I feel like the solution is simpler than you're thinking: "You each get one uncommon and one rare magic item. Please submit them to me beforehand for approval."
Yes this and Chris should not have suggested DMs pick items for players because I know for a fact many DMs will refuse to give players any good items based off of this and it will merely become an exercise in frustration.
@@Kai-K "you have to plan for the worst as you can only hope for the best" you should plan around the dm being a bad actor just as you should plan around the players being a bad actor if it comes up so your ready for a nut job power gamer wants to try and take the spotlight or a tyrant dm that wants to make there players suffer
@@teeteenine2222 If every game was planned around both the DM and players being bad actors, none of my campaigns would have ever progressed. "We should go help that screaming lady!" "What if its a ploy for muggers? What if the DM steals all of our stuff, horse, and cart from the inn while we're gone? What if screaming woman is a CR 20 demon here to kill us, the level 3 party?" "We should take this quest!" "What if it's a trap from the BBEG and we all will die? (what if theft from inn, etc) What if we get paid in fake money? What if at the most critical roll, the DM fakes things against us?" "I'll reward my players with a bag of holding!" "What if they do some weird powergame stuff with it, like filling it with 500 lbs of bricks and turning it inside out on the boss? What if they just lie about how much stuff is in it? What if they all add it to their sheets, each pretending to misunderstand who has it?" It's just nonsensical. You can hedge your bets a little and not give your players the opportunity to *accidentally* do something problematic, but you should not have to plan around people trying to disrupt the game.
@@Kai-K @Soketzu Applesauce A plan is not a action you should have a plan for IF a player or dm wants to fuck you over and you won't use it IF they don't for example "What if they all add it to their sheets, each pretending to misunderstand who has it?" the plan would be talk to them and get them to agree on which player has it "What if they do some weird powergame stuff with it, like filling it with 500 lbs of bricks and turning it inside out on the boss?" this one takes a bit to set up so you can cook up your plan around it when they start the setup and plan for if they do it like lets say it dose however many d whatever bludgeoning damage with a dc? dexsave for halve in a 15ft cone in front of them it as a bit of homebrew "What if it's a trap from the BBEG and we all will die?" well these are things you should be thinking about as a player if you have a cupel enemy's in high places they might set up a honeypot to get the drop on you tricking you in to doing a crime, fetching a thing they need to do bad thing, or in to a trap just to kill you out right for a much higher price that you normally get for a job like whatever they are saying your doing and it can be a good plot point and the dm and player might see it as cool if you see thru it and save the party's hide "What if we get paid in fake money?" well irl people check to see if you have given them counterfeit money all the time or just counting the money to see that its all there and this could be a role playing moment the pc's shoot the shit for a hour as they count out and check the money and if the dm is nice that could be a short rest for the party "What if at the most critical roll, the DM fakes things against us?" I ask the dm to roll in the open for this reason for most thing rolling in the open is fine stealth and slight of hand should be kept in the dark unless someone see it using there perception but other rolls are fine in the open it keeps all player honest with one another even if that means we git by a crit our dm dose not what us to if you are going to roll dice for let the dice decide other wise what's the point of rolling them "What if its a ploy for muggers?" have your weapons ready if this wakes you up take some time to slip on your armor before heading out "What if the DM steals all of our stuff, horse, and cart from the inn while we're gone?" you could have a alarm spell set up. or some locks on your containers to buy time for you get back. take the horse with you so they have to have there own horse to take the cart "What if screaming woman is a CR 20 demon here to kill us, the level 3 party?" you could run tell the party to split up if its just one guy it will only be able to fallow one of you tell the party to meet at a guard house or some thing like that and get help from the town guards on the way you are not always going act on these plans but its good to have them in case they happen
I was in the kitchen, listening while washing the dishes. It was sooo strange that I hade to stop and repeat that part just to be sure i didn't space out and miss something xD Best.Intro.Ever.
DM: "Ok, we're starting at 5th level, and I'm letting everyone pick one Rare item to start with." Problem player: "I pick Helm Of Teleportation and teleport the party away from whatever you have planned for us. Three times per day." DM: "Joke's on you, we're playing Dungeon of the Mad Mage."
@@thedootlord All Teleportation/Planar travel spells fail when trying to enter or leave the dungeon, or to move from one level to another. There are a few loopholes but it mostly keeps the guard rails on.
Acc to DMG, its an uncommon magic item if its a high magic campaign. But everyone is different. If the scene had been me and my group: Me, DM "We start at level 5, you all get 1 rare magic item-" Player "I pick helm of teleport!" Me, "you all get 1 rare magic item (lifts paper sheet) from this list. And no, helm of teleport is not on the list." My thoughts: _i hope he doesnt notice the voyager necklace which is a reskinned teleport helm_
I would disagree with the fact that rarity is worthless, it is simply unreliable. 80% or more magic items are fine (if at times a bit weaker) in their tier. 20% or less are one, in extremely rare cases two rarities off. As a decently experienced dm I let the player's choose, but I price every item and decide when an item is in the wrong rarity and fix it. An inexperienced dm should either seek council when handing out magic items, be very careful or just have an understanding with your players that when a mistake is made you will fix it since you are inexperienced. I will add that an inexperienced dm making or handing out items can do more damage than letting the players pick them for two reasones 1)The dm will surely make at least one mistake due to inexperience with how characters and items work and what character want out of items or are even able to use, for example, "oh yes I'll give the wizard a bag of holding and the fighter a +1 weapon but now you gave a member a utility item that serves the whole party and the other a straight combat power upgrade, these things frequently result in creating potentially bigger imbalance gaps than the players could've created themselves, assuming goodwill 2)If those gaps appear the fault is solely of the dm and is harder to explain to a player that the item you picked was busted and you must take it away, whereas giving a concession makes it easier for a player (in most cases) to accept the situation and find a second pick
An unreliable standard is worthless, though. If you can't count on the standard to apply and you aren't familiar with game balance, you can't use it. At least with CR the effects will only last for one encounter, a magic item stays for the campaign unless you make the VERY unpopular move of using DM powers to steal the item back. At least CR gives you the EXP earned from defeating it, Rarity's only function is what makes it dangerous. Not to mention how balanced some items seem on face value, but turn out to be much stronger than anticipated. The tattoo and staff of the python both appear to be fairly balanced on the first or second read, but they are game breaking. Not to mention that there are plenty of items in the same tier that have literally no mechanical effect. Without any of those issues, it is already unusable. Using it requires a total overhaul of the system, from reassigning value to every item in the game to determining at what tier each item should be handed out.
To be honest... it's pretty much worthless. 1. You can't compare accurately between "Rarities" at all. Compare Winged Boots, Instruments of the Bards, or Bloodwell Vials +1 (uncommon) to Dragon Scale Armor, Animated Shields, or Scimitars of Speed (Very Rare). This isn't about 1 or 2 items being off. 2. Even within a given "Rarity", there's huge variance in power. Compare the aforementioned Dragon Scale Armor, Animated Shields, or Scimitars of Speed to +3 Rods of the Pact Keeper, Staves of Power or Candles of Invocation. The difference isn't minor or limited to a few items. If it doesn't give you an accurate measure of its power as a DM, why bother having a "Rarity" system at all?
I am an inexperienced DM. I gave a Tabaxi PC a circle of blasting because of random rolls. The party is level 2. Fun way take the item worth it? They had to discover how to make it work. After fleeing from some goblins and Dire rats. So they were hiding under some dense brush in a small hollow. The Tabaxi accidentally triggers the firing mechanism. Boom, no more hiding place. Tried to use it again when the rats found them. Oops! No more charges for the day. The PCs had a blast. That's what's important.
@@sethcourtad8733 The clue is in the word "standard". I had a similar conversation with a line manager many years ago, when I was trying to make sense of some sales data that simply didn't add up. Her comment was, "The data isn't entirely accurate..." she then had me marked down as "One to watch" when I pointed out that that is simply a way of saying "It's inaccurate" and went on to point out that unless we know which of the data are "not entirely accurate" and by what sorts of variance, how the hell are we supposed to work round it? I think "Rarity" is a pretty dumb measure anyway, if the rarity of an item is being used to reference its Impact in the game. I think it's a lazy, familiar, carry over from MMOs where items tend to be measured in the rarity of their drop rate, with better stuff dropping less frequently to encourage grinding.... Why would the great crafters of items consistently make the shit stuff more than the good stuff? It's far better to know how items are likely to impact your campaign rather than how often they are likely to turn up. Especially if you are handing them out as a freebie to players. Items like a basic Enchanted +1 weapon are of minor impact. They don't really change the game in standard combat, but will allow a player to hit creatures otherwise unharmed by normal weapons... Anything that lets them fly, potentially has a serious impact, especially if all the party can use it, and thereby bypass a lot of ground based content. Planar travel... MAJOR impact... Anything that grants "Wish" level magic would be filed under "OK, Mr/Mrs DM... you made your own bed by letting them have it... now lie in it!" Of course, if you don't let them choose their own magic items and give them out in a considered and planned way, they will (caveat: USUALLY!) have exactly the impact you intend, and rarity isn't an issue.
My favorite magic item is the belt of many pockets from back in 3rd edition. It was a belt with pockets that let you access 37 separate one cubic foot dimensional storage spaces. I had a half ogre druid wear one around his bicep as an arm band. One pocket was for spell focuses and components. One pocket was for sand. And the rest of the pockets were for different bowling ball sized rocks, each with a different misspelling of "counterspell" scrawled on them with crayons. Fighting a melee character? Shout "Pocket Sand!" and throw a handful in their eyes. Fighting a mage? Shout "Counterspell!" and lob a rock the size of their head directly at their skull. Best magic item in the game.
The imbalance within the same tier is also kinda funny lol. Why do Boots of Striding and Springing exist in the same tier as both Boots of Flying (much stronger) AND Ring of Jumping (much weaker)??? Also I think most of this is alleviated by a DM just saying, "pick an item, but run it by me first" and then being firm in their vetos.
For this one there is actually a reason, but its a dumb one when moved to 5e due to the ring requiring attunement. Rings in 3 and 2e that were based granting/replicating a spell had generally weaker effects compared to other items due to how simple it is to keep swapping them out (even mid combat), while other slots (except sometimes neck and the massively more expensive weapons) werent. So a Spell Ring of Jump (not a Ring of Jumping which gained the same benefits mechanically but didnt count as the spell at will without charges) was a easy +10 to +30 eb to jump checks only when needed. Your character wasn't prevented from wearing multiple rings, just from benefiting from more than 1 on each hand (or in 3.5, 2 on one hand but no rings on any other).
@@fellwindthat would matter a lot more if you couldn't split 4h up in 1min intervals. as they are written, except for long distance travel, they are basically limitless flight
I for one have seen dms create magic items "worse than the professionals." WOTC isnt perfect. They make mistakes but they are smarter at alot of design things than many of us. that being said dms should "Take chances make, mistakes, and get messy" because it will happen one way or another.
I think it takes a min-maxer to spot a min-maxing item. It doesn't matter how many campaigns they've run, or if they're "professionals". You just need the gift of being able to think in 'Cheese' (the language of the min-maxer). Most players, DM's, and game writers, see an ability or item effect, and their eyes scan the "what it does" and then they glaze over and get bored with the minor details. A min-maxer reads the same text, and they're scanning: cooldown? is that radius or diamter? what status effects does it interact with? did that say creature or humanoid? Was that a flat amount or a percentage? Does it stack? Concentration? What does the diminishing returns look like? How would that work if you cast it over running water while hanging upside down? etc. And THEN they look at what the effect actually "does". For example, most people read Wall of Force and think "oh battlefield control, that could be handy". A min-maxer looks at Wall of Force, "if a creature is in the path of the wall, the caster chooses which side of the wall the creature is pushed to" and instantly thinks "oh, I cast wall of force 2 inches above the stone floor, and I chose all of the enemies whose ankles it intersects to be pushed 'under' it"... Anyway, as long as you can think in Cheese, you should be able to home brew stuff which works fine. To a certain degree, a DM needs to be able to think in Cheese to homebrew fixes for game content on the fly anyway. As a general rule though, for homebrew magic items, lean heavy on flavor, but light on effect mechanics.
@@kathrynck Another point toward generating items for players is a simple axiom: The more powerful it is, the fewer people who can actually make use of it--and visa versa. Anyone can use a Ring of Deflection, but you might need to be a high level Sorcerer to overcome the will of an intelligent ring whose effects you want to employ mid-fight--and even then, there might be a price for failure, or success.
I kinda wish rarity was just how difficult it was to find something, and there was a separate stat, like level, that described when it might be most appropriate for the GM to put it into the campaign. Then you could have a 5th level campaign start, and then the GM could just tell the players, “Everyone starts with an uncommon item of level 5 or lower.”
That is how it is, at least in 5e. It isn't about power but rarity this is why we have common/Uncommon/Rare. However the level of an item also feels kind of odd because what does that level do? There are 6 levels already in play. I do understand where you coming from though.
@@WhyYouMadBoi It is about power, because 5e ties rarity to power by telling GMs that the rarer an item is, the higher level a player needs to be to access it. I think 5e makes a small stumble by tying cost, power, scarcity, and access to the same system. I’d like to see those more separated in a future system, since surely there’s common items that are just prohibitively expensive for beginner adventurers. We have those in real life.
@@WhyYouMadBoi it makes more sense than the current system, you would just treat it like an rpg. If an item is too high of a level, probably don't give it to your party. If it's too low, they probably won't find much use in it, or just keep it for utility. With a level system you can easily glance at an item and decide if it's something to award or not, and the level doesn't have to "do" anything aside from show its intended time period to hand out.
Something that should be important is giving players magic items that fit their build. For example a fighter with the unarmed fighting style/a monk should maybe get access to the Insignia of Claws/Eldritch Claw Tattoo. I found it extremely frustrating, when stuff was handed out and one character was pretty much always left out, when it came to something they could use.
Thats why eventually the ranger in my group will be awarded/looting a Flaming Longbow (flame tongue in bow form). They already have an elemental gem and wand of magic missiles. The rogue already has boots of elvenkind and earring (helm) of comprehend languages. Artificer has 4 neads of necklace of fireballs, and a pearl of power.
@@johannschiller2263 I kinda sorta was the only one to work it one time it was weird dm was up set that I was able to use it and reverse engineer it 0.0
I feel this. I had someone on a youtube video bragging about what their build could do and doing a build guide. But their DM let them cherry pick their items and at one point gave the character have a free point of Int, allowing them the freedom to pick a half feat to bump their int up. I was like this build won't give us the same results it's giving you. Your DM has been more generous than pretty much most DM's ever and that has upped the power level of your PC.
This was actually Offbeat Outlaw who was stating that its all well and fun to powerbuild but when items or DM gifts come into play, you have to be malleable.
Yeah 9 times out of 10 when I see people posting about their awesome builds it is either A: Not legal B: Impossibly high rolled stats allowing broken Multi class or C: Super generous DM with items and attributes etc. or a mixture of the three. My rules for highlighting a build are: No Items, no home-brew, point buy, level 12 max unless promoting for a high level one shot.
@@Hyde_Hill I remember a time where I was listening to a "Awesome builds you made" MrRipper was reading it and some bloak was talking about a strength monk build. Which I'm like how is that even a strong build in 5e in anyway? I gotta find that video found it: th-cam.com/video/rYlNXJV68ME/w-d-xo.html
The point of that video wasn’t bragging about the build, it was simply showing the dangers of letting players pick items and how to be malleable. In fact I said that multiple times in that video.
I like the idea of magic item shops a lot. What I usually do is determine what my players can and can't buy, either rebalancing magic items I think can "break" the game or just outright not making them available. But if I find one player has bypassed this and bought a "broken" magic item I hadn't anticipated for, I simply talk to them and either rebalance or exchange that item for something more adequate for the game. What I'm saying is: magic item shops are a lot of fun and there are many ways to make them work if you communicate properly with your players.
Honestly, a lot of complaints about DND 5E can be solved by "communication". Its not that hard. The DM is a player, thye are playing a different role. Communicate with eachother to tell a story. Magic stores work, but you can't allow a blanket list allowance.
For a common item, a Clockwork Amulet is incredibly powerful. If you know for a fact that 10 + your bonuses to hit WILL hit a target, you can guarantee damage once per day. Apply that to a character with Sharpshooter or Great Weapon Master or just a Rogue with all the Sneak Attack damage. That is a LOT of potential for a common.
Looking at what someone else has written in the replies about this item, I would also make it clear that even if it's uncommon, such an item isn't always or even occasionally available for multiple purchases, just multiple people might be able to get it. Having someone walk around with a bag of those just screams "no no no, not going to happen," to me on the DM end.
Have you actually used it or played a game with one? It's not a big deal once a day, especially since it's only attack rolls which means, at most, around 20 hit points from either attack roll spells (of which there are natively like 5 leveled ones worth using in 5e, one of which makes 3+ attack rolls, only one of which you can add the bonus to) or melee attacks.
I've had shops where the PCs can design their own magic items with me. They express what they're looking for, the kind of effects or utility and I tell them what can or can't be done and the price for some different options. The transaction might take place over more than one interaction. Usually I can come up with prices and limitations on the spot from familiarity with other items and experience with the items and process of designing items. If I'm not that sure about something I might say it needs more time, or might cost more depending how hard to process is, and get some more time to think about it. It's never been a problem, the players typically love it and get items that mesh with their character and the story better.
Decanter of endless water is very underrated, I take shape water all the time and I have a million and one uses for the spell. So having some water on hand is always nice.
That said, know your players. I shouldn't be given a bag of tricks (and I don't want one), but someone else might be harmless with it. It's live in my campaign and it's more of a fun-placebo for the player who has it than actually effective.
Well, it wasn’t really a placebo (in my experience) because they summoned all 3 at the beginning of the day, so they had 18 animals charging into combat. They took a stupid amount of hits to all bring down. Luckily, it was a one shot, and I’ve learned my lesson.
Yeah summoning stuff in 5E is very broken and unfun. The horn of Valhalla is even worse. Even one horn is basically enough to grind your game to a halt as a single PC can summon in an average of 7 berserkers, each with 67 hp. And that's using the weakest version of the horn.
The CR and rewards systems pair together to be arguably the biggest obstacle to new DM's in all of 5e. While I agree that the ideal is a DM tailoring the items to their players/game, we really should have a better system for helping new DM's.
@@killfear Then whats the point of putting it in the game? I mean in this ravnica there are warlocks, clerics, fighters and other stuff. I do agree that items should have a boost or drop in rarity if it was applied to Toreil (Forgot the spelling but still the world where DnD is located) I think its because these designers never played older editions or even looked back and think this system just don't got lore to itself.
@@WhyYouMadBoi let me lead with: I'm not attacking your comment. I am addressing setting content vs core book content, and it's presence in non-setting games. Guildmaster's Guide was created by the MTG wing of WOTC, less so the D&D team.... they included mizzium because the izzet league runs on mizzium apparatae.... similar to the dragonmarks from Eberron... uncommon in eberron, unheard of elsewhere.... but -- to your point-- some DMs will allow non-eberron characters to implement dragonmarks, similar to how some DMs will implement theros piety or ravnica renown outside their native settings. The summary of this is... each option makes sense in context to their native book... of which none of these above examples are from Core Books. Your off-hand statement about designers being all over the place with assigning rarity may well be justifified, but the one specific example that you turned to -- mizzium apparatus -- is a coincidental caveat that is actually GOOD for this conversation about how appropriate is granting magic items (or any other setting-specific mechanics like those above and the new strix feats and spells) without considering their impact on the game. DMs should have a discerning eye about anything players want brought in beyond what's in the Player's Handbook. Here's the same perspective applied to a different situation: If Hexblade was introduced through GGtRavnica as a Rakdos patron option, instead of the Raven Queen in XGtE, we'd see a lot of people leaning into the Ravnica book to access that subclass, discussing whether or not to reflavor Rakdos being your patron because of how desirable hexblade mechanics are. I think your coming from the right perspective, but it taps into this larger design space discussion. :)
@@killfear I know you're not attacking my comment you ninny I don't need to be told that like some damn child, this is a discussion. Afterall WOTC and MTG are owned by the same damn company so like have them talk about it. They are after all basically putting DLC into WOTC game. This is why I say that "Hey give them Forgotten Realms names" to it could be used outside of those settings. Also to address you last point Hexblade isn't a Raven Queen patron. Your Patron is the Hexblade or well the force that manifest itself into a hexblade. She was said to make the first of the hexblades (though blackrazor is said to be a hexblade, and he doesn't have a connection towards her). You point does stand ground due to the Critical Role book which added Echo knight Fighter and 2 wizard subclasses which got their power and magics from a different sort of magic which wouldn't fit in alot of worlds or even in the Forgotten Realms setting so either change that up (although it's weird for the fighter side but just say its ki) or ban it haha.
I have a DM who has currently given one of our characters a Sun Blade, a Stone of Good Luck, AND an ability that boosts his Strength to 22. He also just gave him plate armor for free at one point... meanwhile my character has struggled to save up enough gold to buy it. And he's currently only Level 7. It's overshadowed the rest of the players in the group so much that it's difficult to actually feel useful when he's able to just tank and kill everything while we're stuck with mostly uncommon items. Our barbarian doesn't even have a weapon that's magical lol. I know this video is only about buying items, but it's also highly frustrating to have a DM that doesn't think about the needs of all players.
1 players w 4 special stuff? Thats kinda sus. I'd allow the 4 abilities/items but only if spread around. The only way one PC would get all 4 is if the party agreed to it.
Staff of python should be uncommon. If you pick that at 11th level it would break on your first challenging encounter. And moon druids can do exactly that at 6th level anyway.
I did let characters who were joining a campaign pick an item, but it was from a shortlist I composed. If they wanted something else they could ask but no guarantees. They were coming in at level 6 or 7, so I could be a little more lenient, but I wanted to make sure nothing was OP, and would not overshadow the stuff that the players who had been there from the beginning had picked up. Even something like the pipes of haunting is really strong in tier 1 and tier 2. It is an uncommon magic item that you can activate with an action, up to three times per day, and it provides a mass frightened effect in 30 ft radius around you (DC 15), with no friendly fire. The effect is weaker than, say, the web spell, but doesn't require your concentration... So I think it kind of comes out to being a very strong level 2 or weak/moderate level 3 spell effect. Three times a day. And the pipes don't even require attunement! Not outright broken the way staff of python can be, but very strong, and you can combine it with control spells that do use concentration to really disrupt encounters. I think staff of the python would be OK as an uncommon magic item if it were a consumable (so, one and done). After 10 minutes or when the giant snake dies, it reverts to the staff and immediately shatters. Just don't let there be tons of them available for the players to acquire.
I feel like staff of the python is meant to be a villain item. Hence why it is one of the few items that has straightforward rules for it breaking: You give it to a villain and the party destroys it as part of defeating them.
I've been allowing my players to choose their own magic items for years at each level of a campaign. I do give myself veto power on the item, but have only had to use this a couple times. I mostly play with people who are more in it for RP and not combat. If you are playing at a table of optimizers I can see this being a different story. I guess it is dependent on the table you play at.
I played in a delightful campaign once. Started at mid level, got several thousand starting gold and the option to buy magic items along with our mundane equipment, with prices adapted from the charts in the Downtime Activities chart in the DMG. The starting gold was set with the intention that we could afford one rare item and maybe one or two commons, based on how much other stuff we bought. Except if you know that section of the DMG, you know that rares are ten times as valuable as uncommons... I did have to do a bit of filtering by "does not require attunement," but I was decked out like a Christmas tree, while my party members had thing like a Flame Tongue weapon for the same budget. It really, really showed how broken the system was. At least 3.5/PF had varying prices for items, rather than just a few, broad bands.
As a PF gm, the varying prices, built-in crafting rules and wealth-by-level expectation really help, but it does suffer from some... quality control issues while giving players RAW authority to do broken things with magic items. Worst offender I can think of is the Cyclops Helm. Starting at lvl 3, a Wizard/Sorcerer can easily be churning these out for 2,800gp a piece, there's no attunement so you can swap them out whenever you want and each one lets you CHOOSE THE RESULT OF YOUR NEXT d20 ROLL as an immediate action. You can force Vorpal decapitations with this. Hell, at lower levels even guaranteeing Scythe or Musket crits is pretty big.
Honestly, this video seems less about players choosing their own magic items being a problem, and more about how the rarity system in 5e is seriously broken. Unless a DM researches every magic item that a player could potentially be given in their game, then a PC could get an overpowered magic item just as easily as if they had picked it themselves. Basically, whether or not you want to let the players choose magic items on their own or award them yourself, one or both parties are going to have to do some extensive research into the items to make sure that they are both useful, but not game breaking. That's an unreasonable amount of work to put on someone for a game, especially the DM whose probably already swamped with work as is. tl;dr: Letting players chose magic items isn't necessarily a problem, but the rarity system is.
Well-written! And why a DM should always say that they need to approve magic items before they are allowed giving them time to research the item and any feedback people may have given about how it can be abused or is unbalanced in certain situations or at all situations as the case may be.
The hell is a 'Low Magic' level 17 campaign anyway? RAW your spellcasters can still wish for simulacrum, call beings from other planes to do their bidding, telepathically talk to people on the other side of the world, or talk to people on other planes, store high value things in a demiplane, can teleport across the world, have a 17% chance to talk to and get a favor from their own god, and can magically churn out a few dozen high-demand artisan products of their choice weekly for steady income. Low magic is an oxymoron
@@texteel it's not for every campaign or anything, but if you have full casters its very hard to have something feel low magic. To me, the classic high fantasy/low magic "campaign" is the lord of the rings. The world is fantastic and magic has a huge influence, but it's rare and powerful.
@@Eivael i think you can do some minor tailorings in the first two tiers to make it low magic and frankly just not go higher than 12th level. From that point on you would have to do a lot of rework in the monsters, adventure hooks, classes and items to keep it low magic. Could also say that full casters just cant have higher than 6th level spells, (and maybe they dont even exist or are so powerful a wish is like an era defining event) so again capping at lvl 11-12. Because like, i think levels 15-20 just don't fit for a low magic style
You mean boots of Elvenkind which give situational advantage on stealth and the cloak of elvenkind which gives advantage without caveats and disadvantage to anyone trying to see you (which is most perception) aren't the same power level? *Insert Surprised Pikachu*
@@thetimebinder Or they expect DMs to be in control. Something like the tattoo so obviously does not work like that they probably thought it did not need to be spelled out. It is not even as if they are new they were first introduced in 3rd edition.
@@thetimebinder But the rule does not state you can cast something more then once for the virtual spell slot represented by the tattoo. The idea that because the tattoo is active for the duration of the spell does not even imply that it can be used again during that duration. Otherwise the same argument could be made for wands or even standard spellcasting. Yes some people will argue for everything to be done in willfully literal misinterpretations of the rules but those people are called rules lawyers and no one likes them. It at no point says you can cast it multiple times.
Common sense dictates that you can't cast the spell from a spellwrought tattoo more than once. However, the other thing I'd note is "for the duration" so you cast aid 100 times and magically layer 500 hit points onto your party. once the spell ends, (for each sample of the spell cast) the characters then lose, an additional 5 hit points, each. resulting in a TPK. (Unless you can figure out how to cure/deal with, 5 damage a round, for 100 rounds in a row).
I would love to see you rate magic items like you rate spells. Not only would it be interesting to see your opinions on the magic items but the resulting list would be very helpful for dm's.
Last campaign i played we completed a difficult one-shot and so the main campaign characters got a magic item reward. We submitted a 5 magic-item list ranked what we wanted most to least and the dm talked with each of us to figure out the reward. Other items on the list could be kept as ideaa for later in the campaign. But there was a definite filter. Bag o' beans still made it through and was abused. However, its effects were aknowledged, made near non-canon for the module's story, and we moved on the player moving on near empty handed for his shenanigans.
Whoa! So cool to see that you have your own channel! I was Davor on the PF1 forums back in the day, and I remember chatting rules and reading your guides. Just thought I'd say "Hi!"
For what it's worth, if I had a campaign centered around the players having a powerful magical item, I'd do what Lord of the Rings does, which is to make the item dangerous to use. This could be because it's cursed, or draws unwanted attention from the person you're trying to get it from, or both. Though make it actually powerful, but not so powerful that it outweighs the side-effects.
I usually allow everyone to pick an Uncommon item. We're playing in Eberron where these items are more available. We also haven't started a game below level 5 in over a year.
The staff of the python is powerful, but you missed a big part of it. "By using a bonus action to speak the command word again, you return the staff to its normal form in a space formerly occupied by the snake." The DM can choose the space. Make it go outside further than 30 feet away. So now, the staff is over 30 feet away when it transforms back, and the druid has to use it's full move and action to dash in order to get there. Or, just move, and not get there to pick it up. But if they move to get to the staff and pick it up, and can't attack, or cast a spell that round. It also (usually) means they are in melee with whatever was killing the snake, and it's known that this is the PC that controls it, so now, the PC just became the target, surrounded by the enemies that were attacking the snake.
I'm certain this isn't intended. The snake occupies 9 spaces -- the staff has to fall into just one of those. That's all. Edit: I'm reading your comment as saying the snake turns into a staff at any point that's ever been occupied by the snake. Whether the snake is there now, or moved through the space several turns ago.
Great video. Really love your DM and design-related content. Thanks for giving such a comprehensive take on the whole subject. This cleared things up a lot up for me
I ended up creating a spreadsheet classifying magic items as available in villages, towns or cities. Some items I have marked as black market only and anything not on the list has to be made or commissioned by a PC. If a magic item becomes problematic I just remove it from the list and if I offer a PC a free item pick I can say 'pick one uncommon off the town list' and feel pretty safe that I won't see anything oddball.
14:58 there may be no charges but I'd say the moment it becomes a snake it is no longer the staff you were attuned too. So making it become a staff to used it a gain would work unless you have another hour to attune.
I look at that Spellwrought Tattoo kind of like trigger rules in M:TG or Yu-Gi-Oh. Two things happen when you cast a spell from a tattoo: The spell is cast, and the tattoo begins glowing. The latter strikes me like tapping for cost in M:TG, you can't tap a tapped permanent for its own effect, so the trigger conditions are "Tattoo exists" and "Tattoo is not glowing" since the tattoo is unable to begin glowing if it's already glowing. In M:TG terms it's like an enchantment or artifact that has an effect similar to (tap): Target creature gains +0/+5 until the start of your next turn. If you would untap , send it to the graveyard instead (not destroy).
I love rolling up random loot instead of handing requested items out. I love watching players come up with ways to use what they have rather than continue to do what they have always done, only now with bigger numbers. In my experience, the players at the table are usually reasonable about a DM saying "hey that's kinda insane and I don't think that's what the devs were intending, lets limit that item to what it sounds like it can do instead of what RAW technically allows it to" whenever they figure out a way to solve every problem ever with a loophole.
As a player, I despise choosing or "buying" magic items. In just about every campaign I have been in, the DM has basically had lots of options to buy magic items and effectively pick magic items. I don't want to buy things to "Build myself a load out". I want to find interesting things and find ways to work them into play. This is not to say I don't appreciate a DM customizing the game to their players - I played a character with a peg leg and the DM once switched out some boots of elvenkind that were in the campaign for a peg leg of elvenkind. That was amazingly cool. But it was originally some adventure loot or randomly rolled loot that they added some flavor to. Its not just picking stuff that I want and removing the verisimilitude of a real fantasy world where you don't find what you want but find what you get.
I think that was very cool of your dungeon master to do that! Also wondering if Prosthetics (most recent update TCE page 134) are a common thing or a very rare thing item (Rarity aside,) in most game worlds, this and other readers?
@@TreantmonksTemple absolutely agree, it would be a never-ending task with all the releases until this edition is done. But if I had faith in someone who could do it, it would definitely be you.
Half a year late, but for the 4:40 min bit, id attribute it to: 1) The gold in the starting equipment (more than enough to by the DMG get 2 very rare or 4-6 rare items with some spare change). 2) Assumption that the party still want to feel progression. 3) To also fill the use of the table for a player joining a ongoing campaign thus not devalue both the loot already acquired and give RP opening for player trade/others decking out their new ally (or not) thus instantly having the mechanics compliment the characterizations.
Looking over the characters sometimes doesn't work. I made a custom "growth" magic items for my group. At level 1 the rogue made a pirate so the item I made him a magic cutlass. He became an archer.
I think often what I've done is said "choice within reason" Have a dialog with each player about why they want specific passive or active effects and decide with them what seems fair It's on players to mediate themselves for fairness to make the table fun as well as a DM I would consider taking something horribly broken as a failure from the player in part of their job -to facilitate the fun of others at the table as well as themselves
Level 5 Bard. Instrument of the Bards - One of the Uncommon varieties. Gives disadvantage on Saving Throws when saving against Charm effects. Bard takes Hypnotic Pattern. DM either has to pick every monster based on Charm resistance/immunity, or get their encounters all run over. Oh, and it also allows the Bard to cast Fly, Invisibility, levitate, and a bunch of other spells without using a spell slot.
As a player, I certainly enjoy more being able to actually have a hand in what and how I obtain magic items. I play with 2 DM's who do the exact opposite of each other: In one game, we have our own artificer that can make us magic items that we ask for, and in the other the only way to obtain them is via the DM handing them out to us. Whilst in the latter case that DM often gives out lots of homebrew items that are fun, cool and sometimes even wildly overpowered... I just enjoy the ability to actually make a build and piece together the character how I want to play them, much the same way one would choose a feat or somesuch to direct your playstyle. The random-ness of having it completely out of your hands can definitely be fun but I find that it often leads to long stretches of game time where you're not getting any items you actually want and can't incorporate easily into the way you play. Maybe it makes the game more artificial just being able to say "I want this" and being granted that request (within reason, we're still limited by gold so the former DM still has a hard cap on what rarities we can buy especially since the party shares gold) but it's also just really, really fun being able to track your progress as time goes on. As you accomplish fun and cool things in the game, gathering the gold to get that really neat magic item that you'd really like for your character. Magic items in that way can act as mini-milestones that are fun to achieve and then play with, always fighting for that next cool thing. Something that just occurred to me while writing this comment though... We don't play with XP in either game so I imagine that could also be a part of it-we can't reliably go out of our way to try and level up, which leaves magic items as the only means that we can actively take (even though like levels, gold is still granted by DM fiat) to actually upgrade our characters... Anyway, this is an interesting topic to discuss regardless.
I think there's a happy middle ground, where a DM includes items that work well for the players, or maybe were from a player wish list without the players simply choosing the items.
@@TreantmonksTemple Yeah I think a combo of the two is the way to go. Although granted gold should be somewhat meaningless regardless considering even I think magic item shops should be avoided. Us having an artificer is pretty new even in our playgroup, we usually just spend all our thousands of gold on Matthew Colvilles Strongholds xD In my opinion, crafting them or questing for them should be the way to go. There's a lot of space in there for the DM's to draw out when and how they obtain their desired magic items, so they still have plenty of control, alongside ones the DM wants to provide/rolls for
Yeah I know later on westmarch discord server and to reward people for playing a character to high level by picking items of certain rarity. I had a gambler’s blade greatsword for an early +3 weapon. Or serpent scale armor for 20+ AC early on. Save boosting items are a common pick for people. +2 to your spell save DC is crazy or picking a belt of giant strength and not investing in that stat.
I had to look up this item again because I was positive I played the module it was in, and yes once again, the gambler's blade is a *unique* (as in one time per game universe, one of several unique items,) item that is from a specific "Extra Life" event for player characters of 5th to 10th level, though you can choose the item it appears from a list weapon wise and it is meant to be for people who played and overcame that encounter in that module. If we're just handing it out to any person requests it as a magic item, it kind of ruins the point of a specific item that is made as a one-time item not for everyone else. Multiple items in this adventure are made for people who are getting two items of 5th-10th level equivalent. Again, let me emphasize, that *this item is equivalent of two magic items of its Rarity of Fifth to Tenth level*. I won't say what module it is, but the module was an excellent one and it's highly recommended if you happen to look it up or happened to play it by chance because the DM is reading this and getting a thumbs-up from a person on the player end. (I was also reminded what the astral plane looks like when someone showed why you don't put an extradimensional space item into another item of extradimensional space, but that wasn't module-specific, that was just a mistake from another player putting an extradimensional space item that they didn't know was extra-dimensional space into a bag of holding.) Many westmarch campaigns are accepting the rule of cool, but they really need to look into if unique items are supposed to be given to all players. If it's an unbalancing thing there better be house rules about how you are going to obtain it in regards to minimum levels, minimum abilities if you are crafting it, Etc.My westmarch campaign has exactly that.
What do you think about the choice to get rid of item creation feats? That's one element I really miss from Pathfinder, both because I feel it makes the world feel less cohesive (the existence of the feats explains how magic items get into the world to begin with), and because I think they were a good way of balancing players' ability to choose their own equipment against a substantial opportunity cost (i.e. taking other feats).
This is why Artificers make me want to rip my hair out as a DM. Feels like I end up with so much extra homework just because Wizards of the Coast slapped item crafting/replication on this class without much thought.
I once ran a short campaign starting at 5th... I curated (randomly rolled, with exclusions) a single list of magic items. Then, the players each took turns selecting one item, and passed the list to the next player. It got them items that fit (more or less) their PCs, and still allowed pretty tight control of the 'back story loot'. (fwiw, the campaign was a 5e redux of "The Desert of Desolation")
Spellwrought Tatoos are clearly intended to have one charge, and one charge only. The Snake Staff only works for Warlocks, Clerics and Druids and CAN be killed if the enemy focuses it down before the user's turn comes around so they can revert it to staff form, or just concentrates on killing the staff's owner. Frankly, my favorite magic item was when my Warlock found a Broom of Animated Attack. A cursed item that attacks anyone who attempts to use it to fly. He had an ability that allowed him to fly without an item or spellcasting, so he would PRETEND to use the broom to fly, and eventually, someone tried to steal the broom and fly with it. THUMP! WHACK! You may THINK a broom of flying makes for an invincible defense. Wyverns and any intelligent monster with ranged weapons beg to differ.
Anecdote: in my current campaign (level five start) each player was allowed to chose one uncommon magic item. This choice ended up allowing my forge cleric to have only ten strength but wear plate armor (mithril plate) and for our barbarian to take an 8 in strength only to take gauntlets of ogre strength. It may be a bit minor but it allowed both of us to be far more liberal with secondary ability score points that we otherwise wouldn’t be able to afford.
I always get the +1 spell DC items as a spellcaster whenever I get the choice to start with an uncommon. (the +2 DC if I get to choose rare) since your totally fine as a player to spend an entire ASI on +1 spell DC. Plus I just hate magic resistance in the later part of the campaign. I'm fine with legendary resistance, but magic resist is so stupid on top of that. (Another reason why I've moved away from Sorcs as spellcasters and instead go Eliquence Bard if I want to play a spellcaster, since they just get a possible +12 to their spell save DC, not even Tiamant can make a 40 spell DC with a nat 20 and that feels so good.)
Having run plenty of my own campaigns, I will say that sometimes it's alright to let players choose a magic item, but it can't be too open-ended. The general methods to go about it, imhe, are: 1. As stated in video, create your own and dole those out. I've done this plenty and it's awesome. In one of my campaigns I had a Monk get "Handwraps of Lesser Undead Slaying." These were basically +1 gloves that destroyed undead on what would normally be a critical roll (since they are immune to normal critical damage) if they have 4HD or fewer. This helped in a handful of fights against large numbers of weak skeletons/zombies. It would never trivialize the campaign (or even that section of the story), but would always be worth hanging onto until the Monk was strong enough to just kill them in one round without that effect. It also synergized nicely with the Monk's Flurry of Blows since the party wasn't quite high enough to have their 1st bonus iterative attacks yet. 2. Randomly generate it from DM tables while overriding obvious offenders. Just reroll these or adjust the item itself somehow. For example, instead of giving them a Broom of Flying, give them a wand/scrolls/potions with the Flying spell--this way they get to use it, but it's a tactical decision involving resources, and it doesn't permanently compromise your campaign. 3. Give them a mostly open choice. You tell them, "At my discretion," so they understand it needs to be at least somewhat reasonable. They are unlikely to go for broke on the most OP stuff if they feel it will just be turned down., and you just turn it down if they do, lol. This should basically be in play no matter which approach you use, though. You can also provide a list of banned items/effects or items too similar to those on the list. 4. Preselect an item pool for players to choose from. This works, but feels lame compared to the other options.
One of the best examples of this is in a game where I am playing a CoE Bard, and my DM gave me a Doss Lute at 5th level. In combination with Hypnotic Pattern, and Unsettling Words, unless the target is immune to charm, you have a very high probability of shutting down any target for example a BBEG with minions. Hitting the BBEG with Unsettling Words, then the area around them with Hypnotic Pattern (and cast with an Instrument of the Bards, all spells which impose the Charmed condition, and have either a Somatic or Verbal component mean everyone in the target area saves at disadvantage.) So the BBEG is saving at disadvantage, with an additional Bardic Inspiration Die subtracted from the saving throw. Unless they are immune to Charm, even with magic resistance it's a straight save minus a Bardic Inspiration Die which is still not an easy save to make. Another couple of spells that have the same conditions that can be cast through an Instrument of the Bards are Mass Suggestion, and Modify Memory which turn those spells into almost certain successes as well. As a DM, I would never give an Instrument of the Bards to a Bard PC below 11th level, it's way too powerful before then. By 3rd level you can have Suggestion which is another spell which can be cast through the IoTB, giving the target a save at disadvantage, which is stupidly OP at 3rd level. Same with 5th level, when they get Hypnotic Pattern, as described above, one of the best battlefield control spells in the game, and forcing all the targets to make their saves at disadvantage is again, stupidly OP.
I actually don't understand the problem. Can the players fly? Tight corridors still exist. Spell tattoos? The way I'd rule it, from how the text is formulated, it's a one-and-done situation. Staff of the python? Enemy spellcasters can pack dispel magic. Whenever people say "oh no, players getting too strong" I really don't understand the issue. They are YOUR players, and you know their strengths, weaknesses, and above all, motivations. An indestructible flying tank might not be going down because of your ancient dragons, but the moment some evil person kidnaps that one little urchin the tank has taken a shine to, the tank's AC or massive AoE damage won't matter. Honestly, the more I learn about DnD, the more I realise that creativity is the name of the game. Why doesn't that apply to us dungeon masters? My players are OP as shit, and I'm still learning how to challenge them properly - and that's fine. I WANT them to feel strong. I WANT them to feel capable. I still manage to make them anxious some times. There are TONS of other really mighty people out in your worlds, who's to say they haven't gotten wind of your players? Seriously. It's getting a bit weird with how often these "hot takes" crop up.
I've always controlled the magic items I hand out. I tend to run high magic campaigns as well, so balancing what each player gets is crucial. I also design my own magic items regularly. I use the quirk tables to get ideas (I choose the quirks myself) and make a backstory for almost every item, even if it's straight from the book. Spells like Legend Lore and Identify can be far more interesting with this approach. My players who study Arcana, History and Nature or Religion can get great use out of those skills in this regard. Bards and such get much deeper from the details they can acquire from the gear the players acquire. I've been playing since the old school 1980's 1st edition D&D. I've made items like this my entire life, so I'm good at it. My players love it, too.
We started using quality items rather than large numbers of magic items. My favorite and most memorable magic item find was a broken plus 1 magic sword and a quality hilt and hand grip made of shark skin. We also played using a critical system. Soon after I found the sword, my character took what would normally be a game ending injury when he lost his shield arm a couple of inches below the shoulder. The sword and hand grip combination was helpful enough it made the character still playable...
Good suggestion, the Staff of the Python surprised me a few weeks ago in a one-shot with the classic "pick an uncommon magic item", crazy good. Two favorites of mine: Instruments of the Bards (the uncommon ones) and the Winged Boots. What I do now is to create 2 lists for "nice tier 2 items" (being the more common level range I run games) including some homebrew of mine. From the first list they roll, consisting mostly of weapons with nice effects and cool wondrous items. From the second list, I let them pick, and this one consists mostly of consumable items, normally by tier 2 I allow them to expend extra gold to pick more from this list, and are also available for crafting if they have the proficiencies.
Easiest way: At level 5 use the Adventurers League 11.0 rules for the item list they can choose one from. At level 10 they can pick a +2 item off the list, and a +1 item off the list or +1 armour of any kind. At level 15 they can pick a +3 item off the list, a +2 item off the list or +2 magic armour of any kind, and a +1 item off the list or any uncommon magic item (they've lost their scare value by now). Keeps it simple, and they're just boosts, often very class related ones. They do ruin the bounded accuracy system, but that's somewhat intended for larger challenges.
I think the super vanilla magic items like weapons should be available (e.g. +1, +2, +3 magic weapons, +1/+2/+3 wand of the war mage, +1/+2+/3 rod of the pact keeper, +1/+2/+3 sheild). With different bonuses showing up at times that make sense for the campaign. If you don't include those, it has implications on class balance (like...the fact that +3 rod of the pact keeper requires attunement and doesn't add to damage is a real downside compared to a +3 hand crossbow). Also, shields--most people make physical characters that use both hands, so I feel it's worth rewarding the sword and shield fighter with good scaling shields. Nothing else is really needed, though. This includes +X armour (and in fact if you look in the DMG at loot tables, stuff like +1 platemail and +1 half plate doesn't show up until Magic Table I, the last table in the book normally reserved for level 17+ parties, roughly equivalent to legendary weapons). Based on their loot tables, the designers just didn't seem to plan on players getting much in the way of AC from magic armour. They just wanted their armour to have cool effects instead; damage resistances, adamantine armour, elven chain, that kind of stuff.
Yeah, magic items are the most annoying bit of trying to start a one shot higher level or getting a new PC in the fold after character death. I've been thinking on just going to the dmg magic item charts that fit the "rarity" tier I want and just rolling 3 times and picking the most fun option to give a player so that it's something usable but not tailored. Maybe having it on top of the adventurers league character creation rules of just having a +1 item of your choice (if level 5+) and just giving some items on top and letting people pick up common items since they can be flavorful or a couple healing potions
the reason the DM book lists the suggested rate of magical acquisition higher than the starting-at- higher-level loot is because customizing your magicals at higher level lets a player min/max a character build, and this maximizing equipment synergy is what breaks power balance. The enjoyment of finding magicals is figuring out how to incorporate them or gaining novel powers rather than perfectly filling gaps that were balancing your class.
I also have my players submit a list of what they want their characters to accomplish in my campaign, and what kind of rewards they look forward to, including magical gear they would hope their character would someday use. This lets me set up a story that will be deeply satisfying to the players in the long run. I can work on the items over time and detail the history that goes into them before the players/characters encounter them. And I can tailor my story to include opportunities for the characters to accomplish the heroics they would like to accomplish for their characters.
One of the best things you can do as a DM is make custom weapons and gear in your game, because especially compared to past editions, the 5e magic item options suck. The easiest way to do this is just transpose item effects onto different things or locations. Weapons of spell storage, belt buckle of opening, a cape of missile snaring, a frostbrand mace, etc. etc. etc. Especially for weapons, this will hugely diversify the gameplay you see, because a lot of weapons a player might choose don't have fun magic options in 5e, so players don't gravitate towards them.
As I can recall, recent earlier editions even mentioned how you can transfer the spell effect from one magic item to another item type to be enchanted instead. I could be wrong. However, 5th edition is sorely lacking variety or guidelines how to do this.
Also some magic items change in power as the game changes. For instance the Eversmoking Bottle was a cool utility item when it first came out. Then Tasha’s came along, and now any level 1 fighter can start with 10ft of blindsight. Permanent advantage on attacks, disadvantage of attacks against you, ignore attacks of opportunity and spells that require line of sight. Pairs disgustingly well with GWM+PAM due to range of blindsight and the advantage offsetting the -5 to hit penalty. Just a bit better than a +1 halberd…
I think it could actually make for a fun campaign idea to start the players at 1st level but give each of them one legendary item. The caveat is that they'll be facing much more difficult challenges, so they'll need to be more cautious and creative until they can level up a bit. Something like a Cloak of Invisibility has a lot of non-combat potential, but is also quite potent in combat. You could even make it part of the plot that they need to destroy these items, so they eventually have to give up their power and fight on their own strength.
Serpent's Scale armor is a great example of this problem. Armor (scale mail), uncommon This suit of magic armor is made from shimmering scales. While wearing it, you can apply your full Dexterity modifier (instead of a maximum of +2) when determining your Armor Class. In addition, this armor does not impose disadvantage on your Dexterity (Stealth) checks. So a character with a +5 to dexterity (a ranger for example) can have 19 AC with a medium armor piece. At low levels, this is absolutely gamebreaking. I'm currently playing a lost mine of pandelver game where we started at level 3 for some reason. I have +5 dex and the serpent scale mail, and have 19 AC. It's far too easy.
I've never given out regular magic items. When I dish out items, I base it on the person finding it. A player expressed his desire to have his tabaxi be a manicurist as a background (not sure if for lulz or to relate to himself IRL) so he had a nail file. In a later adventure he found an unidentified dagger. He haphazardly put it in his pack and when he went to file his nails as he often did during long rest, he found the dagger had fused with the nail file. He got a custom item that gave his claws a +1. Later gave him polishes that let him gain other effects, and they became his main weapon.
All of the Uncommon Instruments of the Bards cast fly (3rd), invisibility (2nd), levitate (2nd), protection from good/evil (1st). Then they also get a few other spells depending on the instrument, including standouts like entangle, protection from energy (fire only), and faerie fire. Finally, you can impose disadvantage on all your enemies saves vs your charm spells. And these are uncommon items "appropriate" for a 1st - 4th level character. They provide so much versatility. Also, many of the spells these instruments can cast aren't on the bard spell list!
In my own campaign I took the list of magic items availble in XGTE and rolled randomly to determine how many of each item existed in the world. Then, I use the reward section from that book to determine in each set of levels the characters achieve (for example, levels 11-15) I roll to determine which items of each rarity will appear or have the oppotunity to be found if they are discovered (not all items are guranteed to appear). I will then determine story beats for those items to appear, and which ones become items carried by villains. This seems to have worked well and many items actually go unused in the course of a fight, but pop up every so often for character moments or to solve an out of combat challenge. This also happens to be the same campaign that the characters have swords modeled after Matt Colville's Teeth of the Dragon that increase in power as challenges are faced and different detriments/curses of the items are overcome. So, when you have a powerful magic item that blinds you randomly but also has insane good damage the players can have things go horribly well in their favor or the item bites them back and summons a random D20 creature in the middle of a fight.
Some element of player choice is useful, though. Or at least player input.. Otherwise you get DMs handing out Flametongue swords to parties where the only character proficient with martial weapons already has Polearm Master and isn't looking for any kind of sword at all, no matter how fancy.
Whenever i make a character, i imagine where theyd be at level 20, then add a pouch labeled "preferred magic item" list to my sheet on dndbeyond. Then my DM can see my full intent, and hand out things as they please. I also constantly homebrew items, most of the time its a simple flavour change like winged boots being a jetpack, or a set of robes condensed to an earring.
I've used the Sane Magic Item Prices list for a couple of one shots and it worked pretty well, but instead of letting my players choose based on rarity, I gave them a certain amount of gold to spend on the list.
Sane prices also has some serious faults where items have almost random value because of a niche use case. It places Decanter of Endless Water at 135,000g for god's sake.
A Legendary magic item that's practically _designed_ to be handed to a player from level 1 (or maybe level 3) onward is the Moonblade. It has an entire story arc attached that literally works best if the player character destined to be its heir has it early on and has to unlock its powers over the course of the campaign. If you want to make it a little less devastating when all its powers come on at once after they attune, you can say the Moonblade itself has amnesia and has to recover its memories of its prior wielders one by one, only regaining the power associated with a particular past wielder when it regains its memories of that wielder.
I ran a 15th level one-shot last year, and in preparation, I told the players that the items they could get should only have passive effects. It worked for the 2 combat encounters I planned; the one-shot took 5 hours since nobody had too many choices
My personal approach is for each player to make a wishlist. I can then take that wishlist, cut off anything that will break the game, and then any time they get a magic item I give them each one from their lists
I agree fully, the rarity system doesn't work. One thing that has worked for me, i think i saw the tip on some reddit post or something. Is to use more charms, basically give them limited use magic items. If you make up an item just give it as a charm first, if it breaks encounters, well, it's limited it ain't staying forever, if the party liked it and it worked fine, you can make a quest for them to get a permanent version, or the shopkeeper just imported a permanent version or whatever. If you are too worried about them hoarding them and just not using them, give them a time limit or some kind of limit besides uses "The great old blue wizard offer you a powerful charm to help in your quest, but warns you that you need to be swift, it's power will only hold for a day/week/month". As long as you establish from the start that it is limited, the party won't feel bad about losing it when it runs out.
I've told my players that magic items in my world are incredibly rare and those that DO exist are all charge based. For example you can use the boots of speed 3 times before they are empty and become non-magical. I much rather hand out consumables than permanent items.
That's not a bad solution, it might create some weird worldbiilding inconsistencies, like if they are very rare and limited in use how are there any charges left by the time the PCs get them? Who is making the items and why are they available for adventurers instead of locked up in national treasuries or epic level wizard towers?
Here's something for you if you're running a one-shot for higher level players (assuming your players all can be trusted not to start a fight with eachother.) Assemble a list of magic items. Some powerful, some not, without any particular recipient in mind. Then, before character creation, open this list of magic items up for player characters to pick from... once the item is taken by one character, it can't be taken by another. Then, rather than the party picking their magic items to suit their characters they are instead making characters to suit the magic items they've managed to grab. Eventually someone is going to have to make use of that +2 longsword!
This video right here is a big part of why I pay attention to character optimization stuff. As a player, I want to avoid situations that could break the game and unbalance things where they stop being fun, especially for my fellow players and my DM. I've had a few situations where it was a one-shot "Choose an uncommon item" thing or the DM said "As a reward, the hero guild lets you choose an uncommon item from their warehouse." kind of thing. And I have done my level best not to abuse that. I usually create my characters to a theme anyway, so often most of the OP options just don't jive with what I'm building. I'll pick something that fits my theme and gives me a good bonus, or helps shore up a weakness, but isn't gamebreaking.
This is why, as a DM I homebrew EVERY SINGLE MAGIC ITEM, specifically made for each player, so that I'm sure it will go to the right person and I can balance the team power level accordingly(for example, I had a weak draconic sorcerer in my team, so I invented a dragon tooth dagger that would give her a sorc point each time she killed an enemy with fire(no limits) at lv 3 (a rival dragon dropped it). It's strong, especially at higher levels, but that player is not min/maxing, meanwhile if a player is very good at the game or has a very strong character I will give them a magic item that requires them to be creative, for example, I have a min/maxer player with an half-elf rogue and he dedicated little time to his backstory, so I gave him a cool bow that creates arrows of darkness, that has some cool utility effects(like casting misty step or silence), but they work only if no hostile creature currently sees him, and I decided it would link to his backstory and add some salt to it(he knew little of his family and left home young, so I decided that his family was secretely worshipping the raven queen and he left too early to get an initiation rite, but someone decided he would get that bow and learn from the weapon's whispers, he still hasn't figured out who, but it's starting to get more clear). Of course the downside is that it takes creativity and time, but that is the definition of being a DM, or at least doing it with a little dedication.
I mean, sure if you pick up your own magic item that wasn’t from a predetermined list by the DM (as in in-game purchases) it can be really powerful. One of my favorite common items is Harvey’s pouch of spices. It just gives you up to 10 pinches of any spice or seasoning you can think of per day, and it recharges often. Great for chef PC’s and interrogations! (Fun fact: Wasabi is classified as a spice) also, you could shove a strong smelling spice in the nose of a big monster.
I am a DM. We started at level one. We didn’t start with magic items but I want to give them magic items that go with their own character’s build. One character, (an artificer) asked me if he could have a multi-purpose tool. And instead of just giving him one we worked together a magic item “creation” system where he can gradually build the item and continue to upgrade it as he levels up. I think it’ll be fun. He purposely built his character to have as many starting tool kits as possible and this takes that into account with the build of his magic item.
Wand of magic missiles is another uncommon item that can break early level combat pretty easily especially if there are multiples. Can be used by anyone and no attunement. If you have a party of 5 each with a wand they can all just pull them out on round 1 of a serious combat and spend 6 charges and each do an average of (28) at range for a total of 140 unerringly hitting force damage which kills almost all monsters below CR9 in one round and some of a bit higher CR. Magic missile is wonderful to split up as well if you are facing a large number of targets and you just pop 3 here 3 there and 2 over there. Until a characters can average more than a sure 28 in a round it remains great for a serious encounter focus fire due to its auto hit when something really needs to die. Had a campaign where we had a character making them. All the characters ended up with several in a wand bandolier (Wandolier) and the fighter who had no good ranged attack had 6. Even though at later levels he did more damage than that on average if he could get in melee he just whipped them out fired off 6 of the 7 charges for the 28 average and went to the next if something was out of range. The party ended up with the saying "When in doubt, whip your wand out!"
I play in a campaign where our DM gave us a legendary home brew magic item that was made for our character at lvl 5 to be fair the effects are just meant to enhance both our strengths and weaknesses. I think it made the campaign better not worse and made all of our characters really excel in certain scenarios. In one shots the solution Ive seen used before is no repeat items and just banning some items.
In 3.5 i made players roll for them at random but had a few rules. Using multiple items at once requires additional concentration checks at +2 dc for each additional item, divine and arcane items react catastrophically if crossed in such a manor, intelligent items of opposed alignments also auto fail, and when destroyed they deal 1 d6 per level of its constituent spells and are destroyed, and if a particular item cannot be destroyed, the operator is instead, bar a saving reflex dc of spell constituents + 10 to avoid being sucked into a semi random plane depending on the power and nature of the item. Other than that, if players can figure out how to put their random junk togethef in creative ways, they deserve snd have earned it, right up untill i send something to go steal their shit, or force em to cough them up to an npc for a good plot point and a story based replacement item. Some things are so contrived that you cant know how players can use them untill they do.
What I did was see what the players were playing then gave them an option of 1 of 2 or 3 items. If it was higher I just upped numbers. This way they get some choice but I know nothing is going to break the game, unless they use it in some way that I didn't foresee. At that point it is on me as I allowed it and a good on them for being creative.
In AL play, you get to keep 1 magic item of uncommon quality levels 1-4, up to 3 magic items of up to rare quality at levels 5-10, up to 6 magic items of up to very rare quality at levels 11-16, and up to 10 magic items of up to legendary quality at levels 17-20. This makes a big impact on your character because of the number of magic items you have access to. You still have attunement restrictions, but not every magic item requires attunement. The upside is it can take a subpar subclass and make it competitive because of the magic items. Allowing for more variety of builds because you don't necessarily have to rely on the same optimization build tricks to be effective. But it's very High Fantasy leaning as far as power curves go at the table, because everyone has multiple magic items.
Best example of this is the myzium apparatus (uncommon)! It gives a caster the ability to cast "any spell" in the game, without having the spell prepared!
I agree 100% about the rarity being useless. Honestly, I've found Sane Magic Items Pricing to work well in a high fantasy setting. But I utilized a secondary currency (called Guild coins) which they could use to buy them. Guild coins were awarded via specific NPCS and were only allowed at curated magic shops. They still acquired gold, but most (non-guild produced) magic items had an inflated gold cost (200% beyond the cost in the Sane Magic Item Pricing guide). I did choose the magic items they found in the wild though, and used the Sane Magic Item Pricing as a loose guide to make sure everyone got a similar amount of loot. All of that worked okay level 1-10. Now that they are level 15+, any upgrades are either astronomically expensive, or have to be homebrewed. Which is what I end up doing most of the time. They are probably too over-geared now, but at this point I'm just letting them play out the fantasy of being demi-gods molding the world to their wills. :)
I made the mistake of converting from Pathfinder to 5e and didn't adjust any of the loot from the module... My party was swimming in OP gear by level 8 and at level 13 they have found their preferred items and the rest hardly even get ID'd before being dumped in the multiple wagon loads of magic items they have kicking about. I use the companion rules from Strongholds and Followers and even with a companion each they're all kitted with a full set of 3 attunement items and multiple consumable... Thank god they're almost done. I was worried the Luckblade was going to completely skip the campaign by "wishing to be in BBEG's bedroom".
1:35 - Cloak of Protection and Ring of Protection being mechanically identical but different rarity tiers is the first thing I thought of off the top of my head lol.
as a dm i like giving the players powerful magic items, because that means i just get to make them fight things with a higher power level, which for me as a dm is fun. one of my favorite parts of DnD is just theory crafting and building characters and monsters. most of my campaigns i let my players buy or craft whatever they want as long as they have the appropriate resources. although its fairly common that i have to change the requirements for items or how they work, because DnD is very lazy when it comes to balance, and they left that up to the dm to fix
"if you give them a ring of invisiblity, is that gonna destroy your campaign?" not as long as they agree to take it to Mt. Doom to be destroyed
I feel like the solution is simpler than you're thinking:
"You each get one uncommon and one rare magic item. Please submit them to me beforehand for approval."
Yes this and Chris should not have suggested DMs pick items for players because I know for a fact many DMs will refuse to give players any good items based off of this and it will merely become an exercise in frustration.
@@AntoineVello You shouldn't have to assume people are bad actors when giving advice- D&D is a collaboration between the players and the DM.
@@Kai-K "you have to plan for the worst as you can only hope for the best"
you should plan around the dm being a bad actor just as you should plan around the players being a bad actor if it comes up so your ready for a nut job power gamer wants to try and take the spotlight or a tyrant dm that wants to make there players suffer
@@teeteenine2222 If every game was planned around both the DM and players being bad actors, none of my campaigns would have ever progressed.
"We should go help that screaming lady!"
"What if its a ploy for muggers? What if the DM steals all of our stuff, horse, and cart from the inn while we're gone? What if screaming woman is a CR 20 demon here to kill us, the level 3 party?"
"We should take this quest!"
"What if it's a trap from the BBEG and we all will die? (what if theft from inn, etc) What if we get paid in fake money? What if at the most critical roll, the DM fakes things against us?"
"I'll reward my players with a bag of holding!"
"What if they do some weird powergame stuff with it, like filling it with 500 lbs of bricks and turning it inside out on the boss? What if they just lie about how much stuff is in it? What if they all add it to their sheets, each pretending to misunderstand who has it?"
It's just nonsensical. You can hedge your bets a little and not give your players the opportunity to *accidentally* do something problematic, but you should not have to plan around people trying to disrupt the game.
@@Kai-K @Soketzu Applesauce A plan is not a action you should have a plan for IF a player or dm wants to fuck you over and you won't use it IF they don't
for example "What if they all add it to their sheets, each pretending to misunderstand who has it?" the plan would be talk to them and get them to agree on which player has it
"What if they do some weird powergame stuff with it, like filling it with 500 lbs of bricks and turning it inside out on the boss?" this one takes a bit to set up so you can cook up your plan around it when they start the setup and plan for if they do it like lets say it dose however many d whatever bludgeoning damage with a dc? dexsave for halve in a 15ft cone in front of them it as a bit of homebrew
"What if it's a trap from the BBEG and we all will die?" well these are things you should be thinking about as a player if you have a cupel enemy's in high places they might set up a honeypot to get the drop on you tricking you in to doing a crime, fetching a thing they need to do bad thing, or in to a trap just to kill you out right for a much higher price that you normally get for a job like whatever they are saying your doing and it can be a good plot point and the dm and player might see it as cool if you see thru it and save the party's hide
"What if we get paid in fake money?" well irl people check to see if you have given them counterfeit money all the time or just counting the money to see that its all there and this could be a role playing moment the pc's shoot the shit for a hour as they count out and check the money and if the dm is nice that could be a short rest for the party
"What if at the most critical roll, the DM fakes things against us?" I ask the dm to roll in the open for this reason for most thing rolling in the open is fine stealth and slight of hand should be kept in the dark unless someone see it using there perception but other rolls are fine in the open it keeps all player honest with one another even if that means we git by a crit our dm dose not what us to if you are going to roll dice for let the dice decide other wise what's the point of rolling them
"What if its a ploy for muggers?" have your weapons ready if this wakes you up take some time to slip on your armor before heading out
"What if the DM steals all of our stuff, horse, and cart from the inn while we're gone?" you could have a alarm spell set up. or some locks on your containers to buy time for you get back. take the horse with you so they have to have there own horse to take the cart
"What if screaming woman is a CR 20 demon here to kill us, the level 3 party?" you could run tell the party to split up if its just one guy it will only be able to fallow one of you tell the party to meet at a guard house or some thing like that and get help from the town guards on the way
you are not always going act on these plans but its good to have them in case they happen
“How much can we rely on the games rarity system? Not at all it’s practically useless”
*music starts*
Great intro 😂
I was in the kitchen, listening while washing the dishes. It was sooo strange that I hade to stop and repeat that part just to be sure i didn't space out and miss something xD
Best.Intro.Ever.
DM: "Ok, we're starting at 5th level, and I'm letting everyone pick one Rare item to start with."
Problem player: "I pick Helm Of Teleportation and teleport the party away from whatever you have planned for us. Three times per day."
DM: "Joke's on you, we're playing Dungeon of the Mad Mage."
What happens in that
@@thedootlord All Teleportation/Planar travel spells fail when trying to enter or leave the dungeon, or to move from one level to another. There are a few loopholes but it mostly keeps the guard rails on.
@@Maxbeedo2 ah,got it
Acc to DMG, its an uncommon magic item if its a high magic campaign. But everyone is different. If the scene had been me and my group:
Me, DM "We start at level 5, you all get 1 rare magic item-"
Player "I pick helm of teleport!"
Me, "you all get 1 rare magic item (lifts paper sheet) from this list. And no, helm of teleport is not on the list." My thoughts: _i hope he doesnt notice the voyager necklace which is a reskinned teleport helm_
You teleport and the bbeg looks at you
"You weren't supposed to be here yet, oh well"
And casts action surge double Fireball at 9th level
I would disagree with the fact that rarity is worthless, it is simply unreliable.
80% or more magic items are fine (if at times a bit weaker) in their tier.
20% or less are one, in extremely rare cases two rarities off.
As a decently experienced dm I let the player's choose, but I price every item and decide when an item is in the wrong rarity and fix it.
An inexperienced dm should either seek council when handing out magic items, be very careful or just have an understanding with your players that when a mistake is made you will fix it since you are inexperienced.
I will add that an inexperienced dm making or handing out items can do more damage than letting the players pick them for two reasones
1)The dm will surely make at least one mistake due to inexperience with how characters and items work and what character want out of items or are even able to use, for example, "oh yes I'll give the wizard a bag of holding and the fighter a +1 weapon but now you gave a member a utility item that serves the whole party and the other a straight combat power upgrade, these things frequently result in creating potentially bigger imbalance gaps than the players could've created themselves, assuming goodwill
2)If those gaps appear the fault is solely of the dm and is harder to explain to a player that the item you picked was busted and you must take it away, whereas giving a concession makes it easier for a player (in most cases) to accept the situation and find a second pick
An unreliable standard is worthless, though. If you can't count on the standard to apply and you aren't familiar with game balance, you can't use it. At least with CR the effects will only last for one encounter, a magic item stays for the campaign unless you make the VERY unpopular move of using DM powers to steal the item back. At least CR gives you the EXP earned from defeating it, Rarity's only function is what makes it dangerous. Not to mention how balanced some items seem on face value, but turn out to be much stronger than anticipated. The tattoo and staff of the python both appear to be fairly balanced on the first or second read, but they are game breaking. Not to mention that there are plenty of items in the same tier that have literally no mechanical effect. Without any of those issues, it is already unusable. Using it requires a total overhaul of the system, from reassigning value to every item in the game to determining at what tier each item should be handed out.
The thing is that if it doesn't work 99% of the time it's a lot of extra effort the DM needs to put into it. And frankly that's annoying x)
To be honest... it's pretty much worthless.
1. You can't compare accurately between "Rarities" at all. Compare Winged Boots, Instruments of the Bards, or Bloodwell Vials +1 (uncommon) to Dragon Scale Armor, Animated Shields, or Scimitars of Speed (Very Rare). This isn't about 1 or 2 items being off.
2. Even within a given "Rarity", there's huge variance in power. Compare the aforementioned Dragon Scale Armor, Animated Shields, or Scimitars of Speed to +3 Rods of the Pact Keeper, Staves of Power or Candles of Invocation. The difference isn't minor or limited to a few items.
If it doesn't give you an accurate measure of its power as a DM, why bother having a "Rarity" system at all?
I am an inexperienced DM.
I gave a Tabaxi PC a circle of blasting because of random rolls.
The party is level 2.
Fun way take the item worth it? They had to discover how to make it work. After fleeing from some goblins and Dire rats. So they were hiding under some dense brush in a small hollow. The Tabaxi accidentally triggers the firing mechanism. Boom, no more hiding place. Tried to use it again when the rats found them. Oops! No more charges for the day.
The PCs had a blast. That's what's important.
@@sethcourtad8733 The clue is in the word "standard".
I had a similar conversation with a line manager many years ago, when I was trying to make sense of some sales data that simply didn't add up.
Her comment was, "The data isn't entirely accurate..." she then had me marked down as "One to watch" when I pointed out that that is simply a way of saying "It's inaccurate" and went on to point out that unless we know which of the data are "not entirely accurate" and by what sorts of variance, how the hell are we supposed to work round it?
I think "Rarity" is a pretty dumb measure anyway, if the rarity of an item is being used to reference its Impact in the game.
I think it's a lazy, familiar, carry over from MMOs where items tend to be measured in the rarity of their drop rate, with better stuff dropping less frequently to encourage grinding....
Why would the great crafters of items consistently make the shit stuff more than the good stuff?
It's far better to know how items are likely to impact your campaign rather than how often they are likely to turn up. Especially if you are handing them out as a freebie to players.
Items like a basic Enchanted +1 weapon are of minor impact. They don't really change the game in standard combat, but will allow a player to hit creatures otherwise unharmed by normal weapons...
Anything that lets them fly, potentially has a serious impact, especially if all the party can use it, and thereby bypass a lot of ground based content.
Planar travel... MAJOR impact...
Anything that grants "Wish" level magic would be filed under "OK, Mr/Mrs DM... you made your own bed by letting them have it... now lie in it!"
Of course, if you don't let them choose their own magic items and give them out in a considered and planned way, they will (caveat: USUALLY!) have exactly the impact you intend, and rarity isn't an issue.
My favorite magic item is the belt of many pockets from back in 3rd edition. It was a belt with pockets that let you access 37 separate one cubic foot dimensional storage spaces.
I had a half ogre druid wear one around his bicep as an arm band. One pocket was for spell focuses and components. One pocket was for sand. And the rest of the pockets were for different bowling ball sized rocks, each with a different misspelling of "counterspell" scrawled on them with crayons.
Fighting a melee character? Shout "Pocket Sand!" and throw a handful in their eyes.
Fighting a mage? Shout "Counterspell!" and lob a rock the size of their head directly at their skull.
Best magic item in the game.
Hahahahah.
Best edition too, and I won’t take no guff about it neither.
Hilarious story
Im going to use this as an npc lmao
The imbalance within the same tier is also kinda funny lol. Why do Boots of Striding and Springing exist in the same tier as both Boots of Flying (much stronger) AND Ring of Jumping (much weaker)???
Also I think most of this is alleviated by a DM just saying, "pick an item, but run it by me first" and then being firm in their vetos.
The flight boots have a limited duration and that can be a nasty surprise though.
I use Ring of Jumping all the time. Lol.
For this one there is actually a reason, but its a dumb one when moved to 5e due to the ring requiring attunement. Rings in 3 and 2e that were based granting/replicating a spell had generally weaker effects compared to other items due to how simple it is to keep swapping them out (even mid combat), while other slots (except sometimes neck and the massively more expensive weapons) werent. So a Spell Ring of Jump (not a Ring of Jumping which gained the same benefits mechanically but didnt count as the spell at will without charges) was a easy +10 to +30 eb to jump checks only when needed.
Your character wasn't prevented from wearing multiple rings, just from benefiting from more than 1 on each hand (or in 3.5, 2 on one hand but no rings on any other).
@@ANDELE3025 This is actually super interesting. I've really only played 5e so I'm sure I miss plenty of influences from past editions like this
@@fellwindthat would matter a lot more if you couldn't split 4h up in 1min intervals. as they are written, except for long distance travel, they are basically limitless flight
I for one have seen dms create magic items "worse than the professionals." WOTC isnt perfect. They make mistakes but they are smarter at alot of design things than many of us. that being said dms should "Take chances make, mistakes, and get messy" because it will happen one way or another.
I think it takes a min-maxer to spot a min-maxing item.
It doesn't matter how many campaigns they've run, or if they're "professionals".
You just need the gift of being able to think in 'Cheese' (the language of the min-maxer).
Most players, DM's, and game writers, see an ability or item effect, and their eyes scan the "what it does" and then they glaze over and get bored with the minor details.
A min-maxer reads the same text, and they're scanning: cooldown? is that radius or diamter? what status effects does it interact with? did that say creature or humanoid? Was that a flat amount or a percentage? Does it stack? Concentration? What does the diminishing returns look like? How would that work if you cast it over running water while hanging upside down? etc. And THEN they look at what the effect actually "does".
For example, most people read Wall of Force and think "oh battlefield control, that could be handy". A min-maxer looks at Wall of Force, "if a creature is in the path of the wall, the caster chooses which side of the wall the creature is pushed to" and instantly thinks "oh, I cast wall of force 2 inches above the stone floor, and I chose all of the enemies whose ankles it intersects to be pushed 'under' it"...
Anyway, as long as you can think in Cheese, you should be able to home brew stuff which works fine. To a certain degree, a DM needs to be able to think in Cheese to homebrew fixes for game content on the fly anyway. As a general rule though, for homebrew magic items, lean heavy on flavor, but light on effect mechanics.
@@kathrynck
Another point toward generating items for players is a simple axiom: The more powerful it is, the fewer people who can actually make use of it--and visa versa. Anyone can use a Ring of Deflection, but you might need to be a high level Sorcerer to overcome the will of an intelligent ring whose effects you want to employ mid-fight--and even then, there might be a price for failure, or success.
I have not been impressed by WotC.
But then my D&D group consists mostly of people with PhDs in Mathematics, Physics and History.
I kinda wish rarity was just how difficult it was to find something, and there was a separate stat, like level, that described when it might be most appropriate for the GM to put it into the campaign.
Then you could have a 5th level campaign start, and then the GM could just tell the players, “Everyone starts with an uncommon item of level 5 or lower.”
That is how it is, at least in 5e. It isn't about power but rarity this is why we have common/Uncommon/Rare.
However the level of an item also feels kind of odd because what does that level do? There are 6 levels already in play. I do understand where you coming from though.
@@WhyYouMadBoi It is about power, because 5e ties rarity to power by telling GMs that the rarer an item is, the higher level a player needs to be to access it.
I think 5e makes a small stumble by tying cost, power, scarcity, and access to the same system. I’d like to see those more separated in a future system, since surely there’s common items that are just prohibitively expensive for beginner adventurers. We have those in real life.
@@XandiG The first few lines instantly made me think of The Rock rapping and now I can't think.
@@WhyYouMadBoi it makes more sense than the current system, you would just treat it like an rpg. If an item is too high of a level, probably don't give it to your party. If it's too low, they probably won't find much use in it, or just keep it for utility. With a level system you can easily glance at an item and decide if it's something to award or not, and the level doesn't have to "do" anything aside from show its intended time period to hand out.
That’s exactly how Pathfinder 2 handles it
Something that should be important is giving players magic items that fit their build. For example a fighter with the unarmed fighting style/a monk should maybe get access to the Insignia of Claws/Eldritch Claw Tattoo. I found it extremely frustrating, when stuff was handed out and one character was pretty much always left out, when it came to something they could use.
Thats why eventually the ranger in my group will be awarded/looting a Flaming Longbow (flame tongue in bow form). They already have an elemental gem and wand of magic missiles.
The rogue already has boots of elvenkind and earring (helm) of comprehend languages.
Artificer has 4 neads of necklace of fireballs, and a pearl of power.
I agree 100%, I even made a build to showcase the danger of letting people pick magic items and showing why I personally avoid it.
Thank you for sharing, love your channel... now get the %^&& out of this comments section!
@@vernonhampton5863 YOU CANT MAKE ME
This is why I like artificer. I have the power now :).
@@blairbrook1336 You dont give me stuff ? Fine, ill make the macguffin myself
@@johannschiller2263 I kinda sorta was the only one to work it one time it was weird dm was up set that I was able to use it and reverse engineer it 0.0
I feel this. I had someone on a youtube video bragging about what their build could do and doing a build guide. But their DM let them cherry pick their items and at one point gave the character have a free point of Int, allowing them the freedom to pick a half feat to bump their int up. I was like this build won't give us the same results it's giving you. Your DM has been more generous than pretty much most DM's ever and that has upped the power level of your PC.
I keep telling people that. But they never listen that builds that super rely on magic items arenx't really builds
This was actually Offbeat Outlaw who was stating that its all well and fun to powerbuild but when items or DM gifts come into play, you have to be malleable.
Yeah 9 times out of 10 when I see people posting about their awesome builds it is either A: Not legal B: Impossibly high rolled stats allowing broken Multi class or C: Super generous DM with items and attributes etc. or a mixture of the three. My rules for highlighting a build are: No Items, no home-brew, point buy, level 12 max unless promoting for a high level one shot.
@@Hyde_Hill I remember a time where I was listening to a "Awesome builds you made" MrRipper was reading it and some bloak was talking about a strength monk build. Which I'm like how is that even a strong build in 5e in anyway? I gotta find that video
found it: th-cam.com/video/rYlNXJV68ME/w-d-xo.html
The point of that video wasn’t bragging about the build, it was simply showing the dangers of letting players pick items and how to be malleable. In fact I said that multiple times in that video.
I like the idea of magic item shops a lot. What I usually do is determine what my players can and can't buy, either rebalancing magic items I think can "break" the game or just outright not making them available. But if I find one player has bypassed this and bought a "broken" magic item I hadn't anticipated for, I simply talk to them and either rebalance or exchange that item for something more adequate for the game.
What I'm saying is: magic item shops are a lot of fun and there are many ways to make them work if you communicate properly with your players.
Honestly, a lot of complaints about DND 5E can be solved by "communication". Its not that hard. The DM is a player, thye are playing a different role. Communicate with eachother to tell a story. Magic stores work, but you can't allow a blanket list allowance.
For a common item, a Clockwork Amulet is incredibly powerful. If you know for a fact that 10 + your bonuses to hit WILL hit a target, you can guarantee damage once per day. Apply that to a character with Sharpshooter or Great Weapon Master or just a Rogue with all the Sneak Attack damage. That is a LOT of potential for a common.
Looking at what someone else has written in the replies about this item, I would also make it clear that even if it's uncommon, such an item isn't always or even occasionally available for multiple purchases, just multiple people might be able to get it. Having someone walk around with a bag of those just screams "no no no, not going to happen," to me on the DM end.
It's still once a day. If you're putting more into the campaign than a single combat, the item gets much less useful.
Cleric of War got the same thing as a Channel Divinity.
My current DM lets us take 10 for any roll. It hasn't broken the game.
Have you actually used it or played a game with one? It's not a big deal once a day, especially since it's only attack rolls which means, at most, around 20 hit points from either attack roll spells (of which there are natively like 5 leveled ones worth using in 5e, one of which makes 3+ attack rolls, only one of which you can add the bonus to) or melee attacks.
I've had shops where the PCs can design their own magic items with me. They express what they're looking for, the kind of effects or utility and I tell them what can or can't be done and the price for some different options. The transaction might take place over more than one interaction. Usually I can come up with prices and limitations on the spot from familiarity with other items and experience with the items and process of designing items. If I'm not that sure about something I might say it needs more time, or might cost more depending how hard to process is, and get some more time to think about it.
It's never been a problem, the players typically love it and get items that mesh with their character and the story better.
Artificer does that on his own. Can't remember if that's a homebrew class.
Decanter of endless water is very underrated, I take shape water all the time and I have a million and one uses for the spell. So having some water on hand is always nice.
I made this mistake once. They all took bags of tricks and destroyed every encounter with their non concentration summons.
Queue Pokemon theme song
That said, know your players. I shouldn't be given a bag of tricks (and I don't want one), but someone else might be harmless with it. It's live in my campaign and it's more of a fun-placebo for the player who has it than actually effective.
Well, it wasn’t really a placebo (in my experience) because they summoned all 3 at the beginning of the day, so they had 18 animals charging into combat. They took a stupid amount of hits to all bring down. Luckily, it was a one shot, and I’ve learned my lesson.
Yeah summoning stuff in 5E is very broken and unfun. The horn of Valhalla is even worse. Even one horn is basically enough to grind your game to a halt as a single PC can summon in an average of 7 berserkers, each with 67 hp. And that's using the weakest version of the horn.
@@taragnor a dm gave a horn to me once. I was a wizard. I used it once and we got through like 2 combats that day. Never used it again.
The CR and rewards systems pair together to be arguably the biggest obstacle to new DM's in all of 5e. While I agree that the ideal is a DM tailoring the items to their players/game, we really should have a better system for helping new DM's.
It's not like these people didn't write a PHB with the Wizard, Paladin and Monk and thought they had done a good job.
The fact that the mizzium apparatus is a common and not a very rare item is mind blowing
I believe it's uncommon, but your point stands.
its uncommon for ravnica, and doesn't exist at all elsewhere unless DM approves.
same with any item, and ... controversial take... any spells as well.
@@killfear Then whats the point of putting it in the game? I mean in this ravnica there are warlocks, clerics, fighters and other stuff.
I do agree that items should have a boost or drop in rarity if it was applied to Toreil (Forgot the spelling but still the world where DnD is located)
I think its because these designers never played older editions or even looked back and think this system just don't got lore to itself.
@@WhyYouMadBoi let me lead with: I'm not attacking your comment. I am addressing setting content vs core book content, and it's presence in non-setting games.
Guildmaster's Guide was created by the MTG wing of WOTC, less so the D&D team.... they included mizzium because the izzet league runs on mizzium apparatae.... similar to the dragonmarks from Eberron... uncommon in eberron, unheard of elsewhere.... but -- to your point-- some DMs will allow non-eberron characters to implement dragonmarks, similar to how some DMs will implement theros piety or ravnica renown outside their native settings.
The summary of this is... each option makes sense in context to their native book... of which none of these above examples are from Core Books.
Your off-hand statement about designers being all over the place with assigning rarity may well be justifified, but the one specific example that you turned to -- mizzium apparatus -- is a coincidental caveat that is actually GOOD for this conversation about how appropriate is granting magic items (or any other setting-specific mechanics like those above and the new strix feats and spells) without considering their impact on the game. DMs should have a discerning eye about anything players want brought in beyond what's in the Player's Handbook.
Here's the same perspective applied to a different situation: If Hexblade was introduced through GGtRavnica as a Rakdos patron option, instead of the Raven Queen in XGtE, we'd see a lot of people leaning into the Ravnica book to access that subclass, discussing whether or not to reflavor Rakdos being your patron because of how desirable hexblade mechanics are.
I think your coming from the right perspective, but it taps into this larger design space discussion. :)
@@killfear I know you're not attacking my comment you ninny I don't need to be told that like some damn child, this is a discussion. Afterall WOTC and MTG are owned by the same damn company so like have them talk about it. They are after all basically putting DLC into WOTC game.
This is why I say that "Hey give them Forgotten Realms names" to it could be used outside of those settings.
Also to address you last point Hexblade isn't a Raven Queen patron. Your Patron is the Hexblade or well the force that manifest itself into a hexblade. She was said to make the first of the hexblades (though blackrazor is said to be a hexblade, and he doesn't have a connection towards her). You point does stand ground due to the Critical Role book which added Echo knight Fighter and 2 wizard subclasses which got their power and magics from a different sort of magic which wouldn't fit in alot of worlds or even in the Forgotten Realms setting so either change that up (although it's weird for the fighter side but just say its ki) or ban it haha.
I have a DM who has currently given one of our characters a Sun Blade, a Stone of Good Luck, AND an ability that boosts his Strength to 22. He also just gave him plate armor for free at one point... meanwhile my character has struggled to save up enough gold to buy it. And he's currently only Level 7. It's overshadowed the rest of the players in the group so much that it's difficult to actually feel useful when he's able to just tank and kill everything while we're stuck with mostly uncommon items. Our barbarian doesn't even have a weapon that's magical lol.
I know this video is only about buying items, but it's also highly frustrating to have a DM that doesn't think about the needs of all players.
Bro,that sounds like favoritism
Maybe talk yo him about this
1 players w 4 special stuff? Thats kinda sus.
I'd allow the 4 abilities/items but only if spread around. The only way one PC would get all 4 is if the party agreed to it.
Staff of python should be uncommon. If you pick that at 11th level it would break on your first challenging encounter. And moon druids can do exactly that at 6th level anyway.
I did let characters who were joining a campaign pick an item, but it was from a shortlist I composed. If they wanted something else they could ask but no guarantees. They were coming in at level 6 or 7, so I could be a little more lenient, but I wanted to make sure nothing was OP, and would not overshadow the stuff that the players who had been there from the beginning had picked up.
Even something like the pipes of haunting is really strong in tier 1 and tier 2. It is an uncommon magic item that you can activate with an action, up to three times per day, and it provides a mass frightened effect in 30 ft radius around you (DC 15), with no friendly fire. The effect is weaker than, say, the web spell, but doesn't require your concentration... So I think it kind of comes out to being a very strong level 2 or weak/moderate level 3 spell effect. Three times a day. And the pipes don't even require attunement! Not outright broken the way staff of python can be, but very strong, and you can combine it with control spells that do use concentration to really disrupt encounters.
I think staff of the python would be OK as an uncommon magic item if it were a consumable (so, one and done). After 10 minutes or when the giant snake dies, it reverts to the staff and immediately shatters. Just don't let there be tons of them available for the players to acquire.
I feel like staff of the python is meant to be a villain item. Hence why it is one of the few items that has straightforward rules for it breaking: You give it to a villain and the party destroys it as part of defeating them.
I've been allowing my players to choose their own magic items for years at each level of a campaign. I do give myself veto power on the item, but have only had to use this a couple times. I mostly play with people who are more in it for RP and not combat. If you are playing at a table of optimizers I can see this being a different story. I guess it is dependent on the table you play at.
I do want to ask if you've vetoed Adamantine armor.
I played in a delightful campaign once. Started at mid level, got several thousand starting gold and the option to buy magic items along with our mundane equipment, with prices adapted from the charts in the Downtime Activities chart in the DMG. The starting gold was set with the intention that we could afford one rare item and maybe one or two commons, based on how much other stuff we bought. Except if you know that section of the DMG, you know that rares are ten times as valuable as uncommons...
I did have to do a bit of filtering by "does not require attunement," but I was decked out like a Christmas tree, while my party members had thing like a Flame Tongue weapon for the same budget. It really, really showed how broken the system was. At least 3.5/PF had varying prices for items, rather than just a few, broad bands.
As a PF gm, the varying prices, built-in crafting rules and wealth-by-level expectation really help, but it does suffer from some... quality control issues while giving players RAW authority to do broken things with magic items. Worst offender I can think of is the Cyclops Helm. Starting at lvl 3, a Wizard/Sorcerer can easily be churning these out for 2,800gp a piece, there's no attunement so you can swap them out whenever you want and each one lets you CHOOSE THE RESULT OF YOUR NEXT d20 ROLL as an immediate action. You can force Vorpal decapitations with this. Hell, at lower levels even guaranteeing Scythe or Musket crits is pretty big.
Honestly, this video seems less about players choosing their own magic items being a problem, and more about how the rarity system in 5e is seriously broken. Unless a DM researches every magic item that a player could potentially be given in their game, then a PC could get an overpowered magic item just as easily as if they had picked it themselves.
Basically, whether or not you want to let the players choose magic items on their own or award them yourself, one or both parties are going to have to do some extensive research into the items to make sure that they are both useful, but not game breaking. That's an unreasonable amount of work to put on someone for a game, especially the DM whose probably already swamped with work as is.
tl;dr: Letting players chose magic items isn't necessarily a problem, but the rarity system is.
Well-written!
And why a DM should always say that they need to approve magic items before they are allowed giving them time to research the item and any feedback people may have given about how it can be abused or is unbalanced in certain situations or at all situations as the case may be.
The hell is a 'Low Magic' level 17 campaign anyway? RAW your spellcasters can still wish for simulacrum, call beings from other planes to do their bidding, telepathically talk to people on the other side of the world, or talk to people on other planes, store high value things in a demiplane, can teleport across the world, have a 17% chance to talk to and get a favor from their own god, and can magically churn out a few dozen high-demand artisan products of their choice weekly for steady income. Low magic is an oxymoron
Low magic campaigns have to limit full spellcasters. 50/50 multiclass and half-casters at most
@@Eivael thats a very arbitary and potentially very unfun ruling
@@texteel it's not for every campaign or anything, but if you have full casters its very hard to have something feel low magic.
To me, the classic high fantasy/low magic "campaign" is the lord of the rings. The world is fantastic and magic has a huge influence, but it's rare and powerful.
@@Eivael i think you can do some minor tailorings in the first two tiers to make it low magic and frankly just not go higher than 12th level. From that point on you would have to do a lot of rework in the monsters, adventure hooks, classes and items to keep it low magic. Could also say that full casters just cant have higher than 6th level spells, (and maybe they dont even exist or are so powerful a wish is like an era defining event) so again capping at lvl 11-12. Because like, i think levels 15-20 just don't fit for a low magic style
You mean boots of Elvenkind which give situational advantage on stealth and the cloak of elvenkind which gives advantage without caveats and disadvantage to anyone trying to see you (which is most perception) aren't the same power level?
*Insert Surprised Pikachu*
The designers simply have realized that crying bad DMing is more effective than actually fixing the game when it comes to broken stuff.
5e in a nutshell. Designers off loaded everything onto the DM thus putting all the blame on that DM.
DMs don't figure into WotC's calculations. Its all about selling books to people who just roll hundreds of characters they will never play.
@@thetimebinder Or they expect DMs to be in control. Something like the tattoo so obviously does not work like that they probably thought it did not need to be spelled out. It is not even as if they are new they were first introduced in 3rd edition.
@@FakeSchrodingersCat Except Adventure League exists where rules are to be followed as written.
@@thetimebinder But the rule does not state you can cast something more then once for the virtual spell slot represented by the tattoo. The idea that because the tattoo is active for the duration of the spell does not even imply that it can be used again during that duration. Otherwise the same argument could be made for wands or even standard spellcasting. Yes some people will argue for everything to be done in willfully literal misinterpretations of the rules but those people are called rules lawyers and no one likes them. It at no point says you can cast it multiple times.
Common sense dictates that you can't cast the spell from a spellwrought tattoo more than once.
However, the other thing I'd note is "for the duration" so you cast aid 100 times and magically layer 500 hit points onto your party. once the spell ends, (for each sample of the spell cast) the characters then lose, an additional 5 hit points, each. resulting in a TPK. (Unless you can figure out how to cure/deal with, 5 damage a round, for 100 rounds in a row).
The wording does kinda say you lose 5 current HP at the end- but WotC's unofficial guidance (Twitter) is that you don't.
I would love to see you rate magic items like you rate spells. Not only would it be interesting to see your opinions on the magic items but the resulting list would be very helpful for dm's.
i love your username
Last campaign i played we completed a difficult one-shot and so the main campaign characters got a magic item reward. We submitted a 5 magic-item list ranked what we wanted most to least and the dm talked with each of us to figure out the reward. Other items on the list could be kept as ideaa for later in the campaign. But there was a definite filter.
Bag o' beans still made it through and was abused. However, its effects were aknowledged, made near non-canon for the module's story, and we moved on the player moving on near empty handed for his shenanigans.
Whoa! So cool to see that you have your own channel! I was Davor on the PF1 forums back in the day, and I remember chatting rules and reading your guides. Just thought I'd say "Hi!"
For what it's worth, if I had a campaign centered around the players having a powerful magical item, I'd do what Lord of the Rings does, which is to make the item dangerous to use. This could be because it's cursed, or draws unwanted attention from the person you're trying to get it from, or both. Though make it actually powerful, but not so powerful that it outweighs the side-effects.
Oooh that burn... "you cant do worse than the professionals"
I usually allow everyone to pick an Uncommon item. We're playing in Eberron where these items are more available. We also haven't started a game below level 5 in over a year.
The staff of the python is powerful, but you missed a big part of it.
"By using a bonus action to speak the command word again, you return the staff to its normal form in a space formerly occupied by the snake." The DM can choose the space. Make it go outside further than 30 feet away.
So now, the staff is over 30 feet away when it transforms back, and the druid has to use it's full move and action to dash in order to get there. Or, just move, and not get there to pick it up. But if they move to get to the staff and pick it up, and can't attack, or cast a spell that round. It also (usually) means they are in melee with whatever was killing the snake, and it's known that this is the PC that controls it, so now, the PC just became the target, surrounded by the enemies that were attacking the snake.
I'm certain this isn't intended. The snake occupies 9 spaces -- the staff has to fall into just one of those. That's all.
Edit: I'm reading your comment as saying the snake turns into a staff at any point that's ever been occupied by the snake. Whether the snake is there now, or moved through the space several turns ago.
Great video. Really love your DM and design-related content. Thanks for giving such a comprehensive take on the whole subject. This cleared things up a lot up for me
I ended up creating a spreadsheet classifying magic items as available in villages, towns or cities. Some items I have marked as black market only and anything not on the list has to be made or commissioned by a PC. If a magic item becomes problematic I just remove it from the list and if I offer a PC a free item pick I can say 'pick one uncommon off the town list' and feel pretty safe that I won't see anything oddball.
14:58 there may be no charges but I'd say the moment it becomes a snake it is no longer the staff you were attuned too. So making it become a staff to used it a gain would work unless you have another hour to attune.
Problem with that is now you have to come up with a reason as to why you can command it if you are no longer attuned to it
I look at that Spellwrought Tattoo kind of like trigger rules in M:TG or Yu-Gi-Oh. Two things happen when you cast a spell from a tattoo: The spell is cast, and the tattoo begins glowing. The latter strikes me like tapping for cost in M:TG, you can't tap a tapped permanent for its own effect, so the trigger conditions are "Tattoo exists" and "Tattoo is not glowing" since the tattoo is unable to begin glowing if it's already glowing.
In M:TG terms it's like an enchantment or artifact that has an effect similar to (tap): Target creature gains +0/+5 until the start of your next turn. If you would untap , send it to the graveyard instead (not destroy).
For the staff of the python, if you add "after 24 hours" to the end of the last sentence, i think it fixes it.
Yes, that would have worked just fine.
I love rolling up random loot instead of handing requested items out. I love watching players come up with ways to use what they have rather than continue to do what they have always done, only now with bigger numbers. In my experience, the players at the table are usually reasonable about a DM saying "hey that's kinda insane and I don't think that's what the devs were intending, lets limit that item to what it sounds like it can do instead of what RAW technically allows it to" whenever they figure out a way to solve every problem ever with a loophole.
As a player, I despise choosing or "buying" magic items. In just about every campaign I have been in, the DM has basically had lots of options to buy magic items and effectively pick magic items. I don't want to buy things to "Build myself a load out". I want to find interesting things and find ways to work them into play.
This is not to say I don't appreciate a DM customizing the game to their players - I played a character with a peg leg and the DM once switched out some boots of elvenkind that were in the campaign for a peg leg of elvenkind. That was amazingly cool. But it was originally some adventure loot or randomly rolled loot that they added some flavor to. Its not just picking stuff that I want and removing the verisimilitude of a real fantasy world where you don't find what you want but find what you get.
I think that was very cool of your dungeon master to do that!
Also wondering if Prosthetics (most recent update TCE page 134) are a common thing or a very rare thing item (Rarity aside,) in most game worlds, this and other readers?
Waiting for the video you do where you revise all the item rarities and their features, like you did with spells. XP
Great video.
That would be an overwhelming task...
@@TreantmonksTemple absolutely agree, it would be a never-ending task with all the releases until this edition is done.
But if I had faith in someone who could do it, it would definitely be you.
Half a year late, but for the 4:40 min bit, id attribute it to:
1) The gold in the starting equipment (more than enough to by the DMG get 2 very rare or 4-6 rare items with some spare change).
2) Assumption that the party still want to feel progression.
3) To also fill the use of the table for a player joining a ongoing campaign thus not devalue both the loot already acquired and give RP opening for player trade/others decking out their new ally (or not) thus instantly having the mechanics compliment the characterizations.
Looking over the characters sometimes doesn't work. I made a custom "growth" magic items for my group. At level 1 the rogue made a pirate so the item I made him a magic cutlass. He became an archer.
Now I want to know who thought handing out an essentially infinite, concentration-less Conjure Animals to a level 1 character was a good idea.
The same one who made the rest of the book
I think often what I've done is said "choice within reason"
Have a dialog with each player about why they want specific passive or active effects and decide with them what seems fair
It's on players to mediate themselves for fairness to make the table fun as well as a DM
I would consider taking something horribly broken as a failure from the player in part of their job -to facilitate the fun of others at the table as well as themselves
Level 5 Bard. Instrument of the Bards - One of the Uncommon varieties. Gives disadvantage on Saving Throws when saving against Charm effects. Bard takes Hypnotic Pattern. DM either has to pick every monster based on Charm resistance/immunity, or get their encounters all run over.
Oh, and it also allows the Bard to cast Fly, Invisibility, levitate, and a bunch of other spells without using a spell slot.
As a player, I certainly enjoy more being able to actually have a hand in what and how I obtain magic items. I play with 2 DM's who do the exact opposite of each other: In one game, we have our own artificer that can make us magic items that we ask for, and in the other the only way to obtain them is via the DM handing them out to us. Whilst in the latter case that DM often gives out lots of homebrew items that are fun, cool and sometimes even wildly overpowered... I just enjoy the ability to actually make a build and piece together the character how I want to play them, much the same way one would choose a feat or somesuch to direct your playstyle.
The random-ness of having it completely out of your hands can definitely be fun but I find that it often leads to long stretches of game time where you're not getting any items you actually want and can't incorporate easily into the way you play. Maybe it makes the game more artificial just being able to say "I want this" and being granted that request (within reason, we're still limited by gold so the former DM still has a hard cap on what rarities we can buy especially since the party shares gold) but it's also just really, really fun being able to track your progress as time goes on. As you accomplish fun and cool things in the game, gathering the gold to get that really neat magic item that you'd really like for your character. Magic items in that way can act as mini-milestones that are fun to achieve and then play with, always fighting for that next cool thing.
Something that just occurred to me while writing this comment though... We don't play with XP in either game so I imagine that could also be a part of it-we can't reliably go out of our way to try and level up, which leaves magic items as the only means that we can actively take (even though like levels, gold is still granted by DM fiat) to actually upgrade our characters... Anyway, this is an interesting topic to discuss regardless.
I think there's a happy middle ground, where a DM includes items that work well for the players, or maybe were from a player wish list without the players simply choosing the items.
@@TreantmonksTemple Yeah I think a combo of the two is the way to go. Although granted gold should be somewhat meaningless regardless considering even I think magic item shops should be avoided. Us having an artificer is pretty new even in our playgroup, we usually just spend all our thousands of gold on Matthew Colvilles Strongholds xD In my opinion, crafting them or questing for them should be the way to go. There's a lot of space in there for the DM's to draw out when and how they obtain their desired magic items, so they still have plenty of control, alongside ones the DM wants to provide/rolls for
Yeah I know later on westmarch discord server and to reward people for playing a character to high level by picking items of certain rarity. I had a gambler’s blade greatsword for an early +3 weapon. Or serpent scale armor for 20+ AC early on. Save boosting items are a common pick for people. +2 to your spell save DC is crazy or picking a belt of giant strength and not investing in that stat.
I had to look up this item again because I was positive I played the module it was in, and yes once again, the gambler's blade is a *unique* (as in one time per game universe, one of several unique items,) item that is from a specific "Extra Life" event for player characters of 5th to 10th level, though you can choose the item it appears from a list weapon wise and it is meant to be for people who played and overcame that encounter in that module.
If we're just handing it out to any person requests it as a magic item, it kind of ruins the point of a specific item that is made as a one-time item not for everyone else. Multiple items in this adventure are made for people who are getting two items of 5th-10th level equivalent. Again, let me emphasize, that *this item is equivalent of two magic items of its Rarity of Fifth to Tenth level*. I won't say what module it is, but the module was an excellent one and it's highly recommended if you happen to look it up or happened to play it by chance because the DM is reading this and getting a thumbs-up from a person on the player end.
(I was also reminded what the astral plane looks like when someone showed why you don't put an extradimensional space item into another item of extradimensional space, but that wasn't module-specific, that was just a mistake from another player putting an extradimensional space item that they didn't know was extra-dimensional space into a bag of holding.)
Many westmarch campaigns are accepting the rule of cool, but they really need to look into if unique items are supposed to be given to all players. If it's an unbalancing thing there better be house rules about how you are going to obtain it in regards to minimum levels, minimum abilities if you are crafting it, Etc.My westmarch campaign has exactly that.
What do you think about the choice to get rid of item creation feats? That's one element I really miss from Pathfinder, both because I feel it makes the world feel less cohesive (the existence of the feats explains how magic items get into the world to begin with), and because I think they were a good way of balancing players' ability to choose their own equipment against a substantial opportunity cost (i.e. taking other feats).
I had mixed feelings about feats that require you to guess the amount of downtime you'll have.
This is why Artificers make me want to rip my hair out as a DM. Feels like I end up with so much extra homework just because Wizards of the Coast slapped item crafting/replication on this class without much thought.
I once ran a short campaign starting at 5th...
I curated (randomly rolled, with exclusions) a single list of magic items. Then, the players each took turns selecting one item, and passed the list to the next player.
It got them items that fit (more or less) their PCs, and still allowed pretty tight control of the 'back story loot'.
(fwiw, the campaign was a 5e redux of "The Desert of Desolation")
Spellwrought Tatoos are clearly intended to have one charge, and one charge only. The Snake Staff only works for Warlocks, Clerics and Druids and CAN be killed if the enemy focuses it down before the user's turn comes around so they can revert it to staff form, or just concentrates on killing the staff's owner.
Frankly, my favorite magic item was when my Warlock found a Broom of Animated Attack. A cursed item that attacks anyone who attempts to use it to fly. He had an ability that allowed him to fly without an item or spellcasting, so he would PRETEND to use the broom to fly, and eventually, someone tried to steal the broom and fly with it. THUMP! WHACK!
You may THINK a broom of flying makes for an invincible defense. Wyverns and any intelligent monster with ranged weapons beg to differ.
Personally I favour a cooperative choosing between players and dms, so that expectations are managed and it feels like everyone is on the same side
Anecdote: in my current campaign (level five start) each player was allowed to chose one uncommon magic item. This choice ended up allowing my forge cleric to have only ten strength but wear plate armor (mithril plate) and for our barbarian to take an 8 in strength only to take gauntlets of ogre strength. It may be a bit minor but it allowed both of us to be far more liberal with secondary ability score points that we otherwise wouldn’t be able to afford.
I always get the +1 spell DC items as a spellcaster whenever I get the choice to start with an uncommon. (the +2 DC if I get to choose rare) since your totally fine as a player to spend an entire ASI on +1 spell DC. Plus I just hate magic resistance in the later part of the campaign. I'm fine with legendary resistance, but magic resist is so stupid on top of that. (Another reason why I've moved away from Sorcs as spellcasters and instead go Eliquence Bard if I want to play a spellcaster, since they just get a possible +12 to their spell save DC, not even Tiamant can make a 40 spell DC with a nat 20 and that feels so good.)
@@archmagemc3561 my dm specifically banned those ones lol
@@tokenamblyopiac4474 Even the rod of the pactkeeper from the DMG?
Having run plenty of my own campaigns, I will say that sometimes it's alright to let players choose a magic item, but it can't be too open-ended. The general methods to go about it, imhe, are:
1. As stated in video, create your own and dole those out. I've done this plenty and it's awesome. In one of my campaigns I had a Monk get "Handwraps of Lesser Undead Slaying." These were basically +1 gloves that destroyed undead on what would normally be a critical roll (since they are immune to normal critical damage) if they have 4HD or fewer. This helped in a handful of fights against large numbers of weak skeletons/zombies. It would never trivialize the campaign (or even that section of the story), but would always be worth hanging onto until the Monk was strong enough to just kill them in one round without that effect. It also synergized nicely with the Monk's Flurry of Blows since the party wasn't quite high enough to have their 1st bonus iterative attacks yet.
2. Randomly generate it from DM tables while overriding obvious offenders. Just reroll these or adjust the item itself somehow. For example, instead of giving them a Broom of Flying, give them a wand/scrolls/potions with the Flying spell--this way they get to use it, but it's a tactical decision involving resources, and it doesn't permanently compromise your campaign.
3. Give them a mostly open choice. You tell them, "At my discretion," so they understand it needs to be at least somewhat reasonable. They are unlikely to go for broke on the most OP stuff if they feel it will just be turned down., and you just turn it down if they do, lol. This should basically be in play no matter which approach you use, though. You can also provide a list of banned items/effects or items too similar to those on the list.
4. Preselect an item pool for players to choose from. This works, but feels lame compared to the other options.
One of the best examples of this is in a game where I am playing a CoE Bard, and my DM gave me a Doss Lute at 5th level. In combination with Hypnotic Pattern, and Unsettling Words, unless the target is immune to charm, you have a very high probability of shutting down any target for example a BBEG with minions. Hitting the BBEG with Unsettling Words, then the area around them with Hypnotic Pattern (and cast with an Instrument of the Bards, all spells which impose the Charmed condition, and have either a Somatic or Verbal component mean everyone in the target area saves at disadvantage.)
So the BBEG is saving at disadvantage, with an additional Bardic Inspiration Die subtracted from the saving throw. Unless they are immune to Charm, even with magic resistance it's a straight save minus a Bardic Inspiration Die which is still not an easy save to make. Another couple of spells that have the same conditions that can be cast through an Instrument of the Bards are Mass Suggestion, and Modify Memory which turn those spells into almost certain successes as well.
As a DM, I would never give an Instrument of the Bards to a Bard PC below 11th level, it's way too powerful before then. By 3rd level you can have Suggestion which is another spell which can be cast through the IoTB, giving the target a save at disadvantage, which is stupidly OP at 3rd level. Same with 5th level, when they get Hypnotic Pattern, as described above, one of the best battlefield control spells in the game, and forcing all the targets to make their saves at disadvantage is again, stupidly OP.
I actually don't understand the problem. Can the players fly? Tight corridors still exist. Spell tattoos? The way I'd rule it, from how the text is formulated, it's a one-and-done situation. Staff of the python? Enemy spellcasters can pack dispel magic.
Whenever people say "oh no, players getting too strong" I really don't understand the issue. They are YOUR players, and you know their strengths, weaknesses, and above all, motivations. An indestructible flying tank might not be going down because of your ancient dragons, but the moment some evil person kidnaps that one little urchin the tank has taken a shine to, the tank's AC or massive AoE damage won't matter.
Honestly, the more I learn about DnD, the more I realise that creativity is the name of the game. Why doesn't that apply to us dungeon masters? My players are OP as shit, and I'm still learning how to challenge them properly - and that's fine. I WANT them to feel strong. I WANT them to feel capable. I still manage to make them anxious some times. There are TONS of other really mighty people out in your worlds, who's to say they haven't gotten wind of your players?
Seriously. It's getting a bit weird with how often these "hot takes" crop up.
I've always controlled the magic items I hand out. I tend to run high magic campaigns as well, so balancing what each player gets is crucial. I also design my own magic items regularly. I use the quirk tables to get ideas (I choose the quirks myself) and make a backstory for almost every item, even if it's straight from the book. Spells like Legend Lore and Identify can be far more interesting with this approach. My players who study Arcana, History and Nature or Religion can get great use out of those skills in this regard. Bards and such get much deeper from the details they can acquire from the gear the players acquire.
I've been playing since the old school 1980's 1st edition D&D. I've made items like this my entire life, so I'm good at it. My players love it, too.
We started using quality items rather than large numbers of magic items. My favorite and most memorable magic item find was a broken plus 1 magic sword and a quality hilt and hand grip made of shark skin. We also played using a critical system. Soon after I found the sword, my character took what would normally be a game ending injury when he lost his shield arm a couple of inches below the shoulder. The sword and hand grip combination was helpful enough it made the character still playable...
Good suggestion, the Staff of the Python surprised me a few weeks ago in a one-shot with the classic "pick an uncommon magic item", crazy good. Two favorites of mine: Instruments of the Bards (the uncommon ones) and the Winged Boots. What I do now is to create 2 lists for "nice tier 2 items" (being the more common level range I run games) including some homebrew of mine. From the first list they roll, consisting mostly of weapons with nice effects and cool wondrous items. From the second list, I let them pick, and this one consists mostly of consumable items, normally by tier 2 I allow them to expend extra gold to pick more from this list, and are also available for crafting if they have the proficiencies.
Having options is more powerful than being handed an option.
Easiest way:
At level 5 use the Adventurers League 11.0 rules for the item list they can choose one from.
At level 10 they can pick a +2 item off the list, and a +1 item off the list or +1 armour of any kind.
At level 15 they can pick a +3 item off the list, a +2 item off the list or +2 magic armour of any kind, and a +1 item off the list or any uncommon magic item (they've lost their scare value by now).
Keeps it simple, and they're just boosts, often very class related ones. They do ruin the bounded accuracy system, but that's somewhat intended for larger challenges.
I think the super vanilla magic items like weapons should be available (e.g. +1, +2, +3 magic weapons, +1/+2/+3 wand of the war mage, +1/+2+/3 rod of the pact keeper, +1/+2/+3 sheild).
With different bonuses showing up at times that make sense for the campaign.
If you don't include those, it has implications on class balance (like...the fact that +3 rod of the pact keeper requires attunement and doesn't add to damage is a real downside compared to a +3 hand crossbow). Also, shields--most people make physical characters that use both hands, so I feel it's worth rewarding the sword and shield fighter with good scaling shields.
Nothing else is really needed, though. This includes +X armour (and in fact if you look in the DMG at loot tables, stuff like +1 platemail and +1 half plate doesn't show up until Magic Table I, the last table in the book normally reserved for level 17+ parties, roughly equivalent to legendary weapons). Based on their loot tables, the designers just didn't seem to plan on players getting much in the way of AC from magic armour. They just wanted their armour to have cool effects instead; damage resistances, adamantine armour, elven chain, that kind of stuff.
Yeah, magic items are the most annoying bit of trying to start a one shot higher level or getting a new PC in the fold after character death.
I've been thinking on just going to the dmg magic item charts that fit the "rarity" tier I want and just rolling 3 times and picking the most fun option to give a player so that it's something usable but not tailored. Maybe having it on top of the adventurers league character creation rules of just having a +1 item of your choice (if level 5+) and just giving some items on top and letting people pick up common items since they can be flavorful or a couple healing potions
the reason the DM book lists the suggested rate of magical acquisition higher than the starting-at- higher-level loot is because customizing your magicals at higher level lets a player min/max a character build, and this maximizing equipment synergy is what breaks power balance. The enjoyment of finding magicals is figuring out how to incorporate them or gaining novel powers rather than perfectly filling gaps that were balancing your class.
I also have my players submit a list of what they want their characters to accomplish in my campaign, and what kind of rewards they look forward to, including magical gear they would hope their character would someday use. This lets me set up a story that will be deeply satisfying to the players in the long run. I can work on the items over time and detail the history that goes into them before the players/characters encounter them. And I can tailor my story to include opportunities for the characters to accomplish the heroics they would like to accomplish for their characters.
One of the best things you can do as a DM is make custom weapons and gear in your game, because especially compared to past editions, the 5e magic item options suck. The easiest way to do this is just transpose item effects onto different things or locations. Weapons of spell storage, belt buckle of opening, a cape of missile snaring, a frostbrand mace, etc. etc. etc. Especially for weapons, this will hugely diversify the gameplay you see, because a lot of weapons a player might choose don't have fun magic options in 5e, so players don't gravitate towards them.
As I can recall, recent earlier editions even mentioned how you can transfer the spell effect from one magic item to another item type to be enchanted instead. I could be wrong. However, 5th edition is sorely lacking variety or guidelines how to do this.
Also some magic items change in power as the game changes. For instance the Eversmoking Bottle was a cool utility item when it first came out. Then Tasha’s came along, and now any level 1 fighter can start with 10ft of blindsight. Permanent advantage on attacks, disadvantage of attacks against you, ignore attacks of opportunity and spells that require line of sight. Pairs disgustingly well with GWM+PAM due to range of blindsight and the advantage offsetting the -5 to hit penalty. Just a bit better than a +1 halberd…
I think it could actually make for a fun campaign idea to start the players at 1st level but give each of them one legendary item. The caveat is that they'll be facing much more difficult challenges, so they'll need to be more cautious and creative until they can level up a bit. Something like a Cloak of Invisibility has a lot of non-combat potential, but is also quite potent in combat. You could even make it part of the plot that they need to destroy these items, so they eventually have to give up their power and fight on their own strength.
Serpent's Scale armor is a great example of this problem.
Armor (scale mail), uncommon
This suit of magic armor is made from shimmering scales. While wearing it, you can apply your full Dexterity modifier (instead of a maximum of +2) when determining your Armor Class. In addition, this armor does not impose disadvantage on your Dexterity (Stealth) checks.
So a character with a +5 to dexterity (a ranger for example) can have 19 AC with a medium armor piece.
At low levels, this is absolutely gamebreaking. I'm currently playing a lost mine of pandelver game where we started at level 3 for some reason.
I have +5 dex and the serpent scale mail, and have 19 AC. It's far too easy.
I've never given out regular magic items. When I dish out items, I base it on the person finding it.
A player expressed his desire to have his tabaxi be a manicurist as a background (not sure if for lulz or to relate to himself IRL) so he had a nail file. In a later adventure he found an unidentified dagger. He haphazardly put it in his pack and when he went to file his nails as he often did during long rest, he found the dagger had fused with the nail file. He got a custom item that gave his claws a +1. Later gave him polishes that let him gain other effects, and they became his main weapon.
All of the Uncommon Instruments of the Bards cast fly (3rd), invisibility (2nd), levitate (2nd), protection from good/evil (1st). Then they also get a few other spells depending on the instrument, including standouts like entangle, protection from energy (fire only), and faerie fire. Finally, you can impose disadvantage on all your enemies saves vs your charm spells. And these are uncommon items "appropriate" for a 1st - 4th level character. They provide so much versatility. Also, many of the spells these instruments can cast aren't on the bard spell list!
In my own campaign I took the list of magic items availble in XGTE and rolled randomly to determine how many of each item existed in the world. Then, I use the reward section from that book to determine in each set of levels the characters achieve (for example, levels 11-15) I roll to determine which items of each rarity will appear or have the oppotunity to be found if they are discovered (not all items are guranteed to appear). I will then determine story beats for those items to appear, and which ones become items carried by villains. This seems to have worked well and many items actually go unused in the course of a fight, but pop up every so often for character moments or to solve an out of combat challenge. This also happens to be the same campaign that the characters have swords modeled after Matt Colville's Teeth of the Dragon that increase in power as challenges are faced and different detriments/curses of the items are overcome. So, when you have a powerful magic item that blinds you randomly but also has insane good damage the players can have things go horribly well in their favor or the item bites them back and summons a random D20 creature in the middle of a fight.
Some element of player choice is useful, though. Or at least player input.. Otherwise you get DMs handing out Flametongue swords to parties where the only character proficient with martial weapons already has Polearm Master and isn't looking for any kind of sword at all, no matter how fancy.
I'm all for player input for magic items. The key there is a DM can choose.
Whenever i make a character, i imagine where theyd be at level 20, then add a pouch labeled "preferred magic item" list to my sheet on dndbeyond. Then my DM can see my full intent, and hand out things as they please.
I also constantly homebrew items, most of the time its a simple flavour change like winged boots being a jetpack, or a set of robes condensed to an earring.
I've used the Sane Magic Item Prices list for a couple of one shots and it worked pretty well, but instead of letting my players choose based on rarity, I gave them a certain amount of gold to spend on the list.
Sane prices also has some serious faults where items have almost random value because of a niche use case. It places Decanter of Endless Water at 135,000g for god's sake.
A Legendary magic item that's practically _designed_ to be handed to a player from level 1 (or maybe level 3) onward is the Moonblade. It has an entire story arc attached that literally works best if the player character destined to be its heir has it early on and has to unlock its powers over the course of the campaign. If you want to make it a little less devastating when all its powers come on at once after they attune, you can say the Moonblade itself has amnesia and has to recover its memories of its prior wielders one by one, only regaining the power associated with a particular past wielder when it regains its memories of that wielder.
I ran a 15th level one-shot last year, and in preparation, I told the players that the items they could get should only have passive effects. It worked for the 2 combat encounters I planned; the one-shot took 5 hours since nobody had too many choices
My personal approach is for each player to make a wishlist. I can then take that wishlist, cut off anything that will break the game, and then any time they get a magic item I give them each one from their lists
Gotta account for magic item crafting. On the bright side, if it is done properly creating magic items can become an adventure in its own right.
Also, crafting requires a recipe, and the DM can control which are available.
I agree fully, the rarity system doesn't work. One thing that has worked for me, i think i saw the tip on some reddit post or something. Is to use more charms, basically give them limited use magic items.
If you make up an item just give it as a charm first, if it breaks encounters, well, it's limited it ain't staying forever, if the party liked it and it worked fine, you can make a quest for them to get a permanent version, or the shopkeeper just imported a permanent version or whatever. If you are too worried about them hoarding them and just not using them, give them a time limit or some kind of limit besides uses "The great old blue wizard offer you a powerful charm to help in your quest, but warns you that you need to be swift, it's power will only hold for a day/week/month".
As long as you establish from the start that it is limited, the party won't feel bad about losing it when it runs out.
I've told my players that magic items in my world are incredibly rare and those that DO exist are all charge based. For example you can use the boots of speed 3 times before they are empty and become non-magical. I much rather hand out consumables than permanent items.
That's not a bad solution, it might create some weird worldbiilding inconsistencies, like if they are very rare and limited in use how are there any charges left by the time the PCs get them? Who is making the items and why are they available for adventurers instead of locked up in national treasuries or epic level wizard towers?
It'd be interesting to see a video about how to homebrew balanced magical items or spells for player characters, Chris!
Here's something for you if you're running a one-shot for higher level players (assuming your players all can be trusted not to start a fight with eachother.)
Assemble a list of magic items. Some powerful, some not, without any particular recipient in mind. Then, before character creation, open this list of magic items up for player characters to pick from... once the item is taken by one character, it can't be taken by another.
Then, rather than the party picking their magic items to suit their characters they are instead making characters to suit the magic items they've managed to grab. Eventually someone is going to have to make use of that +2 longsword!
This video right here is a big part of why I pay attention to character optimization stuff. As a player, I want to avoid situations that could break the game and unbalance things where they stop being fun, especially for my fellow players and my DM.
I've had a few situations where it was a one-shot "Choose an uncommon item" thing or the DM said "As a reward, the hero guild lets you choose an uncommon item from their warehouse." kind of thing. And I have done my level best not to abuse that. I usually create my characters to a theme anyway, so often most of the OP options just don't jive with what I'm building. I'll pick something that fits my theme and gives me a good bonus, or helps shore up a weakness, but isn't gamebreaking.
This is why, as a DM I homebrew EVERY SINGLE MAGIC ITEM, specifically made for each player, so that I'm sure it will go to the right person and I can balance the team power level accordingly(for example, I had a weak draconic sorcerer in my team, so I invented a dragon tooth dagger that would give her a sorc point each time she killed an enemy with fire(no limits) at lv 3 (a rival dragon dropped it).
It's strong, especially at higher levels, but that player is not min/maxing, meanwhile if a player is very good at the game or has a very strong character I will give them a magic item that requires them to be creative, for example, I have a min/maxer player with an half-elf rogue and he dedicated little time to his backstory, so I gave him a cool bow that creates arrows of darkness, that has some cool utility effects(like casting misty step or silence), but they work only if no hostile creature currently sees him, and I decided it would link to his backstory and add some salt to it(he knew little of his family and left home young, so I decided that his family was secretely worshipping the raven queen and he left too early to get an initiation rite, but someone decided he would get that bow and learn from the weapon's whispers, he still hasn't figured out who, but it's starting to get more clear).
Of course the downside is that it takes creativity and time, but that is the definition of being a DM, or at least doing it with a little dedication.
I mean, sure if you pick up your own magic item that wasn’t from a predetermined list by the DM (as in in-game purchases) it can be really powerful. One of my favorite common items is Harvey’s pouch of spices. It just gives you up to 10 pinches of any spice or seasoning you can think of per day, and it recharges often. Great for chef PC’s and interrogations! (Fun fact: Wasabi is classified as a spice) also, you could shove a strong smelling spice in the nose of a big monster.
I am a DM. We started at level one. We didn’t start with magic items but I want to give them magic items that go with their own character’s build. One character, (an artificer) asked me if he could have a multi-purpose tool. And instead of just giving him one we worked together a magic item “creation” system where he can gradually build the item and continue to upgrade it as he levels up. I think it’ll be fun. He purposely built his character to have as many starting tool kits as possible and this takes that into account with the build of his magic item.
Wand of magic missiles is another uncommon item that can break early level combat pretty easily especially if there are multiples. Can be used by anyone and no attunement. If you have a party of 5 each with a wand they can all just pull them out on round 1 of a serious combat and spend 6 charges and each do an average of (28) at range for a total of 140 unerringly hitting force damage which kills almost all monsters below CR9 in one round and some of a bit higher CR. Magic missile is wonderful to split up as well if you are facing a large number of targets and you just pop 3 here 3 there and 2 over there. Until a characters can average more than a sure 28 in a round it remains great for a serious encounter focus fire due to its auto hit when something really needs to die.
Had a campaign where we had a character making them. All the characters ended up with several in a wand bandolier (Wandolier) and the fighter who had no good ranged attack had 6. Even though at later levels he did more damage than that on average if he could get in melee he just whipped them out fired off 6 of the 7 charges for the 28 average and went to the next if something was out of range. The party ended up with the saying "When in doubt, whip your wand out!"
I play in a campaign where our DM gave us a legendary home brew magic item that was made for our character at lvl 5 to be fair the effects are just meant to enhance both our strengths and weaknesses. I think it made the campaign better not worse and made all of our characters really excel in certain scenarios. In one shots the solution Ive seen used before is no repeat items and just banning some items.
In 3.5 i made players roll for them at random but had a few rules. Using multiple items at once requires additional concentration checks at +2 dc for each additional item, divine and arcane items react catastrophically if crossed in such a manor, intelligent items of opposed alignments also auto fail, and when destroyed they deal 1 d6 per level of its constituent spells and are destroyed, and if a particular item cannot be destroyed, the operator is instead, bar a saving reflex dc of spell constituents + 10 to avoid being sucked into a semi random plane depending on the power and nature of the item. Other than that, if players can figure out how to put their random junk togethef in creative ways, they deserve snd have earned it, right up untill i send something to go steal their shit, or force em to cough them up to an npc for a good plot point and a story based replacement item. Some things are so contrived that you cant know how players can use them untill they do.
What I did was see what the players were playing then gave them an option of 1 of 2 or 3 items. If it was higher I just upped numbers. This way they get some choice but I know nothing is going to break the game, unless they use it in some way that I didn't foresee. At that point it is on me as I allowed it and a good on them for being creative.
In AL play, you get to keep 1 magic item of uncommon quality levels 1-4, up to 3 magic items of up to rare quality at levels 5-10, up to 6 magic items of up to very rare quality at levels 11-16, and up to 10 magic items of up to legendary quality at levels 17-20.
This makes a big impact on your character because of the number of magic items you have access to. You still have attunement restrictions, but not every magic item requires attunement.
The upside is it can take a subpar subclass and make it competitive because of the magic items. Allowing for more variety of builds because you don't necessarily have to rely on the same optimization build tricks to be effective.
But it's very High Fantasy leaning as far as power curves go at the table, because everyone has multiple magic items.
Best example of this is the myzium apparatus (uncommon)! It gives a caster the ability to cast "any spell" in the game, without having the spell prepared!
I agree 100% about the rarity being useless.
Honestly, I've found Sane Magic Items Pricing to work well in a high fantasy setting. But I utilized a secondary currency (called Guild coins) which they could use to buy them. Guild coins were awarded via specific NPCS and were only allowed at curated magic shops. They still acquired gold, but most (non-guild produced) magic items had an inflated gold cost (200% beyond the cost in the Sane Magic Item Pricing guide). I did choose the magic items they found in the wild though, and used the Sane Magic Item Pricing as a loose guide to make sure everyone got a similar amount of loot.
All of that worked okay level 1-10.
Now that they are level 15+, any upgrades are either astronomically expensive, or have to be homebrewed. Which is what I end up doing most of the time.
They are probably too over-geared now, but at this point I'm just letting them play out the fantasy of being demi-gods molding the world to their wills. :)
I made the mistake of converting from Pathfinder to 5e and didn't adjust any of the loot from the module... My party was swimming in OP gear by level 8 and at level 13 they have found their preferred items and the rest hardly even get ID'd before being dumped in the multiple wagon loads of magic items they have kicking about.
I use the companion rules from Strongholds and Followers and even with a companion each they're all kitted with a full set of 3 attunement items and multiple consumable...
Thank god they're almost done.
I was worried the Luckblade was going to completely skip the campaign by "wishing to be in BBEG's bedroom".
Just put some thieves guild and several expendable magic items, like potions scrolls and wands with limites charges
1:35 - Cloak of Protection and Ring of Protection being mechanically identical but different rarity tiers is the first thing I thought of off the top of my head lol.
as a dm i like giving the players powerful magic items, because that means i just get to make them fight things with a higher power level, which for me as a dm is fun. one of my favorite parts of DnD is just theory crafting and building characters and monsters. most of my campaigns i let my players buy or craft whatever they want as long as they have the appropriate resources. although its fairly common that i have to change the requirements for items or how they work, because DnD is very lazy when it comes to balance, and they left that up to the dm to fix