ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ต.ค. 2021
- They cost the same amount. So which is the better investment for your farm? A frame-mounted backhoe attachment for your existing tractor or an old full-sized industrial backhoe? I bought both to find out, and one of them was a big mistake.
1626 Mahindra with 1626B Backhoe vs. John Deere 310a
Follow us on Facebook: / farmdadyoutube - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
Agree with every point you made, would just like to add yet one more thing about getting a compact tractor with all the different attachments instead of the full size industrial ones, i currently own a dually capable of towing a compact with a couple of attachments, possibly a bush hog to hire myself out, the full size stuff, Oopsy now i need to buy a Triaxle with a flatbed pintle equipment trailer and get a CDL ...
Really, really good point.
Can't say enough how awesome this video is. The complexity of the backhoe was something I hadn't given enough thought to.
Clearly I didn't either. My regrets are heavy with that purchase.
I wish that I had watched this a few months ago before I bought my NH 75B. No turning back now. I can't get my money back so full steam ahead on repairs and learning the repairs. Thanks for the lessons.
Hopefully you'll have better luck than me!
I appreciate the info shared here. Looking at getting into more tractor work in the future myself
Funnest work there is
Stick with those repairs Adam, they will pay off! I was in the same boat and almost bought a backhoe attachment for my JD 4052R. I'm glad I didn't. I ended up with a Case 580K that needed quite a bit of money and work. Took a while, but I got it going and it has been instrumental around our property. Glad we connected by happenstance today. That was too darn funny!
Thanks Adam! Glad we got to chat. I had my wife cracking up when I told her about our conversation 🤣. It sure was confusing at first!
@@FarmDad It definitely was! The world wanted us to connect I suppose ha
Really dug this one Dad ! Full play ads and all !
whether you're digging with a backhoe or an excavator, you're not supposed to use straight downward force to dig. You're supposed to scrape off about 2 in layers horizontally each time as you go deeper. The trench will look neater and cleaner and easier to dig that way instead of trying to dig from the bottom up for each bucket full. You will also have less dirt falling back into the trench that way.
My dad taught me a lot about running backhoes and I learned even more when I was working in the operating engineers for 30 years running all kinds of backhoes and excavators.
2 inches?
@@NoName-ml5yk that sounds about right.
A 2-inch layer 4 ft long will fill your bucket all the way up to the top!
And your trench will look a whole lot nicer and cleaner and won't look like an amateur did it!
That's the way all the better operators worked in the operating engineers.
But also the larger the machine, the larger scoops you can take.
With a great big machine you might be taking off 4-6 inch layers that are 10 ft long or more.
But always scoop horizontally not vertically.
And always leave the bottom of the trench smooth and straight.
Also keep your spoils pile at least 2 feet away from the trench for safety.
And don't trench any deeper than 4 ft unless you slope the sides at 45° or use shoring.
@@TF856 I don't see any videos of professional operators scraping off 2 inches at a time.
@@NoName-ml5yk On TH-cam videos I see a lot of people digging the way amateurs dig trenches.
I was just letting you know how the union operators are taught to dig trenches.
This way cuts a cleaner trench with less dirt falling in while you're digging so you have less dirt to dig out and there's less dirt to put back in the trench later and it saves time and when you're on the job every minute counts!
Time is money!
Just like a lot of good backhoe operators never point the backhoe straight down the path of where they're digging.
They will always point the tractor slightly off to one side and keep the front tires parallel with the ditch so when they push the tractor forward they don't have much adjusting to do. But just the fact of turning the tractor slightly sideways lets them look around the backhoe while they're digging without having to lean sideways out of the seat the whole time which cuts down on fatigue and speeds up the job!!!
Another thing is that good operators do not lift the tires of the backht off the ground when they're digging unless it's necessary!
The more points of contact you have on the ground the more stable the tractor will be for digging.
Original tractor up off the ground it becomes a lot more unstable!
The only time you should have a wheel off the ground is when you're digging across the slope and you have to level the tractor, or if you're reaching over something like trying to load a tall truck with the backhoe.
Unlike trenching with a backhoe if you're using an excavator across the slope in order to keep the trench plum you have to take your spoils and pile it in front of the downhill track to level the machine as you're digging.
There have been a few excavators that were built with a leveling feature like the old case excavators that had two-way hydraulic leveling.
You can dig any way you want to.
I just thought that some people might appreciate some friendly helpful pointers.
I did not mean to start an argument.
But most people that are self taught don't necessarily learn the most effective or efficient way of working a tractor.
But do whatever works best for you, because everybody is different.
And you're right. I don't see too many operators doing it on TH-cam but I see it done that way all the time on a lot of jobs.
I wish you great success in your business. 😃
@@TF856 Are you a full time excavator operator?
I actually really like my 1974 case 580b. It has been a really good unit for me. I paid $9,700 for it about a year ago. I have an MF35 and an MF65 as well. Currently I'm hating my mf65 because it seems like every time I get it running something else breaks so I totally get coming to despise a piece of equipment because all it seems to do is use up time and money and does no work for you. Fortunately my 580b and mf35 make me smile when I use them and they seem happy to be put to work unlike my good for nothing 65.
When you find a good one, don't let it go! And put that 65 up for sale first chance you get. It's just not worth it 😀👍
honest talk thanks mate...this is a helpful story for me..deciding what i need.
Big decision for sure.
It's nice that you have a dedicated tlb so you don't need the backhoe on the small tractor. It should be for all of your other attachments. And if you need a small digger get a mini excavator for all those tight spots where you can pile the dirt right behind you if you want to.
Personally I think a mini excavator and a small farm tractor is a good setup. And a small dump truck if needed.
You can always upgrade to larger equipment if you need to.
Couple years back I wanted to buy a loader for my 5140 , ended up buying a 580k extend a hoe for less ,, best thing I ever done
We have a 410 industrial backhoe with enclosed cab and extendahoe boy it is a beast!
I bet! Love to have an extendahoe!
I just purchased my friends Kubota B21 Backhoe and loader unit for 12,500 it has 1008 hours on it and it functions wonderfully. I was thinking of going big but the truck and trailer to haul it home becomes an problem with the massive Backhoes.
After watching this video I have to say, I don't agree with you. I may be lucky but I purchased a JD300B this summer from someone for only $3k (really cheap in my area) and the thing has been absolutely excellent. The previous owner had it running/driving/lifting and I was able to see that before I bought it. It has allowed me to transform my property quickly and can do things the $20K kubota I was initially looking at could never dream of. I had one issue starting it, I had to clean the battery terminals and it was resolved, other than that no reliability issues (the machine has 4800hrs before the hour meter stopped working). Again I may be lucky and I totally get how what happened to you could happen to someone else, I just think the key is finding a machine that someone has had recent frequent use and you can really save some money.
3k is absolute once in a lifetime, highway robbery! That's the scrap price here in Arkansas. I got to see my machine work before I bought it and it was excellent. It had also just had a lot of work done to it that should have made it a reliable machine. Unfortunately, it wasn't. I'm definitely speaking in generalities in this video and am well aware that there are exceptions. Wish I had beat you to the one you bought! 😂
yeah that be a jackpot right there. thats cheaper then a ride on mower is. 😂
Both have pros and cons.
If you have one tractor and need lots of attachments, get the farm tractor with a three-point hitch and PTO.
If you need a good serious digging machine then skip the backhoe and go for a small excavator!
Backhoes are considered outdated and being replaced by skiploaders and excavators on a large majority of job sites.
Farm tractors with three-point make a nice skip loader.
My dad had a crossover tractor back in the '60s. A Massey Ferguson 220 with three point hitch and a frame mounted side shifting backhoe that was detachable.
It was about a 40 horse industrial skip loader that had a 3-point and PTO.
There are videos of similar tractors to his on TH-cam.
And I love old Massey Ferguson's!
in the early '70s my dad traded his Massey Ferguson 220 for a 265 farm tractor and ordered it with the industrial loader, I used it mostly for commercial weed abatement, rototilling, mowing, disking.
My Dad decided to buy a John Deere 500 backhoe with extendahoe and a Drot four-way front bucket to do all the backhoe work and sold the Massey Ferguson backhoe attachment.
You're backhoe looks a lot like my dad's.
there's a lot of videos on TH-cam now that are showing people rescuing old backhoes out of fields and barns and fixing them up.
Unfortunately, even the cheapest excavators are about twice the budget as these two options.
dang! i literally dont see a video of yours where that backhoe isn't just sitting there. sorry y'all are having so much trouble with it and hopefully you can get it up and running or replaced eventually. i can see a lot of other people are having the same problems with there backhoes down here as well. 😂
[thank, you for youre video.👍 just, bought a case ck. 530 diesel Backhoe]👍
Appreciate you. Enjoy that backhoe and I hope it does you well.
I would agree for the most part. I would add the caveat of it depends on what you are using it for. I have large, deep digs I have to do, the smaller backhoe just isn’t capable enough.
True, true.
when digging with any backhoe you should turn the tractor at a slight angle so you don't have to lean sideways to look around the boom when you're digging and just keep the wheels turned parallel with the trench to push yourself forward when needed. That's the way my dad dug for 40 years with his John Deere backhoe.
I still say you don't need a backhoe, you need an excavator. That'll give you a lot more freedom to dump anywhere within reach 180° around you.
I believe I have seen small kubota's with the swivel seat I think the b20 and b35 but I not real sure.
Those are both dedicated tlb tractors.
Also never buy a three-point mounted backhoe attachment!
They may not even sell those anymore because they had the design flaw of breaking the tractor in half without the support of a subframe that was added between the front and back of the tractor.
Those three-point mounted backhoes were more adaptable to many different tractors but they were very very hard on the tractor itself and causing extensive expensive repairs.
Just bought a new farmtrac 25 hp compact and want to add a backhoe,,my qustion is a 3 pt hitch connect backhoe ok or should i try to find a frame mount,,i see several 3pt ones for about 4500
Good question I should have addressed. You definitely want a frame mount. Backhoes put a ton of stress on tractors and I've heard many horror stories from people who buy 3 pt ones.
Well, you make some good points there. Not only have I walked in your shoes, but I had even more courage than you. Not only did I buy an old 14,000 pound backhoe last year, but it wasn't even the darling of the industry. I bought a 1980 Allis Chalmers 715. But I don't think Allis Chalmers actually made anything on it. Perkins diesel, Borg Warner torque converter hydraulic shuttle shift, Borg Warner 4 speed gear box, Ford rear end, Saginaw hydraulics,,,,,,,,,,,,,and so on. Some say it's an ill conceived salad. Some say it used the best of the best. But they all said it was a brute of a machine in it's day.time
In the time it's been here I changed all the fluids twice ($$$$) to get the moisture out, two hoses that were begging to be replaced but I didn't believe them, rebuilt one hydraulic lift cylinder that was annoyingly bad when I got it but refused to get any worse, pushed the neutral safety plug wire back on the trans switch, and pumper 4 cases of grease into it. Where I ask does all that grease go? I am now convinced big backhoes run on grease.
So far it's moved and graded 900 cubic yards of genuine southern concrete facsimile clay, ripped up and regraded the gravel driveway, removed and filled in the "concrete" pool and deck. And, did you know a 715 will lift a Ford F150, the whole thing, onto a flat bed trailer, and dig out a few dozen four foot diameter trunk oak stumps without breaking a sweat?
Yes, I absolutely fretted over whether to get the new $30,000 mini tractor with warranty or take the $5000 gamble. Then it was pointed out to me that even a non working 715 would sell for more than I had in it. So, I brought it home and anticipated the big catastrophic failure while it dutifully went about it's daily chores.
Next time around might not go so good. But one things for sure, if I had that little mini tractor I would still be out there scratching around in the dirt.
Now that the works done it's time to sell it to the next guy and let him have at it. But it just don't seem right to kick it out of the house after it's been so loyal and all.
In closing I'll say if your 310 is any good and you work the bugs out you will be glad to have it over time.
And of course all the best to you and yours.
I see two things you had going for you! You stole that backhoe at 5k, so you really didn't have anything to lose, and you have had some good luck. It's all fun and games until you have something go wrong that requires splitting a 14,000 lb machine! 🥴 in my case, I'd really rather sell mine for a loss than spend the time fixing it, but no one will buy it because it's not fun loading a machine like that with only 3 wheels onto a trailer! But mine is good as sold once I get it fixed back up. Hopefully it'll be better for the next guy.
@@FarmDad I thought the $5000 was plenty for an older than dirt tractor that was probably ready to blow up.
The 715 is a drive shaft tractor. The locomotion motion units are stacked behind the engine one after the other. Engine, torque converter, velvet drive shuttle shift, 4 speed manual, drive shaft, and last, the simple ford rear. It's made like a car. No splitting to do.
I didn't have the nerve to buy a splittable tractor.
I'm surprised nobody want's to fix the 310 where it is, then drive it out of there.
If I were in your position and chose to take the hit selling the 310 fixed or even as is, I would call it good and never look back.
After taking a harder look at the situation, I too would sell the 310. The 310a is a lot more complicated than the 715. And you have convinced me to sell the 715 while I'm ahead of the game. Money in the bank is ok.
If I had it to do over I would get one of those old 8,000 pound Case 530's. There's a plentiful supply of them around here for about $3,000. A true disposable unit.
I do have a cute little red ten year old 2500 pound 25 horse diesel tractor. I cut 3 aches with it, and a few other little things around here off the 3pt. I don't know how much heavy work it can take, but with a 72 inch finish cutting deck running at a modest ground speed it's a lot better than bouncing around on a tiny zero turn. And cost me a lot less used with deck ($2500) than a good late model zero.
I chose the both
I'm a fan of your video's I have 3 tractors and 2 backhoes and a bobcat and a roller and a forklift.❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤🎉
Awesome buddy! Sounds like an adult playground!
My personal choice for industrial ( Utility) Kubota B26 TLB in my opinion best in class for its size. Next Kubota BX25 for residential small stuff. I find it important to have the structure to stabilize the usage of the back hoe.
I've used an l47 and it was a nice machine. My only complaint was the hst pedal configuration felt a bit wonky.
Great vid. your not boring. Haa answerd some good questions for me right now, Looking at a Tym 264 with backhoe seems to be a clone of your mahindra I guess.
YOu think its a good buy? hows parts available/dealer experience been like for ya? Thanks Bro farm on
Hey thanks! Although TYM makes a lot of Mahindra tractors, my model isn't one of them. So I can't really offer a knowledgeable opinion on the one you are looking at. I appreciate you.
Thanks for the comparison!! And that's a nice haircut by the way.
Also what's the differences between a industrial front loader bucket and. A front loader bucket attachment for farm tractors??
Thanks for the compliment! The loader on an industrial backhoe is going to be built stronger and will take far more abuse, plus it's usually larger, allowing you to move more dirt in less time. The advantage ethe quick attach loader on a farm tractor is you can easily remove the bucket to change to other attachments, like a hay fork or pallet forks.
Thanks for the info!
And I are definitely digging the great comparison you've done!
Just some fresh construction humor.
you are
Oops! Misspelled again.
@@FarmDad I don't know if it's a difference of US machines vs European machines, but over here you will struggle to find an industrial backhoe without a quick connect on the front loader. I'm not talking about the brand new, fancy $300k machines with a hydraulic quick connect where you don't even get your shoes wet. But even my 1985 industrial backhoe/loader (how do you even call them correctly?) has two bolts to pull, and the bucket is off and replaced for the pallet forks. Even on the backhoe 90% of the machines have a quick connect for the bucket.
Also I beg to differ that a backhoe on a tractor is better than a decent backhoe loader because of the repairs and reliability issues. You get what you pay for. Pay nothing, and you get a piece of junk. You simply can't expect to buy a backhoe loader where the scrap value due to the weight is already more expensive than your tractor backhoe attachment and have it running flawlessly for months at a time. If you put a Dollar by Dollar comparison for reliability, you also have to put a Dollar by Dollar comparision for capability.
You might be lucky or unlucky, but with an old machine it's a matter of time until you have to do some repairs. Absolutely correct what you stated there. So I get the argument that every minute you spend fixing the machine goes away from doing something useful with it. My argument is that if I absolutely need a job to be completed by a specific deadline, I have to pay someone doing it for me. Still there are many more considerations.
Over here in Europe backhoe attachments for tractors are far less common to find. Even those cute mini tractors are hard to come by. As a result, you won't find as many attachments or spare parts, and if you need something remotely special, you're completely done. Tilt bucket? Rotator? Log grapple for the backhoe? Forget about it. Besides those mini tractors getting overwhelmed with another couple hundred kilos on the backhoe, let alone grabbing a decent sized log or digging out tree stumps where my 9t (20 000 pounds) backhoe loader was at its limits. And you simply don't want to sit on that open seat in a spring/fall/winter in Northern Europe.
While it's not a black and white situation, and you can get away with a tractor attached backhoe for many jobs (even if they take slightly longer), I still see an edge for the bigger industrial backhoe loder, provided you have been able to find a decent machine in a reasonable condition where not everything breaks at the same time.
But to be honest, I share some of your pain - 4 weeks after purchasing mine the differential carrier on the front axle (4WD) broke, and it took me ages to get it fixed, including getting parts custom made. Still my biggest issue with the machine was first convincing my wife that I need one, and fighting off her demands to get rid of it after this little accident involving an underground cable...
It’s better to think of a backhoe as a mobile hydraulic pump than as a digging and earth moving machine.
You can use the parking brake while you're digging just don't put it in four wheel drive. Leave the parking brake on while you're pushing the tractor forward with the boom. just lift the back of the tractor off the ground slightly when you're pushing it forward. That's the way my dad taught me who had been working his backhoe for 40+ years.
Appreciate the tip! That makes sense! I bet I was in 4 wheel drive.
Gotta do your research. All fun and games with an older beast until you buy something like an International and have to go through three different current manufacturers to try to find parts as they own pieces of the the old International. It's a fnk nightmare. Something to be said in buying an attachment for a modern tractor that tends to start when you turn on the key.
Agreed
i would listen to this guy still when it comes to just buying a attachment. but i well say we have a branson 4225ch with a 200bh backhoe. and the problem i ran into here lately was being that we have a cab tractor and the way our backhoe swings onto the tractor. the seat on the backhoe smashed the back window out on me. but once again i cant say that all tractors well have that problem and thats the only problem we ever had with it so far. other then that its been almost as good a a normal backhoe in my opinion.
You bring up a good point. The backhoe attachment isn't really designed for cab tractors. I think Branson has one of the best priced backhoes out there. Glad to hear you are otherwise happy with it.
@@FarmDad yeah really there made more for the cabless tractors. but really the worse thing that happened other then us needing a 300 dollar window now. is my dad being mad at me for the rest of the night afterwards. 😂
@@FarmDad that and we might take the seat off next time we take the backhoe off is what we were thinking.
Get it running well enough to sell it to the next poor unsuspecting fool. That thing might have a curse on it. Clearly the previous owner had a lot of problems with it too, and got tired of having to work on it all the time. Backhoe parts ain't cheap, so when he says "overhauled", he's talking about all the parts he had to replace over the time he owned it as they broke or wore out.
Yeah, I'd say you're right.
If you have cows and need round hay moved you won't be doing it with that little tractor.
Agreed. But it's not easy to move round bales with the big backhoe either. I'd much rather have a tractor with a quick connect loader and a hay spear.