I love how N and Jin are similar yet different. They both have lived numerous lives, wear a mask, have very swift swordplay, have fought in at least one war, and broke completely after losing the one they loved and convinced themselves that the world wouldn’t change. Yet the main difference between the 2, is that Jin always believed in his actions, while N never did.
I think so much of this story is communicated through Harry McEntire's incredible voice work. When he says "the burden is mine alone to bare" his voice wavers, showing the cracks. It is such a fantastic performance
One of the best examples of the meaning being implied and not spoken...He also lets this slip when its talking to Noah in the cell. He talks about how powerless Noah is for dreaming he could fight for a better world...but the camera zooms into his eyes and you realize hes talking about himself, he regrets everything and see's Noah as his "Long Shadow" all while lying to himself. He abuses Noah and the others because he hates them the same way he hates himself and sees a mirror and wants to smash it.
"If I can't then someone else will, down the line. Who knows? Maybe it'll be you" "Isn't that the reason you Blades exist? And when I'm not there to stand by you in that effort, someone else will!" God I love this series
N says that Moebius will never change, in any way, forever transfixed, that THEY will guard the endless now, until the last He doesn't say "we", even though he IS Moebius, and when Matthew asks if that includes N himself, his "...Naturally." kinda suggests to me that he's already starting to second guess himself, if everything with grandad Ghondor didn't already Then when Matthew suggests that it could even be him [N] that stops himself, N even pauses and listens to Matthew before vanishing And I think that's probably when Noah eventually took form, or at the least, those were the seeds to let that sprout Future Redeemed really made me appreciate N a whole lot more, even though I already did like him a lot in the base game, this whole campaign showed just how badly becoming Moebius really affected him, and that even from the outset he did have some haunting regrets
9:20 what adds to this is that he let Matthew get up to him and punch him yet he didn't even retaliate when he clearly still had more than enough strength to do so.
When N said "The burden is mine alone to bear" and calling out Ghondor's name for the one last time shortly after, that just put the entire story to another level of sadness.
I know it's not necessarily important to the the summary here, but when Ghondor was telling N about how he followed all of his advice before fading away in his past life, and that how N's actions were directly contradicting the last words he ever heard from his father, that shit hit me in the feels harder than anything else in the DLC. In that moment, that old man seemed as confused and dissapointed as a child before recomposing himself.
Yeah, Ghondor's childlike innocence towards seeing his dad again instead of instantly shouting or condemning him is what broke me. He was so sad and confused why the man that shaped his character to become what he is at that moment would contradict everything he ever taught and told him. It was heartbreaking. I wish Ghondor could have seen Noah's whole journey - aka N's redemption.
YEAH! I was honestly really meh on Ghondor for most of the story - but holy SHIT, that moment recontextualized it all. He sounded like he was a little kid again…. ;-;
Just another testament to the writing in this game is the way that N tells Alvis "not this again" and you have no idea what he's talking about. Hours later it is revealed that Alvis did this same thing in the city inside of Na'el's body to try and beg for her granddad's help.
I think that Matthew also "created" the Noah that we play in XBC3. Ghondor freed A from Alpha with his Power and Matthew freed Noah from N when he hit his sword at the end of FR.
@@falafelbil455 Mio should have not been removed from the system like N was. N chose to become Moebius thus removing himself from the system. Mio never made that choice. She was forced to become Moebius after she was "reborn" by Z. But before M was reborn by Z, Mio should have still been in the system for decades being "reborn" by the system before N destroys The City. The way I see it, Z "recreated" N's Mio without it effecting the current Mio that has been reborn multiple times already by the system.
I would argue it wasn't just the power of Ouroboros, but the unification of Moebius and Ouroboro's power, which respectively represent Logos/Malos and Pnuema's power that allowed A to separate from Alpha and for N's regrets to be reborn as another version of Noah. Moebius with the power of Logos inside N's Sword of the End represents past memories, while Ouroboros with Pnuema's power embedded in Matthew's Fists of the End has the power to process those memories. It is the moments when the two powers of the Trinity Reactor come together that frees A from Alpha, shows N's memories to the party, allows his regrets to be reborn as Noah, and allow the party to use true Interlinking to defeat Alpha who contains the power of Ontos. N needed Ouroboros to become whole again, just like how he and M reunited with their counterparts in the main game. This was another retelling of Xenoblade 2, where two sides of the same coin are at war with each other and the world suffered as a result. Alpha, or Ontos as the arbitrator going berserk is just a reflection of the other two powers going out of balance. When Noah and N unite and reconcile in the main game, this is also the two powers of Moebius (Logos) and Ouroboros (Pneuma) coming together.
He’s a 100 times better villain then Z was, I almost feel like he was the true villain of xb3. N had motive and his own stakes, not to mention he was the perfect dark mirror to Noah. He was half the reason why the climax at chapter 5-6 was so great and why Z was so disappointing to me.
@@shootout-shinobi6672 i dont even think that Z is a villain really, he is a really just a concept, and i get the approach, he embodys the eternal now, the state of Aionios so to speak, and as the last challenge they have to (as Noah likes to say) tear it all down. But yeah even tho i think thats a cool idea, i agree that he was a weak villain because of this, and it makes N shine even more.
@@lilfence4728 I think they could have made Z work better if they had him being the final villain be a twist. Like instead of always showing us Z all the time throughout the game just show us the effects of his power. Then instead of making Z look like he does, make him look normal (no horns or glowy Moebius veins) and make him one of the Hero characters that can fight alongside the party. Thus Z becomes an actor in his own "play" and when they finally reach the end their long time Hero companion Z-something suddenly starts glowing and gets the Moebius iris, revealing that this was all just to entertain him and that he just played along for his amusement but that he can't allow the party to go on because he is the protector of "the endless now". Can you imagine how much of a mindfuck that would have been as a final boss? They wouldn't even have to change a lot about his personality to make this work since they could just say that he played a different role when he was being buddy buddy with the main cast the whole time. Sprinkle in some cutscenes where we see him genuinely take a liking to some of the main cast and maybe one or two scenes where he saves one of them from a life or death situation and you've got a really great final villain/obstacle while still keeping the meaning of what Z is supposed to represent intact.
They could re structure the plot and swap Z endless now to middle then N endless again or something (A new endless now but this time he,N, wish to be the one in control)
but still how even that works? thats mean there is 2 existence of Noah. and even with the new powered ouroboros stone that able to fusion people memories to understand each other, Noah gain new path that N never to be, never to try, never posible for him.
@@Kindi001 I'd imagine it has something to do with how Origin deals with Moebius and strong emotion. We already know that Z was formed solely out of humanity's fear of the unknown, so it wouldn't be that much of a stretch for Origin to create a separate entity out of N and M's emotions
@@Kindi001 I belive it's because of Pnuema and Malos cores. They pretty much allowed multiple people to be formed, like Pyre came out of Mythra. In a sense, N having the sword with Malos' core, provided the source power to create a dupe.
@@Kindi001there's a lot of spliting apart and crossroads in the xeno universe. Say have you 2 worlds that were supposed to be 1 have collided. What you have is a frozen moment where multiples events can be played out simultaneously. A multiverse where all possibilities play out on this 1 world frozen in time. As N stood before the cross road and had to make a decision it was one that was impossible to make and he inadvertently choose both, spliting himself and Mio in half. One half returned to the cycle of death and rebirth the other became Mobius.
I just want to give props to Matthew as a protagonist, because despite seemingly being a bog-standard hot headed fighter type, they guy has an incredible amount of emotional intelligence. Add onto the fact that his interactions with the entire group throughout the story has been nothing but positive, through thick and thin, he's become my favorite protag in the series.
Great vid! You really put into words the tragedy of N and his ensnarement by Z. The way that the first City seems to be in the open and exposed and had not been destroyed by Moebius before Alpha's arrival tells me that Z waited for an opportune moment to use the City as a measure to further push N beyond redemption to keep him in his grasp. It's nice how much this scene did for N and how it added a bit more to Z.
N didn't want to kill Ghondor, Ghondor walked into his sword. N didn't destroy the City, Alpha did. N never told M the truth, he bore the burden alone.
I do love this video and how it examines this scene as I kept going back to it over and over. N saying “You don’t need to know” might be my favorite line from N and Noah and that’s a high bar since Noah and N have some fantastic lines in the base game.
Absolutely brilliant video on my favourite scene from future redeemed, N is such a well-written and complex character. I love how Future Redeemed helps to humanize him.
Phenomenal video. You really made me think about Ghondor in a very interesting and unique way. It’s great to see that a character with very little screen time can add so much to the theme of the story
One line from the main game that really stuck out to me after Future Redeemed was when N says "I didn't... want to lose anymore." He's already betrayed himself, and if Alpha succeeds and destroys Aionios that decision means nothing.
N is one of my favorite villains. I might be the only one but I relate him a lot to Darth Vader another favorite. Just the way their stories are told. Good to bad then back to good. Feeling like they are to weak to stop what will happen, hunger for power, which leads to them joining and causing the destruction they feared.
You're right, there's a lot a parallels there. even with their redemption being kickstarted by a descendent (luke and matthew/noah, depending on how you wanna look at it). The older Xeno games have a lot of parallels to star wars too!
Hey this is my favourite scene too! Glad to see other people appreciate it. It's genuinely a masterpiece, the visuals, the music, everything, gave me chills the first time i watched it
Honestly the attack on the city may never have even happened if it wasn't for Alpha's plans. Z is the embodiment of eternity so I can see him not giving a damn about the city and its residents as long as they stayed out of his way.
He thought he would be able to discard everything to resurrect M,and yet forget about burning the city,he can't even kill his own son,and he let his great grandson run over him,had alpha didn't interfere with their lives,N wouldn't be going near the city,let alone come inside and destroy it,it is purely coincidental with what happened to ghondor,and later on you can see that N pissed at alpha trying to use Matthew to cover for her like how she used ghondor
This was by far my favorite scene in the expansion and I’m so glad someone stepped up and did an analysis of it (and a incredibly well done one at that)! I’d love to see more of these, you’ve earned a sub!
Well said! I appreciate the extra scenes we got of N's predicament. What bothered me the most about his character was how he was able to kill not only the city but his own son. Although I believe he would have carried it out regardless, I like that his son's death was not only an accident, but he didn't destroy the city either. This doesn't excuse his actions in the slightest, he's a psycho, but at least he didn't fall that far down to be killing his son intentionally.
One thing I noticed that how immedietely Matthew realized N's motive, as he flashbacked to the photo with M zooming in, making me wonder if N's pain and regret regarding M is actually well-known in the family. Even Ghondor seems to know this when he mentions her to N.
I imagine Ghondor telling to Matthew and Na'el stories about N in a similiar way to Obi Wan telling to Luke about who Anakin was, except that Ghondor doesn't know that he became N
Great now ill be crying for the next 8 years... good vid! I already really enjoyed N before 3, but FR really elevates him to a whole new level. Probably my fave xeno villain next to malos and jin.
Love just how much of Xenogear's themes have been represented in XB3 and Future Redeemed. :) If no one has ever played Gears or Saga, they would never know just how much of a connection there is, and lets not even get into the end credits aha. Amazing!
N is an amazing character that it's elevated a lot by Harry McEntire's performance (well, the JP seiyu is also greay), like if N was a manga character he wouldn't have the same impact as he does in the game. And this scene is an example of it
N is probably one of the best written Broken characters in fiction Just the idea of N having to essentially become a demon to both attain what he so selfishly desires, and oppose Alvis, who is enacting his own sick and twisted form of a rapture like a bastardized Messiah, is incredible to me
brilliant video and I absolutely resonate with your analysis on the N/Ghondor scene, that part broke my heart(same happened with the Noah/son scene in the base game)
@@SneakyPeddler personally a video on any of the main parties pairings in xc3 would be cool so like noah and mio, taion and eunie, lanz and sena. But If you were to make another video like this just do whichever character ur interested in.
@@SneakyPeddler thank you, love this series to death but it's hard to put my feelings and thoughts for some scenes or characters into words at times but this video did it perfectly. definitely solidified N as my favorite antagonist in the xeno series
I love how you point out that Gondor's decision is not black and white. While he could have let N take down Alpha, his want to protect the people around him comes first. This is despite the fact that it's in no way the best move. Letting N take Alpha's core means that Aionios is safe. If Gondor's goal is to protect people, stopping N seems to do the opposite. However a big theme in FR is that the mistakes of the past can be corrected in the future. Matthew says this explicitly confronting Alpha. So wither or not Gondor did the right thing in the moment is useless as it is clear that it leads to a good outcome. In fact it leads to the end of Mobius, so it all works out in the end.
seems like N didnt kill anyone except ghondor. As you said ghondors blast hits all the people of the city as well as na'el. N easily could of been "taking the burden" by saying he killed everyone as to not have blame placed on his son.
in order of appearance: 1. A Life Woven Together 2. Life's Fading Flame ~ Holding These Thoughts 3. Noah and N (Phase 2) 4. Release the Power and thank you for the kind words :)
I rewatched some scenes from FR and the Base game and I have a really important question I need someone to answer and it is about N and his motivation. In the base game N is given the choice that if he wants Mio back then he would have to kill everyone in the city. This choice filled him with so much regret that he and M split off into Noah and Mio as atonement of their regret. But in FR this has changed. Now N went to the city to stop Alpha. We already see the Origin robot guys attacking buildings and chasing people so we know they are killing guys but we never see N kill anyone. N didn’t seem to want to kill anyone but Alpha/Na’el. Him stabbing Ghondor was Ghondor’s choice. In the flashback in the base game it seems like N just walked into the city one day and killed everyone. I think N did kill some people because they power Alpha but at this point it kinda ruins N’s whole choice. He didn’t even do it for Mio anymore he did it for a way more selfless reason of stopping Alpha from destroying the world and killing everyone. Why would he feel this much regret when Alpha killed way more people? I feel like i’m missing something can someone please explain.
The way I understand it, Z's orders were to eliminated all the people in the city to deprive Alpha of his power source. I believe that in exchange for this, Z would bring Mio back for N. So the orders were the same in both base game and in FR, there was just the added reasoning of stopping alpha. I think Z took advantage of needing to do this anyway to 'test' N and his dedication to moebius. I also think N didn't plan to attack Alpha, but when he saw that he had inhabited a human body, he took advantage of the opportunity to strike at the source of the problem in addition to killing everyone in the city
@@SneakyPeddler Yeah thank you. I’m looking back and I think I’m hung up on the framing. In the base game it is framed like N went along and killed them as Z asked him to do while in the DLC it is framed as Z being like “Oh shit Alpha is back N please stop them or else we are all screwed and no more endless now”.
yeah I definitely feel you there, the reason I actually wrote this is because I was hung up on it and I needed to organize my thoughts to try and figure it out as best i could lol
@@SneakyPeddler yeah and I posted this same thing in a different place and I did find a satisfying answer. In the base game, you saw M's memory and it's her perception of what happened. In FR, N says that it’s his burden to bare about everything that happened in the city, suggesting he didn't tell M about his real reason. Every flash back in the base game was either M’s memory of what happened or her thinking about what probably happened based on what she knows.
If I remember right, they mention that Matthew and Na'el's parents died in the last battle against moebius before Alpha took over Origin. it was during a flashback scene in the old City where they mentioned "15 years ago" which comes up several times during the story
What’s your take on how long it was between when Aionios was created and when Future Redeemed happens? It had to have been at LEAST 4 or 5 generations of Noahs and Mios. Why are Shulk and Rex both the only ones alive from the OG world (as in not reborn as kids) besides the queens? (And Riku I suppose.)
No actual confirmation but I do like this explanation that I read elsewhere. "Shulk, Rex, Riku and a few others survive the partial fusion of the two worlds without being assimilated into Origin and as a result, were subject to the effects of the "endless now" just like Aionios. So they don't age. The reason Shulk and Rex became avatars along with A is because the there needs to be three of them to fulfill the proper function of the Trinity Processor. The reason Ontos went crazy and tried to enrapture all of the City people before destroying Aionios is because its just a heartless machine without Pneuma and Logos there to feed positive and negative information for forming a more empathetic opinion of the world. On top of this, there just needed to be a replacement for Alpha since with no avatar at all, the fusion of the two worlds would immediately continue and destroy them which neither the people or Moebius wanted. That's what Rex meant by "propping the world up." They just needed to hold it all together until someone defeated Z because without doing that, nobody could reset Origin to put everything back after the worlds properly interlinked."
I agree it had to have been several generations before N and M in order to establish the resistance, Ouroboros, and the first City. I don't know what exactly triggers it, but Linka has dialogue in Colony 9 where she says that while most people were assimilated into Origin, a few people made it through untouched (at least Shulk, Rex, Linka, Panacea, and Riki). its not explained how this happened, but I assume it probably has something to do with them being administrator figures in the construction of Origin. Additionally there's a theory that I agree with that time is technically frozen in place in Aionios, so since the OGs aren't part of the system, they don't age. (or at least age very, very slowly)
I hated N with every fiber of my being when he killed his own son, that's the line that should never be crossed not matter what. Killing family is wrong, killing your own child is even worse
6:24 Hold on - if the explosion caused Alpha's conscience/memories to separate from its vessel (Na'El) and become a new entity in A, then, why was Na'El corrupted by Alpha prior to the explosion? Why didn't Alpha's conscience WITHIN NaEl prior to the explosion keep the machine-like part of Alpha in check?? It wouldn't make sense for Alpha's vessel to successfully carry out its plans to create a new world if Alvis' memories/conscience were still within NaEl.
the way I see it, Ontos' 'conscience' is only active when its bonded to someone (zanza, shulk, etc). without a 'driver' to influence its decisions, the conscience or humanity lies dormant. This is why Alpha formulated its plan for Aionios, because it was acting alone. When the explosion in the city happened, the memories of Ontos' humanity/conscious/driver influence separated from the core being and became A.
It probably was- but remember Na'el was in a vulnerable position emotionally and at the time her views subconciously aligned with Alpha's goal. This is why he chose her as an avatar
Na'el wanted to abandon the soldiers of aionios (the hubris of the past) for her idea of a perfect future and Alpha took advantage of her vulnerability when he took her on as a host.
I’m confused about one thing. They keep talking about how the city was destroyed before Future Redeemed, but we see the city in the core game. Did they rebuild it?
Yes, so during the story of Future Redeemed, the City doesn't exist. 15 years before, the original incarnation of the City was destroyed by N. This is what we see in the flashbacks with Ghondor and the flashbacks in the base game where N revives Mio by destroying the city. At the end of Future Redeemed, the party founds a new version of the City, which eventually grows into the incarnation of it we see in the main game. Hope this clear it up :)
I'm having trouble understanding what you mean about N believing Ghondor agreed that the city folk needed to die. Wouldn't the opposite be true? Ghondor trying to protect Na'el would imply that he agreed with them, not N, right?
N saw two solutions to the problem, kill alpha or kill the city folk. since Ghondor wanted to protect Na'el (Alpha), and since N is thinking in absolutes here, he concludes that Ghondor must agree with killing the city folk. This isn't true though, since Ghondor wants to protect everybody but N isn't thinking straight so that's the conclusion he comes to.
@@SneakyPeddler I don't think that really tracks. N's view of reality is distorted sure, but I can't see him thinking that way. I can believe that he's warping his recollection of events to lessen his culpability in what happened, but I still don't see how it came down to a binary choice in his mind. Where does this choice even come from, and how did N reach it? His goal was to stop Alpha, I don't know why he would be overly concerned with the means of doing so. I don't see how killing Na'el/Alpha is really so different to killing the people of the city in stopping him. I don't see how Ghondor disagreeing with Alpha's plan could cause this dilemma, even in N's warped mind. Am I missing something here?
I see it as N forcing himself to believe that Ghondor wants only Na’el/Alpha so that N feels justified in his own actions. He knows what he’s doing is awful but he doesn’t have much of a choice here so he’s attempting to downplay it for himself.
Before. A thousand years later, after the events of the future redeemed Noah and them showed up. Also, Noah is N's remorse because we have seen N eyes close a bit after he killed his son
LMAO YOU'RE RIGHT It's Life's Fading Flame ~ Holding These Thoughts that begins at about 2:00. After that is Noah and N (Phase 2) and the first song in the video is A Life Woven Together
I don’t think what N told Matthew about Gondor was a total lie. Unlike Matthew, Ghondor is cool enough to realize and agree that the people of the city were Alpha’s fuel. Not that I think he would sacrifice them, but at least understand the situation. Nor do I think Matthew saw through N’s bullshit. Matthew was having an emotional argument, same as he does when A and the others tell him the people of the city are Alpha’s fuel. Matthew clearly sees people with blinders. Those he cares about are 100% good, and his enemies are 100% evil. There is no gray with him.
I like how what we see in FR completely undoes the base game. Now for all we know, no pne in the City died because of N, Ghondor died because he was trucked by a God that told everyone they would steal their future and kill all of them. In short, N does nothing wrong. And he never tells M any of this. For no reason. Nor does Mio or M ever learn the truth despite interlinking with N. The humanising of N just ruins the base game and makes what M did incredibly silly. And no, everyone calling N stupid does not make it ok.
I think it's pretty heavily implied that N killed a good amount of City people. The burning buildings have got to have at least some casualties and there's no point in justifying his actions with "in Alpha's eyes, they are a crucial source of power". Z didn't want N to commit property damage in return for bringing back M, that doesn't track whether or not he's attempting to squash the City or cut off Alpha's fuel source. You don't get that dead look in your eyes if you do arson, no matter if the buildings you burn are the culmination of your legacy, they can be replaced given the time, unlike the people of the City.
Tbh, I'm not sure N and M CAN interlink. They never do in the game if I remember correctly and if you look at the music scores used for their fights, M uses a remix of the Moebius Interlinking track for her second phase despite not being in an Interlink. My guess is that M and N's fancy Moebius powers are here to balance their impossibility to interlink, which is probably due to the fact that M isn't a "true" Moebius (aka, she didn't make that choice herself so her circumstances are wacky) and I can't imagine N interlinking with anybody tbh
@@SneakyPeddler Also, I have to say, Noah and Mio splitting off of N and M makes so much sense now, Mio is obvious as M was seeking repentance seemingly for so long, and Noah split off of N because of the events in future redeemed, and I think, when N teamed up with Matthew to unleash the true power of the ouroboros, is when Noah became destined to split from N, perhaps it did literally happen right than and there, and it simply took a long time for things to line up the way things did in the main game.
Unfortunately, the scene between N and Ghondor was mistranslated pretty badly, as good as the scene is, the English script isn't accurate to what's supposed to be said.
While I enjoyed his characterization in the DLC, I just cannot buy the unearned “redemption,” they give N in the base game. Past antagonists like Egil and Jin had both more profound convictions that went beyond selfishness and were also acknowledged as being ultimately too far in the wrong to be allowed to stick around, even if there was a recognition from the party that their motives were originally grounded in reality. The way N gets this strange double standard from the writers where he is both far more selfish and comically evil than previous villains but also is allowed a happy ending (big sacrificial kill on Z n all) just really ruins my ability to connect with him.
I really can't agree on this, at least in reference to previous villains. The sentiment that Egil "needed to go" is wild to me considering shulk literally abandons his mission to kill him and extends a hand toward him, only for egil to sacrifice himself towards the "real enemy of the game". You see rex step in front of and protect Jin to take on Amalthus similarly. How is N different from either of these? I would also disagree that his motive is necessarily weaker. It's certainly less altruistic and more selfish, but ill be god damned if the game doesn't hammer in how horrible his existence was and I (as well as the cast) think I would have done something similar in his shoes. Agree to disagree though. I think he's phenomenally done, but if game didn't sell that on you, all power to ya
@@maxxtheknife Not allowed to stick around from the perspective of the writers, I think would be more accurate to what I mean perhaps. Sure, there are moments of the party wishing things could have been different, like Shulk extending a hand to Egil in promise of things going back to how they should be as you mention, but ultimately things *werent* different, and these characters were given explicit deaths and in Egils case, even extra heart-to-heart dialogue about how he was in fact taking the wrong actions to solve an otherwise very real problem that extended beyond the scope of himself. The characters may show signs of sympathy, but the writing still does its job to frame these antagonists as unforgivable people, and gives them the tragic fate that they ultimately deserve so that the protagonists can learn from them and take the *correct* actions to solve whatever issues they need to. In the case of N, the game does its job to frame N as a selfish, controlling misogynist who cannot let go, and to be clear I think this is pretty great for most of the game. He starts off as this mysterious, seemingly collected head-of-all-consuls, and by chapter 6, he becomes fully exposed for the utterly spineless man that he is. He feels dynamic in this sense, like we get to see him pared back even further with each encounter. Its past that point that he really falls apart for me though. We don't see any sort of further evolution of his characterization in Origin. He doesn't start to become more honest about anything, he doesn't have any sort of interesting counter to the party's goals. He just doubles down on his twisted misogynistic tendencies, and drones on about eternity with Mio. His motive is sad, sure, but it wasnt something I could genuinely sympathize with. I can easily say that I *wouldn't* follow in his steps, that I *wouldn't* genocide my own kin so that I could get my girlfriend back. I think the game wants to get away with the idea that N originally did these things out of "love," for Mio, but that is simply not enough to keep my suspension of disbelief intact. That isn't an ideal that reaches beyond N's selfishness, or makes me consider anything beyond my own self. Its a dangerous idea to believe that "love," can justify the behavior that N exhibits over M and the party. Ultimately though what puts this over the edge for me personally is the framing of his defeat. The writers don't give N any sort of retribution in the same way those previously mentioned antagonists get. He doesn't get a moment where he ultimately pays for his actions, regardless of the party's words towards him. Instead he is allowed to join the party for the rest of the ride, joining with Noah and eventually getting his own dramatic sacrifice scene where he gets to be the one to deliver the final blow to Z. It feels like a total 180 to me, to have this character that gets progressively pared back as the story goes until they are an unforgivable mess, suddenly get this heroic treatment right at the end. But like you say, agree to disagree, I know I am definitely in the minority on this character. I really wish I could like them, but I just can't get myself to in my experience-- hopefully my perspective at least made some sense lol, more power to you for enjoying them!
@@Ketagcn interesting thoughts. I'll do my best to respond here. Gonna split it into a few comments because this gave me a lot more to say than I expected lol
@@legendarywolf4882 what about options beat Z or pass on with Mio and trust the others to finish the work he started. Also considering N had been fighting and killing mobius before joining them, he should have know it's was a scam.
![[LIVE] : ONE ลุมพินี 88 | คู่เอก "ป้อมเพชร vs อัสลามจอน"](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/1ZqTVVbMgbo/mqdefault.jpg)
Used to be an egilchad. However, I think I’m starting to become a ncel
I was thinking of converting to a ncel but i will remain as a Jingma Male
I love how N and Jin are similar yet different. They both have lived numerous lives, wear a mask, have very swift swordplay, have fought in at least one war, and broke completely after losing the one they loved and convinced themselves that the world wouldn’t change.
Yet the main difference between the 2, is that Jin always believed in his actions, while N never did.
I always like stories that can tackle the same concept but have different approaches as nothing ever that simple.
moreover Jin wanted only to have a moment with Lora but N wanted eternity with (M)io
Funnily enough the ending song of Torna - a Moment of Eternity
I think so much of this story is communicated through Harry McEntire's incredible voice work. When he says "the burden is mine alone to bare" his voice wavers, showing the cracks. It is such a fantastic performance
One of the best examples of the meaning being implied and not spoken...He also lets this slip when its talking to Noah in the cell. He talks about how powerless Noah is for dreaming he could fight for a better world...but the camera zooms into his eyes and you realize hes talking about himself, he regrets everything and see's Noah as his "Long Shadow" all while lying to himself. He abuses Noah and the others because he hates them the same way he hates himself and sees a mirror and wants to smash it.
harry is actually streaming the game on twitch
"If I can't then someone else will, down the line. Who knows? Maybe it'll be you"
"Isn't that the reason you Blades exist? And when I'm not there to stand by you in that effort, someone else will!"
God I love this series
The fact Ghondor is keeping the sword stuck into himself while N is trying to take it out.
Omg, I just noticed that
Metal af
Son, give your dad his sword back
It’s also just a survival technique, it is more dangerous to remove whatever stabbed you than it is to keep it in you
N says that Moebius will never change, in any way, forever transfixed, that THEY will guard the endless now, until the last
He doesn't say "we", even though he IS Moebius, and when Matthew asks if that includes N himself, his "...Naturally." kinda suggests to me that he's already starting to second guess himself, if everything with grandad Ghondor didn't already
Then when Matthew suggests that it could even be him [N] that stops himself, N even pauses and listens to Matthew before vanishing
And I think that's probably when Noah eventually took form, or at the least, those were the seeds to let that sprout
Future Redeemed really made me appreciate N a whole lot more, even though I already did like him a lot in the base game, this whole campaign showed just how badly becoming Moebius really affected him, and that even from the outset he did have some haunting regrets
love this. excellent thoughts
9:20 what adds to this is that he let Matthew get up to him and punch him yet he didn't even retaliate when he clearly still had more than enough strength to do so.
When N said "The burden is mine alone to bear" and calling out Ghondor's name for the one last time shortly after, that just put the entire story to another level of sadness.
I know it's not necessarily important to the the summary here, but when Ghondor was telling N about how he followed all of his advice before fading away in his past life, and that how N's actions were directly contradicting the last words he ever heard from his father, that shit hit me in the feels harder than anything else in the DLC. In that moment, that old man seemed as confused and dissapointed as a child before recomposing himself.
Yeah, Ghondor's childlike innocence towards seeing his dad again instead of instantly shouting or condemning him is what broke me. He was so sad and confused why the man that shaped his character to become what he is at that moment would contradict everything he ever taught and told him. It was heartbreaking. I wish Ghondor could have seen Noah's whole journey - aka N's redemption.
Same. I teared up so much when he said that
YEAH! I was honestly really meh on Ghondor for most of the story - but holy SHIT, that moment recontextualized it all. He sounded like he was a little kid again…. ;-;
Just another testament to the writing in this game is the way that N tells Alvis "not this again" and you have no idea what he's talking about. Hours later it is revealed that Alvis did this same thing in the city inside of Na'el's body to try and beg for her granddad's help.
the xeno games do stuff like this ALL the time and its so satisfying to see on a second playthrough
I think that Matthew also "created" the Noah that we play in XBC3.
Ghondor freed A from Alpha with his Power and Matthew freed Noah from N when he hit his sword at the end of FR.
But what about Mio?
@@falafelbil455 Mio might have been severed from M via the Ouroboros Gauntlets
Or maybe it has something to do with Nia, she created the Ouroboros Stones.
@@brianyang1151 nah, that's reaching
@@falafelbil455 Mio should have not been removed from the system like N was. N chose to become Moebius thus removing himself from the system. Mio never made that choice. She was forced to become Moebius after she was "reborn" by Z. But before M was reborn by Z, Mio should have still been in the system for decades being "reborn" by the system before N destroys The City.
The way I see it, Z "recreated" N's Mio without it effecting the current Mio that has been reborn multiple times already by the system.
I would argue it wasn't just the power of Ouroboros, but the unification of Moebius and Ouroboro's power, which respectively represent Logos/Malos and Pnuema's power that allowed A to separate from Alpha and for N's regrets to be reborn as another version of Noah.
Moebius with the power of Logos inside N's Sword of the End represents past memories, while Ouroboros with Pnuema's power embedded in Matthew's Fists of the End has the power to process those memories.
It is the moments when the two powers of the Trinity Reactor come together that frees A from Alpha, shows N's memories to the party, allows his regrets to be reborn as Noah, and allow the party to use true Interlinking to defeat Alpha who contains the power of Ontos.
N needed Ouroboros to become whole again, just like how he and M reunited with their counterparts in the main game. This was another retelling of Xenoblade 2, where two sides of the same coin are at war with each other and the world suffered as a result. Alpha, or Ontos as the arbitrator going berserk is just a reflection of the other two powers going out of balance.
When Noah and N unite and reconcile in the main game, this is also the two powers of Moebius (Logos) and Ouroboros (Pneuma) coming together.
Especially after FR, i really think that N is one of my favorite Villains of all time.
He’s a 100 times better villain then Z was, I almost feel like he was the true villain of xb3. N had motive and his own stakes, not to mention he was the perfect dark mirror to Noah. He was half the reason why the climax at chapter 5-6 was so great and why Z was so disappointing to me.
@@shootout-shinobi6672 i dont even think that Z is a villain really, he is a really just a concept, and i get the approach, he embodys the eternal now, the state of Aionios so to speak, and as the last challenge they have to (as Noah likes to say) tear it all down. But yeah even tho i think thats a cool idea, i agree that he was a weak villain because of this, and it makes N shine even more.
@@lilfence4728 I think they could have made Z work better if they had him being the final villain be a twist. Like instead of always showing us Z all the time throughout the game just show us the effects of his power. Then instead of making Z look like he does, make him look normal (no horns or glowy Moebius veins) and make him one of the Hero characters that can fight alongside the party.
Thus Z becomes an actor in his own "play" and when they finally reach the end their long time Hero companion Z-something suddenly starts glowing and gets the Moebius iris, revealing that this was all just to entertain him and that he just played along for his amusement but that he can't allow the party to go on because he is the protector of "the endless now". Can you imagine how much of a mindfuck that would have been as a final boss?
They wouldn't even have to change a lot about his personality to make this work since they could just say that he played a different role when he was being buddy buddy with the main cast the whole time. Sprinkle in some cutscenes where we see him genuinely take a liking to some of the main cast and maybe one or two scenes where he saves one of them from a life or death situation and you've got a really great final villain/obstacle while still keeping the meaning of what Z is supposed to represent intact.
They could re structure the plot and swap Z endless now to middle then N endless again or something (A new endless now but this time he,N, wish to be the one in control)
Yeah i dont like z most of time was doing nothing only watching us, and they show us too early and too much imo, cool concept bad execution.
So N inadvertently created Noah not unlike how Mythra created Pyra from her regrets?
but still how even that works? thats mean there is 2 existence of Noah. and even with the new powered ouroboros stone that able to fusion people memories to understand each other, Noah gain new path that N never to be, never to try, never posible for him.
@@Kindi001 I'd imagine it has something to do with how Origin deals with Moebius and strong emotion. We already know that Z was formed solely out of humanity's fear of the unknown, so it wouldn't be that much of a stretch for Origin to create a separate entity out of N and M's emotions
@@Kindi001 I belive it's because of Pnuema and Malos cores. They pretty much allowed multiple people to be formed, like Pyre came out of Mythra. In a sense, N having the sword with Malos' core, provided the source power to create a dupe.
@@Kindi001there's a lot of spliting apart and crossroads in the xeno universe. Say have you 2 worlds that were supposed to be 1 have collided. What you have is a frozen moment where multiples events can be played out simultaneously. A multiverse where all possibilities play out on this 1 world frozen in time. As N stood before the cross road and had to make a decision it was one that was impossible to make and he inadvertently choose both, spliting himself and Mio in half. One half returned to the cycle of death and rebirth the other became Mobius.
This was an amazing dissection of the scene. It made me understand things way better and brought into light stuff that flew over my head at first.
I'm so glad you're able to appreciate it more :)
I always thought that N's Career was a massive cope too. Glad to hear others see it that way too.
I just want to give props to Matthew as a protagonist, because despite seemingly being a bog-standard hot headed fighter type, they guy has an incredible amount of emotional intelligence.
Add onto the fact that his interactions with the entire group throughout the story has been nothing but positive, through thick and thin, he's become my favorite protag in the series.
Great vid! You really put into words the tragedy of N and his ensnarement by Z. The way that the first City seems to be in the open and exposed and had not been destroyed by Moebius before Alpha's arrival tells me that Z waited for an opportune moment to use the City as a measure to further push N beyond redemption to keep him in his grasp. It's nice how much this scene did for N and how it added a bit more to Z.
Basically N own Order 66 moment but worse
That scene made me tear up even more than the DLC's ending.
N didn't want to kill Ghondor, Ghondor walked into his sword.
N didn't destroy the City, Alpha did.
N never told M the truth, he bore the burden alone.
I do love this video and how it examines this scene as I kept going back to it over and over. N saying “You don’t need to know” might be my favorite line from N and Noah and that’s a high bar since Noah and N have some fantastic lines in the base game.
Omg
@@zeldasuss6322 no way it’s you, on a great video no less.
Absolutely brilliant video on my favourite scene from future redeemed, N is such a well-written and complex character. I love how Future Redeemed helps to humanize him.
thank you :)
Phenomenal video. You really made me think about Ghondor in a very interesting and unique way. It’s great to see that a character with very little screen time can add so much to the theme of the story
straight up
One line from the main game that really stuck out to me after Future Redeemed was when N says "I didn't... want to lose anymore." He's already betrayed himself, and if Alpha succeeds and destroys Aionios that decision means nothing.
N is one of my favorite villains.
I might be the only one but I relate him a lot to Darth Vader another favorite. Just the way their stories are told. Good to bad then back to good.
Feeling like they are to weak to stop what will happen, hunger for power, which leads to them joining and causing the destruction they feared.
You're right, there's a lot a parallels there. even with their redemption being kickstarted by a descendent (luke and matthew/noah, depending on how you wanna look at it). The older Xeno games have a lot of parallels to star wars too!
Hey this is my favourite scene too! Glad to see other people appreciate it. It's genuinely a masterpiece, the visuals, the music, everything, gave me chills the first time i watched it
Don't let this video make you ignore the fact that Mathew is full of beans
So much of his character is projection and I love it.
Honestly the attack on the city may never have even happened if it wasn't for Alpha's plans. Z is the embodiment of eternity so I can see him not giving a damn about the city and its residents as long as they stayed out of his way.
This is a brilliantly well constructed analysis of this scene
Thank you for making this 💛
He thought he would be able to discard everything to resurrect M,and yet forget about burning the city,he can't even kill his own son,and he let his great grandson run over him,had alpha didn't interfere with their lives,N wouldn't be going near the city,let alone come inside and destroy it,it is purely coincidental with what happened to ghondor,and later on you can see that N pissed at alpha trying to use Matthew to cover for her like how she used ghondor
This was by far my favorite scene in the expansion and I’m so glad someone stepped up and did an analysis of it (and a incredibly well done one at that)! I’d love to see more of these, you’ve earned a sub!
Well said! I appreciate the extra scenes we got of N's predicament. What bothered me the most about his character was how he was able to kill not only the city but his own son. Although I believe he would have carried it out regardless, I like that his son's death was not only an accident, but he didn't destroy the city either. This doesn't excuse his actions in the slightest, he's a psycho, but at least he didn't fall that far down to be killing his son intentionally.
Thank you very much for making this video. Now I can easily say that N is one of the best (villain/anti hero?) character in jrpg for me
One thing I noticed that how immedietely Matthew realized N's motive, as he flashbacked to the photo with M zooming in, making me wonder if N's pain and regret regarding M is actually well-known in the family. Even Ghondor seems to know this when he mentions her to N.
I imagine Ghondor telling to Matthew and Na'el stories about N in a similiar way to Obi Wan telling to Luke about who Anakin was, except that Ghondor doesn't know that he became N
Great now ill be crying for the next 8 years... good vid!
I already really enjoyed N before 3, but FR really elevates him to a whole new level. Probably my fave xeno villain next to malos and jin.
One of my favourite villains in the series honestly, future redeemed did him so well.
Beautiful video on a beautiful game and scene, well done!
Incredible analysis of this scene! Luxin would be proud.
Incredible video, man... I feel awful for N
This is soooo good also I have a question does N’s sword have logos in it?
This was an amazing dissection of N's character, and really put into words why these scenes resonated so much with me too. Great stuff man ;w;b
Love just how much of Xenogear's themes have been represented in XB3 and Future Redeemed. :) If no one has ever played Gears or Saga, they would never know just how much of a connection there is, and lets not even get into the end credits aha. Amazing!
I mean XB3 FR explicitly mentioned Dimitry Yuriev.
So glad I found this video. I remember listening to your version of Weight of Life after the 2nd trailer before we got the official version haha
Masterful video, N is my favourite antagonist in the series and this is very well worded and coherent. Great job man
N is an amazing character that it's elevated a lot by Harry McEntire's performance (well, the JP seiyu is also greay), like if N was a manga character he wouldn't have the same impact as he does in the game.
And this scene is an example of it
This dlc alone made N my favourite villain ever
N is probably one of the best written Broken characters in fiction
Just the idea of N having to essentially become a demon to both attain what he so selfishly desires, and oppose Alvis, who is enacting his own sick and twisted form of a rapture like a bastardized Messiah, is incredible to me
This is an AMAZING analysis of N, thank you for this!!
thank you I'm glad you liked it :) goated pfp btw
this DLC made Xenoblade peak even more
They really Itachi'd him with Future Redeemed. But since I wasn't a fan of him in the main game, I like it.
I believe that Harry McEntire did just as well as Adam Howden to sell the emotions of the characters
Oh this video is fantastic.. You manage to convey media analysis in a very poetic way. I hope we can see more videos like this from you in the future!
this was an incredible video
thank you :)
brilliant video and I absolutely resonate with your analysis on the N/Ghondor scene, that part broke my heart(same happened with the Noah/son scene in the base game)
Good video please make more xenoblade character analysis
What would you like to see?
@@SneakyPeddler personally a video on any of the main parties pairings in xc3 would be cool so like noah and mio, taion and eunie, lanz and sena. But If you were to make another video like this just do whichever character ur interested in.
unbelievably well made and articulated, the explanation at 5:50 along with the music had me tearing up man
thanks so much
@@SneakyPeddler thank you, love this series to death but it's hard to put my feelings and thoughts for some scenes or characters into words at times but this video did it perfectly. definitely solidified N as my favorite antagonist in the xeno series
I still find it hilarious that nobody could beat N… except himself
I just finished it tonight. I really enjoyed future redeemed. It addressed some of the elements that were lacking at the end of XC3.
Beautiful. I love this world because xenoblade is in this world!
I love how you point out that Gondor's decision is not black and white. While he could have let N take down Alpha, his want to protect the people around him comes first. This is despite the fact that it's in no way the best move. Letting N take Alpha's core means that Aionios is safe. If Gondor's goal is to protect people, stopping N seems to do the opposite. However a big theme in FR is that the mistakes of the past can be corrected in the future. Matthew says this explicitly confronting Alpha. So wither or not Gondor did the right thing in the moment is useless as it is clear that it leads to a good outcome. In fact it leads to the end of Mobius, so it all works out in the end.
I stg I’m gonna be picking apart this game for the rest of my life
its still goddamn painful to think that the people with the name Ghondor have to watch their family/friend coming back as moeibus😢
Great video keep up the good work
seems like N didnt kill anyone except ghondor. As you said ghondors blast hits all the people of the city as well as na'el. N easily could of been "taking the burden" by saying he killed everyone as to not have blame placed on his son.
I think this expansion made me appreciate the main game a lot more.
N parallels vader a lot. The scene was a lot like "you didn't kill anakin skywalker, I did"
Legit goosebumps throughout so much of this video. Amazing. Also, which OST do you use in this vid?
in order of appearance:
1. A Life Woven Together
2. Life's Fading Flame ~ Holding These Thoughts
3. Noah and N (Phase 2)
4. Release the Power
and thank you for the kind words :)
honestly N was already such a tragic villain this just kinda makes it worse.
I rewatched some scenes from FR and the Base game and I have a really important question I need someone to answer and it is about N and his motivation.
In the base game N is given the choice that if he wants Mio back then he would have to kill everyone in the city. This choice filled him with so much regret that he and M split off into Noah and Mio as atonement of their regret.
But in FR this has changed. Now N went to the city to stop Alpha. We already see the Origin robot guys attacking buildings and chasing people so we know they are killing guys but we never see N kill anyone. N didn’t seem to want to kill anyone but Alpha/Na’el. Him stabbing Ghondor was Ghondor’s choice. In the flashback in the base game it seems like N just walked into the city one day and killed everyone. I think N did kill some people because they power Alpha but at this point it kinda ruins N’s whole choice. He didn’t even do it for Mio anymore he did it for a way more selfless reason of stopping Alpha from destroying the world and killing everyone. Why would he feel this much regret when Alpha killed way more people?
I feel like i’m missing something can someone please explain.
The way I understand it, Z's orders were to eliminated all the people in the city to deprive Alpha of his power source. I believe that in exchange for this, Z would bring Mio back for N. So the orders were the same in both base game and in FR, there was just the added reasoning of stopping alpha. I think Z took advantage of needing to do this anyway to 'test' N and his dedication to moebius. I also think N didn't plan to attack Alpha, but when he saw that he had inhabited a human body, he took advantage of the opportunity to strike at the source of the problem in addition to killing everyone in the city
@@SneakyPeddler Yeah thank you. I’m looking back and I think I’m hung up on the framing. In the base game it is framed like N went along and killed them as Z asked him to do while in the DLC it is framed as Z being like “Oh shit Alpha is back N please stop them or else we are all screwed and no more endless now”.
yeah I definitely feel you there, the reason I actually wrote this is because I was hung up on it and I needed to organize my thoughts to try and figure it out as best i could lol
@@SneakyPeddler yeah and I posted this same thing in a different place and I did find a satisfying answer.
In the base game, you saw M's memory and it's her perception of what happened. In FR, N says that it’s his burden to bare about everything that happened in the city, suggesting he didn't tell M about his real reason. Every flash back in the base game was either M’s memory of what happened or her thinking about what probably happened based on what she knows.
that's true, the huge lore dump is reveal to be M communicating N's backstory to Noah. that's a good point.
I wonder, if gondor is Matthew's grandfather, who then is his father.
If I remember right, they mention that Matthew and Na'el's parents died in the last battle against moebius before Alpha took over Origin. it was during a flashback scene in the old City where they mentioned "15 years ago" which comes up several times during the story
Everyone who learns about N’s backstory calls him a dumbass, and correctly so.
Very good video
What’s your take on how long it was between when Aionios was created and when Future Redeemed happens? It had to have been at LEAST 4 or 5 generations of Noahs and Mios. Why are Shulk and Rex both the only ones alive from the OG world (as in not reborn as kids) besides the queens? (And Riku I suppose.)
No actual confirmation but I do like this explanation that I read elsewhere.
"Shulk, Rex, Riku and a few others survive the partial fusion of the two worlds without being assimilated into Origin and as a result, were subject to the effects of the "endless now" just like Aionios. So they don't age. The reason Shulk and Rex became avatars along with A is because the there needs to be three of them to fulfill the proper function of the Trinity Processor. The reason Ontos went crazy and tried to enrapture all of the City people before destroying Aionios is because its just a heartless machine without Pneuma and Logos there to feed positive and negative information for forming a more empathetic opinion of the world. On top of this, there just needed to be a replacement for Alpha since with no avatar at all, the fusion of the two worlds would immediately continue and destroy them which neither the people or Moebius wanted. That's what Rex meant by "propping the world up." They just needed to hold it all together until someone defeated Z because without doing that, nobody could reset Origin to put everything back after the worlds properly interlinked."
I agree it had to have been several generations before N and M in order to establish the resistance, Ouroboros, and the first City. I don't know what exactly triggers it, but Linka has dialogue in Colony 9 where she says that while most people were assimilated into Origin, a few people made it through untouched (at least Shulk, Rex, Linka, Panacea, and Riki). its not explained how this happened, but I assume it probably has something to do with them being administrator figures in the construction of Origin. Additionally there's a theory that I agree with that time is technically frozen in place in Aionios, so since the OGs aren't part of the system, they don't age. (or at least age very, very slowly)
Small pieces indeed.
What are your thoughts on Riku? Is he a simple, run-of-the-mill Nopon?
I think riku is a regular nopon with some very powerful connections. My dude just got in with all the right people
How did you get the cutscenes without the music? :o Wtf wizardry is that?
The sound settings in the game apply to cutscenes! So I turned music all the way off and then went into the event theater!
I hated N with every fiber of my being when he killed his own son, that's the line that should never be crossed not matter what. Killing family is wrong, killing your own child is even worse
it's harrowing to see how far desperation can push someone
@@SneakyPeddler Yeah I understand his reasoning but I still find it despicable
@@franck4727 u do know that N didn’t actually mean to kill his son right
At the same time I wonder if ghondor hesitated stopping him, and thus N kills ni’al would he have let ghondor live?
6:24 Hold on - if the explosion caused Alpha's conscience/memories to separate from its vessel (Na'El) and become a new entity in A, then, why was Na'El corrupted by Alpha prior to the explosion? Why didn't Alpha's conscience WITHIN NaEl prior to the explosion keep the machine-like part of Alpha in check?? It wouldn't make sense for Alpha's vessel to successfully carry out its plans to create a new world if Alvis' memories/conscience were still within NaEl.
the way I see it, Ontos' 'conscience' is only active when its bonded to someone (zanza, shulk, etc). without a 'driver' to influence its decisions, the conscience or humanity lies dormant. This is why Alpha formulated its plan for Aionios, because it was acting alone. When the explosion in the city happened, the memories of Ontos' humanity/conscious/driver influence separated from the core being and became A.
@@SneakyPeddler so Ontos' conscience wasn't bonded to NaEl before the explosion?
It probably was- but remember Na'el was in a vulnerable position emotionally and at the time her views subconciously aligned with Alpha's goal. This is why he chose her as an avatar
Na'el wanted to abandon the soldiers of aionios (the hubris of the past) for her idea of a perfect future and Alpha took advantage of her vulnerability when he took her on as a host.
when does the game explain that noah is a reincarnation of N's regret?
theres a handful of examples, but if I remember correctly Noah and Mio's dialogue to N and M after the final boss spells it out pretty clearly
I’m confused about one thing. They keep talking about how the city was destroyed before Future Redeemed, but we see the city in the core game. Did they rebuild it?
Yes, so during the story of Future Redeemed, the City doesn't exist. 15 years before, the original incarnation of the City was destroyed by N. This is what we see in the flashbacks with Ghondor and the flashbacks in the base game where N revives Mio by destroying the city. At the end of Future Redeemed, the party founds a new version of the City, which eventually grows into the incarnation of it we see in the main game.
Hope this clear it up :)
@@SneakyPeddler I see. Thx
@@SneakyPeddler that's probably why they made the new city moveable, too
@@SneakyPeddler wait 15 years??? is this ever said in the game or i an forgeting something"???
yeah it's mentioned in game
Best scene was T H E R A D I O
I'm having trouble understanding what you mean about N believing Ghondor agreed that the city folk needed to die. Wouldn't the opposite be true? Ghondor trying to protect Na'el would imply that he agreed with them, not N, right?
N saw two solutions to the problem, kill alpha or kill the city folk. since Ghondor wanted to protect Na'el (Alpha), and since N is thinking in absolutes here, he concludes that Ghondor must agree with killing the city folk. This isn't true though, since Ghondor wants to protect everybody but N isn't thinking straight so that's the conclusion he comes to.
@@SneakyPeddler I don't think that really tracks. N's view of reality is distorted sure, but I can't see him thinking that way. I can believe that he's warping his recollection of events to lessen his culpability in what happened, but I still don't see how it came down to a binary choice in his mind.
Where does this choice even come from, and how did N reach it? His goal was to stop Alpha, I don't know why he would be overly concerned with the means of doing so. I don't see how killing Na'el/Alpha is really so different to killing the people of the city in stopping him. I don't see how Ghondor disagreeing with Alpha's plan could cause this dilemma, even in N's warped mind. Am I missing something here?
I see it as N forcing himself to believe that Ghondor wants only Na’el/Alpha so that N feels justified in his own actions. He knows what he’s doing is awful but he doesn’t have much of a choice here so he’s attempting to downplay it for himself.
@@ElmaXC I guess that could make sense. It was still a little unclear overall.
I'm quite confused, so this XBC 3 Future Redeemed is it after the XBC 3 Story or before the XBC 3 Story?
Before. A thousand years later, after the events of the future redeemed Noah and them showed up. Also, Noah is N's remorse because we have seen N eyes close a bit after he killed his son
@@nateortega2912 I see, Thanks 👍
One thing that bug me.
Does every females kids/descendants that Ghondor have have the same blade characteristics as Mio?
What’s the name of the 2nd ost in the background
I'm going to answer this question in like 2 hours if nobody else does
@@SneakyPeddler mr peddler sir it’s been 21 hrs 😁
LMAO YOU'RE RIGHT
It's Life's Fading Flame ~ Holding These Thoughts that begins at about 2:00. After that is Noah and N (Phase 2) and the first song in the video is A Life Woven Together
@@SneakyPeddler ty
A lot of this scene was actually mistranslated from the Japanese original. Very interesting read online!
I don’t think what N told Matthew about Gondor was a total lie. Unlike Matthew, Ghondor is cool enough to realize and agree that the people of the city were Alpha’s fuel. Not that I think he would sacrifice them, but at least understand the situation.
Nor do I think Matthew saw through N’s bullshit. Matthew was having an emotional argument, same as he does when A and the others tell him the people of the city are Alpha’s fuel. Matthew clearly sees people with blinders. Those he cares about are 100% good, and his enemies are 100% evil. There is no gray with him.
I like how what we see in FR completely undoes the base game.
Now for all we know, no pne in the City died because of N, Ghondor died because he was trucked by a God that told everyone they would steal their future and kill all of them.
In short, N does nothing wrong. And he never tells M any of this. For no reason. Nor does Mio or M ever learn the truth despite interlinking with N.
The humanising of N just ruins the base game and makes what M did incredibly silly.
And no, everyone calling N stupid does not make it ok.
I think it's pretty heavily implied that N killed a good amount of City people. The burning buildings have got to have at least some casualties and there's no point in justifying his actions with "in Alpha's eyes, they are a crucial source of power". Z didn't want N to commit property damage in return for bringing back M, that doesn't track whether or not he's attempting to squash the City or cut off Alpha's fuel source. You don't get that dead look in your eyes if you do arson, no matter if the buildings you burn are the culmination of your legacy, they can be replaced given the time, unlike the people of the City.
Bruh what he did wrong was destroying city and bring mobius to invade his descendants lol his main objective was only alpha crystal core😂
he did killed majority of the ppl in city but not ghondor and na'el😢
"The burden is mine alone to bear" refutes all of your comment
Tbh, I'm not sure N and M CAN interlink. They never do in the game if I remember correctly and if you look at the music scores used for their fights, M uses a remix of the Moebius Interlinking track for her second phase despite not being in an Interlink. My guess is that M and N's fancy Moebius powers are here to balance their impossibility to interlink, which is probably due to the fact that M isn't a "true" Moebius (aka, she didn't make that choice herself so her circumstances are wacky) and I can't imagine N interlinking with anybody tbh
It´s sad that this scene was totally mistranslated and has a different meaning than the english dub implies.
I read an article about the mistranslation and I think it's interesting that both versions can lead you to a similar conclusion through different ways
Honestly I like this version more.
@@SneakyPeddler Also, I have to say, Noah and Mio splitting off of N and M makes so much sense now, Mio is obvious as M was seeking repentance seemingly for so long, and Noah split off of N because of the events in future redeemed, and I think, when N teamed up with Matthew to unleash the true power of the ouroboros, is when Noah became destined to split from N, perhaps it did literally happen right than and there, and it simply took a long time for things to line up the way things did in the main game.
Great thoughts, I think this makes a lot of sense too.
Saw some videos but i dont think the 2 translations take that different of a meaning honestly. If anything i think the english one works best.
Unfortunately, the scene between N and Ghondor was mistranslated pretty badly, as good as the scene is, the English script isn't accurate to what's supposed to be said.
No
Whats the original?
While I enjoyed his characterization in the DLC, I just cannot buy the unearned “redemption,” they give N in the base game. Past antagonists like Egil and Jin had both more profound convictions that went beyond selfishness and were also acknowledged as being ultimately too far in the wrong to be allowed to stick around, even if there was a recognition from the party that their motives were originally grounded in reality. The way N gets this strange double standard from the writers where he is both far more selfish and comically evil than previous villains but also is allowed a happy ending (big sacrificial kill on Z n all) just really ruins my ability to connect with him.
No le sabes pa
I don't know if I would call it "forgiving" exactly. It's more like them understanding him, considering he is literally Noah.
I really can't agree on this, at least in reference to previous villains. The sentiment that Egil "needed to go" is wild to me considering shulk literally abandons his mission to kill him and extends a hand toward him, only for egil to sacrifice himself towards the "real enemy of the game". You see rex step in front of and protect Jin to take on Amalthus similarly. How is N different from either of these?
I would also disagree that his motive is necessarily weaker. It's certainly less altruistic and more selfish, but ill be god damned if the game doesn't hammer in how horrible his existence was and I (as well as the cast) think I would have done something similar in his shoes.
Agree to disagree though. I think he's phenomenally done, but if game didn't sell that on you, all power to ya
@@maxxtheknife Not allowed to stick around from the perspective of the writers, I think would be more accurate to what I mean perhaps. Sure, there are moments of the party wishing things could have been different, like Shulk extending a hand to Egil in promise of things going back to how they should be as you mention, but ultimately things *werent* different, and these characters were given explicit deaths and in Egils case, even extra heart-to-heart dialogue about how he was in fact taking the wrong actions to solve an otherwise very real problem that extended beyond the scope of himself. The characters may show signs of sympathy, but the writing still does its job to frame these antagonists as unforgivable people, and gives them the tragic fate that they ultimately deserve so that the protagonists can learn from them and take the *correct* actions to solve whatever issues they need to.
In the case of N, the game does its job to frame N as a selfish, controlling misogynist who cannot let go, and to be clear I think this is pretty great for most of the game. He starts off as this mysterious, seemingly collected head-of-all-consuls, and by chapter 6, he becomes fully exposed for the utterly spineless man that he is. He feels dynamic in this sense, like we get to see him pared back even further with each encounter. Its past that point that he really falls apart for me though. We don't see any sort of further evolution of his characterization in Origin. He doesn't start to become more honest about anything, he doesn't have any sort of interesting counter to the party's goals. He just doubles down on his twisted misogynistic tendencies, and drones on about eternity with Mio. His motive is sad, sure, but it wasnt something I could genuinely sympathize with. I can easily say that I *wouldn't* follow in his steps, that I *wouldn't* genocide my own kin so that I could get my girlfriend back. I think the game wants to get away with the idea that N originally did these things out of "love," for Mio, but that is simply not enough to keep my suspension of disbelief intact. That isn't an ideal that reaches beyond N's selfishness, or makes me consider anything beyond my own self. Its a dangerous idea to believe that "love," can justify the behavior that N exhibits over M and the party. Ultimately though what puts this over the edge for me personally is the framing of his defeat. The writers don't give N any sort of retribution in the same way those previously mentioned antagonists get. He doesn't get a moment where he ultimately pays for his actions, regardless of the party's words towards him. Instead he is allowed to join the party for the rest of the ride, joining with Noah and eventually getting his own dramatic sacrifice scene where he gets to be the one to deliver the final blow to Z. It feels like a total 180 to me, to have this character that gets progressively pared back as the story goes until they are an unforgivable mess, suddenly get this heroic treatment right at the end.
But like you say, agree to disagree, I know I am definitely in the minority on this character. I really wish I could like them, but I just can't get myself to in my experience-- hopefully my perspective at least made some sense lol, more power to you for enjoying them!
@@Ketagcn interesting thoughts. I'll do my best to respond here. Gonna split it into a few comments because this gave me a lot more to say than I expected lol
I still don’t like N, he still came off as an asshole and he get easily forgiven.
@Nhat Anh Hoang does not change the choice made was wrong and where did it lead to regrets even mio wanted death because N dumb as hell etc.
Even noah said he should kept trying
You do realize that N's options were to accept Z's deal or revive, meet Mio, and die for eternity infinitely, right?
@@legendarywolf4882 what about options beat Z or pass on with Mio and trust the others to finish the work he started. Also considering N had been fighting and killing mobius before joining them, he should have know it's was a scam.
@@MrSupersmash93
>Beat Z
lol
You do realize that beat Z in the main game was a miracle and realistically is impossible to beat, right?
So um why did N still need attack city with mobius also what was M doing huh
Being born/created