Great video Warren! I've been using the RND 5059 (the older brother of the 5057) for years. To get the most out of the RND summing I've found it extremely beneficial to print every track individually through the summing mixer with some silk before mixing the song as whole with the unit. I usually accomplish this by having it as part of my tracking chain or before the mixing process go back and print tracks I've recorded else where through it (like drums). This helps make decision making a lot easier when mixing as everything has a nice transformer glow right out the shoot. Even on all plugin mixes. Another good use for the RND and a more obvious one would be to use it to help sum multiple mic'ed sources down to mono to use with single channel outboard gear or to just get less clutter out of your mix. I do this all the time while tracking guitars as I usually have 2-3 mics on a cab and need a mono source to run through compression and various EQs.
"I think I'd be mixing through this, and making my EQ decisions through this" - quote of the video, and yes, 100%. Summing mixers are great, but where you really start to get your money's worth is when you're mixing and doing gain staging through them in order to leverage all of that headroom and space. I mix through the Rupert Neve 5059, which I love for the dual busses and ability to run through Rupert's line amps on each channel for additional boost to the bus, but the 5057 looks and sounds gorgeous and is probably the right unit for most people who don't want the hassle of calibration and recall. I mixed on a Dangerous 2 Bus LT for a bit, which is also a great unit, but the sound of the mix bus, tremendous headroom, and the silk options really make the RND stuff shine. BTW - those red lights indicate that you're 2db from "clipping", so you can actually push it even harder. :)
Please tell me if the sound and space are different between 5059 and 5057, which is better to buy?5057 version is newer does this mean that it has improved sound characteristics?
@@MrRolan79 The 5057 is newer, but the components in it are not. The 5059 has more capability for tone shaping, as it has two separate mix busses with independent transformers and Silk circuits. It also has rotary faders with +10db of gain available, pan controls, and balanced inserts on every channel. This is a subset of the 5059, and when the 5059 is configured to work like the 5057, I expect they sound nearly identical. While it may be a subset, it’s the most important subset, and the way I expect the vast majority of 5059 users have theirs configured, so you are not really losing anything. The most powerful extra feature on the 5059 is the second mix bus which can be fed back into the first mix bus with a patch, allowing you to mimic the behavior of using a group bus en route to the main mix on a large console, with the added benefit of silk on that subgroup.
I feel like the options, two Silk options and trim, only limit a producer or mastering engineer to sounds that plugins are catching up with. Like Unisum, Gullfoss, PA Black Box, UAD 1084, Neve pre-amp and API summing - or Acustica Audio's Ivory and Gold 4 EQs or pre-amps at low settings. The difference between these and this Neve hardware, especially at more extreme settings on this reviewed unit, seem to match results I've found in the previously mentioned plugins.
@@RJ1J I would say that if you don’t hear the difference, or care about it, then congratulations- you have saved money and can be happy about that! To me, the difference is subtle, but every AB I’ve done always has the analog stuff jumping off the front of the speakers a bit more and giving me a better sense of width and back-to-front depth and separation than any of the digital models I’ve used to replicate it. It’s very close, but the ITB stuff feels like it recedes into the speakers and is a teensy bit flatter by comparison. All that means I get inspired more, because the analog stuff is what I grew up on, i like what it does to my workflow, it’s what my brain wants to hear, and that makes it worth the money for me. I don’t view it as limiting at all, ESPECIALLY not on the Rupert Neve units where you can control how colored they are or not. It’s another option to stack with other things. If it’s not for you, and you have a different way to like to get to your happy place, that’s awesome too!
Thanks Warren. I love how you teach. So much about your delivery is disarming. You are teaching us how to think and not making the conclusion for us. Love the real-time prints.
Thank you for your help. It’s difficult to tell on TH-cam. I’ll download the files and listen again. It’s a little saddening because if you don’t hear a clear difference over a popular medium, that’s kind of the target. It makes you wonder where to turn to for that next step in achieving a better translatable mix. Otherwise, you can sound great on a matched pair of speakers driven by mono block amps in a tuned acoustic environment but who else will hear that?
Great video. Having had the 5060 for 3 years now I can testify to the way it just works so well. And what you didn't observe as you were just putting an already finished mix through it was that if you mix into it, you end up needing far fewer plugins. This happened to me straight away when I started using my 5060. Fewer plugins means fewer phase shifts and faster results .. so extra benefits as well.
I built an almost identical summing mixer out of 8 Vintage api 325 cards accept mine has the addition of fully transformered balanced Mixbuss insert. It’s a great piece that sounds really good. And so is this new orbit!! It sounds great.
I just downloaded the prints and imported them to my DAW (thanks Warren for making these available). I have to say I'm blown away at the difference. The Orbit files are much more exciting and and want to "jump out" my monitors. I'm avoiding cliched adjectives here but they would all apply. I wasn't expecting to hear such a marked change, even without the silk settings. Unfortunately I now need one! Thanks for sharing.
Thanks Warren. One of the things I love about gear testing is that we also get to know more about how music is made. It is a journey which shows what can be done with what you have even though primary purpose is not that at all. I am learning alot through high end gear tests and user manuals in a way I never did before . . . It says much more about what it takes to have "that radio sound" . . . You see efforts of deep studies being showcased by manufacturer as an attempt to lead you . . . Whether you can spot the same or not it depends on how much you are focused on the creative process or the gear alone . . . It is up to you . . . Thanks from Mozambique
I am a fan of the 'New" Neve! They seem very "In touch" with being able to get the best of a retro sound with a modern workflow/twist AND at the same time allowing these same pieces to sound modern making then quite versatile! Rupert is a GENIUS! I'm sure he has help. but the guy is amazing!
I think of all the summing mixer shootouts I've listened to tonight, the Orbit sounds the best. I'm a huge SSL and Burl fan but you just can't deny the mojo Neve boards add to the signal.
I saw this unit just a few minutes ago for the first time in an ad, thank you for this video, I think I’m getting this to start going hybrid. Thank yiu
The first three lines of "One Nation Under a Groove" describe everything Rupert Neve ever designed. It was a sad day in January when the man who we all benefited from by turning the recording industry in it's head died at the young age of 94 1/2, and designed up until the day he got pneumonia dying shortly after. He designed the 1073 preamp 51 years ago and it's arguable still the best. Like his gear sounds, he seemed bigger than life. Just run your music through anything he designed and it instantly sounds like cotton was pulled out of your ears. Thanks for this review, not sure how, but I will get one eventually, and the AMS Neve set of 8 1073 preamps on a double rack mount with it to bring up my count to 20 preamps.
Thanks for actually sharing the files, I find that you are one of the few channels who actually do that, and it really gives me a better time comparing, instead of having to skip through a video in lower quality than the actual audio is. I like what it's doing, don't think I'd buy it for just that, but I could see that people who have a little more budget for gear would grab that to give their mix a nice analog touch.
I'm honestly a bit confused on the new products. The 5059, the MBC and the 5057 orbit. Would love to see a video on How would these products compare to each other, how to use them individually or together, and finally which one is the "one for you" or recommended as the one gear that would make the most diffrence?
Thank you for this incredible video. I’m buying this unit! I just bought the Neve 88M and I already own the Rupert Neve dual transformer box. This along with those other pieces of gear as well as my warm audio WA273 , I should have a great pro sound along with my Black Lion Audio modified Apollo Twin. I’m gonna win 6 Grammy Awards 😊
First off, thank you for introducing this product to us! I was fascinated by your demo, downloaded the files and was intrigued enough to order it. After experimenting with it for a while, I have come to the conclusion that, for what I do, pushing into heavy saturation is just way too much. Using the -6db outputs and triggering the clipping lights just occasionally, I find that it just buries too much fine detail in heavy saturation. My preferred mode is to use the main outputs (not the -6db) and use moderate signal levels. I find that if I print a really clean track through the Orbit with various levels of, for example, blue silk applied and then re-print that colored track through the Orbit again but with silk turned OFF, I get a really delicious signal. I can see myself printing individual tracks with various silk settings, then printing stems with silk turned off. Also, let the machine warm up for at least two hours for best results! I may just leave mine on all the time. Thanks again for pointing us at this unit!
Yes, I'm guessing a lot of people are going to hear this as a viable alternative to spending a lot on a console! I'm thinking they are going a lot of these!
I recently got a little 8x Unit Audio summing mixer. It is a very simple passive analog summing solution, with a 220 ohm output in order to connect to dual mic preamp to choose your color. I tested it into 2x Phoenix Audio preamp and into my Audient ASP 880, with very interting color and different result. I would test this Neve one, one day maybe, 16x channel + harmonic generation make it interesting. Thanks for your videos, I always learn a lot!
The girth and throw is similar to my RND 535 compressor. It turns my kik drum into a cannonball, lots of heft. Love how this summing box is entry level, they really have their finger on the pulse.... great vid thanks Warren!
The way this box makes sense: Do the rough mix or listen to a pre of the mix, to decide if the songs spirit/soul is of the “pop hyped upper mids” nature, or a more cozy weighty nature like old school Hip-Hop, and set the silk type to red for the first and blue for the second. Or no silk, if any of them just don’t work.. THEN start mixing. I prefer the RND Portico 542 tape saturation on the mixbus to this summing box.
Aside from the product I like the song a lot. I am pretty sure I heard something very similar to the drums and tambourin in th beginning on some of the songs from the 60s my dad sometimes listens to. But over all this song has a touch of 90s feeling to it, at least for me.
Turning on that silk blue started to sound like an Adele track!!! (Minus the vocal - not the same type of singer). This may be my first outboard piece.
I've got a RND Portico II Channel which I use to record a lot of stuff going in (with blue or red silk) and can't fault it. He's still making great gear.
I've currently been using a 5059 Satellite at the studio I work at, and it sounds amazing, but having the 5057 Orbit is a really really cool idea for having a slightly stripped back, and more importantly cheaper, summing unit :D. Great video as always!
Sounds amazing, I love that the peak level is actually a bit reduced, but sounds more dense, mixing through it from the beginning to work with that color would be even better, to control the low mids.
Yes, mixing through it would be the best way to use it, I chose this song as it had been mixed through my CADAC console which had been used purely for summing.
Excellent didactic video Warren, I'm using a summing Neve 8816 and I like your findings and analytic reaction on this 5057. As known a N 8816 does have a similar magic function ("W").. I love its impact on the natural sound colour and its spatial wide-openingsfactor. A bit more knobs to handle, like you said, there is more temptation. I felt the Silk blue/red of the demo very "dangerously" attractive. Impressive for me since I'm not 'allowed' to use effects like pushed saturation while recoding classical music ensembles... Great content Warren, learning a lot! Thanks.
Thank you for that detailed review/sampling. Just when I thought I didn't need any new gear lol. I got the RND 5211 a year and a half ago and it was the best investment I have made to my studio. It sounds amazing, is so simple, so clean sounding without being sterile and is capable of adding so many different textures as I record depending on how hard I hit it and how much silk is dialed in. I need so much less eq and plug ins to make my mixes shine since I've been using the 5211. Now to have this 5057 on the other end, oh I'm getting too excited...
Greetings, I'm looking at adding a summing mixer to my chain, but I remembered you suggested just running your mix through a pair of preamps instead. What's your thoughts 🤔? Would it be better to go with my preamps or rather the summing mixer is the winner.
Great video and excellent product! I've been always on the edge to get an analog summing mixer, as I love what NLS waves does to my mixes. This video tempts me a little bit more. Great content as usual Warren !
Wow, nice in-depth clip, I have a ssl xdesk for summing along with the ssl xrack g buss com stereo eq and com modules but it appears this unit has more tonal versatility. My hardware does basically the same thing on a SSL level but is able to add other hardware sonic options into the summed mix buss and or Inserted on the xdesk. I could put a RND 5025 or 5052 on the mix bus of the xdesk to get the silk sounds
I really liked the Neve flat version, but I think a lot has to do with overdriving the unit. Both silk are muddy to me. I’d be curious to hear the Neve against something like the Fabfilter Saturn 2 though. All lot of these tests always show big improvements to a non-processed in-the-box mix and I don’t feel it’s entirely fair. I’d like to see a third comparison against a more practical approach with a plugin. I think that would be more apples to apples and give viewers a better idea if the Neve is “worth it.”
You should put the master faders in the DAW at 0db and just dial the trim knob on the summing mixer back to get the richt level. This way you will use all the available digital resolution in DA conversion.
I’m still so confused by these units. I’d love to see a routing diagram. Do you only route audio to it when you’re done with the mix? Or are you going through it the whole time? Do I keep 16 outputs spare just to send them to this, then 2 back to my DAW? Or do I patch everything occasionally over to this? There’s a lot of assumed knowledge when these old boys are talking about gear 😅 I’m trying to follow 😂
It sounds soooo good! My critique would be I like the Blue and Red Silk - both! They should have put two separate circuits on it! Why choose, I'd use both, like a smile curve. Love it!
Hi Warren thanks for the video and multitracks for hearing the unit which is a great idea. There's however a problem with the multitrack if somebody want to compare with his own summing mixer : The tracks are raw (vocal with no effects etc...). When I feed my summing mixer with them trying to compare the result with your Neve printed tracks it's impossible because of raw vs mixed tracks.
I downloaded the stems and tried to make the "in.the.box.print" larger with plugins and STILL didn't achieve the depth and clarity of the processed stems. The flat stem through the 5057 is my favorite all around. Thank you for the stems. This also taught be first hand, perceived loudness. The closest plugin that got me perceived loudness and depth was the Solid State Logic Saturator plugin. Still didn't get there fully though. Fascinating stuff.
@@Producelikeapro perhaps you could address/explain a good workflow with this summer integrated into a DAW? I love the sound but am a bit concerned about over complicating the workflow. What do you think? Thank you
I always use it on the main out of the SPL. Basically as a "Master bus Compressor" I did not use it on singles tracks. In the master it works very well to "glue" the mix. I am not saying that because is a common comment you get on the subject, I said that because 70% of my clients expressed that in one way or another. They say that the mix sound like one compact thing, a few mentioned "glue", but overall they expressed in their own words how they felt the mix. It won't fix anything but make things easier to some extent. I have noticed an improvement on my mixes since I got it.
I don’t think I’m going to purchase this, but my Soundcraft Signature has the option for analog summing. I am going to experiment with that and see if I like it. Maybe even just as a “warmth” track to add back into my box mix. Thanks for the tips.
I recently bought a new interface the Steinberg UR-RT 4. Guess what it came with? Rupert Neve Transformer. It is a button you push to activate on each channel. Since using it I have noticed greater clarity but no bass boost. Maybe I will try pushing up the volume a bit more. (Let's call this the poor man's Rupert Neve system lol.)
Yes, quite a difference! I think it’s because the processes are non-linear. Summing a number of non-linear channels vs. linear summing in DAW and then applying the non-linear processing at the end. Not quite the same!
It's curious to use the red color for the high frequency boost and the blue for the bass with the "silk" fonction. The logic of the wavelengths would have been the contrary: blue (=high color frequency) for the high freq and the red (=low color frequency) for the bass.
Now, I'm not saying that it can't be a useful unit. I am a huge fan of all the RND products. But I downloaded the multitracks to this and level-matched them, and in this particular instance I am not sold. Perhaps it has to do with the source material being very well recorded in the first place, but the difference is very subtle. I feel quite confident that, with this session in particular, that I could get a very similar effect with a plugin quite easily. This is perhaps a unit you get once you have everything else that you could possibly need, and just want something subtle at the very end of the chain.
Hi Warren your videos are very convincing I just bought Apollo X6 heritage edition and will be buying the Orbit soon keep up the good work I'm so glad you made this video with great explaining thanks
Great song. Listening while doing dishes- and I’ll be dammed if I couldn’t hear a difference in each print on my iPhone! That little unit is kinda badass. I want one. Was looking at the 5056 centerpiece- but now I’m considering this one. Keep it simple! Great review!
Sorry to come off as a bit of a noob but I'm quite new to the whole audio hardware scene and am not sure I understand what exactly this piece of hardware is/does. I can hear the differences between the different modes vs the "in the box" etc. but to me, it seems like you could achieve the same effect with a master bus compressor+limiter? Could someone maybe explain what the main goal of the 5057 is? Cheers
Would be interesting to compare the Neve summed version, to just a stereo out going through it, I doubt a lot of the sound is due to the summing itself, then again Neve knows what he's doing. Should release a stereo transformer/silk box...
@@Polydarian It's seems to be a mystery wether running every track individually through MBP and then putting MBP on the MIXBUS. Would give the same sound as "summing" each channel togther through the orbit or satellite.
This sounds great! I would make my sum mixes through the blue. Mix through the red because of the high end on the vocals and the tail end of the reverb. Love the sound of the snare on the red. Great job!!! 👊🏾💯
Dear Mr. Huart, I think you use a vintage SLL mixer in all your productions. This is a Neve product. To your ears which of the settings the red silk or Blue silk most reminds you of your beloved SLL. SLL makes Solid State Logic BiG SiX Professional Desktop Summing Mixer. Could you do a video comparing the Neve vs SLL and the big six verses your awesome SLL mixer to see how close SSL came? Thank you for this wonderful content. By the way if a band would like you to produce them what is the proper way to get in touch with you?
I have a okay audio interface, an Apogee Ensamble Thunderbolt. If I were to step up my game in the direction of hardware, (love the idea of turning knobs and instruments glued together with analog magic), if my budget is somewhat limited, should I buy a Rupert Neve summing mixer (5057) or a bus compressor (5254) first? I guess you would recommend me buying a The Newton channel first, but I think the Apogee does this job pretty well!? And that what I need, with my budget, is something to glue it all together, like a summing mixer or a bus compressor. But what is most important in this regards? Summing or bus if I must pick one? All though I would like to build a Rupert Neve based studio in the long term, can I ask for tips for a great and not to expensive bus compressor, if there is any?! ;) The 5254 is twice as expensive as Newton and Orbit. But I am sure it’s great. Maybe I could manage to buy the summing mixer and a bus compressor. Any other things to consider? I use Ableton and Logic DAW. Thanks for your great video on TH-cam.
Could not help notice the Focal monitors in your studio. We also see a Genelec monitor as well. Are you reviewing the Focals or have they found a home in your studio?
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How would you use this in your mixes?
Maybe is Brad Wood User no. 1
Not an expert, but for me "inserts" are the only reason I would use any summing mixer. Anyways I'll watch the video at the end of my home office :D
I thought you weren't so hip on summing mixers?
Great video Warren! I've been using the RND 5059 (the older brother of the 5057) for years. To get the most out of the RND summing I've found it extremely beneficial to print every track individually through the summing mixer with some silk before mixing the song as whole with the unit. I usually accomplish this by having it as part of my tracking chain or before the mixing process go back and print tracks I've recorded else where through it (like drums). This helps make decision making a lot easier when mixing as everything has a nice transformer glow right out the shoot. Even on all plugin mixes.
Another good use for the RND and a more obvious one would be to use it to help sum multiple mic'ed sources down to mono to use with single channel outboard gear or to just get less clutter out of your mix. I do this all the time while tracking guitars as I usually have 2-3 mics on a cab and need a mono source to run through compression and various EQs.
@@bonafontciel download the tracks and listen for yourself and hear what you think!
RIP to Mr. Rupert Neve!!! He will definitely live on and be heard for generations to come!!! Well done, sir!
🕯️
"I think I'd be mixing through this, and making my EQ decisions through this" - quote of the video, and yes, 100%. Summing mixers are great, but where you really start to get your money's worth is when you're mixing and doing gain staging through them in order to leverage all of that headroom and space. I mix through the Rupert Neve 5059, which I love for the dual busses and ability to run through Rupert's line amps on each channel for additional boost to the bus, but the 5057 looks and sounds gorgeous and is probably the right unit for most people who don't want the hassle of calibration and recall. I mixed on a Dangerous 2 Bus LT for a bit, which is also a great unit, but the sound of the mix bus, tremendous headroom, and the silk options really make the RND stuff shine. BTW - those red lights indicate that you're 2db from "clipping", so you can actually push it even harder. :)
Hi Melissa! Thanks ever so much for sharing your process!
Please tell me if the sound and space are different between 5059 and 5057, which is better to buy?5057 version is newer does this mean that it has improved sound characteristics?
@@MrRolan79 The 5057 is newer, but the components in it are not. The 5059 has more capability for tone shaping, as it has two separate mix busses with independent transformers and Silk circuits. It also has rotary faders with +10db of gain available, pan controls, and balanced inserts on every channel. This is a subset of the 5059, and when the 5059 is configured to work like the 5057, I expect they sound nearly identical. While it may be a subset, it’s the most important subset, and the way I expect the vast majority of 5059 users have theirs configured, so you are not really losing anything. The most powerful extra feature on the 5059 is the second mix bus which can be fed back into the first mix bus with a patch, allowing you to mimic the behavior of using a group bus en route to the main mix on a large console, with the added benefit of silk on that subgroup.
I feel like the options, two Silk options and trim, only limit a producer or mastering engineer to sounds that plugins are catching up with. Like Unisum, Gullfoss, PA Black Box, UAD 1084, Neve pre-amp and API summing - or Acustica Audio's Ivory and Gold 4 EQs or pre-amps at low settings. The difference between these and this Neve hardware, especially at more extreme settings on this reviewed unit, seem to match results I've found in the previously mentioned plugins.
@@RJ1J I would say that if you don’t hear the difference, or care about it, then congratulations- you have saved money and can be happy about that! To me, the difference is subtle, but every AB I’ve done always has the analog stuff jumping off the front of the speakers a bit more and giving me a better sense of width and back-to-front depth and separation than any of the digital models I’ve used to replicate it. It’s very close, but the ITB stuff feels like it recedes into the speakers and is a teensy bit flatter by comparison. All that means I get inspired more, because the analog stuff is what I grew up on, i like what it does to my workflow, it’s what my brain wants to hear, and that makes it worth the money for me. I don’t view it as limiting at all, ESPECIALLY not on the Rupert Neve units where you can control how colored they are or not. It’s another option to stack with other things. If it’s not for you, and you have a different way to like to get to your happy place, that’s awesome too!
Thanks Warren. I love how you teach. So much about your delivery is disarming. You are teaching us how to think and not making the conclusion for us. Love the real-time prints.
Thanks ever so much Mike! I'm glad to be able to help!
Jump between (obviously YT audio wont be as good as downloaded tracks)..
10:59 - Flat Bounce
16:45 - Flat Chrous
15:54 - Blue %50
16:46 - Chorus
20:46 - Blue %100
21:37 - Chorus
25:29 - Red %50
26:20 - Chorus
30:06 - Red %100
30:57 - Chorus
Thank you for your help. It’s difficult to tell on TH-cam. I’ll download the files and listen again. It’s a little saddening because if you don’t hear a clear difference over a popular medium, that’s kind of the target. It makes you wonder where to turn to for that next step in achieving a better translatable mix. Otherwise, you can sound great on a matched pair of speakers driven by mono block amps in a tuned acoustic environment but who else will hear that?
@@onethousandtwonortheast8848 well I can for sure tell a diffrence, even on youtube.
Great video. Having had the 5060 for 3 years now I can testify to the way it just works so well. And what you didn't observe as you were just putting an already finished mix through it was that if you mix into it, you end up needing far fewer plugins. This happened to me straight away when I started using my 5060. Fewer plugins means fewer phase shifts and faster results .. so extra benefits as well.
Can you hear any sound difference between the 5060 and the Orbit? Or does the summing sound the same to you?
Any differences ? With the orbit ?
I built an almost identical summing mixer out of 8 Vintage api 325 cards accept mine has the addition of fully transformered balanced Mixbuss insert. It’s a great piece that sounds really good. And so is this new orbit!! It sounds great.
Hi Steve! Thanks ever so much for sharing!
I'm definitely getting this for my studio.
This is the cheapest Neve rack summing mixer that adds that studio console sound to your mixes.
Thanks ever so much for sharing
I just downloaded the prints and imported them to my DAW (thanks Warren for making these available). I have to say I'm blown away at the difference. The Orbit files are much more exciting and and want to "jump out" my monitors. I'm avoiding cliched adjectives here but they would all apply. I wasn't expecting to hear such a marked change, even without the silk settings. Unfortunately I now need one! Thanks for sharing.
I mix thru the Burl Vancouver and I absolutely love it!!!! I really love the way you can control how much silk you want on the Neve
Thanks Warren. One of the things I love about gear testing is that we also get to know more about how music is made. It is a journey which shows what can be done with what you have even though primary purpose is not that at all. I am learning alot through high end gear tests and user manuals in a way I never did before . . . It says much more about what it takes to have "that radio sound" . . . You see efforts of deep studies being showcased by manufacturer as an attempt to lead you . . . Whether you can spot the same or not it depends on how much you are focused on the creative process or the gear alone . . . It is up to you . . . Thanks from Mozambique
Always a blast checking you out Sir Warren, I really Respect you, because you have such a humble attitude bro.....
Thanks ever so much John
I am a fan of the 'New" Neve! They seem very "In touch" with being able to get the best of a retro sound with a modern workflow/twist AND at the same time allowing these same pieces to sound modern making then quite versatile! Rupert is a GENIUS! I'm sure he has help. but the guy is amazing!
He’s been dead for years bro 😂lmaooo
He’s only been gone 3 yrs and the post is from 3 yrs ago
@@jessezfrombostonshut your ase down real quick lol
I think of all the summing mixer shootouts I've listened to tonight, the Orbit sounds the best. I'm a huge SSL and Burl fan but you just can't deny the mojo Neve boards add to the signal.
That’s amazing to hear! Thanks ever so much for sharing
I saw this unit just a few minutes ago for the first time in an ad, thank you for this video, I think I’m getting this to start going hybrid. Thank yiu
The first three lines of "One Nation Under a Groove" describe everything Rupert Neve ever designed. It was a sad day in January when the man who we all benefited from by turning the recording industry in it's head died at the young age of 94 1/2, and designed up until the day he got pneumonia dying shortly after. He designed the 1073 preamp 51 years ago and it's arguable still the best. Like his gear sounds, he seemed bigger than life. Just run your music through anything he designed and it instantly sounds like cotton was pulled out of your ears.
Thanks for this review, not sure how, but I will get one eventually, and the AMS Neve set of 8 1073 preamps on a double rack mount with it to bring up my count to 20 preamps.
Thanks for actually sharing the files, I find that you are one of the few channels who actually do that, and it really gives me a better time comparing, instead of having to skip through a video in lower quality than the actual audio is. I like what it's doing, don't think I'd buy it for just that, but I could see that people who have a little more budget for gear would grab that to give their mix a nice analog touch.
Awesome stuff! I want one!
You’d love it Glenn!!
My brain read this comment in Glenn's voice.
you won’t regret it mine came In 2 days ago and it’s night and day difference.
The Red Silk at 100% sounded great to my ears. I expected it to sound overblown, but it doesn't.
Agreed Gerry! Thanks ever so much!
Red at 100% is thinning the mix a little too much for my taste but it still sounds really good.
I'm honestly a bit confused on the new products. The 5059, the MBC and the 5057 orbit. Would love to see a video on How would these products compare to each other, how to use them individually or together, and finally which one is the "one for you" or recommended as the one gear that would make the most diffrence?
Thank you for this incredible video. I’m buying this unit! I just bought the Neve 88M and I already own the Rupert Neve dual transformer box. This along with those other pieces of gear as well as my warm audio WA273 , I should have a great pro sound along with my Black Lion Audio modified Apollo Twin. I’m gonna win 6 Grammy Awards 😊
First off, thank you for introducing this product to us! I was fascinated by your demo, downloaded the files and was intrigued enough to order it. After experimenting with it for a while, I have come to the conclusion that, for what I do, pushing into heavy saturation is just way too much. Using the -6db outputs and triggering the clipping lights just occasionally, I find that it just buries too much fine detail in heavy saturation.
My preferred mode is to use the main outputs (not the -6db) and use moderate signal levels. I find that if I print a really clean track through the Orbit with various levels of, for example, blue silk applied and then re-print that colored track through the Orbit again but with silk turned OFF, I get a really delicious signal.
I can see myself printing individual tracks with various silk settings, then printing stems with silk turned off.
Also, let the machine warm up for at least two hours for best results! I may just leave mine on all the time. Thanks again for pointing us at this unit!
Wow this sounds just as big as when I had my WBS console. This is a must have!
Thanks Warren!
Yes, I'm guessing a lot of people are going to hear this as a viable alternative to spending a lot on a console! I'm thinking they are going a lot of these!
Yes! Love how powerful such a small unit can be!
Hi Daniel! Thanks ever so much for sharing!
I recently got a little 8x Unit Audio summing mixer. It is a very simple passive analog summing solution, with a 220 ohm output in order to connect to dual mic preamp to choose your color. I tested it into 2x Phoenix Audio preamp and into my Audient ASP 880, with very interting color and different result. I would test this Neve one, one day maybe, 16x channel + harmonic generation make it interesting. Thanks for your videos, I always learn a lot!
The girth and throw is similar to my RND 535 compressor. It turns my kik drum into a cannonball, lots of heft. Love how this summing box is entry level, they really have their finger on the pulse.... great vid thanks Warren!
The way this box makes sense: Do the rough mix or listen to a pre of the mix, to decide if the songs spirit/soul is of the “pop hyped upper mids” nature, or a more cozy weighty nature like old school Hip-Hop, and set the silk type to red for the first and blue for the second. Or no silk, if any of them just don’t work.. THEN start mixing. I prefer the RND Portico 542 tape saturation on the mixbus to this summing box.
Dude, that is HOT! I love it! I'm listening on my Sony MDR-7506 cans and it's phenomenal.
Thanks ever so much Matt!
The tambourine and the BV's (with their reverb) on this track are what I hear in my head when I'm writing songs... yummy!!
Wow! Thanks ever so much!
I wish we had a Neve/Produce Like a Pro partnership for member discounts. ;)
That's a marvellous idea!
Yes, please
I see you overdubbed the word Saturation. ;). I love your channel and how much you teach us! It clearly shows that you LOVE music!
Aside from the product I like the song a lot. I am pretty sure I heard something very similar to the drums and tambourin in th beginning on some of the songs from the 60s my dad sometimes listens to. But over all this song has a touch of 90s feeling to it, at least for me.
Thanks ever so much!!
Turning on that silk blue started to sound like an Adele track!!! (Minus the vocal - not the same type of singer). This may be my first outboard piece.
Fantastic! Thanks ever so much!
I've got a RND Portico II Channel which I use to record a lot of stuff going in (with blue or red silk) and can't fault it. He's still making great gear.
I really like it. The Red settings definitely has a more modern sound to my ears.
Fantastic!!
An electronic engineering buddy of mine made me a super clean attenuator. I use that into my Neve 1073 preamps to get a wonderful analog sound.
I've currently been using a 5059 Satellite at the studio I work at, and it sounds amazing, but having the 5057 Orbit is a really really cool idea for having a slightly stripped back, and more importantly cheaper, summing unit :D. Great video as always!
What features does the 5059 satellite have that make you most glad you have it instead of the orbit?
Sounds amazing, I love that the peak level is actually a bit reduced, but sounds more dense, mixing through it from the beginning to work with that color would be even better, to control the low mids.
Yes, mixing through it would be the best way to use it, I chose this song as it had been mixed through my CADAC console which had been used purely for summing.
The silk button and texture knob definitely add more colored saturation. I heard the mix as more full or dense if that makes sense.
yes, that makes sense and is well observed! Thanks ever so much!
Hmm. Felt in that silk. I add it to my dream wish list. Thanks for sharing
You’re welcome 😊 Thanks ever so much for sharing!
Always cool to tune in! Great work man!
Thanks ever so much!
@@Producelikeapro My pleasure!
Excellent didactic video Warren, I'm using a summing Neve 8816 and I like your findings and analytic reaction on this 5057. As known a N 8816 does have a similar magic function ("W").. I love its impact on the natural sound colour and its spatial wide-openingsfactor. A bit more knobs to handle, like you said, there is more temptation. I felt the Silk blue/red of the demo very "dangerously" attractive. Impressive for me since I'm not 'allowed' to use effects like pushed saturation while recoding classical music ensembles... Great content Warren, learning a lot! Thanks.
Incredible what one piece of gear can do for an ITB mix! So much character for the price!
Couldn't agree more! Thanks ever so much for sharing!
Such Lovely Separation going on without a doubt. Sounds good, Man.
it really sounds great, I love my RND 511 preamps, best money I've ever spent on audio gear.
Geeez, this thing sounds smooth- was originally looking at the Dangerous 2bus+.... but now, one must consider the 🧈 lowend of this unit.
Thank you for that detailed review/sampling. Just when I thought I didn't need any new gear lol. I got the RND 5211 a year and a half ago and it was the best investment I have made to my studio. It sounds amazing, is so simple, so clean sounding without being sterile and is capable of adding so many different textures as I record depending on how hard I hit it and how much silk is dialed in. I need so much less eq and plug ins to make my mixes shine since I've been using the 5211. Now to have this 5057 on the other end, oh I'm getting too excited...
i would love to combine 50% blue and 100% red for this song. BTW - after playing it so many times, this song has such a great Hook! I need more!
Thanks ever so much Chuck!!
@@Producelikeapro 100% Blue/50% Red for me.
Thank you Rupert Neve! :(
Greetings,
I'm looking at adding a summing mixer to my chain, but I remembered you suggested just running your mix through a pair of preamps instead. What's your thoughts 🤔? Would it be better to go with my preamps or rather the summing mixer is the winner.
This Rupert Neve one is pretty special!
@@Producelikeapro how would you compare this neve to the Burl Vancouver B32? Would it stand up against the Burl flavor?
I wonder how its results compare to those of the Silver Bullet.
Great video and excellent product! I've been always on the edge to get an analog summing mixer, as I love what NLS waves does to my mixes. This video tempts me a little bit more. Great content as usual Warren !
Does this have a transformer for each input, or just one for the summing stage?
Not the easiest piece of gear to get your hands on at the moment. Definitely looking forward to checking this unit out.
Wow. This is life changing.
Thanks ever so much Lucy!
That Saturation overdub was neat 👌🏼
Thanks ever so much for sharing!
Wow, nice in-depth clip, I have a ssl xdesk for summing along with the ssl xrack g buss com stereo eq and com modules but it appears this unit has more tonal versatility. My hardware does basically the same thing on a SSL level but is able to add other hardware sonic options into the summed mix buss and or Inserted on the xdesk. I could put a RND 5025 or 5052 on the mix bus of the xdesk to get the silk sounds
I really liked the Neve flat version, but I think a lot has to do with overdriving the unit. Both silk are muddy to me. I’d be curious to hear the Neve against something like the Fabfilter Saturn 2 though. All lot of these tests always show big improvements to a non-processed in-the-box mix and I don’t feel it’s entirely fair. I’d like to see a third comparison against a more practical approach with a plugin. I think that would be more apples to apples and give viewers a better idea if the Neve is “worth it.”
You should put the master faders in the DAW at 0db and just dial the trim knob on the summing mixer back to get the richt level. This way you will use all the available digital resolution in DA conversion.
50% Silk Blue 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
Total novice here. This was a great education.
Thanks ever so much for sharing! I'm glad to be able to help!
FORGET THE NEVE ! What a sublime composition and singing ! beautiful lyrics everything...who is this ????
I’m still so confused by these units. I’d love to see a routing diagram. Do you only route audio to it when you’re done with the mix? Or are you going through it the whole time? Do I keep 16 outputs spare just to send them to this, then 2 back to my DAW? Or do I patch everything occasionally over to this? There’s a lot of assumed knowledge when these old boys are talking about gear 😅 I’m trying to follow 😂
My word. That is exciting.
I wish I could afford it. This is beautiful. I love how full it makes the sound. I dig it. I want one.
I think I am sold now, this thing sounds amazing and love the form factor in a rack.
It sounds soooo good! My critique would be I like the Blue and Red Silk - both! They should have put two separate circuits on it! Why choose, I'd use both, like a smile curve. Love it!
Haha thanks ever so much for sharing Michael!
Hi Warren thanks for the video and multitracks for hearing the unit which is a great idea. There's however a problem with the multitrack if somebody want to compare with his own summing mixer : The tracks are raw (vocal with no effects etc...). When I feed my summing mixer with them trying to compare the result with your Neve printed tracks it's impossible because of raw vs mixed tracks.
I downloaded the stems and tried to make the "in.the.box.print" larger with plugins and STILL didn't achieve the depth and clarity of the processed stems. The flat stem through the 5057 is my favorite all around. Thank you for the stems. This also taught be first hand, perceived loudness. The closest plugin that got me perceived loudness and depth was the Solid State Logic Saturator plugin. Still didn't get there fully though. Fascinating stuff.
Thanks ever so much Antonio for your great comment!
Yep thats why i bought one never looked back less pluigns needed
Blue 100 hit me in the feels the most from the downloaded tracks.
Mix into Blue and post with some Red
1:53 nice edit :)
Very impressive product and results for $2000 !!
Thanks ever so much Steve! I was impressed as well!
@@Producelikeapro perhaps you could address/explain a good workflow with this summer integrated into a DAW? I love the sound but am a bit concerned about over complicating the workflow. What do you think? Thank you
I have a SPL Summing mixer. All goes to a WesAudio Dione Buss Compressor and I couldn’t be happier!
Thanks ever so much for sharing!
What are your thoughts on the Wes audio by it self on the master? Have you used it on singles tracks?
I always use it on the main out of the SPL. Basically as a "Master bus Compressor" I did not use it on singles tracks. In the master it works very well to "glue" the mix. I am not saying that because is a common comment you get on the subject, I said that because 70% of my clients expressed that in one way or another. They say that the mix sound like one compact thing, a few mentioned "glue", but overall they expressed in their own words how they felt the mix. It won't fix anything but make things easier to some extent. I have noticed an improvement on my mixes since I got it.
@@ELPLAK thanks for the answer. Seems good.
I don’t think I’m going to purchase this, but my Soundcraft Signature has the option for analog summing. I am going to experiment with that and see if I like it. Maybe even just as a “warmth” track to add back into my box mix. Thanks for the tips.
Thanks for sharing! Best of luck to you!
I recently bought a new interface the Steinberg UR-RT 4. Guess what it came with? Rupert Neve Transformer. It is a button
you push to activate on each channel. Since using it I have noticed greater clarity but no bass boost. Maybe I will try
pushing up the volume a bit more. (Let's call this the poor man's Rupert Neve system lol.)
Just curious if there is any difference between 16ch summed through the Orbit vs pushing the digital sum through any RND gear with silk.
Yes, quite a difference! I think it’s because the processes are non-linear. Summing a number of non-linear channels vs. linear summing in DAW and then applying the non-linear processing at the end. Not quite the same!
It's curious to use the red color for the high frequency boost and the blue for the bass with the "silk" fonction.
The logic of the wavelengths would have been the contrary: blue (=high color frequency) for the high freq and the red (=low color frequency) for the bass.
Whats the difference to the 8816 summing mixer in sound ?
Now, I'm not saying that it can't be a useful unit. I am a huge fan of all the RND products. But I downloaded the multitracks to this and level-matched them, and in this particular instance I am not sold. Perhaps it has to do with the source material being very well recorded in the first place, but the difference is very subtle. I feel quite confident that, with this session in particular, that I could get a very similar effect with a plugin quite easily. This is perhaps a unit you get once you have everything else that you could possibly need, and just want something subtle at the very end of the chain.
I can’t wait to hear this! Thanks warren!
Thanks ever so much!!
Fantastic review, Warren.👍
Thanks ever so much
Without the vocals, this could easily be a hidden track on Pet Sounds! (That's a compliment BTW)
WOW! Thanks ever so much!
nice overdub on 'saturation'!
This is such a beautiful song ❤
Hi Warren your videos are very convincing I just bought Apollo X6 heritage edition and will be buying the Orbit soon keep up the good work I'm so glad you made this video with great explaining thanks
Thanks for the detailed rundown! What's your da/ad on these tests?
RIP Rupert Neve
Very Spector-esque production quality
Thanks ever so much!
RIP Rupert Neve.
Man, everything sounds so great!
Can you describe the difference?
Thanks ever so much CrushingAxes!
Download the tracks to hear for yourself!
@@atomicrocker I think everything sounds warmer and fuller perhaps even a little bit wider.
Great song. Listening while doing dishes- and I’ll be dammed if I couldn’t hear a difference in each print on my iPhone! That little unit is kinda badass. I want one. Was looking at the 5056 centerpiece- but now I’m considering this one. Keep it simple! Great review!
Would you combine this with a bus compressor? Kinda wish there was an insert so I could run my Manley before the saturation instead of after it.
Is there a finished version of that song I’d like to buy it I love it!
Sorry to come off as a bit of a noob but I'm quite new to the whole audio hardware scene and am not sure I understand what exactly this piece of hardware is/does. I can hear the differences between the different modes vs the "in the box" etc. but to me, it seems like you could achieve the same effect with a master bus compressor+limiter? Could someone maybe explain what the main goal of the 5057 is?
Cheers
Would be interesting to compare the Neve summed version, to just a stereo out going through it, I doubt a lot of the sound is due to the summing itself, then again Neve knows what he's doing. Should release a stereo transformer/silk box...
Yes, that's probably something they will create. Although at 2k, although not free, it's very inexpensive for 16 channels of summing!
Exactly my thoughts, their master bus processor comes to mind.
@@Polydarian It's seems to be a mystery wether running every track individually through MBP and then putting MBP on the MIXBUS. Would give the same sound as "summing" each channel togther through the orbit or satellite.
This sounds great!
I would make my sum mixes through the blue.
Mix through the red because of the high end on the vocals and the tail end of the reverb. Love the sound of the snare on the red.
Great job!!! 👊🏾💯
11:00 11:51 Flat
15:54 16:46 Neve
Dear Mr. Huart, I think you use a vintage SLL mixer in all your productions. This is a Neve product. To your ears which of the settings the red silk or Blue silk most reminds you of your beloved SLL. SLL makes Solid State Logic BiG SiX Professional Desktop Summing Mixer. Could you do a video comparing the Neve vs SLL and the big six verses your awesome SLL mixer to see how close SSL came? Thank you for this wonderful content. By the way if a band would like you to produce them what is the proper way to get in touch with you?
I have a okay audio interface, an Apogee Ensamble Thunderbolt. If I were to step up my game in the direction of hardware, (love the idea of turning knobs and instruments glued together with analog magic), if my budget is somewhat limited, should I buy a Rupert Neve summing mixer (5057) or a bus compressor (5254) first? I guess you would recommend me buying a The Newton channel first, but I think the Apogee does this job pretty well!? And that what I need, with my budget, is something to glue it all together, like a summing mixer or a bus compressor. But what is most important in this regards? Summing or bus if I must pick one? All though I would like to build a Rupert Neve based studio in the long term, can I ask for tips for a great and not to expensive bus compressor, if there is any?! ;) The 5254 is twice as expensive as Newton and Orbit. But I am sure it’s great. Maybe I could manage to buy the summing mixer and a bus compressor. Any other things to consider? I use Ableton and Logic DAW. Thanks for your great video on TH-cam.
Could not help notice the Focal monitors in your studio. We also see a Genelec monitor as well. Are you reviewing the Focals or have they found a home in your studio?