All I have to say is when I was in college I started a lawn care business and purchased a PB400e Blower, and 3 SRM-2502 Trimmers. I mowed 40 lawns a week by myself the 1st year. My 2nd year I hired 2 employees and we mowed 65 residential lawns a week, a couple shopping centers and apartment complexes. For 2 more years I grew the business and sold the accounts off keeping the Echo equipment. As a police officer I mowed 25-30 lawns on the side, purchased a house with 3 acres, etc. all along using the Echo Blower and Trimmers. I’m now retired and still using the same trimmers and blower around my property. I bought them in 1990 - 34 years ago and they still fire up by the 3rd pull. All I’ve done over those 34 years in put 2 stroke gas / oil mix in the tank, clean and replace the air filters (and replace the carbs 1x on each machine). Show me anything else that can last that long and still run like the 1st year I bought them. I’m sold on Echo…….
I hate to burst you’re bubble but 30+ years ago everything was made like that I have an 031 stihl from 76 that’s almost 50 years old along with a couple other old stihls to your 30+ year-old echoes and still starts on the second or third pull cold with it choked and then first pull every time warmed up and I have multiple other old chainsaws over 40 -50 years old like my old homelites that are in just as good of running shape as your echoes that doesn’t prove anything other than the fact that everyone manufactured quality products 30 plus years ago who’s to say that the new echoes last any longer than anything else nowadays ? Nobody will know until 30 years from now
@@RPeacock1128 I will say, my old man's Stihl FS55 RC, bought I'd guess around 2000? still runs like a champ despite him running 40:1 gas, prob ethanol blend, forever. It will sit for 6+ months and be running in less than 30 seconds.
It would have been nice if they would have shown you an actual cylinder and piston ring under magnification rather than just telling you. Also, there may be a difference but is it a meaningful difference? That said I love my Echo trimmer and chain saw.
Impressive. I can’t believe you worked in LE and still were able to run a business on the side. It’s all I can do to keep up with my own yard, but I do have an Echo trimmer, blower and edger to help.
I was a small engine mechanic for years. I worked on everything. I buy Echo stuff. Echo produces what I consider to be the highest value products that are always easy to start.
Steve Thanks. For the input. I've been cutting full time for the last year and a half. I have a brand new Cs 590 and yes iam with you. Because I listen to you and my saws are blown off and kept spotless on a daily basis then what I noticed was about after 5 to 10 tanks of fuel the 590 lossened up and went better then straight out the box. Mine is Japan assembled. And I also noticed that it's extremely tourqe...... how nice is it to run a saw that has a flywheel heavier then a coke can. Hanging on to a saw for around 10 hours a day then the echo is like driving a European car on a long trip compared to say a taxi! Man oh man Steve. I've said it before you have made me the man I am in the industry that I am today. It's not bullshit it's just all food shit. I can't wait to buy the 74 cc echo. I'd give up all my other saws just to run a full echo/ shindiawa set up. I don't care what anyone believes because Echo is the rolls Royce of small engines in the chainsaw world. You are the only trick I need in my box of tricks out in the forest!
I have used all kinds and brands of lawn care equipment but when I got my first Echo string trimmer, I was done. I now own everything Echo and they run great if you take care of them and I won't have anything else.
Years ago when in a small engine repair shop discussing the "best" trimmers, I asked the owner which one he repaired the least often and which one he used. He carried all the big name brand stuff and I fully expected him to say "Stihl", he said "Echo".
And if it was 15 to 20 years ago, He would have definitely said "Shindaiwa". The old school stuff was the very best, then they merged with Echo and rid themselves of most of the Shindaiwa engineers.
@@robkocol5664 Shindaiwa's were the BEST before Echo ruined them. I bought a T-25 for $40 that needed a fuel line & grommet.... He said gas was probably a few years old, I emptied it & put 110 leaded VP race fuel at 25:1 mixed with Saber. 1st pull it started & ran ok, after running a few minutes & adjusting the carb it runs great. "First to start last quit" isn't promoted anymore since Echo ruined them.
@@robkocol5664 I have one with a paddle drum head for lawn cleaning and still running strong. I also have an echo trimmer and back pack blower, love echo
1) I have an Echo chain saw and love, love it. 2) I'm a big fan of Japanese products in general, especially when metal is involved. Japanese knives, scissors, utility blades, limb loppers, pliers - even nail clippers - pretty much blow everything else out of the water. The craftsmanship is real and once you try it you never want to go back. So the Echo may not be better in every aspect but I believe that the metal finishing probably is better.
As a homeowner, I like all my ECHO products. String trimmer, blower, and five chainsaws. They are easy to start, easy to maintain, and their customer service is excellent.
I have an Echo trimmer and an Echo blower/vacuum. I've had both of these for over 20 years and have done basically nothing to either. I also have a Homelite blower and was told when I bought it that it wouldn't last and after 18 years it still is going strong. I do believe that Echo makes a very high quality product. Looking forward to your next video.
Big topic here. For anyone really interested in the cylinder surface roughness topic, look up some RVK and RPK engine machining videos. There’s a whole science to how peaky the cylinder surfaces are like mountain tops, how deep the valleys are for oil retention and lubrication, how far apart the peaks are, and if the peaks should be knocked down into plateaus in the honing process. All kinds of factors influence the right combo like fuel type, 2 stroke or 4 stroke, compression ratio, boosted or NA, ring type, etc, but unfortunately most of the videos seem to talk about 4 stroke. A 2 stroke deep dive video would be very interesting.
My 20+ years with echo, they make (or did) a great engine and complementary parts. I am still running them. I’ve only replaced a card on my blower, the string trimmer has been fantastic and I beat the shit out of it for last 20+ years. I want to buy a new one but it won’t die
I have 2 Echo chainsaws & 2 Echo trimmers .. won't buy anything else . I don't run professional, but often do projects for family / freinds . No problems for 7 years . I keep them clean & maintained . The shop I bought them from had an engine cut in half on the wall so you could see the quality !! I believe it !
I was taught that you need the microscopic groves to hold oil so you don't wipe the rings by having metal to metal contact. I'm a retired diesel tech, so I don't know much about 2 strokes.
Always like to hear your take on things … Re: Echo engines… like the ones in weed wackers… they’re tough as nails … so long as you use high octane gas and good oil .. they’re indestructible… same goes for their chain saws .. I found them both to be very dependable.. easy to maintain … once you’re used to the echo.. you don’t want to use another product …
My MS 520 chain saw is almost 20 years old and has cut fire wood every year, to this day I have never even change the spark plug! No lie, start third pull every time after sitting for months at a time. I run Amsoil saber at 80 to 1 with non oxy fuel. I adjusted the carb when I first got it and haven't touched it since. Recoil rope had to be replaced last year. Lots of chains and a few bars and sprocket, but over all it is incredible!!
I've had my Shindaiwa T-27 weedeater over 30 years. Just this year I finally put in a new spark plug. It runs perfectly and would cut your leg off haha. But I also have my dad's old Echo weedeater as well, it runs great also. Cool video Steve, thanks!!
This is not just a small engine thing, this is a thing in virtually all internal combustion engines that have pistons. They put a specific finish on the cylinder based on what the piston rings are made of. There are all kinds of theories and recipes for building an engine. It all depends on what your goal is. You can't really say one is better way than the other. I have always considered Stihl, Husky and Echo the big three. They all make great products that will last a long time if treated right.
I cut my firewood year after year with a 40+ year old echo saw. It has so much compression that it hurts to start it sometimes. A few peripheral parts have needed attention, like the chain tensioner, for example, otherwise a new plug and air filter every 5 years or so. Awesome, durable saw
I've been using echo products for years. The thing I love about them is that no matter how long they've sat there they will start! I know other lawn care companies that buy other brands and brag about how good they are. Then I see them buy two or three bc the one they just bought broke! I will only use echo why because they've never let me down. I love the price power and reliability and I love their do it yourself kits! Try finding that with any other brand.
you don't want a too smooth of a cylinder, that's why there are cross hatch patterns which help to hold the oil on the cylinder for lubrication, oil not only lubes but also helps to seal and cool the engine
I do like my Echo Power Equipment. No issues so far. But I am a certified microscopist and I suspect with enough magnification and field of view there could be differences. Which obviously the smoother the bore the performance should be better. But a great Marketing point regardless. Keep up the great videos Steve. Really enjoy your videos.
I have been cutting dogwood pasture brush with a retro-fitted steel blade on my Echo SRM-225 string trimmer for about 6 or 8 years, really working it hard for hours at a time without a problem. It will cut small brush stems about an inch or 2 in diameter like butter, but the blade will get stuck and immediately stop on most of the bigger 3 or 4 inch stems if I'm applying too much pressure. When that happens, the engine keeps running normally and I just keep using the blade and running wide open against that brush until it claws through there. That clutch that protects the turning parts must be bullet proof because this happens all the time, thousands of times over the years and it's still like new. I would think the sudden stops would be really hard on the mechanism, but so far it doesn't seem to have hurt it at all. I love this machine. It starts right up on the 2nd or 3rd pull every time and the only thing I've ever done to is put on a new carb and fuel lines since the day I bought it. The only thing I can't figure out is why I occasionally get an electric shock on my elbow when it touches the plastic spark plug cover. I've seen other owners complain of this same condition and I've learned to keep my elbow away from the spark plug wire and cover. But even with that, the toughness of this little weed-whacker turned brush-cutter has convinced me that Echo products are so much better than the other junk out there. So many machines are built cheaply and built for planned obsolescence, but this one doesn't seem to be. So, I am an Echo customer for life. I just wish I knew which Echo model to buy next after this SRM-225 finally quits since I know they don't make this model any more.
Echo is the longest lasting in the industry. They are wonderful Japanese engineered engines. When nothing else starts, an Echo will! Just like a honda ,Suzuki, kawasaki, and yamaha!
I purchased a residential echo model trimmer and have been using it 3 yrs now as I build my lawncare business. It still runs great and it gets used 90 percent of the time as it seems im always stuck with edging and trimming the properties lol. My friend who typically mows has a stihl and though it is a tad stronger it seems to have issues more often while it is used very infrequently. Personally i love how lightweight the echo is too.
I believe it, right out the box my Echo 2620T was a game changer, I clipped the guard and cut the line trimmer off so is to get a wider swath and the torque head makes that happen. Plus the Black diamond line wears out at the tip into a little needle which make the cuts more fine and easier, I "one hand" the whip now. Even my old srm 230 Echo was a beast using Ugly Line. This is 8 years of lawn care experience from me.
I think a convex profile on a ring as you said has much less area of contact with the cylinder wall and would bypass combustion gases quicker than a conventional ring.
My buddy builds high end racing engines for IMSA sports car series. They have been doing this for years..and those are 9000 rpm, 1000 horsepower motors.
As an Mechanical Engineer I'd say the explanation is possible BUT with that said how the engine was cast/tempered/annealed and what material they used (IE composed of) would matter more. There is so much material science and engineering in these engines that it's almost never one issue that causes something to fail.
Dunno if true but I love my CS2511P. Did the muffler mod and adjusted the carb. Supposedly adds 20% more power. It definitely makes a noticeable difference. Incredibly light and mean 4lb machine. You can also purchase a less restrictive muffler for it.
I bought my house 21 years ago, and bought an Echo trimmer and backpack leaf blower shortly after. Both are running just like the day I brought them home. Yes, I am a stickler for maintenance. But Echo makes a Hell of a machine. I'd never switch brands.
I don't dispute any of this. I have a 28 year old Echo pole hedger with many hours of commercial use and still going strong. A 22 year old CS510 saw that is still going strong, and a 15 year old trimmer that still runs perfectly. Many, many hours on all of these tools and still tons of compression.
We would need surface finish specifications to understand this. There are values that describe peaks and valleys as well as the particular profile. All this determine the ability to hold lubrication as well as sealing.
My only experience with echos is their top handles. I Have a 271 and a 2511. Both have been fantastic since the second I opened the box. The 2511 is probably my favorite saw to run.
From WC, I’ve had two Echo trimmers in the last 40 years, gave the first one to a neighbor 20 years ago then bought a new 210i I believe it’s called, easier to start! Use good gas and oil, other than that trimmer string, which isn’t the easiest to change, other than that I’ve used the 2nd one for the last 20 years and still use it every week! I bought the handlebar option because I feel it is easier to handle! I did have to buy a new belt harness last year but it is 100% better than the one that came with the trimmer when I bought it new!
All I know is I bought a stihl backpack blower 15 years ago the dealer had a hard time starting it.. it’s always been a pain in the ass.. finally last year I bought an echo backpack middle of the road it’s starts and runs great… not quit as much power as the stihl.. but it runs when you start it!
my brother just retired an Echo curved shaft string trimmer he uses on the farm. He inherited it from my dad and he bought it in 1979. 45 years. Pretty hard to ask for more than that.
I bought one echo gas blower and from the time I first tried to start it , it would only start one time and never restart . It was in the shop at least 5 times , it ended up in a garage sale and I bought a stihl.
I have learned over the years that if you get what you pay for when it comes to these tools. I was also told by a couple different dealers that the more economical models are not even made by the true manufacturers but are approved and branded by them. I am not sure if I believe that or not but I always start at the mid level models when considering a new purchase.
Echo SRM 260 SS shaft 23 years old still going strong. Go through 1000 feet of line every two years. I will run it 4 hours at a time, I have a big place. Runs like a top.
I bought an Echo leaf blower around 25 years ago using it just at my residence, not commercially. It had the vacuum attachment so i used it a lot in the fall to clean up leaves. It worked fine and it lasted about 8 years before it just wore out. I replaced it with a husqvarna leaf blower and I got a troy bilt leaf vacuum so I only use the blower for blowing grass now. I'm on my 2nd husqvarna and I seem to wear out whatever brand I use in about 8 years. I like the husqvarnas just as much as the first Echo I bought.
I'm a two stroke mechanic for a fairly large dealer and i have said for years husqvarna , sthil and others will not run under 100 psi compression but i have seen many echos run in the 90's i thought it was funny you brought this up and could not explain it but i have seen it happen many times.
@@husky268 it was a great point for a pro like Steve to bring up. I have a 50 rancher that measured 87 when I got it and started easy and ran great, just wouldn't pull a toddler off a toilet seat. It's at 160 now and a very different animal.
I’m not a 2 stroke expert but I would imagine it has to do with the harmony of the transfer ports, pulse line and carb. The others probably need the higher compression for the diaphragm to move enough fuel and for the carb to atomize it correctly.
If I have this correct, the cross hatch serves multiple purposes. One is to seat the rings during break in by abrading the rings to conform to the irregularities on the cylinder. I would imagine the convex rings will wear/seat to the point of being square on the sides quickly due to the small contact area. This also may be necessary with the smoother hone on the cylinder to get the rings to seat. It is possible to hone a cylinder too ‘smooth’ and the rings never seat properly.
I have an old echo trimmer that's got to be close to 40 years old. Just personal use but it still runs great and I am not too kind to it. Other than it weighs a ton compared to newer ones, no complaints. I also have a newer echo pole saw that I can really depend on. Good products in my book.
I have several Stihl chainsaws, 2 Echos, and one Husqvarna…I will say my Echos are top shelf…the little 2511t is a little jewel!…I could believe the sales pitch…
I’ve been using the same Echo blower and string trimmer for the last 26 years now and have done nothing to them except change fuel lines and air filter. I don’t know if they are the best but they were the best $150 a piece I’ve ever spent.
I have five Echo chainsaw, two of which are ported and one Echo brush trimmer and am satisfied. As for finish, I installed a 620 jug onto a 590 and was surprised at how rough the finish was on the exhaust port. I spent a good bit of time polishing it before I installed.
I used to teach an hvac service school for a large U.S. based manufacturer. Yes, there were talking points like the one around a certain type of compressor valve assembly that open/closed 42 times per second. Sometimes techs disputed this claim as BS propaganda…I had never observed these valves in operation so I didn’t truly know if it was a fact. However, I pointed out that a hummingbird can flap its wings more than 50 times per second…one thing is true, if you teach BS to technicians, they’ll eventually hate you for it and even trash your brand. So I’m inclined to believe the Echo school, even though I’ve never owned one of their products.
Only have good things to say bout my Echo equipment, so far.... Previously owned 2 Ryobi whackers.... Echo replaced both of them.... reliability, design, and function. So, when looking for a dependable, backpack, leaf blower, me went straight to Echo. No regrets.
I have an Echo SRM260 trimmer that I’ve been using for 20+ years to trim and edge our 4 acre property. Other than plugs, filters and tank grommets, zero maintenance required. Starts in no more than 3 pulls every time. Have even used it with a chainsaw-type brush cutter blade to take down saplings and vines. No issues. Decided to get a new trimmer this season, was talked into buying a Stihl FS70. It works, but takes way too many pulls to start, and is much noisier than the old Echo.
I was given an echo weed eater 16 years ago used never done any work to it runs like a champ have two mile long driveways I will eat both sides every two or three weeks.
Have an Echo chainsaw, backpack blower and a bump feed trimmer. Never had an issue starting any of the equipment. Trimmer is 6 years, chainsaw5 years and blower 3 years old. Run all 3 out of fuel prior to winter storage. Never an issue refiring in the spring with fresh fuel mix. Would recommend to any homeowner.
I was ready to chime in and start bragging about my fs110 trimmer that I've had for 15 years. I am blown away by all the rave reviews from Echo owners.
I bought a used ECHO string trimmer 17 years ago it is still going strong. Talking to a city arborist, I asked what chainsaw they used Echo. Then he said he had a Stihl at home and the ECHO started easier. I bought two ECHO pro aborist saw and their pro 59cc. We cut 12 cord of wood a year. And if they would build a lawn tractor I would have one.
I went to a service school back in the early '80s it was the introduction of the CS 500 EVL and we all had saws and disassembled them they had us take the rings off the piston then hold the cylinder bore up and drop the piston inside with our fingers over the spark plug hole The piston floated on the air in the cylinder until you let your finger off and then it went clank when it hit the bottom then you put your finger over it and turned it upside down and the piston wouldn't fall out until you let your finger off and then it fell right out then you changed pistons with a guy on your right put his in your cylinder and it did the same so yes I'm very impressed with their precision at least in the older stuff for sure
Id have to say it was true. Ive only worked on two Echos: a trimmer was given to me - all i did was rebuild the carb and I've had it for 20 years. Still runs strong. The other was a friends chainsaw. He had a box of spare parts and wanted me to piece one together for him - some were damaged/abused by his workers & the rest were OEM new parts in the box. I was quite impressed with the detail that went into those saws. My friend would not use anything else in his company, as a tree trimmer/arborist. I told him I was so impressed with what I saw, that his Echos were as good as my Stihls.
I have an Echo CS-400 with an 18 inch bar that has been absolutely flawless. I also have a Stihl FS70R trimmer that has been a giant pain in the ass since day two. I hate it with a passion. My next trimmer will be Echo and I'm about to order a CS 7310PW with a 32" bar from my local dealer
I have a law/landscape business for 30 years now. I’ve used them all. Still,Husqy, Redmax, currently Echo. Saws, blowers, line trimmers, hedge trimmers… I will say my current Echo equipment is the best I’ve ever used. Reliable, powerful, some tools are very lightweight. I have had problems with the other equipment. I used to be a Redmax guy. When things broke, they would not honor their warranty. So I’m finished with Redmax. I personally feel like Stihl is overpriced and over rated. I absolutely love all my Echo equipment.
Ive got an echo blower i bought at a pawn shop in 1994 Ive put a spark plug in it once just because i thought its not a bad idea Cleaned the air filter a few times Never had a carb kit It doesnt get used a lot now but it still runs fine
That surface finish can be measured with a tool called a profilometer. It reads in micro-inches or the metric equivalent basically describing how deep the scratches are. You can also visually do the same comparing known coupons. Those channels and grooves are filled with oil which will stay there due to capillary action. Less channels means less oil. Less oil means less compression as it helps with ring seal. Unless the marketeer provided dimensions with actual units and not a hand drawn image, it's all just gobble-gobble. There is a range where the surface finish works well. Anywhere in there it's fine. Ring geometry can be a tricky topic. But claiming a special ring grind in yard equipment sounds like marketeering to me since anything other than a straight finish would be more expensive. I race two strokes in karts and have never read about special shaped rings. Instead of going on about something he probably doesn't fully understand, he should really be providing expected lifetimes for the different units. That would be meaningful.
I have definitely seen the 90 psi reading on Echo trimmers that ran perfectly. As far as their honing skills, I can’t say if it’s significant or not, but I doubt it. One could make the argument that the rough surface holds more oil so pick your favorite. Might have to get Project Farm involved for testing!
I will have to agree on the quality control Echo has because I see very few of them in for repairs. As for the magnification of the cylinder bores I think this is a bit of technical garbage some engineer thought up to teach at a training seminar. As someone else stated if you magnify anything enough, it will appear to be very rough.
I'm more a 4-stroke guy, and a highly trained auto tech of almost 30 years, so take my thoughts lightly. I'm a Husqvarna guy first. Always liked my friend's Stihls. Echo has caused me headaches in the past new out of the box for various reasons which made me switch fully away about 12 years ago. He could be telling the truth about what you would see under a microscope. My first question, would this be better long term? Seems the rings would have trouble seating to their full potential quickly. Does that matter much on a 2-stroke? I don't know, but rings are there for a reason. Much like in auto engine building, you want certain lubrication, rings, pistons, cylinders with different applications. Also, would this change lubrication properties on the wall and piston long or short term, new vs old? Second, did this happen by design, or was it found later and turned into marketing? Again, is it good or bad for the engine and in turn good or bad for marketing? I don't have enough experience beyond being able to fix anything I touch. I never liked working on small engines, esp 2-strokes, until the last few years. Thanks to people like you teaching and giving good info. Thanks, Steve.
Another older auto tech here. I used to hate small engine work but found this channel a few years ago. It's a breath of fresh air vs new car electrical and computer shenanigans. But, in 4 stroke cars the specific finish of the cylinder walls is very important and specific for the rings to seal and to hold oil to lubricate the piston. The exact finish is highly guarded and highly invested in information in NASCAR teams. It's been analyzed to death at great cost in great detail. To cut to the chase - smoother is not always better, and usually worse. So for Echo to claim finer machining under a microscope on a cylinder bore, and put the qualifier that you have to cut a cylinder in half, just reeks of hollow marketing wank-a-teering. I would assume in a 2 stoke the cylinder lubrication is different (idk) but still. To be clear I am not doubting the quality of the Echo product.
Interesting insights Steve! I've had plenty of small 2T engines running on less that 120PSI just fine. Sometimes difficult to start, but there are usually other factors that cause the difficulty starting. PSI is not the only reason. Cheers!
Honing procedures & piston ring technology have come along way in recent years for the automotive world. Sounds like Echo is using that new technology as well! I hope they have!
I have an exho straight shaft home depot trimmer that is more than 15 years old and still going strong. Mowed commercially for about 2 years of that. Never changed the plug or air filter. Only the head once from usingon cement and rocks on my hillside average. Ran smooth on the first day. Incredibly smooth. Would and will be an echo as the next one. I wantt to try their timber wolf or saws
All I have to say is when I was in college I started a lawn care business and purchased a PB400e Blower, and 3 SRM-2502 Trimmers. I mowed 40 lawns a week by myself the 1st year. My 2nd year I hired 2 employees and we mowed 65 residential lawns a week, a couple shopping centers and apartment complexes. For 2 more years I grew the business and sold the accounts off keeping the Echo equipment. As a police officer I mowed 25-30 lawns on the side, purchased a house with 3 acres, etc. all along using the Echo Blower and Trimmers. I’m now retired and still using the same trimmers and blower around my property. I bought them in 1990 - 34 years ago and they still fire up by the 3rd pull. All I’ve done over those 34 years in put 2 stroke gas / oil mix in the tank, clean and replace the air filters (and replace the carbs 1x on each machine). Show me anything else that can last that long and still run like the 1st year I bought them. I’m sold on Echo…….
Helluva testimonial.
I hate to burst you’re bubble but 30+ years ago everything was made like that I have an 031 stihl from 76 that’s almost 50 years old along with a couple other old stihls to your 30+ year-old echoes and still starts on the second or third pull cold with it choked and then first pull every time warmed up and I have multiple other old chainsaws over 40 -50 years old like my old homelites that are in just as good of running shape as your echoes that doesn’t prove anything other than the fact that everyone manufactured quality products 30 plus years ago who’s to say that the new echoes last any longer than anything else nowadays ? Nobody will know until 30 years from now
@@RPeacock1128 I will say, my old man's Stihl FS55 RC, bought I'd guess around 2000? still runs like a champ despite him running 40:1 gas, prob ethanol blend, forever. It will sit for 6+ months and be running in less than 30 seconds.
It would have been nice if they would have shown you an actual cylinder and piston ring under magnification rather than just telling you. Also, there may be a difference but is it a meaningful difference? That said I love my Echo trimmer and chain saw.
Impressive. I can’t believe you worked in LE and still were able to run a business on the side. It’s all I can do to keep up with my own yard, but I do have an Echo trimmer, blower and edger to help.
I was an Echo dealer in 1976 in Ct. I still have and use my 452 saw and trimmer. These things don't quit. Low RPM High Torque. Love them!
Have an echo chainsaw for 30 years, worked its butt off, still going strong
Same here - it’s my favorite saw!
I was a small engine mechanic for years. I worked on everything. I buy Echo stuff. Echo produces what I consider to be the highest value products that are always easy to start.
Steve I don’t care what anyone thinks except you. Great teacher.
Thank You...
Steve Thanks. For the input. I've been cutting full time for the last year and a half. I have a brand new Cs 590 and yes iam with you. Because I listen to you and my saws are blown off and kept spotless on a daily basis then what I noticed was about after 5 to 10 tanks of fuel the 590 lossened up and went better then straight out the box. Mine is Japan assembled. And I also noticed that it's extremely tourqe...... how nice is it to run a saw that has a flywheel heavier then a coke can. Hanging on to a saw for around 10 hours a day then the echo is like driving a European car on a long trip compared to say a taxi! Man oh man Steve. I've said it before you have made me the man I am in the industry that I am today. It's not bullshit it's just all food shit. I can't wait to buy the 74 cc echo. I'd give up all my other saws just to run a full echo/ shindiawa set up. I don't care what anyone believes because Echo is the rolls Royce of small engines in the chainsaw world. You are the only trick I need in my box of tricks out in the forest!
I have the Echo 355T 620pw and 7310 saws and an Echo trimmer. They have been bulletproof. Top notch equipment.
I have used all kinds and brands of lawn care equipment but when I got my first Echo string trimmer, I was done. I now own everything Echo and they run great if you take care of them and I won't have anything else.
I haven't bought a trimmer or blower for over 20 years since I bought my Echo's. Bought and echo chainsaw 3 years ago. Runs perfect.
Years ago when in a small engine repair shop discussing the "best" trimmers, I asked the owner which one he repaired the least often and which one he used. He carried all the big name brand stuff and I fully expected him to say "Stihl", he said "Echo".
And if it was 15 to 20 years ago, He would have definitely said "Shindaiwa". The old school stuff was the very best, then they merged with Echo and rid themselves of most of the Shindaiwa engineers.
@@robkocol5664 An excellent comment Rob we noticed the same thing here at Eliminator Performance the Shindaiwa was a quality piece of equipment .
@waynestefinashen239 Eliminator performance another go to website.
@@robkocol5664 Shindaiwa's were the BEST before Echo ruined them. I bought a T-25 for $40 that needed a fuel line & grommet.... He said gas was probably a few years old, I emptied it & put 110 leaded VP race fuel at 25:1 mixed with Saber. 1st pull it started & ran ok, after running a few minutes & adjusting the carb it runs great. "First to start last quit" isn't promoted anymore since Echo ruined them.
@@robkocol5664 I have one with a paddle drum head for lawn cleaning and still running strong. I also have an echo trimmer and back pack blower, love echo
1) I have an Echo chain saw and love, love it.
2) I'm a big fan of Japanese products in general, especially when metal is involved. Japanese knives, scissors, utility blades, limb loppers, pliers - even nail clippers - pretty much blow everything else out of the water. The craftsmanship is real and once you try it you never want to go back. So the Echo may not be better in every aspect but I believe that the metal finishing probably is better.
As a homeowner, I like all my ECHO products. String trimmer, blower, and five chainsaws. They are easy to start, easy to maintain, and their customer service is excellent.
I have an Echo es400 chain saw starts every time and it’s 10 plus years old. It’s not used every day, but has never let me down.
I have an Echo trimmer and an Echo blower/vacuum. I've had both of these for over 20 years and have done basically nothing to either. I also have a Homelite blower and was told when I bought it that it wouldn't last and after 18 years it still is going strong. I do believe that Echo makes a very high quality product. Looking forward to your next video.
Big topic here. For anyone really interested in the cylinder surface roughness topic, look up some RVK and RPK engine machining videos. There’s a whole science to how peaky the cylinder surfaces are like mountain tops, how deep the valleys are for oil retention and lubrication, how far apart the peaks are, and if the peaks should be knocked down into plateaus in the honing process. All kinds of factors influence the right combo like fuel type, 2 stroke or 4 stroke, compression ratio, boosted or NA, ring type, etc, but unfortunately most of the videos seem to talk about 4 stroke. A 2 stroke deep dive video would be very interesting.
Good dude right here. Really enjoy and learn from Steve’s channel. 👍
My 20+ years with echo, they make (or did) a great engine and complementary parts. I am still running them. I’ve only replaced a card on my blower, the string trimmer has been fantastic and I beat the shit out of it for last 20+ years. I want to buy a new one but it won’t die
We have been using Echo products since the 90's. They work great for us and we have some of their first products.
I have 2 Echo chainsaws & 2 Echo trimmers .. won't buy anything else . I don't run professional, but often do projects for family / freinds . No problems for 7 years . I keep them clean & maintained . The shop I bought them from had an engine cut in half on the wall so you could see the quality !! I believe it !
I was taught that you need the microscopic groves to hold oil so you don't wipe the rings by having metal to metal contact. I'm a retired diesel tech, so I don't know much about 2 strokes.
I love Echo equipment, I have weedeater, chainsaw, blower, trimmer, and echo motor on my mantis tiller! Great equipment!
Owner of an Echo blower - no issues with it at all and sounds as good as the day I bought it 4 years ago with no maintenance.
Always like to hear your take on things … Re: Echo engines… like the ones in weed wackers… they’re tough as nails … so long as you use high octane gas and good oil .. they’re indestructible… same goes for their chain saws .. I found them both to be very dependable.. easy to maintain … once you’re used to the echo.. you don’t want to use another product …
My MS 520 chain saw is almost 20 years old and has cut fire wood every year, to this day I have never even change the spark plug! No lie, start third pull every time after sitting for months at a time. I run Amsoil saber at 80 to 1 with non oxy fuel. I adjusted the carb when I first got it and haven't touched it since. Recoil rope had to be replaced last year. Lots of chains and a few bars and sprocket, but over all it is incredible!!
I've had my Shindaiwa T-27 weedeater over 30 years. Just this year I finally put in a new spark plug. It runs perfectly and would cut your leg off haha. But I also have my dad's old Echo weedeater as well, it runs great also. Cool video Steve, thanks!!
I've owned 5 echo products. Long great service out of all them.
This is not just a small engine thing, this is a thing in virtually all internal combustion engines that have pistons. They put a specific finish on the cylinder based on what the piston rings are made of. There are all kinds of theories and recipes for building an engine. It all depends on what your goal is. You can't really say one is better way than the other. I have always considered Stihl, Husky and Echo the big three. They all make great products that will last a long time if treated right.
I cut my firewood year after year with a 40+ year old echo saw. It has so much compression that it hurts to start it sometimes. A few peripheral parts have needed attention, like the chain tensioner, for example, otherwise a new plug and air filter every 5 years or so.
Awesome, durable saw
From my experience, Echo Chainsaw and Echo trimmer, it sounds true to me. Thanks for the explanation.
I've been using echo products for years. The thing I love about them is that no matter how long they've sat there they will start! I know other lawn care companies that buy other brands and brag about how good they are. Then I see them buy two or three bc the one they just bought broke! I will only use echo why because they've never let me down. I love the price power and reliability and I love their do it yourself kits! Try finding that with any other brand.
you don't want a too smooth of a cylinder, that's why there are cross hatch patterns which help to hold the oil on the cylinder for lubrication, oil not only lubes but also helps to seal and cool the engine
I do like my Echo Power Equipment. No issues so far. But I am a certified microscopist and I suspect with enough magnification and field of view there could be differences. Which obviously the smoother the bore the performance should be better. But a great Marketing point regardless. Keep up the great videos Steve. Really enjoy your videos.
I have been doing landscaping commercially for 10 years echo is all i buy.
EVERY landscaper in my area uses Echo. I think that says a lot.
I have been cutting dogwood pasture brush with a retro-fitted steel blade on my Echo SRM-225 string trimmer for about 6 or 8 years, really working it hard for hours at a time without a problem. It will cut small brush stems about an inch or 2 in diameter like butter, but the blade will get stuck and immediately stop on most of the bigger 3 or 4 inch stems if I'm applying too much pressure. When that happens, the engine keeps running normally and I just keep using the blade and running wide open against that brush until it claws through there. That clutch that protects the turning parts must be bullet proof because this happens all the time, thousands of times over the years and it's still like new. I would think the sudden stops would be really hard on the mechanism, but so far it doesn't seem to have hurt it at all. I love this machine. It starts right up on the 2nd or 3rd pull every time and the only thing I've ever done to is put on a new carb and fuel lines since the day I bought it. The only thing I can't figure out is why I occasionally get an electric shock on my elbow when it touches the plastic spark plug cover. I've seen other owners complain of this same condition and I've learned to keep my elbow away from the spark plug wire and cover. But even with that, the toughness of this little weed-whacker turned brush-cutter has convinced me that Echo products are so much better than the other junk out there. So many machines are built cheaply and built for planned obsolescence, but this one doesn't seem to be. So, I am an Echo customer for life. I just wish I knew which Echo model to buy next after this SRM-225 finally quits since I know they don't make this model any more.
Echo is the longest lasting in the industry. They are wonderful Japanese engineered engines. When nothing else starts, an Echo will! Just like a honda ,Suzuki, kawasaki, and yamaha!
I purchased a residential echo model trimmer and have been using it 3 yrs now as I build my lawncare business. It still runs great and it gets used 90 percent of the time as it seems im always stuck with edging and trimming the properties lol. My friend who typically mows has a stihl and though it is a tad stronger it seems to have issues more often while it is used very infrequently. Personally i love how lightweight the echo is too.
I believe it, right out the box my Echo 2620T was a game changer, I clipped the guard and cut the line trimmer off so is to get a wider swath and the torque head makes that happen. Plus the Black diamond line wears out at the tip into a little needle which make the cuts more fine and easier, I "one hand" the whip now. Even my old srm 230 Echo was a beast using Ugly Line. This is 8 years of lawn care experience from me.
12.45 am i love Echo because they are lighter to use especially the top handle as i am getting older.
that beer is getting warm
I think a convex profile on a ring as you said has much less area of contact with the cylinder wall and would bypass combustion gases quicker than a conventional ring.
My buddy builds high end racing engines for IMSA sports car series. They have been doing this for years..and those are 9000 rpm, 1000 horsepower motors.
@@bdixon2668 Are they torn down and rebuilt after every race?
@@brianwaskow5910no..they’ll run a season..
@@brianwaskow5910with zero weight oils..
I have an old Echo string trimmer that has been used and abused for maybe a decade. That thing starts after a few pulls and runs like a champ.
True, they are a great product.
As an Mechanical Engineer I'd say the explanation is possible BUT with that said how the engine was cast/tempered/annealed and what material they used (IE composed of) would matter more. There is so much material science and engineering in these engines that it's almost never one issue that causes something to fail.
Dunno if true but I love my CS2511P. Did the muffler mod and adjusted the carb. Supposedly adds 20% more power. It definitely makes a noticeable difference. Incredibly light and mean 4lb machine. You can also purchase a less restrictive muffler for it.
I bought my house 21 years ago, and bought an Echo trimmer and backpack leaf blower shortly after.
Both are running just like the day I brought them home.
Yes, I am a stickler for maintenance. But Echo makes a Hell of a machine. I'd never switch brands.
Echo is the only tools I've owned that always start on the second pull when cold and the first pull when warm. That's all I buy!
I don't dispute any of this. I have a 28 year old Echo pole hedger with many hours of commercial use and still going strong. A 22 year old CS510 saw that is still going strong, and a 15 year old trimmer that still runs perfectly. Many, many hours on all of these tools and still tons of compression.
We would need surface finish specifications to understand this. There are values that describe peaks and valleys as well as the particular profile. All this determine the ability to hold lubrication as well as sealing.
You are right : rugosity, Ra, wearing area, and all these stuffs
My only experience with echos is their top handles. I Have a 271 and a 2511. Both have been fantastic since the second I opened the box. The 2511 is probably my favorite saw to run.
I just got a 2511 tn man what an amazing saw.
Love my echo saws, I own 3 since 2000 still run, very dependable.
From WC, I’ve had two Echo trimmers in the last 40 years, gave the first one to a neighbor 20 years ago then bought a new 210i I believe it’s called, easier to start! Use good gas and oil, other than that trimmer string, which isn’t the easiest to change, other than that I’ve used the 2nd one for the last 20 years and still use it every week! I bought the handlebar option because I feel it is easier to handle! I did have to buy a new belt harness last year but it is 100% better than the one that came with the trimmer when I bought it new!
All I know is I bought a stihl backpack blower 15 years ago the dealer had a hard time starting it.. it’s always been a pain in the ass.. finally last year I bought an echo backpack middle of the road it’s starts and runs great… not quit as much power as the stihl.. but it runs when you start it!
I've had a Echo leaf blower/vac for 20+ yrs. I think I have had the carb replaced a couple o' times but it works GREAT!
my brother just retired an Echo curved shaft string trimmer he uses on the farm. He inherited it from my dad and he bought it in 1979. 45 years. Pretty hard to ask for more than that.
I have one from 1978, runs like a top!
I bought one echo gas blower and from the time I first tried to start it , it would only start one time and never restart . It was in the shop at least 5 times , it ended up in a garage sale and I bought a stihl.
I have learned over the years that if you get what you pay for when it comes to these tools. I was also told by a couple different dealers that the more economical models are not even made by the true manufacturers but are approved and branded by them. I am not sure if I believe that or not but I always start at the mid level models when considering a new purchase.
If you want one, you better buy it now before a bigger company buys them and goes the profit route.
Already happened 30 years ago
They are owned by Shindaiwa
It ruined Homelite. From good solid machines to plastic crap!
@@billstiles487 Yeah, keep Huskys damn hands off them!
@@jbboltsthey are owned by Yamabiko Corp
Echo SRM 260 SS shaft 23 years old still going strong. Go through 1000 feet of line every two years. I will run it 4 hours at a time, I have a big place. Runs like a top.
I bought an Echo leaf blower around 25 years ago using it just at my residence, not commercially. It had the vacuum attachment so i used it a lot in the fall to clean up leaves. It worked fine and it lasted about 8 years before it just wore out. I replaced it with a husqvarna leaf blower and I got a troy bilt leaf vacuum so I only use the blower for blowing grass now. I'm on my 2nd husqvarna and I seem to wear out whatever brand I use in about 8 years. I like the husqvarnas just as much as the first Echo I bought.
I'm a two stroke mechanic for a fairly large dealer and i have said for years husqvarna , sthil and others will not run under 100 psi compression but i have seen many echos run in the 90's i thought it was funny you brought this up and could not explain it but i have seen it happen many times.
It'll run, but not ideal. Cripes, I have seen 2-strokes from the 70's and 80's run at 60 PSI, but they don't idle worth a dang.
@@husky268 it was a great point for a pro like Steve to bring up. I have a 50 rancher that measured 87 when I got it and started easy and ran great, just wouldn't pull a toddler off a toilet seat. It's at 160 now and a very different animal.
I’m not a 2 stroke expert but I would imagine it has to do with the harmony of the transfer ports, pulse line and carb. The others probably need the higher compression for the diaphragm to move enough fuel and for the carb to atomize it correctly.
yes i have seen this same thing im also a small engine mechanic and echo will run with compression low when nothing else will run.
I have an echo chain saw 16in I use it a couple times a year and it’s 9 years old.
It’s fantastic!
If I have this correct, the cross hatch serves multiple purposes. One is to seat the rings during break in by abrading the rings to conform to the irregularities on the cylinder. I would imagine the convex rings will wear/seat to the point of being square on the sides quickly due to the small contact area. This also may be necessary with the smoother hone on the cylinder to get the rings to seat. It is possible to hone a cylinder too ‘smooth’ and the rings never seat properly.
Thank you, Steve. Well said and well explained. We all value your opinions.
I have an old echo trimmer that's got to be close to 40 years old. Just personal use but it still runs great and I am not too kind to it. Other than it weighs a ton compared to newer ones, no complaints. I also have a newer echo pole saw that I can really depend on. Good products in my book.
I have several Stihl chainsaws, 2 Echos, and one Husqvarna…I will say my Echos are top shelf…the little 2511t is a little jewel!…I could believe the sales pitch…
I've got a 35 year old Echo strimmer, granted I only use it a couple of times a year but have never changed anything on it and it runs great.
I have a Echo line trimmer that is 25 years old this summer and runs great, I do take really good care of it, I believe Echo is what they claim.
Husky and Stihl have served me very well; both chainsaws and weed eaters. Never tried an Echo.
I’ve been using the same Echo blower and string trimmer for the last 26 years now and have done nothing to them except change fuel lines and air filter. I don’t know if they are the best but they were the best $150 a piece I’ve ever spent.
I have five Echo chainsaw, two of which are ported and one Echo brush trimmer and am satisfied. As for finish, I installed a 620 jug onto a 590 and was surprised at how rough the finish was on the exhaust port. I spent a good bit of time polishing it before I installed.
I used to teach an hvac service school for a large U.S. based manufacturer. Yes, there were talking points like the one around a certain type of compressor valve assembly that open/closed 42 times per second. Sometimes techs disputed this claim as BS propaganda…I had never observed these valves in operation so I didn’t truly know if it was a fact. However, I pointed out that a hummingbird can flap its wings more than 50 times per second…one thing is true, if you teach BS to technicians, they’ll eventually hate you for it and even trash your brand. So I’m inclined to believe the Echo school, even though I’ve never owned one of their products.
Only have good things to say bout my Echo equipment, so far....
Previously owned 2 Ryobi whackers.... Echo replaced both of them.... reliability, design, and function. So, when looking for a dependable, backpack, leaf blower, me went straight to Echo. No regrets.
I have an Echo SRM260 trimmer that I’ve been using for 20+ years to trim and edge our 4 acre property. Other than plugs, filters and tank grommets, zero maintenance required. Starts in no more than 3 pulls every time. Have even used it with a chainsaw-type brush cutter blade to take down saplings and vines. No issues. Decided to get a new trimmer this season, was talked into buying a Stihl FS70. It works, but takes way too many pulls to start, and is much noisier than the old Echo.
Hey I gave early 80’s
SRM2400 still going strong. If well maintained and use correct mix they should last very long time
I was given an echo weed eater 16 years ago used never done any work to it runs like a champ have two mile long driveways I will eat both sides every two or three weeks.
My most careful friend sold me on echo, after many others ive heard say the same. Thanks Steve.
Have an Echo chainsaw, backpack blower and a bump feed trimmer. Never had an issue starting any of the equipment. Trimmer is 6 years, chainsaw5 years and blower 3 years old. Run all 3 out of fuel prior to winter storage. Never an issue refiring in the spring with fresh fuel mix. Would recommend to any homeowner.
As an auto mechanic and professor, I would like to see the cutaways comparison under microscope and post on site, good video Steve 😀👍
I was ready to chime in and start bragging about my fs110 trimmer that I've had for 15 years. I am blown away by all the rave reviews from Echo owners.
My husky 266XP purchased in 1989 has and still is running just fine.
I bought a used ECHO string trimmer 17 years ago it is still going strong. Talking to a city arborist, I asked what chainsaw they used Echo. Then he said he had a Stihl at home and the ECHO started easier. I bought two ECHO pro aborist saw and their pro 59cc. We cut 12 cord of wood a year. And if they would build a lawn tractor I would have one.
Man… I love your channel
I went to a service school back in the early '80s it was the introduction of the CS 500 EVL and we all had saws and disassembled them they had us take the rings off the piston then hold the cylinder bore up and drop the piston inside with our fingers over the spark plug hole The piston floated on the air in the cylinder until you let your finger off and then it went clank when it hit the bottom then you put your finger over it and turned it upside down and the piston wouldn't fall out until you let your finger off and then it fell right out then you changed pistons with a guy on your right put his in your cylinder and it did the same so yes I'm very impressed with their precision at least in the older stuff for sure
Id have to say it was true. Ive only worked on two Echos: a trimmer was given to me - all i did was rebuild the carb and I've had it for 20 years. Still runs strong. The other was a friends chainsaw. He had a box of spare parts and wanted me to piece one together for him - some were damaged/abused by his workers & the rest were OEM new parts in the box. I was quite impressed with the detail that went into those saws. My friend would not use anything else in his company, as a tree trimmer/arborist. I told him I was so impressed with what I saw, that his Echos were as good as my Stihls.
I have an Echo CS-400 with an 18 inch bar that has been absolutely flawless. I also have a Stihl FS70R trimmer that has been a giant pain in the ass since day two. I hate it with a passion. My next trimmer will be Echo and I'm about to order a CS 7310PW with a 32" bar from my local dealer
I switched all my lawn care and chainsaws over to echo 7 years ago, never going back to husky or sthil
I have a law/landscape business for 30 years now. I’ve used them all. Still,Husqy, Redmax, currently Echo. Saws, blowers, line trimmers, hedge trimmers… I will say my current Echo equipment is the best I’ve ever used. Reliable, powerful, some tools are very lightweight. I have had problems with the other equipment. I used to be a Redmax guy. When things broke, they would not honor their warranty. So I’m finished with Redmax. I personally feel like Stihl is overpriced and over rated. I absolutely love all my Echo equipment.
Ive got an echo blower i bought at a pawn shop in 1994
Ive put a spark plug in it once just because i thought its not a bad idea
Cleaned the air filter a few times
Never had a carb kit
It doesnt get used a lot now but it still runs fine
Yes, I think it's true, because are you Steve?You're the best.🇺🇲
That surface finish can be measured with a tool called a profilometer. It reads in micro-inches or the metric equivalent basically describing how deep the scratches are. You can also visually do the same comparing known coupons. Those channels and grooves are filled with oil which will stay there due to capillary action. Less channels means less oil. Less oil means less compression as it helps with ring seal. Unless the marketeer provided dimensions with actual units and not a hand drawn image, it's all just gobble-gobble. There is a range where the surface finish works well. Anywhere in there it's fine. Ring geometry can be a tricky topic. But claiming a special ring grind in yard equipment sounds like marketeering to me since anything other than a straight finish would be more expensive. I race two strokes in karts and have never read about special shaped rings. Instead of going on about something he probably doesn't fully understand, he should really be providing expected lifetimes for the different units. That would be meaningful.
I have 3 Echos and a Stihl chainsaw. My Echos are my First choice.
I have definitely seen the 90 psi reading on Echo trimmers that ran perfectly. As far as their honing skills, I can’t say if it’s significant or not, but I doubt it. One could make the argument that the rough surface holds more oil so pick your favorite. Might have to get Project Farm involved for testing!
I will have to agree on the quality control Echo has because I see very few of them in for repairs. As for the magnification of the cylinder bores I think this is a bit of technical garbage some engineer thought up to teach at a training seminar. As someone else stated if you magnify anything enough, it will appear to be very rough.
I'm more a 4-stroke guy, and a highly trained auto tech of almost 30 years, so take my thoughts lightly. I'm a Husqvarna guy first. Always liked my friend's Stihls. Echo has caused me headaches in the past new out of the box for various reasons which made me switch fully away about 12 years ago.
He could be telling the truth about what you would see under a microscope. My first question, would this be better long term? Seems the rings would have trouble seating to their full potential quickly. Does that matter much on a 2-stroke? I don't know, but rings are there for a reason. Much like in auto engine building, you want certain lubrication, rings, pistons, cylinders with different applications. Also, would this change lubrication properties on the wall and piston long or short term, new vs old?
Second, did this happen by design, or was it found later and turned into marketing? Again, is it good or bad for the engine and in turn good or bad for marketing?
I don't have enough experience beyond being able to fix anything I touch. I never liked working on small engines, esp 2-strokes, until the last few years. Thanks to people like you teaching and giving good info. Thanks, Steve.
Another older auto tech here. I used to hate small engine work but found this channel a few years ago. It's a breath of fresh air vs new car electrical and computer shenanigans. But, in 4 stroke cars the specific finish of the cylinder walls is very important and specific for the rings to seal and to hold oil to lubricate the piston. The exact finish is highly guarded and highly invested in information in NASCAR teams. It's been analyzed to death at great cost in great detail. To cut to the chase - smoother is not always better, and usually worse. So for Echo to claim finer machining under a microscope on a cylinder bore, and put the qualifier that you have to cut a cylinder in half, just reeks of hollow marketing wank-a-teering. I would assume in a 2 stoke the cylinder lubrication is different (idk) but still. To be clear I am not doubting the quality of the Echo product.
I own all 3 of them echo stihl and Husqvarna . Can't tell a difference in them .
Interesting insights Steve! I've had plenty of small 2T engines running on less that 120PSI just fine. Sometimes difficult to start, but there are usually other factors that cause the difficulty starting. PSI is not the only reason. Cheers!
Honing procedures & piston ring technology have come along way in recent years for the automotive world. Sounds like Echo is using that new technology as well! I hope they have!
Have a mid 70's John Deere made by Echo. It has cut a lot of wood and still runs like a champ.
I have an exho straight shaft home depot trimmer that is more than 15 years old and still going strong. Mowed commercially for about 2 years of that. Never changed the plug or air filter. Only the head once from usingon cement and rocks on my hillside average. Ran smooth on the first day. Incredibly smooth. Would and will be an echo as the next one. I wantt to try their timber wolf or saws
I have an Echo trimmer and chainsaw. Both run great and are never a problem. Can't say the same for a Stihl I have. ✌
Yep I haven't had good experiences with stihl equipment always problems they never want to run. My echo stuff starts right up runs good