar ripping still easy, anyway most avatars is unoptimized piece of crap what need tens hours for fixing all wrong weights, topology, bone constraints, bad anatomy, texture problems and etc... so rip is better way.
LMAO its a game, womp womp. If i see you bragging about your "custom avatar" (aka just putting a hat on a base model) im gonna rip it and make it public🤷♂️ It's a 3d model, not your identity.
@@l0caljohnny It brings me a lot of joy seeing grown ass adults cry over a 17 year old taking their "custom" avi with insane proportions. Don't get how you think I'm trying to ruin their fun, not crashing them or anything.
RARE Team Party People PFP L. It is a job for the people who make avatars, so it goes under the act of theft to take from a creator without consent or proper payment. Same way art works.
![Newest Anti-Ripper VRChat Tool! [Kanna Protecc]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/vEXrRBen3NI/mqdefault.jpg)
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I was a huge client user and I've been banned 37 times due to it, but since I have matured since then when I look back at what did. I feel ashamed of most things I did such as ripping avatars. I know there's not much of excuse if I only ripped public avi's and such but seeing most children use clients just to be annyoing gets my blood boiling
I like how the name, pfp matches the tone of admitting past faults and maturing. Good on you.
dw same here bro Hope all is well
W bro for changing
They banned client mods because people were using them for stuff like this, but people are still doing this stuff and people who used mods for accessibility got screwed
Hmmm. So Kanna is able to essentially “move” some vertex data from the mesh data to the shader by encrypting/randomizing the mesh and storing the key in the shader. Then doing some other stuff probably to make it harder to reverse engineer.
And because shader decompiling is a very niche problem, it raises the skill required to rip significantly.
Okay, that’s really interesting. I wonder if VRChat could integrate that themselves, but at the same time I worry that it would be defeated easily if *everyone* had the exact same approach.
Maybe they can do something similar with some driver shenanigans to make it harder.
Dawg eac was added to keep the investors happy. Not to get rid of client modding. Adding an anti cheat doesn’t stop anything. If I wanna mod the game i can. Just requires a bit more work now.
@@wtfblazelol investors happy???
@@yeetman4953 the game has investors. People who invested a bunch of money into the game's company so they can turn a profit.
I'd say banning mods was really successful since 90 percent of client users are gone, it's a lot more rare now to be seeing people using clients flying around
Immediately recognized the Furality Sylvia world and remembered how many avatars got ripped from it. Good thing I didn't use my main for it
i cant believe this isnt a joke
See this is why when it comes to model ripping, I only rip models from games where the artist has already been paid for their work anyways from a product I purchased myself, hence why I see no issue ripping models from say PS2, Gamecube and even more modern PC games and etc, but ripping models from an indie creator who personally made their avatar or when the models are specifically supposed to be private, it really hurts especially to see talented creators who sell their models have them stolen, ripping isn't a solely bad practice, but a lotta people abuse that power and use it with more sinister intentions
Welcome to VRC
The philosophy of ripping intrigues me, honestly... there's times where I've wanted to yoink someone's avatar for working purposes because they pulled off an effect I didn't understand or I wanted to spend time studying prop/texture tech, but that's something I could just as well ask nicely about or go sniffing for online.
People who steal the work and owned property of others for what I can only see from the outside as a sadistic pleasure in getting on people's nerves and/or ungainfully having access to higher-quality avatars than what's typically public access... it reeks of a childish mindset. Of someone who never realized the emotional hurt of having someone sneak their weekly allowance out of their pocket or letting an acquaintance borrow a game only for it to come back with your years-long save file gone.
Sure, it sounds petty to be upset by such violations on a surface level, but one could have just as easily been afforded the respect and dignity of being a fellow human being-the simple act of holding up a civilized society. It's the intent and motive to go against that natural conduct to benefit selfishly that deplores the people that do this kind of thing. Pickpockets, shoplifts, conmen... rippers.
it also make it so only ppl who fully show your avatar can see it wich would be annoying af to explain 24/7
Its just a model bro, it's ok just let it happen.
um how about no....
@@dreameva1400 What the sigma!?!!?
Lmao upset about pixels
Ik it's bad But like Just bc i love it and use it all the time i don't like getting harassed that its ripped idrc its sad But it's not my problem just bc i use it doesn't mean I support it nor am one
You can't stop ripping. VRChat is right to not even try. Ultimately, the client has to be able to display the avatar. So no matter how you try to encrypt or convolute the avatar data, the method for correctly decoding it is right there in the client to be reverse engineered.
You mention an anti-ripping tool that you imagine would stop ripping if VRChat just incorporated it. But if they did, hackers would just make a better tool to defeat it within days. The only reason such a tool will work at all right now is because it's not been popular enough to be worth the effort to defeat. But if VRChat incorporated it, it suddenly would be.
What you're talking about is a form of DRM. And just look at the decades of history of how well DRM hasn't been able to stop or even slow down piracy. All efforts to implement DRM have ever done is hindered legitimate users, and that's the same way it would work with efforts to block rippers. So as much as I hate rippers, too, I'm glad that VRChat refuses to go down that path.
assets and textures can still be taken separately with out the effects of the script messing up the meshes. sorry
Someone didn't read the FAQ. Texture encryption is linked and works.
Me after getting mad that my 65 hour redrocket furry gets ripped:
I Love ripping!!! :)
I am a coding technician for a game company and i play vr chat a lot. In my free time mainly. Ive only discovered about ripping about a year ago and now that im looking into how people rip avis, its very concerning. Truth is the way people rip is simply either hacking your acc, finding an avatars pipeline id, using 3rd party software that bypasses the default coding of an avatar projection or they will just buy an avatar from payhip or whatever and then upload the files to ripperstore or vrmodels.
would this antirip prevent the ripper from getting ahold of your textures? because if they already have the model and just liked your textures, all they would have to do is rip the avatar and just apply the textures onto the working model.
Read the Kanna Protecc FAQ. A texture encryption exists.
@@KannaKamui Thank you, after i posted the comment i ended up seeing that it has been answered by someone elses comment. just got lazy on deleting mine. but again, thank you!
ah nice, not like Very poor avatars wasn't even running poorly even without Kanna protecc, but it's just gonna add another layer to it
Lots of people whining on VRChat Discord right now about being permabanned for ripping.
Using this client will get you banned too
Im so happy i dont need to pay for people garbage lol, everyone keep ripping so we can scam these terrible scammers!
Its nice, but using it makes updating avatars take 10 times the time and effort, it also completely breaks some Osc protols, such as haptic vests etc.
Also, it doesnt support any android buildable shaders
You should check out Ripper by JohnieCanine. It's a rap track and sums up the the frustrations of Rippers
Honestly been working on my personal avi for a week or 2 now and I'm afraid of someone ripping my avi so I was going to put my username on the forearm like a tattoo lol
I'm trying out Kanna Protecc rn!!!
The problem is that "3D artists" like you want 60$ for an avatar that is outdated and doesn't even work, and you'll have to spend 8h to try to fix something just to make it halfway usable. So I understand all people who rip avatars.
Sell a quality product, get quality pay. Sell shitty product, get ripped.
What kind of excuse to rip is that. Learn about what you're buying and make an informed decision whether or not your money is worth spending. It's so easy to check if a model is updated frequently, if not you can even just contact the seller.
I used mods before eac but it was only quality of life mods
My secret is to have the most generic ych sona so no one wants to rip my avatar
I haven't been to vrchat in a while. So ppl are "ripping" off of creators of a model the original creator created and it's been a big problem. But you can prevent someone from stealing your model and doing whatever to it, but it can be prevented by using this person named "kanna protecc " who has a code that the original creator of a model can use for their work so whenever someone else tries to steal the model it will turn out to be messed up. Did i get that right? If so then i would need this when I try to make my own model
lets use kannattack, its like this but when ripped it tanks the tippers pc and life
Rippers are good lol I'm such a jackass
truth is you cant stop ripping... if game developers could stop piracy if it was even possible i bet they would... you just gonna live and except ripping has been apart of life since the first console game and be happy not a lot of people do it.
another problem is people who dont read terms of service and still trade and give away made models and stuff. so even if ripping did go away all it takes is a "hey you bought that model ill buy it off you for the files for a lesser price"
tupper is right it cant be solved fully people would just make a new ripper
and your right most rippers are smooth brains but all it takes is to ask a non smooth brain ripper to "take out kanna" and most do before posting your content online they have there own little market places (just like most game devs have anti piracy tactics but people still by pass them and post them on there piracy sites)
aaaannd it just got bypassed just by going into vrchats cache folder, no programs needed and you get the full FBX model...
you're next
Edgy
Sadly this will never not be possible
Its vrchat wer talking about....and they sadly dont want to do much about this.,..
Even if the store is "down" this dosnt mean that ppl are out there still doing it.
Dont get me wrong i know its a bad thing to do, but sadly you cant stop it.
they cant do much about it since its all being ran through unity
Ripping isn’t just a VRChat thing. People rip shit from Overwatch, csgo, and many many other games. There are programs like NinjaRipper that will rip and export whatever is rendered on your screen at the time of the rip. It’s how I got the 3D model for the firecat from Wizard 101 a while back. I used ninja ripper
im too smooth brained to rip avis anyways, i cant get the shit to work
These are horrible, horrible people...
nh we innocent ong
@@BabyT1 stealing hours of work for profit? you know some people dont want to share avatars, so yes, you are horrible, you are not respecting other people and commiting what is basically digital identity theft.
@@sleep_deprived_stormworker did i say i was ripping? i dont do that also its just a avatar, it gets ripped so what, u act like ur gonna die the minute it gets ripped and turned into a VRCA
@@sleep_deprived_stormworkerlmao a 3d model isn't an identity
@@sleep_deprived_stormworkerwomp womp
💀
Why do they only need your username? How does that make sense??
They use the API to find your avatar on the game's cloud storage, and then they download it.
@@dandykong321 what API?
@@updatedotexe The VRChat API used by the website and game client. Anyone can literally just download avatars from the game's backend with no authentication.
@@dandykong321 oh ok
@@dandykong321incorrect. There is authentication required. Just not as strict as you’d like it to be. The server’s api does log when a user downloads the avatar file and they can tell if it was downloaded by the game itself or externally. Just don’t be stupid with the downloading and you’re fine.
Also most people are getting the avatar download link from logged avatar data.
VRChat never deletes anything uploaded. So the asset urls don’t expire even if it’s “removed” from the game. Each version uploaded gets a new asset url and the old one sits to rot forever. Never deleted.
Im just confused how "ripping" is a problem like okay u use the same Avatar as me and?
Maybe Im to used to modding and how open that community is and how aggressive it is against paid mods.
Models =/= mods
A mod is when you modify an existing property, therefore most people distribute it freely because they understand the assets are not theirs.
When you create a model, it is fully yours. You spent time and your own creativity modeling your character. It is not a "mod" for VRChat. I fully understand people not wanting to distribute their art for free (folks gotta eat.)
Coming across this video now and kanna's arrogance and ego is above and beyond. They would literally beg/insult people to show them faults. Not sure why this is a good alternative, They took over somebody else's work and added onto it and renamed it. As glorified as this is, Your avatar will be ripped if somebody has the knowledge and skill to do so. This is not neccesarily a deterrent, more like a proxy against easy swaps and rips. But anyone can find somebody skilled enough to gpu load or rip hotloaded avi's. Most of these people are nobodies, and nobody wants your avatar as much as you think you do. Just putting a deterrent will make people want to take it even more funnily enough. Either way this is vrchat's problem and they are at fault, Not the rippers. It's obvious they can't make a somewhat comprehendable system to negate ripping cause of investors.
Multiple pieces of misinformation here.
I did not take over someone elses work. I'm openly visibly a co-dev of the original repo.
I was blatant to you as you gave misinformation on the secure-ness of my work. If one is skilled enough to undo this, they must be megamind. There's so many little gotcha's in place along with mesh encryption with 32+ keys and randomized shadercode that easily would take over 180 years to even get slight progress in working around.
GPU memdumping does not bypass this. It is POST-Buffer, memdumping also only gives a static mesh, not one with bones or weights.
Why do malicious people always resort to slander? I'm not fully implying you're one of them, but I see it is common, and this is a repeating time I've seen you try to use misinformation against my free work.
@@KannaKamui werent you called Plague before? Your repo at least indicates so. I remember that name from VRC Anti Crash mod and Realfeel or however it was called.
@@OctoFloofy Nice!
good heavens someone is using my hecking rusk edit without my explicit permission its never been more over...
My work is not really intended for things like that. More things like OC's or commissions.
UGHH!1!1 Guys!! Someone is using my custom AVATAR THAT I SPENT A WHOLE DAY MAKING!11! grrrr....... guys this is unacceptable........
@@Nexx11 Ah yes, the words of someone who hasn't achieved enough in life to afford commissioning an artist for something unique. : )
@@Nexx11 Your ignorance is astounding, friend. Custom avatars can cost hundreds of pounds, and take months to make.
LMAO, I don't rlly care tho, i'm still gonna rip whatever I want :3@@WelshSwordsman
Half year pass and avatar ripping still easy, anyway most avatars is unoptimized piece of crap what need tens hours for fixing all wrong weights, topology, bone constraints, bad anatomy, texture problems and etc... so rip is better way.
LMAO its a game, womp womp. If i see you bragging about your "custom avatar" (aka just putting a hat on a base model) im gonna rip it and make it public🤷♂️ It's a 3d model, not your identity.
You liked your own comment
@FAT_ONION didn't but ok (enjoy spending 60+ bucks on some shitty base that you'll only use for a week)
@@Nexx11 Will do, kid. You’re broke
and petty, and you watch gay normie slop like Jewjitsu Cuckken
literally the "quit having fun!" meme
@@l0caljohnny It brings me a lot of joy seeing grown ass adults cry over a 17 year old taking their "custom" avi with insane proportions. Don't get how you think I'm trying to ruin their fun, not crashing them or anything.
ok how about this, dont care if people steal your stuff 😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱
RARE Team Party People PFP L. It is a job for the people who make avatars, so it goes under the act of theft to take from a creator without consent or proper payment. Same way art works.
@@MeatMoji dunno what ur talking about but i still dont care if people steal my stuff xddd
Yeah let’s not care about the work we put weeks or even months into
@@PoppyTsun Also worries me since custom edits are also ripped. And I do like me some edits. Looking for a commission now tbh.
caring for what@@PoppyTsun