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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 23 ส.ค. 2021
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![Kinefinity MAVO Edge 8K - Official Product Launch 2020 [ENGLISH VERSION]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/KKPfOrn3yeE/mqdefault.jpg)
I’ve been drooling over this camera since they first announced it and the image quality definitely doesn’t disappoint. I ultimately went with an FX6 for the versatility, name recognition and quality of life features, but man that Mavo Edge is looking super sweet. I hope Kinefinity gains massive brand recognition for this camera bc I’d love to add one to my arsenal
The image looks really, really nice. Love the design of the camera. The ports on the back are some of the best thought out and included camera ports I've ever seen. Love the power options and the potential of a camera like this.
Completely agree. That footage has had hardly anything done to it either. Simple contrast and saturation boost in resolve on most of them. I did a bit more tweaking in curves on some of the wides where you can see the sky, just to get some of that detail out
Carl
Great video. The battery design is very innovative, I wish more manufacturers would come up with genius ideas like this one.
Wait until you see the UPS baseplate in the next video which means you can hotswap the camera's batteries as well! So many nice design touches
Carl
Liked the look of this camera since its announcement, was nice to some serious innovations being made beyond just resolution. Whilst admittedly this is way too much camera than I'll need, I do hope it's a success and can carve out some decent market share for itself. Then with any luck Kinefinity might consider releasing a lower spec Mavo Edge 4K or 6K :D
Amazing to see how much is already on the body and the built in ND and ProRes codecs as well. Excellent video Carl
It's a pretty comprehensive package!
Carl
Very thorough interview.. thank you for that.
I hope you make a series of videos to compare it with other cameras like red helium, komodo, arri alexa, Sony Venice especially when it comes to dynamic range, iso, image quality in general, cropping 8k videos into full HD or 4k. These are the type of things that can be deal breakers and cannot be found in the specs of each camera.
Really love the look of kinifinity cameras. Almost bought one a couple years ago but opted out because of where I live. Zero support if anything went wrong.
Great review! Been following the camera in the FB group and users who got to test the Mavo Edge won't even talk about anything productive. All they do is share their rig and post 10 second clips of basic shots. Please do an image quality test such as:
1.) If the internal ND"s are IRND (how bad is the IR pollution),
2.) Rolling shutter test,
3.) Dual iso night shots,
4.) If you can compare images from other similar cameras that would be a bonus!
Also, a review of the monitor they have with the camera would be great. (Pros and cons)
hey obi, the e-nd is not an issue with ir pollution since the camera has olpf and cfa pattern with ir/uv cute. however there might be small tint shifts when deploying the e-nd which we believe will be eased out in the color matrix of the camera directly. But all these things can be corrected and a unsaturated color or color cast cant be corrected in post (like with ir pollution)
Glad you liked the video.
The camera is still very new for people. We can try and answer as many questions as possible for people though!
1) I noticed some slight magenta shift as the e/nd increased, but it didn’t seem to be IR pollution as it was across the whole image and could be dialled out in post very easily. So could possibly be compensated for in camera, I’ve flagged it with Kinefinity and they are looking into it.
2) I didn’t do any rolling shutter tests really. I’ll try and do some at the next opportunity
3) I didn’t do night shots, only the interior high iso tests you see in this video. But the 2560 native ISO looks very clean! Once it’s on TH-cam you can’t even really see the noise difference between it and 640
4) our next video which is coming either tomorrow or Thursday will cover all the accessories around the camera and I do touch on the monitors there. But long story short, I love them and think they are well worth getting with the camera.
Carl
Yes Please - More carefully done comparison tests. I know it will make pretty pictures, every camera does these days, question is where and how does the image break, and how does that compare to Venice / Monstro / Alexa LF
@@mattuhry exactly my point! I can post frames of the bmpcc4k graded and it'll come out beautifully but if I compare it to other cinema cameras, you'll truly see the contrasts. Let's see the Mavo Edge compete :)
@@gafpagear again, I would like to see a dedicated tests with all the ND's, preferably someone wearing a black shirt.
Was wondering when it's gonna show up! By far the most exciting camera right now. Having an 8k sensor but shooting in FF 4k is a dream. Variable ND is great (love it on my FX6). But the best thing is universal media and batteries! I hate proprietary cards that are just overpriced repackaged PC parts. I just wish they lowered the price to 10k since there is no RAW.
Couldn't agree more. We are doing our best to help with the price, with a 0% finance deal on the Pro Package and trade in deals available for current Kinefinity owners
Carl
@@ProAVTV no, thanks
@@ProAVTV Tried one of these recently in the Netherlands. It's a stunning camera. For both the Kinefinity and the Z-CAM teams, perhaps a good answer to the "well-known problem" in the industry is simply to bite the bullet and support Blackmagic RAW acquisition? This solves the issue of American patent trolls, and provides seamless integration with the world's favourite editing software in one step.
@@andymanson it's not these camera manufacturers that have to bite the bullet. It's Blackmagic. Currently, BRAW as an acquisition codec is not open.
@@andymanson BRAW is the last defense of BMD's high end solutions, if they openly authorized it to Kinefinity or Z Cam, the majority of the URSA 12K/G2 market would go for the Mavo Edge, and a BRAW capable Z Cam probably would end the BMPCC charm as well.
3:09 you might clean the sensor before next shooting 😄
Always the way! 😫
Carl
I’ve been looking at this camera for a long time now. Hopefully you can do more comparisons in the future, noise levels when shooting in 8k in low light scenarios, rolling shutter and your preferred lenses for this system
Sure, we can certainly look at doing more comprehensive tests to cover those things!
Carl
@@ProAVTV Would really like a rolling shutter test of this camera, can't find it anywhere and I think that is very important information for a camera like this.
@@geoffreybassett6741 check gerald's review of the kine edge 6K
Imaging if they redesign the npf to be deeper and you could put the smaller npf inside all while having the v mount battery on the outside.
In the event the vmount dies, the npf can still power the camera and the operator can safely stop recording and swap out the vmount battery. Therefore no corrupted files from sudden lost & shut down of power from the low voltage of the vmount battery
Well, if you have the KineKit Edge cage you have exactly that, as the baseplate has two NPF batteries inside which power the camera when you take the battery off. The next video will show this in action
Carl
It's an exciting camera. It sure does put the big brands on 'edge'.
Competition is healthy for everyone!
Carl
How does this camera compare to Alexa sensor DR , also how does this compare to the Komodo in terms of final image (DR,RS, and color)
have been watching so many footage from this camera and finally we have a detail video review about this.
Thank you ProAV TV !
Glad it was helpful! Thanks for watching
Carl
Why isn't the BMD Ursa Mini Pro 12K on the list when in comparison with competitors at 04.55?
Certainly, with the recently reduced price, this is a strong competitor or am I wrong?
Blackmagic design should make a camera design like this with a direct mount for a Vmount battery on the back
The Ursas can have a Vlock battery on the back?
Carl
@@ProAVTV I’m assuming he means that it comes with the purchase. The v-mount is a separate attachment
I would like to see how the rolling shutter acts out . Thanks
I was wondering if Kinefinity will consider include internal B-Raw. That could be a very interesting move against apple's propietary raw codec.
BRAW is proprietary as well for cameras. It is only open in terms of NLEs.
Why haven't you done a follow up video using some of the things we wanted to see/know?
Great review. How is the clip playback. I have the mavo LF with their 7 inch U monitor. I do not get smooth playback with most of the codecs. Is the playback smooth for most or all codecs? Thats the only big issue I have with my mavo LF
We will test that soon.
Carl
RED left the chat
This brand still technically not available in my country. zcam is way more aggressive in terms of availability of seller and price.
You didn't include the BlackMagic URSA Mini Pro 12K camera in your comparison, that can do 120fps at 8k!
All the others were large format sensors though, the Ursa 12K is super35mm
Carl
Hi ProAV TV
Tanks for your video!
Regarding MAVO Edge's internal variable ND.
Your chart indicates that the Alexa mini LF, Venice and C500 MKII have clear ND.
Does this mean that the MAVO Edge does not have a clear ND?
And what is the difference between, internal optical filters vs. internal? Aren't they optical?
Best regard Lui
Hi Lui
The Edge can take off all ND in camera, apologies if that wasn’t clear. There is one electronic variable ND that comes down in front of the sensor. So rather than multiple optical glass filters, it’s one e/ND mechanism. This is similar to the way Sony do it on the FX9&FX6
Carl
I think it’s terrific. If only it were available in the States…
You can buy in the States from Kinefinity directly and I believe some of their support is now handled by Origin Cine Rental.
Carl
I tried to purchase it but my bank said I am $15,000 short lol. Seriously though one of the reasons why people love them is because of their pricing however I feel like this is priced a bit too high for most people's interest. Kinefinity would turn on a lot more customers if it was around $10k-$12k but just my two cents. I'd rather get a C300 iii, better features, AF and more.
Isn't it about $12K?
Love the design, prores raw would have taken this over the edge for me (no pun intended), but I understand the politics with red. I may have pulled the trigger otherwise. But this is a lot of money in 2021 for a camera that’s not a huge leap from my Panasonic eva 1’s
In my opinion this is a big step up from the EVA 1. I have always quite liked the EVA, but this has many more features, frame rates, resolutions, better codecs, and better colour in my opinion.
Carl
Hi Carl. I was wondering does the Mavo Edge still use the ISO control system, where you can move your latitude into the highlights or shadows based on your scene?
This was something in the LF that I loved. Hoping to see if it’s still there in the edge.
Yes it is!
Carl
really impressed
So am I!
Carl
Superb.
Its nicely designed isn't it
Carl
Awesome & Thanks :)
Thanks for watching!
Carl
they should contact Black magic and use BRAW since they can't use ProRess Raw, or they will need to develop their version of RAW that can work native in various NLE which will cost alot more than just paying BM, apple or Cannon a licensing fee, and that is if they even agree to it.
I would like to see the low light capabilities compared with RED gemini!
Kinefinty mavo edge with Atomos ninja V ?
Not really ideal unless you get the SDI accessory to go with the ninja v
Why are you leaving the Ursa 12k out of the comparison it can shoot 8k at 120fps it should be considered…
The moving weel is on purpose. Reviewers never understand when something moves this could be on purpose...
Interesting, why do you think it’s on purpose? What benefit does it have?
Carl
Love the innovation, just needs that polish. I hope these companies force the bigger guys to innovate more and use SSDs
Personally I think this has more polish than some of the top camera companies in some areas. Sure the control scheme could do with some work. But no camera is perfect.
Carl
@@ProAVTV and if the only polish needs to be in the one area they can improve with a firmware update, then that's fantastic news.
Is this selling or reviewing a camera. As it is a shop I would say selling.
The 14 stops of DR is a little disappointing.
no, thanks
too many compromises on paper. the demo images don't look spectacular for this kind of spend
Other than not having raw recording, what are the other compromises for you?
Carl
Sorry but $12,000 plus for this camera, given the lack of ProRes Raw is a price that is way out of line with its competition. Without a Raw format the current use of 8K for VFX is useless and if you want to crop down then again, there are better cameras for lesser money. Right now this camera is a fail and I don't see it moving forward.
Well i'm not sure I agree with that, sorry. I normally hear from VFX people that detail and colour information are key, and I struggle to believe that the 8K Prores 4444 XQ files from this will be lacking in detail or colour information. Plenty of high end projects don't use raw workflows and choose prores instead. Plus I know very few high end productions using Prores raw yet.
I don't disagree that a raw codec would be very welcome. But I strongly disagree that the camera is 'useless' without it, even for VFX.
Carl
@@ProAVTV if I may chime in :) the only really uncompressed raw codec is by ARRI (arriraw) the rest are all compressed and as long as a camera can do high profile debayering in camera the prores 444 codec is perfectly suitable for stalling all info and offering the same flexibility in post is same as all raw formats. only potential difference is that raw can be potentially smaller because its essentially a black and white (luminance one channel) only with a fixed cfa profile that can be turned into colors by means of debayering or quantization so rgb debayered is x3 but with smart prores chroma sampling etc this is highly reduced in a visual lossless manner.. So yes, as long as a camera has a good enough build in algorithm it's visually the same or even better (red code even at its lowest ratio setting can have a bit of compression artefacts in shadow noise). Problem with Raw is that it's essentially a marketing term and no cameras below 20k price point record real unfiltered uncompressed raw. Also the ability to change wb and iso (digital gain) in post is exactly the same with prores (if not better) but you don't get the fancy raw ui. But calculations are the same. Now the biggest plus of prores and the reason why the alexa back in 2009 was such a succes :) oversampling!! To get past nyquist limits one need to oversample by at least 0.7x (arri classic =2.8k and oversampled to 2k). You can oversample with raw only in post and the quantization algorithms in post especially in resolve are pretty limited and ancient. So a 8k sensor should be oversampled at least by 0.7x but if you oversample it 0.5x you don't have to debayer having a much more raw signal because combining spatial color resolution (2x green + red and blue) leads to better color depth lower noise and fewer aliasing artefacts! . @carl thanx for your great review ! I agree on the rotating dial knob , maybe it can be replaced down the road!