Great testing! It's surprising that ESP system doesn't brake the slipping rear wheel when only one rear wheel has traction. The hardware on the car should be easily able to brake the slipping rear wheel only and force the rear diff to output power to the only wheel with traction! You could have also tred the old offroader trick to apply light braking while applying throttle: that will make the slipping rear wheel harder to rotate and (depending on differential implementation) can transfer the missing power to the non-slipping wheel.
It's quite complicated for these awd systems cause system must power rear axle by multiplate clutch pack but in the same time it must brake one rear wheel while keeping it's speed similar to the front wheels. Old trick with brake doesn't work in new cars due to brake priority over accelerator.
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers At least VW cars allow pressing brake and accelerator at the same time if you apply the brake first. If you have any accelerator input and then touch the brake the accelerator input is ignored. And I think recent RAV4 models do not have haldex 4WD system but electric motor driving the real axle directly, but I might have misunderstood something.
@@MikkoRantalainen Toyota doesn't use haldex and never did, they use electromagnetic coupling from JTEKT. Electric motor driving rear axle is only in hybrid versions: th-cam.com/video/YvNaiXzdtnM/w-d-xo.html
@@vikiviki1663 Nie polegnie, ale są problemy. Większość dzisiejszych układów awd ma jedną oś "główną" (sztywno połączoną ze skrzynią), a drugą napędzaną sprzęgłem. Najtrudniejszy test to ten, w którym przyczepność ma jedno koło osi napędzanej sprzęgłem i tu sporo aut nie daje rady.
This is an interesting result. Because in real life scenario, when you have a diagonal spin, normally is whit an incline. In that circumstance the old Rav4 is absolutely rubbish, as with two diagonal wheels spinning traction control reduces too much the power not letting the car move, and not distributing correctly power side to side. It seems for what I see the system is supposed to help, but probably not "strong" enough to keep up with the weight of the car on an incline?.
These rollers are in fact harder for the car than an incline (they are 'deep'). I don't know the problem with older RAV4, maybe there was a need to turn ESP off, then power wouldn't be reduced?
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers I mean older Rav4 same as the "old" one you used it here. Toyota's traction control when turned off it disable all the electronics, so it doesn't help. There's some videos here in TH-cam showing that. I had the opportunity many times to travel around the country on Rav4 (2015 - 2018 model) and I experienced that all the time. Traction control sucks all the power and only "pumps" on the brakes, making a loud noise, but not enough to stop the wheel on the air. So I'm quite surprise that here on the rollers car pass it.
@@subazealand9158 I will try to find some 2015-2017 version. There is some video, but we can't see much there: th-cam.com/video/IZU2BsmdihA/w-d-xo.html
Dont forget its not a real 4x4 and it doesnt have locking diffs. All I need though is power to the front and the rear, the rest is just picking the correct line and using momentum if needed. I am a 2015 Forester owner and I always turn traction control when offroading. I am aiming for a 2019 Rav4 like the one in the video for my next car.
@@moonsapling I also have a Forester. But traction control works totally different in both cars. In Subaru when is off still will apply brake distribution, where in Rav4 will disable all electronics.
In RAV4 IV (2013-2015) AWD is button Lock and also TRAC off button - which you used but in manual is also description if you dont just press the button but hold the TRAC off button for 3sec it should off also VSC/ESP and it also helps me when I am going on my mountain cottage in winter a lot. Maybe you can try it if result on one wheel on ground could be passed.
Why not try it in reall? As I said in winter on heavily snowed hill if i just press it systems trying to keep power low and i coudlnt get up to my cottage but when i off everything only keep lock 4x4 all wheels going as much as they can and than i have no problem to get uphill.
@@bazzinacz You are talking about situation which requires wheelspin and momentum. That's very different. Some newer systems (incl. Toyota) have modes which will do everything to keep the wheelspin and not lose the momentum. Here is an example - Mud & Sand mode in new RAV4: th-cam.com/video/kBaaM5ECZ1k/w-d-xo.html
@@aldoraine9949 It is not the point to lock the wheel with no traction but to limit its wheelspin, that requires really complicated algorithms. Locking works good only on rock climbing etc.
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers the rollers are short, you really just need a small boost to get off them. I don't follow how locking (or intermittently braking) the wheel with no traction using the abs system is a complicated algorithm. This would allow the opposing wheel with traction to spin. What am I missing?
@@aldoraine9949 Rollers are short but wheels sit deep inside them so cars must climb up first and then move forward. It's not that easy. If the system would lock the wheel by brakes - how would it know if the traction of that wheel is back? Many situations like deep snow or deep mud requires wheelspin to allow the wheels digging so the system must only brake the wheels a little to keep them all spinning at the same speed. Torque split of open diff is always 50/50 so even slight brake intervention on one side increase torque on both sides - that must be correlated with engine operation. And it varies in relation to the speed, surface etc.
Rollers are different then in most tests. There are usually three rollers in front and back, tire sits in center. Not just one in front and back. Not sure about this test
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers to fajnie bo posiadam Rav 4 2016 2.0 benzyna w manualu. Ciekawy jestem czy silnik w stosunku do so starej wersji się poprawił. Czy jest bardziej dynamiczny i nie ma takiego muła przy starcie czy go nie zdławia. Pozdrawiam
@@orescio Niestety na ten temat nie mam wiedzy. Jeśli jesteś może z Polski południowo-wschodniej, zapraszam na inny test - obecnie mamy możliwość odczytu danych ze sterownika napędu na cztery koła, można się w ten sposób dowiedzieć, co, jak i kiedy robi układ AWD.
Never will there be a situation where at least 1 of 3 wheels won't have some sort of traction. Rollers provide no way of grip. I understand this demonstration as it shows 1 wheel with the most traction won't grab. Think logically though and the fact that a good tire that can grip on a slippery surface can actually outperform any tire on a roller. If you can't follow that then you shouldn't watch these videos.
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers great video. Thanks for sharing. I have just 1 question. Did those other cars have snow tires on? I have a video climbing a couple hills in both of my cars in different situations and different tires. I made it just fine and i have 2 RAV4's. Come check it out and let me know your thoughts. PS, what was the deal with the CR-V? They literally have a huge delay in the rear wheels kicking in.
@@MemphisMojo15s If you mean the cars climbing up the hills - yes, they had winter tyres. CR-V gen 4 had weak awd clutch-pack which wasn't sending much torque to the back. I don't know which your video you mean, link it please.
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers I can't link them from my phone because I don't use TH-cam from a computer. Just any video of the vehicles. I have a few. Some in snow, some just on hills. I go through people's list of videos and if I see one that catches my interest, I click. Just like I did yours 😊
3 wheels with no traction it can’t get off Only reason why it got off was because it slide off the rollers and got traction from the platform. Toyota AWD sucks
Again RAV4 cannot pull with only one rear wheel. This makes it much less off-road worthy than SUVs that can transfer (some) torque to only one rear wheel.
such tests are funny but pointless ! Even they are not performed on the same surface, you donnot know the inclination, tires etc. etc.. Last winter with my Rav4 2016 awd climbed smoothly abt 200m road, 100% covered with black ice, inclination abt 20%, and I did that with summer tires ( the winter surprised me :) ), awd locked, traction off. Before my try, 4 other cars with winter tires couldn't climb it, furthermore one of them slipped and crashed into house fenceSo with my old summer tires but with great 4x4 on Rav4 I returned back home.
![เป็นไปได้ไหม - WanMai [Performance Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Eh5hItD4Mr0/mqdefault.jpg)
I always loved the 2018 ravs design and seeing how it's 4 wheels spin together makes me love it more
You mean 3 wheels?
Great testing! It's surprising that ESP system doesn't brake the slipping rear wheel when only one rear wheel has traction. The hardware on the car should be easily able to brake the slipping rear wheel only and force the rear diff to output power to the only wheel with traction! You could have also tred the old offroader trick to apply light braking while applying throttle: that will make the slipping rear wheel harder to rotate and (depending on differential implementation) can transfer the missing power to the non-slipping wheel.
It's quite complicated for these awd systems cause system must power rear axle by multiplate clutch pack but in the same time it must brake one rear wheel while keeping it's speed similar to the front wheels. Old trick with brake doesn't work in new cars due to brake priority over accelerator.
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers At least VW cars allow pressing brake and accelerator at the same time if you apply the brake first. If you have any accelerator input and then touch the brake the accelerator input is ignored.
And I think recent RAV4 models do not have haldex 4WD system but electric motor driving the real axle directly, but I might have misunderstood something.
@@MikkoRantalainen Toyota doesn't use haldex and never did, they use electromagnetic coupling from JTEKT. Electric motor driving rear axle is only in hybrid versions: th-cam.com/video/YvNaiXzdtnM/w-d-xo.html
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers Thanks for the information. I missed the fact that the electric rear axle is only for hybrid version.
another 2 AWD cars that will not drive off one rear wheel
subaru!
Dlaczego tak sie dzieje? Prosze i link do jakiegos aterialuna teb temat.
@@vikiviki1663 Dlaczego co się dzieje? Sprecyzuj pytanie 🙂
Dlaczego większość aut 4x4 polegnie na 3ech rolkach?
@@vikiviki1663 Nie polegnie, ale są problemy. Większość dzisiejszych układów awd ma jedną oś "główną" (sztywno połączoną ze skrzynią), a drugą napędzaną sprzęgłem. Najtrudniejszy test to ten, w którym przyczepność ma jedno koło osi napędzanej sprzęgłem i tu sporo aut nie daje rady.
Toyota failure starts at 2:30.
Excellent work as usual
I would like to say that I am happy to see the results which I expected :)
Thanks for doing these tests!
Would it be possible to test a base 2019 Rav4 vs a 2019 Rav4 with the torque vectoring rear differential?
Unfortunately the second one is not available in my country...
this channel should have more subscribers
Agree 😉
I don't think the AWD system is capable of lateral transfer of power on the rear wheels.
It’s a delicate balance. Too much torque braking and you lose momentum. Not enough and your just spinning tires. As shown in the video.
Is this test RAV4 2019 the one with torque vectoring awd or the standard version?
Standard version.
thanks. If you get by any chance the torque vectoring awd , it would be nice to see it on the rollers.
@@pppam I wish, but it is not available in my country...
This is an interesting result. Because in real life scenario, when you have a diagonal spin, normally is whit an incline. In that circumstance the old Rav4 is absolutely rubbish, as with two diagonal wheels spinning traction control reduces too much the power not letting the car move, and not distributing correctly power side to side. It seems for what I see the system is supposed to help, but probably not "strong" enough to keep up with the weight of the car on an incline?.
These rollers are in fact harder for the car than an incline (they are 'deep'). I don't know the problem with older RAV4, maybe there was a need to turn ESP off, then power wouldn't be reduced?
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers I mean older Rav4 same as the "old" one you used it here.
Toyota's traction control when turned off it disable all the electronics, so it doesn't help. There's some videos here in TH-cam showing that. I had the opportunity many times to travel around the country on Rav4 (2015 - 2018 model) and I experienced that all the time. Traction control sucks all the power and only "pumps" on the brakes, making a loud noise, but not enough to stop the wheel on the air. So I'm quite surprise that here on the rollers car pass it.
@@subazealand9158 I will try to find some 2015-2017 version. There is some video, but we can't see much there: th-cam.com/video/IZU2BsmdihA/w-d-xo.html
Dont forget its not a real 4x4 and it doesnt have locking diffs. All I need though is power to the front and the rear, the rest is just picking the correct line and using momentum if needed. I am a 2015 Forester owner and I always turn traction control when offroading. I am aiming for a 2019 Rav4 like the one in the video for my next car.
@@moonsapling I also have a Forester. But traction control works totally different in both cars. In Subaru when is off still will apply brake distribution, where in Rav4 will disable all electronics.
Try 2021 Toyota RAV4 2.0 Adventure 4WD Please
difflock is not working like it says it will.
What diff lock?
Yeah, can you do for the RAV4 MK2 ( 2000- 2006?) Thank's a lot!
I wish but so far there were no volunteers...
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers Arf... Maybe one day ! ahah
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers what about mk 3? (2006-2012)
@@davidga6272 All up to volunteers 🙂
In RAV4 IV (2013-2015) AWD is button Lock and also TRAC off button - which you used but in manual is also description if you dont just press the button but hold the TRAC off button for 3sec it should off also VSC/ESP and it also helps me when I am going on my mountain cottage in winter a lot. Maybe you can try it if result on one wheel on ground could be passed.
If you turn everything off then the car will have two open diffs without any help from brakes.
Why not try it in reall? As I said in winter on heavily snowed hill if i just press it systems trying to keep power low and i coudlnt get up to my cottage but when i off everything only keep lock 4x4 all wheels going as much as they can and than i have no problem to get uphill.
@@bazzinacz You are talking about situation which requires wheelspin and momentum. That's very different. Some newer systems (incl. Toyota) have modes which will do everything to keep the wheelspin and not lose the momentum. Here is an example - Mud & Sand mode in new RAV4: th-cam.com/video/kBaaM5ECZ1k/w-d-xo.html
Extremely underestimated AWD system!
What transmission is in the 2019 model present in the video?
CVT.
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers YEEEEESSS! Always wanted to see a CVT Rav4 Test. Awesome vehicle!
CVT? Powaznie? Czy to jest wersji hybrid?
@@robertduklus6555 Spalinowa ma Direct Shift CVT, hybryda e-CVT. Czym się różnią - nie sprawdzałem.
Hmm. Dzieki. W Ameryce pln tylko hybrid ma cvt reszta 8 stopniowa hydrokinetyczna skrzynie.
is this the 2.0 CVT version ??
which one is better on the rollers, 2.5 hybrid or this one ?
Yes, that is CVT. And it is much better than hybrid. In fact I was forced by Toyota to delete a video with direct comparison of petrol vs hybrid.
duszaniespokojna - 4x4 tests on rollers If you are interested in testing private Rav4 Hybrid feel free to ping me on priv.
@@palecgcw Thanks, but I already tested private hybrid. And I compared it with dealers petrol. And I had to delete this comparison...
Was traction control off? That is the main thing.
Traction control must be on, usually it is even impossible to turn it off. ESP may be off, there's an indicator on the screen when it's off.
Why didn’t they rev it a little more?
Up to 3k or 30 km/h is fully enough.
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers He was being sarcastic :)
All they have to do is tweak their ABS to lock the wheel with no traction but thats too much to ask from toyota I guess
That's much more complicated than just locking the wheel with no traction...
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers It's the poors man locking differential. Jeep does this.
@@aldoraine9949 It is not the point to lock the wheel with no traction but to limit its wheelspin, that requires really complicated algorithms. Locking works good only on rock climbing etc.
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers the rollers are short, you really just need a small boost to get off them. I don't follow how locking (or intermittently braking) the wheel with no traction using the abs system is a complicated algorithm. This would allow the opposing wheel with traction to spin. What am I missing?
@@aldoraine9949 Rollers are short but wheels sit deep inside them so cars must climb up first and then move forward. It's not that easy.
If the system would lock the wheel by brakes - how would it know if the traction of that wheel is back?
Many situations like deep snow or deep mud requires wheelspin to allow the wheels digging so the system must only brake the wheels a little to keep them all spinning at the same speed.
Torque split of open diff is always 50/50 so even slight brake intervention on one side increase torque on both sides - that must be correlated with engine operation. And it varies in relation to the speed, surface etc.
This test is to prove which one has better tires???
Not tires but awd & traction control systems.
Can you test also the Land Rover discovery sport??? Thank youuuuu
If I find one :)
duszaniespokojna - 4x4 tests on rollers you can use mine but i think I’m too far :)
@@lucabellan And where are you? :)
duszaniespokojna - 4x4 tests on rollers Italy :)
@@lucabellan Oh that's far away from Poland 🙂
4:00 how can that ever be "lock" the other wheel spinning like that? False advertising?
Lock is front/rear torque split, not left/right.
Can you test the Lexus NX Hybrid or the UX Hybrid or the LS awd. Thank you
I will try to find these models.
Il faudrait peut-être que l'on sache
Quelle est la version 2018
Quelle est la 2019
La bleue ou la matin ?
Like in description, 2019 goes first.
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers thanks
Rollers are different then in most tests. There are usually three rollers in front and back, tire sits in center. Not just one in front and back. Not sure about this test
I don't know what you mean. We test cars on two and three rollers, all configurations.
It would seem the new suburu forester and the old suzuki vitara are the only vehicles capable of pushing off from one rear wheel.
No, there's much more.
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers in that price range? mmmh
@@Staples-King New Forester and old Vitara are not in the same price range...
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers didn't read "old" sorry
@@Staples-King New Vitara ain't in new Forester price range to 🙂
Czyli jeśli chodzi o nawet 4x4 AWD w Rav z 2018 a 2021 nie widać żadnej zmainay technicznej . Działa tak samo jak wcześniej. Pozdrawiam
Mechanicznie to jest ten sam napęd, zmieniło się oprogramowanie sterujące. Pozdrawiam
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers to fajnie bo posiadam Rav 4 2016 2.0 benzyna w manualu. Ciekawy jestem czy silnik w stosunku do so starej wersji się poprawił. Czy jest bardziej dynamiczny i nie ma takiego muła przy starcie czy go nie zdławia. Pozdrawiam
@@orescio Niestety na ten temat nie mam wiedzy. Jeśli jesteś może z Polski południowo-wschodniej, zapraszam na inny test - obecnie mamy możliwość odczytu danych ze sterownika napędu na cztery koła, można się w ten sposób dowiedzieć, co, jak i kiedy robi układ AWD.
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers Oki a dokładnie gdzie to jest jeśli można spytać. Jestem z Przemyśla
@@orescio Świetnie. My raz w Rzeszowie, raz w Jarosławiu. Możemy zrobić tego typu materiał: th-cam.com/video/8L2i85G767A/w-d-xo.html
Why not try left foot braking?
That's not the point of the test 🙂
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers Why not provide additional information for your viewers?
@@bob15479 We tried with handbrake some time ago, didn't help. Furthermore, usually there is brake priority over the acceleration pedal.
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers Good to know. That is what I wanted to know.
The only 2 car makers who can master the last test are Subaru, because it's Subaru, and Tesla.
Subaru, Suzuki, Audi, Jeep, Tesla, Hyundai, Kia, Land Rover, Volkswagen, Seat, Mazda, Volvo, Bmw, Dacia, Peugeot, Mercedes, Nissan...
Yup!! Well said Anthony
so basically no that much of a difference from the Honda crv results
AWD is more like 3WD with some systems
Never will there be a situation where at least 1 of 3 wheels won't have some sort of traction. Rollers provide no way of grip. I understand this demonstration as it shows 1 wheel with the most traction won't grab. Think logically though and the fact that a good tire that can grip on a slippery surface can actually outperform any tire on a roller. If you can't follow that then you shouldn't watch these videos.
Here is the video showing tests on rollers vs real world situations: th-cam.com/video/926i0zqteXE/w-d-xo.html
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers great video. Thanks for sharing. I have just 1 question. Did those other cars have snow tires on? I have a video climbing a couple hills in both of my cars in different situations and different tires. I made it just fine and i have 2 RAV4's. Come check it out and let me know your thoughts.
PS, what was the deal with the CR-V? They literally have a huge delay in the rear wheels kicking in.
@@MemphisMojo15s If you mean the cars climbing up the hills - yes, they had winter tyres.
CR-V gen 4 had weak awd clutch-pack which wasn't sending much torque to the back.
I don't know which your video you mean, link it please.
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers I can't link them from my phone because I don't use TH-cam from a computer. Just any video of the vehicles. I have a few. Some in snow, some just on hills. I go through people's list of videos and if I see one that catches my interest, I click. Just like I did yours 😊
3 wheels with no traction it can’t get off
Only reason why it got off was because it slide off the rollers and got traction from the platform.
Toyota AWD sucks
Nope, there is no grip from the platform: th-cam.com/video/r3sXIfynGls/w-d-xo.html
They need to rework it a bit…..but I thought it would have performed better with these tests.
AWD with bias for FWD
No coz. To tylko AWD. Chociaz niektorzy jaraja sie, ze to naped 4x4.
need some more weight
Again RAV4 cannot pull with only one rear wheel. This makes it much less off-road worthy than SUVs that can transfer (some) torque to only one rear wheel.
whatever the comments, the results are bad.
Its fun how Duster can pass last test but hese two dont.... in real life this is not real issue but it is worth to be mentioned.
why did i watch this though?
So AWD lock was a lie lol
No, Lock is for front/rear, not side to side.
Fail
such tests are funny but pointless ! Even they are not performed on the same surface, you donnot know the inclination, tires etc. etc.. Last winter with my Rav4 2016 awd climbed smoothly abt 200m road, 100% covered with black ice, inclination abt 20%, and I did that with summer tires ( the winter surprised me :) ), awd locked, traction off. Before my try, 4 other cars with winter tires couldn't climb it, furthermore one of them slipped and crashed into house fenceSo with my old summer tires but with great 4x4 on Rav4 I returned back home.
Inclination - always flat. Surface and tyres - no influence for the test.
Pointless till 3 wheels loose traction
Pathetic awd system