Archiving with M-Disc
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 ก.ย. 2024
- M-Disc is a more robust form of writable DVD and Blu-Ray media for making longer-lasting archives and backups. Here I look at M-Disc hardware, test compatitbility, and perform an intensive data retention test to see if M-Discs really do last longer than traditional optical media.
This video is a follow-up to “Data Backup: The 3-2-1 Rule”: • Data Backup: The 3-2-1...
You may also enjoy some of my other storage-related videos: • Storage & Related Hard...
Even more videos on computing-related topics can be found at: / explainingcomputers
You may also like my ExplainingTheFuture channel at: / explainingthefuture
M-Discs DVD's can be read in any DVD player, the "M-Disc certified drive" requirement is only for writing on them since they need a more powerful laser to etch that material.
So we are back to carving into stone. Neat.
:)
Good observation. Stone age man was pretty smart. They built with perfect fit 100 ton stones we couldn't do today. So now we are stone age again. Progress!!!
LOL
Haha, what a trip.
And the sharpest blades are still made by striking stones together (obsidian)
As a neurotic archiver with multiple redundant backups this interest me greatly. Three backup HDs have suddenly died on me in the past two months so I was looking for a reliable yet cheap solution. I have a library of DVDs that I have to re read every six months or so because sometimes they just suddenly can't be read; the humid and hot climate of where I live corrodes them quickly. This is the solution many of us have been waiting. Thanks a lot professor.
Hey there! After 7 years do you still use this for backups? I'm interested into archiving my files for a long term. I was convinced to use SSD's but I'v come across this format, dou you recomend it?
Great video that I just stumbled across. I was in charge of a Digital Archive department for a company that supplied data services to mutual funds. I started testing M-Disc in 2009 or 2010 and was impressed with the potential for our customers. Ultimately it came down to cost vs advantage. We purchased 10K to 20K blank disks per month for production at $.43 each. M-Disc in DVD format were about $5 each - over 10 times the cost. I could not convince top management that the advantage to our customers was worth the added expense. I retired in 2011 and still have stacks of M-Discs and burners.
Would you sell me some?
@@erickrobles3179 I have about 20 M-disc blank DVDs let me know if you are interested
Happy 100K! Now you should expect a silver play button in 1-2 years.
I am really hoping for a package in 1-2 months . . . we shall see! :)
golden now
I used to work in an Antenna factory, and the guys there used to regularly test new designs of Antenna in a special chamber that could emulate 50 years of British weather. The Antennas used to come out looking all weathered and such, it was pretty cool to see :)
Now that chamber sounds very cool.
@@ExplainingComputers Yes, I am afraid I can't give you any good technical details as I wasn't directly involved, but I saw all the highly weathered looking Antennas and was told roughly what had happened to them. There was a sound proof chamber also, for testing microwaves. They say a sound proof room makes a person panic if left inside but I tried it for a good 15 minutes, and i found it quite relaxing. Many thanks.
@@chunkymonkey55555 perhaps depends on what kind of person you are. I find quite places quite nice.
@@jec_ecartsame
"Accelerated Aging Tests" are the category these types of things fit into, it's a really interesting science!
Despite everyday storage exploding into the 21st century, long term archival data storage is still very far behind, most people have no long term data storage plans.
it blows my mind that in 2020 there is still no real solution for long term archival data storage, M-disc seems to be the best bet so far. hopefully they will increase the storage capacity some day
@@SquidkidMega the only way I could see optical discs being improved is with stronger more scratch resistant coatings(perhaps one of the newest Corning glasses?) or encased in housing similar to floppy disks/psp discs and more stable dyes as well as a larger storage capacity. Optical has got to be the most reliable and forgiving long term physical storage medium available to the common consumer, would love to see it developed further.
This is sadly all so true.
@@ExplainingComputers I have been looking into a long term storage method. The only thing I could find was 5D optical glass storage. It's supposed to last a couple million years, so that's probably long enough. Only problem is that I can't find how far along the development is. I read that Elon must received 2 of them, and that they transfered a superman movie on one to see how it would work. If you ask me they should invest into the development and get them on the market as soon as possible. It's a no brainer for me, that I would buy one.
Magnectic tape works fine for archival, big companies use them for important data, it's slow, but if you take good care they will last a lot longer than ssds hds and dvds, plus they're cheap and have redundantly gigantic storage sizes
"I also tried it on this Sony machine that was recently dug up from an archaeological site.. I believe it was made by the Romans." Love British humor and its quintessential deadpan / understated delivery. And as a fellow albeit realatively newly minted M Disc enthusiast.... Great info!
It's been over 7 years since the publication of this much appreciated and helpful video, and I was wondering if you're still using M-Discs for data archival. It may be material worth for an "data archival revisited" video in the near future! Thank you very much for your help spreading computer knowledge in such a clear and concise way!
Sadly Verbatim doesn't sell true m-disc's anymore. So even if he did make an update on this, it wouldn't be very helpful becaus you can't buy true m-disc discs anymore (other than old 4,7Gb from Millenniata)
@@halilsmith8162 This is just a myth.
@@halilsmith8162 Really? Are you sure about they no longer sell actual MDisks at all? Is there anything I can read about on that? Would be a real shame if true.
@@AbsurdScandal
1) This channel just did an updated video about different storage options and their longevity.
2) it lead me to look into buying m discs, and from what I’ve read so far there’s a strong consensus that the Verbatim discs sold as “M” are now an upgraded version of their regular “archival” quality. But “gold” DVDrs and CDRs can last 50 years if you write them at 1x speed. There’s a lot of info available online on maximizing the technology that we can get hold of.
3) there’s a magnetic HDD utility called “Spinrite” that can be used to keep HDDs working much longer than average as well. I used to use it for recovery, but it’s great for the “magnetic refresh” they need when used as mostly-unpowered backups. It’s over thirty years old and still updated by the original software engineer.
@@JasonJrake 2) Doesn't Verbatim still sell DVD mdisks? The Blu Rays may most likely not be using the same mineral layer that the original DVD mdisks used, so are most likely an upgraded archival BD, but the DVDs may be true mdisks still.
That standard DVD looked pretty cool after that long-term water test. I mean, it wasn't very useful, but at least the pattern was interesting.
Yes, it looked great! :) Some cool chemistry was going on there.
@@ExplainingComputers -- I suspect that if the water was not the nice clean water you subjected it to, your results would have been different. For example in a situation where the disk was subjected to a flood where the water might be muddy. Don't laugh, a lot of companies in Houston found out that storing their important paper and data in underground secure storage was not a good idea after Tropical Storm Allison... Here's a photo from the tunnel system that connects many of the large buildings in downtown Houston...
lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/dpChEwFH6dHI7Dzrfx8OE6E5BV4SSVQsYsau4d6bwdqdij1x12490x1N-gKoxqQcy_PTAxraMD12rvXF3XzuYgQ
That photo was taken by someone while the water was still flowing rapidly in there and rising. Apparently the person realize that it probably was not a good idea to stay around as the water rose above the electrical outlets in the wall. It would have eventually filled up the the entire tunnel system and stores located on that level and the city spent quite a bit of time pumping out all the water from the tunnel system.
The disaster planning for the companies was more concerned about the potential for a hurricane and tornado destroying a building, so storing important things underground seemed like a good idea to them. The problem is that storing things underground is not a good idea if you have flooding due to a significant rain event (e.g. Tropical Storm Allison, Hurricane Harvey, etc). Houston has had floods for probably as long at it has been in existence. They will spend millions of dollars after a flood to modify the drainage, but all it does is make it where a place that didn't used to flood ends up flooding now. Here's a photo from 1935 where it flooded to the 2nd and 3rd floor of the downtown buildings:
s.w-x.co//util/image/w/houston-1935-flood-HCFCD.jpg
@@ExplainingComputers "Organic dyes" means its based on carbon chemistry.
M-Disc is pretty awesome especially for archiving video. It might be a good replacement over tape media but only time will tell how long it can really last.
50 GB of M-Discs costs just about the same as 3 000 GB of LTO-5 tape.
@@laszu7137 But the tape drive (assuming roughly $1000) costs as much as (from Amazon) 6 TB of Milleniata M-Discs, or (from your own comment) 36 TB of LTO-5 tape. Furthermore, this isn't about price, but longevity. If it's about price, the cheapest up to roughly 30 TB is HDD, then tape (which, BTW, it has very slow random read/write performance due to it being linear).
The Technology changes so use every 5 Year the latest Backup tech.... So you have a fresh copy of your backup... Dont forgot about changing Media/Conectors/Software and so on... A IDE Harddisk is already usable but witch modern Motherbord support IDE ??? It will be same with SATA.... So keep you older Copies but go for the latest affordable technology....
Dont Forget 3 Copys are 1 Backup, set on 3 different Technologies and Physical different Places. So it must be relativelly save.
Ideally, you should store all your written M-Discs in a 'disaster proof' safe which is fireproof, heatproof and watertight. ;-)
Better still, why not store multiple copies in totally separate locations?
Basically an airplane blackbox?
Under the sea?🤣
@@raiogelato6921 They make fireproof safes that are designed for this, but it is worth noting that it's more useful if you live in a smaller home where the firefighters can get to the fire quickly, as they are more fire resistant than fireproof, but they will protect against water and heat, up to a point.
@@gazzarrr666 In a war or asteroid impact-type scenario, a disaster-proof safe (especially if stored in a basement underground, if such a space is available) would be invaluable, even compared to storing multiple copies in separate locations.
Do a 25 year update.
:)
Love your content man, just discovered this channel a few days ago. Keep up the fabulous work!
Or the 10 years challenge! :b
23 years to go.
I've got 25 year old CD's and DVD's that still work like they're brand new. Popped in an old PC game the other day and installed it... works perfect. Maybe 50 year update...
Nice. I did not known about the M-Disk. I would like to see a UV test of those discs compared to traditional DVD/BR tech too.
For optical media, it's spelled "disc."
Indeed, I think heat and UV tests would be more relevant than moisture and cold - unless you live in some cold climate.
I'm pretty sure the M-dics would be immune because it doesn't use a light sensitive die at all ... the DVD and other discs use some type of dye ... anyway that's my 2 cents
@@BlackieNuff Yep, cold isn't that bad for discs: chemical reactions that make the disk organic dyes decompose are accelerated by heat, not cold. A good rule of thumb is that for every 10 ºC increase, there's a doubling in the reaction rate.
I believe a UV test like what you are suggesting has been done by the US military and M-disc performed well under these circumstances. Here is a link to their report. www.esystor.com/images/China_Lake_Full_Report.pdf
Hiya! Found your vids "along the way" and I'm glad I did! You speak clearly and your audio and video are both very well done. Keep up the GREAT work!
Many thanks. :)
Thanks for the great video! People are starting to be aware of their pecious memories being wiped out … I have 3,5” discs, ZIP100 drives and of course burned CD/DVD and plenty of hard drives. The oldest data I have is over 30 years old on 3,5” discs and slightly newer on ZIP100s. About 80-85% still works, and it also could be the device I’m using for them all to not open. So, not all is readable anymore. I’m seriously considering M-Disc 100GBs for archiving memories for future generations. I’m sure in 50-years time, we’d still have CD/DVD discs and spinners around…since they are so plenty in the world.
100000 Subscribers! Well done, ExplainingComputers
Many thanks! :)
what? you are not at 1 mil yet ? wth !
I always thought that you were a big channel that has 10 million subscribers .
wow.
kaetty_7 You are very kind. :)
ExplainingComputers thanks :)
***** As soon as it arrives! :)
Yes I was on a dig in the ancient Londinium and we found a Sony CD101! I think it's on exhibit at the British Museum. We are working on a Pleistocene-era dig and hope to find a 'floppy disc' hopes run high...
:)
This video made my day :)! I came to learn more about the M-Discs that I now own for archival, but I came away with a much bigger smile and some LOL chuckles at your humor and your experiment! Thanks for your info AND all the fun :)!!
I like this type of video, talking about none mainstream technology stuff. Thanks!
Very interesting, thanks for the video.
I had not heard of M-Disc before. How about exposing the media sides to UV for a period of days to see if the media fades over time.
Great Video. I would like to see a UV test too.
LV_Woodturner Department of Defense has since done it's own set of testing. It's has withstood temperatures of around 176 degrees. in addition to ultraviolet light and liquid nitrogen.
Now keep in mind while the disc is certainly very robust. It can still break but as far as it being damaged through traditional means. That is much more difficult than a standard disk.
I've had dye based discs die in my car during the summer. It can get to 140°F in a car during the peak of summer and it warps the dye pattern. The M-Disc should survive.
Neither have I. I have a DVD writer in my PC and it's apparently M-Disc certified. It has M.DISC written on it and I've always wondered what that means! :D
Simo Hayha: Since BR/DVD (be they R/RW/M) is NOT magnetic media, magnetic fields would have no effect whatsoever on them.
Do the ultimate stress test, and use those discs as a frisbee. Aaah, my childhood days. Many discs died for my amusement.
Make great drink coasters and mobiles.
congrats on the 100k, you deserve the recognition :)
As for the m disc, I've noticed these were never really popular. Atleast not here in Belgium.
Which is a shame, because i quite like having disc backups.
"DVD player made by the Romans"... I think I'm in the right place. New sub! :)
Thanks for the sub -- welcome aboard! :)
@@ExplainingComputers I presume that making scale-mail armour from these discs would render me invincible, and perhaps nigh immortal?
A very interesting video. I had never heard of M-Disc before watching this video. Funnily enough I was looking for a robust backup solution and thanks to you I feel like M-Disc is a suitable candidate, now I know there isn't a 100% full proof method of protecting your data but this should offer greater security than a standard DVD.
i bought a pc with an m-disc dvd drive installed, but i didnt know much about m-disc technology,
now i know, thank you :-)
I am using M-Disc as well, and I have had great results with it. I have yet to punish my discs the way you did, but I am glad to see that they are as hardy as advertised!
new verbatim m-discs sadly are not true m-disc anymore
A 2009 U.S Navy project stress-tested (irradiance, humidity, temperature) M-Discs and several brands of standard DVDs over 24+ hours. All dye-based discs failed. The M-discs "were the only ones tested that maintained information integrity."
Accelerated Life Cycle Comparison of Millenniata Archival DVD
www.esystor.com/images/China_Lake_Full_Report.pdf
Very cool. Thank you for the vid. I actually hadn't heard of M-disk... and now that I've seen this I can think of several hundred DVDs and CDs worth of data that I should probably check out SOON, and consider consolidating and migrating.
I have not had optical drive in any of my computers for around 10 years. This might make me think about fitting one again. Thanks for the video.
+Stephen Morrish My new build dosn't have an optical drive either, hence why I'm thinking of using an external one instead.
Stephen Morrish M-disc has been out for a while now and nobody seems very interested in using it at this point. Because what is the point in having a media that last for 1000 years when it could be next to impossible to find a drive that still works as well as any devices using the same codec or file systems for that matter.
Stephen Morrish I have them on all and haven't used one in last 6 months. if you have good internet connection you don't need one.
When I initially built my PC last year I didn't include an optical drive, but now I have one. The same exact Blu-ray drive that's in this video, in fact. I don't use it very often, but it can be very useful on occasion. For example, I recently recorded a music album for a family member who plays piano. I used inkjet printable discs along with an inkjet disc printer and the result is almost professional.
@Elvis: I have a dvd writer that has the lightscribe function. It can use the dvd laser to etch really professional graphics on lightscribe cd-r/dvd-r discs. Christ knows where to buy em though, lightscribe doesnt appear to have caught on and thus the discs are uncommon and bloody expensive. Dont think I have used the drive for a few years now.
I'm relieved that M disks appear to be a solution to a concern many archivists no doubt have. For the archive I work for, all the data is either photo or individual digitizations of VHS videos. Having to transfer all the data already burned so far is daunting, but do-able. Knowing that it'll be "one and done" for any new data to M disk eases my preservation concerns until long after I'm gone.
A word of caution: in an accelerated aging test conducted by the French Laboratoire National de Métrologie et d’Essais, the resilience of the M-Disc was found not to differ significantly from other reputable types of DVD-R. Only the GlassMasterDisc survived the test without errors, but it is no longer produced (it was basically a DVD custom-made out of glass in a cleanroom environment). Silica discs (Microsoft) or 5D optical storage might eventually replace it.
And in 2022, it was reported that Verbatim no longer produces the M-Disc DVD-R's, and instead only produces a newer Blu-Ray version, which has never undergone independent accelerated aging tests.
i like that he freeze them and boil , that was fun test
I've been wanting to get one of these. So far I have been backing up old DVDs with new DVDs every decade.
I just stumbled across M-Disc late last week, thanks for covering it here.
My experience with traditional discs is that when stored under moist conditions for a long time, mold would get into the disc and consume the organic dye.
Stefan Noack don't store your disks in a rainforest then
OK That's not always the case, those of us that live in the south. Like Georgia or Florida in the US. We run into these problems. Or when I import older media from central and South America these problems are more common.
Hi, I have CDs with scratches in them like more scratches than you can count, and they still read fine, but the dye i guess....That would be a problem. I would just vacuum seal them.
The organic dye in the disc is in fact not bio-degradable. The "mold" you saw was probably just the metallic layer oxidising.
Main disc rot cause however is UV light, which breaks down the organic layer.
Evert Guzman I also live in a moist, warm climate. I have never had my discs mold. I back up all of my CDs and keep the burned copies in my car. They all work fine after several years of that. If you keep your discs out of sunlight, you really don't need to worry about much else.
8:18 - Broke my heart man. I've been saving for a time machine :(
:O
"This is not something to be tried unless you're incredibly stupid."
-Christopher Barnatt trying it, 2016
10:25
I'm sure nobody will care about the vast majority of my data in a few centuries (save perhaps local historians unearthing old photos), but it's nice to have a medium that is unlikely to fail at least in my own lifetime. Before too long, I plan to invest in an Mdisc compatible Bluray drive for backing up my most critical stuff to Mdisc, and the less critical stuff on generic writable blurays.
This was a very informative video. I'm wanting to do some long-term storage, and M-Disc makes a lot of sense for that purpose based on this video.
You know, like many folks I had almost forgotten about optical drives on a p.c !
Thought their days were numbered.
Remember when the first writable CD's came out? they tried to claim they were indestructible, eating your dinner from them, scratching with a Brillo pad etc.
But we soon found out they weren't that tough.
This video is very timely, as I was pondering how I should store some of my more worthwhile files long-term.
So far I have found hard drives, and lots of them to be a stop gap measure.
Heard of the M disc, but that's. all, so thanks for this video.
Amazed at the backwards compatibility, IDE ROM drive !!? WoW
It seems many of here are starting to think about how we are storing data for the long-term. Like you, I have slipped into relying on hard drives, even though the data on them is known to fade unless it is re-written every few years. I feel another video coming on here about how and why media fail, and how to try and prevent this occuring.
My first CD ROM was single speed, required a SCSI host adaptor, and If I recall correctly, cost £199.
I've Had WAY more data loss from mechanical hard drive failure than burnable media I consider it far more secure & that has tested true by a mile in the last 20 or so years.
Interesting attempted come back for optical media! I don't think I personally have used optical media in a computer for 10 years now - my last two computers haven't had an an optical drive. For long term storage though optical certainly seems a better bet than disk, flash or tape.
But the question has to be - what are the chances of having a working drive that would read today's optical disks in 25 years time? To illustrate the point, 25 years ago I was using floppy disks for removable storage. Granted these were no more reliable for long term storage than any other magnetic media, but just suppose somebody had developed a more permanent version - an M-Floppy. Fast forward to the present - how am I going to read an M-Floppy?
It's a problem as old as digital media. Nobody has solved it yet. I think your best bet for data you really want to keep is to store multiple copies on different technologies, and then refresh the storage onto new and current technology every few years, say each time you replace your computer.
If someone in 500 years time wants to read your M-disc, I'm sure they could find a way to do it. We can still buy methods of reading outdated storage methods today, people still sell cassette players and record players and yes, even floppy disc drives. It might be a niche item by then, but it would definitely be possible. ESPECIALLY if the disc was being used by historians or archivists.
well floppy disk drives are still made and sold...as well as Zip drives
How are you going to read an M-Floppy? Well he could, at 5:55 you can see that his computer still has a floppy drive!
CDs were around in the 1980s, so pretty good chances.
I use M-Discs to store my digital photo album photos. I use the Blu-Ray versions of the M-Disc.
The Ashens of technology! Nice vid.
exactly
He's more the techmoan of computer stuff, if you don't know who that is, look him up.
I know all 3 of them,I love their content,great side of youtube.
^ Indeed.
Glad to see you used solid state storage to confirm the discs reliability! 🤣
BD finally found its place above the floppy drive. Now for a 25 GB backup you will need only 1 M-Disc instead of 17362 Diskettes :)
That funky moist DVD looked awesome
"M" 4 completely mad, exquisitely mental and wonderfully entertaining; Bravo M captain.
Congrats on passing 100k subscribers.
May I ask, any news on your foot?
Thanks for this. My foot continues to be problematic. The surgery I hoped for and talked about here many months ago never happened, as when I saw the surgeon 17 weeks after the fracture, he found that the bone had not healed (and they will not further cut and pin a bone that is not healing). So I've continued being rather immobile ever since (it is now I think week 29) -- several doctors have basically told me to avoid doing anything that hurts, and to be patient. This said, I am now nervously venturing out a bit and hope to make some progress in the coming months. I even hope to film at tradeshow in about 10 days time. Fingers crossed! :)
i hope it gets better. sending prayers.
mike maynard Thanks.
Congratulations on the 100,000 subscriber milestone! Probably might try them real soon.
11:54
You say “Weird and Wonderful Color Patterns”
I say “Tryptophobia”
So the same test to commercial CDs and DVDs to see what their longevity is. I had water damage to 50 of my music library resulting in a white sticky residue and some smell of mold. Fortunately I have RIPs of them. Many of them were still playing at the time. I wrapped them in plastic storage bags and ser them aside until.I could find replacements. Some were out of print.
The glue adhesive and polycarbonate will die before the data layer
9:08 best ice cream ever, now thats what i called "a frozen disc"🤣
Hello, Chris!
Thank you for doing this video! I have been hunting for a reliable media storage, something that I can send to relatives and others (I do genealogy). Up to this time, all I thought was available were Archival DVD,s. This is wonderful to know about the "M' DVD yet I am a bit surprised that the price is not more expensive! I wonder if the storage level will increase as time goes on?? I had to laugh at a couple of other things on your video, Sharpies, for one thing, time machine for another. I live in the US and the world headquarters for the manufacture of Sharpies is down the street about 5 miles, many of my neighbors work there and regarding time machines. we do have one, its called "the bed!" You lay down every night and awake in the morning in the future!!!! It may not be perfect but a great start! I thought this would have been one of the first things you would have learned upon retiring from university! LOL!!!
Have a great day and keep the videos coming!
Rich
very cool video, thank your sharing. I had to laugh when you mounted a Blu-ray burner drive next to your floppy drive.
Awesome, so there is now a dvd that lasts longer then all the computers that will be able to read them!
probably 😉😁
There will always be computers able to read DVDs considering how prevalent the medium is, or at least some service to convert them into a newer medium. Even today there are many places that offer conversion of 8mm film into digital format. Say in 1000 years an archaeologist uncovers a box of m-discs buried underground, civilisation could be much more advanced than it is today and there will likely be information available on the dvd format and how dvds worked, so the data would be able to be recovered.
+Vercusgames
VCRs can stay dead, but record players keep rising like zombies. They're still in production. Importantly for records, they can be read even if you don't know how record players are built. All you have to know is that it is analog sound data in a spiral groove, and you can work out all the other details along the way. That's why the Voyager probes had gold-plated records attached for aliens to potentially listen to, as opposed to some other medium.
Cassettes are terrible archival media, even aside from the mechanical problems tape decks inevitably suffer with age. Records have a much higher chance of being readable in 50 or 100 years, and direct drive turntables don't even have belts to break.
tell that to vinyl...
I doubt that this will be a real problem.
IF I'm wrong (and all of us commenting here will be dead in 100 years):
Great job humanity, on screwing up the most imortant task:
Data Storage and retrieval.
3:34 M-Disc Christmas hahaha what ?
7:29 This is actually a tech-comedy show in disguise
*where's my popcorn ?*
10:28 Unless you are... ahahah
I really think that especially the end is fantastic! Good call on making a new take!
Hi it has been over 7years now, Do you still have these discs which you subjected to temperature and moisture extream in this video, Do they still work fine after 7years or have you noticed any deterioration.
Very informative video. I will be cancelling an order I just placed for a replacement DVD drive. Instead, I will be buying a M-Disc compatible Blu-Ray burner. Thank you for the information; allowing me to make my purchase a little more future proof!
Well done Dr. Chris, long video, but informative as usual.
Yacoub
dude , congrats on a 100 K subs ,however , you do deserve more , if i was able to describe your channel my description would be "the under-dog of tech channels ". keep it up , it will eventually lead to that youtube fame.
btw , this video really helped me know why when i was a child i had to buy 10 copies for one game on the ps2 , ahhhh , if this was just made back then.
Thanks for this -- I like "the under-dog of tech channels" label! It certainly feels like that at times. This said, both views and subscribers have really gone up since August. And they do say that the first 100K subscribers is the hardest goal to achieve on TH-cam . . .
ExplainingComputers maybe you should do collaborations with popular channels , suggestions : linus tech tips , austin evan and MKBHD. they are like the crew who actually enjoy building pcs and like that kind of nerdy/geeky stuff. (i kinda bet you already knew that)
Excellent video and videos. Congratulations on 100k subscribers!
I was told of a way to securely erase CD R discs that probably also work with DVD Rs. Since you can't rewrite over them to delete things. I would have liked to have found out if the M-Disk could survive that....
One cup that is microwave safe, put some water in it, then set the disc on top of the cup. The water is used to absorb the energy of the microwave without ruining the microwave. The foil that is inside the CD and the DVD will turn into a light show with little lightning bolts going around on the desk, making a unique pattern on each disc. Afterwards the disc will be unreadable....
An interesting methods. I usually just put a cutter through a CD or DVD-R if it needs to go in the bin.
@@ExplainingComputers
It makes pretty coasters....
Very Good Exploration Of Long Term Archiving
This is a great video - daft as it sounds every house could do with a M-Disc burner to archive their photos and videos which if they do not have something like you have showcased - all their pictures risk being "lost".
Hi! M-Disc was released in 2009. Today in 2024. Do we have statistics on reliability of this discs?
some people are trying this at home right now :-D
5:14 Mystery solved! I have that exact same bundle lying around in my cupboard for the 5 years!
I can hear the audio quality has improved since this lovely old video (not that the audio is bad for this video).
Edit: The quality is about the same when you do voice over.
Happy 100k!
Many thanks. :)
4:24 I have that exact Blu-ray burner!
It's funny hearing people say stuff like, there won't be dvd or blu ray players in 20, 100, or 1000 years or whatever. Are VCRs obsolete? Yes. Can you still get one if you need one....yes. As long as there is a need, those players will be around. Keep in mind that the government still has a treasure trove of data stored on magnetic media. Are there more convenient, faster, sexier types of media - sure. Hard drives and SD cards have a shelf life though. It's a matter of when, not if they'll go bad. Stored properly, CDs and DVDs will last a long while (I still have CDs that are readable and usable from the 1990s) because I stored them properly and have avoided humidity and scratches. Anyway, Mdisc is (currently) the most reliable form of media for data archiving. If it is important, make more than one backup and store it in another location.
I'd like to see how it last with sun light. I once had a picture CD go corrupt in a few days or weeks and I think it was because of light on it?
well youre not supposed to put ANY disc uncovered near or in sunlight but if that M-disc survived extreme moisture it would probably survive the sun too. As much as they cost though, I wouldnt chance it
The problem I had with mine over time was a kind of mold. The M-Disc looks like it has a better seal on the side? Another thing I would liked to see is if if the writable surface was just a smooth as a blue ray, and if it scratches easier or not.
did he get the silver play button
thank goodness i learned about m discs today!! this might be the solution for life time archieval of our data, its surprising to think that there are not many more options like this one considering how much data is being overproduced and stored in 21st century and all we have is temporary storage devices on the market also note that cloud storage comes with its own set of problems.
I have the same LG Blue Ray M-Disc Burner in my PC. The drive works great, and plays very well. I haven't yet tried the M-Disc burning as the discs are a bit expensive and not easily available without ordering online.
If I recall my drive was about $90, not a bad price considering its a blue ray burner with M-Disc capabilities.
Its like all your videos are one continuous video. You never age your hair always looks the same , same shirt , same video. You might be an alien.. Who else would need a disc to last 1000 years. That sterile white back round, are you on your ship. That being said your videos are very informative keep making them.
FIRST THANKS FOR THE FANTASTIC VIDEO…I LOVE YOUR TH-cam CHANNEL!!! SORRY FOR ALL THE CAPS …I HAVE VISION ISSUES!
I AM ALWAYS LOOKING FOR A LONG TERM SOLUTION FOR STORING INFO INFO AND FAMILY PHOTOS…THIS MAY BE THE ANSWER. I HAVE BEEN USING GOOD QUALITY THUMBS DRIVES
AND SOLID STATE DRIVES BUT I UNDERSTAND THAT THEY ALL HAVE ABOUT A 5 TO 10 YEAR LIFE EXPECTANCY WITH OUT REFRESHING THEM (REWRITING THEM BEFORE THE 5YEAR MARK)!
THESE M DVD SEEM TO BE THE BEST SOLUTION TO LONG TERM STORAGE OF DATA…FOR NOW!
I AM GOING TO BUY A DVD R/W M CERTIFICATE DVD BURN/PLAYER AND REDO ALL OF MY LONG TERM STORAGE.
Hello, Christopher. Is it possible by any means that you have access to these particular two discs now, after 5 years? Would be cool to test them!!!!
Just watching this now as I'm considering purchasing an m-disc compatible drive. Trying to change the way I save things like family photos, etc that will never be deleted, and I would not want to lose.
Happy 100000 subscribers
Very happy I am! :)
I heard of these long ago but damn 100 years le is awesome. I remember backing uo data on cds then dvds etc.
i put an M-Disc DVD in my cassette deck, and to my surprise it worked, it even did the 4K upscaling and sent me a 50% discount on my next purchase.. Just joking man, thanks for the video
But will it work in my 8-track cassette deck as well?
Of course but you must POSITIVELY hold your mouth right when you (carefully) shove it in ... forget 4K that thing will sport 8K 🤪🤪🤪
@@MrAlexandriaTech It should work with anything - it's effectively connecting with a "cloud" computer a thousand years in the future which then re-calibrates local reality parameters according to your needs. I use them to make espresso sandwiches which sound like Led Zeppelin.
Another manufacturer called Ridata also sells the m-disc
congratulations on 100k!
Thanks. :)
Congrats on 100k Subscribers! Thank you for sharing your findings on the M-Disc. I have an M-Disc drive, just no media for it. All of the shops I have checked, don't sell the media. So I may have to order it online.
Yes, M-Disc media does seem to be an online kind of purchase! :)
Thanks for the test and the video. Just a side note - the last time I checked a UV radiation (meaning - sunlight) was a much worse enemy to CDs/DVDs/BRs then a moisture in the air. So if I would to test a longetivity of these disks, I'd go with storing them an intense UV lamp for a few days, instead of freezing them solid...
I believe the point to all of this is: if you have a disc that is readable for 1000 years, than the few years you actually need it for is a much better bet. Give me a format that is rock solid for twenty years, and nineteen years from now I will rewrite the info onto the latest format and be happy.
put the m disc in the tardis and send it 1000 years forward to see how time affects it;)
Record players have been around since the 1800s and there is still a way to play them
100GB M-Discs, or any other type are sadly very pricy now, so most ppl will just buy harddrives instead. im hoping we will see those 1TB + discs soon we've been promised for a decade now
Remember when they were trying to up sell the new cd and dvd technology and how they were telling us your data, or movies, would last a "lifetime" on this media? Gotta love how the truth only comes out after their sales are up!
So the moral of this M-Disc is that should always have been in the making of CDs, DVDs and Blu-Rays from the beginning after all they were 1st advertised as lifetime storage, and that you couldn`t damage them even if they had scratches on them, indestructible was the term used back in the day. Now we have to pay for keeping our Data safe for Lifetime.
I would like to burn all my family photo albums over my lifetime onto one of these with pictures of say local headlines and then bury the disc somewhere in the hope that in 500 years or so someone digs it up and finds out what a sad life I lead. :-)
gary72carol61 I would not waste money to last a lifetime since there would not be a reader to read them after 30 years.
Yes, that is an excellent point. You will have to continue to migrate your backups to whatever new medium comes along. I still think that external USB HDD's are probably the best bet for long-term storage. Handled carefully, USB drives can be very reliable. (handled roughly, they might not see out the first week!)
Well upload them on the Internet.
m-disc's approach is not compatible with multi-layer discs, unfortunately that essentially restricts you to half the normal full DVD capacity, and one third the largest bluray capacity.
I wouldn't be so sure. You can take a CD pressed in 1982 and you won't have any problems playing it back in your UHD bluray player manufactured 35 years later. The popularity of optical media is being reduced by more affordable flash storage and high bandwidth network connections, but there will always be a need for offline storage, and optical media is going to be the cheapest form of portable/durable offline storage for quite a while to go.
Even if optical storage becomes more of a niche, it will likely still be a usable medium if you track down the hardware: you might be surprised to learn that most enterprise data archival is still done on tape, because tape is still the cheapest possible storage medium available!
Excellent video as always sir! BTW I'm captain obvious right now and want to let you know that the M stands for 1000 years. From the roman numbering system. I know I must be the 1000th person to mention this.
This was a particularly humorous video. Though it was a bit hard to pay attention at the start with that extended razorblade out and facing you and so close to your hand lol
Is the Data still sound half a decade later?
I'd never use a sharpy even if made for. I mean, if you really wanna take care of it, you put it in a jewel case, so there is no need to write on the disk, just write on the paper sleeve of the jewel case.
why not? the sharpie will not hurt the disc
@@SupremeNerd It does on some disks, that's why.
@@NintenloupWolfFR oh....i never had that problem therefore i can't relate. They do have marker pens just for Discs though
When we buy a motherboard, graphics card, monitor, printer the DVD or CD that comes in the box doesn't have a rainbow effect and it looks the same as the m-disc that you showed. I think driver disks that come with the products we buy also uses a disc that has an inorganic die.