You missed the most important point. Cost. The cost of those parts would likely be 1,500-2k a piece. A day designing in cad, a wasted day+ printing the first failed part, another 1-2 days troubleshooting your supports, another day or 2 to print the final parts, and then the inevitable comment from the customer about it costing so much when his grandkid is using a $300 amazon printer to make stuff much cheaper.
That's why this works at hobbyist DIY level, not so much 1 offs, unless is for your own product development on early prototyping. Each process has it's own benchmarks.
@@macgyver9134 he just taught that grand kid information on has to layout the first model....then print multiple models without error....then generating profit without multiple fails and wasted filament, cad time and personal time. Also a 300 dollar Amazon printer cant print half these filaments. Not heated chamber (youll get warped parts) sub 300c nozzle and a soft nozzle with will wear too quickly since its brass not hardened material. Without knowledge shows here. But I understand your point...kinda.
@Cereal_Killr you can easily print PA6CF on an ender 3 with a few modifications. People do it all the time. A hardened nozzle can be bought for a few bucks. The hard part is the CAD work. PA6CF is consumer grade filament while the other filament he mentioned are more production level. That's why his printer has the 500c nozzle 200c bed plate and 100c chamber.
im my case I don't factor in anything but the filament. Otherwise id have to justify to my wife the cost of the printer itself lol. Tho in my case, Im starting on parts that simply arent available. No one is designing what I want, so Im scanning parts and designing stuff for myself. then if the limited community of drivers of my car want one, maybe then worry about production type designs and workflow
Thanks Rob and Vision Miner for printing these for me. Nice to see you could get a good how to video out of the deal as well. Correction: For all the folks out there wondering where the engine is, these are oil cooler ducts and are in the front of a mid-engine Porsche behind the cooler element/housing, under that beautiful Pyrotect fuel cell.
REALLY liked this video format, seeing all the details and products used. also liked seeing your process for selecting the appropriate material for the job.
STRONGLY agree! Very useful and informative video. They have a ton of experience, sharing that with the community helps everyone, it builds trust and engagement. Hell, I didn't even know that they did 3D printing as a service. I'm really looking forward to more videos like this one.
I love the look but really dislike the the reduced layer adhesion when CF is introduced into a material. GF filled seems to fair slightly better but not by much.
@@biggboysouth we focus more on aesthetics than strength at the moment. The control and definition the CF gives is awesome! It makes the PETG behave like Matte PLA!
Highly recommend the 'Highlight Overhang by Angle' and then enable the "On overhangs only" option when manually painting supports. This greatly simplifies the process of adding support enforcers as it is very clear which parts need supports.
I tend to like using basically a form of paint bucket tool but I don't know if it is available in prusaslicer or if it is just Bambu and orcaslicer. You set the angle threshold and then you can paint whole surfaces at once, it would have been good just used on that edge.
Consumer printers have come a long way. I recommend the Qidi Plus 4 (bambu clone with upgrades). They're like $700ish for a complete out of the box experience and can easily print this material which IMO is a little bit overkill for the application. If not directly touching any heat source ASA or ABS would have also worked at a fraction of the cost. If still too expensive you can buy a decent entry level printer and with some easy mods and a homemade cardboard box enclosure be printing CF Nylon with decent results.
Also the nano polymer is the real deal! I use it for keeping all of my FDM machines consistent in adhesion even if they have different OEMs for PEI sheets.
Wow what a great video and such a great insight into your workflow. Sometimes I'll put supports in if I know it'll need them but most of the time I just slice the model and go through the layers looking for anything that will print in mid air before adding supports.
Beautiful piece... By what I see in 27:20, I suppose they could have added parallel ribs going up from the main body to the flanged contour, to act as support (if there is space under there available in assembly, could be even be part of the design ).
Thanks a lot,the last video when you were printing large parts and prevented warping by switching from a rectilinear pattern to a hilbert curve was a godsend,sometimes when printing large parts i experimented warping but since im using the hilbert curve thats gone.thanks a lot!!
Given your experience, can you provide insight on the safety of handling the filament and printed parts?, I started using PET-CF but I noticed little splinters in my hand after looking with a microscope, so I'm concerned about if those go into my eye if I rub them after handling the filament or printed parts being handler by children. love your videos!!
I have a Qidi Plus4 with heated chamber that hits 60C and so far good for printing PA12CF with the NanoAdhesive, and I imagine PA6CF will be same. HOWEVER, there is a PA that I have found which warps no mater what I do, and that's blue string trimmer line. It should a be torture test material. Wind on a spool, run it through a drying cycle, then put it in a dry box. Was able to print finished Benchies with a slightly curved bottom, but with a narrow tall and thin rectangle it pulled up no matter how wide of a brim I added. Also, what I want out of a 3D printer is not multi-color, but high-speed multi-material. Makertech has their switching hotend that allows for a material and support-material on one hotend to save time, and THAT's what the market needs. I want to print PA or PCTG with break-away supports that don't destroy the finish quality.
Great video. What causes the horizontal banding you see on the installed pics at the end of your video? I have been chasing this issue for years on an E5+
My experience with PA6-CF is that it loves to deform under pressure... screws getting loosed, bending from filament extruder and so... I hope these will not rattle on the rivets soon. :) Some says, heat treat after print helps to avoid deforming. I like more PC-CF or ASA-CF/ASA-GF. Nice video ofcourse, just little too long about prusa slicer :D I've switched to Orca and there is no way back to prusa...
Very nice! Love printing with PA6-CF, and would love an IDEX someday, but at $15K it's a little our of my range. K1 Max gets the job done for now. lol I've made a few parts for my BRZ, but definitely want a printer capable of extruding the more exotic materials. Wish I could get chamber temps hotter, especially for PA6-CF so I wouldn't have to anneal, but 60C isn't too bad. I do have my PA6-CF supports down, and love how clean and easily they pop off. I have my settings tuned pretty well, never use any glues or adhesives, and have very little issues with warping with PA6-CF, but it would probably really help me out with ASA. Great video.
A better way to print that is to move it to a 45° angle and use a very thin snap off support on the back. Most of the supports you used are not needed. Also, using PA6 anywhere near the engine is not generally a good idea. You can't trust HDT, better to think of that as the melting point over time. The plastic may be able to handle the rated HDT for a limited time, but not constant, not after heat soaked. And not even after we heat treat and cryotreat. I can show you examples. We lab test all of our parts. Love your videos as always, peace.
Absolutely, we've seen that video going around -- @slant3d right? As for the material, Kevins comment is accurate -- for his final parts, we even used HTNCF25, for the extra heat resistance, just in case. In this video we switched to PA6+CF to be applicable to a broader audience.
Metal makes for too much wear and tear against most types of print plates. Just print a scraper with a swappable edge. I only needed to swap my edge once so far.
We usually fit up to 8 standard spools -- but a lot of our spools are 500g or 750g, I'm pretty sure I've fit at least 5x 1kg spools in there -- possibly 6x.
@@PiDsPagePrototypes Real race cars will use whatever is practical and prudent to fix a problem or solve a temporary issue. I've both designed complex parts for race teams and utilized many additive manufacturing processes as well as subtractive, depending on the tolerance and restrictions around part in question and rulebook leniency(s) for governed motorsport. Other times you can replace an extremely specific machined part with a screw, zip-tie and some decently strong reinforced tape that will last most of a season.
They don't become spongy/floppy or soft -- but they do become more ductile, more impact resistant. If you print a thin-walled vase, and stick it in a dehydrator or oven for a few hours, it will be much stiffer -- when it soaks up the moisture, it is more pliable. On thicker parts, this isn't noticeable at all, but on very thin parts it can be a factor to consider. (testing videos incoming.... subscribe and stay tuned!)
After watching this, I realized my bottle of Nano had a nozzle that was stuck up inside the cap. I've been dipping the brush all this time wondering why you did not put a nozzle on the bottle. OH.. there it is.
I imagine that you have to include the time and material of test/tuning prints into the bill to the customer? That's a lot of time and effort, especially for one or two prints to do for free?
Absolutely. Depending on the assessed difficulty of a part, labor estimates are included, machine time itself, estimates for re-prints -- this is much more common in the high-temp filaments, where the material behavior is far less predictable. With materials like CF-Nylon, generally the standard profile works just fine. However, it's still better to do partial prints to ensure success, than to print stock and find out it didn't work -- lost time, and material. Many parts are simple enough to print without these extra steps -- but in this video, we specifically wanted to break it down and give a lot of tips and techniques, so this video doubles as a training video for our clients :)
@VisionMiner Can you share a ballpark number of what a project like that costs? For billing purposes, how is material accounted for? Do you try to keep track of exactly how much was used, either from slicer numbers or by weighing spools?
Having owned a 914 myself, I have to say this is a very strange duct he’s adding to his car. I guess this is a non-v8-swapped car and it’s for the oil cooler exhaust but I am curious why he wants to send hot air under the car rather than into cut-outs in the wheel wells or, even better, ducts cut out of the hood.
what is the actual difference between a machine like that and a bambu x for eg(for one the bigger build volume, and probably the ability to print in more exotic materials.). except the very high price. what can it do that lower consumer models cannot? kinda curious.
This exact filament he uses prints fine in a bambu x1c. the printer in the video is made for more engineering materials that require very high temps that most consumer machines cant reach. 500c is much higher than the 300c nozzle temp from bambu
Hardly a factor in this case. Creep can be an issue with weight-bearing things like brackets -- although it could still be considered minimal. We had a 5-pound banner hanging on a hook for 2 years in our old facility -- in the warehouse. When we moved, and took down the brackets, they had experienced "creep" -- deformation, deflection of about 1cm. This might actually make a good video, I'm pretty sure we have the part somewhere still... but in this application, really not a factor.
That is an IDEX machine, why in the world aren't you using separate support material? And since your printer gets hot enough, did you anneal the part in the printer after removing the supports?
We didn't use a separate support material because it adds significant time to the print, as well as more failure points. It's _always_ recommended to avoid dual extrusion if you can, at least in higher-temp materials, because not only will you shave off a ton of toolhead-change time, but your layers can also maintain more heat (doesn't always apply) resulting in better layer adhesion. Keeping one extruder going constantly is just faster than switching back and forth -- there's a time and place for multi-material, but this wasn't it :) as for annealing, yes, technically it anneals while printing (rule of thumb: anneal around the Tg of a material. Chamber was above the Tg of PA6) This particular part, we didn't do any additional processes on.
I print my CF nylon (PA 612 CF) and have pretty good luck on my P1S even without heated chamber. I just heat the bed for 15 minutes prior to print and keep door shut. I run Aux fan on 5 just to keep heat even inside. Believe it or not my textured bed adheres perfectly fine I just use the Nano bond glue. Like 7-8 drops. A bottle goes a LONG way. At 45 bucks a bottle I find ways to stretch it.
Hi I am from India. Do you have an official seller of your filements and nano polymer adhesive in India or should I purchase from your website directly
Unlike many other people in the comments section, I will not comment on the print quality and cost. I wonder why this part was not optimized for a more consistent air flow and reduced turbulence? It looks like it was made by intersection two fairly simple geometrical shapes, but the problem here is that the joint between them produces unwanted drag and turbulence, hence the performance is not as good as it should. This particular model could be easily done with free-form NURBS modeling program (like Rhino) for less than 30 minutes offering a much better air flow.
nano polymer adhesive - over 40 prints on one coating with PLA? Well, over the past 5 years, I've run two Prusa MK3s printers for over 600 days total printing time of PLA on each, with possibly 4 or 5 failed prints without any glue.; You do NOT need glue for PLA on PEI sheets! Especially very, very over-priced glue
We love when people point this out. Yes, PLA often sticks to a warm bed with no adhesive. We didn't make this adhesive for PLA -- we made it for PEEK and ULTEM, and it's super beneficial to engineering polymers like PC and Nylon. To add to this, plenty of people DO have trouble keeping PLA stuck to the bed, for whatever reason, and you can see those people singing it's praises all over the internet (especially X) -- if you don't need it, that's awesome! But the customer reviews speak differently :)
@@VisionMiner I print nylon and PEEK on a regular ender 3 with a modded extruder for 30$ and a $20 amazon enclosure... you DO NOT NEED a 15k printer and glue... just set your print speed nice and slow, calibrate your printer.
An oven is not necessary when vacuuming. Water boils at room temp in a vacuum chamber, in fact the temp of the water under vacuum gets colder during vacuuming. Additional cost for the the oven is not necessary. The fact that the air temp in side the chamber is drastically higher than the in coming air temp as you release the vacuum from the chamber can cause the cold air to recondense forming water back inside the plastics at a more rapid rate. This is how fronts work and perception is formed in fronts. Recommend you just vacuum at room temps only.
In actual experience, however, it's very necessary. Check out CNC Kitchen's video, where he just vacuumed cold spools, and it didn't get the desired results, especially on higher-end filaments. Now -- you're absolutely correct about condensation -- that's why the BEST method is: 1. bake spool 2. vacuum spool 3. allow spool to cool in vacuum 4. remove from vacuum. Otherwise, you're right -- hot spools absorb moisture much quicker. If you're in a pinch, a hot spool and quick vacuum is still much better than a cold spool, though, so long as you don't leave the hot spool out in cold air too long before inserting it into the hot printer chamber :)
Same… I print all kinds of car parts from PA6/12 CF on my X1C mostly using stock settings on either the Gold textured PEI plate or the smooth Lightyear G10 plate. No issues at all.
Crazy to think that less than 5yrs ago this part&material would have required a 5k-10k printer. Now anyone could have made it with a ~1k printer. With some design tweaks to build it in 2 pieces, it could be made in a ~$500 printer.
If you have a choice, do not use .STL files, use .STEP files instead. STL files have a much lower resolution compared to STEP files. It does make a quality difference in the print.
Did you mention needing to swap out the usual Brass nozzle on most machines for a Hardened Steel nozzle for the extremely abrasive Carbon Fiber? What about Safe Handling? - Don't handle PA-CF filaments bare handed, and NEVER make anything from it that will be used near bare skin or food service. Sanding requires full PPE with gloves and mask, and PA-CF parts should be sealed in a paint or clear-coated before use. The short Carbon Fibres used in PA-CF need to be treated as just as dangerous as Asbestos or Diamond Dust. Learnt most of the contents shown here while getting PA-CF to print reliably on a Voxelabs Aquila X2.
You definitely want hardened steel nozzles, instead of softer materials like brass -- Hardened Steel is standard on the 22 IDEX, from the factory. Handling PPE should be considered, certainly!
I got a bambu lab printer. I can't believe how many extra steps other printers have. So much wasted time. I can make a model and get the print started while getting the kids ready for school.
Bambu boys will eat you alive for showing some 15k printer. And prusaslicer is putting a crown on it. You can't do that to them. Anyway nice approach about real work.
We'll ask the customer if they want it shared, but this was a print for a customer -- so probbbbably not :) Here's a few similar parts, though! thangs.com/search/NACA%20Duct?scope=all
What slicing software do you use? For many years, we were strong advocates of Simplify3D, but we've found that PrusaSlicer has truly excelled in development and innovation. In our opinion, it currently leads the pack when it comes to FFF toolpaths and advanced features. Cura is another popular option, although it often requires workarounds for high-temperature printing. That said, we've chosen PrusaSlicer as our primary slicer for the past few years and have been very satisfied. Orca may be part of our workflow in the future. Ultimately, our machines operate using standard G-code, so you’re free to use any slicer you prefer-the core principles remain the same!
You missed the most important point. Cost. The cost of those parts would likely be 1,500-2k a piece. A day designing in cad, a wasted day+ printing the first failed part, another 1-2 days troubleshooting your supports, another day or 2 to print the final parts, and then the inevitable comment from the customer about it costing so much when his grandkid is using a $300 amazon printer to make stuff much cheaper.
That's why this works at hobbyist DIY level, not so much 1 offs, unless is for your own product development on early prototyping. Each process has it's own benchmarks.
@@macgyver9134 he just taught that grand kid information on has to layout the first model....then print multiple models without error....then generating profit without multiple fails and wasted filament, cad time and personal time. Also a 300 dollar Amazon printer cant print half these filaments. Not heated chamber (youll get warped parts) sub 300c nozzle and a soft nozzle with will wear too quickly since its brass not hardened material. Without knowledge shows here. But I understand your point...kinda.
@Cereal_Killr you can easily print PA6CF on an ender 3 with a few modifications. People do it all the time. A hardened nozzle can be bought for a few bucks. The hard part is the CAD work. PA6CF is consumer grade filament while the other filament he mentioned are more production level. That's why his printer has the 500c nozzle 200c bed plate and 100c chamber.
im my case I don't factor in anything but the filament. Otherwise id have to justify to my wife the cost of the printer itself lol. Tho in my case, Im starting on parts that simply arent available. No one is designing what I want, so Im scanning parts and designing stuff for myself. then if the limited community of drivers of my car want one, maybe then worry about production type designs and workflow
He started by establishing his shop was "high end". Therefore, cost is not an issue.
Thanks Rob and Vision Miner for printing these for me. Nice to see you could get a good how to video out of the deal as well.
Correction: For all the folks out there wondering where the engine is, these are oil cooler ducts and are in the front of a mid-engine Porsche behind the cooler element/housing, under that beautiful Pyrotect fuel cell.
Thanks a ton for reaching out, and letting us use your part in the video! :)
bot channel name.
A modified Voron 350 could make that part and the total cost would be well under 3k USD.
REALLY liked this video format, seeing all the details and products used. also liked seeing your process for selecting the appropriate material for the job.
Glad it was helpful! Thanks for watching, and subscribe, we've got a ton more in the works!
STRONGLY agree! Very useful and informative video. They have a ton of experience, sharing that with the community helps everyone, it builds trust and engagement. Hell, I didn't even know that they did 3D printing as a service. I'm really looking forward to more videos like this one.
You guys did an amazing job with this one. Very thorough walkthrough of everything required.
Thank you!
We absolutely LOVE printing anything with Carbon Fiber!
Yeah, it's the best!
I love the look but really dislike the the reduced layer adhesion when CF is introduced into a material. GF filled seems to fair slightly better but not by much.
@@biggboysouth we focus more on aesthetics than strength at the moment. The control and definition the CF gives is awesome! It makes the PETG behave like Matte PLA!
I really enjoyed your presentation, you know your stuff and you can present it well. Often that's two different people! Thanks!
Highly recommend the 'Highlight Overhang by Angle' and then enable the "On overhangs only" option when manually painting supports. This greatly simplifies the process of adding support enforcers as it is very clear which parts need supports.
I didn't know about that option, thanks!
I was screaming the same thing at the video. Come on Rob 😂
HAH!! Still learning :) Thanks for the tip, we'll include it in a future video! @JRSkola @jmedlin
I tend to like using basically a form of paint bucket tool but I don't know if it is available in prusaslicer or if it is just Bambu and orcaslicer. You set the angle threshold and then you can paint whole surfaces at once, it would have been good just used on that edge.
@conorstewart2214 for sure, that's my go-to as well. It's called the same thing in Prusa Slicer.
Thanks for the tip on splitting the fractional part for support testing.
THIS IS EXACTLY what I need to make prototype car parts! I just don't know if I can ever spend that much on a printer.... maybe one day!
Consumer printers have come a long way. I recommend the Qidi Plus 4 (bambu clone with upgrades). They're like $700ish for a complete out of the box experience and can easily print this material which IMO is a little bit overkill for the application. If not directly touching any heat source ASA or ABS would have also worked at a fraction of the cost.
If still too expensive you can buy a decent entry level printer and with some easy mods and a homemade cardboard box enclosure be printing CF Nylon with decent results.
Very interesting video, all the information is valuable, thanks for sharing knowledge. I look forward to more videos of this type. Greetings!!!
Also the nano polymer is the real deal! I use it for keeping all of my FDM machines consistent in adhesion even if they have different OEMs for PEI sheets.
Same! That nano is almost too good. I need patience for bed to cool a bit.
Oh yeah, cooling is key... Patience is a virtue.... th-cam.com/users/shortsE2ZmNGCXuRY
Wow what a great video and such a great insight into your workflow. Sometimes I'll put supports in if I know it'll need them but most of the time I just slice the model and go through the layers looking for anything that will print in mid air before adding supports.
Beautiful piece... By what I see in 27:20, I suppose they could have added parallel ribs going up from the main body to the flanged contour, to act as support (if there is space under there available in assembly, could be even be part of the design ).
Thanks a lot,the last video when you were printing large parts and prevented warping by switching from a rectilinear pattern to a hilbert curve was a godsend,sometimes when printing large parts i experimented warping but since im using the hilbert curve thats gone.thanks a lot!!
Glad it helped! Great to hear :)
Would your results show the min and max angle required for adding supports for that material?
Given your experience, can you provide insight on the safety of handling the filament and printed parts?, I started using PET-CF but I noticed little splinters in my hand after looking with a microscope, so I'm concerned about if those go into my eye if I rub them after handling the filament or printed parts being handler by children. love your videos!!
Thats definitely a topic for a future video!
I have a Qidi Plus4 with heated chamber that hits 60C and so far good for printing PA12CF with the NanoAdhesive, and I imagine PA6CF will be same. HOWEVER, there is a PA that I have found which warps no mater what I do, and that's blue string trimmer line. It should a be torture test material. Wind on a spool, run it through a drying cycle, then put it in a dry box. Was able to print finished Benchies with a slightly curved bottom, but with a narrow tall and thin rectangle it pulled up no matter how wide of a brim I added.
Also, what I want out of a 3D printer is not multi-color, but high-speed multi-material. Makertech has their switching hotend that allows for a material and support-material on one hotend to save time, and THAT's what the market needs. I want to print PA or PCTG with break-away supports that don't destroy the finish quality.
nice 914 I love mine.. what are the bottom vents for ?
Great vid, man. Printer looks sick, too. Too bad it costs as much as a used car...😭 Tossed you a sub!!
Using the vacuum chamber @ 21 to help pull moisture from the filament is a new trick for me.
Makes a HUGE difference, enjoy!
Great video. What causes the horizontal banding you see on the installed pics at the end of your video? I have been chasing this issue for years on an E5+
You forgot that PA6CF shrinks, you have to print it on 101 or 102% (measure it on a testprint ) and the part needs to get tempered after printing !
I'm using ABS and printed a battery cover for my jeep and it's been 3 years and its fine near the engine
My experience with PA6-CF is that it loves to deform under pressure... screws getting loosed, bending from filament extruder and so... I hope these will not rattle on the rivets soon. :) Some says, heat treat after print helps to avoid deforming. I like more PC-CF or ASA-CF/ASA-GF. Nice video ofcourse, just little too long about prusa slicer :D I've switched to Orca and there is no way back to prusa...
Very nice! Love printing with PA6-CF, and would love an IDEX someday, but at $15K it's a little our of my range. K1 Max gets the job done for now. lol I've made a few parts for my BRZ, but definitely want a printer capable of extruding the more exotic materials. Wish I could get chamber temps hotter, especially for PA6-CF so I wouldn't have to anneal, but 60C isn't too bad. I do have my PA6-CF supports down, and love how clean and easily they pop off. I have my settings tuned pretty well, never use any glues or adhesives, and have very little issues with warping with PA6-CF, but it would probably really help me out with ASA. Great video.
Thanks man! Love the BRZ, what parts have you made for it?
The qidi xmax 3 has an active heated chamber and high temp nozzle and bed for 800 it's a great deal works very well
Why PA6 instead of PA12 for the water resistance? Just wondering.
Perhaps if it was submerged in water, but PA6 does fine in other situations like this :)
Because it's what they have the most of in stock and want to shift out to customers. ;)
Odds are, classic Porsche is never going to see a wet track.
.....Where was I not knowing about this adhesive fighting with a 74 hour print....Time to test it out and hope it works.
A better way to print that is to move it to a 45° angle and use a very thin snap off support on the back. Most of the supports you used are not needed. Also, using PA6 anywhere near the engine is not generally a good idea. You can't trust HDT, better to think of that as the melting point over time. The plastic may be able to handle the rated HDT for a limited time, but not constant, not after heat soaked. And not even after we heat treat and cryotreat. I can show you examples. We lab test all of our parts. Love your videos as always, peace.
these are not in the engine bay (Porsche 914 mid-engine)
Absolutely, we've seen that video going around -- @slant3d right?
As for the material, Kevins comment is accurate -- for his final parts, we even used HTNCF25, for the extra heat resistance, just in case. In this video we switched to PA6+CF to be applicable to a broader audience.
Metal makes for too much wear and tear against most types of print plates. Just print a scraper with a swappable edge. I only needed to swap my edge once so far.
Nice video. How many spools could I fit at a time in that vacuum drying kit?
We usually fit up to 8 standard spools -- but a lot of our spools are 500g or 750g, I'm pretty sure I've fit at least 5x 1kg spools in there -- possibly 6x.
Even the stick glue will last for multiple repeat prints using PLA. I've gone over a dozen without cleaning/refreshing the glue.
CF Nylon+race car parts? You have my attention. 😁
Real racecars use Continuous Carbon Fibre, this isn't that.
@@PiDsPagePrototypes Real race cars will use whatever is practical and prudent to fix a problem or solve a temporary issue. I've both designed complex parts for race teams and utilized many additive manufacturing processes as well as subtractive, depending on the tolerance and restrictions around part in question and rulebook leniency(s) for governed motorsport.
Other times you can replace an extremely specific machined part with a screw, zip-tie and some decently strong reinforced tape that will last most of a season.
That's a really broad statement... not based in reality, sorry
Nice video Rob on supports!
Thanks a bunch! :)
Does the part become moisture conditioned after 1 month of it being exposed in the environment and become spongy,floppy and soft like other PA6?
They don't become spongy/floppy or soft -- but they do become more ductile, more impact resistant. If you print a thin-walled vase, and stick it in a dehydrator or oven for a few hours, it will be much stiffer -- when it soaks up the moisture, it is more pliable. On thicker parts, this isn't noticeable at all, but on very thin parts it can be a factor to consider. (testing videos incoming.... subscribe and stay tuned!)
After watching this, I realized my bottle of Nano had a nozzle that was stuck up inside the cap. I've been dipping the brush all this time wondering why you did not put a nozzle on the bottle. OH.. there it is.
I've seen everyone talk about nylon carbon, but not many about pet cf, what is your opinion on pet cf? it seems very promising
I'm sure we'll be playing with it soon... very soon ;) ;) subscribe so you don't miss it! :)
I imagine that you have to include the time and material of test/tuning prints into the bill to the customer? That's a lot of time and effort, especially for one or two prints to do for free?
Absolutely. Depending on the assessed difficulty of a part, labor estimates are included, machine time itself, estimates for re-prints -- this is much more common in the high-temp filaments, where the material behavior is far less predictable. With materials like CF-Nylon, generally the standard profile works just fine. However, it's still better to do partial prints to ensure success, than to print stock and find out it didn't work -- lost time, and material. Many parts are simple enough to print without these extra steps -- but in this video, we specifically wanted to break it down and give a lot of tips and techniques, so this video doubles as a training video for our clients :)
@VisionMiner Can you share a ballpark number of what a project like that costs? For billing purposes, how is material accounted for? Do you try to keep track of exactly how much was used, either from slicer numbers or by weighing spools?
Having owned a 914 myself, I have to say this is a very strange duct he’s adding to his car. I guess this is a non-v8-swapped car and it’s for the oil cooler exhaust but I am curious why he wants to send hot air under the car rather than into cut-outs in the wheel wells or, even better, ducts cut out of the hood.
Rob, what do you know about Tullomer by Z-Polymers? What are your thoughts?
Fascinating material, with some advantages, and some drawbacks. Stay tuned (subscribe) --- we'll have a video on it relatively soon :)
what is the actual difference between a machine like that and a bambu x for eg(for one the bigger build volume, and probably the ability to print in more exotic materials.). except the very high price. what can it do that lower consumer models cannot? kinda curious.
This exact filament he uses prints fine in a bambu x1c. the printer in the video is made for more engineering materials that require very high temps that most consumer machines cant reach. 500c is much higher than the 300c nozzle temp from bambu
Right on!
wouldnt SLS be beter at this kind of part?
I'm new to 3 d printers. Just got them bambu mini A1. What software were you using to alternate your three d prints?
If you read closer you can see he's using a forked version of the "Prusa slicer 2.8".
Bambu Studio has the same features, as well, to slice parts -- it's the two rectangles with a dotted line in between, up on the top tool bar :)
What about the decreased rigidity of PA6 as it absorbs moisture over time, post print?
Hardly a factor in this case. Creep can be an issue with weight-bearing things like brackets -- although it could still be considered minimal. We had a 5-pound banner hanging on a hook for 2 years in our old facility -- in the warehouse. When we moved, and took down the brackets, they had experienced "creep" -- deformation, deflection of about 1cm. This might actually make a good video, I'm pretty sure we have the part somewhere still... but in this application, really not a factor.
Great video
That is an IDEX machine, why in the world aren't you using separate support material? And since your printer gets hot enough, did you anneal the part in the printer after removing the supports?
We didn't use a separate support material because it adds significant time to the print, as well as more failure points. It's _always_ recommended to avoid dual extrusion if you can, at least in higher-temp materials, because not only will you shave off a ton of toolhead-change time, but your layers can also maintain more heat (doesn't always apply) resulting in better layer adhesion. Keeping one extruder going constantly is just faster than switching back and forth -- there's a time and place for multi-material, but this wasn't it :) as for annealing, yes, technically it anneals while printing (rule of thumb: anneal around the Tg of a material. Chamber was above the Tg of PA6) This particular part, we didn't do any additional processes on.
I print my CF nylon (PA 612 CF) and have pretty good luck on my P1S even without heated chamber. I just heat the bed for 15 minutes prior to print and keep door shut. I run Aux fan on 5 just to keep heat even inside. Believe it or not my textured bed adheres perfectly fine I just use the Nano bond glue. Like 7-8 drops. A bottle goes a LONG way. At 45 bucks a bottle I find ways to stretch it.
Awesome!!
What size nozzle did you use?
What is that build plate made of im building a new printer and need a big custom buildplate but i dont want glass this looks like what i need
We use a special high-temperature resin impregnated carbon fiber plate, it works fantastic! visionminer.com/products/carbon-fiber-plate
Hi I am from India. Do you have an official seller of your filements and nano polymer adhesive in India or should I purchase from your website directly
I would look into a package forwarder. Shipping with standard shipping in the US will be very expensive to India.
Unlike many other people in the comments section, I will not comment on the print quality and cost. I wonder why this part was not optimized for a more consistent air flow and reduced turbulence? It looks like it was made by intersection two fairly simple geometrical shapes, but the problem here is that the joint between them produces unwanted drag and turbulence, hence the performance is not as good as it should. This particular model could be easily done with free-form NURBS modeling program (like Rhino) for less than 30 minutes offering a much better air flow.
nano polymer adhesive - over 40 prints on one coating with PLA? Well, over the past 5 years, I've run two Prusa MK3s printers for over 600 days total printing time of PLA on each, with possibly 4 or 5 failed prints without any glue.; You do NOT need glue for PLA on PEI sheets! Especially very, very over-priced glue
We love when people point this out. Yes, PLA often sticks to a warm bed with no adhesive. We didn't make this adhesive for PLA -- we made it for PEEK and ULTEM, and it's super beneficial to engineering polymers like PC and Nylon. To add to this, plenty of people DO have trouble keeping PLA stuck to the bed, for whatever reason, and you can see those people singing it's praises all over the internet (especially X) -- if you don't need it, that's awesome! But the customer reviews speak differently :)
@@VisionMiner I print nylon and PEEK on a regular ender 3 with a modded extruder for 30$ and a $20 amazon enclosure... you DO NOT NEED a 15k printer and glue... just set your print speed nice and slow, calibrate your printer.
It’s not over priced when you don’t have any failures.
I really wish the 22idex was 24” long. Normal motor intakes are just too big for it.
An oven is not necessary when vacuuming. Water boils at room temp in a vacuum chamber, in fact the temp of the water under vacuum gets colder during vacuuming. Additional cost for the the oven is not necessary. The fact that the air temp in side the chamber is drastically higher than the in coming air temp as you release the vacuum from the chamber can cause the cold air to recondense forming water back inside the plastics at a more rapid rate. This is how fronts work and perception is formed in fronts. Recommend you just vacuum at room temps only.
In actual experience, however, it's very necessary. Check out CNC Kitchen's video, where he just vacuumed cold spools, and it didn't get the desired results, especially on higher-end filaments. Now -- you're absolutely correct about condensation -- that's why the BEST method is: 1. bake spool 2. vacuum spool 3. allow spool to cool in vacuum 4. remove from vacuum.
Otherwise, you're right -- hot spools absorb moisture much quicker. If you're in a pinch, a hot spool and quick vacuum is still much better than a cold spool, though, so long as you don't leave the hot spool out in cold air too long before inserting it into the hot printer chamber :)
HAHA and here i am on a P1S and an X1C just throwing it in the printer and hitting go :D
Same… I print all kinds of car parts from PA6/12 CF on my X1C mostly using stock settings on either the Gold textured PEI plate or the smooth Lightyear G10 plate. No issues at all.
Crazy to think that less than 5yrs ago this part&material would have required a 5k-10k printer. Now anyone could have made it with a ~1k printer. With some design tweaks to build it in 2 pieces, it could be made in a ~$500 printer.
how long does it take to scan a person? from einscan h2
Anywhere from 1-5 minutes depending on the resolution and detail you want :)
Here, check out this video, where we scan a person with the H2: th-cam.com/video/vXeJ18RXeLw/w-d-xo.html
If you have a choice, do not use .STL files, use .STEP files instead.
STL files have a much lower resolution compared to STEP files. It does make a quality difference in the print.
Did you mention needing to swap out the usual Brass nozzle on most machines for a Hardened Steel nozzle for the extremely abrasive Carbon Fiber?
What about Safe Handling? - Don't handle PA-CF filaments bare handed, and NEVER make anything from it that will be used near bare skin or food service. Sanding requires full PPE with gloves and mask, and PA-CF parts should be sealed in a paint or clear-coated before use.
The short Carbon Fibres used in PA-CF need to be treated as just as dangerous as Asbestos or Diamond Dust.
Learnt most of the contents shown here while getting PA-CF to print reliably on a Voxelabs Aquila X2.
You definitely want hardened steel nozzles, instead of softer materials like brass -- Hardened Steel is standard on the 22 IDEX, from the factory. Handling PPE should be considered, certainly!
Nice, didn't know Cory Wong was into commercial IDEX printing
We thought he was senator Josh Hawley for awhile, but the Seinfeld accent gave him away... 😂😜
@@VisionMinerthought he looked familiar. I like when he’s absolutely ripping into people in congress
Thank You Sir!
I could print that on my bambu in 30mins and it would look way better too with no errors.. Let’s gooooooooooooo
6:54 what about torque specifications?
Hard to say no to race car parts
Ya that’s why they didn’t
15k for a printer that is slower than a slightly modified ender 3 :D
I got a bambu lab printer. I can't believe how many extra steps other printers have. So much wasted time. I can make a model and get the print started while getting the kids ready for school.
you give alot of good informations but you talk too much about those which are not important.
great content hut the music is very distracting and horrible
Noted! Thanks for the feedback :)
Bambu boys will eat you alive for showing some 15k printer. And prusaslicer is putting a crown on it. You can't do that to them. Anyway nice approach about real work.
How about sharing idea of the stl file ?
We'll ask the customer if they want it shared, but this was a print for a customer -- so probbbbably not :) Here's a few similar parts, though! thangs.com/search/NACA%20Duct?scope=all
Hahahaha he still uses Prusaclicer😂
What slicing software do you use? For many years, we were strong advocates of Simplify3D, but we've found that PrusaSlicer has truly excelled in development and innovation. In our opinion, it currently leads the pack when it comes to FFF toolpaths and advanced features. Cura is another popular option, although it often requires workarounds for high-temperature printing. That said, we've chosen PrusaSlicer as our primary slicer for the past few years and have been very satisfied. Orca may be part of our workflow in the future.
Ultimately, our machines operate using standard G-code, so you’re free to use any slicer you prefer-the core principles remain the same!
it's not pronounced "porsh" it's "por-sha"
Depends which country you grew up in 😅😅 (you are correct)
Can I borrow $15k for a printer?
Wow the quality it amazing though.
*shuffles back to his Bambu machine that's basically a toy in comparison*
Not paying $50 for glue.