Daniel Smith Color Showdown S2E2: Ultramarine Blue vs. French Ultramarine
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 1 ก.ค. 2018
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In this series we compare two very similar Daniel Smith watercolors through swatches. Learn the differences between the two colors, which one you should pick for your palette, or find out that they are both worth having!
In this episode, we compare the long debated difference between Ultramarine Blue and French Ultramarine. What's the difference?
** Supplies I used **
+ Ultramarine Blue (Daniel Smith) www.jacksonsart.com/daniel-sm...
+ French Ultramarine (Daniel Smith) www.jacksonsart.com/daniel-sm...
+ Cadmium Yellow Light (Holbein) www.jacksonsart.com/holbein-w...
+ Cadmium Yellow Orange (Holbein) www.jacksonsart.com/holbein-w...
+ Vermilion (Holbein) www.jacksonsart.com/holbein-w...
+ Permanent Red (Daniel Smith) www.jacksonsart.com/daniel-sm...
+ Quinacridone Rose (Daniel Smith) www.jacksonsart.com/daniel-sm...
+ Quinacridone Violet (Holbein) www.jacksonsart.com/holbein-w...
+ Ultramarine Violet (Schmincke) www.jacksonsart.com/schmincke...
+ Ultramarine Blue (handmade by me)
+ Phthalo Blue Yellow Shade (Holbein) www.jacksonsart.com/holbein-w...
+ Phthalo Turquoise (Daniel Smith) www.jacksonsart.com/daniel-sm...
+ Viridian Hue (Holbein) www.jacksonsart.com/holbein-w...
+ Permanent Green No. 1 (Holbein) www.jacksonsart.com/holbein-w...
Papers
+ Bockingford 140lb CP watercolor paper www.jacksonsart.com/bockingfo...
+ Bockingford 140lb HP watercolor paper www.jacksonsart.com/bockingfo...
+ Bockingford 140lb Rough watercolor paper www.jacksonsart.com/bockingfo...
+ Arches 140lb CP watercolor paper pad www.jacksonsart.com/arches-aq...
Other Tools
+ Gauze www.otokano.com/shop/gauze-fo...
+ Pro Arte Prolene Plus size 12 round brush www.jacksonsart.com/pro-arte-...
Music: I Found Me by Lakey Inspired / i-found-me
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******* Apologise about the hand waving ********
I am very sorry that there was a lot of handwaving in this video. I have received several comments regarding this and I have taken it on board. I have just finished filming Episode 3 and 4, and I can assure everyone there is much less handwaving there. Thank you for your patience and thank you very much for the advice.
Stephen Turner thank you Stephen, I appreciate your support 💚
I dont mind, it shows your enthusiasm 😊
"Are you incapable of talking without flapping your hands about?" - War Doctor. I honestly didn't notice until I read your comment and we all need a bit more Matt Smith in our lives :)
I'm more of a cobalt man myself.
Ohh my gosh really?! It's soooooo not a problem. Love your videos. 💙💙💙💙💙💙
I have to admit, it's SO weird, as just last night I was wondering about my Schmincke French Ultramarine Blue and my Daniel Smith Ultramarine Blue, as I now include them in one tin, together, side by side... and to be honest - I can't tell the difference between them! This was a REALLY helpful and informative examination and I sincerely cannot believe that you covered this topic just hours after I was literally wondering about it myself! Are you reading my mind, Oto Kano? lol!! Thank you so much and a wonderfully put together video! Cheers! :)
Ha ha ha maybe you sent me the vibes? So glad it was useful to you in a timely manner :D Thank you for watching the video!
John Cogley owner of Daniel Smith makes it quite simple to understand. FUMB has a larger particle size. This accounts for the shift to the warm red due to the angle of light refraction. The larger particles absorb more to the blue end of the visible light range therefore bouncing back more of the red end of the light spectrum. That also explains why the FUMB is more expensive. You have to retain the larger pigment size to make the FUMB and would have more smaller particles left over to make the UMB. I JUST LOVE YOUR CHANNEL. Thank you so much for all your work and insight.
David Tennant is my favorite Doctor! Since these colors are so similar, I’ll go with the Ultramarine blue because it is Series 1.
Wow I think there is a huge huge difference between the two. Isn't it funny how our eyes work so differently between each individual.
I choose Ultramarine Deep by Sennelier!
Such an amazing colour, and you do such good comprehensive swatching.
It's fitting that there'd be a Doctor Who reference in a video with TARDIS blue ;) Daniel Smith's French Ultramarine was my first, but I now use Senneliers Ultramarine Deep... Which I think is still a redder variety haha. But cost was the factor.
lol I did wonder if it was the color that made me think of Doctor Who in the first place! Is Sennelier cheaper for you than DS?
Oto Kano this big tubes are! Per ml anyway.
My goodness, thank you for making the Doctor Who comparison ♥♥ I started with Chris Eccleston, but Matt Smith is my favorite as well. :] These colors are lovely, and it's really nice to see how similar they are. Those mixes are in fact incredibly versatile! I actually don't always have an ultramarine on my palette, depending what I'm using. It's a very clean blue, which is awesome, but I usually reach for pthalo blue (rs) or indanthrone blue.
SOoooooo glad to hear you are a Smithy convert! I adore him and everyone that were close to his Doctor. I love River SO much.
I am so glad you mentioned Phthalo blue RS. Never really knew their point until I used it as a non-granulating replacement for the ultramarine. I loved the result.
Thank you for such an in-depth comparison. Since they are so similar in every way, I'll stick to the one I was first introduced to and became the most familiar with. Your explanation made so much sense. 😊
Thank you, Oto, this series is soooo helpful for me - I as a beginner understand so much better what all the artists are talking about andy why it matters which pigment a colour is made of! As for the reference colours in mixing - perhaps it could be a good alternative to simply put a little dot of the "original" colour beside its name? That way, the viewer could see the three colours at once, the two mixing colours and the result 😃 Thanks again for all the work, effort and love than shine through in your videos!
Oh, and btw - I love Ultramarine light by Schmincke - it's such a lovely sky blue...
I've only been painting with watercolors for about a month now, so I was happy to watch this! That means that, even though I have only purchased the Windsor & Newton Cotman travel set, it is only a half pan, so I am not married to the Ultramarine Blue that comes standard.
By the time I run out, I will be able to get better quality series of paints, so I might check out the F.U.B., just based on the subtle differences in color when mixed with yellow, which you were so good to show.
I love how thorough you are in swatching, and I absolutely love how "lovely" everything is to you! Ha-ha!
You get as excited about colors as I do...I didn't even notice your hand waving!
Subscribing...and watching more of your videos now.
Hugs from Texas!
Excellent vid Oto, I’m a French ultramarine blue guy myself. I like all the doctors each iteration of the doctor brings new lovely quirks I enjoy. Thank you Oto!
I agree, and I guess that's the fun of the whole Doctor Who series :D
This helped SO much! I have French UB and one of my fave artists love regular Ultramarine - I needed to know and your videos are SUPER informative!!! I really appreciate this comparison. Thanks so much!! Also, from one hand waver to another it didn't both me :)
Hi Oto! Great video, as always. So...my go-to ultramarine is Schmincke's ultramarine finest, since I love the hue but need a nongranulating color for most of the illustrations I do. Well one project called for texture in the background, so I bought a tube of Daniel Smith's French ultramarine because I wanted the most
granulation I could get and they're known for their intensely granulating watercolors. It worked wonderfully...such an amazing texture! So now I have two different versions of ultramarine to choose from, depending on what the illustration calls for.
Oh, and you're right about who our favorite Doctor is, I think. As much as I love watching Matt Smith and think David Tennant might just have perfectly channeled the Doctor, Christopher Eccleston was the first Doctor I watched, and for some reason he's still my favorite. 😉
Having two, based on difference in the level of granulation is a great idea!
Thanks for the video. I think the better option to choose would be French Ultramarine for a more well rounded palette since it leans towards the red shade while your cooler blue - the Phthalo would lean towards the yellow shade so it seems to make a good counter balance for that.
This is a great point, thank you!
Very thorough swatch testing - I appreciate it! ✨
Good information. I just purchased the French, and I’m sort of shocked by how granulating it is. Thx for your study of the 2 colors.
I love your Doctor Who analogy. And I love the vermilion with both of these blues! Thanks so much for the lovely video :).
I love your Doctor Who reference! In my country it is not so popular, so it is a nice surprise for me. :D
Thank you for the videos, they are so great! Being a beginner, I learned so much about how to test new colours!
Thank you for doing this test!
Love your DW analogy, same here about 11 💙
While watching I liked the french one a bit more, but blue is blue and I’ll always love blue
I think it needs to be said that Daniel Smith's UB (and probably FU too) dries like a hard rock in the pan (cracks and falls out, unfortunately a big tendency with many DS colors) which makes it hard to use in a travel palette. Which is a pity because I love DS UB! I have tried other brands of UB and FU but no one comes close to the DS UB in my opinion. Right now I am using Winsor & Newton's FU and Rosa Gallery's UB to try them out. I have also tried Scmincke's FU but I find them all too muted compared to DS UB. Of course they are all quite similar but I started with DS UB and judge all my ultramarines based on it. So if you live in a dry climate you might not want to get the DS.
Thank you for this comparison, I was wondering the difference for a long time!
You are so welcome! Glad the video could clear up the difference for you :) Thanks for watching.
If they're almost exactly the same then it makes sense to get the cheaper one. Thanks so much for your color comparison videos. These help me so much as I'm completely self taught and only been painting two years or so. I can't wait for your next video!
You are so welcome Rebecca, thank you so much for watching the series!
That is interesting! And then, my thinking was that if I was to hang on to a tube of 15ml for a long while, I was going to get the nicer tube. I like the more intense red blue :-) I ♥️ Daniel Smith!
They are so close! I like the slightly redder tone of the French ultramarine blue, but the price of the ultramarine blue. I think price would win out.
I use French ultramarine by Schmincke, it is heavily granulating, deep red shade. It lifts almost to pure white. If I had to choose one, that would be it. I don’t mind granulation even on the portraits. Schminke has also ultramarine finest that almost lacks granulation, and I keep it for specific uses.
Ultramarine is a staple in my palette. I started with the usual ultramarine by White Nights and when I got the redder French ultramarine I immediately jumped to it.
Thank you for doing the comparison. I had been wondering what the difference really was. From online description it has made them sound more different then they really are, at least the DS ones. So I will be sticking with the Ultramarine Blue and spend on another colour on wish list.
So glad I could save you money! :D
I love the Doctor Who analogy. I was so sad when Matt Smith was done--like I lost a friend! I started from the beginning with French Ultramarine and it's one of my favorite colors.
Matt smith is my doctor too! Although I started with Eccelston and after Tennant I had extreme concerns about Smith. But fish fingers and custard stole my heart! Loved Whittaker's premiere and very excited for her run. Question about ultramarine - have you found one that doesn't granulate? I can't stand granulation. I am using m graham right now and to be honest I've just been staying away from the ultramarine on my palette. I am also trying to step away from m graham because as much as I love everything about the company, it is not travel friendly paint (I travel every week for work) and it's hard to get just a bit of paint because of its rewetting capabilities. Would love to switch brands slowly as I work through my stash.
I always used DS Ultramarine blue but recently switched because I included DS Cobalt blue n my palette. Cobalt is pretty dead center between warm and cool and I thought I would take advantage of the DS French Ultramarine's warmness to have an added possibility. In my smaller palettes with out Cobalt, I still use Ultramarine. simply because it is cheaper.
Thank you for the comparison. When I wanted something more serious to practice with I got the three pack primary tubes on amazon for cheap.(For the price it was like buy two tubes get one free but in a set and 15ml) I started out with french ultramarine and was asked "why not just ultramarine?"
I think it was because I was just new to watercolor and frankly still am. Their reasoning was it is more granular/ less easy to predict or handle. Being stubborn I already got it and thought I'll just explore what this paint does. I'm not about to be scared to play with color.
Anyways, they look almost indecipherable to me in this test. This just conforms my gut feeling and to go wherever my heart carries me, especially if it is a bit easier on my wallet. Btw love the doctor who ref it has always been David Tennant for me.
I agree, the differences between them are soooo slight. I love your philosophy of going wherever your heart takes you. Best policy.
Thanks!
Thank you so much . Your videos are very useful. I would like to know what brand of watercolor paper you use for the printer
I wonder if the imperial purple is made with the French ultramarine and rose of ultramarine is made with regular ultramarine?
When I run out of DS Ultramarine and Rose of Ultramarine I will get the French Ultramarine and Quin Violet. I am a multi-Dr fan, evidently😎
I love blues in general, so I feel like I would easily want both off of that alone. But if I absolutely had to choose, I'm sure I would prefer the Ultramarine Blue on its own since it's more transparent and kind of prefer the leftover staining from when it is lifted versus it being completely liftable. I also feel that I would personally reserve the French Ultramarine mainly for mixing since the mixes were a bit bolder. But both are very beautiful colors on their own, despite being so similar! And glad I got to watch another great color showdown!
Also, your Ultramarine Blue looks gorgeous too! 😍💙
That's great :D And I totally do that with colors I am most drawn to, I have no idea how many cool reds and roses I have!
Aw thank you :3 still practicing but hand making paints is so much fun!
I love how the vermilion mixes with the French Ultramarine. Such a nice subtle colour.
Though to be fair vermillion is generally a colour that I gravitate towards.
Thanks a lot for this one, I've never tried the F. Ultramarine but after listening to you I won't spend te extra money on it since it is not necessary.
When I purchased Susie Short's Essential 7 set from Daniel Smith, it came with French Ultramarine. So, that's what I have used since. I don't even have Ultramarine Blue and never felt compelled to purchase it.
I do like using French Ultramarine for skies. Especially, warm, summer, cloudless skies. I just make sure my paper is wet and my paint is wet. It goes on without too much granulation. It re-wets really well and seems to hold on to that wetness for as long as I need it.
Thank you Donna for sharing your thoughts on French Ultramarine. I was really impressed with the rewettability of both ultramarine colors by Daniel Smith!
That comparison is so good. Reason why I use F. Ultramarine. It's just the one I was introduced to and the one I used. (And all Doctors are good in their own way!)
So glad you liked it. Thank you for watching!
So far I'm this season I'm learning these showdown colours are super dang similar! Wow. This showdown is even more subtle than the last!
My first doctor was Christopher Eccleston, and he is one of my favourites. I also really loved Peter Capaldi and my favourite classic doctor is Sylvester McCoy. Apparently I like it when the Doctor is darker and sorta cranky? I honestly would travel with any of them! Still holding out for a Canadian companion one day ...
Yes, there were so many great suggestions of colors that are super duper similar. I'm very grateful for everyone's input. Capldi was excellent as the doctor as well!
Hi, a Peter Capaldi fan here though only to a small degree, as I sort of watch this stuff because of children who do. I come more from the Tom Baker generation, pre hi-tech effects. I spent a bit of time in hospital a couple of years ago and got a bit of extra attention from the nurses when Rory's mum came to visit! Well he isn't really called Rory.... and his mum is a bit of a legend in her own right. Anyway, I have neither of these blues, but do have Jacksons own, and a W&N and a couple of different Daler Rowney versions. I am a bit overendowed with the stuff, the Jacksons tubes are really generous, so am discovering other blues too, but really you have to love this stuff, even if all you do is paint large squares of it so you can just fall into its blueness, like a bit of late afternoon James Turrell sky. All my versions paint out different, and have more variation than these two. Thinking about it I think I also have a Sennelier version, which is very like the Jacksons but slightly (and surprisingly) weaker. I do not think I would look for slightly warmer or cooler versions, if I need that I would adjust them slightly with another colour. They would still granulate, but maybe in a wash there would be some interesting separation. I have seen a nongranulating version, not sure, but perhaps it was Schminke. I am more interested in the obscure ultramarine colours, particularly the violet/pinkish versions, and have o White Nights version that is very pretty.
I can't believe you met Rory's real mum! That's so awesome. I have totally painted many squares of blues because I love them!
Oto Kano, I've known them both forever!
WOAH! That's amazing!!!!! I loved Rory, Amy & River, my favourite companions!
Yay! A new episode! I'm still in this weird place where I have a knee-jerk reaction of disliking all UMBs, but then I try one here or there that is easy to rewet and I think "oh, it's not *that* bad". It's a truly lovely hue :)
Even Dan's Blue?
I have to remind myself of Dan's Blue to help me remember that it can be easy to rewet and so color-loaded! No other paints have been that pleasant to use for this color :D
How these fare when it comes to rewetting from palette? :) I opted for French ultramarine, supposedly it rewets better than the other ultramarine from info I scavenged up. Wonder if it's true or not? :)
Granulation is great thing, but requires growing up to love it ^.^ now I adore that effect.
I didn't notice any difference between them in terms of rewetting. They were both pretty good but not a big difference between the two, not enough to notice anyway.
Yes! I am sooooo loving granulation now. Took a while but got to love the granulation in the end!
Oto Kano thanks a lot for the reply ^.^ seems if I'll ever run through my French tube, I'll give the other one a try too ^.^ but that's not going to be sooner than in few years, knowing myself... Lol :D
These videos are super helpful. Thanks for dedicating so much of your time to do them for the rest of the world! ^.^
have had both in different pallets and for me its ever one. tom baker was the best DR. who, any one for a jelly baby LOL
lol yes he is awesome!
I don’t see much difference to warrant buying series 2 over series 1 so I think I’ll stick to Ultramarine Blue. My first u.b. Was Cotman’s, then W&N prof. French Ultramarine. Both were half pans. Was looking for info on which (french) ultramarine blue I would prefer and this one popped up so watched it again but like so many of the Daniel Smith colors, some are sooooo similar that you wouldn’t recognize which one is used if you were to guess from other people’s artwork. I know this is an older video (think it’s been 3 years since watching the first time) but to my amateur eyes I still don’t detect much difference so I’ll go with the cheaper one
I actually think knowing they are so close makes it easier to go with ultramarine at the lower price
I adored you bfore and then you dropped the Doctor Who bomb. You've seriously rocked my world! ahhh!! ok gonna finish the video
Awwww Carolyn! So glad you are a Doctor Who fan too :D Yes, I get super passionate about Doctor Who, even made a Doctor Who quilt.
My Dr Who was Tom Baker although I started wiht John Pertwee
I'm a Capaldi fan and I want to say I'm going for French Ultramarine, but the price difference doesn't really justify the switch even if I like the slightly warmer tone of French Ultramarine.
I love both for difference reasons. I reach for French Ultramarine more for some reason - but both are permanent pigments in my regular palette.
Thanks for this video Oto!
You are so welcome, thank you for watching :D
Love David Tenent but Matt Smith’s story lines were WAY better. Also I think Donna and Amy would get along making fun of the Doctor. Fight me
I have the UMB and wanted to buy the FUMB but now I will not. Thank you for this video.
Glad I could save you money!
You did.
I really dislike granulation, especially in a blue which means you can't get nice smooth skies. Any advice?
I also dislike granulation in blue skies, which is why I tend to use Phthalo Blue for skies (add some magenta to make it more purple-toned and less greenish, and/or use the Red Shade). I also like a light wash of Cobalt Blue; it's granulating but the Da Vinci version is not very granulating. A light wash Prussian Blue can also be a nice sky, though it's a bit more muted.
I find French slightly harder to use from dry.
Lapiz lazuli please.
The Codex Astartes supports this color.
The emperor protects!
For the Emperor!
I don't like french ulramarine of Daniel Smith which came in set of three primary colors. Its granulating which doesn't look good. It looks dirty and cheap. Cannot say about other brand's french ultramarine but I knew it's generally very granualting. I used vegan colors so have fewer options. I will try ultramine blue and other blue of Daniel Smith and some other vegan brands.
The difference is too small to loose sleep over...😉
Loved the video and information as well as this series. But all of your hand movements are very very distracting. It would be such better to use far less hand movement. At several points I actually had to close my eyes.
Hi Cathy, thanks for the feedback. Someone else said the same thing on the last video so I’m now reducing the hand movements a lot. Unfortunately this video was already uploaded and scheduled before this. So I’m sorry there was a lot of hand waving again. I just finished the next two episode and I promise there’s much less handwaving in those. Thank you for your patience. 🙏
It's Sour Puss Time. Why? Because my experience with ultramarine blue was bad. To my eyes it makes the most hideous greens. No matter how little or how much blue, yellow, white, or black I mixed it came out icky. I prefer Grumbacher thalo blue it creates bright and happy greens and that also goes for the purples and violets.
Wait a minute
This is not Warhammer 40k Ultramarines Lore