Changing and Explaining Timing Curve on MSD Distributor
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 31 ม.ค. 2019
- Here I am going over how to change your timing curve on your msd distributor.
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Thanks for posting, great explanation video. 👌👍
Thank you 👍
Thank You this made everything easy, I'm currently running 33' total timing and my 302 is running great.
👍👍👍
Good video. I understood everything.
David Walle thank you that’s great to hear. I tried my best to explain and not jump around to much lol. 👍🏻
Great video my brother.
BEARDED YAKIN thanks brother!
Great post tony
Martin Schaffmeir thank you! 👍🏻
Great video thanks brother. I bet you wished you confused me. Ha ha nope done this with a race car back in the day. We didn't have the paperwork to go from. Trial and error math on paper for the engine timing. I believe you know what I'm saying about this. Bore, stroke, cam, cam lobe, duration of cam and then the math. Set the timing then mess with the weights in the distributor. The fun days. I like what you're doing and how you're doing it. Keep up the great work see you in the next video thanks again brother.
Scott Pearson TOOLS &MORE haha yes I completely understand what you mean. Back in the day working with my dad as a kid we had to do the exact same thing. No paperwork just small adjustments and a little time to get it dialed in. Thank you 👍🏻
Good video i just changed my springs to softer ones in my 1968 Riviera GS i got a 455 in it it took it out for a test drive and it burned rubber down the block way more 🐎 power thank you i owe u a case of beer .
Very nice. That's awesome. Glad it helped!!!
Great video Thanks 👍
Thank you
Good explanation on all those little parts ! But to avoid confusion I think you may have read that graph backward (i could be wrong). The heavy silver springs do not "kick-in" at 4500-4800 rpm, they are "ALL-IN" at 4500-4800 RPM (where the stop bushing halts the curve), they start kicking in at 1900-2000 RPM (the bottom of the curve). Great video though !
Ya that's my bad I should have explained that a little better. Thank you!
love the video man , i have a 73 Charger 400 low compression , i have an msd ready to run distributor with its coil and wiring , the problem is my car is lazy on low rpms (it's a 4 speed ) but i push the gas pedal and open the 4 bbl it moves pretty good , i have a street demon carb 625 cfm ( also had many problems with rich mixture especially on low rpms you have to kick the 4bbl to make it go ) engine is stock and didn't know much about these springs and am not very familiar with timing and stuff , anyways what do you think my car needs for the perfect spring and bushing setup needs to be happy ( car is used for cruising but many uphills where i live ), plus my spark plugs are always black! thanks in advance
Great video..nicely done.. ıf initial advance is 26 or locked to 34 degrees, at stop lights doesn't the car wants to move forward on breaks which causes the breakes to overheating. did you have any problem like that?how did Setting the initial to 34 effect your driving response..
Hey tony I need some help before I get on a dyno this is what the tuner said “I would suggest that you setup your distributor for the total timing you would like to run on the engine.
Depending on your distributor, you should be able to adjust ir with the bushings and or springs for for timing curve” I have a msd pro billet like yours my cam rpm range is 2500-6500 what spring would I use ?
I have a 69' ford falcon with a 351w, hei electronic ign. It's a little sluggish at first but after it opens up it's great. Think if I tried the blue springs it would help?! Cam is comp cam 280h, gt-40 heads (for now) .030 over, 750 holley with Aluminum torker 2 intake. 3.25 gears c4 trans with shift kit. It's just a temporary engine until I get the other engine finished for it. Used the same carb on my built 302 with zero issues.
Which bushing did you end up using, the 10 or 14? How did it work for you and what springs did you end of with? Thanks...just ordered mine but wanted some feedback
We have a ford mustang with 428 fe and just installed the PN 8594 pro-billet distributor. The distributor came with the 2 silver heavy springs and silver bushing (25 degrees). The factory curve shows the blue stop bushing and advancement starting at 4000RPM's with the silver bushing around 4800RPM's. What do you recommend to drive on the street and stay cool? Thanks!
Great video my brother I've been looking for some information on MSD curves I have a old 350 rocket Edelbrock aluminum heads hydraulic roller cam RPM range 2200 to 6,000 9 in Ford rear 370 gear th400 full manual transmission I would like for my Advanced to open up as soon as possible with my cam Power Band what Springs and bushing do you suggest also I have the mechanical version distributor my timing now is at 34°
So did you get the bigger bushings from FBO? If so how did your engine like it? Any hot start problems?
Even though it's mechanical and not computerized there is a lot of technology there when you think about it.
DOYLECLEVERLOBE1 ya very true. It still blows my mind. Even though adjustments are easy the thought of someone thinking up this creation is genius
Great video, thank you for taking the time..I am confused, but that's my own mind trying to understand. I am new to valvetrane geometry and timing. A friend and myself built a .383 stroker in his shop and I have so much bottom end, I can't get enough out, its a smoke machine! Running 3.73's in the back with a 2400 stall HCI converter, 750 Holley DP. My ? is, should I keep the heavier springs or go lighter?
Thank you and it really depends on what you have built the 383 with. Like your heads, compression, whether it is balanced or unbalanced either internally or externally. But a 383 usually can run a rpm of 6500 to 9000 depending on if it's mildly built or fully race built. So if it's a standard built 383 I would base my spring choices off the 6500 rpm. Sorry if that's confusing
Hi, today I measured with a vacuum gauge and it stucked at 17Hg wich supossed to mean late timing issue. Do you thing it could occurs because a the the springs? It is a stock MSD HEI. Thanks for your thoughts.
Just picked up a proform custom curve for my mild and. Terrible compared to tbi I swapped out....whats a good distributor for a "drop-in and run" install? I'm running a crane cam 1400 to 4800 range. Thanx in advance. Great vids👍👍
Hi I have a shelby 1970 and I dont know the spec of the engine. But I found out talking to the seller that it is a 351w stroked to 408 with a holley 600cfm , roller rockers, but unknown camshaft. But looking at the firering order it is a 302 camshaft. Original distributor I now will change to MSD 8354. How will I start figure out the right timimg? Thinking no vaccum advance. idle timing at 15 degrees and total timing +21 degrees to start with. Is this a good starting point? My old distributor gave med with vaccum total timing of 50 degrees and thats not good
I have a sbf 302 stroked to 331 I installed my ready to run distributor out of box I have it on vacuum advance what springs would help sooner tnx
Have 548bbc stroker 3500 Stahl converter 11 :1 comp 373 gears in 70 nova turbo 475 hyd have all msd stuff plus rev limiter . Run 100 oct av gas. Motor balanced. Big hyd roller 720 lift 3000 to 6600 rpm. Have two lighters springs and black bushing.how much initial timing do I need .what total timing do I need at what rpm to set total timing?
so any wear in the spindle bush will reduce the efficency of the spark ?
i have the 10 degree in right now with one silver heavy and one light blue so if im reading the chart right that means my timing is all in by 2300? or is there more to it?
I just purchased a msd pro billet distributor I'm wondering which box to get I'm running a FI 460 e40d I want this thing to hop when I hit the gas any any advice btw this is a toy hauler 3/4 ton truck stage 2 transmission stock converter on 35s if it matters
I have a 421 Chevy stroker. I put in the engine and the builder capped off the vacuum advance. I have a 700 r4 trans with a 10 3000 stall converter and 373 rear gear. The total timing is set to 34 degrees. The engine was dunked at 565 horse power and 570 torque at 5700 rpms. The cam is 236/242 with 110 lobe. I started the engine and is fired up and ran great. it idles at 950 rpms in park and when I put it in drive the rpms lowers to 600. I was told it was the torque converter but the cam card said it is the correct stall for this engine not too loose or tight. I was told the initial timing was to low and I need vacumn advance. I have a msd 8363 hei distributor. how can I fix this drop in rpms in drive. I cave set all 4 fuel blocks on my 750 Holley carb. What can I do to the distributor to on have max 200 rpm drop? Thanks for your help.
I am running a Ford FE 390 that isn’t quite stock, and only slightly modified. I think I understand the concept of total timing, so I’m pretty sure I want to run the two silver springs that are light but I am confused as to whether to use the red stop bushing or a different one.
Eric, that will depend on what you set your initial timing at. If you set idle/initial at, lets say 16 Degrees BTDC, then you want to stop the total timing bushing to allow 20 degrees and 36 degrees will be total timing. That is how my BBF 460 in Mustang Gt is set up. = Mega torque and head snap off throttle response. Check this guy out. badasscars.com/index.cfm. All this is explained in one page. Good Luck sir.
Exactly. Great explanation of it. Thank you 👍
Thank you Very much!!
Your very welcome. Thanks for watching
Greetings from Germany :)
@@69runner_j nice!! Thank you for watching. Greetings from the USA
@@TonyTheTechnician Tony, I just want to ask you something about the springs. I got a 512 stroker but I'm still not sure witch springs I should use. Got a 4500 Stall converter max rpm is about 7200. More like a street tripe motor. Cam is a comp 265 @ 50. What happen if I have to mutch mechanic timing in lower rpm? I mean, it's dependent on your setup for sure. Maybe you could help me.
@@TonyTheTechnician is it possible that the engine start knocking cuz its to mutch timing in lower rpm? Or what about fuel economy and the temperature inside the motor. Is it possible that it runs to hot cuz the timing doesn't work with the cam?
Thank you for the informational video ,,I Was wondering if you can shed some light here ,,Have a 403 olds and putting 350 olds 7a heads on it ,They say I have to recurve the dizzy will be bumping up the compression with the heads So do i need to recurve it so the timing will advance at higher RPMS ?
The compression won't affect your timing with the distributor to much. It's more about where your power and rpm range operates at. If you have more power early or if it's a high revving engine
@@TonyTheTechnician I didnt get to that point yet ,In the process of doing the job
So I have a BB Chevy and the builder wants 18 degrees at 1000 rpms and 36 total at 3000 rpm, I run a 3200 stall converter , MAX RPM will be 6200. Street/ Strip car, 505ci/ 700HP in a 70 Chevelle SS. How should I setup the distributor? MSD 85551. Thank you!
If street strip car, Have all your timing in by 2300 rpm to avoid it being a sluggish turd. Please refer to this engine builder in Cali. badasscars.com/index.cfm . This man has built some of the best racing/street/strip engines in the U.S. Good Luck Vinny with that monster. You have my dream car!!!
So the bushings under the springs don't do anything it's the bushing under the weight that will add or reduce the initial advance ? .
That MSD looks like it was based off the GM points dist like my Pertronix 3 , although they have a spring set they didn't include a alternate bushing .
I have a MSD ready to run distributor 8360. If my vacuum Advance is hooked up does that give it more timing or does it change the curve or both? I never changed my Springs or bushings and my initial timing is 12 to 14
As rpm goes up while cruising the vacuum advance will cause the spark plugs to fire sooner creating better gas mileage and should run smoother.
Can you explain the firing order! On a sbc msd pro billet TY.
18436572
Thanks for the video. How do you determine the maximum advance of timing? I have a 327 with a very strong midrange cam. I currently have 10° of initial and 31 max with advance. Currently using a one heavy silver and one blue spring. Recommendations?
I should mention I don’t use vacuum advance.
It's really either driving it and feeling at what all in degree feels most responsive. Or put it on a dyno to see at what total timing performs the best. I just drove and adjusted and drove and adjusted.
Being new to this what I am confused with is: Once you have your bushings & spring choice in your MSD distributor how do you know were to lock the distributor down at?
You make sure you are TDC on cylinder 1 of the compression stroke. Both valves shut. Then drop the distributor in with it pointing to that number 1 cylinder. That will get you close enough to start it and adjust it to where you want
I heard of people removing the vacuum advance. If you don't hook up a vacuum line to it why do you need to remove it?
Hi Tony,
I have problem I don’t have ignition to the sparks plug and I use the ignition 6AL box.
Can you recommend something?
Thank you
Did you hook your coil up right, is your coil good??
How do I decide where (rpm) my mechanical advance should come in? My cam’s power range is 2500-6000
You base it on your cams power range and stall for your torque converter so you want it to come in by 2500 and go through your 6000. So you can set your springs to be all in at 2500 or up to roughly 3000 and it should be all in by that point
Are you not worried about detonation ? With so much timing at a low engine speed ?
michael penna no 24 should be just fine at lower rpms.
Can I leave out all that extra stuff and just run it? I never replaced a distributor so difficult. But I do see the science behind it. Also what happened to firing orders on the caps?
You can drop it in the way it comes but after you get it running you may want to adjust it depending on your power range. The firing order stays the same
What do you gain from eliminating the vacum advance
Normally you would most likely run it but I'll be controlling my timing through my efi.
Will you have any starting problem when its hot using 18 degrees initial ?
Haven't had had any so far and I believe I have it at 22 degrees initial
What springs and bushings are best for sniper efi
Depends on engine and performance type. Balanced or unbalanced. You will have to play around and see what works best for your needs
And when do you know to change the curve in your distributor
just a suggestion but instead of all the talk why didn't you show folks how you pull the springs then the weights so they could actually see where the bushings go then explain how the weights use centrifical force to open outward by giving the shaft a spin - - if you have lighter springs on the pins the weights have less resistance thus open easier thus bringing in the timing earlier and the bushings on the pins allow for more or less movement depending on their size. I've been running a 6 AL older style box with a billet distributor and a two step add on which allows me to put the first chip on my line-loc button so I simply plant the gas and the RPM limiter misfires the ignition to keep the launch RPM at say 4800 ( or whatever chip I have in the first step) so I can concentrate on the tree. The second step is my max RPM limiter in case of an over rev. I have it all coming in at 2200 presently and it works for my setup. However I've to step out of my comfort zone to learn "tuning by lap top" as when I change out the present motor I think I'll be going twin turbo on an LS and the systems I'm looking at will allow tuning fuel delivery, timing and boost - - great when you know what you are doing but a giant headache to an old timer like me but this old dog is still learning. In closing I guess what I'm trying to say is seeing how something is actually done as you do the work on camera might have been the way to go - - show them how the weights function and how you take the springs off the pins then pull the weights and actually slip a bushing on the pin and show them how the plate moves because a narrated video of the work being takes away the mystery as they see it with their own eyes - - you explained it well but seeing how its done gives more confidence to someone trying it for the first time and they can visually compare what they are doing with what you are doing in case they get stuck - - nice job
I am confused about what the stop bushing does
It is a stop bushing so if you have a 14 degree stop bushing then it won't let your mechanical advance go any further than 14 degrees. So let's just say you had initial timing set at 22 degrees and a 14 degree stop bushing then when your mechanical advance sets in then it won't exceed 36 degrees of timing. I hope that helps
How did you determine how much initial and total timing you wanted?
Total timing is usually about the same for any older sbc and initial timing depends on what your setup is
Great video....I understood NOTHING!
Thank you 😂👍
Jeez, 8 minutes of chatter without actually showing you physically doing anything useful. Cool!
I literally explained it all and showed exactly where the parts were and what they do. If you cant figure out how to get a spring off or a screw out without me showing you. Then don't bother attempting this process 👍👍👍