I like how you reference Zaitsev's notes, before mentioning the film portrays him as illiterate. It got me to go "Of course that's false" when it came up.
Should be noted, order 227 only specified that soldiers should not retreat PAST their current position. If you advanced on the enemy, met too strong of a resistance and then fell back to your original position, that wasn't considered a violation of the order. Even if you did fall back farther and were caught by barrier troops, the officer was put before a tribunal, if he had a good tactical reason for falling back they usually let them go, there's records of officers providing a good reason for falling back and being allowed to return to command with no or little reprimand from the tribunal.
Add to this, majority of soldiers who actually retreated due to cowardice were actually often than not sent back to the frontlines. They couldn't just waste resources on killing a soldier or sending said soldier to prison.
Until that one time where Stalin's son's artillery battery was overrun and would not command the unit to retreat because of his relation to his father. However, I think this action took place before Order 227. Stalin's dislike for retreat and surrendering units was known and maybe this was some of the impetus behind 227? World War II Russia is not an area that I'm super familiar with, so if anyone else knows, holler! And perhaps I'm going out on a limb, in my mind, Yakov Dzhugashvili was most likely a better man than his father.
@@Nosliw837 The impetus for 227, as the video says, was that panic was beginning to set into the Red Army as a result of the fact that the Wehrmacht were making rapid gains during the opening stages of Barbarossa, and Stalin and the Politburo realised something had to be done to ensure morale remained high and emphasise the fact that the war against the Nazi invasion was one not just of political survival, but survival of the entire Slavic ethnicity in the face of a planned genocide. Besides, of those detained as a result of Order 227, the overwhelming majority were sent back to their units because the majority of those caught by barrier troops were either separated from their units and lost during a retreat or had retreated further than expected and had a tactical reason to do so. A smaller proportion were punished by being sent to a penal battalion or, a lesser punishment, being demoted if it was felt there was no justifiable reason for the retreat. A very small percentage of the total number of soldiers caught by Barrier Troops were actually executed, and even then it was for repeatedly deserting from, what the Soviets rightfully understood, was a fight for the very survival of Slavic people and every other ethnicity in the USSR and other Socialist states.
@@nmeister007 Another interesting tidbit is that veterans of the Red Army from back then remember this order as being exactly what they needed and made them decide to make their stand against the until then undefeated german summer offensives.
@@The4thResidentofEvil It's not as clear cut as saying they would have won the war or lost the war. Lend lease arrived after the successful defense of Moscow, could the red army have moved to Berlin without it? probably not, they may not have been able to even get them out of their own borders, but the aid offered was absolutely crucial
I highly recommend everyone to watch Russian/Soviet war movies. They have nothing to do with American war movies. Not that there are no amazing American war movies, of course. But these are focused on the soldiers and their heroism. Soviet war movies, on the other hand, show very few war scenes. The few we see show no pride in even killing the Nazi soldiers (unlike they do in Inglorious Basterds), and most movies are centered in soldiers AND the civilians. In the USSR, everyone was involved 24/7 in the war effort, whether in the front or in factories. The moral of every movie was to send an anti-war message. 'The Cranes are Flying' of 1957 by Kalatozov would be a great start to Russian war cinema
As a person who lived in the Eastern block during communism, I can tell every single movie which is made in the west doesnt capture the point. It simply didnt happen thatway. Those KGB guys marching with machine guns in the streets intimidating everyone who dares to say anything against the premiere, thats not how it was. They dont dare to show the real thing because its kindof similar how they would crackdown on dissent in the west. Noone cared if some talked bad about the party leadership up until the point that he didnt do it in the media. and even then they would simply fire some from his job, they wouldnt bother following someone everywhere. Some had to be very influential to have thatkind of KGB surveillance on him, but thats not that dissimilar from the FBI shadowing Martin Luther King. yes of course the KGB had moles everywhere but generally not to monitor individuals, but potential organizations dangerous for the state. It was kindof legal to protest, if some protested along the party narratives, for example some could organize a protest against Vietnam, but if someone would have tried to protest against the occupation of Czechoslovakia that would be cracked down, something similar what they are trying to do with the Palestinian protests. People were very rarely coerced not to dissent, everyone knew that in order to get ahead in life, some had to silence himself, and attend some meetings. there were even multiple parties, the communist party, the peasant party, of course those were all communists, but the facade was there, a little bit similarly how the mainstream parties behaving nowadays. It was way more subtle than as it is portrayed in western movies, and in some ways very similar of how they handle their populace. Thats the reason of common Russians find these western movies insulting, because its so obvious cartoon propaganda, they know the reality, and the agenda, that these movies arent made for them, but western audiences to crack down on dissent amongst their ranks.
We need more voices like yours from people who actually experienced the thing, and not western propaganda-fed people or gen Z east europeans who only got to see the aftermath of the cold war
Most don't know how to read the Scriptures, because if they did, they would understand that the collection of misfits in Canaan(or "Palestine") that calls themselves "Israel", are NOT the Hebrews of the Texts. That most believe they are, demonstrates that they are a Member of the Congregation of the Dead(spiritually). The Oxymoronic Judeo-Christian Godspel, has done it's work very well. Hopeless Cultists, calling themselves "Christian", acting like Satan(which simply means "Accuser") Praying to dead gods, instead of to Yahweh Elohim. Sad, very sad. Is it moral for you to forcibly rob your neighbors, to pay for things you think society should do? How many "people" "voting" for such immorality, makes it moral?? Think on that, eh? And when you pathetically agree to "Vote" for a "ruling class", can you truly be surprised when their immorality spills over onto you??? GROW UP. Reflect on this: Voting IS Praying to a spiritually dead god, Government. We are praying for it's blessings upon Our just causes, are We not?? All organized "Religion" is just another mental Prison. Government and Religion, are the "Gifts" granted unto this World, by the Light-Bringer. His other name, "Satan", which simply means "the Accuser", is carried by all, who join the Congregation of the Spiritually Dead, and pick their "side"; whether Communist vs Capitalist, Catholic vs Baptist, Left vs Right, Red vs Blue, Muslim vs Jew. These "factions" ACCUSE each the other, of trying to bring about Chaos. Behaviour that is as Satanic as the Day is Long, which causes Those who were brought to Earth most recently(roughly 7600 years now), to abandon Their Mission of Deliverance of this World, from these two "Gifts" of Satan, the Devil, "Lucifer". Think on it just a moment... Do not Governments facilitate the Mass murder, mass theft, and rape of this world's resources?? Do not Religions, tell their adherents that all other religions are missing the Truth? Accusers All, meant to Keep the Populace of this blood-soaked, mud-covered bar-magnet of a planet, DIVIDED AND FALLEN. Keep Reflecting, Little Flock. The number of the Mark of the Beast is 666, which actually breaks into 6x60x600. 216,000. Every hominid has 144.000 genetic expressions in their DNA; 72K from the male progenitor, and 72K from the female progenitor. This "mRNA" "Vaccine" CAN change your 144K to 216,000, by splicing a third set of genetic expressions into your DNA... Sorry folks. CRISPR technology, forbidden Fruits yet again, being "eaten". Fear not, Little Flock. Judgement is Soon.
Most don't know how to read the Scriptures, because if they did, they would understand that the collection of misfits in Canaan(or "Palestine") that calls themselves "Israel", are NOT the Hebrews of the Texts. That most believe they are, demonstrates that they are a Member of the Congregation of the Dead(spiritually). The Oxymoronic Judeo-Christian Godspel, has done it's work very well. Hopeless Cultists, calling themselves "Christian", acting like Satan(which simply means "Accuser") Praying to dead gods, instead of to Yahweh Elohim. Sad, very sad. Is it moral for you to forcibly rob your neighbors, to pay for things you think society should do? How many "people" "voting" for such immorality, makes it moral?? Think on that, eh? And when you pathetically agree to "Vote" for a "ruling class", can you truly be surprised when their immorality spills over onto you??? GROW UP. Reflect on this: Voting IS Praying to a spiritually dead god, Government. We are praying for it's blessings upon Our just causes, are We not?? All organized "Religion" is just another mental Prison. Government and Religion, are the "Gifts" granted unto this World, by the Light-Bringer. His other name, "Satan", which simply means "the Accuser", is carried by all, who join the Congregation of the Spiritually Dead, and pick their "side"; whether Communist vs Capitalist, Catholic vs Baptist, Left vs Right, Red vs Blue, Muslim vs Jew. These "factions" ACCUSE each the other, of trying to bring about Chaos. Behaviour that is as Satanic as the Day is Long, which causes Those who were brought to Earth most recently(roughly 7600 years now), to abandon Their Mission of Deliverance of this World, from these two "Gifts" of Satan, the Devil, "Lucifer". Think on it just a moment... Do not Governments facilitate the Mass murder, mass theft, and rape of this world's resources?? Do not Religions, tell their adherents that all other religions are missing the Truth? Accusers All, meant to Keep the Populace of this blood-soaked, mud-covered bar-magnet of a planet, DIVIDED AND FALLEN. Keep Reflecting, Little Flock. The number of the Mark of the Beast is 666, which actually breaks into 6x60x600. 216,000. Every hominid has 144.000 genetic expressions in their DNA; 72K from the male progenitor, and 72K from the female progenitor. This "mRNA" "Vaccine" CAN change your 144K to 216,000, by splicing a third set of genetic expressions into your DNA... Sorry folks. CRISPR technology, forbidden Fruits yet again, being "eaten". Fear not, Little Flock. Judgement is Soon.
Doing that simultaneous to putting Nazi aligned political projects back in power in Eastern Europe was the clearest example of American ideology that I can think of.
The funniest and most ridiculous sh*t that the american political elite and the corporate media does is that they accuse the russians of meddling in the 2016 presidential election for which there is no credible evidence presented to this day, just a flimsy report from the us government on the matter. However nobody has said a thing when the americans openly supported and likely interfere in the 1996 russian presidential elections where Yeltsin the candidate with the lowest popularity and approval rating amongst the populace somehow won.
This is a fantastic video. As a child, I watched Enemy at the Gates over a dozen times, and it drove part of my interest in history that I have today. As I grew and especially as I began to make content regarding history, I realized how much of the content that motivated me was hilariously off the mark, but there was always a nugget of truth and I find that once I learned the real history, the tales of our past are so much more intricate and interesting than the flat narratives of good and evil. Loved your video and can't wait to see more.
He seems to think the movie just shouldn't have been made unless it was willing to portray Zaitsev as Communist rather than just a general, apolitical patriot-which a US film wouldn't have been willing to do. I think having a mainstream US movie about the battle with a few unsurprising omissions and exaggerations is valuable rather than outrageous and I think the movie did depict the Soviet soldiers as heroic and the battle as a big achievement even while still being against the Communist system and leaders.
it's kind of a crap video, it takes some unsupported statement so outlandish that even the talkshow host wants to yeet himself out of a window it would be like quoting the japanese suicide cults leader that caused the terrorist attack on the subway and then talk about how it reflects japanese society also enemy at the gates is already infamous for inaccuracy in germany part of post war history is denazification (or more accurately the failure of) including taking wehrmacht generals memoirs at face value, as well as transferring alot of former Nazis into positions of power in military, secret services, justice system and government
What I feel like is also warranted to point, as you briefly mentioned, is that Stalingrad wasn't important becaused it was named after Stalin, but rather because being able to keep it would prevent the Nazis from occupying the oil fields in the Caucasus. People think that Barbarossa was just Hitler being dumb or something, but well, first, not invading the USSR wasn't an option because he was Hitler, and second, people forget that wars are about resources, which includes stuff like gas, oil, and all those other pesky things we need to construct and run things. Like, it's not just about who has the coolest tanks and the most fantastical technology. This is precisely why I wanted to elaborate on this because people never talk about that and just go 'well, if Hitler didn't just go invade Russia like that...'
@Zoomer Stasi yes, but the point being made is that nazi ideology demands a purge of subhumans i.e. the population of the soviet union, therefore destruction of their state was considered necessary
@Zoomer Stasi I think you have that flipped around. Halder still wanted to chase his own objectives in ending the war, and no doubt the higher ups were doing the same thing. It was Hitler who was focused on taking the resource rich area of Ukraine and the Caucuses. Halder intentionally sabotaged the operations in the southern theater precisely because he wanted the army to focus on Moscow.
Hitler wanted to invade the USSR because he wanted to colonise Eastern Europe. The point of the war against Western Europe was just a ‘tool’ he need for his real objectives in the East.
I think it's important to point out that the reasons for invading the USSR were more than just ideological 'he was Hitler' stuff - the entire point of the war, really, was to secure territory, 'lebensraum', to support a new German economy that could resist capitalist collapse. Generalplan Ost was explicitly a plan to enact settler-colonialism on the territories of the USSR, massacring the populace and replacing them with 'wehrbauer' peasant settlers, which would vastly reduce the power of not only socialism in the USSR, but of the German proletariat, by shifting so much of the economy out of their hands and opening up fresh new domains for the expansion of capital. The war, the genocide, everything, was the direct and logical result of capitalism in deep and final economic crisis - and having already faced numerous socialist uprisings within its own borders.
What confuses me the most is that majority of the USSR countries got more than sufficient literacy rates than most countries at the time because of the communal education system. So it honestly baffles me when they're treated as illiterate morons compared to the west. Even countries who adopted Communist ideals outside the USSR had literacy skyrocketed like Cuba.
What is up with communist sympathizers and mentioning literacy rates. As if the ability to read somehow makes you smart. You have to be able to read to understand Karl Marx but that doesn't mean anything that moron had to say led to anything but poverty. I don't know, maybe being able to read is a big deal in communist countries because they definitely can't think
That was primarily done to ensure the populace moves up from entirely ignorant peasants to mostly ignorant peasants who now know Marx and the occasional state propaganda.
It's kind of insane to me how prevalent the idea has become that the USSR's massive loss of life during WWII was because human life was not valued and soldiers were "cannon fodder", instead of ya know, the USSR having to bear the brunt of the Nazi's assault as well as the genocide that was the General Ostplan. It's even more annoying vecause you just know that if it was any of the Western powers who lost that many people in battle, it would be all about the incredible bravery and self-sacrifice of those who fought for the liberation of Europe
@@mynamejeff3545 The French, the Norwegians and so on had the luxury of being able to surrender and keep their losses low. Not so the Russians, they knew what would happen if they did.
@@mynamejeff3545 Ironically it's the US that loves human wave attacks (attacks intentionally using solely infantry without combined arms support or expecting a lot of casualties). Not even China used human wave tactics in Korea because those were skirmishing, infiltration teams and why most of the time they did not find bodies which the US also tried to spin into something nefarious.
@@ThomasPalm-w5y True. And it was like this throughout the entire Eastern front, Poles for example were brutally treated by the Germans also. I read somewhere, don't remember where, that after the war a French civilian and a Pole met, and the second one said to the first "You don't what the war was. In Paris restaurants and theaters were always open and life was almost normal".
One infuriating detail about this "stereotype" that the soviets were always killing their own people is that the germans also killed a lot of their own people. Their "undesirables" included not only civilians but also "coward" soldiers that had suffered trauma during combat.
I’m not sure what your point is. Are you saying that the Germans also killed their own people, and so it was located the Soviets did it? I don’t think that’s what you’re saying but I’m not sure what your point is.
@@hashtagunderscore3173 What you mean "it was located the Soviets did it"? I don't understand this sentence. About what I meant, just re-read my first comment. I'm complaining that this widespread stereotype that the soviets were always killing and "gulaging" their own is most part propaganda (you can see this occurring today, when represents of the European Union and in media comments about the war in Ukraine and say that the Russians "aren't like them and don't hare the same civilized values"), while it's equality a result of propaganda that you don't usually knows the Nazis killed a lot of their own population and soldiers. Everyone theoretically knows how the Nazis were bad and murderous, but in practice most most are unaware of all the peoples they killed. It may be hard to see, but the Nazis where whitewashed.
This movie seems to draw imagery from WW1 and then assigning it to Stalingrad-era red army. On the beginning of WW1 major supply problems with Russia and outdated doctrine of bayonet charging resulted in several documents assaults where soldiers were expected to pick up arms of fallen soldiers. But besides the supply issue, early WW1 was a massacre for almost every party involved, as the old charge doctrine faced machine guns and artillery. The First World War by Martin Gilbert documents suicidal charges by Germans, Austrians and Austro-Hungarians. Luigi Cadorna, the Italian commander, was famous for throwing man at the meat grinder and blaming the losses on "lack of fighting spirit" My guess is that the director used these events of the WW1 as inspiration for the movie, in a blatant disregard to historical accuracy.
There is a phrase that is often used to describe this situation during WWI as "one rifle for three soldiers", which many people remember since school, but they forget that it was applied to WWI, and will use it to describe WWII. And many anti-soviet stories start to build their narrative on this fallacy. You will find too many people in post-soviet countries believing it, along with many other myths. Post-modern at it's best.
The primary inspiration for Enemy at the Gates is Stalingrad, written by a British "gentleman historian", Antony Beevor. Just like the movie, the book is more interested in smearing the legacy of the USSR than any factual recounting of history.
I am sorry, i got upset by the German woman at the beginning of your video. Obviously she forgets that under the austerity measures by IMF to Greece period 2008 onwards, the Greek hospitals did not have money to provide bandages to the patients. That was predominately imposed by the Germans who wanted to 'punish' the lavish Greek State. So, where was the solidarity of EU and mainly the Germans? I am sorry, but Russia had to cut gas supply to Germany. Let them pay now 4 times up the US LNG.
thank you for bringing this up! As a Greek I've grown tired of the Germans giving the title of "European" wherever they like it as a continuation to the title of "honourary Arian"! Bad habits never die!
I really like Enemy at the Gates from a standpoint of it just being, you know, a movie. Taken on its own, a lot of the scenes genuinely are cool and get a hell of a rise out of me. But seeing how many people's understanding of Eastern Front history is basically wholly formed by it has soured me on it.
You might want to try some Russian cinema that deals with WW2, then. Try "White Tiger" - it's a (very) fictitious story, but it still manages to feel far, far more authentic than this piece of trashy propaganda.
@@flippydaflip5310 White Tiger does end with a rather nationalist notion that Russia is in inherent state of antagonism with the rest of the world, who are potentially just as evil as the Nazis for wanting nothing more than to take advantage of the poor Slavic people, and the general "well that's just how things are!" mindset. Which is the same kind of nationalism and propaganda condemned in the video, only from another side.
The saying is hyperbole, but its interesting to note that most soviet battalions had a company specifically equipped entirely with SMGs like the PPS41 and PPS42 by mid war. Special "tank rider" battalions more so, with 4 companies being equipped with such. Assault engineer battalions were equipped with automatic weapons alone.
@@SusCalvin another Cold War myth. The UK received more Lend Lease than the Soviets, despite a vastly inferior contribution to the war. Not only that, but the Germans had already conducted their last successful offensive when Lend Lease started to increase for the Soviets. That is ... the Red Army had already beaten the Germans.
Enemy at the Gates received bad reviews at the time of its release and when I watched it on home video a year later, I could see why. A wasted opportunity that fails to convey the magnitude of the situation - which is particularly annoying because Annaud is aware of this and said in an interview that had Stalingrad fallen, he'd be speaking German. I'm embarrassed to admit that I wasn't aware that Zinn had reviewed SPR, likewise that I've only just discovered your channel. Better late than never!
Time for a more proper Hollywood representation of Zaitsev and the heroic defenders of Stalingrad. Albeit, showing more the casualties of war, rather than glorify it etc. This German 1993 movie about Stalingrad does a much better job.
Its a known fact that any Hollywood war movies have to be vetted by the CIA. Its why Spielberg wrote the Soviets storming Berlin at the end of Schindlers List, but had to change it to a couple of Cossacks on horseback.
Zhukov... Zhukov, the guy Stalin is envious and fearful of, the guy Stalin himself hates and erases all mentions in his Blockbuster Soviets films featuring Stalin as hero. the Guy who also killed all of Stalins second hand men after discovering Beria is a pedo. That Zhukov? I like the guy, but I doubt he's all that ideological. What's next? Kissinger and China wasn't all buddy buddy against the Soviet Union? hah, Communists sure are funny.
It's pretty clear from their newest video that Kay and Skittles have still never forgiven the U.S. Military for liberating East Asia from Fascism and stopping genocide. And you probably haven't, either.
I remember being taught the "soviets shot their own troops if they retreated" and the 1 gun for 2 people thing in school. The fact that this was apparently sourced from a movie is so pathetic I want to laugh.
This is interesting. In India, that has had a long history of Soviet collaboration, the story we absorbed is of an intrepid Russian army, fighting against a much superior german army, the latter done in by its own arrogance against an army it considered not worthy enough. It dovetails quite nicely with india's own colonial encounter and the massive effort it took to overthrow british rule
I remember watching EatG in GCSE History class and my teacher uncritically reinforced it's message. There is no doubt in my mind that thousands if not millions of English-speaking peoples first and lasting introduction to the Soviet Union and Eastern front was this movie. All those redditors calling Russians 'orcs' and 'subhuman' are thinking of this movie.
They got their title orc for being straight up genocidal in Ukraine and breaking some records in war crimes while being dumb enough to make trenches in Chornobyl. Is calling nazi "pigs" bad now? You ruzzian suckers would change a tune when you have this orcs calling you "small ruzzians" for 8 years and desiring your genocide.
One of the many absurdities in this film, was the scene where Koulikov is talks about how he was accused of being a German spy at some point, and how his interrogators knock all his teeth out with a hammer for....what again? Then, after taking pretty much every tooth he has, they give him a mouth full of false teeth and made him a sniper. Because commies are that dumb and inconsistent I guess? I dont know, but this entire films anti-soviet messaging is about as subtle as a hammer to the teeth, and it pretty much starts at the very beginning of the film and hardly ever lets up. And, no, in case anyone is wondering < not 'pro-soviet here', I am pro-honesty though.....
That's the first thing any military does with spies: light, non-handicapping torture followed by promotion to an elite military unit on the front lines.
I can't tell you how many times I had that argument with my uncle at family gatherings. Like imagine the outrage from Americans if the USSR had depicted the boys at Iwo Jima as hapless, illiterate fools who were being fed lies by powerful tyrants so as to manipulate them.
There's plenty of American movies that portray US soldiers as dumb hicks...that's the thing I find hilarious about people like you, you get outraged at some minor examples of inaccuracies in film (as if entertainment should be always fully realistic...like come on, we watch movies to have fun, not to always be inundated with facts...we have entertainment to ESCAPE from reality not be doused in it) while there are many examples of movies trying to be as realistic as they can. That's the thing, the West has a myriad of sources in media and entertainment..sure, you can find a lot of spurious BS, misinformation, propoganda, etc..but you also can find the shocking truth as well, all freely available. In Russia you just can't...war movies there are right-wing propoganda showing the wars Russia fought in as glorious conflicts where Russia never did anything bad, and to this day the Russian government still airs such movies in cinemas to stoke nationalistic spirit and bans movies that show the reality of the situation
No good analogy of Stalingrad in the Pacific other than maybe the Japanese pushing America out of the Philippines or the Dutch in what is now Indonesia.
It's also worth remembering that Soviet troops *welcomed* the "not a step back" policy because they knew they had to make a stand somewhere. These were people with families who they didn't want to die in concentration camps. They were massively invested in the liberation of their country in the way that only the threat of total annihilation can make you be. They didn't want to just go home and beat off while waiting for their entire family to be killed.
Ah yes, the movie about Stalingrad that spends more time denouncing the Soviets than the Nazi invaders trying to exterminate them. Hollywood, ladies and gentlemen.
Hollywood films _routinely_ portray the Germans in WWII as empathetic and "not all bad", and barely even portray the Soviets _at all._ That basically sums it up - the USA is a fascist state.
I'm from Russia myself. I may surprise you, but this is the leitmotif of 99% of films about the war shot after the collapse of the USSR in Russia. A considerable number of left-wing bloggers in Russia already specialize in critic analysis of such films (for example, Badcomidian, Tagany, Rebel Jack, Red Cynic, etc.) , and even joke about the fact that it has become a kind of a single cranberry sinematic universe. So the fact that foreign filmmakers are far behind in the matter of shitting on our history. What can I say, capitalists are the same everywhere. I am glad that now someone outside the CIS has begun to review these films. It will be funny if you get to modern Russian films, in this regard, you can even use the sketches of the above-mentioned bloggers.
I wouldnt be surprised if anti-Slavic sentiment is inseparable from anti-Semitism since many of the Jewish immigrants in Western Europe and the US were from Eastern Europe.
@@Братецревольверalso because they're Russian and they're not capitalist and they're fighting against capitalism and they're not American (important!) and they successfully overthrew the oppressive capitalist government and they value life differently (unlike the Japanese, which are so in line with us in US)
I remember really liking EatG when it came out, I'm a sucker for tense sniper movies. But wow, I would've never picked up on all this back then. Great video!
So, as a US Navy vet, I think I can shed some light on the reasons behind the weird plot of Saving Private Ryan. The military does actually have a series of policies in place that are designed to get people out of combat if all of their brothers are killed in action. It's and old timey rule that is less about lessening the pain of a grieving mother than it is about ensuring that the "family line" is preserved. The example we always learn about in the Navy is the case of the Sullivan brothers, who were all serving on the same ship when it was destroyed, killing all five brothers. In response to this, the Navy made a new policy that siblings can no longer serve on the same ship during wartime and it also caused a military-wide codification of the already unofficially in use "Sole Surviving Son Policy", which says that if you are the sole surviving son of a family where at least one of your brothers had died in combat, then you were exempted from military service, whether in peace or wartime. If all the sons in a given family were serving in the military, and all but one of them died, the surviving son was usually sent home and made to finish out their service behind a desk somewhere, and there are a number of stories of this happening during WW2, when it wasn't uncommon for whole families to sign up. I think Spielberg probably heard these stories and thought "What's the worst case scenario for getting one of these kids home?" and then ran with it.
My grandpa was in basic training preparing for the Korean War. His father who was a farmer, was struck by a barn door in a wind storm and died. My grandpa was sent home as the only male in the family. None of his friends from basic survived.
that happened to the Niland brothers, on which SPR is loosely based. With the Nilands though, two of the brothers actually survived - the eldest was shot down over Burma and a POW who returned home after Japan's surrender, but he was MIA presumed dead so the sole survivor rule was invoked for the youngest brother to be repatriated.
The population in the territory held by the axis was larger than that of the soviet union by the battle of Stalingrad. The Nazis alone outnumbered the soviets in military personnel early in the war. The heavier losses on the soviets side were largely due to severe logistical difficulties due to the extremely large and sparse territory of eastern europe as well as nazi massacres of civilians and POWs. No army in WW2 was just like "lol, we have infinite people so it doesn't matter who dies".
Ya, this WW2 was a massive logistical and resource intensive war. Some say it is a reason for Nazi swiftness in tactics is that once started they rapidly would need to secure access to resources like oil. I dunno for sure but regardless resources management was paramount for all involved. This included manpower. This was an industrial war. Hell, even the US had rationing during the war and the war wasn't taking place on their soil.
@@shanefoster2132 yup. The reason Stalingrad was considered a big deal was it would cut off soviet logistics to the south and allow the nazis to seize the southern oil fields to solve their oil shortage. Because it was a soviet victory the Axis would suffer from a crippling oil shortage for the rest of the war which would force them to not only reduce production of military vehicles but even start scrapping tanks and trucks they already had built due to not even being able to fuel them.
@@ninjasheep7492 holy shit, just looked at a map. It just struck me how far they had pushed. Before now I thought of it more as above the Black Sea but it's above the Caspian almost Central Asia. I guess cuz of the meme/myth of invading Russia in winter was still in the back of my head.
The allies faced 8 german divisions in France in June of 1944. On the Eastern Front in June of 1944, the Soviets were fighting back and winning against 260 german divisions.
I don’t really see it as a meat grinder either, all operations made during the war be it Soviet or western ones were carefully planed and required huge efforts of combined arms such as air power, artillery shells raining, armored assaults and infantry supporting them. Sadly when you have to assault the positions of an entrenched enemy who also has massive forces casualties will be very high.
BIG THANK YOU from a descendant of Red Army's WW2 veterans! I'm glad that someone broke down this garbage movie for English-speaking audience! You won't believe how many "Enemy at the gates"-style movies we having now in post-Soviet countries. I assume this movie started the whole thing. And our young west-oriented generation believes in those lies. So once again thank you 👍
It's so depressingly unsurprising to see that NATO shares the ideology of the Azov battalion. I just finished watching a documentary on the battle of Kursk and it is so sobering to think that these same villages are being fought for today by Russians fighting sieg hieling, black sun and wolfsangel wearing, Stephan Bandera worshiping fascists. Almost a century later and Germany is still imperialist, still fascistic (oppressing both Palestinians and non-zionist Jews as well as the so-called "Orcs"). Fuck NATO. Fuck Germany and the USA.
In fact, evem majority of Russian WW2 movies in the 2000s also jumped on this hype train of "drunk and stupid commander sends people to die, evil NKVD executes good guys, then we win the war".
As a soviet reenactor for wwii i am so glad to say out loud to everyone "finally someone said it!" I'm so glad you made this video. As much as I love enemy at the gates. It is a disgusting portrayal of Stalingrad and the ussr as a whole. Its needs to get out there that this is truly how it is in this day and age.
This is definitely a super duper American movie. It goes full Western in the final scene before the epilogue, when Jude Law faces down Ed Harris in the railyard. Sun's shining through the smoke, he's got a poncho that waves in the wind, a high whistle sounds as he's revealed between the train cars. That's what really slapped me in the face back when I first saw the film with "this is an American movie! get it??" The comparison with Private Ryan is very important
This movie's influence on later depictions of the Eastern front in Western fiction cannot be overstated. I remember one of the opening scenes of one of the earlier Call of Duty games being practically a shot-for-shot recreation of the opening of Enemy at the Gates. When Relic Entertainment made Company of Heroes 2 set on the Eastern Front, they billed it as an authentic depiction based on exhaustive historical research, when in reality they obviously just watched Enemy at the Gates and made a video game about it. On the other hand, most media out of Russia about the war, like Battle for Sevastopol and The Dawns Here Are Quiet (entertaining though they are), are propagandized from their own perspective. There's very little popular media that I'm aware of about this time and place in history that isn't colored by propaganda.
Though some are much better and nuanced, than others. For the Eastern Front, the best to me, and the one I am advising my students to watch in one of my courses, is 'Come and See' (1985). Try it. Fair warning: it is a very tough film to watch, almost unbearable.
I agree, they could have made with soviets look much worse with how they legitimately operated during this time up until 1945. Portraying the reds and its footsoldiers as an acceptable evil is propaganda thats been with us since the second world war
The bias of the author and allegory on Gulag here was absurd, because in reality doors weren't locked - troops inside were already armed and in case of attack were ready to jump out and defend the train. Also Vasiliy mentions in his book that train had seats and even restaurant carriage. It was a nice ride and quiet passing trough river, because soviets were crossing the river only during the night.
Another nugget of truth: In Junior Lieutenant Mansur Abdulin's fantastic memoir Red Road From Stalingrad, he notes that his division was chronically short of rifles and had less than half their authorized number. So instead, most soldiers used Submachine Guns. This is notable because the Soviets had entire SMG battalions (the only country to deploy them organically, en masse) but Mansur's division was a rifle division.
Yup, the joke "Only one half had rifles, because other half had SMGs" is real, because PPSH was absurdly simple, reliable SMG that was mass produced. It was so simple, that even AK could be jealous in this regard. There are videos of people finding old, rusty PPSHs and making them fire even without any refurbishment, just a new drum mag.
@@calluxdoaron1903 I mean one soldier carries the rifle, the other carries ammo is also rooted in reality. The phrase goes "one soldier carries the rifle, the other carries ammo and together they are called anti-tank crew". Because anti-tank rifles were that heavy
My grand-grandfather, who served in RKKA air force logistics corps, likely rolls in his grave every time, when somebody watches the infamous "one rifle, one clip" scene.
I saw this movie when I was 8, I think, but now I find the better film about Operation Barbarossa is the Russian film "Come and See" where the director actually lived that experience and it's at least ambiguous as to what villages/cities are present. Not that the villages or cities really matter.
Фильм "иди и смотри" только 1 страница из книги с названием "я из огненной деревни". Трагедия белорусов. 3.600 деревень сожгли вместе с людьми. Каждый 2ой белорус погиб тогда. Там много всего. Но есть такой рассказ. Что в деревню зашли немцы и стали всех сгонять в избу, чтобы жечь. Одна женщина взглянула на своего сына. Он одел резиновые сапоги, что очень ему нравились. Она сказала, что-то вроде того, что сынок, как же долго будут гореть твои ноги в этой резиновой обуви...🤷
Regarding that EU official......for a German to be using such obviously dehumanizing language about slavs should ring numerous alarm bells. It is actually chilling considering the fact the Nazis genocided millions of slavs in their occupied territories (worth noting when the roles were reversed, there was no such genocide against Germans.) Also, yet another reason to loathe the EU.
It seems that this anti-Slavic sentiment may go back as far as the Holy Roman Empire expanding eastward if not further, occupying territory via divine destiny,
TBH, I loathe both EU and Russia. The later for having Christian ethno-nationalism (arguably the most destructive ideology humanity has ever seen). The former for being a centralized body that is used to perpetuate western imperialism and suppressing the rise of socialism within its border.
@@musicaleuphoria8699 It absolutely does. One of the reasons The Battle of Tannenberg (WWI) was also known as The Second Battle of Tannenberg was for propaganda reasons surrounding the Teutonic loss at the Battle of Grunwald 500 years prior, in the same spot, against the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. Bigotry runs deep.
physical displacement is also genocide. Look what happened to Konigsberg/Kaliningrad. The Russians living there weren't the Germans who had been for over a thousand years.
From a Slavic American, thank you for making a case against anti-Slavic racism. It's an unfortunately common, and overlooked if not fully accepted form of geopolitically fueled racism in the United States and Western Europe.
Well, theres a point to that. All slav countries tend to cry about how they suffered during history, and victimize themselves as the ultimate good, while if they comitted some crimes thats always justified. Thats the case with the Baltics, who were the fiercest SS soldiers, the Polish, who were as much colonizers in Ukraine as the Russians, Czechs and Slovaks, who made a mass executin on their minorities, yet they cry about what nazies comitted against them, Serbs and Croats, Russians, you name them, I tell you what horrible thing they did. At least germans know they committed evil things.
Yeah, that whole Americans care about human life was deeply ironic considering how many "Americans" were being lynched at picnics in this country at the time that was asserted!
Western/American hypocrisy with regards to foreign policy is sickening at this point. Listen, Im not gonna defend Russia invading another country, nevertheless doing so without being attacked first, however your comment reminded me of some other things that is discussed incessantly on mainstream media about this war that absolutely infuriates me. We're suddenly all flipping shit about Ukraine's sovereignty, when we to this very day still are partly occupying almost a third of Syria alongside our Kurdish proxies. Us being there in the first place without the legal government having invited us there, (regardless of what you think of said government), is a violation of it's sovereignty and therefore illegal. Not to mention the fact that we flooded the Syrian civil war with weapons which literally fueled it into the warzone it had been for nearly a decade and now, even though the war is over and our regime change attempt was thwarted, (once again, regardless of what you think of Assad, we most certainly were deliberately fueling this conflict to overthrow him), we are still sanctioning the shit outa the government because our side lost and we don't wanna let the country rebuild. Hell, when it comes to Ukraine - we literally backed and helped direct a coup of the corrupt but democratically elected Yanukovych government back in 2014 and helped install a virulently anti-Russian government so as to peel Ukraine away from Russia's influence and weaken our adversary. And suddenly now we care about democracy and sovereignty. There was a study that came out like a year ago, that found that Ukraine is more corrupt and less democratic now than it was prior to that "revolution". But of course, us backing Ukraine has nothing to do with helping the Ukrainians being slaughtered, it has everything to do with the exact same reason we backed the Mujahidin in Afghanistan against the Soviet Union and Communist Afghan government, it's done to bleed Russia. In other words, our political class in this country are willing to fight Russia to the last Ukrainian. But of course media in the west leaves all this out, this current conflict is instead framed as if Russia one day woke up and decided to conquer Ukraine without any actual historical or geo-political context being provided, because if they did people wouldn't tolerate sending 60 billion dollars worth of weapons to fuel a proxy war while economy is still in shambles as a result of covid. And just like we did with all our adversary/enemy nations in the past, we reduce them down to their evil leader, that of course being in this case - Putin, just like we did with Saddam for Iraq, Assad for Syria, and so on and so on.
Yup. I’m Pennsylvanian Deutsch/Dutch, and even though DROVES of us joined in on the war effort to help liberate our homelands, we were treated like the enemy. We went to fight our own brothers, and at home we were treated like we were the ones who caused it. It seriously damaged our culture. Most PA Deutsch aren’t fluent in german anymore or very in touch with our culture because of the extreme racism. Even in school growing up I dealt with discrimination from it because me and my family had a different language, and this was at the peak of WW2 shooters like MoH and CoD.
@@Gilberto90 I’m not a wehreboo. I’m PA Deutsch. If you have nothing intelligent to say, leave this conversation. Imagine calling someone a wehraboo because their ethnicity. Tf is wrong with you
Italian chiming in on the so-called "blocking detachments" : in WW1, italian military police, the Carabinieri, were infamous for tracking down and executing deserters. The war movie "Uomini Contro" shows this well. And as far as I know, such policies were not uncommon in WW1. Now the video may be about WW2 but I find it odd that so many western people are keen to paint the brutality of total war with a broad brush when it comes to the "other" and try to pin it on socialism not valuing lives or some such, yet few remember when these things happened among European states not long before, and not to stop fascist genocide as in WW2, but to fill the pockets of the war industry and to honor intricated war treaties as in WW1.
I have to say that while Italy was the country that killed the most of his own men in ww1 the n umber of italian soldiers execuded amounts to about 1000. Don't get me wrong it is a lot if you compare it to the about 650 french soldiers executed by France but it still is far from the situation depicted in "uomini contro". Uomini contro is not a bad movie but it is not historically accurate. Rosi (the director) was more concerned in launching a general anti-war message rather than making a historically accurate depiction of the Asiago front. Same goes for Lussu (the author of the book that inspired the movie), while the book is far more historically accurate as it basically is Lussu's memoirs many events were exagerated in order to make more of an anti-war message. In reality all the executions in the italian army happened after a trial by military tribunal and the role of carabinieri barrier troops, much like the one of NKVD barrier troops in ww2, was to rally up flleting soldiers, make them return to the front lines and eventually arrest the officers of the fleeing unit
Excelent video, congratulations! I'm an old guy by now, but being the son of a diplomat I first received the dubious honor of an american private school education; and then had the oportunity to visit Russia in different ocations: The USSR in the late 80's, the crap-hole Russia became in the 90's, the re-birth of a nation in the early 2000's, and finally, the olympics at Sochi and the Soccer World Cup in the last decade. The most amazing thing (that's why I refer as a "doubious Honor" to my american early education) is that I was absolutely convinced of every bias and truism they taught me. I thought of "communists" as brainwashed people who would believe every bit of preposterous propaganda spewed by their leaders without question. And now, 54 years of experience has shown me, that this is true to Americans. Most americans (not all) are ready to take anything the mass media tells them at face value, even if it doesn't make any sense. People is more interested in "winning" debates in order to confirm their own viewpoint than they are in finding the actual truth of things. I guess it is just human condition. But the level of propagandized, braindead folks you find around in the States rivals, and surpasess by much, anything I ever saw in the old Soviet Union. May be this is, because generally speaking, the soviet citizen was better informed than the average Hollywood taught six-pac Joe.
And then they make a movie on the racist, fascist, colonialist, imperialist Winston Churchill, and never show anything bad about him even once. US/UK oligarchy has completely warped history in their favor.
Indeed. The only reason so many medals were given out at Rourkes drift was to move the gaze away from Britain's worst military failure just hours earlier that still gets little coverage.
Listening to the words of Florence Gaub is actually scary. Scary to me, at least. Because I'm from Russia. I was born here, I live here. My country is the biggest in the world. We have Asian part and European part. Not divided by race, but simply by geography. And all of my life I lived in the European part. And when I travelled with my family to Europe... it wasn't different. Yes, different people, different culture, I got it. But it felt a lot like Moscow and St.Petersburg. Of course I heard that even before War Europeans saw us differently than we see ourselves. But... I didn't ever think that it was like this. That we are less human to them. It's actually scary. I'm used to anti-soviet, anti-communist propaganda. Just because our government give money to produce films like "Enemy At The Gates". But it didn't actually come to me before that to Europe Russians and Soviets are the same people. Not Ukrainians for now, of course. The lies about Holodomor and war between Russia and Ukraine help it. Thanks for opening my eyes. Damn, that sounds weird considering massive anti-communist TV Show and book "Zuleikha Opens Her Eyes". But still. Thank you, Kay and Skittles. P.S. Could you, please, do a video about the politics of BioShock? It's interesting to hear what you have to say.
@@edward9674 The Holodomor has been heavily propogandized as being a campaign of purposeful directed genocide by the Soviets against the Ukrainian people. In reality the Holodomor was a horrible tragedy that affected many soviet citizens including the Ukrainian people, caused primarily as a result of the following- 1. Weather problems crippling harvests. 2. Improper handling of the crisis by the Soviet government as a result of the soviets still advancing from the feudal economy that was Tsarist Russia and the primitive practices implemented during Tsarist times. 3. Influence of Kulaks i.e. wealthy land owning bourgeois and petite bourgeois peasants, primarily in the hoarding and destruction of resources like grain stocks as a reaction to implementation of collectivism. It is also important to note that similar famines had historically occurred during the Tsarist era as well in much greater frequency, compare this with the Soviet response which would result in the end of such crisises post WWII. While the USSR made some mistakes and could have handled the situation better, the decades of historical revisionism and propaganda by bourgeois governments and "historians" such as Robert Conquest and the group responsible for "The Black book of Communism" have left much misinformation surrounding the event. For more details about the famine I would recommend this video- th-cam.com/video/vu5-tqHHtaM/w-d-xo.html
Hey! Another russian here. Nationalism and xenophobia are popular in russia, so saying that we're divided by geography rather than nationality/race is a false statement. And yeah what lied about holodomor?
@@АняПетрова-х9н nationalism is popular in Russia, yes. But Russians live in both parts. You can’t say that in the European part live Europeans and in the Asian part - Asians. That is what I wanted to say. Holodomor is presented as if the government deliberately let people die of hunger. Not by mistake. And this concept is false. Yes. There was a hunger. Yes. People died. Yes. This is a tragedy. But so are hungers that we’re quite popular in Russian Empire. Also the hunger in other countries at the time. Holodomor wasn’t an intentional genocide, like it is presented in media.
@@edward9674 Holodomor is presented as if the government deliberately let people die of hunger. Not by mistake. And this concept is false. Yes. There was a hunger. Yes. People died. Yes. This is a tragedy. But so are hungers that we’re quite popular in Russian Empire. Also the hunger in other countries at the time. Holodomor wasn’t an intentional genocide, like it is presented in media.
The depiction of Stalingrad in Enemy at the Gates is pure black propaganda. There's a nerdy YT channel called Stalingrad Battle Data (I think) which uses primary sources to demonstrate this with abundant clarity. Great video by the way!
*maybe I should have said "white" propaganda given that the sheer venom of the anti-communist messaging in the film brings some heavy-duty civil war era White energy with it...
Probably the channel you've mentioned is TIK channelwhere guys taking different sources from all sides and by comparing them and putting on a big map giving like the full view on the Battle of Stalingrad
@@Kantorek17 It's a different channel but it has done some stuff with the one you mention. Pretty sure it's called StalingradBattleData or similar. Nope have just checked it's now called Armageddon lol. Probably helps the algorithm.
@@moretimeneeded56It was not about the political regime. They were fighting to save their lives and the lives of their families. By the time of the Battle of Stalingrad, everyone knew what was happening in the occupied territories. The Germans were coming for living space, not to overthrow the communists. And they did not need the local population.
The idea that the justification for the dropping of bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki was the kamikaze fighters is actually taught in American schools. Still.
funny that the narrative that "we nuked japan to save lifes" wasn't a thing at the time. that narrative was born during the cold war, so that the Americans could pretend they weren't as brutal as the fascists or communists. But the nuking of japan was pretty much intentional, to make sure Stalin won't have a piece of Japan's cake
Might be one school brother, that is unheard of in American culture, I live with many history nerds who went to different schools and never heard of this
I'm Russian-Ukrainian and I'd never even heard of this movie until now, I had no idea how much it had contributed culturally. Holy shit, this is what you guys (generalised) all believe happened during that battle? So many of our people died in that war - twenty million by some counts - and you all think it's the result of stupid shit like THIS? Are you telling me every time I've had some internet argument with a Westerner about how no, we didn't lose twenty million people by just being bad at fighting and it was the price of blood of turning back the Nazis, they had THIS propaganda reel playing in the back of their head? Oh my god...
And Westerners think Russians are the ones who are brainwashed by propaganda, while in fact Westerners are brainwashed systematically by the most cartoonishly shitty propaganda imaginable. Just look at all the ridiculous things Westerners believe about north Korea because their racist media and governments tell them so. Really cartoonish things, like claiming Kim Jong Un had an architect executed because he didn't like the way the guy redesigned Pyongyang's airport. People in the West BELIEVE this crap. And these same people think they're all such "free thinkers", and look down on everyone else. It's amazing. Absolutely amazing.
I might have to disappoint you even more. This is just one small part of the whole systemic brainwashing which led to unprecedented rusophobia. It is literally illness. There are movies such as Rocky where he trains in snow with wood, something ordinary person can relate to, but evil Soviets have some high tech shit, unnatural, and surely enough poor Rocky wins over the bad guys. But what is interesting to me is that ordinary westerner until mid 2010s would use "Russian" and "Ukrainian" as synonyms, however very quickly they they were taught the difference, so now they just love Ukrainians (regardless of hating them not that long ago) and Russians will just continue to be Russians, literally lower beings. What is also amazing is that Ukrainians are obviously dying for western goals they aren't able to notice that. Like, peaceful solution was right under their nose and they refused to accept it, and then they blame Russians for everything. Idk who nor how managed to convince Ukrainians that their only option is to join Nato. 100% unnecessary and stupid.
This was very challenging and important to hear. I can’t say I heard much of the anti-Russian narratives in my media, but I did have some of these biases rattling around in my head. I’m going to have to keep reflecting
Those narratives will exist for decades and more. It's basically a second Cold War, with US being far superior in informational warfare and demonization of their economical/political/ideological enemies.
Fun fact, during the cold war, Cuba had the highest literacy rate in the Western hemisphere. Not something western Europe or the US talks about very often.
As a Russian it is so awesome to have found a channel like yours. Thank you so much for your work in clearing up things people don't question (for example the narrative that "soviets dont value life like WE do" didnt go anywhere (now it's just Russians) and is such a simplistic classic case of otherness that people in the west simply accept as default) Thank you ❤
Good video. I've just recently started playing Partisan 1941, a tactical stealth game about partisans in occupied Russia. I actually didn't know that when I started, I thought it was about the French resistance as it is a more common subject. I got caught by surprise by the earnest positive military nationalism that is displayed in the game by the main characters, with a good boy commander protagonist who all he wants is to protect his nation and communism. It is not something that Russians are usually allowed to have in Western media, so it is very illuminating. I am still not comfortable with it, the same way I am not comfortable with the nationalism in American war movies, the military its its version of nationalism is pretty much bad everywhere and the game is very much not interested in analyzing too deeply the ideology of any main character. But, the point is this sort of thing from a Soviet perspective is so rare to me it was refreshing.
If you want something more easy to shallow play Starship Trooper Terran Command that is based in Paul Verhoeven movie, even that is science fiction and have a touch of satire, really show the brutality of war, because the Command not give a fuck about their soldiers.
I'd like to add that even the contemporary Russian war movies about WW2 rarely display soldier and officers in a good light. So the game was a breath of the fresh air even for us. I mean, they've made NKVD officer a good guy, what's essentially have never been seen in any work of fiction so far.
@@TheKeyser94 Thanks, but from screenshots the gameplay is not similar at all and it is the type of game I don't like to play. I am not a fan of RTS as a rule, Partisan 1941 works for me because it is a *stealth* tactical game, with a focus on very small teams. Anyway, the game politics aren't particularly hard to shallow. That was my point, though I guess I didn't make it clear. It is par for the course for most media with military protagonists and the those protagonists are Russian make it a bit more novel if anything. It is not good politics but it is fun as it is and no worse than most stuff out there.
As a Russian, I was also pleasantly surprised by the release of this game. Russian games about the war have not been released for many years, and post-Soviet works of art in which the Soviet army and people look like heroes literally for the first time. Although the number of heroism in that war of worthy games and films is literally limitless. And the secret turned out to be simple, the game came out without any support from the modern anti-Soviet state (it would not have released such a game in life and would not have financed it), purely by enthusiasts.
As someone from Ireland I have an oddly acute understanding of the White but not White rhetoric. For so long we were seen as lesser white people solely because we were Irish, seen as second class citizens in countries outside Ireland because we were "the stupid Paddy". Yes, the bulk of this was prevalent in the UK but the narrative was the same everywhere for so long. I have met plenty of Americans who have said they see themselves as Irish and therefore not white, to me an absolute head scratcher but it shows that there was obviously this feeling in America as well. My point is, this whole idea of whiteness, blackness or anything in between is pure bollocks. I share more with a black Irishman than an American who's great great grandfather left Ireland in the late 1890s
Truth is, those who want to hate seek for reasons to hate people, those who wants to love do the same. "Not white enough" rhetoric is one of these reasons for hate.
it was very interesting to read. I visited Ireland 4 years ago and was just shocked by how much we have in common (I'm from Russia, from Udmurtia). Almost all Udmurts have red hair, and we are called Irish by the Hand (because of our red hair and love of strong alcohol), haha. In fact, it is very sad that history repeats itself again, and the propaganda machine is once again making cruel bastards and unworthy whites out of us, although after visiting Europe, I realized that there is practically no difference between the conventional Conor and Ivan. I wish you all the best, and may Jesus keep you safe.
Appeals to America's goodness goes back farther than that, from The Revolution, to The Civil War, to WW2, lots and lots of Appeals to that "American Virtue" were told that Americans have. But as George Carlin puts it, the founding Fathers we're hypocritical, they owned slaves and started a Revolt so they can have financial autonomy, The Civil War ended Slavery, The Union became the Federal government that despite ending slavery was very much ok with Segregation and allowed the the Institution of Slavery that so many people on both sides died for to be replaced by a billion dollar prison industry... So the truth is, we are honestly no better than any empire that has ever existed and they thought they were all swell people too.
Actually, as Knowing Better informed me and many others in such disturbing detail, it was the _onset of WW2_ that finally ended traditional chattel slavery of black people in America. What can I say but yikes.
I'm a Conservative and even tho I imagine we would disagree on a fair few things I Full agree with your point on dehumanisation and how the elits use propaganda to justify hating the "enemy" and to start wars
many people start on the right much like you since thats what dominates todays politics. may i recommend the channel, "second thought" ? hes a fairly good introduction into modern issues of society and leftism
@shahramtondkarmobarakie1824 Thanks but ive seen and watch second thought, i dount know about right wing being defual tho in the uk form what I've seen people are pretty center/center left these days. Like in school if any one was political it would be left wing and I've actively gotten right-wing over the years, even polling shows that younger people start out more left wing. I just agree with some left wing ideas and that because I'm not dogmatic and realise that people of all political Persuasion will have some points that are worth considering and agreeing with.
Very well done analysis. Your tone of speech really makes it sound as if you watched the same news as me over the last 20 years and are no completely fed up with “America is good, no matter what” without any criticism or attempt at change and are now expressing you discontent.
Since moving left politically some 15 odd years ago, I keep learning and unlearning new things. A lot of propaganda. Every so often, a new bit of info pops up, either to show a new view entirely or to expand my understanding of something, and I just have to take a minute and look at the effect that thing has had. It is occasionally astounding just how hardcore the propaganda machine worked with regard to the USSR. Not just during the cold war but (as demonstrated by this movie) the reverberations from the initial impacts. The Red Scare lives on today. How many folks are convinced Russia is still a communist country?
a lot and you can see how the Red Scare is still happening in a way with how a lot of people call people on the left Communists even if they aren't just another Us vs them
Watching this video after becoming a communist, goddam, I knew US propaganda was enforced on the movie but I hadnt thought it was this much, wonderful video to put it simply.
Token Bulgarian tm here, unfortunately confirming that ppl just be like that in this country and the fact that Kiril Petkov said that surprised no one of intelligence unfortunately.
There’s a reason why the Mosin Nagant was, and maybe even still is, the cheapest surplus rifle you could buy. There were SO MANY of them left over after WW2…
Good video. I will say part of what makes the opening of Saving Private Ryan good is that there are moments where Americans are bad or have a crisis of faith at D-Day. One is when one soldier ( I think the same one who gets slowly stabs later) breaks down upon realizing that the fascists are sending Hitler Youth to the front, shown by a knife on a corpse. Another is when two surrendering soldiers are shot by Americans while begging for their lives in a foreign language. Not only is it uncomfortable if you only speak English, but the two are speaking Czech, saying, at least in the fiction of the film, that they were pressed into service. If Enemy at the Gates had actually tried to empathize with the Soviet soldiers or why people would fight for it beyond survival, it could have also had moments that show the brutality of the war that is inescapable by any force committing it.
11:27 hey (hellbeck) he was my professor! he actually discussed this film and the same fallacies you picked up on in class! Great guy and he often offered us to go out for coffee and had a plethora of stories from his time spent interviewing russians
Unknown5 has a video explaining the situation on the eastern front. Only a handful of soldiers were executed during the war. Incredibly many soldiers were convinced to go towards the front.
This was a great video and I'm shocked that the events depicted in Enemy at the Gates were almost completely made up. I had absorbed the "not one step back" and "every other man gets a gun" bits as fact. Interestingly, they were further reinforced in Call of Duty (I think? Maybe Medal of Honor) and you actually play out many of the scenes depicted in the movie (they were heavily... uh inspired by the movie) And this is just Stalingrad... so many other real-world battles and scenarios have been depicted in popular media and I've never really questioned the facts bc... why would they lie? Its all historical and they can just get events from historical accounts, right? Right? Saving Private Ryan also kicked off HBO's Band of Brothers and The Pacific. I've never really looked at it from the perspective of that quote you included (I forget the name). That these movies change war from being "always hell" to "sometimes good". As an American, our society is so steeped in military conflicts and it's hard to get the full picture.
I liked how Call of Duty: World at War handled the Russian campaign. While there is a sniper battle in Stalingrad, it doesn't feel like a rip off of Enemy at the Gates and fighting through Berlin was awesome and unique as WW2 shooters go. There is brutality (mostly done by Gary Oldman hamming it up) but it's always at Nazis and you understand why in the game's narrative ( and history obvs). There is an objector to the violence but I don't remember if he was anti-communist.
Funny thing - some of those myths are even present in modern-day russian movies about the war - which means either that this propaganda is so widespread even Russians believe it, or that russian moviemakers also want to depict the USSR bad to make sure people don't think about trying that whole thing again
i find it kind of funny how cod1's soviet campaign was so insanely stupid that cod2 kind of tried to make up for that by actually portraying the red army as competent except for the tutorial where you throw potatoes instead of grenades on the range lol
@@DiscoPickle102 I wonder if anyone besides Badcomidan has talked about historical lies in this game? Well, at least he made an English-language version of this review in those years, or else I think, no one would have found out about that nonsense in the game.
One thing that never appears in American movies during WW2 is how brutally racists Americans and the American army were. Remember, that was segregation era, but during not even one movie or series during WW2 there is a single reference to racism.
Usual racism in WW2 movies it's like: -Marines boxing in a aircraft carrier for money, black person being the big winner while beating the only racist white guy who challenged him or the reverse. -Black soldier being called the n-word one time and later saving the only racist sacrificing himself. Here it is the big "racism" in Hollywood ww2 movies
Not even to mention how anti-Semitic they were. That scene in Saving Private Ryan where the soldier points at a german angrily and says “JUDEN” is hilarious to me
Excellent video! Happy you are refusing to fall into the anti-communist claptraps about the USSR, and the teardown of that horrid movie is very entertaining.
Yeah, the loudest people on the USSR sometimes (not always) seem to be either Tankies or people just saying everything connected to the USSR is bad. It's never that easy. There were great achievements and great injustices both committed in large quantities there, imo.
@@michimatsch5862 Given how many countries wanted to join the EU instead of Russia's alternative union it seems the USSR didn't have that many great achievements.
@@uanime1 They won the space race for starters. They largely improved literacy rates (especially for women.) They drastically reduced homelessness. They brought down homelessness to virtually 0. No serious person will argue that the USSR was perfect, but to ignore their achievements is silly.
@@uanime1 Russia at the start of the revolution was an absolute monarchy based on the same basic system of pre-industrial peasant feudalism that had been outdated for at least a century, and had just been ravaged by the first world war (which was far more destructive on the Eastern Front than on the Western Front because the Russian Empire used outdated equipment and strategy). From that shitshow, the USSR managed to build a geopolitically powerful, comparatively democratic, industrialised, scientifically prolific world power in only about twenty years, at which point they had to stop briefly to be the most important player in the defeat of the Nazis before going on to stand toe-to-toe with the United States as one of the two most powerful countries in the world for another forty years. Yeah no achievements there.
I always tell people to go watch a Chinese film called "Wolf warrior". You will never take these self important western war movies seriously again because when you see another country doing the exact same self congratulating, it becomes hard to ignore it. It's like holding up a mirror to yourself.
11:30 maybe the 'one rifle for two men' thing started because the other man had a submachine gun. I remember reading some old ww2 book where they said that about half had rifles, about half had submachine guns, but they worded it really poorly.
Apart from making the Soviet leadership seem cartoonishly cruel and indifferent to human suffering, they also purposely made them appear incompetent. For one, in the opening sequence Russian soldiers are brought in to attack an entrenched German position. Shouldn't it be the opposite? They're directed to make a straightforward charge, half without weapons, while they are mowed down by machine gun fire. When they naturally retreat, their own commanders mow them down instead. Strategically, this makes no sense, and accomplishes nothing. It is entirely wasteful to the point of absurdity.
Amen, brother. great video! As to a Russian person myself it's surprising that moviemakers in Russia started filming "our reply to Hollywood" where they were trashing Soviet veterans even more. Which in it's turn led to empty movie theaters when we see slogans like "the real truth about WW2, this time for sure!!!". BTW, speaking of blatant propaganda, what about "Bridge of spies"? Anyways great channel you have here, keep it up!
Ivan's War by Catherine Merridale is a great book to read if you're interested in the lives many Soviet Infantry had during WW2. It's a non-fictional book telling real stories based on diaries, wartime records, and personal accounts. I think it compliments this video pretty well.
So I do agree with what you said but I do want to point out that the US did in fact have a policy to bringing home sole survivors of a family. This was was done after all 5 Sullivan brothers were killed during the sinking of USS Juneau. And Pvt. Ryan was based off Fredrick Niland who had 2 of his 3 brothers killed with the 3rd MIA and presumed dead but was actually in a Japanese POW camp. But Order 227 is definitely portrayed wrongly here in the West because it does make the Soviets look barbaric you see it in movies and video games despite like you said it having more to do with officers as opposed to the rank and file
The policy is of course believable, the part that is unbelievable is actually mounting a rescue mission in order to fulfill the policy when they needed every officer and platoon. The policy only meant an officer would go to the surviving son and give him the news while dismissing him from the front lines. If the surviving son was unreachable that was it. Now going behind enemy lines to fulfill the order is bonkers, it is SAFER to not send anyone as an unit in this position's best chance of survival is to remain hidden. Then you're likely to lose many men rescuing the one man, which is also insane as much as American movies try to paint as heroic. And the guy they were sent to rescue REFUSING IT is utterly laughable. Even as a kid I knew that was bullshit and Tom Hanks would be validated from executing Ryan on the spot for being so arrogant and a glory-chaser.
@@rafaelneumann8365 I didn't argue that they would send a team to get them. It was true I was just correcting the part of where he states that the bring back Pvt. Ryan is fictional while it it's based on a true story and he doesn't mention it so I'm filling in that gap by explaining the real policy and the story of Fredrick Niland who is the person Pvt. Ryan is based on and Sgt. Niland did actually at first refuse to go home at first like Ryan does but he does go home soo yeah..... the executing part seems a bit much
@@timothygoodwin3287 causing the death of your brothers in arms is one of the most common causes for execution in armies throughout history. By refusing to follow orders to go back (which 100% supercedes the orders to protect a bridge) he basically causes the deaths of almost everyone. Execution is a bit much, yes. But wouldn't be so out of the ordinary. Soldiers have been executed for far less.
Hey, I know I am late to the party but had to stop the video near the end (the good war quote) and really think about my understanding of the righteous of defeating fascism. Good shit man, love this stuff.
Hi. Sorry for low-level English. As an anti-war activist who still stay in Russia I can say that our «интеллигенция»/liberal so called intellectuals also have cold-war-mindset. So it's our inner problem too. They only make an exception for cool true european middle class opposition while poor and non-slavic russians portraits as a stupid evil sovetish crowd. And that caused a lot of problems for resistance for years. (But yes, we also have crazy shitty tankies from other side of opposition.) Thanks for your video!
С той стороны, кстати, вообще не Танкиз сидят, хотя дух от них похожий. Они не коммунисты даже, они просто хотят себе героическую историю без просчетов, свой "национальный миф", как в других странах, где корни свои надо обязательно протянуть чуть ли не до начала времен. Нашенские госдумовские КПРФовцы, если ты про них, конечно, тоже занимаются именно этим, на самом деле, а не защитой советского строя или чем-то подобным.
I like how you reference Zaitsev's notes, before mentioning the film portrays him as illiterate. It got me to go "Of course that's false" when it came up.
FRFR, “LikBez” (national literacy), was completed while Zaitsev was a child.
@@Mortablunt Yeah and that's irrelevant because the man himself was not.
@@Peaches-i2i was not what? Literate? dude was an accountant before the war and professor at a university after
@@Peaches-i2iah yesss because a movie told you that. Looks like your mind is locked whoops
Should be noted, order 227 only specified that soldiers should not retreat PAST their current position. If you advanced on the enemy, met too strong of a resistance and then fell back to your original position, that wasn't considered a violation of the order. Even if you did fall back farther and were caught by barrier troops, the officer was put before a tribunal, if he had a good tactical reason for falling back they usually let them go, there's records of officers providing a good reason for falling back and being allowed to return to command with no or little reprimand from the tribunal.
Add to this, majority of soldiers who actually retreated due to cowardice were actually often than not sent back to the frontlines. They couldn't just waste resources on killing a soldier or sending said soldier to prison.
Until that one time where Stalin's son's artillery battery was overrun and would not command the unit to retreat because of his relation to his father. However, I think this action took place before Order 227. Stalin's dislike for retreat and surrendering units was known and maybe this was some of the impetus behind 227? World War II Russia is not an area that I'm super familiar with, so if anyone else knows, holler!
And perhaps I'm going out on a limb, in my mind, Yakov Dzhugashvili was most likely a better man than his father.
@@Nosliw837 The impetus for 227, as the video says, was that panic was beginning to set into the Red Army as a result of the fact that the Wehrmacht were making rapid gains during the opening stages of Barbarossa, and Stalin and the Politburo realised something had to be done to ensure morale remained high and emphasise the fact that the war against the Nazi invasion was one not just of political survival, but survival of the entire Slavic ethnicity in the face of a planned genocide.
Besides, of those detained as a result of Order 227, the overwhelming majority were sent back to their units because the majority of those caught by barrier troops were either separated from their units and lost during a retreat or had retreated further than expected and had a tactical reason to do so.
A smaller proportion were punished by being sent to a penal battalion or, a lesser punishment, being demoted if it was felt there was no justifiable reason for the retreat. A very small percentage of the total number of soldiers caught by Barrier Troops were actually executed, and even then it was for repeatedly deserting from, what the Soviets rightfully understood, was a fight for the very survival of Slavic people and every other ethnicity in the USSR and other Socialist states.
@@nmeister007 Another interesting tidbit is that veterans of the Red Army from back then remember this order as being exactly what they needed and made them decide to make their stand against the until then undefeated german summer offensives.
order 227 was only appliable to officers ordering unauthorized retreats. The regular soldier wasnt affected by it
"Communism can't work cuz I'm a huge incel" made me laugh tbh.
It is pretty messed up how this movie portrayed a real person tho..
Quite true.
Imagine being foolish enough to think that the USSR would've won the war without western support...Even Stalin admitted how crucial lend lease was!
The USSR would have won the war without the lend-lease. Just not as fast as it did.
@@The4thResidentofEvil
It's not as clear cut as saying they would have won the war or lost the war. Lend lease arrived after the successful defense of Moscow, could the red army have moved to Berlin without it? probably not, they may not have been able to even get them out of their own borders, but the aid offered was absolutely crucial
@@jamestortorella5171 The aid was not decisive. USSR would win in any case. But the losses would be much bigger.
I highly recommend everyone to watch Russian/Soviet war movies. They have nothing to do with American war movies. Not that there are no amazing American war movies, of course. But these are focused on the soldiers and their heroism.
Soviet war movies, on the other hand, show very few war scenes. The few we see show no pride in even killing the Nazi soldiers (unlike they do in Inglorious Basterds), and most movies are centered in soldiers AND the civilians. In the USSR, everyone was involved 24/7 in the war effort, whether in the front or in factories. The moral of every movie was to send an anti-war message.
'The Cranes are Flying' of 1957 by Kalatozov would be a great start to Russian war cinema
just don't watch modern russian war movies, they suck
th-cam.com/video/zjIiApN6cfg/w-d-xo.htmlsi=InSsaW70Z3Fvrcn1
Did you just really compare soviet war movies with inglorious basterds?
@@helvijs100 Why not?
You are so right! Soviet war movies is a lesson on humanity.
As a person who lived in the Eastern block during communism, I can tell every single movie which is made in the west doesnt capture the point. It simply didnt happen thatway. Those KGB guys marching with machine guns in the streets intimidating everyone who dares to say anything against the premiere, thats not how it was. They dont dare to show the real thing because its kindof similar how they would crackdown on dissent in the west. Noone cared if some talked bad about the party leadership up until the point that he didnt do it in the media. and even then they would simply fire some from his job, they wouldnt bother following someone everywhere. Some had to be very influential to have thatkind of KGB surveillance on him, but thats not that dissimilar from the FBI shadowing Martin Luther King. yes of course the KGB had moles everywhere but generally not to monitor individuals, but potential organizations dangerous for the state. It was kindof legal to protest, if some protested along the party narratives, for example some could organize a protest against Vietnam, but if someone would have tried to protest against the occupation of Czechoslovakia that would be cracked down, something similar what they are trying to do with the Palestinian protests. People were very rarely coerced not to dissent, everyone knew that in order to get ahead in life, some had to silence himself, and attend some meetings. there were even multiple parties, the communist party, the peasant party, of course those were all communists, but the facade was there, a little bit similarly how the mainstream parties behaving nowadays. It was way more subtle than as it is portrayed in western movies, and in some ways very similar of how they handle their populace. Thats the reason of common Russians find these western movies insulting, because its so obvious cartoon propaganda, they know the reality, and the agenda, that these movies arent made for them, but western audiences to crack down on dissent amongst their ranks.
We need more voices like yours from people who actually experienced the thing, and not western propaganda-fed people or gen Z east europeans who only got to see the aftermath of the cold war
Minor correction: The men belonged to the NKVD and later MGB, precursor organizations to the dreaded MGB.
I also grew up in Eastern Europe and second that. Also people were less propagandized back them than they are now.
Most don't know how to read the Scriptures, because if they did, they would understand that the collection of misfits in Canaan(or "Palestine") that calls themselves "Israel", are NOT the Hebrews of the Texts. That most believe they are, demonstrates that they are a Member of the Congregation of the Dead(spiritually). The Oxymoronic Judeo-Christian Godspel, has done it's work very well. Hopeless Cultists, calling themselves "Christian", acting like Satan(which simply means "Accuser") Praying to dead gods, instead of to Yahweh Elohim. Sad, very sad.
Is it moral for you to forcibly rob your neighbors, to pay for things you think society should do? How many "people" "voting" for such immorality, makes it moral?? Think on that, eh? And when you pathetically agree to "Vote" for a "ruling class", can you truly be surprised when their immorality spills over onto you??? GROW UP.
Reflect on this: Voting IS Praying to a spiritually dead god, Government. We are praying for it's blessings upon Our just causes, are We not?? All organized "Religion" is just another mental Prison. Government and Religion, are the "Gifts" granted unto this World, by the Light-Bringer. His other name, "Satan", which simply means "the Accuser", is carried by all, who join the Congregation of the Spiritually Dead, and pick their "side"; whether Communist vs Capitalist, Catholic vs Baptist, Left vs Right, Red vs Blue, Muslim vs Jew. These "factions" ACCUSE each the other, of trying to bring about Chaos. Behaviour that is as Satanic as the Day is Long, which causes Those who were brought to Earth most recently(roughly 7600 years now), to abandon Their Mission of Deliverance of this World, from these two "Gifts" of Satan, the Devil, "Lucifer". Think on it just a moment... Do not Governments facilitate the Mass murder, mass theft, and rape of this world's resources?? Do not Religions, tell their adherents that all other religions are missing the Truth? Accusers All, meant to Keep the Populace of this blood-soaked, mud-covered bar-magnet of a planet, DIVIDED AND FALLEN. Keep Reflecting, Little Flock.
The number of the Mark of the Beast is 666, which actually breaks into 6x60x600. 216,000. Every hominid has 144.000 genetic expressions in their DNA; 72K from the male progenitor, and 72K from the female progenitor. This "mRNA" "Vaccine" CAN change your 144K to 216,000, by splicing a third set of genetic expressions into your DNA... Sorry folks. CRISPR technology, forbidden Fruits yet again, being "eaten". Fear not, Little Flock. Judgement is Soon.
Very good point!
"Communism can't happen because she won't let me seize her means of reproduction, Vasily!"
-Movie Danilov, probably
"Dali... there's a word from America, that I learned.... and it's called threesome..."
-Vasily, probably
(I'm just joking, ok mate)
I mean there do be a lot of bros that this happens to 😂😂😂 one even became president
@@SerfsUp1848 Lmao can't imagine it XD
@@LeoKuz19683 if only lol
@@SerfsUp1848 Aahahhaha XD for reals mate XD
-“Hey Russia, here’s some shock therapy”
-Lowers their life expectancy
-“You are no longer human to me. Also you werent before either lol”
Most don't know how to read the Scriptures, because if they did, they would understand that the collection of misfits in Canaan(or "Palestine") that calls themselves "Israel", are NOT the Hebrews of the Texts. That most believe they are, demonstrates that they are a Member of the Congregation of the Dead(spiritually). The Oxymoronic Judeo-Christian Godspel, has done it's work very well. Hopeless Cultists, calling themselves "Christian", acting like Satan(which simply means "Accuser") Praying to dead gods, instead of to Yahweh Elohim. Sad, very sad.
Is it moral for you to forcibly rob your neighbors, to pay for things you think society should do? How many "people" "voting" for such immorality, makes it moral?? Think on that, eh? And when you pathetically agree to "Vote" for a "ruling class", can you truly be surprised when their immorality spills over onto you??? GROW UP.
Reflect on this: Voting IS Praying to a spiritually dead god, Government. We are praying for it's blessings upon Our just causes, are We not?? All organized "Religion" is just another mental Prison. Government and Religion, are the "Gifts" granted unto this World, by the Light-Bringer. His other name, "Satan", which simply means "the Accuser", is carried by all, who join the Congregation of the Spiritually Dead, and pick their "side"; whether Communist vs Capitalist, Catholic vs Baptist, Left vs Right, Red vs Blue, Muslim vs Jew. These "factions" ACCUSE each the other, of trying to bring about Chaos. Behaviour that is as Satanic as the Day is Long, which causes Those who were brought to Earth most recently(roughly 7600 years now), to abandon Their Mission of Deliverance of this World, from these two "Gifts" of Satan, the Devil, "Lucifer". Think on it just a moment... Do not Governments facilitate the Mass murder, mass theft, and rape of this world's resources?? Do not Religions, tell their adherents that all other religions are missing the Truth? Accusers All, meant to Keep the Populace of this blood-soaked, mud-covered bar-magnet of a planet, DIVIDED AND FALLEN. Keep Reflecting, Little Flock.
The number of the Mark of the Beast is 666, which actually breaks into 6x60x600. 216,000. Every hominid has 144.000 genetic expressions in their DNA; 72K from the male progenitor, and 72K from the female progenitor. This "mRNA" "Vaccine" CAN change your 144K to 216,000, by splicing a third set of genetic expressions into your DNA... Sorry folks. CRISPR technology, forbidden Fruits yet again, being "eaten". Fear not, Little Flock. Judgement is Soon.
Funny, but brutaly truthful at the same time.
Doing that simultaneous to putting Nazi aligned political projects back in power in Eastern Europe was the clearest example of American ideology that I can think of.
The funniest and most ridiculous sh*t that the american political elite and the corporate media does is that they accuse the russians of meddling in the 2016 presidential election for which there is no credible evidence presented to this day, just a flimsy report from the us government on the matter. However nobody has said a thing when the americans openly supported and likely interfere in the 1996 russian presidential elections where Yeltsin the candidate with the lowest popularity and approval rating amongst the populace somehow won.
Considering all the appeals to the West Yeltsin and Putin ever made, that's just some cruel shit to be honest.
That "I will not be surprised if Spielberg gets an Academy Award. Did not Kissinger get a Nobel Prize?" finisher is an absolute mic drop, goddamn.
This is a fantastic video. As a child, I watched Enemy at the Gates over a dozen times, and it drove part of my interest in history that I have today. As I grew and especially as I began to make content regarding history, I realized how much of the content that motivated me was hilariously off the mark, but there was always a nugget of truth and I find that once I learned the real history, the tales of our past are so much more intricate and interesting than the flat narratives of good and evil. Loved your video and can't wait to see more.
Wendigoon? Didn't expect to see you at a video like this, but nice to see you here
Love your channel!
Wendigoon! You should do more film criticism too. Especially ones like these that perpetuate a false myth
He seems to think the movie just shouldn't have been made unless it was willing to portray Zaitsev as Communist rather than just a general, apolitical patriot-which a US film wouldn't have been willing to do. I think having a mainstream US movie about the battle with a few unsurprising omissions and exaggerations is valuable rather than outrageous and I think the movie did depict the Soviet soldiers as heroic and the battle as a big achievement even while still being against the Communist system and leaders.
it's kind of a crap video, it takes some unsupported statement so outlandish that even the talkshow host wants to yeet himself out of a window
it would be like quoting the japanese suicide cults leader that caused the terrorist attack on the subway and then talk about how it reflects japanese society
also enemy at the gates is already infamous for inaccuracy
in germany part of post war history is denazification (or more accurately the failure of) including taking wehrmacht generals memoirs at face value, as well as transferring alot of former Nazis into positions of power in military, secret services, justice system and government
What I feel like is also warranted to point, as you briefly mentioned, is that Stalingrad wasn't important becaused it was named after Stalin, but rather because being able to keep it would prevent the Nazis from occupying the oil fields in the Caucasus. People think that Barbarossa was just Hitler being dumb or something, but well, first, not invading the USSR wasn't an option because he was Hitler, and second, people forget that wars are about resources, which includes stuff like gas, oil, and all those other pesky things we need to construct and run things. Like, it's not just about who has the coolest tanks and the most fantastical technology. This is precisely why I wanted to elaborate on this because people never talk about that and just go 'well, if Hitler didn't just go invade Russia like that...'
Very true! Not to mention the Germans were BADLY in need of oil for much of the war.
@Zoomer Stasi yes, but the point being made is that nazi ideology demands a purge of subhumans i.e. the population of the soviet union, therefore destruction of their state was considered necessary
@Zoomer Stasi I think you have that flipped around. Halder still wanted to chase his own objectives in ending the war, and no doubt the higher ups were doing the same thing. It was Hitler who was focused on taking the resource rich area of Ukraine and the Caucuses. Halder intentionally sabotaged the operations in the southern theater precisely because he wanted the army to focus on Moscow.
Hitler wanted to invade the USSR because he wanted to colonise Eastern Europe. The point of the war against Western Europe was just a ‘tool’ he need for his real objectives in the East.
I think it's important to point out that the reasons for invading the USSR were more than just ideological 'he was Hitler' stuff - the entire point of the war, really, was to secure territory, 'lebensraum', to support a new German economy that could resist capitalist collapse. Generalplan Ost was explicitly a plan to enact settler-colonialism on the territories of the USSR, massacring the populace and replacing them with 'wehrbauer' peasant settlers, which would vastly reduce the power of not only socialism in the USSR, but of the German proletariat, by shifting so much of the economy out of their hands and opening up fresh new domains for the expansion of capital. The war, the genocide, everything, was the direct and logical result of capitalism in deep and final economic crisis - and having already faced numerous socialist uprisings within its own borders.
What confuses me the most is that majority of the USSR countries got more than sufficient literacy rates than most countries at the time because of the communal education system. So it honestly baffles me when they're treated as illiterate morons compared to the west. Even countries who adopted Communist ideals outside the USSR had literacy skyrocketed like Cuba.
What is up with communist sympathizers and mentioning literacy rates. As if the ability to read somehow makes you smart. You have to be able to read to understand Karl Marx but that doesn't mean anything that moron had to say led to anything but poverty. I don't know, maybe being able to read is a big deal in communist countries because they definitely can't think
That was primarily done to ensure the populace moves up from entirely ignorant peasants to mostly ignorant peasants who now know Marx and the occasional state propaganda.
Algeria had a literacy rate of 3% after independence, now it has 82%
Anti-communist propaganda spread by capitalists to paint socialism as evil.
No shit. You can't consume theory if you can't read.
Our troops have 'indomitable fighting spirit'
The oppositions troops have an 'cruel implacable mentality'
It's kind of insane to me how prevalent the idea has become that the USSR's massive loss of life during WWII was because human life was not valued and soldiers were "cannon fodder", instead of ya know, the USSR having to bear the brunt of the Nazi's assault as well as the genocide that was the General Ostplan.
It's even more annoying vecause you just know that if it was any of the Western powers who lost that many people in battle, it would be all about the incredible bravery and self-sacrifice of those who fought for the liberation of Europe
@@mynamejeff3545 The French, the Norwegians and so on had the luxury of being able to surrender and keep their losses low. Not so the Russians, they knew what would happen if they did.
@@mynamejeff3545 Ironically it's the US that loves human wave attacks (attacks intentionally using solely infantry without combined arms support or expecting a lot of casualties). Not even China used human wave tactics in Korea because those were skirmishing, infiltration teams and why most of the time they did not find bodies which the US also tried to spin into something nefarious.
@@ThomasPalm-w5y True. And it was like this throughout the entire Eastern front, Poles for example were brutally treated by the Germans also. I read somewhere, don't remember where, that after the war a French civilian and a Pole met, and the second one said to the first "You don't what the war was. In Paris restaurants and theaters were always open and life was almost normal".
Fictional Danilov basically: “The state should distribute girlfriends”
Based and Redpilled
This movie cemented my dislike for whathisname, the inferior Fiennes brother.
State assigned wife
Vasily: she's my girlfriend
Danilov: our girlfriend!
Incan communism at its best
One infuriating detail about this "stereotype" that the soviets were always killing their own people is that the germans also killed a lot of their own people. Their "undesirables" included not only civilians but also "coward" soldiers that had suffered trauma during combat.
But aren't germans the bulwark of the civilized white race?!?😨😨😨
@Swarmpope No, there are people that do, someone did that recently.
@ERRATAS 0202
Did you really miss the whole Holocaust thing? It’s kind of a big deal.
I’m not sure what your point is. Are you saying that the Germans also killed their own people, and so it was located the Soviets did it? I don’t think that’s what you’re saying but I’m not sure what your point is.
@@hashtagunderscore3173 What you mean "it was located the Soviets did it"? I don't understand this sentence.
About what I meant, just re-read my first comment. I'm complaining that this widespread stereotype that the soviets were always killing and "gulaging" their own is most part propaganda (you can see this occurring today, when represents of the European Union and in media comments about the war in Ukraine and say that the Russians "aren't like them and don't hare the same civilized values"), while it's equality a result of propaganda that you don't usually knows the Nazis killed a lot of their own population and soldiers. Everyone theoretically knows how the Nazis were bad and murderous, but in practice most most are unaware of all the peoples they killed. It may be hard to see, but the Nazis where whitewashed.
This movie seems to draw imagery from WW1 and then assigning it to Stalingrad-era red army.
On the beginning of WW1 major supply problems with Russia and outdated doctrine of bayonet charging resulted in several documents assaults where soldiers were expected to pick up arms of fallen soldiers.
But besides the supply issue, early WW1 was a massacre for almost every party involved, as the old charge doctrine faced machine guns and artillery. The First World War by Martin Gilbert documents suicidal charges by Germans, Austrians and Austro-Hungarians. Luigi Cadorna, the Italian commander, was famous for throwing man at the meat grinder and blaming the losses on "lack of fighting spirit"
My guess is that the director used these events of the WW1 as inspiration for the movie, in a blatant disregard to historical accuracy.
Very interesting point!
There is a phrase that is often used to describe this situation during WWI as "one rifle for three soldiers", which many people remember since school, but they forget that it was applied to WWI, and will use it to describe WWII. And many anti-soviet stories start to build their narrative on this fallacy. You will find too many people in post-soviet countries believing it, along with many other myths. Post-modern at it's best.
The primary inspiration for Enemy at the Gates is Stalingrad, written by a British "gentleman historian", Antony Beevor. Just like the movie, the book is more interested in smearing the legacy of the USSR than any factual recounting of history.
The director used those events for one reason only and you know what that reason is
Yeah I think the one man rifle one man ammo thing was actually done in czarist Russia
I am sorry, i got upset by the German woman at the beginning of your video. Obviously she forgets that under the austerity measures by IMF to Greece period 2008 onwards, the Greek hospitals did not have money to provide bandages to the patients. That was predominately imposed by the Germans who wanted to 'punish' the lavish Greek State. So, where was the solidarity of EU and mainly the Germans?
I am sorry, but Russia had to cut gas supply to Germany. Let them pay now 4 times up the US LNG.
Germany like most of Europe will be predominantly Muslim within the next 100 years. German culture is dying a slow pitiful death
thank you for bringing this up! As a Greek I've grown tired of the Germans giving the title of "European" wherever they like it as a continuation to the title of "honourary Arian"! Bad habits never die!
I really like Enemy at the Gates from a standpoint of it just being, you know, a movie. Taken on its own, a lot of the scenes genuinely are cool and get a hell of a rise out of me. But seeing how many people's understanding of Eastern Front history is basically wholly formed by it has soured me on it.
You might want to try some Russian cinema that deals with WW2, then. Try "White Tiger" - it's a (very) fictitious story, but it still manages to feel far, far more authentic than this piece of trashy propaganda.
@@flippydaflip5310 also "come and see" if you want probably the most moving portrayal of the horrors of war.
@@flippydaflip5310 White Tiger does end with a rather nationalist notion that Russia is in inherent state of antagonism with the rest of the world, who are potentially just as evil as the Nazis for wanting nothing more than to take advantage of the poor Slavic people, and the general "well that's just how things are!" mindset. Which is the same kind of nationalism and propaganda condemned in the video, only from another side.
@@olserknam I think you may need to watch the ending of that movie again... you may have misinterpreted it.
@@flippydaflip5310 Now I'm curious, what is your take on it?
A meme that I love is: "When they tell you that only half of the Soviets have rifles, but it was because the other half had SMGs"
The saying is hyperbole, but its interesting to note that most soviet battalions had a company specifically equipped entirely with SMGs like the PPS41 and PPS42 by mid war. Special "tank rider" battalions more so, with 4 companies being equipped with such. Assault engineer battalions were equipped with automatic weapons alone.
The best part is that its true!
There is a reason it's so easy to find historical nagant rifles.
US material like trucks and jeeps were a lot more vital.
According to western media, the modern Russian army ran out of ammunition 2 years ago and now relying on shovels and washing machine parts to fight.
@@SusCalvin another Cold War myth. The UK received more Lend Lease than the Soviets, despite a vastly inferior contribution to the war. Not only that, but the Germans had already conducted their last successful offensive when Lend Lease started to increase for the Soviets.
That is ... the Red Army had already beaten the Germans.
Enemy at the Gates received bad reviews at the time of its release and when I watched it on home video a year later, I could see why. A wasted opportunity that fails to convey the magnitude of the situation - which is particularly annoying because Annaud is aware of this and said in an interview that had Stalingrad fallen, he'd be speaking German. I'm embarrassed to admit that I wasn't aware that Zinn had reviewed SPR, likewise that I've only just discovered your channel. Better late than never!
Time for a more proper Hollywood representation of Zaitsev and the heroic defenders of Stalingrad. Albeit, showing more the casualties of war, rather than glorify it etc. This German 1993 movie about Stalingrad does a much better job.
Its a known fact that any Hollywood war movies have to be vetted by the CIA. Its why Spielberg wrote the Soviets storming Berlin at the end of Schindlers List, but had to change it to a couple of Cossacks on horseback.
'"We liberated Europe from fascism, but they will never forgive us for it'- Marshal Zhukov: The movie"
Zhukov... Zhukov, the guy Stalin is envious and fearful of, the guy Stalin himself hates and erases all mentions in his Blockbuster Soviets films featuring Stalin as hero. the Guy who also killed all of Stalins second hand men after discovering Beria is a pedo. That Zhukov? I like the guy, but I doubt he's all that ideological. What's next? Kissinger and China wasn't all buddy buddy against the Soviet Union? hah, Communists sure are funny.
The Japanese empire not valuing life the same as everyone else is actually historical based. It’s not racist if it’s true.
There are still leftists who despise the U.S. for liberating Asia-Pacific from fascism. Quit being such a hypocrite, fool!
@@davemccage7918 Don't you know that the woke mentality is "if it's racist, it can't be true."
It's pretty clear from their newest video that Kay and Skittles have still never forgiven the U.S. Military for liberating East Asia from Fascism and stopping genocide. And you probably haven't, either.
I remember being taught the "soviets shot their own troops if they retreated" and the 1 gun for 2 people thing in school. The fact that this was apparently sourced from a movie is so pathetic I want to laugh.
Why laugh when you can weep instead?
The funny thing is, many modern history teachers and all sorts of media figures in Russia also broadcast this nonsense.
They were so desperate for guns that they gave machine guns to barrier troops... the logic....
That’s American education for you.
@Hiazro Kailindo At a smear campaign of BS propaganda being perpetuated as fact.
This is interesting. In India, that has had a long history of Soviet collaboration, the story we absorbed is of an intrepid Russian army, fighting against a much superior german army, the latter done in by its own arrogance against an army it considered not worthy enough. It dovetails quite nicely with india's own colonial encounter and the massive effort it took to overthrow british rule
Yet India now forgets about colonialism when it gets stuff from ruzzia.
@Swarmpope well, this is playbook for "special military operation" .
@@mikhaelgribkov4117 India is actually doing the smart thing for its people instead of virtue signaling.
Everyone loves an underdog story, fighting against all odds and barely winning solely due the bravery and sheer determination of an army.
@@justiron2999 the Red Army fitted that description perfectly.
I remember watching EatG in GCSE History class and my teacher uncritically reinforced it's message. There is no doubt in my mind that thousands if not millions of English-speaking peoples first and lasting introduction to the Soviet Union and Eastern front was this movie. All those redditors calling Russians 'orcs' and 'subhuman' are thinking of this movie.
calling a human being an "Orc" because of their nationality is crazy
Many white Americans will jump at any chance to be racist.
They got their title orc for being straight up genocidal in Ukraine and breaking some records in war crimes while being dumb enough to make trenches in Chornobyl. Is calling nazi "pigs" bad now? You ruzzian suckers would change a tune when you have this orcs calling you "small ruzzians" for 8 years and desiring your genocide.
The actions of modern Russia also have a lot to do with that.
@@雷-t3j Nazis are bad unless they are Ukrainian, right?
One of the many absurdities in this film, was the scene where Koulikov is talks about how he was accused of being a German spy at some point, and how his interrogators knock all his teeth out with a hammer for....what again? Then, after taking pretty much every tooth he has, they give him a mouth full of false teeth and made him a sniper. Because commies are that dumb and inconsistent I guess? I dont know, but this entire films anti-soviet messaging is about as subtle as a hammer to the teeth, and it pretty much starts at the very beginning of the film and hardly ever lets up.
And, no, in case anyone is wondering < not 'pro-soviet here', I am pro-honesty though.....
Subtle irony is not a thing with Americans.
That's the first thing any military does with spies: light, non-handicapping torture followed by promotion to an elite military unit on the front lines.
to play the devil's advocate, Konstantin Rokossovsky was brutaly tortured by the NKVD and yet he was among the the very best Soviet commanders.
You love the big red commie duck don’t you?
@@TeutonicEmperor1198I think he actually did get metal teeth out of the deal too.
I can't tell you how many times I had that argument with my uncle at family gatherings.
Like imagine the outrage from Americans if the USSR had depicted the boys at Iwo Jima as hapless, illiterate fools who were being fed lies by powerful tyrants so as to manipulate them.
There's plenty of American movies that portray US soldiers as dumb hicks...that's the thing I find hilarious about people like you, you get outraged at some minor examples of inaccuracies in film (as if entertainment should be always fully realistic...like come on, we watch movies to have fun, not to always be inundated with facts...we have entertainment to ESCAPE from reality not be doused in it) while there are many examples of movies trying to be as realistic as they can. That's the thing, the West has a myriad of sources in media and entertainment..sure, you can find a lot of spurious BS, misinformation, propoganda, etc..but you also can find the shocking truth as well, all freely available. In Russia you just can't...war movies there are right-wing propoganda showing the wars Russia fought in as glorious conflicts where Russia never did anything bad, and to this day the Russian government still airs such movies in cinemas to stoke nationalistic spirit and bans movies that show the reality of the situation
Twitter would riot
didnt clint eastwood make a movie with more or less that same premise
No good analogy of Stalingrad in the Pacific other than maybe the Japanese pushing America out of the Philippines or the Dutch in what is now Indonesia.
It's also worth remembering that Soviet troops *welcomed* the "not a step back" policy because they knew they had to make a stand somewhere. These were people with families who they didn't want to die in concentration camps. They were massively invested in the liberation of their country in the way that only the threat of total annihilation can make you be. They didn't want to just go home and beat off while waiting for their entire family to be killed.
Enemy at the gates: "The guy who wrote notes that inspired this movie is illiterate".
Ah yes, the movie about Stalingrad that spends more time denouncing the Soviets than the Nazi invaders trying to exterminate them. Hollywood, ladies and gentlemen.
Hollywood films _routinely_ portray the Germans in WWII as empathetic and "not all bad", and barely even portray the Soviets _at all._ That basically sums it up - the USA is a fascist state.
*All liberals and most self-described "leftists", ladies and gentlemen.
@@Dorian_sapiens Same difference
I'm from Russia myself. I may surprise you, but this is the leitmotif of 99% of films about the war shot after the collapse of the USSR in Russia. A considerable number of left-wing bloggers in Russia already specialize in critic analysis of such films (for example, Badcomidian, Tagany, Rebel Jack, Red Cynic, etc.) , and even joke about the fact that it has become a kind of a single cranberry sinematic universe.
So the fact that foreign filmmakers are far behind in the matter of shitting on our history. What can I say, capitalists are the same everywhere.
I am glad that now someone outside the CIS has begun to review these films. It will be funny if you get to modern Russian films, in this regard, you can even use the sketches of the above-mentioned bloggers.
America was hitlers inapirstion and main financier so no surprise...america loves fascists
Can’t have a bunch of Slavic communists be sympathetic protagonists, can we?
Wondering: is it because they are slavs or communists? Or actually both?
@ Both.
I wouldnt be surprised if anti-Slavic sentiment is inseparable from anti-Semitism since many of the Jewish immigrants in Western Europe and the US were from Eastern Europe.
@@Братецревольверalso because they're Russian and they're not capitalist and they're fighting against capitalism and they're not American (important!) and they successfully overthrew the oppressive capitalist government
and they value life differently (unlike the Japanese, which are so in line with us in US)
They are just as bad as fascist Germans ... Slavic communists have tarnished themselves through history and are still at it as you can see.
I remember really liking EatG when it came out, I'm a sucker for tense sniper movies. But wow, I would've never picked up on all this back then. Great video!
So, as a US Navy vet, I think I can shed some light on the reasons behind the weird plot of Saving Private Ryan. The military does actually have a series of policies in place that are designed to get people out of combat if all of their brothers are killed in action. It's and old timey rule that is less about lessening the pain of a grieving mother than it is about ensuring that the "family line" is preserved. The example we always learn about in the Navy is the case of the Sullivan brothers, who were all serving on the same ship when it was destroyed, killing all five brothers. In response to this, the Navy made a new policy that siblings can no longer serve on the same ship during wartime and it also caused a military-wide codification of the already unofficially in use "Sole Surviving Son Policy", which says that if you are the sole surviving son of a family where at least one of your brothers had died in combat, then you were exempted from military service, whether in peace or wartime. If all the sons in a given family were serving in the military, and all but one of them died, the surviving son was usually sent home and made to finish out their service behind a desk somewhere, and there are a number of stories of this happening during WW2, when it wasn't uncommon for whole families to sign up. I think Spielberg probably heard these stories and thought "What's the worst case scenario for getting one of these kids home?" and then ran with it.
My grandpa was in basic training preparing for the Korean War. His father who was a farmer, was struck by a barn door in a wind storm and died. My grandpa was sent home as the only male in the family. None of his friends from basic survived.
that happened to the Niland brothers, on which SPR is loosely based. With the Nilands though, two of the brothers actually survived - the eldest was shot down over Burma and a POW who returned home after Japan's surrender, but he was MIA presumed dead so the sole survivor rule was invoked for the youngest brother to be repatriated.
IIRC that policy was in effect even before the Sullivans, but it was ignored and was proven why it existed.
It's almost like the maker of this video ignored that, so he could jab at Spielberg and the US.
@@deusvultpictures6550 I remember that
The population in the territory held by the axis was larger than that of the soviet union by the battle of Stalingrad. The Nazis alone outnumbered the soviets in military personnel early in the war. The heavier losses on the soviets side were largely due to severe logistical difficulties due to the extremely large and sparse territory of eastern europe as well as nazi massacres of civilians and POWs. No army in WW2 was just like "lol, we have infinite people so it doesn't matter who dies".
Try explaining that to "history buffs" who like playing "realistic" games or "learning" about the war.
Believe me, I tried.
@@michimatsch5862 HOI4 playing, Cheeto dust covered and Nazi sympathizing mfs.
Ya, this WW2 was a massive logistical and resource intensive war. Some say it is a reason for Nazi swiftness in tactics is that once started they rapidly would need to secure access to resources like oil. I dunno for sure but regardless resources management was paramount for all involved. This included manpower. This was an industrial war. Hell, even the US had rationing during the war and the war wasn't taking place on their soil.
@@shanefoster2132 yup. The reason Stalingrad was considered a big deal was it would cut off soviet logistics to the south and allow the nazis to seize the southern oil fields to solve their oil shortage. Because it was a soviet victory the Axis would suffer from a crippling oil shortage for the rest of the war which would force them to not only reduce production of military vehicles but even start scrapping tanks and trucks they already had built due to not even being able to fuel them.
@@ninjasheep7492 holy shit, just looked at a map. It just struck me how far they had pushed. Before now I thought of it more as above the Black Sea but it's above the Caspian almost Central Asia. I guess cuz of the meme/myth of invading Russia in winter was still in the back of my head.
Not sure any army ever made larger "meat wave" than D-Day.
Wich dday
The allies faced 8 german divisions in France in June of 1944.
On the Eastern Front in June of 1944, the Soviets were fighting back and winning against 260 german divisions.
I don’t really see it as a meat grinder either, all operations made during the war be it Soviet or western ones were carefully planed and required huge efforts of combined arms such as air power, artillery shells raining, armored assaults and infantry supporting them. Sadly when you have to assault the positions of an entrenched enemy who also has massive forces casualties will be very high.
BIG THANK YOU from a descendant of Red Army's WW2 veterans! I'm glad that someone broke down this garbage movie for English-speaking audience! You won't believe how many "Enemy at the gates"-style movies we having now in post-Soviet countries. I assume this movie started the whole thing. And our young west-oriented generation believes in those lies. So once again thank you 👍
Oops, Ukraine is a meat grinder and Putin refuses to stop! I suppose it was not so removed from reality after all ツ
It's so depressingly unsurprising to see that NATO shares the ideology of the Azov battalion. I just finished watching a documentary on the battle of Kursk and it is so sobering to think that these same villages are being fought for today by Russians fighting sieg hieling, black sun and wolfsangel wearing, Stephan Bandera worshiping fascists. Almost a century later and Germany is still imperialist, still fascistic (oppressing both Palestinians and non-zionist Jews as well as the so-called "Orcs"). Fuck NATO. Fuck Germany and the USA.
THIS
In fact, evem majority of Russian WW2 movies in the 2000s also jumped on this hype train of "drunk and stupid commander sends people to die, evil NKVD executes good guys, then we win the war".
@@bbcmotd Why?
As a soviet reenactor for wwii i am so glad to say out loud to everyone "finally someone said it!" I'm so glad you made this video. As much as I love enemy at the gates. It is a disgusting portrayal of Stalingrad and the ussr as a whole. Its needs to get out there that this is truly how it is in this day and age.
The Soviets tortured and murdered 50 MILLION of their own people and sent millions of others to forced labor camps. The USSR WAS disgusting.
why do you love it then?
This is definitely a super duper American movie. It goes full Western in the final scene before the epilogue, when Jude Law faces down Ed Harris in the railyard. Sun's shining through the smoke, he's got a poncho that waves in the wind, a high whistle sounds as he's revealed between the train cars. That's what really slapped me in the face back when I first saw the film with "this is an American movie! get it??" The comparison with Private Ryan is very important
In zaytsevs own book he describes how new troops spent three days getting prepared and equipped before crossing the Volga.
This movie's influence on later depictions of the Eastern front in Western fiction cannot be overstated. I remember one of the opening scenes of one of the earlier Call of Duty games being practically a shot-for-shot recreation of the opening of Enemy at the Gates. When Relic Entertainment made Company of Heroes 2 set on the Eastern Front, they billed it as an authentic depiction based on exhaustive historical research, when in reality they obviously just watched Enemy at the Gates and made a video game about it. On the other hand, most media out of Russia about the war, like Battle for Sevastopol and The Dawns Here Are Quiet (entertaining though they are), are propagandized from their own perspective. There's very little popular media that I'm aware of about this time and place in history that isn't colored by propaganda.
Though some are much better and nuanced, than others. For the Eastern Front, the best to me, and the one I am advising my students to watch in one of my courses, is 'Come and See' (1985). Try it. Fair warning: it is a very tough film to watch, almost unbearable.
You assume Russian media is pro Soviet.
I agree, they could have made with soviets look much worse with how they legitimately operated during this time up until 1945. Portraying the reds and its footsoldiers as an acceptable evil is propaganda thats been with us since the second world war
cool video skittles. You're always such a good writer.
_also I guess kay did a good job reading your script_
Gotta say, "inside train" is definitely my preferred state vs. "outside train" once a train hits speed.
The bias of the author and allegory on Gulag here was absurd, because in reality doors weren't locked - troops inside were already armed and in case of attack were ready to jump out and defend the train.
Also Vasiliy mentions in his book that train had seats and even restaurant carriage. It was a nice ride and quiet passing trough river, because soviets were crossing the river only during the night.
Another nugget of truth: In Junior Lieutenant Mansur Abdulin's fantastic memoir Red Road From Stalingrad, he notes that his division was chronically short of rifles and had less than half their authorized number. So instead, most soldiers used Submachine Guns. This is notable because the Soviets had entire SMG battalions (the only country to deploy them organically, en masse) but Mansur's division was a rifle division.
Yup, the joke "Only one half had rifles, because other half had SMGs" is real, because PPSH was absurdly simple, reliable SMG that was mass produced. It was so simple, that even AK could be jealous in this regard.
There are videos of people finding old, rusty PPSHs and making them fire even without any refurbishment, just a new drum mag.
@@calluxdoaron1903 I mean one soldier carries the rifle, the other carries ammo is also rooted in reality. The phrase goes "one soldier carries the rifle, the other carries ammo and together they are called anti-tank crew". Because anti-tank rifles were that heavy
My grand-grandfather, who served in RKKA air force logistics corps, likely rolls in his grave every time, when somebody watches the infamous "one rifle, one clip" scene.
I saw this movie when I was 8, I think, but now I find the better film about Operation Barbarossa is the Russian film "Come and See" where the director actually lived that experience and it's at least ambiguous as to what villages/cities are present. Not that the villages or cities really matter.
Фильм "иди и смотри" только 1 страница из книги с названием "я из огненной деревни". Трагедия белорусов. 3.600 деревень сожгли вместе с людьми. Каждый 2ой белорус погиб тогда.
Там много всего. Но есть такой рассказ. Что в деревню зашли немцы и стали всех сгонять в избу, чтобы жечь. Одна женщина взглянула на своего сына. Он одел резиновые сапоги, что очень ему нравились. Она сказала, что-то вроде того, что сынок, как же долго будут гореть твои ноги в этой резиновой обуви...🤷
Regarding that EU official......for a German to be using such obviously dehumanizing language about slavs should ring numerous alarm bells. It is actually chilling considering the fact the Nazis genocided millions of slavs in their occupied territories (worth noting when the roles were reversed, there was no such genocide against Germans.) Also, yet another reason to loathe the EU.
The actual genocide going on right now maybe should chill you a little more than a normal European being fashy.
It seems that this anti-Slavic sentiment may go back as far as the Holy Roman Empire expanding eastward if not further, occupying territory via divine destiny,
TBH, I loathe both EU and Russia. The later for having Christian ethno-nationalism (arguably the most destructive ideology humanity has ever seen). The former for being a centralized body that is used to perpetuate western imperialism and suppressing the rise of socialism within its border.
@@musicaleuphoria8699 It absolutely does. One of the reasons The Battle of Tannenberg (WWI) was also known as The Second Battle of Tannenberg was for propaganda reasons surrounding the Teutonic loss at the Battle of Grunwald 500 years prior, in the same spot, against the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. Bigotry runs deep.
physical displacement is also genocide. Look what happened to Konigsberg/Kaliningrad. The Russians living there weren't the Germans who had been for over a thousand years.
From a Slavic American, thank you for making a case against anti-Slavic racism. It's an unfortunately common, and overlooked if not fully accepted form of geopolitically fueled racism in the United States and Western Europe.
Well, theres a point to that. All slav countries tend to cry about how they suffered during history, and victimize themselves as the ultimate good, while if they comitted some crimes thats always justified. Thats the case with the Baltics, who were the fiercest SS soldiers, the Polish, who were as much colonizers in Ukraine as the Russians, Czechs and Slovaks, who made a mass executin on their minorities, yet they cry about what nazies comitted against them, Serbs and Croats, Russians, you name them, I tell you what horrible thing they did. At least germans know they committed evil things.
Yeah, that whole Americans care about human life was deeply ironic considering how many "Americans" were being lynched at picnics in this country at the time that was asserted!
Well, yeah ruzzia is better than that. It just developed segregated zones and throws poor minorities in front.
Western/American hypocrisy with regards to foreign policy is sickening at this point. Listen, Im not gonna defend Russia invading another country, nevertheless doing so without being attacked first, however your comment reminded me of some other things that is discussed incessantly on mainstream media about this war that absolutely infuriates me. We're suddenly all flipping shit about Ukraine's sovereignty, when we to this very day still are partly occupying almost a third of Syria alongside our Kurdish proxies. Us being there in the first place without the legal government having invited us there, (regardless of what you think of said government), is a violation of it's sovereignty and therefore illegal. Not to mention the fact that we flooded the Syrian civil war with weapons which literally fueled it into the warzone it had been for nearly a decade and now, even though the war is over and our regime change attempt was thwarted, (once again, regardless of what you think of Assad, we most certainly were deliberately fueling this conflict to overthrow him), we are still sanctioning the shit outa the government because our side lost and we don't wanna let the country rebuild. Hell, when it comes to Ukraine - we literally backed and helped direct a coup of the corrupt but democratically elected Yanukovych government back in 2014 and helped install a virulently anti-Russian government so as to peel Ukraine away from Russia's influence and weaken our adversary. And suddenly now we care about democracy and sovereignty. There was a study that came out like a year ago, that found that Ukraine is more corrupt and less democratic now than it was prior to that "revolution". But of course, us backing Ukraine has nothing to do with helping the Ukrainians being slaughtered, it has everything to do with the exact same reason we backed the Mujahidin in Afghanistan against the Soviet Union and Communist Afghan government, it's done to bleed Russia. In other words, our political class in this country are willing to fight Russia to the last Ukrainian. But of course media in the west leaves all this out, this current conflict is instead framed as if Russia one day woke up and decided to conquer Ukraine without any actual historical or geo-political context being provided, because if they did people wouldn't tolerate sending 60 billion dollars worth of weapons to fuel a proxy war while economy is still in shambles as a result of covid. And just like we did with all our adversary/enemy nations in the past, we reduce them down to their evil leader, that of course being in this case - Putin, just like we did with Saddam for Iraq, Assad for Syria, and so on and so on.
Yup. I’m Pennsylvanian Deutsch/Dutch, and even though DROVES of us joined in on the war effort to help liberate our homelands, we were treated like the enemy. We went to fight our own brothers, and at home we were treated like we were the ones who caused it. It seriously damaged our culture. Most PA Deutsch aren’t fluent in german anymore or very in touch with our culture because of the extreme racism. Even in school growing up I dealt with discrimination from it because me and my family had a different language, and this was at the peak of WW2 shooters like MoH and CoD.
@@stuglife5514 Says the Wehraboo
@@Gilberto90 I’m not a wehreboo. I’m PA Deutsch. If you have nothing intelligent to say, leave this conversation. Imagine calling someone a wehraboo because their ethnicity. Tf is wrong with you
Italian chiming in on the so-called "blocking detachments" : in WW1, italian military police, the Carabinieri, were infamous for tracking down and executing deserters. The war movie "Uomini Contro" shows this well. And as far as I know, such policies were not uncommon in WW1. Now the video may be about WW2 but I find it odd that so many western people are keen to paint the brutality of total war with a broad brush when it comes to the "other" and try to pin it on socialism not valuing lives or some such, yet few remember when these things happened among European states not long before, and not to stop fascist genocide as in WW2, but to fill the pockets of the war industry and to honor intricated war treaties as in WW1.
@@nikolamilicevic1040 'Decimazione' too?
France was infamous for doing this in WW1. Kubrick made an entire movie about it.
"Uomini Contro" is a masterpiece. Extremely heart breaking depiction of the horrors of war.
I have to say that while Italy was the country that killed the most of his own men in ww1 the n umber of italian soldiers execuded amounts to about 1000. Don't get me wrong it is a lot if you compare it to the about 650 french soldiers executed by France but it still is far from the situation depicted in "uomini contro".
Uomini contro is not a bad movie but it is not historically accurate. Rosi (the director) was more concerned in launching a general anti-war message rather than making a historically accurate depiction of the Asiago front.
Same goes for Lussu (the author of the book that inspired the movie), while the book is far more historically accurate as it basically is Lussu's memoirs many events were exagerated in order to make more of an anti-war message.
In reality all the executions in the italian army happened after a trial by military tribunal and the role of carabinieri barrier troops, much like the one of NKVD barrier troops in ww2, was to rally up flleting soldiers, make them return to the front lines and eventually arrest the officers of the fleeing unit
Excelent video, congratulations! I'm an old guy by now, but being the son of a diplomat I first received the dubious honor of an american private school education; and then had the oportunity to visit Russia in different ocations: The USSR in the late 80's, the crap-hole Russia became in the 90's, the re-birth of a nation in the early 2000's, and finally, the olympics at Sochi and the Soccer World Cup in the last decade.
The most amazing thing (that's why I refer as a "doubious Honor" to my american early education) is that I was absolutely convinced of every bias and truism they taught me. I thought of "communists" as brainwashed people who would believe every bit of preposterous propaganda spewed by their leaders without question. And now, 54 years of experience has shown me, that this is true to Americans.
Most americans (not all) are ready to take anything the mass media tells them at face value, even if it doesn't make any sense. People is more interested in "winning" debates in order to confirm their own viewpoint than they are in finding the actual truth of things. I guess it is just human condition. But the level of propagandized, braindead folks you find around in the States rivals, and surpasess by much, anything I ever saw in the old Soviet Union. May be this is, because generally speaking, the soviet citizen was better informed than the average Hollywood taught six-pac Joe.
I applaud you my friend! I’m Russian and I’m deeply grateful to you for bringing up this topic!
Propaganda lacks nuance
And relies on compliance
And then they make a movie on the racist, fascist, colonialist, imperialist Winston Churchill, and never show anything bad about him even once.
US/UK oligarchy has completely warped history in their favor.
Indeed. The only reason so many medals were given out at Rourkes drift was to move the gaze away from Britain's worst military failure just hours earlier that still gets little coverage.
Interesting thing to read is Winstons article called Zionism vs bolshevism
Listening to the words of Florence Gaub is actually scary.
Scary to me, at least. Because I'm from Russia. I was born here, I live here. My country is the biggest in the world. We have Asian part and European part. Not divided by race, but simply by geography. And all of my life I lived in the European part. And when I travelled with my family to Europe... it wasn't different. Yes, different people, different culture, I got it. But it felt a lot like Moscow and St.Petersburg.
Of course I heard that even before War Europeans saw us differently than we see ourselves. But... I didn't ever think that it was like this. That we are less human to them. It's actually scary.
I'm used to anti-soviet, anti-communist propaganda. Just because our government give money to produce films like "Enemy At The Gates". But it didn't actually come to me before that to Europe Russians and Soviets are the same people. Not Ukrainians for now, of course. The lies about Holodomor and war between Russia and Ukraine help it.
Thanks for opening my eyes. Damn, that sounds weird considering massive anti-communist TV Show and book "Zuleikha Opens Her Eyes". But still. Thank you, Kay and Skittles.
P.S. Could you, please, do a video about the politics of BioShock? It's interesting to hear what you have to say.
What lies about the holodomor?
@@edward9674 The Holodomor has been heavily propogandized as being a campaign of purposeful directed genocide by the Soviets against the Ukrainian people.
In reality the Holodomor was a horrible tragedy that affected many soviet citizens including the Ukrainian people, caused primarily as a result of the following-
1. Weather problems crippling harvests.
2. Improper handling of the crisis by the Soviet government as a result of the soviets still advancing from the feudal economy that was Tsarist Russia and the primitive practices implemented during Tsarist times.
3. Influence of Kulaks i.e. wealthy land owning bourgeois and petite bourgeois peasants, primarily in the hoarding and destruction of resources like grain stocks as a reaction to implementation of collectivism.
It is also important to note that similar famines had historically occurred during the Tsarist era as well in much greater frequency, compare this with the Soviet response which would result in the end of such crisises post WWII. While the USSR made some mistakes and could have handled the situation better, the decades of historical revisionism and propaganda by bourgeois governments and "historians" such as Robert Conquest and the group responsible for "The Black book of Communism" have left much misinformation surrounding the event.
For more details about the famine I would recommend this video-
th-cam.com/video/vu5-tqHHtaM/w-d-xo.html
Hey! Another russian here. Nationalism and xenophobia are popular in russia, so saying that we're divided by geography rather than nationality/race is a false statement.
And yeah what lied about holodomor?
@@АняПетрова-х9н nationalism is popular in Russia, yes. But Russians live in both parts. You can’t say that in the European part live Europeans and in the Asian part - Asians. That is what I wanted to say.
Holodomor is presented as if the government deliberately let people die of hunger. Not by mistake. And this concept is false. Yes. There was a hunger. Yes. People died. Yes. This is a tragedy. But so are hungers that we’re quite popular in Russian Empire. Also the hunger in other countries at the time. Holodomor wasn’t an intentional genocide, like it is presented in media.
@@edward9674 Holodomor is presented as if the government deliberately let people die of hunger. Not by mistake. And this concept is false. Yes. There was a hunger. Yes. People died. Yes. This is a tragedy. But so are hungers that we’re quite popular in Russian Empire. Also the hunger in other countries at the time. Holodomor wasn’t an intentional genocide, like it is presented in media.
The depiction of Stalingrad in Enemy at the Gates is pure black propaganda. There's a nerdy YT channel called Stalingrad Battle Data (I think) which uses primary sources to demonstrate this with abundant clarity. Great video by the way!
*maybe I should have said "white" propaganda given that the sheer venom of the anti-communist messaging in the film brings some heavy-duty civil war era White energy with it...
@@allypoum White Russians (monarchists) and White Terror also fit.
@@ruedelta yeah that's what I was referring to.
Probably the channel you've mentioned is TIK channelwhere guys taking different sources from all sides and by comparing them and putting on a big map giving like the full view on the Battle of Stalingrad
@@Kantorek17 It's a different channel but it has done some stuff with the one you mention. Pretty sure it's called StalingradBattleData or similar. Nope have just checked it's now called Armageddon lol. Probably helps the algorithm.
I feel like Enemy at The Gates is closer in some ways to a Warhammer 40k live action film, in principle, than anything resembling the red army.
I remember even as a kid, I was shocked by the anti soviet bias of enemy of the gates. And this was just from casual reading at the library
9:30 - actually, it was THE bloodiest battle in human history. Nearly 2 million men died fighting for this city.
They were fighting to save their revolution. Prepared to give their lives. True patriotism. Socialist patriotism.
@@moretimeneeded56It was not about the political regime. They were fighting to save their lives and the lives of their families. By the time of the Battle of Stalingrad, everyone knew what was happening in the occupied territories. The Germans were coming for living space, not to overthrow the communists. And they did not need the local population.
@@za_nu_dait more had to do with racial theories of nazis and that they lived under a socialist state.
The idea that the justification for the dropping of bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki was the kamikaze fighters is actually taught in American schools. Still.
Which schools? History was my best subject, to the point that I reenact and volunteer at a WW2 museum and this is the first I've ever heard of this.
Theres a book full of letters from japanese pilots assign to "Special Atack" ie kamikaze. They were just young guys like us...
funny that the narrative that "we nuked japan to save lifes" wasn't a thing at the time. that narrative was born during the cold war, so that the Americans could pretend they weren't as brutal as the fascists or communists. But the nuking of japan was pretty much intentional, to make sure Stalin won't have a piece of Japan's cake
Might be one school brother, that is unheard of in American culture, I live with many history nerds who went to different schools and never heard of this
@@prinzalbatross9526you can even see it on youtube, till thos day there are videos justifying it and many brainwashed people who defend it
I'm Russian-Ukrainian and I'd never even heard of this movie until now, I had no idea how much it had contributed culturally. Holy shit, this is what you guys (generalised) all believe happened during that battle? So many of our people died in that war - twenty million by some counts - and you all think it's the result of stupid shit like THIS? Are you telling me every time I've had some internet argument with a Westerner about how no, we didn't lose twenty million people by just being bad at fighting and it was the price of blood of turning back the Nazis, they had THIS propaganda reel playing in the back of their head? Oh my god...
And Westerners think Russians are the ones who are brainwashed by propaganda, while in fact Westerners are brainwashed systematically by the most cartoonishly shitty propaganda imaginable. Just look at all the ridiculous things Westerners believe about north Korea because their racist media and governments tell them so. Really cartoonish things, like claiming Kim Jong Un had an architect executed because he didn't like the way the guy redesigned Pyongyang's airport. People in the West BELIEVE this crap. And these same people think they're all such "free thinkers", and look down on everyone else. It's amazing. Absolutely amazing.
I might have to disappoint you even more. This is just one small part of the whole systemic brainwashing which led to unprecedented rusophobia. It is literally illness.
There are movies such as Rocky where he trains in snow with wood, something ordinary person can relate to, but evil Soviets have some high tech shit, unnatural, and surely enough poor Rocky wins over the bad guys.
But what is interesting to me is that ordinary westerner until mid 2010s would use "Russian" and "Ukrainian" as synonyms, however very quickly they they were taught the difference, so now they just love Ukrainians (regardless of hating them not that long ago) and Russians will just continue to be Russians, literally lower beings.
What is also amazing is that Ukrainians are obviously dying for western goals they aren't able to notice that.
Like, peaceful solution was right under their nose and they refused to accept it, and then they blame Russians for everything.
Idk who nor how managed to convince Ukrainians that their only option is to join Nato. 100% unnecessary and stupid.
This was very challenging and important to hear. I can’t say I heard much of the anti-Russian narratives in my media, but I did have some of these biases rattling around in my head. I’m going to have to keep reflecting
Those narratives will exist for decades and more. It's basically a second Cold War, with US being far superior in informational warfare and demonization of their economical/political/ideological enemies.
Fun fact, during the cold war, Cuba had the highest literacy rate in the Western hemisphere. Not something western Europe or the US talks about very often.
As a Russian it is so awesome to have found a channel like yours. Thank you so much for your work in clearing up things people don't question (for example the narrative that "soviets dont value life like WE do" didnt go anywhere (now it's just Russians) and is such a simplistic classic case of otherness that people in the west simply accept as default) Thank you ❤
Stalingrad 1993 is a superior Film
Good video. I've just recently started playing Partisan 1941, a tactical stealth game about partisans in occupied Russia. I actually didn't know that when I started, I thought it was about the French resistance as it is a more common subject. I got caught by surprise by the earnest positive military nationalism that is displayed in the game by the main characters, with a good boy commander protagonist who all he wants is to protect his nation and communism. It is not something that Russians are usually allowed to have in Western media, so it is very illuminating. I am still not comfortable with it, the same way I am not comfortable with the nationalism in American war movies, the military its its version of nationalism is pretty much bad everywhere and the game is very much not interested in analyzing too deeply the ideology of any main character. But, the point is this sort of thing from a Soviet perspective is so rare to me it was refreshing.
If you want something more easy to shallow play Starship Trooper Terran Command that is based in Paul Verhoeven movie, even that is science fiction and have a touch of satire, really show the brutality of war, because the Command not give a fuck about their soldiers.
I'd like to add that even the contemporary Russian war movies about WW2 rarely display soldier and officers in a good light. So the game was a breath of the fresh air even for us. I mean, they've made NKVD officer a good guy, what's essentially have never been seen in any work of fiction so far.
@@TheKeyser94 Thanks, but from screenshots the gameplay is not similar at all and it is the type of game I don't like to play. I am not a fan of RTS as a rule, Partisan 1941 works for me because it is a *stealth* tactical game, with a focus on very small teams.
Anyway, the game politics aren't particularly hard to shallow. That was my point, though I guess I didn't make it clear. It is par for the course for most media with military protagonists and the those protagonists are Russian make it a bit more novel if anything. It is not good politics but it is fun as it is and no worse than most stuff out there.
As a Russian, I was also pleasantly surprised by the release of this game. Russian games about the war have not been released for many years, and post-Soviet works of art in which the Soviet army and people look like heroes literally for the first time.
Although the number of heroism in that war of worthy games and films is literally limitless. And the secret turned out to be simple, the game came out without any support from the modern anti-Soviet state (it would not have released such a game in life and would not have financed it), purely by enthusiasts.
You should watch Come And See directed by Elem Klimov, it's a Soviet film about the war from a partisan POV and it's free on TH-cam.
Communism is when I can't get laid so I became a proud boy.
"If you don't sleep with me, don't you get it, I'm gonna TURN NAZI"
hply shit man this just made my day
Reddit rtards spotted in the wild
Fallacy of association, anything else?
As someone from Ireland I have an oddly acute understanding of the White but not White rhetoric. For so long we were seen as lesser white people solely because we were Irish, seen as second class citizens in countries outside Ireland because we were "the stupid Paddy". Yes, the bulk of this was prevalent in the UK but the narrative was the same everywhere for so long. I have met plenty of Americans who have said they see themselves as Irish and therefore not white, to me an absolute head scratcher but it shows that there was obviously this feeling in America as well. My point is, this whole idea of whiteness, blackness or anything in between is pure bollocks. I share more with a black Irishman than an American who's great great grandfather left Ireland in the late 1890s
Truth is, those who want to hate seek for reasons to hate people, those who wants to love do the same. "Not white enough" rhetoric is one of these reasons for hate.
it was very interesting to read. I visited Ireland 4 years ago and was just shocked by how much we have in common (I'm from Russia, from Udmurtia). Almost all Udmurts have red hair, and we are called Irish by the Hand (because of our red hair and love of strong alcohol), haha. In fact, it is very sad that history repeats itself again, and the propaganda machine is once again making cruel bastards and unworthy whites out of us, although after visiting Europe, I realized that there is practically no difference between the conventional Conor and Ivan. I wish you all the best, and may Jesus keep you safe.
I'm sorry, I was writing through a translator.,
Soviet vets walked out of the film en masse because it was such an offensive mischaracterization
This video is officially certified by the Recommending Ones & Zeros.
Appeals to America's goodness goes back farther than that, from The Revolution, to The Civil War, to WW2, lots and lots of Appeals to that "American Virtue" were told that Americans have.
But as George Carlin puts it, the founding Fathers we're hypocritical, they owned slaves and started a Revolt so they can have financial autonomy, The Civil War ended Slavery, The Union became the Federal government that despite ending slavery was very much ok with Segregation and allowed the the Institution of Slavery that so many people on both sides died for to be replaced by a billion dollar prison industry... So the truth is, we are honestly no better than any empire that has ever existed and they thought they were all swell people too.
Actually, as Knowing Better informed me and many others in such disturbing detail, it was the _onset of WW2_ that finally ended traditional chattel slavery of black people in America.
What can I say but yikes.
I'm a Conservative and even tho I imagine we would disagree on a fair few things I Full agree with your point on dehumanisation and how the elits use propaganda to justify hating the "enemy" and to start wars
What do you think about the elites using conservatism to withhold ressources from the lower parts of society
Spoiler - the war has already started. And it was not propaganda that bombarded Muriapol.
many people start on the right much like you since thats what dominates todays politics. may i recommend the channel, "second thought" ? hes a fairly good introduction into modern issues of society and leftism
@shahramtondkarmobarakie1824
Thanks but ive seen and watch second thought, i dount know about right wing being defual tho in the uk form what I've seen people are pretty center/center left these days. Like in school if any one was political it would be left wing and I've actively gotten right-wing over the years, even polling shows that younger people start out more left wing. I just agree with some left wing ideas and that because I'm not dogmatic and realise that people of all political Persuasion will have some points that are worth considering and agreeing with.
@@maciejsosnowski5742maidan was the start of the civil war. Russia stepping in was their attempt to end the war since the west only wanted to fuel it
Very well done analysis. Your tone of speech really makes it sound as if you watched the same news as me over the last 20 years and are no completely fed up with “America is good, no matter what” without any criticism or attempt at change and are now expressing you discontent.
Since moving left politically some 15 odd years ago, I keep learning and unlearning new things. A lot of propaganda. Every so often, a new bit of info pops up, either to show a new view entirely or to expand my understanding of something, and I just have to take a minute and look at the effect that thing has had. It is occasionally astounding just how hardcore the propaganda machine worked with regard to the USSR. Not just during the cold war but (as demonstrated by this movie) the reverberations from the initial impacts. The Red Scare lives on today. How many folks are convinced Russia is still a communist country?
a lot and you can see how the Red Scare is still happening in a way with how a lot of people call people on the left Communists even if they aren't just another Us vs them
I’ve had a similar journey. If you want to just cut to the chase, read Capital and you’ll be communist by the end.
@@justinwatson1510 Oh man, that ship sailed a long time ago. Way ahead of you. Didn't even have to read Capital, I just looked at my life.
Tankies.
@@SaraphDarklaw What about them?
The cinematography in this video was TOP NOTCH.
Chernobyl, unfortunately, does the same mistakes, as Enemy at the Gate. Even though it is talanted crafted series, the propaganda spoils everything.
Not great not terrible. 😅
Watching this video after becoming a communist, goddam, I knew US propaganda was enforced on the movie but I hadnt thought it was this much, wonderful video to put it simply.
Token Bulgarian tm here, unfortunately confirming that ppl just be like that in this country and the fact that Kiril Petkov said that surprised no one of intelligence unfortunately.
This was a great look into how cinematic films distort history for purposes of making money and propaganda. Thank you it was a great watch!
Yes! An upload from my favorite TH-camr!
There’s a reason why the Mosin Nagant was, and maybe even still is, the cheapest surplus rifle you could buy. There were SO MANY of them left over after WW2…
Good video. I will say part of what makes the opening of Saving Private Ryan good is that there are moments where Americans are bad or have a crisis of faith at D-Day. One is when one soldier ( I think the same one who gets slowly stabs later) breaks down upon realizing that the fascists are sending Hitler Youth to the front, shown by a knife on a corpse. Another is when two surrendering soldiers are shot by Americans while begging for their lives in a foreign language. Not only is it uncomfortable if you only speak English, but the two are speaking Czech, saying, at least in the fiction of the film, that they were pressed into service. If Enemy at the Gates had actually tried to empathize with the Soviet soldiers or why people would fight for it beyond survival, it could have also had moments that show the brutality of the war that is inescapable by any force committing it.
Too bad SPR crumbles as it goes on, following the Omaha beach scene
11:27 hey (hellbeck) he was my professor! he actually discussed this film and the same fallacies you picked up on in class! Great guy and he often offered us to go out for coffee and had a plethora of stories from his time spent interviewing russians
Unknown5 has a video explaining the situation on the eastern front. Only a handful of soldiers were executed during the war. Incredibly many soldiers were convinced to go towards the front.
Fantastic and very necessary critique.
This was a great video and I'm shocked that the events depicted in Enemy at the Gates were almost completely made up. I had absorbed the "not one step back" and "every other man gets a gun" bits as fact.
Interestingly, they were further reinforced in Call of Duty (I think? Maybe Medal of Honor) and you actually play out many of the scenes depicted in the movie (they were heavily... uh inspired by the movie) And this is just Stalingrad... so many other real-world battles and scenarios have been depicted in popular media and I've never really questioned the facts bc... why would they lie? Its all historical and they can just get events from historical accounts, right? Right?
Saving Private Ryan also kicked off HBO's Band of Brothers and The Pacific. I've never really looked at it from the perspective of that quote you included (I forget the name). That these movies change war from being "always hell" to "sometimes good". As an American, our society is so steeped in military conflicts and it's hard to get the full picture.
Company of Heroes 2 does the same thing. It's pretty disturbing how big of an influence this flick has had.
I liked how Call of Duty: World at War handled the Russian campaign. While there is a sniper battle in Stalingrad, it doesn't feel like a rip off of Enemy at the Gates and fighting through Berlin was awesome and unique as WW2 shooters go. There is brutality (mostly done by Gary Oldman hamming it up) but it's always at Nazis and you understand why in the game's narrative ( and history obvs). There is an objector to the violence but I don't remember if he was anti-communist.
Funny thing - some of those myths are even present in modern-day russian movies about the war - which means either that this propaganda is so widespread even Russians believe it, or that russian moviemakers also want to depict the USSR bad to make sure people don't think about trying that whole thing again
i find it kind of funny how cod1's soviet campaign was so insanely stupid that cod2 kind of tried to make up for that by actually portraying the red army as competent except for the tutorial where you throw potatoes instead of grenades on the range lol
@@DiscoPickle102 I wonder if anyone besides Badcomidan has talked about historical lies in this game? Well, at least he made an English-language version of this review in those years, or else I think, no one would have found out about that nonsense in the game.
One thing that never appears in American movies during WW2 is how brutally racists Americans and the American army were. Remember, that was segregation era, but during not even one movie or series during WW2 there is a single reference to racism.
Red Tails (2012).
Usual racism in WW2 movies it's like:
-Marines boxing in a aircraft carrier for money, black person being the big winner while beating the only racist white guy who challenged him or the reverse.
-Black soldier being called the n-word one time and later saving the only racist sacrificing himself.
Here it is the big "racism" in Hollywood ww2 movies
The pacific
Not even to mention how anti-Semitic they were. That scene in Saving Private Ryan where the soldier points at a german angrily and says “JUDEN” is hilarious to me
Excellent video! Happy you are refusing to fall into the anti-communist claptraps about the USSR, and the teardown of that horrid movie is very entertaining.
Yeah, the loudest people on the USSR sometimes (not always) seem to be either Tankies or people just saying everything connected to the USSR is bad.
It's never that easy. There were great achievements and great injustices both committed in large quantities there, imo.
@@michimatsch5862
Given how many countries wanted to join the EU instead of Russia's alternative union it seems the USSR didn't have that many great achievements.
@@uanime1 They won the space race for starters. They largely improved literacy rates (especially for women.) They drastically reduced homelessness. They brought down homelessness to virtually 0. No serious person will argue that the USSR was perfect, but to ignore their achievements is silly.
@@uanime1 Russia at the start of the revolution was an absolute monarchy based on the same basic system of pre-industrial peasant feudalism that had been outdated for at least a century, and had just been ravaged by the first world war (which was far more destructive on the Eastern Front than on the Western Front because the Russian Empire used outdated equipment and strategy).
From that shitshow, the USSR managed to build a geopolitically powerful, comparatively democratic, industrialised, scientifically prolific world power in only about twenty years, at which point they had to stop briefly to be the most important player in the defeat of the Nazis before going on to stand toe-to-toe with the United States as one of the two most powerful countries in the world for another forty years. Yeah no achievements there.
@@uanime1 Russia !=USSR.
Either you are terribly misinformed, or this is really weak bait.
My country, Vietnam, how we fought the Americans and the French was portrayed like that, using human waves. How funny!
Um I’m pretty sure that was true considering the war was on film
@CrazyGorilla99 Nice one!
I always tell people to go watch a Chinese film called "Wolf warrior". You will never take these self important western war movies seriously again because when you see another country doing the exact same self congratulating, it becomes hard to ignore it. It's like holding up a mirror to yourself.
Try watching The Eight Hundred. Wolf Warrior is supposed to be more Rambo. The Eight Hundred is more WW2 reflection.
You know wolf warrior is like a action flick it’s not a reflection of reality. It’s like taking a James Bond film or Rambo film seriously.
@@joshuabonilla3491 the point is the jingoism smh 🙄
11:30 maybe the 'one rifle for two men' thing started because the other man had a submachine gun. I remember reading some old ww2 book where they said that about half had rifles, about half had submachine guns, but they worded it really poorly.
Apart from making the Soviet leadership seem cartoonishly cruel and indifferent to human suffering, they also purposely made them appear incompetent. For one, in the opening sequence Russian soldiers are brought in to attack an entrenched German position. Shouldn't it be the opposite? They're directed to make a straightforward charge, half without weapons, while they are mowed down by machine gun fire. When they naturally retreat, their own commanders mow them down instead. Strategically, this makes no sense, and accomplishes nothing. It is entirely wasteful to the point of absurdity.
"In Soviet Russia, we want to lose the war!" -badcomedian
The idea of Soviets doing this is so incredibly stupid
Best Video essay I have watched in a while. 10/10 would watch again
Amen, brother. great video! As to a Russian person myself it's surprising that moviemakers in Russia started filming "our reply to Hollywood" where they were trashing Soviet veterans even more. Which in it's turn led to empty movie theaters when we see slogans like "the real truth about WW2, this time for sure!!!". BTW, speaking of blatant propaganda, what about "Bridge of spies"? Anyways great channel you have here, keep it up!
Ivan's War by Catherine Merridale is a great book to read if you're interested in the lives many Soviet Infantry had during WW2.
It's a non-fictional book telling real stories based on diaries, wartime records, and personal accounts.
I think it compliments this video pretty well.
I have recently finished "Lenin on the Train" from her and wanted to check out some of her other books. Thank you for the recomendation.
@@firstname_lastname840 Haven't read "Lenin on the Train", I'll have to look into it. Appreciate the comment :D
A disgusting book full of conjectures and distortions of facts
A good perspective given with much objectivity.
Same thing with South Slavs. To Westerners, we are warlike barbarians even though we mainly cooperated here.
So I do agree with what you said but I do want to point out that the US did in fact have a policy to bringing home sole survivors of a family. This was was done after all 5 Sullivan brothers were killed during the sinking of USS Juneau. And Pvt. Ryan was based off Fredrick Niland who had 2 of his 3 brothers killed with the 3rd MIA and presumed dead but was actually in a Japanese POW camp. But Order 227 is definitely portrayed wrongly here in the West because it does make the Soviets look barbaric you see it in movies and video games despite like you said it having more to do with officers as opposed to the rank and file
The policy is of course believable, the part that is unbelievable is actually mounting a rescue mission in order to fulfill the policy when they needed every officer and platoon.
The policy only meant an officer would go to the surviving son and give him the news while dismissing him from the front lines. If the surviving son was unreachable that was it.
Now going behind enemy lines to fulfill the order is bonkers, it is SAFER to not send anyone as an unit in this position's best chance of survival is to remain hidden. Then you're likely to lose many men rescuing the one man, which is also insane as much as American movies try to paint as heroic. And the guy they were sent to rescue REFUSING IT is utterly laughable. Even as a kid I knew that was bullshit and Tom Hanks would be validated from executing Ryan on the spot for being so arrogant and a glory-chaser.
@@rafaelneumann8365 I didn't argue that they would send a team to get them. It was true I was just correcting the part of where he states that the bring back Pvt. Ryan is fictional while it it's based on a true story and he doesn't mention it so I'm filling in that gap by explaining the real policy and the story of Fredrick Niland who is the person Pvt. Ryan is based on and Sgt. Niland did actually at first refuse to go home at first like Ryan does but he does go home soo yeah..... the executing part seems a bit much
@@timothygoodwin3287 causing the death of your brothers in arms is one of the most common causes for execution in armies throughout history.
By refusing to follow orders to go back (which 100% supercedes the orders to protect a bridge) he basically causes the deaths of almost everyone.
Execution is a bit much, yes. But wouldn't be so out of the ordinary. Soldiers have been executed for far less.
I see it differently, Russian, Chinese and countries from that region have more courage and bravery to fight than that of westerners.
And were least r4c1st and cruel than western countries and empires
Hey, I know I am late to the party but had to stop the video near the end (the good war quote) and really think about my understanding of the righteous of defeating fascism. Good shit man, love this stuff.
Hi.
Sorry for low-level English. As an anti-war activist who still stay in Russia I can say that our «интеллигенция»/liberal so called intellectuals also have cold-war-mindset. So it's our inner problem too. They only make an exception for cool true european middle class opposition while poor and non-slavic russians portraits as a stupid evil sovetish crowd. And that caused a lot of problems for resistance for years. (But yes, we also have crazy shitty tankies from other side of opposition.)
Thanks for your video!
I'm glad that I'm not the only Russian left who watches this channel =))). And yes, peace to the huts, war to the palaces!
Ну, так мы тоже против войны, мы за победу русского оружия
С той стороны, кстати, вообще не Танкиз сидят, хотя дух от них похожий. Они не коммунисты даже, они просто хотят себе героическую историю без просчетов, свой "национальный миф", как в других странах, где корни свои надо обязательно протянуть чуть ли не до начала времен. Нашенские госдумовские КПРФовцы, если ты про них, конечно, тоже занимаются именно этим, на самом деле, а не защитой советского строя или чем-то подобным.
Chernobyl series are also a sack of sh🥒t. You are supposed to eat without thinking
I remember my first CoD too having the one rifle two dudes propaganda 😂😂
Wow this video made me reconsider so much of my understanding of war , thank you
I'm glad that I watched this movie when I was too young to understand the politics of it but rather enjoy "cool sniper stuff"