It's very rare that I'll watch an entire video from anyone if it's over 15 to 20 minutes, but I watched this in its entirety. Excellent video! I've been hunting with a muzzleloader since 1988, and I've used a Savage ML since 2003. For most of those years, my muzzleloader was the only firearm I used for deer. For the first several years, I spent a lot of time contributing over at Doug's message board. I really enjoyed the video. I never made the jump to a sabotless 45 barrel, but it's still something I'd really like to do some day.
Luke is basically using UML or Ultimate Muzzle Loader system. Randy Johnston was doing the same stuff over a dozen years ago He used a 45 win mag case and magnum rifle primer but shot BP substitute. Remington now uses his system
You and many talk about cleaning and deep cleaning the barrel. Using 62 grains of IMR4198 behind a Parker .45 cal 310gr Black Max Hollow Base sized to .450" is a great fit down my barrel for the first 5 to 6 shots. After that point the powder build up makes seating the bullet crazy tight so I brush the barrel one pass through followed by a dry patch. Then I'm back in business. So many ways to retain accuracy and functionality. One thing not covered that I have found using this bullet is that it has a certain amount of springback in the metal after sizing the bullet. If the bullet is stored over night and not used that day makes it super tight ram rodding it down the barrel. So I run each bullet through the sizing die three times using lubricant so as not to gall the jacket and retains proper sizing. Enjoyed your pod cast video very much!
My grandpa and his friend started making smokeless muzzleloaders in the late 80s converting break open shotguns and machining a breach plug and having barrels custom made. Mine is on an H&R frame and I love that thing.
I can say that in South Dakota, our muzzleloader rules for big game require a minimum of .50 for pistols, and .45 for rifles. It actually says for instance with rifles, "capable of firing a .50 caliber projectile." But, most use saboted .45's. Also, we can't use 'magnified' optics. So, sidelock, inline, weatherproof actions are all ok, sabots ok, red dots ok. Muzzleloaders on Turkeys ok......
Guys, I killed a White-tailed Deer at 237 measured yards with a Traditional 50 caliber CVA Hawkin, with iron sights, in fading light from the Prone position. All of these rifles, modern inline or traditional, are RIFLES! If you understand the importance of the Seven fundamentals of marksmanship, especially trigger control which is the most important of all the fundamentals, you can shoot whichever type of rifle at distance. Practicing at distance is second in line. Learn to shoot and shoot well. Find a qualified Instructor or a Certified Coach and learn, check your ego at the door and learn how to shoot. You cannot buy a championship with just equipment.
Yes and no . What youre shooting is No Comparison to the rifle that a custom modern SML/BH209 built muzzleloader IS . Not even in the same league . And to try to make that comparison between the rifles abilitys is wishfull thinking . Yes it is all up to the trigger puller but without the equipment the disadvantages stack up like cord wood !!!
I got the traditions asslerater flintlock stainless steel barrel synthetic stock 1&48 twist and iron night sites, I site in for 100yards i feel good hitting out to 150 to 200 yards if need be using full boar bullets
Three shots with my TC 54 cap and ball iron sights and no antelope. Borrowed my sons 50 cal CVA inline that has a cabelas 44 mag BDC 3x9 scope. I blame my aging eyes.
@@dustindunham2135 yeah, the remington kit is better than the musket cap, but still let's a lot of junk back into bolt. Here's the kit I have for it. www.arrowheadrifles.com/product/700ml-replacement-plug/
Badger Ridge also offers the custom bolt head / breech plug kit for the 700ml . ASG and Bader Ridge both offer the Best 209 ignition upgrades for the 700ml made hands down .
Many areas are open to muzzle loaders because they are considered short range and safe for those areas. My concern is we will lose areas to hunt with these long range weapons and they will no longer be considered “primitive”. Some states may eliminate the muzzle loader season since they no longer have any handicap versus “modern” firearms.
I can’t believe after 20 years of shooting sabot shotgun slugs and giving up shooting them out of semi-auto rifled shotguns, did i final here the reason why the accuracy goes to sh-t. That the hot barrel is melting the sabot’s, thank you, It really isn’t as material with sabot rifled slugs and a smooth bore barrel 🎉 thanks great show!!!!
I’d me more than happy to take that “old outdated” omega x7 off your hands 😉..have one just like it..along with 4 other omegas that I’ll never part with
@@msa4548 they are awesome rifles…I don’t own any t/c rifles after s&w took over the company but the ones I do have are all awesome shooters and very well built, from the x7 to the dream season omega, to my 2 standard ss omegas. All great rifles
@@msa4548 eBay,,you can usually find a laminate stock every couple of months for between 100-200$ of all the omegas have they are all in wood laminate stocks, much more comfortable to shoot
as long as you use powered fffg Triple Seven and Pyrodex they will work fine in a Hawkins(cap lock) rifle just fine.. never load pellet type you will learn how to pull a load the hard way :)
If for nothing else, a flintlock should have been displayed as an example of how our Founding Fathers took this country away from England. And...the American Riflemen did shoot quite long distances during the War of Independence.
I started deer hunting back in the early 80s, and it will never be the same, as far as how commercialized it is now. To me it's just not as fun as it used to be.
would have been nice if you held up your props from time to time. You have 3 guns on the table and NEVER picked any of them up to show the audience. That was disappointing.All we can see is the bottom of the rifles with ? Very good discussion, not a good presentation. 😀
I don’t know what they are talking about not being able to use modern powders in percussion cap muzzle losers I have used pyrodex in my percussion cap for years and have never had a failure to ignite
They werent talking about pyrodex . What was refered to was blackhorn 209 powder . You try that and your ignition system lacks the heat to ignite that powder . Its ALOT MORE POTENT !!!
Well it's because there NOT using black powder or black powder substitutes , there using Smokeless powder, you basically need to detonate with modern primer
Black powder or subs PACKED TIGHTLY UNDER PRESSURE Does Respond with a More Power . No it wont self ignite . Smokeless powder Does NOT Yield the same results .
Longer hunting season for muzzle loaders is not worth the effort and money to invest in as a project or business, but it is interesting to see the development of modernization from a primitive tool to where they are today with the development of center fire , but for the one"s that live in liberal zone cities or states I can see the effort.
Well let me tell you all right now $5,500 for one of these muzzleloaders is just plain stupid. Somebody needs to look at what the hell they're doing and lower the price on these things. My 30-06 will shoot just as far. So there's really no need for me to have this gun. Drop the price I'll bet you sell more cuz 5500 is just ridiculous that's beyond top of the line precision rifle. I got a 338 win mag brand new out of the box high polish stainless $1,400. got to bring these things back into reality man I can see 2500 maybe 3 Grand that's it no more
I agree to a degree as to price . But a True Custom centerfire costs the same !!! These arent factory built guns so that alone makes your point invalad . You can also build one yourself only buying the parts if desired . Theres more desireability with these state of the art muzzleloaders than you think !!! For one that 338s power would find itself LACKING !!!
When you talk about custom builds be it a gun or rifle, a piece of furniture, a fishing rod or a car engine, what your really paying for is the excellence in workmanship. Plus the knowledge that there are very few pieces out there built to the same standard. If you are basing your views just on price then a factory gun in a good brand is more up your alley. But: if you love quality of build and you know what your dream rifle is and how you would like it made. How you want it personalised and satisfaction of owning such a piece counts for so much more. Are they good value? It really depends on how well they perform-and how you view what you get out of owning the piece you use.
So, first it was primitive arms, now we've reinvented the wheel. What's the point? Just cause it's easier doesn't make it better. Less challenge, if that's your bag. Don't get it. Just commercialization ruining the sport.
And any sub lites off with a MAG Spark 209 conversion ,at least in my 12 Renegade/Hawken/H+A under hammers ! You 2 should learn the subject before attempting to inform the public ,you are just talking trash /Luke is into smokeless so he doesn"t pretend to know much on BP/traditional stuff .He builds quality high end inlines for folks with DEEP pockets /just sayin
What you say is true to a degree but not completely . While that magspark enables you it also is shooting a bullet out of a antiquated rifled barrel in twist rate and groove depth . As far as cost of a built rifle goes i agree it is too expensive . Ive built 1 myself and started another for Much Less . I wont go back to the old tech either having enjoyed the state of the art . You honestly cant knock what you havent experianced !!!
![เปิดบ้าน โคตรสวย ป๋องกพล รู้จักตั้งนาน เพิ่งรู้ว่ารวย!!! l [Nickynachat]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/tmgCF_2HfYI/mqdefault.jpg)
It's very rare that I'll watch an entire video from anyone if it's over 15 to 20 minutes, but I watched this in its entirety. Excellent video! I've been hunting with a muzzleloader since 1988, and I've used a Savage ML since 2003. For most of those years, my muzzleloader was the only firearm I used for deer. For the first several years, I spent a lot of time contributing over at Doug's message board. I really enjoyed the video. I never made the jump to a sabotless 45 barrel, but it's still something I'd really like to do some day.
Luke is basically using UML or Ultimate Muzzle Loader system. Randy Johnston was doing the same stuff over a dozen years ago He used a 45 win mag case and magnum rifle primer but shot BP substitute. Remington now uses his system
You and many talk about cleaning and deep cleaning the barrel. Using 62 grains of IMR4198 behind a Parker .45 cal 310gr Black Max Hollow Base sized to .450" is a great fit down my barrel for the first 5 to 6 shots. After that point the powder build up makes seating the bullet crazy tight so I brush the barrel one pass through followed by a dry patch. Then I'm back in business. So many ways to retain accuracy and functionality. One thing not covered that I have found using this bullet is that it has a certain amount of springback in the metal after sizing the bullet. If the bullet is stored over night and not used that day makes it super tight ram rodding it down the barrel. So I run each bullet through the sizing die three times using lubricant so as not to gall the jacket and retains proper sizing. Enjoyed your pod cast video very much!
4198 is for smokeless actions your comment mite blow someone up you should make that clear talking on muzzleloader sites.
My grandpa and his friend started making smokeless muzzleloaders in the late 80s converting break open shotguns and machining a breach plug and having barrels custom made. Mine is on an H&R frame and I love that thing.
I can say that in South Dakota, our muzzleloader rules for big game require a minimum of .50 for pistols, and .45 for rifles. It actually says for instance with rifles, "capable of firing a .50 caliber projectile." But, most use saboted .45's. Also, we can't use 'magnified' optics. So, sidelock, inline, weatherproof actions are all ok, sabots ok, red dots ok. Muzzleloaders on Turkeys ok......
Guys, I killed a White-tailed Deer at 237 measured yards with a Traditional 50 caliber CVA Hawkin, with iron sights, in fading light from the Prone position. All of these rifles, modern inline or traditional, are RIFLES! If you understand the importance of the Seven fundamentals of marksmanship, especially trigger control which is the most important of all the fundamentals, you can shoot whichever type of rifle at distance. Practicing at distance is second in line. Learn to shoot and shoot well. Find a qualified Instructor or a Certified Coach and learn, check your ego at the door and learn how to shoot. You cannot buy a championship with just equipment.
Well said
Yes and no . What youre shooting is No Comparison to the rifle that a custom modern SML/BH209 built muzzleloader IS . Not even in the same league . And to try to make that comparison between the rifles abilitys is wishfull thinking . Yes it is all up to the trigger puller but without the equipment the disadvantages stack up like cord wood !!!
I got the traditions asslerater flintlock stainless steel barrel synthetic stock 1&48 twist and iron night sites, I site in for 100yards i feel good hitting out to 150 to 200 yards if need be using full boar bullets
What sort of bullet?
Three shots with my TC 54 cap and ball iron sights and no antelope. Borrowed my sons 50 cal CVA inline that has a cabelas 44 mag BDC 3x9 scope. I blame my aging eyes.
Really enjoyed this, gonna have to watch this again ,take some notes and research . Too much information for my old brain to absorb! Thanks!
Late to the show but look up Jeff Hankins Muzzleloader from 4 years ago using Smokeless Powder Gun Builder from Kentucky
Still love my Savage ML, but Doug's message board was a real life saver.
it is cool to hear a technical conversation you can learn from versus the typical it shoots video.
I have a Remington 700 ml like you were showing converted mind over to use 209 primers still hunt with a during Muzzleloader season love the gun
Remington made the 209 kit for a couple years
@@dustindunham2135 yeah, the remington kit is better than the musket cap, but still let's a lot of junk back into bolt. Here's the kit I have for it. www.arrowheadrifles.com/product/700ml-replacement-plug/
Badger Ridge also offers the custom bolt head / breech plug kit for the 700ml . ASG and Bader Ridge both offer the Best 209 ignition upgrades for the 700ml made hands down .
Many areas are open to muzzle loaders because they are considered short range and safe for those areas. My concern is we will lose areas to hunt with these long range weapons and they will no longer be considered “primitive”. Some states may eliminate the muzzle loader season since they no longer have any handicap versus “modern” firearms.
I can’t believe after 20 years of shooting sabot shotgun slugs and giving up shooting them out of semi-auto rifled shotguns, did i final here the reason why the accuracy goes to sh-t. That the hot barrel is melting the sabot’s, thank you, It really isn’t as material with sabot rifled slugs and a smooth bore barrel 🎉 thanks great show!!!!
Loved the info and details you shared on muzzleloaders, im just starting to research info and have to say this is by far very informative, thank you….
Wish T/C still made the omega
Bring back that crossfire optic you talked about. That would be so nice for South Dakota muzzleloader hunting!
Yeah, can't use smokeless for muzzy season in Utah.
And if you think the Gibbs is crazy, check out what the Whitworth is capable of.
I'm after a front stuffer. The new generation look beautiful don't they
I’d me more than happy to take that “old outdated” omega x7 off your hands 😉..have one just like it..along with 4 other omegas that I’ll never part with
T/C new bone collector version still isn't as interesting to me as my Omega. I have one and still check gun broker for more.
@@msa4548 they are awesome rifles…I don’t own any t/c rifles after s&w took over the company but the ones I do have are all awesome shooters and very well built, from the x7 to the dream season omega, to my 2 standard ss omegas. All great rifles
@@tcburgess2939 mine is a ss synthetic stock model. Though I'd like to find another one with the laminated stock.
@@msa4548 eBay,,you can usually find a laminate stock every couple of months for between 100-200$ of all the omegas have they are all in wood laminate stocks, much more comfortable to shoot
I have shot pyrodex for years in my hawkin rifle
as long as you use powered fffg Triple Seven and Pyrodex they will work fine in a Hawkins(cap lock) rifle just fine.. never load pellet type you will learn how to pull a load the hard way :)
If for nothing else, a flintlock should have been displayed as an example of how our Founding Fathers took this country away from England. And...the American Riflemen did shoot quite long distances during the War of Independence.
It was great meeting y’all at shot show 2020.
You too! :D
Does Like have a website for his rifles?
Yes - www.arrowheadrifles.com/
This guest sounds like he’s about to cry.
smokeless powder was the first "black powder substitute"
that's right!
good content
Thanks!
I started deer hunting back in the early 80s, and it will never be the same, as far as how commercialized it is now. To me it's just not as fun as it used to be.
A few myths and misconceptions in here about black powder.
O speaking og Muzzle loading , How about 223 WSSM
Sold my ML for a Savage 220 instead.
Land of entrapment has muzzleloader and primitive muzzleloader, regardless no optics.
Not trying to be too critical but it is pronounced Lop-wa not la-poo-a
He said nipple
How about the gun works,,,
Or how much is respectful
would have been nice if you held up your props from time to time. You have 3 guns on the table and NEVER picked any of them up to show the audience. That was disappointing.All we can see is the bottom of the rifles with ? Very good discussion, not a good presentation. 😀
I don’t know what they are talking about not being able to use modern powders in percussion cap muzzle losers I have used pyrodex in my percussion cap for years and have never had a failure to ignite
They werent talking about pyrodex . What was refered to was blackhorn 209 powder . You try that and your ignition system lacks the heat to ignite that powder . Its ALOT MORE POTENT !!!
Well it's because there NOT using black powder or black powder substitutes , there using Smokeless powder, you basically need to detonate with modern primer
Guy in the red shirt sounds as if he is tired and is boring to listen to plz make him take a nap
Wish You could buy all guns mail order to the door. #sad
We can dream, can't we? ;)
Compression will (NEVER) activate BLAck POWDER ,suprised Luke should know better and the other 2 sound like NOOBIES!/Ed
Black powder or subs PACKED TIGHTLY UNDER PRESSURE Does Respond with a More Power . No it wont self ignite . Smokeless powder Does NOT Yield the same results .
Longer hunting season for muzzle loaders is not worth the effort and money to invest in as a project or business, but it is interesting to see the development of modernization from a primitive tool to where they are today with the development of center fire , but for the one"s that live in liberal zone cities or states I can see the effort.
Your opinion only as far as desireability for seasons go .
Well let me tell you all right now $5,500 for one of these muzzleloaders is just plain stupid. Somebody needs to look at what the hell they're doing and lower the price on these things. My 30-06 will shoot just as far. So there's really no need for me to have this gun. Drop the price I'll bet you sell more cuz 5500 is just ridiculous that's beyond top of the line precision rifle. I got a 338 win mag brand new out of the box high polish stainless $1,400. got to bring these things back into reality man I can see 2500 maybe 3 Grand that's it no more
I agree to a degree as to price . But a True Custom centerfire costs the same !!! These arent factory built guns so that alone makes your point invalad . You can also build one yourself only buying the parts if desired . Theres more desireability with these state of the art muzzleloaders than you think !!! For one that 338s power would find itself LACKING !!!
When you talk about custom builds be it a gun or rifle, a piece of furniture, a fishing rod or a car engine, what your really paying for is the excellence in workmanship. Plus the knowledge that there are very few pieces out there built to the same standard. If you are basing your views just on price then a factory gun in a good brand is more up your alley. But: if you love quality of build and you know what your dream rifle is and how you would like it made. How you want it personalised and satisfaction of owning such a piece counts for so much more. Are they good value? It really depends on how well they perform-and how you view what you get out of owning the piece you use.
So, first it was primitive arms, now we've reinvented the wheel. What's the point? Just cause it's easier doesn't make it better. Less challenge, if that's your bag. Don't get it. Just commercialization ruining the sport.
And any sub lites off with a MAG Spark 209 conversion ,at least in my 12 Renegade/Hawken/H+A under hammers ! You 2 should learn the subject before attempting to inform the public ,you are just talking trash /Luke is into smokeless so he doesn"t pretend to know much on BP/traditional stuff .He builds quality high end inlines for folks with DEEP pockets /just sayin
What you say is true to a degree but not completely . While that magspark enables you it also is shooting a bullet out of a antiquated rifled barrel in twist rate and groove depth . As far as cost of a built rifle goes i agree it is too expensive . Ive built 1 myself and started another for Much Less . I wont go back to the old tech either having enjoyed the state of the art . You honestly cant knock what you havent experianced !!!