Seperates are not necessarily better. If they're from the same company and the same time period, their seperates probably are at least a little better than their top integrated amp (if they make those too). There are integrateds from Luxman, Hegel etc. that would outperform seperates of all but the very best companies. If you took the exact same circuitry of an integrated amp and seperated it into two seperate chassis, chances are you would hear some improvement. Electromagnetic fields in each chassis would be less, since there's less circuitry and interaction. Lots of invisible stray fields of many kinds going on under the hood of audio equipment. However, with seperates you need an extra interconnect. Even the best interconnects lose some sound quality. The ones that are so so interconnects, they lose a LOT of sound quality. So it's conceivable that a seperate preamp and power amp that with a great interconnect is 30% better than the same companies best integrated amp, could lose it's 30% edge and then some, if using a cheap not so great interconnect. If I were the letter writer, I would be more apt to go seperates if I had a great quality interconnect. If I was one of those cable "doubters", I'd stick with integrated amps.
Some of the upper model integrated amps of the 1980s had connections on the back where you could bypass the preamp and use only the power amp section of the integrated amp. In effect making an integrated amp SEPERATES, so to speak. You could reverse also and bypass the power amp section and use only the preamp section. I always thought it would make an interesting discussion on which of those integrated amps had phono sections that would rival expensive gear of today. Or power amp sections that would do the same. Maybe there are some real sleepers out there on the used market. Some 1980s amps are still sonically relevant. Anyone who has Bedini, Audire, Threshold, Levinson, etc. knows that. Actually few people back then ever heard how good their integrated amp really was with those U shaped metal jumpers on the back. A stunning improvement can be made by throwing those U shaped things away and using a good interconnect as jumpers instead. The improvement is clearly obvious. There was a heated discussion of that on one of the forums. It was a good way for me to ferret out which forum users had "ears" whose opinion I might seriously consider in the future, and those whose opinions can be put aside (to the trash) as far as future reference. How many people read, who the post is from before reading the actual posts? That saves a lot of time and lessens buying mistakes.
Separates are always bulky , ugly , expensive and eyesore . Integrated are always very beautiful , lean design , never make your room cluttered , it's an art . Yes , my favourite are of course Luxman .
Luxman is one of my favorites also. An older company than most realize; they date back to 1925. Of course for many decades they made tube amps. In the 1970s when most integrated amps had a transistory sound; their L series of integrated amps was refreshingly free of that. I remember listening to a piano on a vintage Luxman integrated and thinking " my other amp might do frequency response just right, but this amp gets the sounds a piano makes, just right. No additives.They used great Sanken transistors, and were built well. Some say when Luxman sold out to Alpine their quality went down. But if you ask these people to name one Luxman model that wasn't really good; they can't. I can't either. I thonk Luxman always went above and beyond. Would love to hear one of their pre mid 1960's tube amps; whether integrated or seperates.
This question is an other example of many people being obsessed with power... and features for that matter. If that's your thing then Chi-Fi is the way to go.
If you are willing to listen carefully what he says, the answer is there. Like everything in life, do not expect the truth to be presented on a silver plate to you.
I own a Mark levinson 326s, Msb Select,classe audio mono blocks. Fantastic products exceptional quality. No need for the owners to make small talk like Paul
@@Mark-lq3sbI was misled into buying a psaudio power generator by watching his video. Paul is an influencer who is peddling products with questionable specifications. The claim of pure power is patently false. This opinion is based on my own experience which is a bitter one and several research papers on audio science review.
@@adv.rohitl.jbrasdesa2402 Your first mistake was to make a decision based on a video. Of course the maker of a certain product is going advocate their product, and never make a decision based solely on a TH-cam reviewer either. Let us remember, the ASR review only "tested" one of the power plants. There are three power plants in all. ASR bashes one entry level unit and then all of the ARS cult members cry-out that power plants are useless is a joke. Be leery of Amir and his practices. He has his own way of "testing". It's not always a straight-up foregone conclusion when equipment is "tested".
@@Mark-lq3sb you are very presumptuous that i made my decision based on the TH-cam video alone . I was misled by the specification shown on their website and the material sent by the distributor. You appear to be a proxy for Paul to shield him from constructive criticism based on solid scientific measurements carried out by Amir at audio science review. You are being silly to discard the review without any concrete scientific measurements to the contrary. For your information i spent a lot of money to buy the psaudio p 10 and have it burn. It does not do what it says my words are from my experience while you are paying lip service as a proxy for paul. Educate yourself do not discard the reviews done by Amir from audio science review or waste your hard earned money on paul and psaudio . Who cares. Hope you get the message . Period.
@@adv.rohitl.jbrasdesa2402 If I'm a "proxy to Paul" then what is your position here? A cry baby? Someone that comes to this channel just to bitch and moan? This isn't the first time you've been here and all you comment about is your "problem" Since no other manufactures have TH-cam channels where you can "vent" do you send emails, write letters or make phone calls when you're not satisfied with their products? I highly doubt that. I think you should re-read your first sentence in your first reply to me or I can repeat it for you... "I was misled into buying psaudio power regenerator by watching his video." Then your last reply states... "you are very presumptuous that i made my decision on the TH-cam video alone." You're contradicting yourself. How come we don't hear your whole story? All you can say is my P-10 burned. I spent a lot money and more complaining... By the way, I did some research on the internet. I can find complaints from people that own the Levison 326s preamp. One gentleman said he has problems with the volume control. Sometimes without touching the unit or the remote it will increase in volume. On the Audiogon forums an owner stated the preamp will intermittingly shut itself off. Yes, I looked into MSB Select DACs and Classe amps and found some problems. Also, in the past I've looked into audio equipment that I own, and yes, I found owners with certain problems. My point is there is no manufacture that has had a 100%, no problems record. That's just the way manufacturing is. ...and for your information I've had a P-10 and years later I traded it in for a P-15 with at least 10 years total between them of trouble free operation. Maybe I was lucky and you weren't. That's life or as we say in the States... that's the way the cookie crumbles. As far as Amir, you really need to do research about that channel. It's not just my opinion, many people have commented on his "practices." Personally, I agree specs are important, but it's not the whole story. Remember, audio sound and equipment can be very "subjective" One person loves the sound of a particular piece and another person absolutely hates the sound from that particular piece. Some people swear by tube audio equipment even though it defiantly doesn't have the advantages of solid state and the specs surly don't add-up either. By the way, if you think you've spent a lot of money I too have spent thousands and thousands and thousands of U.S. Dollars on high-end audio equipment. I consider myself very lucky to have the money to spend on this luxury. Considering there are people on this Earth that can't feed themselves.
Buy a good integrated and save yourself interconnect clutter including mains leads, mismatching and possible hum. For the same quality and specifications of an integrated compared to separates, the integrated would cost less.
I had an integrated amp and bought a new high-end separates system. Side-by-side with careful attention to volume in an A/B comparison (blind to me) the integrated could sound better or worse than the separates with different equalization settings. The bottom line is that if you have a good integrated amp, spending money on upgrading speakers is a better investment than spending the money on separates.
Integrated Amps do have an advantage no1 talks about and that is they have the closest signal path and they have less Cables that pick RF ' all cables pic up RF ' Integrated Amps have came a long ways !
Thank you for your honesty, Paul. As a guy who makes his livelihood from separates, your answer was unbiased and fair. Always appreciate your insight and wisdom. Keep up the great work!
@@ryanray6215 Not an employee of PS audio Just a fan of the quality products that I can get from them and the sound that I get from my system and the customer service they provide.
So in other words, you are NOT getting the best quality from PS Audio unless you're spending the big bucks! According to Paul, if you don't have a lot of cash you're getting the trash😮
@@ryanray6215 Ok, as the kids say... whatever. Maybe you should be educated... Do you realize that almost all manufactures produce a good, better and best line? This is to accommodate different budgets. Pretty simple, if a customer can't afford the best or the better maybe they can afford the good. It's rather obvious that said manufacturer isn't going to be able to spend the same amount of money on every product in the good, better and best category. Meaning that said products will differ in the quality of the parts used.
The advantage of a separates system is the ability to interchange the amplifier combinations. You can select different manufactures for the pre-amp and a power amplifier. This can help realise the desired tonality for the system. One of the current trends is to use a valve (tube) pre-amp with a Class D power amplifier. For a digital source system, you can opt to use a DAC with a volume control / buffer output stage and directly feed the power amplifier. Unfortunately, the money saved on the pre-amp disappears into the more expensive DAC. The question in the video was about price points within the general audio market. Not all audiophiles can afford to buy PS Audio references systems. If you have a limited budget, then it worth considering mixing and matching components from different manufacturers. A good HiFi dealer will be able to demonstrate the synergy between the various components they sell (and / or your current equipment).
Yes some enthusiast's like to Frankenstein their systems with the goal of generating a desired tonality. More power to them. This is an amazing hobby but gets pricey quick. Let's please refrain from claiming that this is a better system for obtaining reference quality playback systems. I guarantee that you combine A PS Audio MKII DAC with their top preamp that was designed specifically to work in concert with each other, will outperform any combination you come up with, handily in the sheer sound quality department. Proprietary designs will almost always outperform other types of systems. This is very important if your goals are to get into an 80%+ reference quality system.
@@lexicon612 Please identify the section of text in my comment that makes any claim regarding the superiority of a mix and match system build. This is just an alternative approach that can yield good results if applied carefully and with the help of a good HiFi dealer. There was no intent to undermine the purist single manufacturer approach or to affront owners of PS Audio reference quality playback systems.
@@SteveD-m6z The PS Audio robust used market afforded me a MKII DAC & an S-300 Amp. $2100.00 total investment and have never looked back. I would say that the mixing & matching different components from multiple manufacturer's (to obtain a certain tonality) is more for the seasoned guy. Meant no disrespect. The goal should always be component's designed for each other, whenever financially possible. imho. Thank you for your thoughtful reply.
Oh boy. My Integrated NAD M32, a Stereophile class A component, does the job of 3-4-5 boxes at a fraction of the price, and I don't have to think about matching and cables. Just power it up and enjoy. I get it. If you have a bottomless bank account, I'm sure separates can be better, but you're going to pay
Personally, I prefer separates. Usually they have less interference. I also believe it is easier for a company to do one thing really well if they do not need to do many things and put everything in one small box. It also has an additional benefit in that I can switch out one box (the streamer, the DAC, the preamp or the amp) to tweak the sound signature. The only downsides I see are: * it costs more. * it takes up more space. * you need buy more interconnects, which, again, costs more.
If we're talking about receivers. Get your stereo pair off the receiver and those things will "wake up"! Seriously these improvements are not even audiophile grade changes THEY ARE the difference between a boom box and headphones Also every other speaker in the chain will now too because 70% of the work is taken care of by an external amplifier now.
Receivers are overrated and overpriced. I wouldnt pay more than 500 USD to any receiver. All in one receivers are not the same quality as separates, that's for sure
Rarely is there a post where not a thing makes sense, like this one. Someone might have taught him to speak the language wrong. Oh well, the stereo pair is divorcing itself from the boombox's canopy and it's kaleidoscope is taking a bath with a seasoned fern.
There are some pretty high-end integrated amps on the market. I'd put a $24k T+A PA3100HV class-AB integrated up against a lot of separates.(RMS output per channel into 8 Ohms 300 watts, RMS output per channel into 4 Ohms 500 watts, Peak output into 8 Ohms 380 watts, Peak output into 4 Ohms 700 watts, Power bandwidth 1Hz - 150kHz, Frequency response + 0 / - 3 dB 0.5Hz - 180kHz, Signal/noise ratio > 115dB, Total harmonic distortion
Nice, Paul already answered the question on his channel at least 7 times, and in all these years he comes to the same conclusions... ;-) One main theme is "integrateds are built to a price", but my wild guess would be that even monoblocks and pre-amps of the BHK line are built to a price. This point would maybe deserve some remarks in the next / future video episode about the pre/power vs. integrated series.
Sorry, I used to be the guy who thought separates were better but using PS audio as an example the strata integrated sounds way better than the stellar stacks. Sorry Paul this is the first time I disagree with you on your own products
In a “properly” designed integrated, sound quality and flexibility of use are non-issues. You just may not like the price of the unit, with its more appropriate, more costly physical design, and robust feature set. You’d also have to expect it a be a bit larger than typical integrated’s of similar output capability, due to its greater feature set, and carefully distributed and isolated electronics. It is plausible that there’s not enough of a market for it, as many people who really get into audio, seem to prefer as many separate widgets as possible to be more involved in their own personalized custom configuration. People also tend to be picky about specific features available to them on any unit, not only demanding specific features for their current or future use, but also not wanting to pay for features they have no use for, or even having those features contained within the existing design.
I feel that an integrated has advantages for sure. I would also agree that separates do not always sound better. That being said, your experience is really dependent on the make you come across. A lot of time you can find an integrated that sound just as good, a lot of the time not. My main rig is comprised of separates, even if I went with a top of the line integrated from the same manufacturer the amount of engineering and the resulting sound quality is not on par with their separates. That is the offerings from one particular company. Go with an integrated from another notable brand now we are experience units that easily goes toe to toe with their separates. Dovetailing on what is said here, I find there is no hard and fast rule. No matter what you are interested in, you will want to audition both approaches first and decide for yourself. IMHO, if you cannot tell a difference (Separates vs Integrated Amps.) save yourself some money and always go with the integrated.
This Is Kind of a Easy question if you want Real Good Quality you go for separate if you want to have oke end its easy fore all to use you go for integrated simpel bud i run quadral gold shogun accuphase c3850 diy pre amp bx2 advance paris mono blocks my dac is a diy TDA1541A dac usb optical end coaxial inputes streaming i work with tablet or smartphone on bit perfect or mqa cd player i have a b&o beocenter on stand It's just Amazing What You Can have if you build stuf yourself a couple of 100s Go A Long Way in diy audio 😅
Another viable response might be... Like integrated amps, power amps too are designed to a price point - sometimes a higher price point. Regardless, other aspects to consider include but are not limited to the fact that the greatest distortions crippling our components are induced by poorly-managed electrical and the poorly-managed mechanical energies induced on the electric current and input signal flow. Hence more component chassis' and power supplies implies more (not less) poorly-managed energies inducing more (not less) distortions. Another potential benefit of integrated is shorter wiring paths with fewer interconnects because every additional cable and connection is just more opportunity to introduce more (not less) distortions. And since most racking systems are less than stellar, one fewer shelf implies less opportunity to poorly manage mechanical energy and less opportunity to induce even more distortions. Assuming all else being equal, an integrated stands a far better chance of improved levels of musicality than separates. When it comes to genuine performance in perhaps any performance-oriented industry, less most always translates to more. However, the above does not apply to Class D integrated amps as that's a whole nuther story and Class D integrated amps should never be a consideration.
One power supply can be a weak link, and if multiple power supplies are used for amp and preamp sections of an integrated this can also cause problems being so close together in one chassis. There are pros and cons to both separate and integrated.
@@mitchtaylor6512 Agreed. However, in response to your example above, I'm pretty sure in many or most cases the pre-amp section borrows power from one of the 2 main channels in the case of integrated amps - at least in the case of some Class D int. amps. And even though there are exceptions the more common config is a single power supply serving L&R plus pre. One exception are Class D int. amps since it seems most Class D integrated amps are one amp per channel but they share a common AC inlet. Anyway, there seems to be significant potential for a continuously vibrating power supply to wreak some sonic havoc especially when those unwanted energies are poorly managed. In such cases, is it not better to have fewer rather than more power supplies with each potentially inducing its own sonic havoc? But even just fundamentally, isn't less always potentially more in perhaps any performance-oriented industry? Ever witness a Top Fuel dragster towing a U-Haul trailer down the quarter mile?
@@Paulmcgowanpsaudio Integrated as a budgetary decision is an outdated argument. Modern integrated can be found at unintelligible noise floor/interference. I'm surprised you don't know this.
I do know this, however, it doesn't address sound quality. Just because the noise floor is low that doesn't mean it sounds good and that was the point I was trying to make.@@kenhiett5266
@@Paulmcgowanpsaudio Yes, there are several integrated available these days that can go head to head with separates. You're making an objective claim about a subjective sound. I guess you could argue sound stage, but integrated can compete in this subjective opinion category, too. So which separates sound better than the Technics su-r1000 integrated, and why is your pick objectively better?
When you got an integrated amp, you dream about separates to see how sound would improve. Not the other way round. Yes, separates give you all the flexibility to play.
Seperates are not necessarily better. If they're from the same company and the same time period, their seperates probably are at least a little better than their top integrated amp (if they make those too). There are integrateds from Luxman, Hegel etc. that would outperform seperates of all but the very best companies. If you took the exact same circuitry of an integrated amp and seperated it into two seperate chassis, chances are you would hear some improvement. Electromagnetic fields in each chassis would be less, since there's less circuitry and interaction. Lots of invisible stray fields of many kinds going on under the hood of audio equipment.
However, with seperates you need an extra interconnect. Even the best interconnects lose some sound quality. The ones that are so so interconnects, they lose a LOT of sound quality. So it's conceivable that a seperate preamp and power amp that with a great interconnect is 30% better than the same companies best integrated amp, could lose it's 30% edge and then some, if using a cheap not so great interconnect. If I were the letter writer, I would be more apt to go seperates if I had a great quality interconnect. If I was one of those cable "doubters", I'd stick with integrated amps.
Some of the upper model integrated amps of the 1980s had connections on the back where you could bypass the preamp and use only the power amp section of the integrated amp. In effect making an integrated amp SEPERATES, so to speak. You could reverse also and bypass the power amp section and use only the preamp section. I always thought it would make an interesting discussion on which of those integrated amps had phono sections that would rival expensive gear of today. Or power amp sections that would do the same. Maybe there are some real sleepers out there on the used market. Some 1980s amps are still sonically relevant. Anyone who has Bedini, Audire, Threshold, Levinson, etc. knows that.
Actually few people back then ever heard how good their integrated amp really was with those U shaped metal jumpers on the back. A stunning improvement can be made by throwing those U shaped things away and using a good interconnect as jumpers instead. The improvement is clearly obvious. There was a heated discussion of that on one of the forums. It was a good way for me to ferret out which forum users had "ears" whose opinion I might seriously consider in the future, and those whose opinions can be put aside (to the trash) as far as future reference. How many people read, who the post is from before reading the actual posts? That saves a lot of time and lessens buying mistakes.
Separates are always bulky , ugly , expensive and eyesore .
Integrated are always very beautiful , lean design , never make your room cluttered , it's an art .
Yes , my favourite are of course Luxman .
Luxman is one of my favorites also. An older company than most realize; they date back to 1925. Of course for many decades they made tube amps. In the 1970s when most integrated amps had a transistory sound; their L series of integrated amps was refreshingly free of that. I remember listening to a piano on a vintage Luxman integrated and thinking " my other amp might do frequency response just right, but this amp gets the sounds a piano makes, just right. No additives.They used great Sanken transistors, and were built well. Some say when Luxman sold out to Alpine their quality went down. But if you ask these people to name one Luxman model that wasn't really good; they can't. I can't either. I thonk Luxman always went above and beyond. Would love to hear one of their pre mid 1960's tube amps; whether integrated or seperates.
This question is an other example of many people being obsessed with power... and features for that matter. If that's your thing then Chi-Fi is the way to go.
Manufacturers make more money with separates. That’s why they promote them.
Paul is in politician mode did he answer the question I don't think so
If you are willing to listen carefully what he says, the answer is there. Like everything in life, do not expect the truth to be presented on a silver plate to you.
I own a Mark levinson 326s, Msb Select,classe audio mono blocks. Fantastic products exceptional quality. No need for the owners to make small talk like Paul
So, why are you here making negative comments?
@@Mark-lq3sbI was misled into buying a psaudio power generator by watching his video. Paul is an influencer who is peddling products with questionable specifications. The claim of pure power is patently false. This opinion is based on my own experience which is a bitter one and several research papers on audio science review.
@@adv.rohitl.jbrasdesa2402
Your first mistake was to make a decision based on a video. Of course the maker of a certain product is going advocate their product, and never make a decision based solely on a TH-cam reviewer either. Let us remember, the ASR review only "tested" one of the power plants. There are three power plants in all. ASR bashes one entry level unit and then all of the ARS cult members cry-out that power plants are useless is a joke. Be leery of Amir and his practices. He has his own way of "testing". It's not always a straight-up foregone conclusion when equipment is "tested".
@@Mark-lq3sb you are very presumptuous that i made my decision based on the TH-cam video alone . I was misled by the specification shown on their website and the material sent by the distributor. You appear to be a proxy for Paul to shield him from constructive criticism based on solid scientific measurements carried out by Amir at audio science review. You are being silly to discard the review without any concrete scientific measurements to the contrary. For your information i spent a lot of money to buy the psaudio p 10 and have it burn. It does not do what it says my words are from my experience while you are paying lip service as a proxy for paul. Educate yourself do not discard the reviews done by Amir from audio science review or waste your hard earned money on paul and psaudio . Who cares. Hope you get the message . Period.
@@adv.rohitl.jbrasdesa2402
If I'm a "proxy to Paul" then what is your position here? A cry baby? Someone that comes to this channel just to bitch and moan? This isn't the first time you've been here and all you comment about is your "problem" Since no other manufactures have TH-cam channels where you can "vent" do you send emails, write letters or make phone calls when you're not satisfied with their products? I highly doubt that.
I think you should re-read your first sentence in your first reply to me or I can repeat it for you...
"I was misled into buying psaudio power regenerator by watching his video."
Then your last reply states...
"you are very presumptuous that i made my decision on the TH-cam video alone."
You're contradicting yourself.
How come we don't hear your whole story? All you can say is my P-10 burned. I spent a lot money and more complaining...
By the way, I did some research on the internet. I can find complaints from people that own the Levison 326s preamp. One gentleman said he has problems with the volume control. Sometimes without touching the unit or the remote it will increase in volume. On the Audiogon forums an owner stated the preamp will intermittingly shut itself off. Yes, I looked into MSB Select DACs and Classe amps and found some problems. Also, in the past I've looked into audio equipment that I own, and yes, I found owners with certain problems. My point is there is no manufacture that has had a 100%, no problems record. That's just the way manufacturing is.
...and for your information I've had a P-10 and years later I traded it in for a P-15 with at least 10 years total between them of trouble free operation. Maybe I was lucky and you weren't. That's life or as we say in the States... that's the way the cookie crumbles.
As far as Amir, you really need to do research about that channel. It's not just my opinion, many people have commented on his "practices." Personally, I agree specs are important, but it's not the whole story. Remember, audio sound and equipment can be very "subjective" One person loves the sound of a particular piece and another person absolutely hates the sound from that particular piece. Some people swear by tube audio equipment even though it defiantly doesn't have the advantages of solid state and the specs surly don't add-up either.
By the way, if you think you've spent a lot of money I too have spent thousands and thousands and thousands of U.S. Dollars on high-end audio equipment. I consider myself very lucky to have the money to spend on this luxury. Considering there are people on this Earth that can't feed themselves.
Buy a good integrated and save yourself interconnect clutter including mains leads, mismatching and possible hum.
For the same quality and specifications of an integrated compared to separates, the integrated would cost less.
I had an integrated amp and bought a new high-end separates system. Side-by-side with careful attention to volume in an A/B comparison (blind to me) the integrated could sound better or worse than the separates with different equalization settings. The bottom line is that if you have a good integrated amp, spending money on upgrading speakers is a better investment than spending the money on separates.
Integrated Amps do have an advantage no1 talks about and that is they have the closest signal path and they have less Cables that pick RF ' all cables pic up RF ' Integrated Amps have came a long ways !
Thank you for your honesty, Paul. As a guy who makes his livelihood from separates, your answer was unbiased and fair. Always appreciate your insight and wisdom. Keep up the great work!
I would imagine that countries like in the UK with limited space would prioritize space over cost in an integrated.
I have The Stellar M700's and wow it was like Putting a turbo and a supercharger on a Ferrari.. and my Sprout is truly amazing.. PS Audio for the win.
What speakers are you using with the Sprout? Thanks for any response.
@ArthurZazueta
Obviously you are a worker at the BS Audio . LOL
@@perlman7376 I'm using a 1985 pair of Klipsch 4.5s kgs. An absolute perfect match
@@ryanray6215 Not an employee of PS audio Just a fan of the quality products that I can get from them and the sound that I get from my system and the customer service they provide.
Separates are better. Less noise and interference. Like you and your wife decide to sleep in separate bedrooms after 6 years marriage
It seems like marriage gone wrong
Haha!! We love our space
@@MasterofPlay7 Sh*t happens when you are an audiophile...
@@hugobloemers4425or married
Hahahahaha
So in other words, you are NOT getting the best quality from PS Audio unless you're spending the big bucks!
According to Paul, if you don't have a lot of cash you're getting the trash😮
"trash" that's *your* word not Paul's.
@@Mark-lq3sb Paul said "sucker" not "trash".
@@ryanray6215
Ok, as the kids say... whatever.
Maybe you should be educated...
Do you realize that almost all manufactures produce a good, better and best line? This is to accommodate different budgets. Pretty simple, if a customer can't afford the best or the better maybe they can afford the good. It's rather obvious that said manufacturer isn't going to be able to spend the same amount of money on every product in the good, better and best category. Meaning that said products will differ in the quality of the parts used.
Hello,
what about the electromagnetical interference between the parts in an integrated vs separate. Does this have some infuence on sound quality?
I choose integrated, because fewer boxes and connections for me.
The advantage of a separates system is the ability to interchange the amplifier combinations. You can select different manufactures for the pre-amp and a power amplifier. This can help realise the desired tonality for the system. One of the current trends is to use a valve (tube) pre-amp with a Class D power amplifier. For a digital source system, you can opt to use a DAC with a volume control / buffer output stage and directly feed the power amplifier. Unfortunately, the money saved on the pre-amp disappears into the more expensive DAC.
The question in the video was about price points within the general audio market. Not all audiophiles can afford to buy PS Audio references systems. If you have a limited budget, then it worth considering mixing and matching components from different manufacturers. A good HiFi dealer will be able to demonstrate the synergy between the various components they sell (and / or your current equipment).
Yes some enthusiast's like to Frankenstein their systems with the goal of generating a desired tonality. More power to them. This is an amazing hobby but gets pricey quick.
Let's please refrain from claiming that this is a better system for obtaining reference quality playback systems. I guarantee that you combine A PS Audio MKII DAC with their top preamp that was designed specifically to work in concert with each other, will outperform any combination you come up with, handily in the sheer sound quality department. Proprietary designs will almost always outperform other types of systems. This is very important if your goals are to get into an 80%+ reference quality system.
@@lexicon612 Please identify the section of text in my comment that makes any claim regarding the superiority of a mix and match system build. This is just an alternative approach that can yield good results if applied carefully and with the help of a good HiFi dealer. There was no intent to undermine the purist single manufacturer approach or to affront owners of PS Audio reference quality playback systems.
@@SteveD-m6z The PS Audio robust used market afforded me a MKII DAC & an S-300 Amp. $2100.00 total investment and have never looked back. I would say that the mixing & matching different components from multiple manufacturer's (to obtain a certain tonality) is more for the seasoned guy. Meant no disrespect. The goal should always be component's designed for each other, whenever financially possible. imho. Thank you for your thoughtful reply.
Oh boy. My Integrated NAD M32, a Stereophile class A component, does the job of 3-4-5 boxes at a fraction of the price, and I don't have to think about matching and cables. Just power it up and enjoy.
I get it. If you have a bottomless bank account, I'm sure separates can be better, but you're going to pay
Integrated amps are probably bought more often to save space than money. They're popular in Europe, small houses, small apartments, etc.
Why bother with pre/power amps when integrates are now so good. Less space, less cables and less noise. Everyone's a winner!😃
Personally, I prefer separates. Usually they have less interference. I also believe it is easier for a company to do one thing really well if they do not need to do many things and put everything in one small box.
It also has an additional benefit in that I can switch out one box (the streamer, the DAC, the preamp or the amp) to tweak the sound signature.
The only downsides I see are:
* it costs more.
* it takes up more space.
* you need buy more interconnects, which, again, costs more.
Integrated as a budgetary decision is an outdated argument.
If we're talking about receivers. Get your stereo pair off the receiver and those things will "wake up"! Seriously these improvements are not even audiophile grade changes THEY ARE the difference between a boom box and headphones
Also every other speaker in the chain will now too because 70% of the work is taken care of by an external amplifier now.
HUH??
Receivers are overrated and overpriced. I wouldnt pay more than 500 USD to any receiver. All in one receivers are not the same quality as separates, that's for sure
Rarely is there a post where not a thing makes sense, like this one. Someone might have taught him to speak the language wrong. Oh well, the stereo pair is divorcing itself from the boombox's canopy and it's kaleidoscope is taking a bath with a seasoned fern.
Gimme a break.. Everyone always working to a price point .
in the very very niche high end, one does not target a price point, but rather a desired profit margin atop all captured costs.
@@grumpy9478 potaytoe potato
you've not been inside the biz at that level. @@shipsahoy1793
There are some pretty high-end integrated amps on the market. I'd put a $24k T+A PA3100HV class-AB integrated up against a lot of separates.(RMS output per channel into 8 Ohms 300 watts, RMS output per channel into 4 Ohms 500 watts, Peak output into 8 Ohms
380 watts, Peak output into 4 Ohms 700 watts, Power bandwidth 1Hz - 150kHz, Frequency response + 0 / - 3 dB 0.5Hz - 180kHz, Signal/noise ratio > 115dB, Total harmonic distortion
Nice, Paul already answered the question on his channel at least 7 times, and in all these years he comes to the same conclusions... ;-)
One main theme is "integrateds are built to a price", but my wild guess would be that even monoblocks and pre-amps of the BHK line are built to a price. This point would maybe deserve some remarks in the next / future video episode about the pre/power vs. integrated series.
At the end of the day, just about everything in is built to a price.... perhaps the exception is ultra-premium / ultra-luxury items.
Sorry, I used to be the guy who thought separates were better but using PS audio as an example the strata integrated sounds way better than the stellar stacks. Sorry Paul this is the first time I disagree with you on your own products
In a “properly” designed integrated, sound quality and flexibility of use are non-issues. You just may not like the price of the unit, with its more appropriate, more costly physical design, and robust feature set.
You’d also have to expect it a be a bit larger than typical integrated’s of similar output capability, due to its greater feature set, and carefully distributed and isolated electronics.
It is plausible that there’s not enough of a market for it, as many people who really get into audio, seem to prefer as many separate widgets as possible to be more involved in their own personalized custom configuration. People also tend to be picky about specific features available to them on any unit, not only demanding specific features for their current or future use, but also not wanting to pay for features they have no use for, or even having those features contained within the existing design.
What's the turntable sitting on; i.e. between the stand and (mostly) its feet?
I feel that an integrated has advantages for sure. I would also agree that separates do not always sound better. That being said, your experience is really dependent on the make you come across. A lot of time you can find an integrated that sound just as good, a lot of the time not. My main rig is comprised of separates, even if I went with a top of the line integrated from the same manufacturer the amount of engineering and the resulting sound quality is not on par with their separates. That is the offerings from one particular company. Go with an integrated from another notable brand now we are experience units that easily goes toe to toe with their separates.
Dovetailing on what is said here, I find there is no hard and fast rule. No matter what you are interested in, you will want to audition both approaches first and decide for yourself. IMHO, if you cannot tell a difference (Separates vs Integrated Amps.) save yourself some money and always go with the integrated.
And separates just look better. Two chunks of metal appeal to me more than one chunk and probably sound better too.
This Is Kind of a Easy question if you want Real Good Quality you go for separate
if you want to have oke end its easy fore all to use you go for integrated simpel bud
i run quadral gold shogun
accuphase c3850 diy pre amp
bx2 advance paris mono blocks
my dac is a diy TDA1541A dac usb optical end coaxial inputes streaming i work with tablet or smartphone on bit perfect or mqa
cd player i have a b&o beocenter on stand
It's just Amazing What You Can have if you build stuf yourself a couple of 100s Go A Long Way in diy audio 😅
So many great sounding and powerful integrated options nowadays. I'd go for separate only if I needed some tremendous power for a really big room.
Yup
Another viable response might be... Like integrated amps, power amps too are designed to a price point - sometimes a higher price point. Regardless, other aspects to consider include but are not limited to the fact that the greatest distortions crippling our components are induced by poorly-managed electrical and the poorly-managed mechanical energies induced on the electric current and input signal flow. Hence more component chassis' and power supplies implies more (not less) poorly-managed energies inducing more (not less) distortions. Another potential benefit of integrated is shorter wiring paths with fewer interconnects because every additional cable and connection is just more opportunity to introduce more (not less) distortions. And since most racking systems are less than stellar, one fewer shelf implies less opportunity to poorly manage mechanical energy and less opportunity to induce even more distortions. Assuming all else being equal, an integrated stands a far better chance of improved levels of musicality than separates. When it comes to genuine performance in perhaps any performance-oriented industry, less most always translates to more.
However, the above does not apply to Class D integrated amps as that's a whole nuther story and Class D integrated amps should never be a consideration.
One power supply can be a weak link, and if multiple power supplies are used for amp and preamp sections of an integrated this can also cause problems being so close together in one chassis. There are pros and cons to both separate and integrated.
@@mitchtaylor6512 Agreed. However, in response to your example above, I'm pretty sure in many or most cases the pre-amp section borrows power from one of the 2 main channels in the case of integrated amps - at least in the case of some Class D int. amps. And even though there are exceptions the more common config is a single power supply serving L&R plus pre. One exception are Class D int. amps since it seems most Class D integrated amps are one amp per channel but they share a common AC inlet. Anyway, there seems to be significant potential for a continuously vibrating power supply to wreak some sonic havoc especially when those unwanted energies are poorly managed. In such cases, is it not better to have fewer rather than more power supplies with each potentially inducing its own sonic havoc? But even just fundamentally, isn't less always potentially more in perhaps any performance-oriented industry? Ever witness a Top Fuel dragster towing a U-Haul trailer down the quarter mile?
Why can't you make a integrated that uses the same amplifier as your standalone?
We can and do. The problem is you then have to share that amplifier with the preamplifier.
@@Paulmcgowanpsaudio Integrated as a budgetary decision is an outdated argument. Modern integrated can be found at unintelligible noise floor/interference. I'm surprised you don't know this.
I do know this, however, it doesn't address sound quality. Just because the noise floor is low that doesn't mean it sounds good and that was the point I was trying to make.@@kenhiett5266
@@Paulmcgowanpsaudio Yes, there are several integrated available these days that can go head to head with separates. You're making an objective claim about a subjective sound. I guess you could argue sound stage, but integrated can compete in this subjective opinion category, too. So which separates sound better than the Technics su-r1000 integrated, and why is your pick objectively better?
When you got an integrated amp, you dream about separates to see how sound would improve. Not the other way round. Yes, separates give you all the flexibility to play.