One of my favourite things about a Christmas Carol is that Scrooge isn’t necessarily portrayed as a man who will go to any lengths to make money. He is miserly, sure, but he doesn’t break laws, he does everything that is legally required of him as an employer. Dickens was trying to say that simply doing no evil and following the law was not necessarily enough to be good. You had to go out of your way to be charitable, and many found that controversial. It says it is not ok to be blissfully ignorant. I think some rich people need to realise that today
@@mollymcnaughton3133Does never having been Christened count as being a Pagan? If it does I'm a natural and all for it. I hate the commercialisation of Christmas in our Western Culture and I'm pretty sure it's diametrically opposite to the Christian Prophet's central message.....
@@coalcreekdefense8106 Jacob: There's only one Marley on that sign! Robert: Because it's already enough having to share space with you on real life! Both: D'OHOHOHOHOHOHOHOHO
I don't think Scrooge hired the rats as bookkeeping staff, they're just the normal city amount of rats and he said "Well if you're going to be occupying space in my office you're going to have to make yourself useful." Weird ways that a world with muppets would be different but I think it makes enough sense.
You can look at it that way or you can view this through scrooges eyes and how he sees certain sections of society in this cases he sees his lower class employees as thieving rats while he sees cratchit and the other middle managers as cowardly frogs
@@Ericshadowblade As I said on your other post, I'm not sure this is true to the story at all. Admittedly, I am no Dickens expert, but I do not ever remember this being presented as a part of Scrooge's character.
Yes, American children would be confused by pudding. I, a Canadian, was confused by British pudding when I started reading books like Agatha Christie. Our pudding is only ever a sweet goop that is kind of a custard consistency in a variety of flavours from chocolate or vanilla to banana or pistachio.
I think most US kids are familiar with bread pudding, which is closer to a British pudding, though still not the same. We used to have bread pudding every so often and I think it stands out to kids because there just aren't too many desserts you light on fire.
Best not to speak for all of Canada, since we are so big. In Atlantic Canada (especially, but not only, Newfoundland) we eat plenty of Christmas pudding.
@@shannonsenzig1676although I had heard of it as a kid, I was not familiar with what it was like until my 30s? Lol. I want to say it's more of an eastern/southern coastal thing.
What I’ve heard from fashion historians online is that the MCC has the most accurate costumes out of all the other filmed CC interpretations. Which is cool because most of the costumes are tiny and muppet sized.
Abby Cox is one of those fashion historians who has fantastic video on why she feels the costumes of MCC deserved, and was robbed, of an Oscar. It’s a great watch.
The bit with the scarf always gets me, because the way Caine plays it; its clear that this is the first present he's been given in a LONG time and he isn't sure what to do with it. He was so focused on making amends that he never once considered people would be nice to him in return.
From what I heard, this was the first Muppet movie made after Jim Henson's death and his son, Brian Henson, really put his heart and soul into it. It was a project fueled by grief and everyone wanted to get it just right, all the way down to the costuming. I imagine that dedication comes through to us the audience as well, which is why its such a classic to many.
Nicole Rudolph, one of the costume historians in TH-cam, did an analysis of the costumes going along with a project to recreate one of the looks, and her analysis was that the costumes were very accurate, and actually one of the better versions in that regard.
@@Masquaradethewriter I was five at the time, and his was the first death I was ever aware of. I was devastated, and I think I was vaguely under the impression that Muppets content would no longer be on television.
22:00 - Dickens' description of the Ghost of Christmas Past sounds like what you'd get from an AI art generator trying to animate a ghost of Christmas past, but that's unable to properly keep it cohesive between frames so parts of it morph from one thing to another over time.
I always interpreted young Scrooge saying "who cares about stupid old Christmas" in this movie as more a resentment about his parent; they pay to get rid of him, basically, and don't let him come home over the winter holidays, and so he says what he says instead of breaking down in front of his classmates in tears because his parents doesn't care enough about him to have him come home.
You are exactly right. I'm a teacher and have worked with countless elementary students, and I can tell you that the "who cares about stupid old Christmas" outburst would be a very normal thing to come from a neglected child. He's disappointed and hurt so he tries to make himself feel a little better by telling himself that he doesn't actually want what he's missing. At the same time, he also has his defenses way up because he's afraid of looking pathetic to his peers and becoming an object of pity. That's why the lines that set him off were "Hurry up Ebenezer, the last coach is leaving," "Come on, he never goes home for Christmas."
I’m a “muppets is the best adaptation” person. My favourite aspects are how closely they quote the text and Michael Caine’s performance. He supposedly said he was going to play it completely straight like it was a theatre drama. Just brilliant.
I came to say this if no one else had. I remember seeing an interview with him where he said he made a very conscious decision when he took the role to treat the Muppets the same way he would any other costars.
American kids are very opinionated when they see or hear of food they are not familiar with, like boiled pudding. I can imagine kids going “ewwww.” I’ve dealt with plenty of spoiled American kids showing disgust at foreign foods. 😢
He said he was going to play it as if the Muppets were actually classically-trained thespians. Conversely, Tim Curry decided to play Long John Silver as if he were also a Muppet. They are both correct.
One thing I really like in this version is how quickly scrooge begins his change. Most adaptations leave his pivot for the climax but in the book scrooge is already realising the errors of his ways with the ghost of Christmas past (wishing to talk to bob, wishing he didn't shut the door on the carol singer.) and is open to learn from ghost of Christmas present and Christmas yet to come.
I think its important for the story that Scrooge changes before he meets the ghost of Christmas future. It's less impactful when the other ghosts do nothing and he just gets scared straight. He especially needs to feel bad seeing Tiny Tim and realizing a little boy will die because of his actions.
That line always stood out to me as weirdly out of place, as though it were inserted after-the-fact. Fascinating to discover that that's basically what happened.
The line "and to Tiny Tim, who did NOT die, he was a second father" is in the original Dickens. They were just being true to the source material -- but Gonzo's delivery is charming and reassuring.
As an American, I can confidently say that all of the 5-year-olds I’ve known would have been very confused by a British pudding. We do not have any puddings like that in America. 😂 However, as a mom, I’m a big proponent of teaching kids small things in passing. They’re the building blocks of future learning.
You talking about anachronisms reminds me of the time the scrap metal merchants came around, sounding their horn as they do. Now, these type of people used to also collect rags and bones, so were known as "rag and bone men". My daughter, who was 4 at the time, asked me who was blowing the horn, and when I told her it was the "rag and bone men" she was frightened, as she imagined a man made out of rags and bones! Having typed all that out, I wonder if you even have scrap metal collectors in America? They're usually travelling people (who we used to call "Gypsies" but that word is not PC these days) and they go around in a pick-up truck type of vehicle. They blow their horn so that people know that they're there and people can bring out any items containing metal that they want to get rid of. Obviously, the scrap metal merchants extract as much metal as they can and when they have enough to sell they go and get money for it.
@@zappababe8577 I am 67 and grew up in Brooklyn ny. We didn't have rag and bone men. Kirk douglas wrote a book called "the rag man's son" (which he was). That was the first time I heard of it. When I was a kid t knife grinder would come around and ring loud "jingle bells" a d the women would bring out their knives
Abby Cox made a fantastic video about how insanely accurate the costumes are! They even made sure that less wealthy characters were wearing 1830's clothes, since not everyone can afford to keep up with the latest fashions.
Yes! Abby's video is phenomenal! It's one of my favorite TH-cam videos ever. Nicole Rudolph also has a video series where she makes Gonzo's outfit from this movie, shoes included.
... and I love that one of the costume designers even commented on Abby Cox's video! I like how this video talks about all the dialogue, and similarities and differences regarding plot. As someone who's never read the book, it is very interesting.
13:05 Americans absolutely do not ear Christmas Pudding. In The States, "pudding" is basically like a thick custard. Most common flavours being chocolate, butterscotch, and vanilla.
Yeah this was such a hilarious moment .. "Americans have puddings don't you?" Bestie love you but we get offended at the variety of definitions the UK has for "pudding"
Michael Caine’s performance is amazing because he didn’t act like he was preforming against muppets, he played the role seriously as if the rest of the cast were live actors.
At a pub quiz, the question was 'How many ghosts visited Scrooge in A Christmas Carol?' The consensus in our team was 4 until my wife piped up with 'But there were 5. Both Marley brothers visited him.' This was the definitive version of the story for her.
There is, though I cannot post it, a brilliant meme. Patrick Stewart has played Scrooge as well and it has a still image of him looking like he is shouting "there are only FOUR ghosts" Underneath you have the Muppets Marley and Marley just floating there.
@@genericname2747 I've read the book and I don't remember that at all, funny how the muppet version just pushed out the recollection of the original plot points again.
If you really want to nerd out about the costumes in The Muppet Christmas Carol, I highly recommend Abby Cox's video on the movie's costumes. Also, Nicole Rudolph did a series of videos where she created a historically accurate, human sized version of Gonzo's costume. Both of them pretty much conclude that the movie's costuming was insanely impressive by any standard, and absolutely mind blowing when you consider that its target audience was kids who weren't even old enough to read, let alone know anything about historical clothing.
For Fozziewig and Mom, that's a reference to the 1987 Muppet Family Christmas special. It was a crossover where the Muppets, Sesame Street muppets and Fraggles all wind up at the country home of Fozzie's mother. It's fantastic, and I highly recommend it. Swedish Chef sees Big Bird and immediately plans to cook him for Christmas dinner. ("Gobla gobla humunga!")
And then, Swedish Chef immediately changes his mind when Big Bird gives him a present. It's genuinely charming and heartwarming. Edit: and then they sing “The Christmas Song”, and I will just break down sobbing because of Carol Spinney.
@@Brasswatchman not necessarily. In the Midlands, Mom is quite commonly used rather than Mum or Mam. It's not necessarily a straight American/British thing, even if people tend to assume it is.
In regards to Miss Piggy's style... I feel like at least part of it is emphasizing that the Cratchits don't have enough money for her to BE fashionable. Her clothing is neat and well-cared for, but her husband certainly didn't have the money to keep her up to date.
Yes but 99% of people watching the film would not have understood the subtle differences in Miss Piggy’s costume to be reflective of 1830s vs 1840s style…
@@maddieb.4282Even if secondhand shops are an anachronism, secondhand clothing surely is not. They may not have had Goodwill and Salvation Army stores, but the fashionably dressed would have done *something* with their old fashions.
This is confirmed in the directors commentary. They deliberately gave Piggy outfits a few years and slightly not in fashion because they would of been cheaper secondhand.
I’ve taught A Christmas Carol to 8th graders for several years, and I’m so happy you spent time on the Ghost of Christmas Past! So hard to make sense of that description, and SO MUCH WEIRDER than you expect. I see the Ghost as a representation of a candle and, in some ways, like memory (our ability to hold many “ages” in our memory).
I appreciate that Gonzo and Rizzo tell the children that the 3rd ghost will be scary. It also breaks the 4th wall and the tension of the scene. Its a smart way to take away the drama because it is made for children. This would not be done for an adult audience. And personally as a parent, I appreciate the tip off.
I'm very surprised she didn't cover the fact that Gonzo's Dickens Character *explicity* gives a call to action to the viewer to consider reading the book just prior to the end credits. I would have thought that would have given the Muppets' depiction of this story some well-deserved bonus points. I always remember feeling very happy with that final suggestion from Gonzo as a kid. It gives the original source material such a great amount of acknowledgement and respect/deference. I wish she'd highlighted it here :-)
I actually did read the original book because I like the Muppet adaptation so much. It had that suggestion, and I figured that most of Gonzo's great lines were from the book, so I read it.
I believe “Fuzziwig and Mom” is a call back to the TV special “A Muppet Family Christmas” which took place at Fozzie’s Mom’s house. That special also ended with a rare Jim Henson appearance and I think is one of if not the last time all the muppet tv shows were in one spot. “A Muppet Christmas Carol” is the first big Muppet project after Jim Henson died and that his son, Brian Henson, directed. All that to say, I’m not surprised they used Fozzie’s Mom in this adaptation (unless she’s in the original book?).
I quite like the "Who cares about stupid old Christmas?!" line from young Scrooge, as it seems a very natural way for a child to react. He's lonely and stuck at the school, and lashes out at the other kids with that statement, even if deep down he doesn't real feel it's true. He absolutely does care about Christmas at that stage. It's exactly how someone that age, and even some adults, react when they're hurting inside.
I will say in defense of YA Scrooge, after Fozziewig tells him to shut up and enjoy the party, he shuts up and enjoys the party. He may not be as cool as Book Scrooge, but he’s still going on the Scrooge journey from less to more uptight and greedy as he ages and isolates himself from the world.
I don’t know. It IS a natural reaction to lash out when you’re hurting, but I feel they could have done a better job of making it clear that he was speaking out of his pain and really didn’t mean it. For me, personally, the outburst makes it just a bit more difficult to find the character sympathetic- easier to [mis]interpret his isolation as voluntarily self-imposed. In the book, one gets the sense that if this lonely and abandoned young boy were invited to join his friends, he would have leaped at the opportunity, rather than reacting with defensive hostility.
yeah it seems like both this version of the story and the original both give scrooge a lot of.. implied backstory. Especially with his family. Purely by him saying or hearing things that require that to be the case. They took different routes, but either way the ghost of the past is showing us he changed, without showing us the specific time when he changed (before the flashbacks in this movie, and after the flashbacks in the book. unless there's some part i'm unaware of. haven't read it in some time.)
@@StoryMing one of the hardest things for people to do, especially in the 21st century, is get over the idea of someone's isolation as self-imposed or deserved for their behavior, and focus on just fixing them to what you know they should be, knowing that only some past trauma could have caused this.
@@KairuHakubi Self-imposed isolation or other hardship is definitely a thing, and Scrooge DOES *absolutely* have moral responsibility for his own life choices. _However,_ in the original book, at this stage in his life, he is abandoned and neglected, which is not of his doing, nor is he shown to be hostile or resentful over it. To recognize that there are outward forces which had a large bearing in shaping him to be what he became, is NOT, in my opinion, to excuse, condone, or absolve him for what he has done wrong; it is simply to understand better what he needs to overcome and change.
If anyone wants to teach their kids what "pudding" is but don't want to go through a week of boiling and steaming things in a cubic meter of cognac, may I recommend sticky toffee pudding! Made with dates, covered in warm toffee sauce and topped with vanilla ice cream or custard it's a very nice treat kids really love and it's very wintery and a great decadent Christmas dessert! I've been making it for a few years now and its always a hit.
The Tiny Tim "First parting there was among us" scene is especially somber in this film's context, as this is the first Muppets movie production after the death of Jim Henson. Steve Whitmere's then-recent acquisition of the role of Kermit made his mournful performance in this scene have an extra layer of heartbreak to it.
Oh man. This scene already made me cry and now it's going to be even worse. I was 9 in 1990 and Jim Henson's was the first major death of an artistic creator I admired.
Rowlf was almost entirely retired, as he was one of Henson's personal favorites (and they couldn't retire Kermit). He has a quick cameo in the band at the party, but he's not given any lines until The Muppets with Jason Siegal (and he's probably one of the funniest in the movie).
I read recently that this is Michael Caine's favorite of his film performances. In the article Caine said that he crafted the whole of his character as though he was playing with humans - perfectly straight with no mugging. He was proud that the youngest members of his family could comfortably watch it.
I am not surprised after seeing just part of the movie recently. During the song sung by the spirit of Christmas present, Michael Caine is so effortlessly happy. I especially love that last detail. Michael Caine is an awesome actor, but a lot of his movies are not for littles. 😅 He and Tim Curry are great in their Muppet movies. Tim Curry went as over the top as the Muppet characters, so he wasn't overshadowed by their shenanigans. My favorite line is "Upstage, lads. This is my only number."
It works really well as it opens an avenue to see how scrooge sees other people some as rats others as pigs and frog while the noticely human are his family and more wealthy classes
About Bobs scarf. They call it a comforter, which in America means big blanket. So I pictured him just bundled up in a big blanket to stay warm, to poor to even own a coat. Thank you for clearing that up.
I really like Gonzo as Dickens. Most adaptations feel like a stage play, or a movie adapted from a stage play, to the point that you would think A Christmas Carol was originally a play, and not a novel/novella. Gonzo as Dickens gives it much more of a "storyteller" feel.
I recall the reasoning for that is children are presented here with the Muppets ( for childhood joy) that may, in time, make an older child or young adult want to read the actual story.
Honestly in material where the narrator's voice adds so much, I wish I saw this kind of narrator-as-character insert more often. Eg. Any future adaptation of anything Douglas Adams has ever written
@@InnuendoXPI love how The Guide takes the role of narrator in the Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy radio plays. It lets more of Douglas Adams’ writing get in.
The perfect finishing touch is when the characters finish singing, and as the credits begin to roll we hear Rizzo's voice saying "Great story, Mr. Dickens," and Gonzo answers, "Thanks. Hey, if you liked this then you should read the book."
I think Dickens would've approved. He started the endless adaptations of this story with his live readings, where he was constantly revising it to make it work for a live audience.
Something I really appreciate about A Christmas Carol is that it uses Christmas as a setting, but it’s really focused on how society (well-to-do people in particular) treated the poor. Things have certainly changed since the 1840s of course, but the upper class’ attitude towards the poor not so much. I really respect that the Muppets adaptation faithfully brought that into their version
Yeah, the problem isn't that scrooge doesn't like Christmas, it's that if you can't at least be decent to each other on Christmas what hope do we have for the rest of the year
George C Scott's version jams the candle "snuffer" on the 1st ghost. Grinding it to the ground--awakening to find himself wringing his blankets, as if strangling thempirit.
I don't disagree with you. But it also was very much about Christmas. Dickens wrote it because he didn't like how people were treating Christmas. But he also was explicitly using the Spirit of Christmas to push for better conditions for the poor as well. He had other books on this topic, of course. It was a form of activism. If you haven't seen it, I very much recommend the Annotated A Christmas Carol. It goes heavily into Dickens's intent. He was both a bit proponent of Christmas as well as caring about the poor.
LoL! I was just going to say that. I think Abby's Muppet Christmas Carol video pretty much put her channel on the map and it is a solid video she geeks out hard about smocking etc. it is charming
I love that Michael approached this movie like a serious adaptation, and treated the Muppets like fellow actors. A bit like how Tim Curry, in Muppets Treasure Island, went full Muppet himself and became one with the cast in a different way.
I believe he was quoted as saying he would only do it if he could play it as if he was on stage with the Royal Shakespeare Company. (Also, a cute little detail I found out when Googling for that quote. Apparently, his other reason was that his daughter was 7 at the time and really wanted to see a film her dad was in, but none of his work from the time was age appropriate. So he did it so she could see it.)
I expect that is why Michael Caine was chosen. It seems to me a directorial decision was taken to make a faithful, honest and accurate adaptation so they needed an English actor with gravitas.
I would expect nothing less from a Muppet production. I think we have this tendency to dismiss children's programs as frivolous or "not real" somehow but I can't really think of a time when Jim Henson's Creature Workshop ever had that attitude. They tend to put in the thought and the work.
In the scene from the original in which Bob Cratchit involuntarily applauds Scrooge’s nephew’s speech, Scrooge does in fact verbally admonish Cratchit (after the clerk has accidentally extinguished his own fire!): ‘Let me hear another sound from you… and you’ll keep your Christmas by losing your situation’. So the Muppet’s Scrooge yelling at the clerks is in line with the story. Also, Bob actually does go to Scrooge in the hope of replenishing the coal for his fire, and Scrooge refuses. Dickens uses strangely subtle language to tell the reader this, with no dialogue, so it’s quite easy to miss! I’m really glad you mentioned that there was no ‘unemployment line’ :)
The detail of Fozziwihig and Mom is a nod back to the ‘87 Muppet Family Christmas where every Muppet character, as well as Doc from Canadian Fraggle Rock, end up at Fozzie’s mom’s house.
this is one of my favorite versions of "A Chritmas Carol" because of Michale Caine's remarkable performance. In many adaptations Scrooge doesn't show regret until the Ghost of Christmas Future--which give the impression that Scrooge changes out of fear of punishment rather than understanding his mistakes. I prefer the intperpretation that Scrooge has had an epiphany and that's why he changes--which Caine does fabulously.
Yes!! I know people think of this as a movie for children because of the Muppets, and it is accessible to children because of them, yet I didn't see this movie until I was nearly 40 and it is my favorite. Michael Caine gave the first portrayal of Scrooge as someone I could relate to, not just some hollow Christmas-hating ogre.
Agreed. In the book, even during the Christmas Past segment, Scrooge was starting to see himself in some of the people he shunned and realizing that he could have made them happy, just as his sister and old employer had for him. As the video said, it wasn't about psychoanalyzing him. It was about reminding him of what he used to be, and of how much it meant to him when he was shown kindness during his times of need.
I was sceptical that I'd enjoy such a long video, but I've found it incredibly informative. Also, I've just realised for the first time that the additional Marley is given the name Robert, which surely must be a reference to Bob Marley.
While this was absolutely made (at least largely) for a US audience, the Jim Henson Company did a lot of work in England, including filming 5 seasons of The Muppet Show there, and Frank Oz (Miss Piggy among others) was even born in England (and has lived there off and on during his life) so I suspect many of the core people involved were familiar with the differences between US and British Christmas, but made the changes intentionally. And for most people in the US, if they have heard of "Christmas pudding" it is because they have read/seen a version of A Christmas Carol, that has it in it , but may not know exactly what it is supposed to be. Not only is it not a tradition here, but "pudding" now refers to a completely different set of deserts (like custards).
I am an American in my mid-50's and have had my first ever "pudding" in the UK style over thanksgiving. I would say we would most understand it as a dessert bread. For us, pudding is closer to what the UK calls custard, though our puddings are generally sweeter than UK custards. Also, for a lot of us, a pudding comes in a small box and you add the powder to milk.
I have a friend and coworker who focuses on historical clothing, primarily late-18th century but branching into other eras. She gushes over the costumes in this movie, speaking breathlessly about whoever designed Gonzo's outfits. And believe me, she is not easily impressed. The fact that a children's movie filled with puppets and talking rats, pigs, and frogs has more authentic and well-researched costuming than many big budget historical epics fascinates me.
In the animation industry, they call this kinda thing "bumping the lamp," which means something along the lines of "to put in a lot of effort into something very few will notice." The term originates from the movie Who Framed Roger Rabbit, specifically the scene where Roger bumps his head on the lamp in the parlor, causing it to swing back and forth. This swinging lamp was a nightmare for the animators, who had to hand-paint every light and shadow on Roger. Why was this included in the film if it was so difficult? Well, aside from being comedic, the director wanted the Toons to interact with the real world as much as possible, to thoroughly convince the audience that they are physically present in the scene. Muppeteers work on a similar philosophy. It is very difficult to convince an audience that a bunch of felt, thread and fur is alive and present. And yet they not only manage to convince the audience that the puppets are alive, but even the actors and crew who often interact with them. Many people who have worked with Muppeteers have reported talking to the muppets and not the puppeteers, even when they can clearly see the puppeteers. There's even been instances where people have placed microphones on the puppets and not the puppeteers by mistake. It is the attitude of having to work extra hard to convince people that an inanimate object is alive that created the strive for historical accuracy. *That's* why the Muppet Christmas Carol is so accurate. Because they already have to put in more work to suspend your disbelief than a live action human.
My favorite adaptation of ACC is the animated version directed by Richard Williams from 1971. It ran 25 minutes, was produced by Chuck Jones, and won an Oscar for best animated short in 1972. Scrooge was voiced by Alistair Sims, the star of the 1951 version. And in spite of its brevity, it included S flying thru the air with the ghost of Xmas Present to view the 2 men in the lighthouse, the crew of a ship at sea, and the impoverished family whose menfolk work as miners. No other version I know has these scenes. The pen-and-ink crosshatch style of animation is breathtaking. *A Must-See !!*
We DON'T have Christmas pudding in the US, not as a standard tradition. Just yesterday I was having to explain what a 'figgy pudding' was to my dad, because he had spent 83 years thinking the song said 'sticky pudding'. I had to explain the whole flaming Christmas pudding to him, he was truly ignorant on the fact.
The closest parallel to this I can come up with as a Brit, is that I have in my life heard the word Poindexter twice, once in a song, and once in Dodgeball, and it took a considerable amount of digging for me to find out what it meant.
The whole thing with the Ghost of Christmas present having a bad short-term memory is actually my favorite addition, about how he is always living in the present. I'm surprised that other adaptations haven't included that. Also just because you mentioned it several times, yes children would be confused by "pudding" and frankly many adults because Christmas pudding is not a thing here. Also we understand pudding a a chocolate-y mouse type of thing, which I know is not what British people mean by pudding
I commented earlier that it depends. I must have watched different shows. Even if no one cooked it, it was in illustrations, and other Christmas carol versions. Kind of same thing about why I know what a dragon or unicorn is.
I'm super late to this video, but the algorithm was like, "hey, it's Christmas time again!" And I'm really glad to see this video recommended. It was really nice to see these line-for-line comparisons of the original Dickens text! Great video!
I don't think he hates Christmas during the Fozziwig party. Instead, he's just surprised at how much the party costs and Fozziwig saying "Don't worry about it". The breakup scene implies that Scrooge is more and more concerned with money. So he HAS changed.
Yeah, my thought is that he was ambivalent about Christmas, not thinking of it as super special, perhaps due to his upbringing. Finding Belle changes him for a little while, but he reverts back to his natural state after awhile, something Belle doesn't appreciate.
@@tgbotg Yes, that's how I see it too. Belle's character does make sense in that context. When she meets him, he's being introduced by an old friend who describes him as "the finest young financial mind in the city." So, the information she has on first sight is that he's smart, ambitious, and highly recommended by someone who's opinion she respects. He's also handsome, well-mannered, and seems interested in her. Your right that he would change for a while after meeting Belle. It's very common for a person to show their best selves when they're excited to be in a new relationship and are trying to impress someone. And yes, that does inevitably fade and they go back to their natural states over time. It would also be very normal for Belle to focus on his good traits and his potential and to hope that the negatives that she does see would be what would fade over time. As he becomes colder and more distant, she'll stay for a while with the hope that something is only temporarily making him act out of character and he'll go back to normal eventually. Hopefully it will be like he says, and things will be better once he's got the secure job and is less stressed about financial stability. After a while though she'll finally accept that this IS normal for him and the way he was at the beginning was the part when he was acting out of character. That's when they break up. It's far from an unheard-of relationship arc.
@@tgbotg Yes, that's how I see it too. Belle's character does make sense in that context. When she meets him, he's being introduced by an old friend who describes him as "the finest young financial mind in the city." So, the information she has on first sight is that he's smart, ambitious, and highly recommended by someone who's opinion she respects. He's also handsome, well-mannered, and seems interested in her. Your right that he would change for a while after meeting Belle. It's very common for a person to show their best selves when they're excited to be in a new relationship and are trying to impress someone. And yes, that does inevitably fade and they go back to their natural states over time. It would also be very normal for Belle to focus on his good traits and his potential and to hope that the negatives that she does see would be what would fade over time. As he becomes colder and more distant, she'll stay for a while with the hope that something is only temporarily making him act out of character and he'll go back to normal eventually. Hopefully it will be like he says, and things will be better once he's got the secure job and is less stressed about financial stability. After a while though she'll finally accept that this IS normal for him and the way he was at the beginning was the part when he was acting out of character. That's when they break up. It's far from an unheard-of relationship arc.
When I taught 4th grade I would read A Christmas Carol to my students every year. After we finished, I would show the movie in class. The muppet version immediately came to mind, but for academic value I wanted to use the version that was the closest to the book that I could find. Keeping that in mind, I looked through several versions. The muppet version came out the winner anyway, even when considering it on equal grounds with many of the other classic adaptations. The deciding factor ended up being the sheer number of lines that were quoted directly from the book.
@lbatemon1158 Is that the one where the Ghost of Christmas Future sends Scrooge to Hell down a dark tunnel? (I think it was Hell anyway, it's been a long time since I saw it.)
I agree. If it hadn't been the muppets then it would have been either the George C. Scott version and the Patrick Stewart version, and that would have been a difficult decision.
The best thing about this adaptation is that Michael Caine treats the Muppets as fellow actors instead of just fuzzy fictional puppets on an elevated platform. He really brought his A-Game to this adaptation.
"OK Michael, it's a Muppet movie, you're the only human actor in the film, feel free to play with it, have some fun" "Nope, I'm going to play it absolutely arrow-straight!"
Michael Caine is a professional. Much as a professional plumber doesn't discriminate based on the circumstances of his client, neither does he worry about the nature of his co-workers.
@@bobkatfan2013 Tim Curry decided to play Silver as the most charismatic bombastic pirate he could, I think the Henson Company had to up their game to jeep up with him honestly
I read an interview once where Michael Caine said (paraphrased), “The only way this movie will work is if I play this 100% seriously, as if I’m working alongside human actors.”
Would American children be confused by Christmas pudding? Yes. 😂 I was also confused by “sweetmeats” which showed up a few times in the books I liked to read. I mean, it’s good to bridge those culture gaps, too, so maybe they could have left the pudding in. But yes, Americans being confused by British pudding is a thing!
And I understand that generally, "pudding" means dessert, not necessarily what us North Americans would think of as pudding. Of course, in this context, "pudding" means Christmas pudding.
Americans also don't have many boiled desserts in the style of figgy pudding, which Americans have heard of from carolers singing We Wish You a Merry Christmas, but aren't likely to have had it.
Oh hey! I can't tell if you just skipped past it for time, but if you haven't seen it, I recommend the cut with Belle's song, When Love Has Gone, that was left out of the theatrical release. (It's finally on Disney+, in the extras, as "full length version" or some such!) It makes Rizzo's bawling make more sense, it marks the emotional turning point for present-day Scrooge, the very next song says Christmas is "in all the places we find love", and the ending song, The Love We Found, is a direct reprise that brings the whole thing full circle. As good a movie as it is without that song, it's on another level with it included.
It was on the VHS copy. We didn't realize it was an extended cut until we got it on DVD years later. We always fast-forwarded the song. We were excited to finally have a skip scene button, but we didn't even need it. As a musician and composer though, I will agree that the musical reprise makes the cut a weird decision, and as an adult I see its appeal.
Oh, it's in the extras! I was very confused when I watched it on Disney+ this Xmas just gone and saw the song wasn't there, despite reading in more than one place that it was added back in.
@@Richard_Nickerson The version with the song is now called the extended cut but in reality it is the theatrical cut. The song there when I saw the movie in the theater in the 90’s. Some daft executive thought the song was too boring for children so he cut it from the first DVD edition. After a lot of uproar from fans it was placed back in the so-called extended edition on Blu ray.
@@thulcandran It wasn't "some daft executive", it was based on what people said coming out of the theaters. I got to tell people asking about Pride, Prejudice, & Zombies that they messed up the whole thing when I walked out of theaters, but I don't think enough people complained with me. This is standard movie-making procedure. Edit: Again, it always existed on the VHS, and it *is* an option on the regular DVD. You're acting as if it completely disappeared when the comment you're responding to already disproves that.
36:07 I think Scrooge's awkward dance is more than just to accommodate the puppet. He's been a shriveled up old crank for so long he's lost a lot of strength and flexibility, which means now that he's moving in unaccustomed ways looks awkward and painful because it's so strangeand difficult. It reinforces the huge change he's suddenly making in his life.
Also, in my experience, there is no Christmas pudding in the US. Maybe in some specific families, up in New England. I'm in my 50s and am still a little confused about pudding that gets boiled and set on fire. Pudding, in my experience, comes from a box and sets up in the fridge, but I've never been very fancy. 😁
@@adoxartist1258it varies from family to family. I was born and raised in California, and my mom used to make steamed Persimmon Pudding. Similar in many ways to Christmas pudding, and we sometimes ate it at Christmas, with hard sauce (butter, powdered sugar, and liquor).
It tends to be more like a cake with certain wintery fruits in it. The cake part is often made with brandy, if i recall correctly. It tended to end up pretty dry so they boiled it to make it easier to eat. Due to the alcholal content it was set on fire to make it taste of brandy and minimise the intoxication effect. @@adoxartist1258
@christajennings3828 Very cool! I've never seen anything about Christmas pudding outside British shows and movies. Happy Holidays! Merry Christmas! Happy 2024!
I had to add that the bit where Beaker gives Scrooge the scarf lets us see his reaction to it, he has just been filled with enthusiasm for Christmas, his priority had been to spread his generosity to atone for his past (hence the many back payments line) it had not even occured to him that someone would give him a gift, so much so he is taken by surprise and moved by it, it is after all likely the first gift anyone has given him in MANY years, its a joyous moment where he is almost INSTANTLY rewarded for his change of heart, and Michael Cain effortlessly portrays the moment as if he was about to shed a tear, GOD I LOVE THIS MOVIE!!!
I'd forgotten how great Michael Caine was in this role! In one of his books he mentioned how much fun he had being involved with this movie, and the respect he had for the Henson crew....Thank you so much for doing this!
Abby Cox did a great video looking specifically at the costumes from the perspective of a costume historian, and Nicole Rudolph has one where she remakes Gonzo’s (main) Dickens costume from the movie (generally the costumes are all shockingly accurate considering they’re mostly on puppets).
Yes! I love this version partly because of the costumes, they're more accurate than a lot of other adaptations I've seen and it made me irrationally happy
The bit where Scrooge tries to snuff out the Ghost of Christmas Past is actually shown in the 2009 Christmas Carrol staring a motion-captured Jim Carrey. It’s made even more over the top as the spirit’s metal cap flies up like a rocket, launching Scrooge over the London skyline.
@@Jus10Edyess thank you!! Sifting thru the comments to see if anyone mentioned that scene. George C Scott and Muppets are tied for my favorite Christmas Carol 🎄🥰🙏 📣
Regarding the whole "pudding" idea: historically, a pudding is a method of cooking, where you use a wrapping of some sort to keep your ingredients together while you boil it. You could have all different types of puddings, but the invention of the pudding cloth (which is re-usable, as opposed to previous versions which were basically haggis-adjacent sausages) made puddings much less expensive to make. As such, it became popular as a lower-class way of cooking a relatively large meal for a family. Because it's basically just "stuff somthing in a cloth and boil it", you can have egg or milk-based puddings (which tended to be more desserts), or meat or bread-based puddings (which tended to be more of the main course, although the bread puddings were arguably more cake-like). Americans leaned towards the custard-style desert puddings (custard was developed separately, but merged with puddings as a name and concept), as Americans usually didn't need to make main-course style puddings, as they had other things they wanted to eat. However, the dessert-style puddings were still moderately popular. In the 1840's a food scientist was able to develop custard powder (which was cornstarch-based), which was WAY easier to use as a thickening agent, and so Americans went even more towards puddings as desserts. So, yeah - Americans consider puddings to be custard-deserts because we stopped using the pudding style of cooking for main courses, but still used it for desserts to make custards (and thus the names converged). Whereas in England it was originally a main course, but became more of a dessert, and then a synonymn for the dessert course, but still included cake-style puddings. (And historically a few savory puddings, such as black pudding, still exist.) EDIT: Sources - the Wikipedia article on "pudding", a "history of pudding" timeline on a food history website that came up in my Google search, and (I think) a "Tasting History with Max Miller" TH-cam episode on puddings that I watched a few weeks ago.
Thanks a bundle for another little, historical lesson, knowledge that I pleased to have. Not only for my own pleasure but something that this particular food and word buff looks forward to showing off with. Sould I just mention that the local Scandinavian black pudding ('blood sausage' ) has been a VERY traditional, local dish, especially at Christmas, ever since our Viking days - and probably earlier. Merry Christmas
Yes, literally no American kid who isn't a GBBO addict (which wasn't a thing when this was made) or doesn't have a historic-baking minded or anglophile parent is going to think "pudding" is anything other than a cold, well, pudding...goopy sweet stuff made from powder pudding mix and chilled in the fridge, or that came out of a plastic pudding cup from a grocery store. Wouldn't call it a custard or know what that meant, either. "Boiled pudding" or calling all dessert "pudding" are completely alien.
@@Eet_Miacan’t speak for the whole country, but in Louisiana we baked bread puddings, they were never boiled. It’s not a custard but contains all the custardy ingredients.
32:52 Can we just mention that Caine's acting here is immaculate? The way he makes you feel the regrets of a broken old man? Or maybe that's just a little too close to home for me right now.
If I remember correctly, Mr. Fezziwig ran a fabric wholesaler. Sold cloth by the bolts or yards, or orders of multiple bolts from the weavers. The open bolts were in a separate cabinet from the “new” bolts. Scraps were sold for a pittance for crafters to earn their own profits. I think Dickens notes about clearing the tables and putting away the bolts and putting up the shutters.
I wonder too if it wasn't that they were ALLOWED to go hard. A lot of fashions of this period just look very, very silly now--the mob caps and the fichus and the bright purple coats. It's hard to sell a lot of those details to a 2020s audience and not have them laugh through your whole costume drama. But as these are Muppets, and they're silly anyway . . . no reason not to be 100% period-accurate silly.
I’ve always loved this movie for the snippets of actual Dickens peppered throughout. For lines like “As solitary as an oyster” is why we still hold his writing in such high regard. No one could describe a character that perfectly.
Jenny's videos are always a joy, the depth of her knowledge is incredible. If I ever make it to London with my family, I am definitely going to book one of her tours.
1:36 "I don't want to stop it this early, but..." I have an auntie who is an absolute history buff. Watching movies with her is something like this! She'll stop the movie every time something is historically inaccurate to explain to me in (great) detail how it _actually_ was and why it was like that. ❤
I love how much detail the costumers put into the clothes the muppets wear. How wild is it that they put characters like Rizzo the rat and Gonzo into period appropriate outfits?
I was watching a costumer review the clothes and she pointed out that, based on the way the clothes bunch and move on the puppets, she's pretty sure they're even wearing the right UNDERWEAR!
An American note towards the prison costume: kids of that time (like myself) were raised on old Looney Tunes and Tom and Jerry cartoons. They always depicted prisoners in jail in that particular costume so it makes sense the Henson folks would do the same so kids would understand “that’s a jail”. Bars on a window might not mean anything since in some places, houses have/had barred windows as a common thing.
Your aunt is a superstar and the amount of raw serotonin I receive every rewatch when I get to see all the delightful costumes filling up my screen cannot be understated
It's so amazing that you did this comparison, my boyfriend and I were talking about it the other day. He told me, and I verified on the Wiki page, that Michael Caine said ""I'm going to play this movie like I'm working with the Royal Shakespeare Company. I will never wink, I will never do anything Muppety. I am going to play Scrooge as if it is an utterly dramatic role and there are no puppets around me." And he did an incredible job! Also, we sadly do not grow up knowing what a Christmas pudding is honestly. Not unless you're the strange child who sits in the corner reading books all the time. . . 😂 Although it didn't understand it well until I was an adult and watched GBBS for the first time ❤
One of the things you kept mentioning was how this movie is aimed at very young children. You even said five-year-old several times. What you must keep in mind is that the Muppets had been around since the mid 60s, and popularized on Sesame Street starting in 1969, followed by The Muppet Show in the 70s. The Muppet Christmas Carol wasn’t released until 1992. Most of the fans of the Muppets grew up with them, and at this point were Adults. So, even though a lot of the specific words were modernized and Americanized, as a whole it was as much for adults as for children.
Thank you! This was the ONE big thing that bugged me about this review. This movie was not made FOR 5 year olds, it was made FOR everyone some of whom _might_ be 5 year olds. At their best the Muppets always made material that could be enjoyed by both adults AND children
I didn't see the Muppet Christmas Carol until I was 52 (about four years ago). And I think it IS one of the best adaptations! I don't have nostalgia for it. I just think it is tremendously well-done. Michael Caine plays the role of Scrooge perfectly!
Same here! I know that many people consider the Alistair Sim version to be "the classic", but that's only because it was formative for us, not because the adaptation was excellent. I don't think anyone else can hold a candle to Michael Caine's interpretation of Scrooge.
It was an absolute pleasure spending an hour with you talking about all of this! As an American, I would like to apologize for the "Pudding Erasure". Yes the vast majority of people here (especially children) would not have understood references to pudding, in our vernacular, it refers to a very specific type of dessert and would have made no sense in the context.
As a kid singing We Wish You a Merry Christmas the line about figgy pudding raised some questions, promptly (& correctly) answered by my dad. It never occurred to me until years later that this was a gap in *American* knowledge. I just figured it was something that kids didn't know but adults did. 🤷🏻♀️
I don't believe I've ever seen a British pudding in person, and would have to look up how to make figgy pudding. In my estament, they likely went extinct in the mid 1800's this side of the Ocean.
I teach that song to my students every year and it wasn't until fairly recently that I heard one of the kids singing by himself and he was singing "Now bring us some friggin' puddin'!" I had to go back and reteach and now I always wonder how many years worth of kids learned to sing it like that! @@urbanpoodle
Agreed. I'm an adult, have spent several months in a country where pudding does not mean what it does in America, and my understanding of everyone-else-pudding is still only "I think it's sort of like a cake, except when it isn't." I was very confused when I was younger and made a pudding recipe from an older cookbook and the result in no way resembled pudding.
This was such a delight to watch. My husband and I drank tea together and watched your video over the course of two evenings once the kids were in bed, and it was a great way to start some discussions of our own. Thank you for your insights. It made me wonder whether you had seen George C. Scott's performance in the 1987 Christmas Carol. It addresses some of your issues; I'd love to hear your reaction to its portrayal of the themes and character arc.
We do not have Christmas pudding in America. In fact I have had several conversations having to explain what a pudding is, even though I myself have never had one, but most Americans are only familiar with the custard-like dessert pudding. Then to further confuse us Americans I have to add in that pudding is sometimes used as a name for dessert and not just the dish.
I suspect "Fuzziwig and Mom" is a reference to the earlier _Muppet Family Christmas_ where Fozzie and pals go and visit his mother for Christmas. And I don't think Fozzie tends to wear shoes--but then, neither does Kermit. That said, Fozzie would be the type to tell a joke about his *bear* feet.
25:30 to be extremely fair, he does have a nephew. He had to have some form of sibling. It took me *this year* at a play of Christmas Charol to have it pointed out to me that sister must be his nephew's mother. Which puts the tragedy of him wanting to be alone and to be asked by the same side of family again to come for Christmas all the more tragic.
I can’t reiterate this enough that as an American who was once a child, yes, pudding really would’ve COMPLETELY thrown me off. Literally nowhere in American is ‘pudding’ used to refer to the UK version, pudding here only means a custard basically, and pudding cups where especially popular amongst kids, they’re basically just soft custardy, chilled dessert that you’d get in your school lunch. That context of pudding is pretty much all an American child would be exposed to, so boiling pudding is the equivalent of like, boiling ice cream. It would’ve been super confusing.
I always had a feeling like Dickens wrote the notion of the ghosts coming on three seperate nights in a first draft and then just...never remembered to fix the line in revisions. I do think it says something about the effectiveness of both the scene itself and the story as a whole where theres just that glairing of a "plot hole" but no one (not even the author) really notices it until you specifically look for it.
Thank you for pre-warning us that you don't think this movie is perfect and magical, I really needed to brace myself! There's something about the layer of abstraction provided by puppetry or cartoons that allows for a kind of emotional storytelling that works really well with this sort of story, which I think is why people get so attached to this adaptation and find others difficult to get into.
Yes, American Children would have been VERY confused by the word pudding. When I heard it as a kid in British media, I always pictured what Americans mean by pudding. I wondered why they liked pudding so much.
It's actually kind of nice knowing Dickens had the same foibles a lot of writers do, where when you're releasing something piece by piece (as novels were done at the time), you might mess up some of the continuity and not be able to go back and change it. But also, time being messed with kind of helps with the final wonderful surprise he has at it still being Christmas. He thought he'd gone on and on well into Kwanzaa without getting to make any changes in his life and would have to wait for the next Christmas to really show it.
One thing i love about michael caines decision to play as if the muppets were people is that it opens an avenue for deeply anaylising how scrooge see people around him. He sees those that work for him as rats and frogs and the women as sows mainwhile those he does see as human are his family and those who are clearly upper class
An interesting take, but I wonder if it doesn't interpret into Scrooge's character an elitism that isn't really expressed from him in the book. He is alone, miserly, and miserable, but as far as I know he has never been depicted as classist or elitist or the like.
@adamsmall5598 potentialy. Im not sure how well the human as upper class holds as i havent done a frame by frame analysis of the crowd to see but there is a definetly theme with how scrooges family all being human in his eyes as well as his fiance
I don’t know who said this first, but the best thing about Christmas Carol and Muppet Treasure island is that Michael Caine treated the muppets as if they were actors and Tim Curry treated himself like a Muppet.
43:36 I remember watching the Patrick Stewart one when I was young and the scene with the children under the robe freaked me out it was so scary and has stuck with me to this day. And I imagine it would either be too scary for the muppets or they would make them puppets and it would making the point not work.
Fun fact about the Spirits in this movie. The original plan was that they were supposedly going to use established Muppet characters to portray them but then decided to have them be entirely original creations. And I think that's for the best because I can't think of who I'd pick. Anyone I could think would be a character that was performed by Jim Henson or Richard Hunt who had both recently passed away (the film is dedicated in their memory). And you can tell they didn't want to immediately replace the performers of all their characters (obviously with a few exceptions - Kermit, Statler and Waldorf) I really enjoyed this video. I'm a massive fan of this version and you brought up some points that I never actually thought about before - mostly the younger Scrooge stuff.
I think Sweetums would've been good as the ghost of present, but Richard Hunt's passing definitely would have made it rough. Uncle Deadly could've been used for future, but really lacked the somber tone. Honestly, it was really good that they all ended up unique muppets (other than the Marleys) in order to help with the tone. If more iconic muppets had held the roles, it wouldve been far more jokey.
The Ghost of Christmas Past puppet was originally filmed in a big tank of baby oil to get that slow moving etheral effect. The team found that the baby oil became difficult to work with and clean from the tank and puppet so filmed the remaining scenes with the puppet submerged in water :)
There's a fun little detail from the book this video doesn't mention. (That's not a knock on this video; it's quite long enough as it is.) After he sees Marley's face in the knocker, Scrooge "did pause, with a moment’s irresolution, before he shut the door; and he did look cautiously behind it first, as if he half expected to be terrified with the sight of Marley’s pigtail sticking out into the hall." Michael Caine's Scrooge does this and Gonzo tells Rizzo they need to run inside before he shuts the door, but Rizzo is looking for his jellybeans and Gonzo gets the door slammed in the face. LOL.
This was such a delightful watch that gave me so many feelings. This is my definitive live version of Christmas Carol. While I love the book for many of the specifics you mentioned, the way the MCC manages to gut punch me with feelings every is just... impressive considering I have watched it nearly every year for nearly 30 years. Even just watching you watch the Tiny Tim scene made me tear up!
07:20 There's an interesting radio interview with Paul Williams, songwriter for The Muppet Christmas Carol, where he recounts his struggle with his own demons around the time of writing, and that coming up with lyrics pertaining to the themes of self-imposed loneliness, redemption, love and, of course, sweet seasonal sentiment proved especially therapeutic. The series was called 'The Sound of Cinema' on BBC Radio 3, it should still be available to listen to. Wonderful video! I really enjoyed your informative and witty take on my childhood introduction to A Christmas Carol!
"Do you have Christmas puddings in America?" No, it's not at all common. And for Americans, a pudding is what Brits would probably identify as a custard. (Absolutely love your videos!!)
I'm even more confused now... like you have custard with Christmas Pudding ? The pudding is the cake-like part ? ( if my profile picture didn't make it clear enough I'm British )
@@Beithyr In the US "pudding" exclusively refers to smooth custard like deserts. Chocolate pudding (sort of like chocolate mouse), rice pudding, tapioca pudding. Nothing cake like would be called pudding.
@@Beithyr we don’t have Christmas pudding at all. We think of Christmas pudding as a foreign, extremely British thing (assuming we’ve even heard of it or know what it is)
@@Beithyr As a Brit who has eaten some American 'pudding', I would say that it's generally what we'd call blancmange or perhaps a mousse if it's less set. I don't think I'd describe it as a custard, but maybe there are more custardy types I haven't had.
I grew up with this film, as an American, and I still love it. We watched it alongside the George C Scott 1984 version mostly. Your criticisms are, of course, very valid, and I honestly didn't realize just how good the adaptation was from both the text and the costuming, so this was a joy to watch!
There’s a real sense of dedication to this film. It could very easily have just been some cash grab Muppet movie but it’s clear that the filmmakers really did put their all into this. It’s a surprisingly accurate adaptation of A Christmas Carol for one thing and includes a lot of book dialogue, so it at least shows that someone read the book, unlike some adaptations (cough, 2019 BBC miniseries, cough). It’s also just a plain fantastic film. PS, I love that they called the second Marley “Robert”. Y’know, as in Bob. Bob Marley.
One of my favourite things about a Christmas Carol is that Scrooge isn’t necessarily portrayed as a man who will go to any lengths to make money. He is miserly, sure, but he doesn’t break laws, he does everything that is legally required of him as an employer. Dickens was trying to say that simply doing no evil and following the law was not necessarily enough to be good. You had to go out of your way to be charitable, and many found that controversial. It says it is not ok to be blissfully ignorant. I think some rich people need to realise that today
We really need to raise our standards in the modern day...
[This message has been directed towards every multimillionaire]
especially, *especially* since when adjusting for inflation, Scrooge was paying above multiple countries' minimum wages of today💀
Celebrate Yule/Winter Solstice like the pagans did? That's how I celebrate...🌠✨✨❄️
@@mollymcnaughton3133Does never having been Christened count as being a Pagan? If it does I'm a natural and all for it. I hate the commercialisation of Christmas in our Western Culture and I'm pretty sure it's diametrically opposite to the Christian Prophet's central message.....
@@purplepedantry
Do you mean Bernie Sanders?
Fozzie doesn't wear shoes for one simple reason: he has bare feet.
Underappreciated comment.
Wocka wocka wocka 🎉
I see what you did there! Appreciated!
@@SkulShurtugalTCG bear feet
Ba-dum-CH!
9:30 I could imagine Scrooge being too cheap to get a sign with the extra "Marley" - "You've got the same name, you can share!"
I would imagine the Marleys THEMSELVES making that decision.
@@coalcreekdefense8106
Jacob: There's only one Marley on that sign!
Robert: Because it's already enough having to share space with you on real life!
Both: D'OHOHOHOHOHOHOHOHO
I don't think Scrooge hired the rats as bookkeeping staff, they're just the normal city amount of rats and he said "Well if you're going to be occupying space in my office you're going to have to make yourself useful."
Weird ways that a world with muppets would be different but I think it makes enough sense.
You know what, given how rat infested London was at the time, I’m going to accept that as ‘accurate’
I mean he took it too far but I’ll be damned if Scrooge wasn’t industrial 😂 no free loading rats!
You can look at it that way or you can view this through scrooges eyes and how he sees certain sections of society in this cases he sees his lower class employees as thieving rats while he sees cratchit and the other middle managers as cowardly frogs
@@Ericshadowblade As I said on your other post, I'm not sure this is true to the story at all. Admittedly, I am no Dickens expert, but I do not ever remember this being presented as a part of Scrooge's character.
@adamsmall5598 i dont know if it is in the novel its just an angle that you can use when your analysing this version
Yes, American children would be confused by pudding. I, a Canadian, was confused by British pudding when I started reading books like Agatha Christie. Our pudding is only ever a sweet goop that is kind of a custard consistency in a variety of flavours from chocolate or vanilla to banana or pistachio.
I grew up with "bread pudding" and "Indian pudding" and a heavy diet of British literature and television shows so...who knows.
I think most US kids are familiar with bread pudding, which is closer to a British pudding, though still not the same. We used to have bread pudding every so often and I think it stands out to kids because there just aren't too many desserts you light on fire.
Best not to speak for all of Canada, since we are so big. In Atlantic Canada (especially, but not only, Newfoundland) we eat plenty of Christmas pudding.
@@shannonsenzig1676although I had heard of it as a kid, I was not familiar with what it was like until my 30s? Lol. I want to say it's more of an eastern/southern coastal thing.
American and I love plum pudding on Boxing Day with my British friends. Still when I hear pudding I think jiggly, gooey American pudding.
What I’ve heard from fashion historians online is that the MCC has the most accurate costumes out of all the other filmed CC interpretations. Which is cool because most of the costumes are tiny and muppet sized.
It's also one of the most accurate as far as dialogue. Almost everything the characters other than Gonzo and Rizzo say comes right out of the book.
Abby Cox is one of those fashion historians who has fantastic video on why she feels the costumes of MCC deserved, and was robbed, of an Oscar. It’s a great watch.
I was talking to a friend studying theater costume design. That was their comment too: period-accurate costumes, even for the Muppets.
The bit with the scarf always gets me, because the way Caine plays it; its clear that this is the first present he's been given in a LONG time and he isn't sure what to do with it. He was so focused on making amends that he never once considered people would be nice to him in return.
That's the moment that broke me, this year
Every single time 😢
He dons it like a badge of honour
Amen. If it weren't already full of muppets, Caine's portrayal alone would make this worth watching.
After all, to give without thought of reward is the heart of charity.
From what I heard, this was the first Muppet movie made after Jim Henson's death and his son, Brian Henson, really put his heart and soul into it. It was a project fueled by grief and everyone wanted to get it just right, all the way down to the costuming. I imagine that dedication comes through to us the audience as well, which is why its such a classic to many.
Nicole Rudolph, one of the costume historians in TH-cam, did an analysis of the costumes going along with a project to recreate one of the looks, and her analysis was that the costumes were very accurate, and actually one of the better versions in that regard.
The speech that Bob gives about many partings while influenced by the book itself I think was mainly Kermit's Puppeteer speaking about the loss of Jim
Jim Henson's death was a shock because he died of pneumonia at 53. He didn't realize how sick he was and go to the hospital until it was too late.
@@scribbly2983it was shocking even to those of us who were young people at the time.
@@Masquaradethewriter I was five at the time, and his was the first death I was ever aware of. I was devastated, and I think I was vaguely under the impression that Muppets content would no longer be on television.
22:00 - Dickens' description of the Ghost of Christmas Past sounds like what you'd get from an AI art generator trying to animate a ghost of Christmas past, but that's unable to properly keep it cohesive between frames so parts of it morph from one thing to another over time.
Ahaha it really is
I've always thought it sounded suspiciously like a biblically accurate angel
That's a very good analogy!
I always interpreted young Scrooge saying "who cares about stupid old Christmas" in this movie as more a resentment about his parent; they pay to get rid of him, basically, and don't let him come home over the winter holidays, and so he says what he says instead of breaking down in front of his classmates in tears because his parents doesn't care enough about him to have him come home.
Yeah, and him starting to be miserly as a young adult because he never wanted to be poor again-- this version being just a little earlier in life.
Exactly! This is the defensive reaction of a child who is hurting, not an expression of actual antipathy toward Christmas itself (as of yet).
He learns to love Christmas and people under Fezziwig
You are exactly right. I'm a teacher and have worked with countless elementary students, and I can tell you that the "who cares about stupid old Christmas" outburst would be a very normal thing to come from a neglected child. He's disappointed and hurt so he tries to make himself feel a little better by telling himself that he doesn't actually want what he's missing. At the same time, he also has his defenses way up because he's afraid of looking pathetic to his peers and becoming an object of pity. That's why the lines that set him off were "Hurry up Ebenezer, the last coach is leaving," "Come on, he never goes home for Christmas."
@@OscarOSullivan - I think you mean "Fozziwig". ^_^
I’m a “muppets is the best adaptation” person. My favourite aspects are how closely they quote the text and Michael Caine’s performance. He supposedly said he was going to play it completely straight like it was a theatre drama. Just brilliant.
I came to say this if no one else had. I remember seeing an interview with him where he said he made a very conscious decision when he took the role to treat the Muppets the same way he would any other costars.
American kids are very opinionated when they see or hear of food they are not familiar with, like boiled pudding. I can imagine kids going “ewwww.” I’ve dealt with plenty of spoiled American kids showing disgust at foreign foods. 😢
@@hbanana7what?
That’s what I heard too. That’s why it’s so good.
He said he was going to play it as if the Muppets were actually classically-trained thespians.
Conversely, Tim Curry decided to play Long John Silver as if he were also a Muppet.
They are both correct.
One thing I really like in this version is how quickly scrooge begins his change. Most adaptations leave his pivot for the climax but in the book scrooge is already realising the errors of his ways with the ghost of Christmas past (wishing to talk to bob, wishing he didn't shut the door on the carol singer.) and is open to learn from ghost of Christmas present and Christmas yet to come.
I think its important for the story that Scrooge changes before he meets the ghost of Christmas future. It's less impactful when the other ghosts do nothing and he just gets scared straight. He especially needs to feel bad seeing Tiny Tim and realizing a little boy will die because of his actions.
I like how you don't simply point out inaccuracies, but each time speculate on what might have motivated and justified those decisions.
It's kind of sweet to hear that Dickens' editors were so worried about Tiny Tim that he had to add "Who did NOT die" at the end
Sign of a great writer when the editors are so invested in the story that they worry about a specific character. 🥰
That line always stood out to me as weirdly out of place, as though it were inserted after-the-fact. Fascinating to discover that that's basically what happened.
@@teresaellis7062Sounds more like the editors were concerned about the book not selling well if it had a sad ending.
The line "and to Tiny Tim, who did NOT die, he was a second father" is in the original Dickens. They were just being true to the source material -- but Gonzo's delivery is charming and reassuring.
@@maxinegautier3313that’s what they said…… you’re just rephrasing their statement?
Miss Piggy threatening to deck Scrooge is in character for Miss Piggy; it's recognizable and expected
And one of my favorite moments of the film
As an American, I can confidently say that all of the 5-year-olds I’ve known would have been very confused by a British pudding. We do not have any puddings like that in America. 😂 However, as a mom, I’m a big proponent of teaching kids small things in passing. They’re the building blocks of future learning.
I think that fruitcake would be the apt thing to use instead of pudding for North American audiences.
Same. I recall hearing the word from time to time as a kid and always picturing something like Jello brand chocolate pudding.
_Small things in passing_ is the best way to learn. Ideally you keep doing it for yourself even when mom (or dad) is not available.
You talking about anachronisms reminds me of the time the scrap metal merchants came around, sounding their horn as they do. Now, these type of people used to also collect rags and bones, so were known as "rag and bone men". My daughter, who was 4 at the time, asked me who was blowing the horn, and when I told her it was the "rag and bone men" she was frightened, as she imagined a man made out of rags and bones!
Having typed all that out, I wonder if you even have scrap metal collectors in America? They're usually travelling people (who we used to call "Gypsies" but that word is not PC these days) and they go around in a pick-up truck type of vehicle. They blow their horn so that people know that they're there and people can bring out any items containing metal that they want to get rid of. Obviously, the scrap metal merchants extract as much metal as they can and when they have enough to sell they go and get money for it.
@@zappababe8577 I am 67 and grew up in Brooklyn ny. We didn't have rag and bone men. Kirk douglas wrote a book called "the rag man's son" (which he was). That was the first time I heard of it. When I was a kid t knife grinder would come around and ring loud "jingle bells" a d the women would bring out their knives
Abby Cox made a fantastic video about how insanely accurate the costumes are! They even made sure that less wealthy characters were wearing 1830's clothes, since not everyone can afford to keep up with the latest fashions.
Yes! Abby's video is phenomenal! It's one of my favorite TH-cam videos ever.
Nicole Rudolph also has a video series where she makes Gonzo's outfit from this movie, shoes included.
... and I love that one of the costume designers even commented on Abby Cox's video! I like how this video talks about all the dialogue, and similarities and differences regarding plot. As someone who's never read the book, it is very interesting.
13:05 Americans absolutely do not ear Christmas Pudding. In The States, "pudding" is basically like a thick custard. Most common flavours being chocolate, butterscotch, and vanilla.
@@kyndramb7050 We absolutely should though.
Yeah this was such a hilarious moment ..
"Americans have puddings don't you?"
Bestie love you but we get offended at the variety of definitions the UK has for "pudding"
Michael Caine’s performance is amazing because he didn’t act like he was preforming against muppets, he played the role seriously as if the rest of the cast were live actors.
That's what the best of the Muppet movies do.
Meanwhile, Tim Curry acted like a fellow Muppet in Treasure Island, which is equally amazing.
@@AroAceGamer that would be because Tim Curry IS a muppet, in the best possible way.
@@missarose6159 Lmao. True.
I see you also saw that tumbler post that was reposted on reddit.
At a pub quiz, the question was 'How many ghosts visited Scrooge in A Christmas Carol?' The consensus in our team was 4 until my wife piped up with 'But there were 5. Both Marley brothers visited him.' This was the definitive version of the story for her.
That’s so amazing and so sweet omg 😭💗
There is, though I cannot post it, a brilliant meme. Patrick Stewart has played Scrooge as well and it has a still image of him looking like he is shouting "there are only FOUR ghosts"
Underneath you have the Muppets Marley and Marley just floating there.
@@mrtalos this sounds brilliant, wish i could find it
In the original book there's 6. Ghost of Christmas Present has 2 ghosts named Ignorance and Want following him
@@genericname2747 I've read the book and I don't remember that at all, funny how the muppet version just pushed out the recollection of the original plot points again.
If you really want to nerd out about the costumes in The Muppet Christmas Carol, I highly recommend Abby Cox's video on the movie's costumes. Also, Nicole Rudolph did a series of videos where she created a historically accurate, human sized version of Gonzo's costume. Both of them pretty much conclude that the movie's costuming was insanely impressive by any standard, and absolutely mind blowing when you consider that its target audience was kids who weren't even old enough to read, let alone know anything about historical clothing.
For Fozziewig and Mom, that's a reference to the 1987 Muppet Family Christmas special. It was a crossover where the Muppets, Sesame Street muppets and Fraggles all wind up at the country home of Fozzie's mother.
It's fantastic, and I highly recommend it. Swedish Chef sees Big Bird and immediately plans to cook him for Christmas dinner. ("Gobla gobla humunga!")
To be fair, though, given that the setting is England, it should be "Fozziwig and Mum," not "Mom."
@@Brasswatchman Excellent point considering this is all about historical accuracy
And then, Swedish Chef immediately changes his mind when Big Bird gives him a present. It's genuinely charming and heartwarming.
Edit: and then they sing “The Christmas Song”, and I will just break down sobbing because of Carol Spinney.
@@Brasswatchman not necessarily. In the Midlands, Mom is quite commonly used rather than Mum or Mam. It's not necessarily a straight American/British thing, even if people tend to assume it is.
@@tomshortell1046 the Snowman that briefly shows up in this movie was also from Muppet Family Christmas :D
In regards to Miss Piggy's style... I feel like at least part of it is emphasizing that the Cratchits don't have enough money for her to BE fashionable. Her clothing is neat and well-cared for, but her husband certainly didn't have the money to keep her up to date.
Yes, it's like she found the prettiest things she could in the secondhand shop and decided not to care if they were a decade out of style.
Yes but 99% of people watching the film would not have understood the subtle differences in Miss Piggy’s costume to be reflective of 1830s vs 1840s style…
@@maryanneslater9675secondhand clothing shops themselves would be a historical anachronism…
@@maddieb.4282Even if secondhand shops are an anachronism, secondhand clothing surely is not. They may not have had Goodwill and Salvation Army stores, but the fashionably dressed would have done *something* with their old fashions.
This is confirmed in the directors commentary. They deliberately gave Piggy outfits a few years and slightly not in fashion because they would of been cheaper secondhand.
I’ve taught A Christmas Carol to 8th graders for several years, and I’m so happy you spent time on the Ghost of Christmas Past! So hard to make sense of that description, and SO MUCH WEIRDER than you expect. I see the Ghost as a representation of a candle and, in some ways, like memory (our ability to hold many “ages” in our memory).
I appreciate that Gonzo and Rizzo tell the children that the 3rd ghost will be scary. It also breaks the 4th wall and the tension of the scene. Its a smart way to take away the drama because it is made for children. This would not be done for an adult audience. And personally as a parent, I appreciate the tip off.
Well analyzed!
That doesn't sound that much unlike something Dickens would've done, actually. He kept a good balance between dark and funny moments.
@petraw9792
Thank you for the info about Dickens. I didn't know that about his writing.
@@carakellmeyer5037 I was mainly referring to A Christmas Carol, actually.
Watched it with little children this year, and they were quite scared the 3rd ghost. 😁
I'm very surprised she didn't cover the fact that Gonzo's Dickens Character *explicity* gives a call to action to the viewer to consider reading the book just prior to the end credits.
I would have thought that would have given the Muppets' depiction of this story some well-deserved bonus points.
I always remember feeling very happy with that final suggestion from Gonzo as a kid.
It gives the original source material such a great amount of acknowledgement and respect/deference.
I wish she'd highlighted it here :-)
Same!
I actually did read the original book because I like the Muppet adaptation so much. It had that suggestion, and I figured that most of Gonzo's great lines were from the book, so I read it.
The narration from Gonzo is actually why this is one of my favorite adaptations of the Christmas Carol.
I believe “Fuzziwig and Mom” is a call back to the TV special “A Muppet Family Christmas” which took place at Fozzie’s Mom’s house. That special also ended with a rare Jim Henson appearance and I think is one of if not the last time all the muppet tv shows were in one spot. “A Muppet Christmas Carol” is the first big Muppet project after Jim Henson died and that his son, Brian Henson, directed. All that to say, I’m not surprised they used Fozzie’s Mom in this adaptation (unless she’s in the original book?).
The use of the Gonzo as a narrator to get Dickens' prose in is why this is my favorite adaptation. Those lines are just so good.
I quite like the "Who cares about stupid old Christmas?!" line from young Scrooge, as it seems a very natural way for a child to react. He's lonely and stuck at the school, and lashes out at the other kids with that statement, even if deep down he doesn't real feel it's true. He absolutely does care about Christmas at that stage. It's exactly how someone that age, and even some adults, react when they're hurting inside.
I will say in defense of YA Scrooge, after Fozziewig tells him to shut up and enjoy the party, he shuts up and enjoys the party. He may not be as cool as Book Scrooge, but he’s still going on the Scrooge journey from less to more uptight and greedy as he ages and isolates himself from the world.
I don’t know. It IS a natural reaction to lash out when you’re hurting, but I feel they could have done a better job of making it clear that he was speaking out of his pain and really didn’t mean it. For me, personally, the outburst makes it just a bit more difficult to find the character sympathetic- easier to [mis]interpret his isolation as voluntarily self-imposed.
In the book, one gets the sense that if this lonely and abandoned young boy were invited to join his friends, he would have leaped at the opportunity, rather than reacting with defensive hostility.
yeah it seems like both this version of the story and the original both give scrooge a lot of.. implied backstory. Especially with his family. Purely by him saying or hearing things that require that to be the case. They took different routes, but either way the ghost of the past is showing us he changed, without showing us the specific time when he changed (before the flashbacks in this movie, and after the flashbacks in the book. unless there's some part i'm unaware of. haven't read it in some time.)
@@StoryMing one of the hardest things for people to do, especially in the 21st century, is get over the idea of someone's isolation as self-imposed or deserved for their behavior, and focus on just fixing them to what you know they should be, knowing that only some past trauma could have caused this.
@@KairuHakubi
Self-imposed isolation or other hardship is definitely a thing, and Scrooge DOES *absolutely* have moral responsibility for his own life choices. _However,_ in the original book, at this stage in his life, he is abandoned and neglected, which is not of his doing, nor is he shown to be hostile or resentful over it.
To recognize that there are outward forces which had a large bearing in shaping him to be what he became, is NOT, in my opinion, to excuse, condone, or absolve him for what he has done wrong; it is simply to understand better what he needs to overcome and change.
If anyone wants to teach their kids what "pudding" is but don't want to go through a week of boiling and steaming things in a cubic meter of cognac, may I recommend sticky toffee pudding! Made with dates, covered in warm toffee sauce and topped with vanilla ice cream or custard it's a very nice treat kids really love and it's very wintery and a great decadent Christmas dessert! I've been making it for a few years now and its always a hit.
The Tiny Tim "First parting there was among us" scene is especially somber in this film's context, as this is the first Muppets movie production after the death of Jim Henson. Steve Whitmere's then-recent acquisition of the role of Kermit made his mournful performance in this scene have an extra layer of heartbreak to it.
Oh man! That just makes that scene hit even harder. No wonder Kermit sounded like he was trying not to cry, now I'm trying not to cry
@@wiseforcommonsense possibly Steve *was* trying not to cry!
That scene gets me every time, even just thinking about it.
Oh man. This scene already made me cry and now it's going to be even worse. I was 9 in 1990 and Jim Henson's was the first major death of an artistic creator I admired.
Rowlf was almost entirely retired, as he was one of Henson's personal favorites (and they couldn't retire Kermit). He has a quick cameo in the band at the party, but he's not given any lines until The Muppets with Jason Siegal (and he's probably one of the funniest in the movie).
I read recently that this is Michael Caine's favorite of his film performances. In the article Caine said that he crafted the whole of his character as though he was playing with humans - perfectly straight with no mugging. He was proud that the youngest members of his family could comfortably watch it.
I am not surprised after seeing just part of the movie recently. During the song sung by the spirit of Christmas present, Michael Caine is so effortlessly happy. I especially love that last detail. Michael Caine is an awesome actor, but a lot of his movies are not for littles. 😅
He and Tim Curry are great in their Muppet movies. Tim Curry went as over the top as the Muppet characters, so he wasn't overshadowed by their shenanigans. My favorite line is "Upstage, lads. This is my only number."
It works really well as it opens an avenue to see how scrooge sees other people some as rats others as pigs and frog while the noticely human are his family and more wealthy classes
On the opposite side of the spectrum, Tim Curry made himself a muppet for muppet treasure island
About Bobs scarf. They call it a comforter, which in America means big blanket. So I pictured him just bundled up in a big blanket to stay warm, to poor to even own a coat. Thank you for clearing that up.
I really like Gonzo as Dickens. Most adaptations feel like a stage play, or a movie adapted from a stage play, to the point that you would think A Christmas Carol was originally a play, and not a novel/novella. Gonzo as Dickens gives it much more of a "storyteller" feel.
I recall the reasoning for that is children are presented here with the Muppets ( for childhood joy) that may, in time, make an older child or young adult want to read the actual story.
Honestly in material where the narrator's voice adds so much, I wish I saw this kind of narrator-as-character insert more often. Eg. Any future adaptation of anything Douglas Adams has ever written
@@InnuendoXPI love how The Guide takes the role of narrator in the Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy radio plays. It lets more of Douglas Adams’ writing get in.
The perfect finishing touch is when the characters finish singing, and as the credits begin to roll we hear Rizzo's voice saying "Great story, Mr. Dickens," and Gonzo answers, "Thanks. Hey, if you liked this then you should read the book."
I think Dickens would've approved. He started the endless adaptations of this story with his live readings, where he was constantly revising it to make it work for a live audience.
Something I really appreciate about A Christmas Carol is that it uses Christmas as a setting, but it’s really focused on how society (well-to-do people in particular) treated the poor. Things have certainly changed since the 1840s of course, but the upper class’ attitude towards the poor not so much. I really respect that the Muppets adaptation faithfully brought that into their version
Ooh - Madeline PFP!
I really appreciate this explanation! Thanks!
Yeah, the problem isn't that scrooge doesn't like Christmas, it's that if you can't at least be decent to each other on Christmas what hope do we have for the rest of the year
George C Scott's version jams the candle "snuffer" on the 1st ghost. Grinding it to the ground--awakening to find himself wringing his blankets, as if strangling thempirit.
I don't disagree with you. But it also was very much about Christmas. Dickens wrote it because he didn't like how people were treating Christmas.
But he also was explicitly using the Spirit of Christmas to push for better conditions for the poor as well. He had other books on this topic, of course. It was a form of activism.
If you haven't seen it, I very much recommend the Annotated A Christmas Carol. It goes heavily into Dickens's intent. He was both a bit proponent of Christmas as well as caring about the poor.
The bookeepers is because there's a rat chorus in every movie and they all work at 1 place, so this is the best place to put them where it makes sense
One of the things I love about the Muppets Christmas Carol is how much work they put into the costumes
have you seen abby cox’s video on the costumes?
LoL! I was just going to say that. I think Abby's Muppet Christmas Carol video pretty much put her channel on the map and it is a solid video she geeks out hard about smocking etc. it is charming
Nichole Rudolph's recreation of Gonzo's costume was a true masterpiece of costume-tube as well!
Stars! Somehow I've missed that! I shall go look for it. Thanks
How this movie was not even nominated for a best costume Oscar is beyond me.
I love that Michael approached this movie like a serious adaptation, and treated the Muppets like fellow actors. A bit like how Tim Curry, in Muppets Treasure Island, went full Muppet himself and became one with the cast in a different way.
I believe he was quoted as saying he would only do it if he could play it as if he was on stage with the Royal Shakespeare Company. (Also, a cute little detail I found out when Googling for that quote. Apparently, his other reason was that his daughter was 7 at the time and really wanted to see a film her dad was in, but none of his work from the time was age appropriate. So he did it so she could see it.)
@@ghostmadlittlemiss 'for the kids' is also why Raul Julia did Street Fighter.
I expect that is why Michael Caine was chosen. It seems to me a directorial decision was taken to make a faithful, honest and accurate adaptation so they needed an English actor with gravitas.
I completely agree, except that Muppet Tim Curry is, in fact, his truest form. 😂
I would expect nothing less from a Muppet production. I think we have this tendency to dismiss children's programs as frivolous or "not real" somehow but I can't really think of a time when Jim Henson's Creature Workshop ever had that attitude. They tend to put in the thought and the work.
In the scene from the original in which Bob Cratchit involuntarily applauds Scrooge’s nephew’s speech, Scrooge does in fact verbally admonish Cratchit (after the clerk has accidentally extinguished his own fire!): ‘Let me hear another sound from you… and you’ll keep your Christmas by losing your situation’. So the Muppet’s Scrooge yelling at the clerks is in line with the story. Also, Bob actually does go to Scrooge in the hope of replenishing the coal for his fire, and Scrooge refuses. Dickens uses strangely subtle language to tell the reader this, with no dialogue, so it’s quite easy to miss!
I’m really glad you mentioned that there was no ‘unemployment line’ :)
The detail of Fozziwihig and Mom is a nod back to the ‘87 Muppet Family Christmas where every Muppet character, as well as Doc from Canadian Fraggle Rock, end up at Fozzie’s mom’s house.
Watch out for the icy patch!
It’s cold enough to freeze your Winnebago!
I came here to write this. I wish Muppet Family Christmas wasn't so hard to come by.
Lucky to still have the copy we taped from TV 🥰🎄
this is one of my favorite versions of "A Chritmas Carol" because of Michale Caine's remarkable performance. In many adaptations Scrooge doesn't show regret until the Ghost of Christmas Future--which give the impression that Scrooge changes out of fear of punishment rather than understanding his mistakes. I prefer the intperpretation that Scrooge has had an epiphany and that's why he changes--which Caine does fabulously.
Yes!! I know people think of this as a movie for children because of the Muppets, and it is accessible to children because of them, yet I didn't see this movie until I was nearly 40 and it is my favorite. Michael Caine gave the first portrayal of Scrooge as someone I could relate to, not just some hollow Christmas-hating ogre.
Agreed. In the book, even during the Christmas Past segment, Scrooge was starting to see himself in some of the people he shunned and realizing that he could have made them happy, just as his sister and old employer had for him. As the video said, it wasn't about psychoanalyzing him. It was about reminding him of what he used to be, and of how much it meant to him when he was shown kindness during his times of need.
I was sceptical that I'd enjoy such a long video, but I've found it incredibly informative. Also, I've just realised for the first time that the additional Marley is given the name Robert, which surely must be a reference to Bob Marley.
Yes, Robert Marley = Bob Marley!
While this was absolutely made (at least largely) for a US audience, the Jim Henson Company did a lot of work in England, including filming 5 seasons of The Muppet Show there, and Frank Oz (Miss Piggy among others) was even born in England (and has lived there off and on during his life) so I suspect many of the core people involved were familiar with the differences between US and British Christmas, but made the changes intentionally.
And for most people in the US, if they have heard of "Christmas pudding" it is because they have read/seen a version of A Christmas Carol, that has it in it , but may not know exactly what it is supposed to be. Not only is it not a tradition here, but "pudding" now refers to a completely different set of deserts (like custards).
I am an American in my mid-50's and have had my first ever "pudding" in the UK style over thanksgiving.
I would say we would most understand it as a dessert bread.
For us, pudding is closer to what the UK calls custard, though our puddings are generally sweeter than UK custards.
Also, for a lot of us, a pudding comes in a small box and you add the powder to milk.
@@MonkeyJedi99 I wonder how close american pudding is to angel delight, which is an add powder to milk dessert we have in the UK.
@@RAFMnBgaming I'd been thinking much the same thing.
I have a friend and coworker who focuses on historical clothing, primarily late-18th century but branching into other eras. She gushes over the costumes in this movie, speaking breathlessly about whoever designed Gonzo's outfits. And believe me, she is not easily impressed. The fact that a children's movie filled with puppets and talking rats, pigs, and frogs has more authentic and well-researched costuming than many big budget historical epics fascinates me.
You’d probably enjoy Nicole Rudolph’s videos on the costumes in this film, then!
In the animation industry, they call this kinda thing "bumping the lamp," which means something along the lines of "to put in a lot of effort into something very few will notice." The term originates from the movie Who Framed Roger Rabbit, specifically the scene where Roger bumps his head on the lamp in the parlor, causing it to swing back and forth. This swinging lamp was a nightmare for the animators, who had to hand-paint every light and shadow on Roger. Why was this included in the film if it was so difficult? Well, aside from being comedic, the director wanted the Toons to interact with the real world as much as possible, to thoroughly convince the audience that they are physically present in the scene.
Muppeteers work on a similar philosophy. It is very difficult to convince an audience that a bunch of felt, thread and fur is alive and present. And yet they not only manage to convince the audience that the puppets are alive, but even the actors and crew who often interact with them. Many people who have worked with Muppeteers have reported talking to the muppets and not the puppeteers, even when they can clearly see the puppeteers. There's even been instances where people have placed microphones on the puppets and not the puppeteers by mistake. It is the attitude of having to work extra hard to convince people that an inanimate object is alive that created the strive for historical accuracy. *That's* why the Muppet Christmas Carol is so accurate. Because they already have to put in more work to suspend your disbelief than a live action human.
it's not a children's movie
My favorite adaptation of ACC is the animated version directed by Richard Williams from 1971. It ran 25 minutes, was produced by Chuck Jones, and won an Oscar for best animated short in 1972.
Scrooge was voiced by Alistair Sims, the star of the 1951 version. And in spite of its brevity, it included S flying thru the air with the ghost of Xmas Present to view the 2 men in the lighthouse, the crew of a ship at sea, and the impoverished family whose menfolk work as miners. No other version I know has these scenes.
The pen-and-ink crosshatch style of animation is breathtaking. *A Must-See !!*
We DON'T have Christmas pudding in the US, not as a standard tradition. Just yesterday I was having to explain what a 'figgy pudding' was to my dad, because he had spent 83 years thinking the song said 'sticky pudding'. I had to explain the whole flaming Christmas pudding to him, he was truly ignorant on the fact.
The closest parallel to this I can come up with as a Brit, is that I have in my life heard the word Poindexter twice, once in a song, and once in Dodgeball, and it took a considerable amount of digging for me to find out what it meant.
Ummm, ok
@@kwd3109 Great conversation.
Heh. "Piggy pudding."
You did ...but u don't anymore...watch Townsemds 18th century cooking videos on plum pudding etc x think it just died out
The whole thing with the Ghost of Christmas present having a bad short-term memory is actually my favorite addition, about how he is always living in the present. I'm surprised that other adaptations haven't included that.
Also just because you mentioned it several times, yes children would be confused by "pudding" and frankly many adults because Christmas pudding is not a thing here. Also we understand pudding a a chocolate-y mouse type of thing, which I know is not what British people mean by pudding
I commented earlier that it depends. I must have watched different shows. Even if no one cooked it, it was in illustrations, and other Christmas carol versions. Kind of same thing about why I know what a dragon or unicorn is.
I'm super late to this video, but the algorithm was like, "hey, it's Christmas time again!" And I'm really glad to see this video recommended. It was really nice to see these line-for-line comparisons of the original Dickens text! Great video!
I don't think he hates Christmas during the Fozziwig party. Instead, he's just surprised at how much the party costs and Fozziwig saying "Don't worry about it". The breakup scene implies that Scrooge is more and more concerned with money. So he HAS changed.
What they SHOULD have done was show Scrooge having fun at the party before meeting a girl.
Yeah, my thought is that he was ambivalent about Christmas, not thinking of it as super special, perhaps due to his upbringing. Finding Belle changes him for a little while, but he reverts back to his natural state after awhile, something Belle doesn't appreciate.
@@tgbotg Yes, that's how I see it too. Belle's character does make sense in that context. When she meets him, he's being introduced by an old friend who describes him as "the finest young financial mind in the city." So, the information she has on first sight is that he's smart, ambitious, and highly recommended by someone who's opinion she respects. He's also handsome, well-mannered, and seems interested in her. Your right that he would change for a while after meeting Belle. It's very common for a person to show their best selves when they're excited to be in a new relationship and are trying to impress someone. And yes, that does inevitably fade and they go back to their natural states over time. It would also be very normal for Belle to focus on his good traits and his potential and to hope that the negatives that she does see would be what would fade over time. As he becomes colder and more distant, she'll stay for a while with the hope that something is only temporarily making him act out of character and he'll go back to normal eventually. Hopefully it will be like he says, and things will be better once he's got the secure job and is less stressed about financial stability. After a while though she'll finally accept that this IS normal for him and the way he was at the beginning was the part when he was acting out of character. That's when they break up. It's far from an unheard-of relationship arc.
@@tgbotg Yes, that's how I see it too. Belle's character does make sense in that context. When she meets him, he's being introduced by an old friend who describes him as "the finest young financial mind in the city." So, the information she has on first sight is that he's smart, ambitious, and highly recommended by someone who's opinion she respects. He's also handsome, well-mannered, and seems interested in her. Your right that he would change for a while after meeting Belle. It's very common for a person to show their best selves when they're excited to be in a new relationship and are trying to impress someone. And yes, that does inevitably fade and they go back to their natural states over time. It would also be very normal for Belle to focus on his good traits and his potential and to hope that the negatives that she does see would be what would fade over time. As he becomes colder and more distant, she'll stay for a while with the hope that something is only temporarily making him act out of character and he'll go back to normal eventually. Hopefully it will be like he says, and things will be better once he's got the secure job and is less stressed about financial stability. After a while though she'll finally accept that this IS normal for him and the way he was at the beginning was the part when he was acting out of character. That's when they break up. It's far from an unheard-of relationship arc.
When I taught 4th grade I would read A Christmas Carol to my students every year. After we finished, I would show the movie in class. The muppet version immediately came to mind, but for academic value I wanted to use the version that was the closest to the book that I could find. Keeping that in mind, I looked through several versions. The muppet version came out the winner anyway, even when considering it on equal grounds with many of the other classic adaptations. The deciding factor ended up being the sheer number of lines that were quoted directly from the book.
The George C. Scott has always been my favorite, but it is scary at moments.
Yeah I think this version, for the most part, is faithful where it counts.
The most faithful adaptation I have ever seen is the 1999 version with Patrick Stewart.
@lbatemon1158 Is that the one where the Ghost of Christmas Future sends Scrooge to Hell down a dark tunnel? (I think it was Hell anyway, it's been a long time since I saw it.)
I agree. If it hadn't been the muppets then it would have been either the George C. Scott version and the Patrick Stewart version, and that would have been a difficult decision.
I hope you consider making this a yearly event! I would love hearing you examine different versions of The Christmas Carol
The best thing about this adaptation is that Michael Caine treats the Muppets as fellow actors instead of just fuzzy fictional puppets on an elevated platform. He really brought his A-Game to this adaptation.
"OK Michael, it's a Muppet movie, you're the only human actor in the film, feel free to play with it, have some fun"
"Nope, I'm going to play it absolutely arrow-straight!"
Same with A Muppet Treasure Island. Tim Curry acts like he’s one of them and it works brilliantly.
Michael Caine is a professional. Much as a professional plumber doesn't discriminate based on the circumstances of his client, neither does he worry about the nature of his co-workers.
@@bobkatfan2013 Tim Curry decided to play Silver as the most charismatic bombastic pirate he could, I think the Henson Company had to up their game to jeep up with him honestly
I read an interview once where Michael Caine said (paraphrased), “The only way this movie will work is if I play this 100% seriously, as if I’m working alongside human actors.”
Would American children be confused by Christmas pudding? Yes. 😂 I was also confused by “sweetmeats” which showed up a few times in the books I liked to read. I mean, it’s good to bridge those culture gaps, too, so maybe they could have left the pudding in. But yes, Americans being confused by British pudding is a thing!
And I understand that generally, "pudding" means dessert, not necessarily what us North Americans would think of as pudding. Of course, in this context, "pudding" means Christmas pudding.
Yeah and pudding is a very specific thing here.
Americans also don't have many boiled desserts in the style of figgy pudding, which Americans have heard of from carolers singing We Wish You a Merry Christmas, but aren't likely to have had it.
What Is Christmas Pudding?
@@JDraper I did not know it's traditionally set on fire!
"You have Christmas puddings in America!" I like how confident you were initially, like, we 100% do not.
Oh hey! I can't tell if you just skipped past it for time, but if you haven't seen it, I recommend the cut with Belle's song, When Love Has Gone, that was left out of the theatrical release. (It's finally on Disney+, in the extras, as "full length version" or some such!) It makes Rizzo's bawling make more sense, it marks the emotional turning point for present-day Scrooge, the very next song says Christmas is "in all the places we find love", and the ending song, The Love We Found, is a direct reprise that brings the whole thing full circle. As good a movie as it is without that song, it's on another level with it included.
It was on the VHS copy. We didn't realize it was an extended cut until we got it on DVD years later.
We always fast-forwarded the song. We were excited to finally have a skip scene button, but we didn't even need it.
As a musician and composer though, I will agree that the musical reprise makes the cut a weird decision, and as an adult I see its appeal.
Oh, it's in the extras! I was very confused when I watched it on Disney+ this Xmas just gone and saw the song wasn't there, despite reading in more than one place that it was added back in.
@@Richard_Nickerson The version with the song is now called the extended cut but in reality it is the theatrical cut. The song there when I saw the movie in the theater in the 90’s. Some daft executive thought the song was too boring for children so he cut it from the first DVD edition. After a lot of uproar from fans it was placed back in the so-called extended edition on Blu ray.
@@thulcandran
It wasn't "some daft executive", it was based on what people said coming out of the theaters.
I got to tell people asking about Pride, Prejudice, & Zombies that they messed up the whole thing when I walked out of theaters, but I don't think enough people complained with me.
This is standard movie-making procedure.
Edit: Again, it always existed on the VHS, and it *is* an option on the regular DVD. You're acting as if it completely disappeared when the comment you're responding to already disproves that.
@@Richard_Nickersonlol we fast forwarded thru it too. 😂 i had no idea there was a version without it.
36:07 I think Scrooge's awkward dance is more than just to accommodate the puppet. He's been a shriveled up old crank for so long he's lost a lot of strength and flexibility, which means now that he's moving in unaccustomed ways looks awkward and painful because it's so strangeand difficult. It reinforces the huge change he's suddenly making in his life.
Also, in my experience, there is no Christmas pudding in the US. Maybe in some specific families, up in New England. I'm in my 50s and am still a little confused about pudding that gets boiled and set on fire. Pudding, in my experience, comes from a box and sets up in the fridge, but I've never been very fancy. 😁
@@adoxartist1258it varies from family to family. I was born and raised in California, and my mom used to make steamed Persimmon Pudding. Similar in many ways to Christmas pudding, and we sometimes ate it at Christmas, with hard sauce (butter, powdered sugar, and liquor).
It tends to be more like a cake with certain wintery fruits in it. The cake part is often made with brandy, if i recall correctly. It tended to end up pretty dry so they boiled it to make it easier to eat. Due to the alcholal content it was set on fire to make it taste of brandy and minimise the intoxication effect. @@adoxartist1258
@christajennings3828 Very cool! I've never seen anything about Christmas pudding outside British shows and movies. Happy Holidays! Merry Christmas! Happy 2024!
I had to add that the bit where Beaker gives Scrooge the scarf lets us see his reaction to it, he has just been filled with enthusiasm for Christmas, his priority had been to spread his generosity to atone for his past (hence the many back payments line) it had not even occured to him that someone would give him a gift, so much so he is taken by surprise and moved by it, it is after all likely the first gift anyone has given him in MANY years, its a joyous moment where he is almost INSTANTLY rewarded for his change of heart, and Michael Cain effortlessly portrays the moment as if he was about to shed a tear, GOD I LOVE THIS MOVIE!!!
I do like her theory that it makes him look a little warmer and friendlier. I had a similar thought as you on the reason behind the scarf.
I'd forgotten how great Michael Caine was in this role! In one of his books he mentioned how much fun he had being involved with this movie, and the respect he had for the Henson crew....Thank you so much for doing this!
Abby Cox did a great video looking specifically at the costumes from the perspective of a costume historian, and Nicole Rudolph has one where she remakes Gonzo’s (main) Dickens costume from the movie (generally the costumes are all shockingly accurate considering they’re mostly on puppets).
Yes! I love this version partly because of the costumes, they're more accurate than a lot of other adaptations I've seen and it made me irrationally happy
My favorite part is the observation that Gonzo’s shoes are on the wrong feet.
Nicole’s gonzo costume made me envious. ❤
@@sarahleanos129 Well, they would be, wouldn't they? 😆
The bit where Scrooge tries to snuff out the Ghost of Christmas Past is actually shown in the 2009 Christmas Carrol staring a motion-captured Jim Carrey. It’s made even more over the top as the spirit’s metal cap flies up like a rocket, launching Scrooge over the London skyline.
It also happens in the George C. Scott version of A Christmas Carol, although it's deliberate, not accidental.
@@Jus10Edyess thank you!! Sifting thru the comments to see if anyone mentioned that scene. George C Scott and Muppets are tied for my favorite Christmas Carol 🎄🥰🙏 📣
Pretty sure Patrick Stewart does it, too.
Regarding the whole "pudding" idea: historically, a pudding is a method of cooking, where you use a wrapping of some sort to keep your ingredients together while you boil it. You could have all different types of puddings, but the invention of the pudding cloth (which is re-usable, as opposed to previous versions which were basically haggis-adjacent sausages) made puddings much less expensive to make. As such, it became popular as a lower-class way of cooking a relatively large meal for a family.
Because it's basically just "stuff somthing in a cloth and boil it", you can have egg or milk-based puddings (which tended to be more desserts), or meat or bread-based puddings (which tended to be more of the main course, although the bread puddings were arguably more cake-like).
Americans leaned towards the custard-style desert puddings (custard was developed separately, but merged with puddings as a name and concept), as Americans usually didn't need to make main-course style puddings, as they had other things they wanted to eat. However, the dessert-style puddings were still moderately popular. In the 1840's a food scientist was able to develop custard powder (which was cornstarch-based), which was WAY easier to use as a thickening agent, and so Americans went even more towards puddings as desserts.
So, yeah - Americans consider puddings to be custard-deserts because we stopped using the pudding style of cooking for main courses, but still used it for desserts to make custards (and thus the names converged). Whereas in England it was originally a main course, but became more of a dessert, and then a synonymn for the dessert course, but still included cake-style puddings. (And historically a few savory puddings, such as black pudding, still exist.)
EDIT: Sources - the Wikipedia article on "pudding", a "history of pudding" timeline on a food history website that came up in my Google search, and (I think) a "Tasting History with Max Miller" TH-cam episode on puddings that I watched a few weeks ago.
Thanks a bundle for another little, historical lesson, knowledge that I pleased to have. Not only for my own pleasure but something that this particular food and word buff looks forward to showing off with.
Sould I just mention that the local Scandinavian black pudding ('blood sausage' ) has been a VERY traditional, local dish, especially at Christmas, ever since our Viking days - and probably earlier.
Merry Christmas
“Haggis-adjacent” is my new profile orientation.
👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Yes, literally no American kid who isn't a GBBO addict (which wasn't a thing when this was made) or doesn't have a historic-baking minded or anglophile parent is going to think "pudding" is anything other than a cold, well, pudding...goopy sweet stuff made from powder pudding mix and chilled in the fridge, or that came out of a plastic pudding cup from a grocery store. Wouldn't call it a custard or know what that meant, either. "Boiled pudding" or calling all dessert "pudding" are completely alien.
@@Eet_Miacan’t speak for the whole country, but in Louisiana we baked bread puddings, they were never boiled. It’s not a custard but contains all the custardy ingredients.
32:52 Can we just mention that Caine's acting here is immaculate? The way he makes you feel the regrets of a broken old man? Or maybe that's just a little too close to home for me right now.
If I remember correctly, Mr. Fezziwig ran a fabric wholesaler. Sold cloth by the bolts or yards, or orders of multiple bolts from the weavers. The open bolts were in a separate cabinet from the “new” bolts. Scraps were sold for a pittance for crafters to earn their own profits. I think Dickens notes about clearing the tables and putting away the bolts and putting up the shutters.
The costume department of this film went HARD with the historically accuracy of the wardrobe for this film. Way more than they needed to.
I wonder too if it wasn't that they were ALLOWED to go hard. A lot of fashions of this period just look very, very silly now--the mob caps and the fichus and the bright purple coats. It's hard to sell a lot of those details to a 2020s audience and not have them laugh through your whole costume drama. But as these are Muppets, and they're silly anyway . . . no reason not to be 100% period-accurate silly.
I’ve always loved this movie for the snippets of actual Dickens peppered throughout. For lines like “As solitary as an oyster” is why we still hold his writing in such high regard. No one could describe a character that perfectly.
And yet oysters aren't solitary. They tend to clump together in oyster reefs. Yet it still works somehow? 😆
@@Brasswatchman I always took it to be talking about how it's alone in its shell
@@AlannaStarcrossed Ah. Kind of like a Dalek. That would make sense.
Also the ALLITERATION. Dickens plays with sound better than just about any writer in canon. All those Ses . . . cold wind . . . fading whispers . . .
Jenny's videos are always a joy, the depth of her knowledge is incredible. If I ever make it to London with my family, I am definitely going to book one of her tours.
1:36 "I don't want to stop it this early, but..."
I have an auntie who is an absolute history buff. Watching movies with her is something like this! She'll stop the movie every time something is historically inaccurate to explain to me in (great) detail how it _actually_ was and why it was like that. ❤
I love how much detail the costumers put into the clothes the muppets wear. How wild is it that they put characters like Rizzo the rat and Gonzo into period appropriate outfits?
I was watching a costumer review the clothes and she pointed out that, based on the way the clothes bunch and move on the puppets, she's pretty sure they're even wearing the right UNDERWEAR!
Obviously it's as accurate as possible because it was narrated by Charles Dickens himself! And his rat friend helped a little too. 😊
Loved this comment ❤️❤️❤️
Little known fact, Salacious Crumb was actually based on Dicken's rat partner
An American note towards the prison costume: kids of that time (like myself) were raised on old Looney Tunes and Tom and Jerry cartoons. They always depicted prisoners in jail in that particular costume so it makes sense the Henson folks would do the same so kids would understand “that’s a jail”. Bars on a window might not mean anything since in some places, houses have/had barred windows as a common thing.
I always thought it was impressive that Charles Dickens managed to do a book adapation of muppets christmas carol before the movie came out
He was quite close to the canonical Muppet version too. Good on him for not messing with perfection.
He was truly ahead of his time
Knowing the Doctor probably helped him quite a bit.
Was excited to see this. My aunt did the costuming on this film ❤
Has she seen the Abby Cox video?!? The costuming for this movie is just so insanely good! I hope she knows how much we love her work for it!
@@shannoncrowder1528 I'll have to ask her!
I hope she knows how many people really appreciate her efforts!
Your aunt is a superstar and the amount of raw serotonin I receive every rewatch when I get to see all the delightful costumes filling up my screen cannot be understated
woahhhh hats off to that lady 🥹🥰
What a lovely and thorough analysis. Really good, thank you.
It's so amazing that you did this comparison, my boyfriend and I were talking about it the other day. He told me, and I verified on the Wiki page, that Michael Caine said ""I'm going to play this movie like I'm working with the Royal Shakespeare Company. I will never wink, I will never do anything Muppety. I am going to play Scrooge as if it is an utterly dramatic role and there are no puppets around me." And he did an incredible job!
Also, we sadly do not grow up knowing what a Christmas pudding is honestly. Not unless you're the strange child who sits in the corner reading books all the time. . . 😂 Although it didn't understand it well until I was an adult and watched GBBS for the first time ❤
@@TheRegisteredNerd GBBS?
@jrnsurlan405 Great British Baking Show ❤️
I'm here for the headwear. Your sartorial sense is on par with Miss Piggy's. And yes, that is obviously a compliment.
One of the things you kept mentioning was how this movie is aimed at very young children. You even said five-year-old several times. What you must keep in mind is that the Muppets had been around since the mid 60s, and popularized on Sesame Street starting in 1969, followed by The Muppet Show in the 70s. The Muppet Christmas Carol wasn’t released until 1992. Most of the fans of the Muppets grew up with them, and at this point were Adults. So, even though a lot of the specific words were modernized and Americanized, as a whole it was as much for adults as for children.
I've always lived how The Muppets has always been accessible to kids and adults!
Thank you! This was the ONE big thing that bugged me about this review. This movie was not made FOR 5 year olds, it was made FOR everyone some of whom _might_ be 5 year olds.
At their best the Muppets always made material that could be enjoyed by both adults AND children
I didn't see the Muppet Christmas Carol until I was 52 (about four years ago). And I think it IS one of the best adaptations! I don't have nostalgia for it. I just think it is tremendously well-done. Michael Caine plays the role of Scrooge perfectly!
Same here! I know that many people consider the Alistair Sim version to be "the classic", but that's only because it was formative for us, not because the adaptation was excellent. I don't think anyone else can hold a candle to Michael Caine's interpretation of Scrooge.
It was an absolute pleasure spending an hour with you talking about all of this! As an American, I would like to apologize for the "Pudding Erasure". Yes the vast majority of people here (especially children) would not have understood references to pudding, in our vernacular, it refers to a very specific type of dessert and would have made no sense in the context.
Pudding cups essily beat real pudding fr fr. USA USA USA USA!!!
As a kid singing We Wish You a Merry Christmas the line about figgy pudding raised some questions, promptly (& correctly) answered by my dad. It never occurred to me until years later that this was a gap in *American* knowledge. I just figured it was something that kids didn't know but adults did. 🤷🏻♀️
I don't believe I've ever seen a British pudding in person, and would have to look up how to make figgy pudding. In my estament, they likely went extinct in the mid 1800's this side of the Ocean.
I teach that song to my students every year and it wasn't until fairly recently that I heard one of the kids singing by himself and he was singing "Now bring us some friggin' puddin'!" I had to go back and reteach and now I always wonder how many years worth of kids learned to sing it like that!
@@urbanpoodle
Agreed. I'm an adult, have spent several months in a country where pudding does not mean what it does in America, and my understanding of everyone-else-pudding is still only "I think it's sort of like a cake, except when it isn't." I was very confused when I was younger and made a pudding recipe from an older cookbook and the result in no way resembled pudding.
This was such a delight to watch. My husband and I drank tea together and watched your video over the course of two evenings once the kids were in bed, and it was a great way to start some discussions of our own. Thank you for your insights.
It made me wonder whether you had seen George C. Scott's performance in the 1987 Christmas Carol. It addresses some of your issues; I'd love to hear your reaction to its portrayal of the themes and character arc.
We do not have Christmas pudding in America. In fact I have had several conversations having to explain what a pudding is, even though I myself have never had one, but most Americans are only familiar with the custard-like dessert pudding. Then to further confuse us Americans I have to add in that pudding is sometimes used as a name for dessert and not just the dish.
They use "tea" to refer to entire meals!
Just like “tea” is a meal & not just a drink.
I suspect "Fuzziwig and Mom" is a reference to the earlier _Muppet Family Christmas_ where Fozzie and pals go and visit his mother for Christmas. And I don't think Fozzie tends to wear shoes--but then, neither does Kermit. That said, Fozzie would be the type to tell a joke about his *bear* feet.
Literally when she pointed that out I was thinking, "Of course he's not wearing shoes, he has BEAR feet" 😂
25:30 to be extremely fair, he does have a nephew. He had to have some form of sibling. It took me *this year* at a play of Christmas Charol to have it pointed out to me that sister must be his nephew's mother. Which puts the tragedy of him wanting to be alone and to be asked by the same side of family again to come for Christmas all the more tragic.
I can’t reiterate this enough that as an American who was once a child, yes, pudding really would’ve COMPLETELY thrown me off. Literally nowhere in American is ‘pudding’ used to refer to the UK version, pudding here only means a custard basically, and pudding cups where especially popular amongst kids, they’re basically just soft custardy, chilled dessert that you’d get in your school lunch. That context of pudding is pretty much all an American child would be exposed to, so boiling pudding is the equivalent of like, boiling ice cream. It would’ve been super confusing.
....I mean, it's a liquid so I def imagined dropping people into a cauldron of like,, Jello brand chocolate pudding.....
I really appreciate that J. Draper called her patrons “Second fathers to Tiny Tim.” That one got me.
I always had a feeling like Dickens wrote the notion of the ghosts coming on three seperate nights in a first draft and then just...never remembered to fix the line in revisions. I do think it says something about the effectiveness of both the scene itself and the story as a whole where theres just that glairing of a "plot hole" but no one (not even the author) really notices it until you specifically look for it.
Thank you for pre-warning us that you don't think this movie is perfect and magical, I really needed to brace myself! There's something about the layer of abstraction provided by puppetry or cartoons that allows for a kind of emotional storytelling that works really well with this sort of story, which I think is why people get so attached to this adaptation and find others difficult to get into.
Yes, American Children would have been VERY confused by the word pudding. When I heard it as a kid in British media, I always pictured what Americans mean by pudding. I wondered why they liked pudding so much.
Tbh banana pudding is delicious but I don't think they have that in the UK.
We have banana Angel Delight - I think. Best not to ask what's in it (no natural ingredients probably). But, it's like a US version of pudding
It's actually kind of nice knowing Dickens had the same foibles a lot of writers do, where when you're releasing something piece by piece (as novels were done at the time), you might mess up some of the continuity and not be able to go back and change it. But also, time being messed with kind of helps with the final wonderful surprise he has at it still being Christmas. He thought he'd gone on and on well into Kwanzaa without getting to make any changes in his life and would have to wait for the next Christmas to really show it.
I didn't think I would want to watch an hour long video about a Muppet movie, but this was a great historical review and I did stay until the end!
One thing i love about michael caines decision to play as if the muppets were people is that it opens an avenue for deeply anaylising how scrooge see people around him. He sees those that work for him as rats and frogs and the women as sows mainwhile those he does see as human are his family and those who are clearly upper class
Wow 🤯 You just changed my entire perception of the movie.
An interesting take, but I wonder if it doesn't interpret into Scrooge's character an elitism that isn't really expressed from him in the book. He is alone, miserly, and miserable, but as far as I know he has never been depicted as classist or elitist or the like.
@adamsmall5598 potentialy. Im not sure how well the human as upper class holds as i havent done a frame by frame analysis of the crowd to see but there is a definetly theme with how scrooges family all being human in his eyes as well as his fiance
@@Ericshadowblade Fair.
I don’t know who said this first, but the best thing about Christmas Carol and Muppet Treasure island is that Michael Caine treated the muppets as if they were actors and Tim Curry treated himself like a Muppet.
43:36 I remember watching the Patrick Stewart one when I was young and the scene with the children under the robe freaked me out it was so scary and has stuck with me to this day. And I imagine it would either be too scary for the muppets or they would make them puppets and it would making the point not work.
Fun fact about the Spirits in this movie. The original plan was that they were supposedly going to use established Muppet characters to portray them but then decided to have them be entirely original creations. And I think that's for the best because I can't think of who I'd pick. Anyone I could think would be a character that was performed by Jim Henson or Richard Hunt who had both recently passed away (the film is dedicated in their memory). And you can tell they didn't want to immediately replace the performers of all their characters (obviously with a few exceptions - Kermit, Statler and Waldorf)
I really enjoyed this video. I'm a massive fan of this version and you brought up some points that I never actually thought about before - mostly the younger Scrooge stuff.
I think Sweetums would've been good as the ghost of present, but Richard Hunt's passing definitely would have made it rough. Uncle Deadly could've been used for future, but really lacked the somber tone. Honestly, it was really good that they all ended up unique muppets (other than the Marleys) in order to help with the tone. If more iconic muppets had held the roles, it wouldve been far more jokey.
The Ghost of Christmas Past puppet was originally filmed in a big tank of baby oil to get that slow moving etheral effect. The team found that the baby oil became difficult to work with and clean from the tank and puppet so filmed the remaining scenes with the puppet submerged in water :)
Thanks! Happy Christmas.
There's a fun little detail from the book this video doesn't mention. (That's not a knock on this video; it's quite long enough as it is.) After he sees Marley's face in the knocker, Scrooge "did pause, with a moment’s irresolution, before he shut the door; and he did look cautiously behind it first, as if he half expected to be terrified with the sight of Marley’s pigtail sticking out into the hall." Michael Caine's Scrooge does this and Gonzo tells Rizzo they need to run inside before he shuts the door, but Rizzo is looking for his jellybeans and Gonzo gets the door slammed in the face. LOL.
This is among my favorite versions. Partly because it is more accurate to the text than a puppet version would normally be expected to be
It is more faithful than non-puppet versions would normally be expected to be!
Which is why I use it in my classroom.
This was such a delightful watch that gave me so many feelings. This is my definitive live version of Christmas Carol. While I love the book for many of the specifics you mentioned, the way the MCC manages to gut punch me with feelings every is just... impressive considering I have watched it nearly every year for nearly 30 years. Even just watching you watch the Tiny Tim scene made me tear up!
07:20 There's an interesting radio interview with Paul Williams, songwriter for The Muppet Christmas Carol, where he recounts his struggle with his own demons around the time of writing, and that coming up with lyrics pertaining to the themes of self-imposed loneliness, redemption, love and, of course, sweet seasonal sentiment proved especially therapeutic. The series was called 'The Sound of Cinema' on BBC Radio 3, it should still be available to listen to.
Wonderful video! I really enjoyed your informative and witty take on my childhood introduction to A Christmas Carol!
"Do you have Christmas puddings in America?" No, it's not at all common. And for Americans, a pudding is what Brits would probably identify as a custard.
(Absolutely love your videos!!)
I'm even more confused now... like you have custard with Christmas Pudding ? The pudding is the cake-like part ? ( if my profile picture didn't make it clear enough I'm British )
@@Beithyr In the US "pudding" exclusively refers to smooth custard like deserts. Chocolate pudding (sort of like chocolate mouse), rice pudding, tapioca pudding. Nothing cake like would be called pudding.
@@Beithyr we don’t have Christmas pudding at all. We think of Christmas pudding as a foreign, extremely British thing (assuming we’ve even heard of it or know what it is)
@@Beithyr As a Brit who has eaten some American 'pudding', I would say that it's generally what we'd call blancmange or perhaps a mousse if it's less set. I don't think I'd describe it as a custard, but maybe there are more custardy types I haven't had.
Thank you all for the clarification!
I grew up with this film, as an American, and I still love it. We watched it alongside the George C Scott 1984 version mostly. Your criticisms are, of course, very valid, and I honestly didn't realize just how good the adaptation was from both the text and the costuming, so this was a joy to watch!
There’s a real sense of dedication to this film. It could very easily have just been some cash grab Muppet movie but it’s clear that the filmmakers really did put their all into this. It’s a surprisingly accurate adaptation of A Christmas Carol for one thing and includes a lot of book dialogue, so it at least shows that someone read the book, unlike some adaptations (cough, 2019 BBC miniseries, cough). It’s also just a plain fantastic film.
PS, I love that they called the second Marley “Robert”. Y’know, as in Bob. Bob Marley.