Forgot to mention that in the vid. Admirer now accompanyes someone to make them astral and RB immune for a night , removing some negative effects as well.
Executioner is such a badass and fun role, but I agree it sucks for everyone the game. Somehow, you took my 2nd favorite role and made it way cooler. Seriously, the modding team for tos1 and tos2 never ceases to be amazing.
If there was one thing I preferred in tos 2 over tos 1 is lo being astral as there was nothing more infuriating than rolling lo and dying to a crus simply because I did my job. As far as baker goes, the change of it being both a pm and tav is interesting to say the least
I think soul collector change is my favorite. Not only is the role about predicting deaths, but now it can act as a mini exe to get an extra soul in a tough spot
I think it's important to note that you do know the roles of the heretics as Inquisitor. The way it's explained in the video makes it seem like the Inquisitor has no information about the heretics.
Easy way to fix invest, invest now checks to see if their target has the ability to kill. (Necro holders, rit, jinx, all nk, berserk, jailor, pros, bg, crus, trapper, vigi, dep, vet) I might be missing a few but this shouldn't affect jesters haunt or hex's hex bomb.
@@little_gremlin6778 Tos 2 changed invest because tos 1 invest was WAY too restrictive for evils. Basically you could only fake claim whatever roles was in your invest list. Berserker is literally a buffed juggernaut, even though it functions the exact same, just because it doesn't have to adhere by that stupid invest list it got. It's fake claim list is now a lot more diverse instead of being forced to always claim LO, or else risk insta lynching as soon as invest visited you.
Imagine all evils want to keep pretending they are town and the only townies die (sometimes there is just 1-3 town) and see neutral pariahs leave, then coven and neutrals know town is fricking evil
Idea to buff Invest while keeping it's current concept: If you visit someone who doesn't have blood, but is still capable of killing (whether they be TK, TP, Book Holder, Apoc, Arso) you will see that they have Dangerous items in their home. This middle option between blood and no blood should make it more reliable, and help it find targets like Apoc and the Book Holder that Sheriff can't detect. Edit: if this is too strong, Dousing and Bread can frame people as having Dangerous Objects.
@@giovarlin_31 but against non-killing Coven its useless, and causes a lot of false positives (especially if Dousing or Bread could frame people as Arso/Baker)
This will just end up outing fake claims too often, and will be harmful for the game. One idea I had was the option to leave a bloodhound at a player's house once per game, and similarly to how the new WW works, you will always learn if that player has blood or not each night
Ok Rethinking about executioner, i think i have a great idea for the role (hopefully not bad), please read... its great, i think!: Since the executioner's "torment" is about grabbing souls, an idea! The executioner (having this as charge ability or not ) visits a player at night or every moon like werewolf, roleblocking them and starting a vote with dead players and themselves at the target, their vote being 2 votes. If enough votes are "guilty" the target on the next day gets tormented. They win and leave town once they torment someone. They can also post messeages at night to dead players when they use the ability, seen by dead chat and the target anonymously like jailor, but cannot see dead chat themselves. Or maybe they don't roleblock the target and do not see the exe's messages, but they are notified of "you feel something will go terribly wrong tomorrow." and then be tormented at the end of day.
would "enough votes" be a certain fraction of the votes, or a total number of votes? because if it's the former... well, then they obviously shouldn't be able to act n1 lol
@@epikitee2186 i left it ambiguous because i didn't think much of it. But now that im thinking about it, maybe its all non DC town that can vote at night but dead players and exe have 2 votes. Maybe then the exe can try to exe 1 or 2 times, and if they all fail, maybe like TOS1 they turn jester and can win... but as a jester instead. but now i d k. The idea I thought for the role is that as an "executioner" and someone that torments souls or something, the "lore" of this role is like those necromacer rituals where the ghosts can take revenge of the one that killed them through the EXE (but also can vote anyone as theyre raging, or because why not.) Like Exe becomes an evil medium or something.
DUDE, I LITERALLY UNDERSTOOD FIRST TRY WHAT YOU WERE SAYING ABOUT STARGAZER, I LITERALLY KNOW THE CONCEPT It’s called Ascetic, and basically, it reverse roleblocks your target, roleblocking everyone that visits your target EXCEPT killers. God i’m so damn happy this is a role now.
I think the seer instead of not be able to check the same person for the rest of the match, his abitlity should have charges. Cos either way you are going to end the game without being able to check anyone
And idk, but maybe to give invest some power, it could be merged with TOS1 spy. It could invest someones house to find blood and see 1 coven visit? Idk is hard to find something uselful
Executioner rework idea, pariah, gain a kill charge whenever a townie is lynched, can only attack a guilty voter, unstoppable if they hit town, wasted if they hit evil.
What would happen if death is recruited by jackal? (in the scenario death transformation happens) Also feels like if jackal dies before recruits, both recruits dying like admirer feels too punishing, perhaps tweak it so recruits no longer die if their companion dies in anyway (if jackal died first)
investigator: easy fix is just make it not affected by illusionist and enchanter. If any role needs to be removed it's illusionist not Invest Executioner: the reason it's the way it is, is because that's the whole point of NE now, they're meant to be roles that are swingy and chaotic so of course them having a target that is coven and then losing a townie for it is bad but that's the point! It's not meant to be about it helping or hurting factions it's about being selfish and getting your win and not caring about the other factions
Amnesiac: - Day ability: Attempt to remember a Town role of your choice. This is just ToS1 Amnesiac but 1 day faster, makes the role less pointless since now you actually get to choose your role again
Night ability: Hide at another player's house. - 4 uses. - If anything bad happens at your home while you are hiding, you dodge it (like in jail) - If anything bad happens at the home you visit, you are affected (like a rampage) - If you visit the same player twice, you will reveal yourself to them. You can only reveal yourself to 1 other player. Goal: Reveal yourself to another player and survive to see that player win. If you win or fail before the game ends, you will leave town or die of a broken heart. Role name: Survivor
Maybe something that invest could do is something similar to tos1, except with alignments instead of just roles, ex. It gives like “town killing/coven killing/neutral killing”, “town power/coven power”, “town investigative/coven deception” or something like that
Perhaps we can combine the ability of the Investigator with the Medium from TOS1? Make it such that the Investigator can talk with the dead chat while investigating for blood, and allow them to seance with another player when they are dead?
Idea: Detective A jailor and potion master put into one town information It has a day-time ability that allows it to interrogate someone at night and role block them. This does not prohibit visitors from visiting the interrogated target. The interrogated target can either choose to not answer questions (and is delt a basic attack if they don’t do so) or answer truthfully to a question of the detectives choice. The questions: “Can you kill?” “Can you give yourself defense or have base defense?” And “Is your goal eliminating all others?” It has 3 charges It also can gather evidence if it chooses to not do anything that night (1 passively and gains 1 for every attacker that attacks them). That evidence can be used to reveal 1 person for every 2 evidence. They can reveal multiple people a night, and the reveal ability is not counterplayed by illusionist or enchanter, but is stopped by smoke bomb. Not roleblock immune unless interrogating.
If you are a NP role and a day/game ending event happens, like hex bomb, or death claiming the souls of town, or say a doomsayer vs 3 town and one NP, if the doom dooms all 3 town then what happens, does NP win? Is it a draw in specific cases like this last one?
I think it specifically stops people from activating the ability, instead of stopping abilities that are already in progress (so, basically, jailor and pirate can choose their target during the day, but the ability only technically "activates" at the end of the day to lock in the player they chose. But, for roles like Mayor and Marshall, if they activate the ability before daybreak happens, they're fine)
You know, I just thought of a possible way of adding Investigator, by making it have VERY reliable information, like seer, but they are slow. Abilities: Inspect: You can check a player each night, which will help you know the faction that they belong to (Town Traitors will appear as Town), but you need to check a player twice to know their faction, and maybe they cant check the same player twice in a row, so they get really useful information, but it's a slow process. Town, Coven, and Apocalypse will appear as their respective faction, but I'm not sure if when Checking a neutral role they should know what subfaction they belong to. Maybe they have to be checked thrice to know?? This would be the way I think Investigator can be brought back and start strong, but not too strong.
You shouldn't be able to perfectly confirm someone by just going on them twice. Adding more nights won't solve the issue, it's the situation like with current Trickster - your only counterplay is to kill them before they do.
@@tipoima How about leaving a certain clue at the second inspect, like tos1 investigator? Edit: Hoe about, instead of knowing the faction, they know the subfaction of the role. Their results would be: Power, killing, support, protective, investigative.
@@craigmccune6066 I mean that certain roles woulf fall on certain ranks. For example, the clue of Investigative would fall on town investigative, but it can also fall on coven deception, the reworked plaguebearer, and etc.
Question. What happens if SC has 5/6 souls and they frame someone, and the same day, that person gets hung, do they transform into Death and wait until tomorrow to Armageddon, or does it just happen?
@@nicholasvogel9783 Marshal is cracked in the right hands, and considering the BTOS playerbase is a smaller more dedicated group of TOS fans the Marshal is usually in good hands anyway. Town can still stomp games pretty easily
Watching this video after playing a lot of current tos2, Im wondering how many of these changes got grabbed by the devs and how many are coincidental. Example: seer and psychic changes, etc. Like when I joined seer already couldnt use the same player more than once in a game, and psychics already had their visions swapped to start with good. Does anyone happen to know if its coincidence or is bmg taking some ideas from this mod?
Throwing really bad ideas idk. What if Exe was like a Ritualist who has to guess what role will be hanged to activate its ability at night and punish a random guilty or abstainer if it happens? Also bad idea i thought for roleplaying rather than balance: sheriff being buffed for an auditor-like ability that removes one charge if finds the target sus and if they have charges (you took the suspicious evidence) (maybe not being able to call others sus if they don't have charges as balance.) Then invest being able to guess the role bucket of the target? Or partially, like power or killing, or special, etc but not knowing faction. But these are bad ideas i had.
tbh I feel like having roles leave after achieving their win condition just makes the game more luck based as a loss or win is exlusively determined by your role instead of your ability to convince the third guy, also having neutral pariah leaving especially means they can't truly ally a faction since they'll leave before the game ends, limiting their possibilities in game... It just feels like it's taking away winning chances from the worst roles, making some like sk harder for no real need... for example imagine we have 2 coven, a neutral pariah and an sk, by leaving neutral just gives coven a free win, while if they stayed the game would still be open. The only reason kingmakers felt unfair is that people relied on their roles instead of their ability to persuade, and that some players just voted arbitrarely, removing such a core element of the game doesn't make it fair, if anithing it's the opposite, it makes it unfair on the roles without a team.
bro really doesn't know what explaining your position means. yes, the main point is that I liked kingmakers, the comment, however, was trying to explain why they were healthy to the game. You know that thing you should do instead of screaming at their face (like you probably do) when you are arguing with somebody about something, called explaining yourself? yeah @@Mattssz
@@hunterpeterson1495 yes, I'm advocating for kingmakers, the comment was explaining why I think they were healthy to the game, I have always seen them as a great way to balance certain roles and situations while giving everybody a chance
Because everyone appears as Jury evils can say any number they want even if they dont know Judge if they say all numbers between 1 and 15 they'll say judge's number
Not a big fan of the Neutral roles, but Oracle is genius and gives non visiting roles a better chance to claim TP. I can see Banshee being very funny. Love the interaction between Necromancer and Potion Master btw.
The only possible idea I have for executioner would be to punish the faction of who ever the target is, like if you target town you torment a random town, if you target a coven you’d torment a random coven, they’d the only idea I have for it but I’m not sure if it would balanced though
Tbh I had the suggestion of adding Oracle to the game. Not this one, it was a different version that I had come up with. I posted it near the start of January where basically it had a special interaction with Monarch. I'll copy and paste it here, but it was really cool to see you guys make a better version! New town support role: Oracle Unique interaction with Monarch for this role. There cannot be an Oracle in the game without a Monarch but there can be a Monarch just normally but no Oracle. So basically whoever roles Oracle will know 100% there is a Monarch somewhere but the Monarch will never know until Oracle comes out. Here's an example of the role card: Attack: None Defense: None Role: Oracle Faction: Town Sub-alignment: Town Support Goal: Hang every criminal and evildoer. Abilities: Visit a player each night to attempt to link with them. You will only link with the Monarch. Attributes: You will know what happens to the Monarch each night (kind of like a permanent Bug from Spy) but you won't know who they are until you link with them. (kind of like Admirer but if one dies the other does not) Now once the Oracle has linked with the Monarch, their ability changes. Attack: None Defense: Basic NEW ability: You may banish a player during the day with a Powerful Attack (they basically turn into a Deputy) If anyone would like to add-on or subtract anything from this idea, I would love to hear some feedback. Thanks!
does ethereal defense stop powerful and unstoppable attacks? (cl empower, ww, jester haunt, conj meteor, rit, doom, war) and does tricker store the strength of the attack? (so if trickster stores cl empowered attack can they deal powerful attack?)
me when Seer is useless after N7: also there's not really much content about CS games in BTOS2 I could only find one and that was pretty much SK -aligned CS in a game with CS Spy and Town SK, and coven won and somehow the SK CS tried swapping with the Coven and it was bugged or hit the dying vet here it is: th-cam.com/video/-2EPyjYqW6c/w-d-xo.html
Detailed Timestamps
0:00 - Intro
0:10 - Role Buckets
0:18 - Common Town and Common Coven
1:05 - Neutral Pariah
1:54 - Neutral Special
2:28 - True Any
3:08 - New Roles
5:22 - Oracle
5:58 - Starspawn
7:41 - Auditor
9:06 - Judge
10:22 - Banshee
10:52 - Jackal
12:24 - Inquisitor
13:11 - New Modifiers
13:18 - Apoc TT
13:37 - Necro Passing
14:06 - Teams
14:35 - Anon Names
15:02 - Balance Changes
15:10 - Amnesiac
15:29 - Deputy and Vigilante
16:22 - Investigator
17:04 - Lookout
17:36 - Prosecutor
18:38 - Psychic
19:05 - Seer
19:50 - Trickster
21:02 - Necromancer
21:42 - Cursed Soul
22:42 - Doomsayer
23:20 - Executioner
24:15 - Pirate
24:55 - Berserker
25:22 - Plaguebearer
25:57 - Soul Collector
26:28 - Baker
Forgot to mention that in the vid. Admirer now accompanyes someone to make them astral and RB immune for a night , removing some negative effects as well.
The pirate change is hilarious, yelling sea speak and playing mind games with your victim should be in the base game
Executioner is such a badass and fun role, but I agree it sucks for everyone the game. Somehow, you took my 2nd favorite role and made it way cooler. Seriously, the modding team for tos1 and tos2 never ceases to be amazing.
Its sad too because Exe is fun, but it harms everyone, an EXE could just kill two evils
Wait Tuba is actually speaking in a youtube video? What’s this?
He's talked in live streams before.
@@ProbablyGlowthose are on twitch, I’ve hopped in a few
He's talked in youtube videos before, such has his discussion of new roles on release of tos2
I also heard him laugh in one of his shorts
I think he talked in videos before TOS2 released, because there's some shorts of him from the original Town of Salem talking
If there was one thing I preferred in tos 2 over tos 1 is lo being astral as there was nothing more infuriating than rolling lo and dying to a crus simply because I did my job.
As far as baker goes, the change of it being both a pm and tav is interesting to say the least
Well uhh, LO is no longer astral lmao
I think soul collector change is my favorite. Not only is the role about predicting deaths, but now it can act as a mini exe to get an extra soul in a tough spot
I think it's important to note that you do know the roles of the heretics as Inquisitor. The way it's explained in the video makes it seem like the Inquisitor has no information about the heretics.
At the beginning of the game the inquisitor is told the roles of the three heretics
Mmhm yep yes uh huh right indeed sure thing absolutely correct that's the spirit
Easy way to fix invest, invest now checks to see if their target has the ability to kill. (Necro holders, rit, jinx, all nk, berserk, jailor, pros, bg, crus, trapper, vigi, dep, vet) I might be missing a few but this shouldn't affect jesters haunt or hex's hex bomb.
Or just have it be the original TOS 1's invest, invest has always been fine, no reason to nerf it to, ahem, "iNcRiMiNaTiNg EvIdEnCe".
@@little_gremlin6778 Tos 2 changed invest because tos 1 invest was WAY too restrictive for evils. Basically you could only fake claim whatever roles was in your invest list.
Berserker is literally a buffed juggernaut, even though it functions the exact same, just because it doesn't have to adhere by that stupid invest list it got. It's fake claim list is now a lot more diverse instead of being forced to always claim LO, or else risk insta lynching as soon as invest visited you.
Imagine all evils want to keep pretending they are town and the only townies die (sometimes there is just 1-3 town) and see neutral pariahs leave, then coven and neutrals know town is fricking evil
I can't wait for the NPs to leave and people STILL claim town because they don't know how to pivot xD
Idea to buff Invest while keeping it's current concept:
If you visit someone who doesn't have blood, but is still capable of killing (whether they be TK, TP, Book Holder, Apoc, Arso) you will see that they have Dangerous items in their home. This middle option between blood and no blood should make it more reliable, and help it find targets like Apoc and the Book Holder that Sheriff can't detect.
Edit: if this is too strong, Dousing and Bread can frame people as having Dangerous Objects.
Better sheriff then lol
@@giovarlin_31 but against non-killing Coven its useless, and causes a lot of false positives (especially if Dousing or Bread could frame people as Arso/Baker)
actually a good buff to invest
This will just end up outing fake claims too often, and will be harmful for the game. One idea I had was the option to leave a bloodhound at a player's house once per game, and similarly to how the new WW works, you will always learn if that player has blood or not each night
Kinda removes the strategy of not killing on a night you might be checked so you can appear good. And it really hurts arso's whole thing
New Role buckets 0:10
New roles 3:10
New modifiers 13:15
Balance changes 15:12
Cursed soul is gonna be wild
THE TRICKSTER OVERHAUL WAS VERY MUCH NEEDED AS TRICKSTAR WAS THE LEAST SKILLED ROLE OF TOS2
Ok Rethinking about executioner, i think i have a great idea for the role (hopefully not bad), please read... its great, i think!:
Since the executioner's "torment" is about grabbing souls, an idea!
The executioner (having this as charge ability or not ) visits a player at night or every moon like werewolf, roleblocking them and starting a vote with dead players and themselves at the target, their vote being 2 votes. If enough votes are "guilty" the target on the next day gets tormented.
They win and leave town once they torment someone. They can also post messeages at night to dead players when they use the ability, seen by dead chat and the target anonymously like jailor, but cannot see dead chat themselves.
Or maybe they don't roleblock the target and do not see the exe's messages, but they are notified of "you feel something will go terribly wrong tomorrow." and then be tormented at the end of day.
so a weird form of tos 1 medium... i like it.
would "enough votes" be a certain fraction of the votes, or a total number of votes? because if it's the former... well, then they obviously shouldn't be able to act n1 lol
@@epikitee2186 i left it ambiguous because i didn't think much of it.
But now that im thinking about it, maybe its all non DC town that can vote at night but dead players and exe have 2 votes.
Maybe then the exe can try to exe 1 or 2 times, and if they all fail, maybe like TOS1 they turn jester and can win... but as a jester instead.
but now i d k. The idea I thought for the role is that as an "executioner" and someone that torments souls or something, the "lore" of this role is like those necromacer rituals where the ghosts can take revenge of the one that killed them through the EXE (but also can vote anyone as theyre raging, or because why not.)
Like Exe becomes an evil medium or something.
Does anyone else miss the Mafia roles? I feel like there was more flavor being the godfather than being the coven leader
Honestly, I think the exe fix is just:
Whenever you target a nontown player at night, you learn thier true role, rather than making them your target.
DUDE, I LITERALLY UNDERSTOOD FIRST TRY WHAT YOU WERE SAYING ABOUT STARGAZER, I LITERALLY KNOW THE CONCEPT
It’s called Ascetic, and basically, it reverse roleblocks your target, roleblocking everyone that visits your target EXCEPT killers. God i’m so damn happy this is a role now.
Same its basically ss from tol which is one of my fav roles besides inq and possessor
I think the seer instead of not be able to check the same person for the rest of the match, his abitlity should have charges. Cos either way you are going to end the game without being able to check anyone
Yeah it’s basically giving seer six charges, or 6.5 but you cant half a role
Due to coding limitations, the maximum possible number of charges is 3 - so it would have to have 3 uses max 😓
@@NunnyNuggetis it possible to regain charges used?
And idk, but maybe to give invest some power, it could be merged with TOS1 spy. It could invest someones house to find blood and see 1 coven visit? Idk is hard to find something uselful
So Neutral Pariah’s win condition is evil victory or town fully dies off.
Finally! Wonder how long TT Rit's wheel is gonna be
Title should be: "Tuba Voice Reveal"
Not really a reveal, he uses his voice when streaming
@@Kiremba i know, i mean on TH-cam.
@@Surgeoniche's spoken in some previous videos as well, so that's still a no
@@NotSureIExist You must be fun at parties.
@Surgeonic nah he's just correcting you dude
Executioner rework idea, pariah, gain a kill charge whenever a townie is lynched, can only attack a guilty voter, unstoppable if they hit town, wasted if they hit evil.
What would happen if death is recruited by jackal? (in the scenario death transformation happens)
Also feels like if jackal dies before recruits, both recruits dying like admirer feels too punishing, perhaps tweak it so recruits no longer die if their companion dies in anyway (if jackal died first)
IIRC Death gives the win to whatever faction it's in
Death and Hex Master both win for their team - so a recruited version of either would win with Jackal :)
Cursed seer scrolls about to go up in price.
If Banshee has the book and attacks a target with defense, do they recieve both the deafened and protected feedback or just deafened?
investigator: easy fix is just make it not affected by illusionist and enchanter. If any role needs to be removed it's illusionist not Invest
Executioner: the reason it's the way it is, is because that's the whole point of NE now, they're meant to be roles that are swingy and chaotic so of course them having a target that is coven and then losing a townie for it is bad but that's the point! It's not meant to be about it helping or hurting factions it's about being selfish and getting your win and not caring about the other factions
Amnesiac:
- Day ability: Attempt to remember a Town role of your choice.
This is just ToS1 Amnesiac but 1 day faster, makes the role less pointless since now you actually get to choose your role again
Night ability: Hide at another player's house.
- 4 uses.
- If anything bad happens at your home while you are hiding, you dodge it (like in jail)
- If anything bad happens at the home you visit, you are affected (like a rampage)
- If you visit the same player twice, you will reveal yourself to them. You can only reveal yourself to 1 other player.
Goal: Reveal yourself to another player and survive to see that player win.
If you win or fail before the game ends, you will leave town or die of a broken heart.
Role name: Survivor
Maybe something that invest could do is something similar to tos1, except with alignments instead of just roles, ex. It gives like “town killing/coven killing/neutral killing”, “town power/coven power”, “town investigative/coven deception” or something like that
7:02 did i just get SCP 001 daybreak flashbacks
Perhaps we can combine the ability of the Investigator with the Medium from TOS1?
Make it such that the Investigator can talk with the dead chat while investigating for blood, and allow them to seance with another player when they are dead?
Lookout dies to Veteran now right…?
One important question for nerds, what's the Necronomicon priority on Banshee? Do they get it early or late?
Idea: Detective
A jailor and potion master put into one town information
It has a day-time ability that allows it to interrogate someone at night and role block them. This does not prohibit visitors from visiting the interrogated target. The interrogated target can either choose to not answer questions (and is delt a basic attack if they don’t do so) or answer truthfully to a question of the detectives choice. The questions: “Can you kill?” “Can you give yourself defense or have base defense?” And “Is your goal eliminating all others?”
It has 3 charges
It also can gather evidence if it chooses to not do anything that night (1 passively and gains 1 for every attacker that attacks them). That evidence can be used to reveal 1 person for every 2 evidence. They can reveal multiple people a night, and the reveal ability is not counterplayed by illusionist or enchanter, but is stopped by smoke bomb. Not roleblock immune unless interrogating.
Too OP imo
If you are a NP role and a day/game ending event happens, like hex bomb, or death claiming the souls of town, or say a doomsayer vs 3 town and one NP, if the doom dooms all 3 town then what happens, does NP win? Is it a draw in specific cases like this last one?
14:48: You are Giles Corey, an evil guy
I love the Seer nerf, I never heard anyone suggest this but it seems great!
These are amazing, I'd love a video on how to get these better mods/ game play
Can Starspawn cancel out a marshall lynch if it’s already started with daybreak?
I think it specifically stops people from activating the ability, instead of stopping abilities that are already in progress (so, basically, jailor and pirate can choose their target during the day, but the ability only technically "activates" at the end of the day to lock in the player they chose. But, for roles like Mayor and Marshall, if they activate the ability before daybreak happens, they're fine)
Im still waiting to see if starbound's Daybreak will work on Death's Armageddon (I really wonder if it counts as a day ability)
i don't think so, it is more like the TT hunt, but only 1 day instead of 3
You know, I just thought of a possible way of adding Investigator, by making it have VERY reliable information, like seer, but they are slow.
Abilities:
Inspect: You can check a player each night, which will help you know the faction that they belong to (Town Traitors will appear as Town), but you need to check a player twice to know their faction, and maybe they cant check the same player twice in a row, so they get really useful information, but it's a slow process.
Town, Coven, and Apocalypse will appear as their respective faction, but I'm not sure if when Checking a neutral role they should know what subfaction they belong to. Maybe they have to be checked thrice to know??
This would be the way I think Investigator can be brought back and start strong, but not too strong.
You shouldn't be able to perfectly confirm someone by just going on them twice. Adding more nights won't solve the issue, it's the situation like with current Trickster - your only counterplay is to kill them before they do.
@@tipoima How about leaving a certain clue at the second inspect, like tos1 investigator?
Edit: Hoe about, instead of knowing the faction, they know the subfaction of the role. Their results would be: Power, killing, support, protective, investigative.
@@cristianelizondo2477 i believe that only town has investigative, but other than that, quite interesting
@@craigmccune6066 I mean that certain roles woulf fall on certain ranks. For example, the clue of Investigative would fall on town investigative, but it can also fall on coven deception, the reworked plaguebearer, and etc.
@@cristianelizondo2477 oh ok, that's reasonable
Kinda crazy how 90% of these changes were made into the vanilla version of the game
Why make it neutral special and not neutral chaos like tos1? Fits better considering the chaos added.
Question.
What happens if SC has 5/6 souls and they frame someone, and the same day, that person gets hung, do they transform into Death and wait until tomorrow to Armageddon, or does it just happen?
So now cursed souls can make their own TT? I wonder how the pros will deduce who is the best town role.
So its all town nerfs and evil buffs??
Well yeah, remember this mod added marshal so it needs evils to balance it out
Is Marshal really that strong? I have seen it backfire easily, especially with all the TI nerfs
@@nicholasvogel9783 Marshal is cracked in the right hands, and considering the BTOS playerbase is a smaller more dedicated group of TOS fans the Marshal is usually in good hands anyway.
Town can still stomp games pretty easily
When I try to enter the mac terminal command to get the mod loader it says there is no such file or directory
What’s the default book priority position for Banshee?
Watching this video after playing a lot of current tos2, Im wondering how many of these changes got grabbed by the devs and how many are coincidental. Example: seer and psychic changes, etc. Like when I joined seer already couldnt use the same player more than once in a game, and psychics already had their visions swapped to start with good.
Does anyone happen to know if its coincidence or is bmg taking some ideas from this mod?
13:10 Does inquisitor win if they die before the heretics, but all heretics die?
No, same as exe. They have to live to see them die.
Throwing really bad ideas idk.
What if Exe was like a Ritualist who has to guess what role will be hanged to activate its ability at night and punish a random guilty or abstainer if it happens?
Also bad idea i thought for roleplaying rather than balance: sheriff being buffed for an auditor-like ability that removes one charge if finds the target sus and if they have charges (you took the suspicious evidence) (maybe not being able to call others sus if they don't have charges as balance.)
Then invest being able to guess the role bucket of the target? Or partially, like power or killing, or special, etc but not knowing faction.
But these are bad ideas i had.
tbh I feel like having roles leave after achieving their win condition just makes the game more luck based as a loss or win is exlusively determined by your role instead of your ability to convince the third guy, also having neutral pariah leaving especially means they can't truly ally a faction since they'll leave before the game ends, limiting their possibilities in game... It just feels like it's taking away winning chances from the worst roles, making some like sk harder for no real need... for example imagine we have 2 coven, a neutral pariah and an sk, by leaving neutral just gives coven a free win, while if they stayed the game would still be open. The only reason kingmakers felt unfair is that people relied on their roles instead of their ability to persuade, and that some players just voted arbitrarely, removing such a core element of the game doesn't make it fair, if anithing it's the opposite, it makes it unfair on the roles without a team.
This is just advocating for king making though
Literally just say you want kingmakers, this is just a really detail way of saying you want kingmakers lmao
bro really doesn't know what explaining your position means. yes, the main point is that I liked kingmakers, the comment, however, was trying to explain why they were healthy to the game. You know that thing you should do instead of screaming at their face (like you probably do) when you are arguing with somebody about something, called explaining yourself? yeah @@Mattssz
@@hunterpeterson1495 yes, I'm advocating for kingmakers, the comment was explaining why I think they were healthy to the game, I have always seen them as a great way to balance certain roles and situations while giving everybody a chance
NO KINGMAKERS
how is judge a counter to marshal?
what happens if a neutral pariah get conjured?
When Judge uses Call Court, what's stopping every Town member from just saying their own number in chat to out the Judge?
Evils confusing the others probably
@@giovarlin_31 The evils would have to know the Judge beforehand.
Because everyone appears as Jury evils can say any number they want even if they dont know Judge if they say all numbers between 1 and 15 they'll say judge's number
Can it be used without having full version?
You need to own the deed to the town to play the game, if that’s what you mean. F2P can’t play due to reasons out of their control
@@NunnyNuggetsad
Not a big fan of the Neutral roles, but Oracle is genius and gives non visiting roles a better chance to claim TP. I can see Banshee being very funny. Love the interaction between Necromancer and Potion Master btw.
The only possible idea I have for executioner would be to punish the faction of who ever the target is, like if you target town you torment a random town, if you target a coven you’d torment a random coven, they’d the only idea I have for it but I’m not sure if it would balanced though
My question is does trickster die to a WW rampage if they magic mirror the WW's target? Or does it completely absorb the attack
Yes, they die to the rampage unless they get protected, and yes, their target is protected from the attack.
Why cant we have Seer act like maid or handmaiden from ToL
12:26 so the recruits and the Jackal are their own trio faction
Tbh I had the suggestion of adding Oracle to the game. Not this one, it was a different version that I had come up with. I posted it near the start of January where basically it had a special interaction with Monarch. I'll copy and paste it here, but it was really cool to see you guys make a better version!
New town support role: Oracle
Unique interaction with Monarch for this role.
There cannot be an Oracle in the game without a Monarch but there can be a Monarch just normally but no Oracle. So basically whoever roles Oracle will know 100% there is a Monarch somewhere but the Monarch will never know until Oracle comes out.
Here's an example of the role card:
Attack: None
Defense: None
Role: Oracle
Faction: Town
Sub-alignment: Town Support
Goal: Hang every criminal and evildoer.
Abilities: Visit a player each night to attempt to link with them. You will only link with the Monarch.
Attributes: You will know what happens to the Monarch each night (kind of like a permanent Bug from Spy) but you won't know who they are until you link with them. (kind of like Admirer but if one dies the other does not)
Now once the Oracle has linked with the Monarch, their ability changes.
Attack: None
Defense: Basic
NEW ability: You may banish a player during the day with a Powerful Attack (they basically turn into a Deputy)
If anyone would like to add-on or subtract anything from this idea, I would love to hear some feedback. Thanks!
This is just townie guardian angel
Question about NP, what if the game end with a Hex Bomb or Death Bomb meanwhile there still town alive, does the NP wins or not?
NP wins
does ethereal defense stop powerful and unstoppable attacks? (cl empower, ww, jester haunt, conj meteor, rit, doom, war)
and does tricker store the strength of the attack? (so if trickster stores cl empowered attack can they deal powerful attack?)
1 - No
2 - Yes
I mena for exe make it like tos1 you can still pick your target but you just leave if you get it right without the death of a second vitcim
Bence ruhani defans durdurulamaz ve güçlü ataklarıda durdurmalı.
Bring back Medium when? XD
Bana neden exe in unhealty olduğunu anlatırmısın? Bence tos 1 haline donse baya balanced olurdu
YESSS TRICKSTER REWORK WOHOOOO
Yo tuba can you pls make f2p players be able to play BetterTos2 pls I'm too poor to afford deed
LOVE BTOS2
Does this mean Common Town can still have Deputy?
Also, are Mayor and Marshal mutually exclusive like in BetterTOS1?
Deputy is TK so yes it's in Common Town.
@@bmobmo6438Sounds like it doesn’t deal with as many of the problems as would be best then unfortunately, but I get it
Never mind, Deputy was made unique. Is fine.
So, is this official ToS2 changes, or is this from the modding community?
Its global modification for game. Not original game changes.
YAY
THE TRICKSTER OVERHAUL WAS VERY MUCH NEEDED BACK WHEN IT CAUSED 1F1S NOW IT WORKS LIKE BTOS2 ITS USELESS
me when Seer is useless after N7:
also there's not really much content about CS games in BTOS2
I could only find one and that was pretty much SK -aligned CS in a game with CS Spy and Town SK, and coven won and somehow the SK CS tried swapping with the Coven and it was bugged or hit the dying vet
here it is: th-cam.com/video/-2EPyjYqW6c/w-d-xo.html
Your voice is cute
Starspawn is pretty much Sellsword.
omg voice
Make Invest like Tos1 invest
Ah, you forgot about Sheriff! Oh well, there are fixes for that.
Sheriff sus list: Coven w/o Necronomicon, Baker, Plaguebearer, Soul Collector, Neutral Evil, Pirate, Enchanted players, Reaped players, not-youngest Vampires, Neutral Pariah
Sheriff inno list: Town, Coven w/ Necronomicon, Berserker, Neutral Killing, Illusioned players, youngest Vampire, Jackal
Not sure about Cursed Soul.
They changed Sheriff to find non-Bers apoc sus? I didn't know that, that's a great change. Unless you mean you wish they had done that.