to me, the Drop Dash is a final realization of what Sonic's 'action' should be, they were trying to come up with a mid-air action for Sonic that kept his theme going, like Tails and Knuckles had, but the realization was that his 'theme' is high ground-speed and acceleration, Sonic was not made to have aerial options and control, he is all about speed, on the ground. the Drop Dash already feels like a game-changer in the sense that it feels like what he should have had from the get-go. Truly he now has his action to emphasize speed, and perhaps even his mastery of the spindash in comparison to Tails and Knuckles.
You really get more use out of the insta-shield honestly. I just find the Drop Dash to be largely useless, even though I used it quite a bit in the game it was mainly just for back tracking up slopes.
insta shield was great for killing bosses faster in sonic 3, but thats bascially all its good for. the drop dash lets you maintain speed even in slow sections of levels so its a HUGE game changer. Not to mention it feels really damn good to use instead of stopping completely for a spindash. Also why are you back tracking with the drop dash its so weak for that use a spindash you get so much more height.
After watching the official reveal of the drop dash and then later starting up the game for the first time I said to myself "when the hell am I ever going to use that, that's stupid." After beating Mania 3 times I now find myself playing Sonic 1 2 and 3 getting pissed off because I keep trying to do it in them and I can't.
I literally cannot play the classic games anymore because I expect the drop dash. There better be an update to Sonic 3 Complete which allows me to do so, or else I won't play S3&K much anymore.
The Drop Dash is surprisingly versatile, although you need a good head on your shoulders to make use of it. I disagree with the popular argument that it's "only" useful for speedrunning; I find myself using it quite often in just plain old casual play, primarily to quickly zip into enemies that I've overshot in a jump, to quickly change direction when I realize I need ot be going the other way, or to force Sonic to "climb" steep slopes that previously only spamming the glide with Knuckles could have gotten me back up. "Useful" is only as useful as a given player's ingenuity, after all. But more importantly, it's just so darn fun to use once you've worked it into your natural playstyle. Sometimes I legitimately find myself annoyed that I happen to have an elemental shield active at a given time, since that replaces the Drop Dash with some other action (and the Drop Dash is easier to control than the Fire Shield's air-dash). - Lewis
Drop dash is amazing for speedrunning. If you end crashing into a wall and you need to fast, charge a drop dash. If you need to go to the other side, charge a drop dash. If you are running and you want to drop dash, charge a drop dash. Hell, it helps on making you go slightly faster when going down a slope. The Brop Bash is aBazing.
Sonic was inspired by the creator speedrunning the first level of Mario on the NES. When they were porting sonic over to a 3d game, they realized that having to deal with more axises meant simply jumping on enemies became a chore. They included the homing attack so that they could keep the game moving without making it frustrating. A homing attack in a 2d sonic game, in my opinion, is stupid. It just doesn't translate well, and it sometimes takes away from that awesome feeling of bouncing on multiple enemies. The fire shield is probably what you're looking for with that mid-air boost, but that goes away after one hit. Still, it feels cool bouncing off an enemy using it and launching forward through it.
Yeah. The only reason the homing attack was added was that it would be hard to jump on enemies in a 3d environment so they added it. No point in adding it into 2d sonic.
I honestly thing the Drop Dash serves basically the same purpose: making up for imprecise jumps while still maintaining flow. However, I think the best option for a move to replace the HA in 3D would be a mid-air, aimable Spindash, like the Bullet Dash for the Junio Sonic mod in SRB2. However, unlike that move, you won't freeze in the air; at most you'll only go into Bullet Time. This way, jumping higher actually becomes useful for speed, you can make your jump a bit higher to get to higher areas quickly, and you can do all the things the HA does, but now you actually need skill.
I think a homing attack in a 2d sonic game isn't bad at all. My problem is when it's in a classic sonic game. For sonic rush and colours Ds, the homing attack works there because it's a modern game
Homing attack kills the need of precision, so luckly it was dropped. This kind of thing is only accepted in 3D Sonic games, where precision is a problem.
Nah, levels can certainly be designed for homing attacks, the problem is, they HAVE to be designed for homing attacks, you cannot just put the mechanics everywhere and expect it to work or flow well. though the other issue is, homing attacks (as it is currently designed) doesn't really emphasize speed at all since it robs you of your forward momentum. I'd say if I were to pick a game which uses "homing" attacks well, it'd be the Spectre Knight: The slash-through mechanic actually has a homing component which determines whether you slice upwards or downwards, and better yet, it actually moves you forward while doing so. Granted it still sets your momentum to a fixed value from when you triggered it, but still far better than how it's implemented in Sonic 4.
@@sinteleon I like Sonic Heroes "without target" homing attack. It lasts for quite a long time and you have almost full control of it's direction, like, you can even turn around and go backwards mid-homming attack. The speed just feel right - it isn't too fast to make it imprecise, yet it doesn't steal your momentum if you're already too fast.
I never used the Drop Dash on my first playthrough of the game, and this is purely because I didn't understand how it worked. That is, however, on me. I only discovered it's existence in-game when I was panicking while falling, and heard a spindash charge. I began toying around and initially thought it was dumb as all heck, because I couldn't figure out how to trigger it other than spamming the jump button in mid-air. Then I watched a streamer's videos and felt like an idiot when they explained it on-stream. Yea. It's REALLY fun, and now that I know it exists, it really feels bloody natural to control, and I find myself not wanting to play Tails or Knuckles (Both of which I loved playing more than Sonic in the old games due to their unique abilities) because I wanted to Drop Dash everywhere.
I actually didn't use the Drop Dash (intentionally) much at all when I played through Mania. I think I forgot it existed most of the time since I'm used to just stopping to spindash.
Y'know I should say, Sonic Adventure for the DS had this attack Game Champ refered to, Homing attacks weren't really a thing yet so wwe had the boot formula that gave us a special attack in a direction, the only "Homing" style thing would be the extra jump ability you had to get more height but it was very situational and you had to be at the mercy of the physics in order to be in the correct place at the correct time to pull it off
The drop dash is a perfect fit for a classic sonic game. It keeps with the integrity that the original sonic games had because it keeps the focus of speed on the mind. It reminds me of running through the original green hill zone in sonic 1 a bit because if you work with the terrain you can keep your speed and the drop dash helps gain the speed that is necessary to keep that thrilling momentum. Great addition imo!
Drop Dash is cool! I didn't know about it on my first playthrough, and I wish they told you about it at some point, but it's cool. Very nice that Sonic has a unique thing, and isn't just a flightless Tails or Knuckles.
what you said here about the sonic 4 homing attack being improved by removing the homing aspect makes me think of the "speed thok" in the fan game Sonic Robo Blast 2
I seem to get the feeling that you view "being at the mercy of physics" is necessarily a bad thing for a Sonic game, which I disagree with. I do think that Sonic games tend to necessitate the knowledge of a level layout as a bare minimum for skilled play, but I think the way rings act as a hit solve that design problem (bottomless pits are and always have been BS in classic Sonic). I think using your momentum as a way to solve the problem of "how do I get over there" is an integral part of classic Sonic and I think having the ability to control your aerial momentum that the homing attack does makes that problem less interesting.
I don't feel that way at all, my intention in the prior video was to demonstrate that Sonic 4 was an inherently different game at its most basic level. And here, the intention is to show how the drop dash falls in line more with the classic games than the homing attack does. It isn't a measure of quality.
I didn't know about drop dash until I accidentally activated it. When I did, I immediately fell in love because that accident had such smooth momentum. Use it like mad. IMO, best Sonic special move aside from spin dash. Used together and it's incredible.
i love that Sonic finally has something that sets him apart from tails and knuckles in this game. in the older games tails and knuckles could do the spin dash AND could Fly and Glide making Sonic feel kinda inferior in a way. Drop Dash gives Sonic his own unique ability that not only sets him apart from Tails and Knuckles but the Drop Dash also helps reinforce Sonics position as the Speedy one of the 3 allowing him to maintain his momentum more often. Drop Dash in my opinion should be a mainstay for future 2D sonic games
I contemplated before how to properly edit the homing attack in 3D, my solution was to nerf the homing range and buff the bounce off of enemies, so rather than just spamming the button, you're performing precision platforming by bouncing off enemies, and the homing attack would be kind of your method to bounce off of them in addition to giving a little bit of leeway if you were a bit off. Think like how Shovel Knight bounces off of enemies. I still stand by mine, but yours sounds more fun for a 2D space. I would like to have midair movement options like that and it sounds more interesting than a double jump. For future 2D Sonics, I would like to have more movement options. I agree wholeheartedly about the Drop Dash, it is incredible, but I can't see why I have to sacrifice the Figure-8 to use it. Why can't figure 8 just be mapped to a different button or something? Come to think of it, why not give your "homing attack" pitch its own button as well? Here's my pitch for a 2D Sonic game control scheme (Using Nintendo Switch buttons): A/B = Jump. A/B (hold in midair) = Drop Dash. Y (hold) = Rev up Spin Dash. Y (release) = Unleash Spin Dash. X (hold) = Rev up Figure 8. X (release) = Unleash Figure-8. ZL/ZR = Your pitch for homing attack. But that's just me. Anyone else want to say I'm stupid and wrong, feel free to. I'd like to hear your thoughts. (And of course the original inputs for spin dash would have to stay in as an alternate input to make Sonic purists happy)
I think the devs wanted really bad to make Mania a one-button game just like the whole classic series. The only exception is that going Super is mapped to its own button. It goes a long way to keeping the game accessible to newcomers; you can press any of the four face buttons and they'll all do the same thing.
Oh I completely understand why they did it the way they did, and I don't think it's a bad approach at all. I just kind of want to see a 2D Sonic that really evolves the formula and goes a little more ambitious in the controls department, and I think Sonic Mania is a step in the right direction. In this game, they strayed a little from the classics by adding new stages and movement options. From a sequel, I'd like them to stray even further to give 2D Sonic a reinvention like the new Doom did for its series. I gave a lot of movement options because that's something I really like in platformers. You don't often think about it, but Mario's got like seven kinds of jumps from just two buttons and a stick in Super Mario Galaxy.
+Michael Patton If there are gonna add the figure 8 back, they'll have to make it weaker than it was in sonic cd. Think about it, in sonic cd, the spindash was made super irrelevant just because, well, it was basically the same thing as the spindash but faster and with a cool animation. What they should do is extend the charging period to about 5 seconds so the spin dash wouldn't be completely irrelevant.
AwesomeG46 I don't believe it's that broken, if you run into an enemy you're going to take damage. It's actually a little situational if you think about it. But I can see your point about it defeating the purpose of the spin dash. Perhaps it doesn't need to be back that bad. But I would still tweak the spin dash to be charged by holding a button rather than spammed, and maybe it maxes out after two seconds and has a super satisfying charge animation.
+Michael Patton The thing with the figure 8 though is that right after you let go, you can press down... then BOOM, no emenies can hurt you. Also, the spindash is fine as it is. In 3d, it should be held down.
The homing attack thing you were going on about reminds me of Srb2's Speed thok ability that they gave sonic. it didnt lock on to enemies but you had to time it. (2:20)
I love the fact that it works really well for speedrunning a stage! I'm no speedrunner myself, haha, but the fact that it gives you an immediate speed boost if you know what you're doing means that you can keep using it to maintain a constant momentum as long as you keep making the right jumps! I practice with it a lot on Green Hill just to get the hang of it and the whole game is built so well to accommodate it and incentivize it while not making it a required skill. ^u^ I agree it makes your approach to stages so unique and fun and adds a new element of planning out your run so you constantly have that speed doing for you. Plus you don't need to rely on sluggish run buildup to get moving, so you can just hop right into a speed boost and be back on your merry way if you, say, hit a rock in your path or something. I like it! Good video too, you brought up lots of good points. Kudos!
I like all his abilities, I have made a combo using the insta shield, if you end up falling in a lava or spike you can time it perfectly and jump again doing it as much you want, but you need to time it, the cd is nice for a start up, when you stop and already want to go fast you dont need to go maximium, for the regular speed just unleash it early and its fine, the drop dash is nice when you hit wall so you can get all your momentum back by drop dashing, at the end of the day all sonic abilities are nice in their way, none is bad even for the homing attack
I was hoping you would cover the Shoulder Button tricks and team shenanigans in Sonic Advance 3 which actually serve as interesting mid-air and ground based skills which serve a similar purpose to the Drop Dash even if limited to bouncing off certain objects for the mid air tricks. I can agree on Mania even if I haven't taken the time to get it yet... Now is the time.
The Homing Attack does take away the cool feeling of bouncing on enemies in 2D Sonic. You mentioned a non-homing Homing Attack, which I assume is like the Thok from Sonic Robo Blast 2. I like the idea of that feature, but I think the Drop Dash is still better.
I think the difference is in how the games are meant to be played mania is just like the classics where knowing the level is important if you want to go fast and get a good score where 4 was at least trying to be like the modern/adventure games where the levels are more like a Mario level where you have to know the mechanics not the level. Eventually the design principals of the genesis games would be broken if the homing attack was introduced, if it were in a 2D game that was designed more like modern/adventure games it wouldn't be bad. However Sonic 4 shows that the styles of the classic and modern, know the levels and know the game can't be in the same game, at least not with a large degree of difficulty. But who knows perhaps someone will make a good game with both styles but I think that doing so would make both of them worse sonic in the classic games has a small move set that (for the most part) can be fully understood without a tutorial and so you can focus on finding a path trough the levels through several plays of it. Modern Sonic's games have some degree of branching paths but due to the fact that being fast in 3D is hard the difficulty comes from mastering the move set. So the Homing Attack could work in 2D but not a true genesis 2D. The drop dash mostly just optimizes the existing game play of Classic Sonic without breaking the formula of Classic Sonic. In conclusion it could work but it couldn't be a Classic Sonic game it would have to be a 2D modern game. TLDR You are technically wrong, but your points are valid could be used to make a whole new genre of Sonic game.
My only complaint is that you can't force Sonic to roll into a ball/preform the drop dash from anything but a jump. Like, if you spin off the floor, you can't drop dash while airborne. It HAS to be from a jump. Have you ever played that Sonic fangame thats based on CD's style? Where you can press the crouch button to roll into a ball when in the air? If that was in Mania, it would be perfect. It even show's him doing this in the opening animation of both CD and Mania, yet it isn't in the game. It can really mess with the fluidity when you accidentally run off the edge of something, leaving you unable to preform the drop dash to keep momentum.
The homing attack doesn't work for 2d games, making it to the top of a level should be rewarded for skill, not pressing A alot. It makes enemies too easy to defeat, it makes everything too easy!
Tails: Jump twice to go up (fly) Knuckles: Jump twice to go left or right (glide) Sonic: Jump twice to go down (drop dash) It seems somewhat evident that it should have been like this from the beginning, from a play mechanics sense. Not sure how Sonic affects gravity to suddenly drop out of the air, but whatever. It also makes Spin Dash looks like a really heavy handed game mechanic to address building momentum. Homing attacks can be part of some shield, if there's a need for it. Also, I like Sonic 4 for what it is. The physics suck, the graphics aren't quite on, trying for this 2D With Depth thing, but I dig the context sensitive team techniques that allow you to use Tails even while in a single player game.
The drop dash doesn't direct velocity downward. All it does is allow you to immediately enter a spindash-like state as soon as you touch the ground. You can touch the ground anywhere, however; your movement in the air is totally unaltered.
I know you were talking about the mechanic in 2D specifically, but there's actually a 3D sonic fangame that uses a move similar to your suggested "homing" attack. In Sonic Robo Blast 2, if Sonic presses jump in the air he'll suddenly launch forwards at high speed, and if you're good enough at it you can bounce off of enemies and maintain momentum while gaining height to cross huge gaps. It's called the Speed Thok after the noise it makes. Although I'd reccomend waiting a little before playing SRB2, if only because v2.2 is coming out soon, and that looks like it's going to be amazing.
In your thanks at the end, the Japanese text 「ありがとうございますです」doesn't make sense grammatically. It roughly translates to "[I] is thank you." You want to leave out the 「です」(Desu) so that it's just 「あらいがとうございます」(Arigatou gozaimasu). Or, if you want to be super thankful to your patrons, you could write 「どうもありがとうございます」(Doumo arigato gozaimasu).
counter argument: mario only has hair on his head and face, sonics body is covered with hair and quills, which are basically super hairs. his entire body is one powerful mustache.
I *LOVE* the Dropdash, but it's only useful for speedrunners/speedy players (like me), but the insta-shield is also, but I find it more useful with perfect timing. Also it's called *HOMING* Attack, it's meant to keep you stationary, Homing as in that's its new home, Attack as in it's attacking you. You don't see a missle aim at something, blow up, and keep going...
I don't think it's faithful AT ALL. In the genesis games (that I happen to love btw, so pls hear me out) you would often come to a grinding halt. The spin dash was how you would approach inclines if you were too slow to overcome them. Speed was often only given to the most skilled, veteran players who were wary of the terrain. The drop dash COMPLETELY changes the game's dynamics. Sonic can now be fast WHENEVER HE WANTS. Skill still rewards the player with not dying and maintaining speed, but the reward of speed itself is almost a given. Some people (weirdo purists) might consider this a "bad" thing, but I LOOOOOOOOVVVVVVEEEEE being fast. I love that I can maintain momentum so much more easily in this game. Sonic Mania is honestly the future for 2d sonic. The only thing that I wish they did was make knuckles' glide ability more rewarding. Just by initiating the glide and releasing from it, most momentum is lost and landing is really slow. If they could keep the speed up like in post Sonic&Knuckles games like sonic adventure 2, I would really appreciate it. Until then, I find Knuckles to not be that great of a character to play.
Drop dash is an amazing addition to sonic's moveset. It is orthodox and methodical enough while providing a subtle addition to his movement options. I think it's one of the best additions that they could have made without changing the classic sonic formula. They should build on this by making insta shield always available as well. Not sure how I feel about the peel-out. It's cool but I feel it's not in line with classic sonic's momentum based gameplay since it trivializes the spindash
I'm gonna be real here...Sonic Mania's a great game. I just beat it yesterday. But even with saying that, I honestly never found the Drop Dash to be useful. It's a cute little move for Classic Sonic noobs who don't know how to play these sorts of games, but even then, they rarely use it anyways. The move isn't only a weaker version of the original Spin Dash, but can get you mucked over far more than usual when you shouldn't have in the first place. I have a multitude of other issues with this game, but the Drop Dash is a pretty big one. It's also not a very hard move to activate by pure accident, since it's a "hold" button activation. I can't stand that garbage. I ended up using a cheat table to hack the game to allow me to use Peel-Out and Insta-Shield since those are really the only Classic Sonic moves worth even using, if available, and EVEN THEN, they HEAVILY nerfed the Insta-Shield to a point where it no longer serves much else of a purpose other than to make you THINK it's a good move, when it really isn't. It's invincibility frames are utter BS and it's range sucks SO hard, it's not funny. The fact you can't even use it, and Peel-Out ON THEIR OWN, with a SAVE, is appalling to say the least. This game's wonderful, and while it does indeed deserve the praise it's received, I also hope some people start to notice the glaring flaws in it's design. As for the Homing Attack, while I understand why you're using Sonic 4 as your example (it's an official Sonic game, and it's also Sonic 4), I think you should actually use the fan-made ROMHack, Sonic Megamix, as your example. The Homing Attack/Air Dash in Megamix is absolutely amazing, and it allows you to not only build up speed, but feel safer in midair whenever going through utterly hard areas. Megamix would've been IMPOSSIBLE for me without that, as well as the Light Speed Dash as a nice bonus, so I can firmly agree about it's use in a 2D field. There's also Sonic CD, a game I usually can't play well, that was given a ROMHack modification known as Sonic CD++, which added not only the Sonic 2 Spin Dash, but also the Megamix Homing Attack. The Homing Attack's a good move, and I think people bashed it just because of Sonic 4 not doing well overall, blaming things for it's failure that were never really a factor to begin with...
Clearly you don't do speedrunning. The drop dash is AMAZING for going fast and losing as less speed as possible. It's like making a charged spindash without stopping, at the cost of less power than a fully charged one.
Sure, but not everyone's a speed runner. The fact it's the only move you can use with saves active is outright proof they left it to be the ONLY move you use for the most part when booting up Mania. That's a very small purpose for such a hugely supported new move. In comparison to moves such as Homing Attack/Air Dash, and the ORIGINAL Insta-Shield from Sonic 3, it doesn't have near as many practical uses. I even find the Peel-Out to have more practical uses than Drop Dash, and I've already had my issues with THAT move as is.
To each their own, Still if people how to use the Drop Dash, excluding on the easy instruction on how to do it. Then it makes going through levels a breeze more. Used well you can at least have that sense of speed, and it helps with time attack and speedrunning altogether, but that's been discussed already. I'm just saying that when used well, people can get something out of it, going through levels fast.
In fan-game Sonic Robo Blast 2 Sonic have move called "Speed Thok" which allows him to do something like homing attack but without actual homing. It's just gives him some altitude and acceleraion, so you can use that to move more freely in air and clear wide gaps
I use the drop dash all the time. It makes the game so much more fun! I think it's the best thing ever and it's as much as a step forward as the spin dash when it was introduced in Sonic 2.
What you describe at 2:30 is a technique Sonic has in Sonic Advance 3 when teamed up with Cream. It's also technically a homing attack there but the homing range is so small that element is pretty much irrelevant, serving almost exclusively as a speedy forward launch.
The Drop Dash (and Sonic's superior super form compared a to the others) made Sonic my favourite character to play as in Mania. In other games I just prefer using Tails or Knuckles because they have better abilities that make it easier to get through the levels and/or beat certain bosses, but the Drop Dash is so satisfying, useful and easy to use that I prefer playing as Sonic now.
I while knowing about it, couldn't figure out how to do it for the life of me when I wanted and it pissed me off having to rely only on the spin dash when it just didn't work for some areas. I thank you for explaining it. :P
There was an attack in the recent Shovel knight DLC (The spectre one), where you dash towards a locked on target (or wall thing) and then fling away with forward momentum. I feel like if Sonic Mania 2 has lock on, it should be like that (as opposed to momentum-halting) and it could even be used in puzzle platforming
I think the Drop Dash was a genius mechanic that I had never anticipated myself using much. But the fact that it's a compromise between the spin dash and rolling/running forward, I find myself using it notably often without neglecting the spin dash. It allows me to keep up momentum and speed without ever really stopping-I can go fast in any direction at any time. If I feel myself slowing down or needing to change the way my momentum is functioning, I can use it and not feel that I'm at the mercy of the physics or that the game is being broken; it's a more natural addition to Sonic's arsenal than even the Insta-Shield. But at the same time, if I'm already at a stop (i.e. the momentum of gameplay has already halted), I can use a spindash and get much more speed right out of the gate. The Drop Dash allows the player to keep the game moving and remain fluid, while the spindash allows the player to start that back up as soon as possible. They were able to find the best way to optimize speed without taking control out of the hands of the player (quite observable in many sections of Sonic 2 where the player was locked into the momentum of a roll with no way to escape until they gained enough control to change the way Sonic moved). The Drop-Dash mitigates this issue by only removing control from the player while they're in the air after their jump, a choice that has its own consequences with the responsibility left entirely to the player. It's so much more *fair*, since whenever the player's actions land them in a position they don't want to be in, there's no blaming the physics of the game. They chose to make that action, and the Drop-Dash allows them to change their movement if a hazard is approaching without sacrificing speed and mobility. I also think that incorporating the homing attack into 2D Sonic would require some tweaking. I personally believe the Drop-Dash is a much better tactic in 2D Sonic, but I also think they could make the homing attack work (albeit not as well) if it were made to propel momentum forward rather than redirect velocity upward after it hits and enemy. If it were akin to jumping on an enemy's head in Mario games (preserving forward momentum), and if used when there are no enemies around, acting like a small version of the fire shield dash, I think it could work. In its current state the homing attack assists in the flow of gameplay where technique is important (such as enemy chains), but for a game focused on moving to the right as fast as possible, it could use some work.
I feel much the same way about Crash Bandicoot's Spin Attack. In most 2D platformers, the only way to attack enemies is to jump on their heads. Some games, like Super Mario Bros., do give the player a projectile option, but it can only be used if they have collected a specific power-up, and only until they take damage. With a 3D platformer, there is now a third axis that needs to be managed, meaning that it becomes much harder to actually land your jump, especially on a moving target. Jumping is no longer a sufficient means of attacking, so the developers need to provide an additional offensive maneuver. Some such maneuvers are better than others, however. To use a comparative example, Super Mario 64 lets Mario punch whatever is directly in front of him. However, its hitbox is so small that Mario will only land the hit if he is directly facing his target AND if the target is less than half his height away. And the punch itself lasts only a quarter of a second, meaning if you press B too early, you're getting a Goomba foot to the face. Not only that, but punching makes Mario lose almost all his momentum while running, and bounces off wharever he punches, severely hindering the player's movement. With Crash Bandicoot, however, NaughtyDog gave him a Spin Attack, which is a much more viable combat option. The hitbox surrounds the entire character model, so it doesn't matter what direction the enemy is coming at you from, nor does it matter which way Crash is facing. Not only that, but Crash can use the Spin while mid-air, or while moving, or both, and loses almost no horizontal speed in the process. He also doesn't stop or bounce when he hits something, and the hitbox lasts almost 3/4 of a second, meaning there is much more margin for error (which is helpful, considering how difficult the first game was!). The Spin Attack is a move which is easy to use and feels fluid to execute, and *I love it!*
Drop dash is a godsend for when you are speedrunning and i pretty sure it was design that way, When you know your routes in a stage, sonic mania run look soooo smooth.
The Drop Dash would have made a lot of sense as an inclusion in Sonic Adventure, since you can activate a Spindash at any time in that game as long as you charge it enough. In addition, it would be a really great addition to the 3D games in general, since if you miss a jump, you can just roll into the enemy instead. However, another option for Sonic's airborne moveset that I find particularly appealing is the Bullet Dash. This move, a momentum-affected move where Sonic performs an aimable spin dash midair in order to change the direction or speed of a jump, takes the same concepts which the homing attack and the drop dash introduce, and raises the skill ceiling beyond that of either of them. It was originally hinted at in the Sonic CD intro, in which Sonic gains some speed whilst curling in the air to tunnel through a boulder, used many times in the Sonic OVA as a quasi-homing attack, appeared as a move (I think it was part of the spin dash) in Smash 4 (Sonic could activate the spin dash in midair and dash toward the ground), and is now an essential move in a fangame called Sonic Freedom. In various incarnations of the move, when performing it Sonic will either keep moving, enter a bullet-time state for better precision, or freeze in the air for a few seconds. This lasts until the button is let go. Essentially, this move is a drop dash but you can do more things with it, and you need to charge and aim it.
The Drop Dash is awesome! It effectively makes a Sonic playthrough of mania into by far the quickest as it's a Sonic exclusive move and makes the game a joy to speedrun. While I'd like to see more options this so far is pretty damn good. Perhaps a homing attack could be included with an additional character, perhaps they could include Shadow in Sonic Mania 2 and give him the homing attack... who knows.
![ILLSLICK - KILLSHOT REMIX [FULL VERSION]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/RIK8RrqIAzE/mqdefault.jpg)
to me, the Drop Dash is a final realization of what Sonic's 'action' should be, they were trying to come up with a mid-air action for Sonic that kept his theme going, like Tails and Knuckles had, but the realization was that his 'theme' is high ground-speed and acceleration, Sonic was not made to have aerial options and control, he is all about speed, on the ground. the Drop Dash already feels like a game-changer in the sense that it feels like what he should have had from the get-go.
Truly he now has his action to emphasize speed, and perhaps even his mastery of the spindash in comparison to Tails and Knuckles.
Yeah that's one of my favourite things about it, even as a kid I remember feeling like the Insta-Shield didn't really fit with Sonic's character
Is the Insta Shield in Mania? I never got to play it yet. I heard the Super Peel Out returned as well?
yeah, you unlock it with Mania medals form the GBS bonus stages, you can only use it or the peel-out in no-save mode, though
You really get more use out of the insta-shield honestly. I just find the Drop Dash to be largely useless, even though I used it quite a bit in the game it was mainly just for back tracking up slopes.
insta shield was great for killing bosses faster in sonic 3, but thats bascially all its good for. the drop dash lets you maintain speed even in slow sections of levels so its a HUGE game changer. Not to mention it feels really damn good to use instead of stopping completely for a spindash. Also why are you back tracking with the drop dash its so weak for that use a spindash you get so much more height.
After watching the official reveal of the drop dash and then later starting up the game for the first time I said to myself "when the hell am I ever going to use that, that's stupid."
After beating Mania 3 times I now find myself playing Sonic 1 2 and 3 getting pissed off because I keep trying to do it in them and I can't.
ask markeyjester to do it
I literally cannot play the classic games anymore because I expect the drop dash. There better be an update to Sonic 3 Complete which allows me to do so, or else I won't play S3&K much anymore.
NathanGuiaYT Hopefully if SEGA ever allows a S3K remake, they would port them all to consoles and maybe a drop dash extra :p
Same
Is it worse than trying to spin dash in sonic 1?
The Drop Dash is surprisingly versatile, although you need a good head on your shoulders to make use of it. I disagree with the popular argument that it's "only" useful for speedrunning; I find myself using it quite often in just plain old casual play, primarily to quickly zip into enemies that I've overshot in a jump, to quickly change direction when I realize I need ot be going the other way, or to force Sonic to "climb" steep slopes that previously only spamming the glide with Knuckles could have gotten me back up. "Useful" is only as useful as a given player's ingenuity, after all. But more importantly, it's just so darn fun to use once you've worked it into your natural playstyle. Sometimes I legitimately find myself annoyed that I happen to have an elemental shield active at a given time, since that replaces the Drop Dash with some other action (and the Drop Dash is easier to control than the Fire Shield's air-dash).
- Lewis
Agreed, though I will say the elemental shields made the regular shield feel very bland.
+Samuel Schilmeister Eh... It is a regular sheild.
Samuel Schilmeister I felt the same way until I remembered that with it you can take an extra hit and you can still Drop Dash, so I no longer mind it
Agreed with it all. Hoping Sonic 3 complete can have the Drop Dash as an option soon as I prefer it over the Insta Shield.
Samuel Schilmeister I think it's more of a placeholder shield for yourself. You might as well take it if you have nothing.
1:35 Sonic Mania clip: Sonic collects enough rings to reach 88. **switches to Sonic 4** Has 88 rings.
ILLUMINATI CONFIRMED
OMG 😮😮😮😮😮😮😮
WELL... easter egg?
Jasoncrafter82
where we're going we don't need *roads* 😎
Maybe illuminati
So, can you beat Sonic Mania using Drop Dash always without stopping at any time? (Just in the cutscenes)
Drop dash is amazing for speedrunning.
If you end crashing into a wall and you need to fast, charge a drop dash.
If you need to go to the other side, charge a drop dash.
If you are running and you want to drop dash, charge a drop dash.
Hell, it helps on making you go slightly faster when going down a slope.
The Brop Bash is aBazing.
Rapidgame7 10/10 best profile picture i have ever seen
m e t a k n i g h t ?
You can climb slopes by spamming drop dash.
When a problem comes along, you must drop dash
The 🅱️ro🅿️ 🅱️🅰️sh is 🅰️🅱️🅰️zing.
look at how so speeeeeeeeeeed
Ya Boi Sime u
Oh hey it's the dude who edits RedFalcon videos
Sonic was inspired by the creator speedrunning the first level of Mario on the NES. When they were porting sonic over to a 3d game, they realized that having to deal with more axises meant simply jumping on enemies became a chore. They included the homing attack so that they could keep the game moving without making it frustrating. A homing attack in a 2d sonic game, in my opinion, is stupid. It just doesn't translate well, and it sometimes takes away from that awesome feeling of bouncing on multiple enemies. The fire shield is probably what you're looking for with that mid-air boost, but that goes away after one hit. Still, it feels cool bouncing off an enemy using it and launching forward through it.
Yeah. The only reason the homing attack was added was that it would be hard to jump on enemies in a 3d environment so they added it. No point in adding it into 2d sonic.
I honestly thing the Drop Dash serves basically the same purpose: making up for imprecise jumps while still maintaining flow. However, I think the best option for a move to replace the HA in 3D would be a mid-air, aimable Spindash, like the Bullet Dash for the Junio Sonic mod in SRB2. However, unlike that move, you won't freeze in the air; at most you'll only go into Bullet Time. This way, jumping higher actually becomes useful for speed, you can make your jump a bit higher to get to higher areas quickly, and you can do all the things the HA does, but now you actually need skill.
I only like homing attack in advance 2 cause you couldn’t always activate it
I think a homing attack in a 2d sonic game isn't bad at all. My problem is when it's in a classic sonic game. For sonic rush and colours Ds, the homing attack works there because it's a modern game
Homing attack kills the need of precision, so luckly it was dropped.
This kind of thing is only accepted in 3D Sonic games, where precision is a problem.
Nah, levels can certainly be designed for homing attacks, the problem is, they HAVE to be designed for homing attacks, you cannot just put the mechanics everywhere and expect it to work or flow well. though the other issue is, homing attacks (as it is currently designed) doesn't really emphasize speed at all since it robs you of your forward momentum.
I'd say if I were to pick a game which uses "homing" attacks well, it'd be the Spectre Knight: The slash-through mechanic actually has a homing component which determines whether you slice upwards or downwards, and better yet, it actually moves you forward while doing so. Granted it still sets your momentum to a fixed value from when you triggered it, but still far better than how it's implemented in Sonic 4.
@@sinteleon I like Sonic Heroes "without target" homing attack. It lasts for quite a long time and you have almost full control of it's direction, like, you can even turn around and go backwards mid-homming attack. The speed just feel right - it isn't too fast to make it imprecise, yet it doesn't steal your momentum if you're already too fast.
They could just make the enemies huge.
I never used the Drop Dash on my first playthrough of the game, and this is purely because I didn't understand how it worked. That is, however, on me.
I only discovered it's existence in-game when I was panicking while falling, and heard a spindash charge.
I began toying around and initially thought it was dumb as all heck, because I couldn't figure out how to trigger it other than spamming the jump button in mid-air.
Then I watched a streamer's videos and felt like an idiot when they explained it on-stream.
Yea.
It's REALLY fun, and now that I know it exists, it really feels bloody natural to control, and I find myself not wanting to play Tails or Knuckles (Both of which I loved playing more than Sonic in the old games due to their unique abilities) because I wanted to Drop Dash everywhere.
It's pretty much Boosting, except it's short-lived, there's no gauge and it requires a jump to perform.
I actually didn't use the Drop Dash (intentionally) much at all when I played through Mania. I think I forgot it existed most of the time since I'm used to just stopping to spindash.
I had no idea it existed in the first place, I beat the whole game without it. Oh well now I guess I have to play it again knowing I can use it now :D
Z-10 same here
I saw it in the trailer but had no idea how to pull it off
Eric Weisbrot hold jump midair
I know this was 5 months ago but same I also used it a lot accidentally when trying to fly with tails
Literally the stop, drop, and roll without the stop. Except there is no stopping
Y'know I should say, Sonic Adventure for the DS had this attack Game Champ refered to, Homing attacks weren't really a thing yet so wwe had the boot formula that gave us a special attack in a direction, the only "Homing" style thing would be the extra jump ability you had to get more height but it was very situational and you had to be at the mercy of the physics in order to be in the correct place at the correct time to pull it off
Should I buy Sonic Mania?
yes
Sharton Gaming ye
Yes
Sharton Gaming do it,just do it!
Is that even a question?
Sonic fans made a mechanic so well fitting and executed for sonic gameplay that it's in Forces and now origins. And every fan game now.
The drop dash is a perfect fit for a classic sonic game. It keeps with the integrity that the original sonic games had because it keeps the focus of speed on the mind. It reminds me of running through the original green hill zone in sonic 1 a bit because if you work with the terrain you can keep your speed and the drop dash helps gain the speed that is necessary to keep that thrilling momentum. Great addition imo!
Drop Dash is cool! I didn't know about it on my first playthrough, and I wish they told you about it at some point, but it's cool. Very nice that Sonic has a unique thing, and isn't just a flightless Tails or Knuckles.
+oi23origin
Tails and Knuckles are slower and Knuckles jump is even lower than Sonic's one.
I didn't come to hear why they should add the homing attack
what you said here about the sonic 4 homing attack being improved by removing the homing aspect makes me think of the "speed thok" in the fan game Sonic Robo Blast 2
I seem to get the feeling that you view "being at the mercy of physics" is necessarily a bad thing for a Sonic game, which I disagree with. I do think that Sonic games tend to necessitate the knowledge of a level layout as a bare minimum for skilled play, but I think the way rings act as a hit solve that design problem (bottomless pits are and always have been BS in classic Sonic). I think using your momentum as a way to solve the problem of "how do I get over there" is an integral part of classic Sonic and I think having the ability to control your aerial momentum that the homing attack does makes that problem less interesting.
I don't feel that way at all, my intention in the prior video was to demonstrate that Sonic 4 was an inherently different game at its most basic level. And here, the intention is to show how the drop dash falls in line more with the classic games than the homing attack does. It isn't a measure of quality.
And now in Frontiers, we got BOTH the drop dash and homing attack… 😎😎🔥🔥
Having a child DROP DASH
😂😂
Getting sweaty palms from Smash Bros Competitive? DROP DASH!
Replying to a comment? DROP DASH!
Drop the load and hit the road
It turns out the drop dash was made for Sonic 3 the entire time, yet was replaced by the insta-shield last second.
0:41 I like how it apparently took you a full minute to do a spindash.
I didn't know about drop dash until I accidentally activated it. When I did, I immediately fell in love because that accident had such smooth momentum. Use it like mad. IMO, best Sonic special move aside from spin dash. Used together and it's incredible.
When i jump, i drop dash, i cant stop, HELP
M.B.M V2.0 what he means is that he has a huge habit of drop dashing and naturally does the drop dash out of habit
i love that Sonic finally has something that sets him apart from tails and knuckles in this game. in the older games tails and knuckles could do the spin dash AND could Fly and Glide making Sonic feel kinda inferior in a way.
Drop Dash gives Sonic his own unique ability that not only sets him apart from Tails and Knuckles but the Drop Dash also helps reinforce Sonics position as the Speedy one of the 3 allowing him to maintain his momentum more often. Drop Dash in my opinion should be a mainstay for future 2D sonic games
I contemplated before how to properly edit the homing attack in 3D, my solution was to nerf the homing range and buff the bounce off of enemies, so rather than just spamming the button, you're performing precision platforming by bouncing off enemies, and the homing attack would be kind of your method to bounce off of them in addition to giving a little bit of leeway if you were a bit off. Think like how Shovel Knight bounces off of enemies. I still stand by mine, but yours sounds more fun for a 2D space. I would like to have midair movement options like that and it sounds more interesting than a double jump.
For future 2D Sonics, I would like to have more movement options. I agree wholeheartedly about the Drop Dash, it is incredible, but I can't see why I have to sacrifice the Figure-8 to use it. Why can't figure 8 just be mapped to a different button or something? Come to think of it, why not give your "homing attack" pitch its own button as well?
Here's my pitch for a 2D Sonic game control scheme (Using Nintendo Switch buttons):
A/B = Jump.
A/B (hold in midair) = Drop Dash.
Y (hold) = Rev up Spin Dash.
Y (release) = Unleash Spin Dash.
X (hold) = Rev up Figure 8.
X (release) = Unleash Figure-8.
ZL/ZR = Your pitch for homing attack.
But that's just me. Anyone else want to say I'm stupid and wrong, feel free to. I'd like to hear your thoughts.
(And of course the original inputs for spin dash would have to stay in as an alternate input to make Sonic purists happy)
I think the devs wanted really bad to make Mania a one-button game just like the whole classic series. The only exception is that going Super is mapped to its own button. It goes a long way to keeping the game accessible to newcomers; you can press any of the four face buttons and they'll all do the same thing.
Oh I completely understand why they did it the way they did, and I don't think it's a bad approach at all. I just kind of want to see a 2D Sonic that really evolves the formula and goes a little more ambitious in the controls department, and I think Sonic Mania is a step in the right direction. In this game, they strayed a little from the classics by adding new stages and movement options. From a sequel, I'd like them to stray even further to give 2D Sonic a reinvention like the new Doom did for its series.
I gave a lot of movement options because that's something I really like in platformers. You don't often think about it, but Mario's got like seven kinds of jumps from just two buttons and a stick in Super Mario Galaxy.
+Michael Patton If there are gonna add the figure 8 back, they'll have to make it weaker than it was in sonic cd. Think about it, in sonic cd, the spindash was made super irrelevant just because, well, it was basically the same thing as the spindash but faster and with a cool animation. What they should do is extend the charging period to about 5 seconds so the spin dash wouldn't be completely irrelevant.
AwesomeG46 I don't believe it's that broken, if you run into an enemy you're going to take damage. It's actually a little situational if you think about it. But I can see your point about it defeating the purpose of the spin dash. Perhaps it doesn't need to be back that bad.
But I would still tweak the spin dash to be charged by holding a button rather than spammed, and maybe it maxes out after two seconds and has a super satisfying charge animation.
+Michael Patton The thing with the figure 8 though is that right after you let go, you can press down... then BOOM, no emenies can hurt you.
Also, the spindash is fine as it is. In 3d, it should be held down.
My uncle used to joke about sonic 2 being "when sonic was just a ball"
Well, since mania came out, I don't think I've seen him standing
The homing attack thing you were going on about reminds me of Srb2's Speed thok ability that they gave sonic. it didnt lock on to enemies but you had to time it. (2:20)
and also that one move that i forgot the name of in sonic adventure 1&2
Hey do you remember me man, I used to watch your old live streams. Anyways I'm glad you're getting immensely popular man.
I love the fact that it works really well for speedrunning a stage! I'm no speedrunner myself, haha, but the fact that it gives you an immediate speed boost if you know what you're doing means that you can keep using it to maintain a constant momentum as long as you keep making the right jumps! I practice with it a lot on Green Hill just to get the hang of it and the whole game is built so well to accommodate it and incentivize it while not making it a required skill. ^u^ I agree it makes your approach to stages so unique and fun and adds a new element of planning out your run so you constantly have that speed doing for you. Plus you don't need to rely on sluggish run buildup to get moving, so you can just hop right into a speed boost and be back on your merry way if you, say, hit a rock in your path or something. I like it! Good video too, you brought up lots of good points. Kudos!
I like all his abilities, I have made a combo using the insta shield, if you end up falling in a lava or spike you can time it perfectly and jump again doing it as much you want, but you need to time it, the cd is nice for a start up, when you stop and already want to go fast you dont need to go maximium, for the regular speed just unleash it early and its fine, the drop dash is nice when you hit wall so you can get all your momentum back by drop dashing, at the end of the day all sonic abilities are nice in their way, none is bad even for the homing attack
same all of his abilities on feels just right
I was hoping you would cover the Shoulder Button tricks and team shenanigans in Sonic Advance 3 which actually serve as interesting mid-air and ground based skills which serve a similar purpose to the Drop Dash even if limited to bouncing off certain objects for the mid air tricks.
I can agree on Mania even if I haven't taken the time to get it yet... Now is the time.
2:29 probably took more budget than sonic '06
The Homing Attack does take away the cool feeling of bouncing on enemies in 2D Sonic. You mentioned a non-homing Homing Attack, which I assume is like the Thok from Sonic Robo Blast 2. I like the idea of that feature, but I think the Drop Dash is still better.
I think the difference is in how the games are meant to be played mania is just like the classics where knowing the level is important if you want to go fast and get a good score where 4 was at least trying to be like the modern/adventure games where the levels are more like a Mario level where you have to know the mechanics not the level. Eventually the design principals of the genesis games would be broken if the homing attack was introduced, if it were in a 2D game that was designed more like modern/adventure games it wouldn't be bad. However Sonic 4 shows that the styles of the classic and modern, know the levels and know the game can't be in the same game, at least not with a large degree of difficulty. But who knows perhaps someone will make a good game with both styles but I think that doing so would make both of them worse sonic in the classic games has a small move set that (for the most part) can be fully understood without a tutorial and so you can focus on finding a path trough the levels through several plays of it. Modern Sonic's games have some degree of branching paths but due to the fact that being fast in 3D is hard the difficulty comes from mastering the move set. So the Homing Attack could work in 2D but not a true genesis 2D. The drop dash mostly just optimizes the existing game play of Classic Sonic without breaking the formula of Classic Sonic. In conclusion it could work but it couldn't be a Classic Sonic game it would have to be a 2D modern game.
TLDR
You are technically wrong, but your points are valid could be used to make a whole new genre of Sonic game.
My only complaint is that you can't force Sonic to roll into a ball/preform the drop dash from anything but a jump. Like, if you spin off the floor, you can't drop dash while airborne. It HAS to be from a jump.
Have you ever played that Sonic fangame thats based on CD's style? Where you can press the crouch button to roll into a ball when in the air? If that was in Mania, it would be perfect.
It even show's him doing this in the opening animation of both CD and Mania, yet it isn't in the game. It can really mess with the fluidity when you accidentally run off the edge of something, leaving you unable to preform the drop dash to keep momentum.
I think you're talking about Sonic Utopia, and it's beautiful.
The drop dash is pretty satisfying. I love charging it up mid air, bouncing on a few badniks, then landing on the ground at blistering speeds
2:25 so a fire shield with sonic
tbh, never knew the drop dash was a thing before this video. Thanks Gamechamp
I like sonic4
I like sonic mania
Is that ....
....
Wrong?
Nah, like what you wanna like.
Jamill Moore only like Sonic Mania because that is what I say and if you disagree you are stupid
This was a joke I think
Oh baby what is you doing?
*LE GASP* another has joined our ranks
*Le welcomes u to the one group of 3 people who like both sonic 4 and mania*
I actually enjoyed playing Sonic 4 I and II because they were my first experience with Sonic games
It’s like you’re making commercials for Sonic Abilities. It’s freaking great.
The homing attack doesn't work for 2d games, making it to the top of a level should be rewarded for skill, not pressing A alot. It makes enemies too easy to defeat, it makes everything too easy!
I didn't think I'd be using that Drop Dash all that much, but I found it was extremely helpful when you needed to boost forward on a dime.
Drop Dash > Spin Dash
The most untrue lie I have flipping heard!!!!!
The gushing part of this video is just super adorable XD
Tails: Jump twice to go up (fly)
Knuckles: Jump twice to go left or right (glide)
Sonic: Jump twice to go down (drop dash)
It seems somewhat evident that it should have been like this from the beginning, from a play mechanics sense. Not sure how Sonic affects gravity to suddenly drop out of the air, but whatever. It also makes Spin Dash looks like a really heavy handed game mechanic to address building momentum. Homing attacks can be part of some shield, if there's a need for it.
Also, I like Sonic 4 for what it is. The physics suck, the graphics aren't quite on, trying for this 2D With Depth thing, but I dig the context sensitive team techniques that allow you to use Tails even while in a single player game.
The drop dash doesn't direct velocity downward. All it does is allow you to immediately enter a spindash-like state as soon as you touch the ground. You can touch the ground anywhere, however; your movement in the air is totally unaltered.
Actually there was a shield that allowed you to do a homing attack in Sonic 3D Blast.
Going downs for the MIGHTIEST of men
I know you were talking about the mechanic in 2D specifically, but there's actually a 3D sonic fangame that uses a move similar to your suggested "homing" attack. In Sonic Robo Blast 2, if Sonic presses jump in the air he'll suddenly launch forwards at high speed, and if you're good enough at it you can bounce off of enemies and maintain momentum while gaining height to cross huge gaps. It's called the Speed Thok after the noise it makes.
Although I'd reccomend waiting a little before playing SRB2, if only because v2.2 is coming out soon, and that looks like it's going to be amazing.
WHY WOULD YOU WANT THE HOMING ATTACK IN A 2D SONIC GAME?!
*AGAIN?!?!??!?/1/1/1/?!///1/*
Internet police come after me: I LIKE SONIC 4.
I will fight with you side by side
Sonic 4 isn't a bad game in general, it's just a bad *Sonic* game.
it a game made for baby
it easy and no fun
baby gaem
I literally didn't know you could do this until this video popped up in my suggested feed.... mind blown
2:25 yes just like Super Sonic in Sonic 3
Pickle Cat and the homing attack is locked and not that good
"Where is Cybershell?!"
A man of culture, this one.
In your thanks at the end, the Japanese text 「ありがとうございますです」doesn't make sense grammatically. It roughly translates to "[I] is thank you." You want to leave out the 「です」(Desu) so that it's just 「あらいがとうございます」(Arigatou gozaimasu).
Or, if you want to be super thankful to your patrons, you could write 「どうもありがとうございます」(Doumo arigato gozaimasu).
Glad I'm not the only one to notice.
Can't desu also be a tic? Granted that's probably only in spoken Japanese, but still...
You're missing the point. It's intentionally ungrammatical, it's a joke.
+Keiran Blazier What would be the point of making that joke? It's not funny. Most people wouldn't even understand it. It was clearly unintentional.
"Most people wouldn't even understand it."
"Do a Drop Dash" is going to be the new "Do a Barrel Roll".
loving the new types of vids man next do why sonic IS better than mario or why mario is better than sonic
CAPTAIN BUTTERS 435 Sonic wins with one word: Physics.
Mario then wins with another:
Mustache.
Winning is all about the facial hair.
+CAPTAIN BUTTERS 435
2d sonic>>2d mario
3d sonic and 3d mario
Debatable
counter argument: mario only has hair on his head and face, sonics body is covered with hair and quills, which are basically super hairs. his entire body is one powerful mustache.
A powerful mustache that can cut through (or, at least, damage) metal.
One of the most Important changes in mania is that doing a rolling jump still lets you move!
Drop dash.
Enough said.
#DropDash
I *LOVE* the Dropdash, but it's only useful for speedrunners/speedy players (like me), but the insta-shield is also, but I find it more useful with perfect timing.
Also it's called *HOMING* Attack, it's meant to keep you stationary, Homing as in that's its new home, Attack as in it's attacking you. You don't see a missle aim at something, blow up, and keep going...
Toasty eh dropdash can be used by anyone
I don't think it's faithful AT ALL. In the genesis games (that I happen to love btw, so pls hear me out) you would often come to a grinding halt. The spin dash was how you would approach inclines if you were too slow to overcome them. Speed was often only given to the most skilled, veteran players who were wary of the terrain.
The drop dash COMPLETELY changes the game's dynamics. Sonic can now be fast WHENEVER HE WANTS. Skill still rewards the player with not dying and maintaining speed, but the reward of speed itself is almost a given.
Some people (weirdo purists) might consider this a "bad" thing, but I LOOOOOOOOVVVVVVEEEEE being fast. I love that I can maintain momentum so much more easily in this game.
Sonic Mania is honestly the future for 2d sonic. The only thing that I wish they did was make knuckles' glide ability more rewarding. Just by initiating the glide and releasing from it, most momentum is lost and landing is really slow. If they could keep the speed up like in post Sonic&Knuckles games like sonic adventure 2, I would really appreciate it. Until then, I find Knuckles to not be that great of a character to play.
the drop dash reminds me of wavedashing, its pretty neat.
Okay, okay, let me fix that title for you.
Why Sonic 4's Homing Attack Is Awesome (And Mania On The Title For Views)
2:29
That's the most quality animation I've ever seen. 10/10 👏👏👏👏
drop dash good
Drop dash is an amazing addition to sonic's moveset. It is orthodox and methodical enough while providing a subtle addition to his movement options. I think it's one of the best additions that they could have made without changing the classic sonic formula. They should build on this by making insta shield always available as well. Not sure how I feel about the peel-out. It's cool but I feel it's not in line with classic sonic's momentum based gameplay since it trivializes the spindash
Thing is I don't know why it took them this long to give him a move like that. Rock Mario can do this also.
I'm gonna be real here...Sonic Mania's a great game. I just beat it yesterday. But even with saying that, I honestly never found the Drop Dash to be useful. It's a cute little move for Classic Sonic noobs who don't know how to play these sorts of games, but even then, they rarely use it anyways. The move isn't only a weaker version of the original Spin Dash, but can get you mucked over far more than usual when you shouldn't have in the first place. I have a multitude of other issues with this game, but the Drop Dash is a pretty big one. It's also not a very hard move to activate by pure accident, since it's a "hold" button activation. I can't stand that garbage.
I ended up using a cheat table to hack the game to allow me to use Peel-Out and Insta-Shield since those are really the only Classic Sonic moves worth even using, if available, and EVEN THEN, they HEAVILY nerfed the Insta-Shield to a point where it no longer serves much else of a purpose other than to make you THINK it's a good move, when it really isn't. It's invincibility frames are utter BS and it's range sucks SO hard, it's not funny. The fact you can't even use it, and Peel-Out ON THEIR OWN, with a SAVE, is appalling to say the least. This game's wonderful, and while it does indeed deserve the praise it's received, I also hope some people start to notice the glaring flaws in it's design.
As for the Homing Attack, while I understand why you're using Sonic 4 as your example (it's an official Sonic game, and it's also Sonic 4), I think you should actually use the fan-made ROMHack, Sonic Megamix, as your example. The Homing Attack/Air Dash in Megamix is absolutely amazing, and it allows you to not only build up speed, but feel safer in midair whenever going through utterly hard areas. Megamix would've been IMPOSSIBLE for me without that, as well as the Light Speed Dash as a nice bonus, so I can firmly agree about it's use in a 2D field. There's also Sonic CD, a game I usually can't play well, that was given a ROMHack modification known as Sonic CD++, which added not only the Sonic 2 Spin Dash, but also the Megamix Homing Attack.
The Homing Attack's a good move, and I think people bashed it just because of Sonic 4 not doing well overall, blaming things for it's failure that were never really a factor to begin with...
Clearly you don't do speedrunning.
The drop dash is AMAZING for going fast and losing as less speed as possible.
It's like making a charged spindash without stopping, at the cost of less power than a fully charged one.
Sure, but not everyone's a speed runner. The fact it's the only move you can use with saves active is outright proof they left it to be the ONLY move you use for the most part when booting up Mania. That's a very small purpose for such a hugely supported new move. In comparison to moves such as Homing Attack/Air Dash, and the ORIGINAL Insta-Shield from Sonic 3, it doesn't have near as many practical uses. I even find the Peel-Out to have more practical uses than Drop Dash, and I've already had my issues with THAT move as is.
I don't know, I'm not a speed runner, and I think it's super useful once you practice using it. I use it all the time now.
Christal Blue tl;dr?
To each their own, Still if people how to use the Drop Dash, excluding on the easy instruction on how to do it. Then it makes going through levels a breeze more. Used well you can at least have that sense of speed, and it helps with time attack and speedrunning altogether, but that's been discussed already. I'm just saying that when used well, people can get something out of it, going through levels fast.
Please do not waive that in my face it looks rather sharp and on fire! We need more of this...
In fan-game Sonic Robo Blast 2 Sonic have move called "Speed Thok" which allows him to do something like homing attack but without actual homing. It's just gives him some altitude and acceleraion, so you can use that to move more freely in air and clear wide gaps
I use the drop dash all the time. It makes the game so much more fun! I think it's the best thing ever and it's as much as a step forward as the spin dash when it was introduced in Sonic 2.
What you describe at 2:30 is a technique Sonic has in Sonic Advance 3 when teamed up with Cream. It's also technically a homing attack there but the homing range is so small that element is pretty much irrelevant, serving almost exclusively as a speedy forward launch.
The "no homing homing attack" has existed since Sonic 3, in the fire shield
2:30 Leaked footage of Sonic Mania in pre-alpha.
The Drop Dash (and Sonic's superior super form compared a to the others) made Sonic my favourite character to play as in Mania. In other games I just prefer using Tails or Knuckles because they have better abilities that make it easier to get through the levels and/or beat certain bosses, but the Drop Dash is so satisfying, useful and easy to use that I prefer playing as Sonic now.
I love it. I just like the fact that I can get better momentum when I hit the ground rather than having to charge it up first.
I love the drop dash! I think it should be a move in every new classic game. The drop dash is so much fun to use especially for speed running.
I while knowing about it, couldn't figure out how to do it for the life of me when I wanted and it pissed me off having to rely only on the spin dash when it just didn't work for some areas.
I thank you for explaining it. :P
Congratulations on 100k Subs
There was an attack in the recent Shovel knight DLC (The spectre one), where you dash towards a locked on target (or wall thing) and then fling away with forward momentum. I feel like if Sonic Mania 2 has lock on, it should be like that (as opposed to momentum-halting) and it could even be used in puzzle platforming
I think the Drop Dash was a genius mechanic that I had never anticipated myself using much. But the fact that it's a compromise between the spin dash and rolling/running forward, I find myself using it notably often without neglecting the spin dash. It allows me to keep up momentum and speed without ever really stopping-I can go fast in any direction at any time. If I feel myself slowing down or needing to change the way my momentum is functioning, I can use it and not feel that I'm at the mercy of the physics or that the game is being broken; it's a more natural addition to Sonic's arsenal than even the Insta-Shield. But at the same time, if I'm already at a stop (i.e. the momentum of gameplay has already halted), I can use a spindash and get much more speed right out of the gate. The Drop Dash allows the player to keep the game moving and remain fluid, while the spindash allows the player to start that back up as soon as possible. They were able to find the best way to optimize speed without taking control out of the hands of the player (quite observable in many sections of Sonic 2 where the player was locked into the momentum of a roll with no way to escape until they gained enough control to change the way Sonic moved). The Drop-Dash mitigates this issue by only removing control from the player while they're in the air after their jump, a choice that has its own consequences with the responsibility left entirely to the player. It's so much more *fair*, since whenever the player's actions land them in a position they don't want to be in, there's no blaming the physics of the game. They chose to make that action, and the Drop-Dash allows them to change their movement if a hazard is approaching without sacrificing speed and mobility.
I also think that incorporating the homing attack into 2D Sonic would require some tweaking. I personally believe the Drop-Dash is a much better tactic in 2D Sonic, but I also think they could make the homing attack work (albeit not as well) if it were made to propel momentum forward rather than redirect velocity upward after it hits and enemy. If it were akin to jumping on an enemy's head in Mario games (preserving forward momentum), and if used when there are no enemies around, acting like a small version of the fire shield dash, I think it could work. In its current state the homing attack assists in the flow of gameplay where technique is important (such as enemy chains), but for a game focused on moving to the right as fast as possible, it could use some work.
I feel much the same way about Crash Bandicoot's Spin Attack. In most 2D platformers, the only way to attack enemies is to jump on their heads. Some games, like Super Mario Bros., do give the player a projectile option, but it can only be used if they have collected a specific power-up, and only until they take damage. With a 3D platformer, there is now a third axis that needs to be managed, meaning that it becomes much harder to actually land your jump, especially on a moving target. Jumping is no longer a sufficient means of attacking, so the developers need to provide an additional offensive maneuver. Some such maneuvers are better than others, however. To use a comparative example, Super Mario 64 lets Mario punch whatever is directly in front of him. However, its hitbox is so small that Mario will only land the hit if he is directly facing his target AND if the target is less than half his height away. And the punch itself lasts only a quarter of a second, meaning if you press B too early, you're getting a Goomba foot to the face. Not only that, but punching makes Mario lose almost all his momentum while running, and bounces off wharever he punches, severely hindering the player's movement. With Crash Bandicoot, however, NaughtyDog gave him a Spin Attack, which is a much more viable combat option. The hitbox surrounds the entire character model, so it doesn't matter what direction the enemy is coming at you from, nor does it matter which way Crash is facing. Not only that, but Crash can use the Spin while mid-air, or while moving, or both, and loses almost no horizontal speed in the process. He also doesn't stop or bounce when he hits something, and the hitbox lasts almost 3/4 of a second, meaning there is much more margin for error (which is helpful, considering how difficult the first game was!). The Spin Attack is a move which is easy to use and feels fluid to execute, and *I love it!*
When Lord Gamechamp the pizzahentai master noticed you
I love the drop dash. I totally do that drop dash restless thing after an act while I wait for the score to pop up!
I didn't even know this was in the game. As soon as I unlocked the Super Peel Out, I set that as my ability and never looked back
This channel is amazing. Subbed
I played to the desert zone with the magician guy without ever learning this was a thing.
Drop dash is a godsend for when you are speedrunning and i pretty sure it was design that way, When you know your routes in a stage, sonic mania run look soooo smooth.
Your voice is so relaxing.
Your fixed homing attack sounds like Sonic Robo Blast 2's Speed Thok
"LOOK AT HOW SO SPEED!!!"
"Please do not wave that at me it looks rather sharp and on fire!"😂
Sonic 4: My ability makes the game easier to control, allowing for an easier experience.
Sonic Mania: *already five miles away* NYOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM
The Drop Dash would have made a lot of sense as an inclusion in Sonic Adventure, since you can activate a Spindash at any time in that game as long as you charge it enough. In addition, it would be a really great addition to the 3D games in general, since if you miss a jump, you can just roll into the enemy instead.
However, another option for Sonic's airborne moveset that I find particularly appealing is the Bullet Dash. This move, a momentum-affected move where Sonic performs an aimable spin dash midair in order to change the direction or speed of a jump, takes the same concepts which the homing attack and the drop dash introduce, and raises the skill ceiling beyond that of either of them. It was originally hinted at in the Sonic CD intro, in which Sonic gains some speed whilst curling in the air to tunnel through a boulder, used many times in the Sonic OVA as a quasi-homing attack, appeared as a move (I think it was part of the spin dash) in Smash 4 (Sonic could activate the spin dash in midair and dash toward the ground), and is now an essential move in a fangame called Sonic Freedom. In various incarnations of the move, when performing it Sonic will either keep moving, enter a bullet-time state for better precision, or freeze in the air for a few seconds. This lasts until the button is let go.
Essentially, this move is a drop dash but you can do more things with it, and you need to charge and aim it.
I had no idea drop dash existed when I played.
The Drop Dash is awesome! It effectively makes a Sonic playthrough of mania into by far the quickest as it's a Sonic exclusive move and makes the game a joy to speedrun. While I'd like to see more options this so far is pretty damn good. Perhaps a homing attack could be included with an additional character, perhaps they could include Shadow in Sonic Mania 2 and give him the homing attack... who knows.
That's why you have the fire shield. It basically does what you'd want from the homing attack
"Please do not wave that in mY FACE IT LOOKS RATHER SHARP AND ON FIRE-"
This video literally taught me how to drop dash.
At first I didn't get the Drop Dash and didn't know how to use it but now I use it all the time.
I enjoy the drop dash when I do it but I always forget that it exists