Thanks for watching, and here are the links to Factor ( code 50PLASMA bit.ly/4eHXfxx ) , Onshape ( Onshape.pro/PlasmaChannel ), and the custom transformer video: th-cam.com/video/DkhpuuPljS4/w-d-xo.html . Let me know what you think about these really cool mysteries called Electrets!
Diffusers in front of the leds would be easier to see the field and maybe it would work better mounted on a proper pcb instead of free floating solder joints
@@Alfred-Neuman The difference is that the balloon eventually loses its charge, but this keeps it for a long time. As an analogy: a magnetized nail is to a permanent magnet as the balloon is to an electret
Makes for a very good filter for the smallest particles doesn't it? I have used a few metallic static charged filters but they lose their charge with time
@@Technichian462 3M bought the technology from a Dutch firm decades ago. It's really interesting how they make charged fibres, but I'm uncertain how much is a trade secret: it's enough to know that once the fibres have been formed into a non-woven fabric that the overall charge is zero (as measured form the outside), and yet individual fibres retain their charge like little capacitors.
@@DarkAttack14 Unlike HEPA filters, which use physical restriction to block particles, Electret fibres actually pull particulates from the airstream. Did you know that the masks used by most folks during the PN-demic were actually useless in thwarting viruses by the way?
Everytime I start to believe that i know everything in fundamental sciences these very intelligent science youtubers come up with videos about things that are not taught or available mainstream. I love your videos plasma man. I've always used electret microphones in my electronic projects always thought that electret is some trade name or something this video proved me wrong and made me Learn something new. Wonderful! Thanks.
@thekaxmax what undergraduate engineering school has "electrets" in the syllabus? I have a BE in electronics. I think maybe materiel science and engineering but electrets are surely some advanced pg or phd level stuff...
For the high-res version, I think you'll have an easier time designing a PCB and having it assembled for you by JLCPCB or PCBWay. You might even be able to have the sponsor the video, I've seen them sponsor quite a few maker videos featuring their PCBs
"Thumb - Power and influence. Men wearing a ring on their thumb has long been viewed as a symbol of power or influence. It has also been associated with high-class society and royalty."
For the Static Field Detector, I think it is the very weak Corona Discharge which is concentrated on the tip of your finger. The field is thus extended so the local potential difference is reduced to almost zero, because of the flying charges extending the field. Edit: To add on this, I'm pretty sure the detector works by inducing an electric dipole across the base resistor of the transistor, so incident flying charges would nullify or neutralize the induced dipole temporarily. Second Edit: I think I am mistaken because after reviewing the clip your hand isn't touching the Van De Graaf generator. It's more likely that his finger provides a short path for the slight discharge to ground, given how sensitive it is, it should be enough to discharge the base of the transistor.
The word electret sounded vaguely familiar but I couldn't place it until the last frame when you mentioned microphones. I remember the word from electronics kits and tape recorders when i was a kid back in the 70s and 80s "electret microphone." It was just a word back then. I had no idea what it meant. Interesting video, thanks.
Quick note, but when melting wax, candle makers use a bain-marie. A water bath. You fill the pan with water then put another container within, stood up on a couple of blocks. The wax goes in that. That way the temperature can never get above 100C. It's fine for wax (and also chocolate come to think of it), and it won't get high enough that the wax might ignite or char.
Well done Bro. Dielectric Fields are fascinating. I am glad you are into electrets. Thomas Townsend Brown made the best ones his unreleased patents are on the TT Brown Family website. Using Heavy elements like Tungsten Carbonate ans Carnauba Wax making an tuned potential battery
Another idea for mapping the field. Have just one sensor, or a row of them and move the sensors across smoothly while using a long camera exposure. Not sure how well it would work but might be easier than creating a huge grid. A challenge there would be ensuring it moves at a constant speed.
Electret Condenser mics also have the advantage of not needing external power supplies. Normal non-electret condenser mics require external power supplies. Either batteries in the mic housing or an actual external supply which send DC up to the mic in the same cable the sound comes back down from. But because of lower current potential, they have lower voltage out and are typically lower end models.
Electrets do need an external power, they have a jfet inside that needs current. This current can be provided by the input, there is always some leakage. Electret is usually too weak to do anything but to drive a jfet gate. So a lot of electret mics do have a battery but those batteries tend to last very long time. It is possible for battery to simply go old sooner than it drains. Basic omnidirectional electret capsules are surprisingly accurate and consistent. Panasonic WM61-A costs pennies and is inside a lot of measurement mics, like ECM-8000. I have few dozen of those somewhere, and about a hundred of another similar models.. Really simple things to play around with, take op-amp and battery, bias the input to half the PSU and connect the capsule between input and output, slap capacitors to input to the opamp input&output, feedback/gain resistor and it is about done. In a lot of applications you don't even need to be careful what components and sizes to use..
You should try your hand at making a Birkland Eyed generator, making nitric acid from air using a plasma arc. Some designs used magnets or electromagnets to force the arc into a disc, donut shape or others to increase efficiency.
This is how face mask filter media can be higher filtration efficiency than just the fabric itself. The material is made from polypropylene and is charged between charged bars.
Not just face masks. It is used much more in furnace filters! They are really effective when combined with a box fan. I had a 20 inch box fan and then used 5 furnace filters to create a big whole apartment air filter setup. The downside is 5 high merv furnace filters can cost up to 80 bucks and they only last around 3ish months depending on use time
My biggest note would be that as I went over the papers on this subject, some of the more "recent" ones on using wax (1960s I think) talked about how it was safer and more reliable to create the wax disks first, and then electrify them while solid. There is a solid phase change in the carnuba wax somewhere around 70C which is the sweet spot. Also, of note your wax had some large stress fractures, which can be minimized by adding some bees wax and/or cooling more slowly. You really beat me to my own project here, but you also solved a lot of the issues slowing me down. I wasn't confident at using 3d printed materials as a mold due to temperatures involved, and so I designed molds to pour silicone molds. My first attempt failed the same way except since my plates were well insulated the sparking happened right down the side of the solid wax and left tracks down the inside of the mold and on the wax.
I don't know if this will help, but I did a study on why high voltage wires have ribbed insulators. Turns out the ribs increase the length of the path needed for the original contact. Hard to mold ribs in the substance without a four part mold, but I would want to pour that object from the side anyway to make better contact with the plates.
Honestly this video was perfectly timed. I was about to put some money down this week and buy what I've learned now the wrong materials to build this exact electret. Thank you so so much for making this video right now. You saved me days and days of work :-)!!
If you want to bulk solder, grab some high density organic flouridated hydrocarbon with a high boiling point, make your arrays, coat them with paste-solder, just look for soldering gel or liquid solder or tin paste or atomic tin paste, then put whatever you are soldering into a catering tray, the ones they use at buffets or dinners for events, with a lid on it, a glass lid works better with a silicone seal so you don't gas yourself, then heat it up over some candles or something and you'll make a soldering environment that'll melt the solder and you won't have to do them all 1 by 1. There are a few videos on youtube of course but I have no idea what you'd have to search to find them.
the non crackhead version of this is called vapor soldering and you need to be careful with temperatures since the flourinated hydrocarbons will readily decompose into hydroflouric acid at a certain temperature.
Puzzle for me too. Either that was wireless current to ground (finger lightning rod facilitating cloud discharge) or the space between the battery/antenna plate and the Jay/tesla plate was being made a polarized dielectric (capacitor?), and I'm not sure it's not both.
@@cherylm2C6671 Same, I think. Even a capacitor is a conductor with high dielectric resistance. Sparks/lightning are dielectric breakdown, but there is also less violent transfer of charge, which accumulates gradually. In this case, charge was diverted away from the sensor to his finger. Likely, if the finger was insulated, once it accumulated enough charge, the diversion would cease and the sensor would light up again.
Ok, I just learned a bunch I didn’t know. This dude is the best! I love his passion for plasma physics and attention to detail on all the builds. Thank you!!!
That detector array seems like a perfect candidate for some creative PCB design. Make a 5x5 array on a maybe 50mm square board with strategically located power pads around the edges and solder as many as you want into a plane.
Can't believe I've never heard of this effect before. This might be the coolest thing I've seen all year, and I spend an unhealthy amount of time watching interesting science on TH-cam. How permanent is that electret?
I'm mad but happy at the same time with this video. I'm naturally a competitive guy so when i saw (electret) in the title I was furious... and that's because for the past 3 months ive been on a mission to make one of these. I'd be down for a chat to learn from your experience. I'm currently on the stage of building a high DC power supply (first step i know haha).
imagine how strong it would be charged if you apply a voltage across thats at 95% of the dielectric breakdown for that thickness. 40kv for PE this thick is nothing. 1 inch would be able to withstand at least half a megavolt. (>19MV/m for solid PE) you could stick two electret discs together with this field strength theres a method of forming lichtenberg figures inside clear acrylic plastic by bombarding it with a electron accelerator to charge it up massively and then ram a grounded spike into it to discharge it in one snap.
Yo! Nice! Hey, for the mold for the static curing you need to think of how they do the sides of large powerline insulators with the ribs, all the surface area makes it harder for the break down to happen. This should allow for higher voltages during curing. Maybe even try some ceramic paint on the 3d print too on the edges. Nice work! I a fan of Gabriel Kron, so I will be following this project close! (Edit, I see you got one rub now. 😂 should comment after I watch)
Fantastic video! I have a question: what happens if you place the electret in an electrolyte solution? I would expect that free charge carriers in the electrolyte would accumulate on either side of the electret, effectively shielding the electric field. However, I’m unsure about this because a similar effect should occur when touching the electret with your hand. It's surprising that the electric field can persist permanently. I would expect that over time, ions or molecules in an ionized state within the surrounding medium would migrate to opposite sides of the electret due to the electric field, eventually neutralizing the field. However, this might not occur if the process is energetically unfavorable-for instance, if the repulsive potential of the charges accumulating on the surface is greater than the work done by the electric field in moving the charges to the surface. In any case, this phenomenon is incredibly surprising and super cool!
For an even more amazing detector: 1) use an array of detectors to figure out the direction of the field, and then 2) use RGB leds to display both hue (which would indicate direction) and brightness (which would indicate strength). 0 strength has no defined direction, so it’s best to make it off-by-default and make it light up when in presence of an electric field.
These are also used in commercial radon detection systems as well. A small disc electret (with both plates permanently attached) is charged (by the manufacturer) to a known static voltage, sent out to vendors, which take them the locations (to be evaluated for radon) and placed in a reusable chamber with known air volume exposed to its surface. To activate the detector you simply expose opening of the chamber to the location air. After x number of hours (or days) the electrets charge voltage is read out on a handheld device, and the amount of radon it was exposed to is calculated based in the size of the container and the net decrease in the electrets charge voltage. The principal of these systems is Radon's decay products (in the air) will slowly strip the electret of its charge, and can be easily read out with a static detector (in the handheld device). After several exposures the electret will no longer have enough charge for the reader to detect and you will have to send your electrets back to the manufacture for "refurbishment" I think I'm going to try to remelt them (after they are fully discharged from use) and cool under a high voltage source and see if I can find out the range needed to "refurbish" them myself!😁
Awesome stuff once again! I would have loved to have seen an array of those small sensors next to your VanderGraaff generator to see them all light up in a row. I bet if you put the sensors in a line that's pointing away from the generator, they will light up consecutively while the charges build up and make a bigger and bigger field. Then it becomes really clear how you can modulate the field size by moving your finger closer and further away from the generator :)
So, if you want to make a higher res version of that sensor array, Do it using tiny surface mount components on a PCB, use one of the online services, have them mount tiny transistors led arrays, and make the antenna with an open trace (Similar to how PCB antennae are done) if you wanted to go all out, you could (in theory) achieve a heatmap style array using RGB LEDs and bias the green/blue LEDs with higher value resistors in line to raise their forward threshold.
when you point at the detector you're basically grounding it with your finger through the static field and the magnetic field. Your proposition aims to create a model in which a photon's past and future trajectories around its current position can be represented as volumes in space, which would then allow you to hypothetically deduce the photon’s current position and speed. Let's break down this idea: 1. Visualizing Motion in Space: In a classical physics framework, you can indeed represent the path of a photon (or any object) as a line or volume in space as it moves through time. If you imagine a 3D space where the photon travels, its past trajectory could be represented as a volume through which it has moved, while its future trajectory might expand in the direction of its travel. 2. Current Position and Speed: If you know the speed of the photon (which is constant at the speed of light in a vacuum) and the volumes representing its past and future paths, you could theoretically deduce its current position. If we assume the paths are linear and not influenced by external factors, understanding the lengths of time it has traveled and the corresponding distances would give you a precise snapshot of where it is. 3. Predicting the Position: If you have the volumes of its past and future trajectories defined mathematically (for instance, as lines extending in both directions along its path), then you could calculate the present position as the intersection of these volumes at any given moment in time. This would work well in a model where you assume no interactions that would alter the photon's course. 4. Geometric Representation: In geometric terms, the current position of the photon could indeed be thought of as the "meeting point" of the volumes representing past and future paths, providing a visually appealing way to understand its motion. The speed remains constant, so you can derive future positions based on the current one and the interval you wish to predict forward. 5. Practical Limitations: While this approach is conceptually sound within the classical framework, it's essential to remember that in the context of quantum mechanics-which governs the behavior of photons and other subatomic particles-this model may not hold. Quantum behavior can lead to phenomena such as superposition and entanglement that complicate definitive predictions about past and future positions. 6. Spacetime Concepts: This thought experiment resonates with concepts in relativity and spacetime, where we often visualize events in four dimensions (three dimensions of space plus time). In relativity, knowing an object's past and future trajectory can often inform you about its current state. Conclusion: In summary, your thought experiment regarding the relationship between a photon's past and future volumes in relation to its current state is a valid and intriguing way to think about motion and predictability. It does rely on assumptions characteristic of classical physics and does not account for the complexities introduced by quantum mechanics. It serves as a useful conceptual model, particularly when considering idealized situations without interaction or perturbation. I wish I had a classical understanding of quantum dynamics
Holy freaking moly I didn't know a static electric field was possible! But I'm relieved that there's an equivalent to a magnet 🧲 for electricity. It always felt weird to me that they were supposed to be closely related, but permanent magnets always seemed magical.
450 solder points. When I did my apprenticeship, each apprentice had to make a bird cage from tinned copper wire. Every piece of wire had to be perfectly straight and each of the 1,200 solder joints had to be to defence standard 57/21. We were given a week to do it.
Rather than making a 10 by 10 sensor field: Mount your current sensor field on a jig that you can move both horizontally and vertically, either manually or by stepper motors with belts. Then you can mount your electret in front of the sensor field and move the field about while recording the results with a static (non moving in this case) camera on a tripod. That should give you an immense amount of data if you overlay the frames additively. I'd love to see this in action if you have a chance.
Every time I watch your work, I feel that you enjoy it, the positive energy that radiates from you is amazing. Keep it up, your content is amazing 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
If you want to go high res, you could mount the detectors on a rotating mount like a ventilator. This will spare you a lot of soldering and you can increase the sensor density along the radial axis.
There's probably a billion electret microphones in use. Recently, phones have switched to MEMS microphones but electret ones were the main ones up to several years ago. But say those shady Welcome phones that are still in use around poorer countries, those are still usually electret. Action cameras, wired headsets where you have this button module with a mic, video lavalier mic, PC gaming/comm headset, that's all electret condenser microphones. You can get them up to 24mm in size, but 6mm and 9mm are most popular. Large membrane condensers use an active polariser instead that supplies about 100V to the capsule.
Static Field Detector: The problem can be modeled in many ways, but the way I chose to see it for this explanation is by modeling both the resistor and your finger as charged particles approaching the source, modeled as another charged particle. Your finger has a charge closer to the one of the source, but is much closer when you approach it, so the the electrically charged "particles" that were going to the resistor are pulled away to go to your skin and vice-versa.
for your next video please make carbon nanotubes from acetylene soot. you could even use the soot from copper acetylide, Iron Acetylide Cobalt Acetylide or Nickel Acetylide because these metals are already used as catalyst in nanotube production. I have always wanted to try this experiment
This is absolutely mind-blowing and super fascinating! I wonder how this could potentially be used in the field of chemistry. For example I read a paper a few years back about using magnets to separate chiral enantiomers during crystallization. I wonder if this could be harnessed in an application where glass is the insulating material, and it is then implemented into a still, separating the enantiomers that way. This could completely change the field of chemistry!
Magnets aren't really permanent, it's just that left on their own they'll retain their magnetism for longer than you will live. However, each time the field interacts it degrades a little. You could attach a magnet to the end of a rotating armature and affix a metal plate just outside of its rotational path and measure its magnetic field strength every day. It shouldn't be a huge change, but you'll be able to see it within a relatively short period of time, for a magnet.
Well I have admit, you reacted badly when you got called out for using BetterHelp as your sponsor but none the less it’s good to see you’ve chosen morally acceptable sponsors since then. Nice. Also really cool to see that your projects have become even more freakin awesome and bigger over time. Good for you dude. Keep up the good work
I want to make a very high resolution version of the detector! I may create one on a livestream. I have a curious question, can the PE be cut out in the mold shape and charged, or does it need to be molded?
I believe the reason for the Van deGraffe generator being affected by your finger is a simple one. The field is radiated outward in a toroid, and you finger is essentially grounding it out at that distance. Just a guess, but an easy place to start. Simply put you little detector closer.
Hello, my suggestion is to do it in 3 stages; one of 2 cm with a hole and add several aluminum balls on both sides and complete the piece with a total coverage, all stages cooling in the middle of the electric field. Tank´s for share (this is new to me)!
Fantastic video! I might have to build one of these and make a video doing experiments with it. It would be cool if you reworked your field sensors so that instead of being on/off, you could measure the strength. A quick google search shows some field sensing circuits that use op-amps. You couid probably have an arduino or something continuously varying the gain/feedback of the op-amp to find the threshold where the sensor is activated, and then have the arduino control an RGB LED to reflect that field strength. You'd presumably be able to see something akin to the electric field lines.
An electrostatic speaker is essentially a "real charge" electret. This could be fun to build. And depending on size, it has excellent freqency responce at high and mid range freqency, but you have to go huge to get good base response.
I’m guessing the van de graff generator produces a positive charge on its dome, pointing your finger at it gives a spiky shape for electrons to bunch up on and more easily get attracted through the air back across to the dome. I think it’s because the electric field density is much higher pointing into sharper shapes, making it easier to ionise the air. Also electrets are really cool, I’ve wanted to make one myself for ages. It would be really cool to see you make a capacitive motor using electrets and plates.
I'm not an electrical engineer, but I was curious about the difference between north/south and positive/negative. N/S seems to strictly describe the flow direction, and P/N refers to the alignment of quanta that's channelling the flow of electrons. Magnets do not "hold" a magnetic field so much as a field is expressed by the alignment of the quanta directing those electrons. I'd look forward to corrections or alternative models.
Static is attracted to points. Thanks for doing this. Ever since I saw a Lord Kelvins thunderstorm I've wanted to use the static field from that and cool iron. However Ive gotten a custom to breathing and id probably stop if I screwed up
Slowing the cooling process will lead to better results. Repeat the whole process using the PE in a hotter environment within 50 -80 deg celsius . You would need a better mould probably printed or made from high temp material.
On this principle we can make lightning detector, which will show us where it's will be in several next moments, or more. If we place on back side your electret, and then place between this and cloud electrostatic detector with reduce sensitivity. When we will direct that sandwich on a cloud with a fairly large negative charge, it's power lines will direct to electret, and as concequence on electrostatic detector, which will show us where will be lightning. And THANK YOU, cause I was interested about this question.
I do not know how the charges are distributed within the electret, in case each side would carry only one type of charge, cutting it in two would then allow to increase significantly the electric field. I explain: I think the electric field of your electret is due to the difference in position between positive and negative charges, when you approach the electret of an object, one type of charge is closer than the other, this difference in distance between the charge poles thus creates an electric field. If there were only one type of charge, the field generated by the potential difference would be much larger, because there would no longer be the decrease due to the other type of load. I am very intrigued by this hypothesis. It would be great if you make a second video with all the improvements made to your electret.
7:55 it was originally called "aluminum" by Sir Humphry Davy, the British chemist who first identified the metal in 1808 so im sticking with the original spelling & pronunciation. So the next time a European calls you out just to blame it on them because it was the British that named it that originally.
I liked the DIY single LED sitting on top of the AA batteries, would you be able to provide instructions on how to build that for the newbies please. Cool video, and thanks for your energy and possitivity!
Thanks for watching, and here are the links to Factor ( code 50PLASMA bit.ly/4eHXfxx ) , Onshape ( Onshape.pro/PlasmaChannel ), and the custom transformer video: th-cam.com/video/DkhpuuPljS4/w-d-xo.html . Let me know what you think about these really cool mysteries called Electrets!
how are they mysteries? lol they are well understood but i guess thats typical youtuber engagement bait
2nd reply second like
How about using a pair of N- and P-channel MOSFETS for the sensing, with red and green LEDs to show the polarity.
Better idea: make lots of tiny electrit compasses that can turn to show the directions like a magnetic compass.
More specifically Bi-color Red/Green LEDs.
@@doppelrutsch9540 Well, he's kind of already doing that with the light grid\detector thing, at the end.
Came here to say the same 😅❤
Edit: would use npn/pnp bjt of course 😅
Diffusers in front of the leds would be easier to see the field and maybe it would work better mounted on a proper pcb instead of free floating solder joints
I never even knew what an electret was until less than 20 minutes ago. What a crazy concept, I love it
I wish he explained it a bit better, from what I understood it's just like a balloon that you rob on your air... (?)
@@Alfred-NeumanI think it's like the balloon but if you melt it and the solidify the way the molecules point.
There is an electret microphone in your phone. Headsets also use them quite commonly. They are cheap and surprisingly accurate.
@@Alfred-Neuman The difference is that the balloon eventually loses its charge, but this keeps it for a long time. As an analogy: a magnetized nail is to a permanent magnet as the balloon is to an electret
I used to work for 3M. We used Electret fibres for air filters.
Ii have to of those in my house.
And in the 1990's, I bought a couple for the house I owned then too.
Makes for a very good filter for the smallest particles doesn't it? I have used a few metallic static charged filters but they lose their charge with time
@@Technichian462 3M bought the technology from a Dutch firm decades ago. It's really interesting how they make charged fibres, but I'm uncertain how much is a trade secret: it's enough to know that once the fibres have been formed into a non-woven fabric that the overall charge is zero (as measured form the outside), and yet individual fibres retain their charge like little capacitors.
@@DarkAttack14 Unlike HEPA filters, which use physical restriction to block particles, Electret fibres actually pull particulates from the airstream. Did you know that the masks used by most folks during the PN-demic were actually useless in thwarting viruses by the way?
@@chriscarter2101 That's really interesting!
Would that be the same kind of tech in like a 3M respirator?
Everytime I start to believe that i know everything in fundamental sciences these very intelligent science youtubers come up with videos about things that are not taught or available mainstream. I love your videos plasma man. I've always used electret microphones in my electronic projects always thought that electret is some trade name or something this video proved me wrong and made me Learn something new. Wonderful! Thanks.
Maaaan, diggin into 60's patents and inventions bring up topics of science you think its crazy, yet there's always a simple ass reason
Do engineering as well as high school science, easy. ;)
Stuff like this is mainstream, just not school level.
@thekaxmax what undergraduate engineering school has "electrets" in the syllabus? I have a BE in electronics. I think maybe materiel science and engineering but electrets are surely some advanced pg or phd level stuff...
For the high-res version, I think you'll have an easier time designing a PCB and having it assembled for you by JLCPCB or PCBWay. You might even be able to have the sponsor the video, I've seen them sponsor quite a few maker videos featuring their PCBs
This! And that way you can make it even higher than 10x10.
This guy deserves more
More what? More bots?
@@plotholedetective4166 More Like Praises Brother
@@plotholedetective4166 definetly more volts. he'd like that
"Thumb - Power and influence. Men wearing a ring on their thumb has long been viewed as a symbol of power or influence. It has also been associated with high-class society and royalty."
he's got 900,000 subs, what more?
For the Static Field Detector, I think it is the very weak Corona Discharge which is concentrated on the tip of your finger. The field is thus extended so the local potential difference is reduced to almost zero, because of the flying charges extending the field.
Edit: To add on this, I'm pretty sure the detector works by inducing an electric dipole across the base resistor of the transistor, so incident flying charges would nullify or neutralize the induced dipole temporarily.
Second Edit: I think I am mistaken because after reviewing the clip your hand isn't touching the Van De Graaf generator. It's more likely that his finger provides a short path for the slight discharge to ground, given how sensitive it is, it should be enough to discharge the base of the transistor.
You should try some grass seeds on top of water. Halliday Resnick had many pictures showing them to work similar to iron filings for electric field
5:24 You made a finger gun.
And with the contents of this channel, it's obvious that your finger guns would be electron ray guns.
7:57 You should always wrap things in foil shiny side inward.
I learned that from the movie Multiplicity, the nanny clone gave a lot of good advice.
The word electret sounded vaguely familiar but I couldn't place it until the last frame when you mentioned microphones. I remember the word from electronics kits and tape recorders when i was a kid back in the 70s and 80s "electret microphone." It was just a word back then. I had no idea what it meant. Interesting video, thanks.
It would be cool if you made a 3-dimensional array and plotted the field strength in 3D. You could streamline the processes using PCBs.
Great ideal, same as in my comment. That would be awsome.
I can imagine something like GreatScott's 3D led matrix
Quick note, but when melting wax, candle makers use a bain-marie. A water bath. You fill the pan with water then put another container within, stood up on a couple of blocks. The wax goes in that. That way the temperature can never get above 100C. It's fine for wax (and also chocolate come to think of it), and it won't get high enough that the wax might ignite or char.
Well done Bro. Dielectric Fields are fascinating. I am glad you are into electrets. Thomas Townsend Brown made the best ones his unreleased patents are on the TT Brown Family website. Using Heavy elements like Tungsten Carbonate ans Carnauba Wax making an tuned potential battery
Another idea for mapping the field. Have just one sensor, or a row of them and move the sensors across smoothly while using a long camera exposure. Not sure how well it would work but might be easier than creating a huge grid. A challenge there would be ensuring it moves at a constant speed.
Electret Condenser mics also have the advantage of not needing external power supplies. Normal non-electret condenser mics require external power supplies. Either batteries in the mic housing or an actual external supply which send DC up to the mic in the same cable the sound comes back down from. But because of lower current potential, they have lower voltage out and are typically lower end models.
Electrets do need an external power, they have a jfet inside that needs current. This current can be provided by the input, there is always some leakage. Electret is usually too weak to do anything but to drive a jfet gate. So a lot of electret mics do have a battery but those batteries tend to last very long time. It is possible for battery to simply go old sooner than it drains.
Basic omnidirectional electret capsules are surprisingly accurate and consistent. Panasonic WM61-A costs pennies and is inside a lot of measurement mics, like ECM-8000. I have few dozen of those somewhere, and about a hundred of another similar models.. Really simple things to play around with, take op-amp and battery, bias the input to half the PSU and connect the capsule between input and output, slap capacitors to input to the opamp input&output, feedback/gain resistor and it is about done. In a lot of applications you don't even need to be careful what components and sizes to use..
This is the kind of shit we need. Freaking Awesome.
This was extremely interesting. Thank you!
You should try your hand at making a Birkland Eyed generator, making nitric acid from air using a plasma arc. Some designs used magnets or electromagnets to force the arc into a disc, donut shape or others to increase efficiency.
This is how face mask filter media can be higher filtration efficiency than just the fabric itself. The material is made from polypropylene and is charged between charged bars.
Not just face masks. It is used much more in furnace filters! They are really effective when combined with a box fan. I had a 20 inch box fan and then used 5 furnace filters to create a big whole apartment air filter setup. The downside is 5 high merv furnace filters can cost up to 80 bucks and they only last around 3ish months depending on use time
My biggest note would be that as I went over the papers on this subject, some of the more "recent" ones on using wax (1960s I think) talked about how it was safer and more reliable to create the wax disks first, and then electrify them while solid. There is a solid phase change in the carnuba wax somewhere around 70C which is the sweet spot. Also, of note your wax had some large stress fractures, which can be minimized by adding some bees wax and/or cooling more slowly.
You really beat me to my own project here, but you also solved a lot of the issues slowing me down. I wasn't confident at using 3d printed materials as a mold due to temperatures involved, and so I designed molds to pour silicone molds. My first attempt failed the same way except since my plates were well insulated the sparking happened right down the side of the solid wax and left tracks down the inside of the mold and on the wax.
I don't know if this will help, but I did a study on why high voltage wires have ribbed insulators. Turns out the ribs increase the length of the path needed for the original contact. Hard to mold ribs in the substance without a four part mold, but I would want to pour that object from the side anyway to make better contact with the plates.
Honestly this video was perfectly timed. I was about to put some money down this week and buy what I've learned now the wrong materials to build this exact electret. Thank you so so much for making this video right now. You saved me days and days of work :-)!!
If you want to bulk solder, grab some high density organic flouridated hydrocarbon with a high boiling point, make your arrays, coat them with paste-solder, just look for soldering gel or liquid solder or tin paste or atomic tin paste, then put whatever you are soldering into a catering tray, the ones they use at buffets or dinners for events, with a lid on it, a glass lid works better with a silicone seal so you don't gas yourself, then heat it up over some candles or something and you'll make a soldering environment that'll melt the solder and you won't have to do them all 1 by 1. There are a few videos on youtube of course but I have no idea what you'd have to search to find them.
the non crackhead version of this is called vapor soldering and you need to be careful with temperatures since the flourinated hydrocarbons will readily decompose into hydroflouric acid at a certain temperature.
@@drkastenbrot 🤣🤣🤣
nah this is AWFUL advice
That is a Cool material!
I think your finger was acting as a ground for the Van De Graffe electric field.
Puzzle for me too. Either that was wireless current to ground (finger lightning rod facilitating cloud discharge) or the space between the battery/antenna plate and the Jay/tesla plate was being made a polarized dielectric (capacitor?), and I'm not sure it's not both.
@@cherylm2C6671 Same, I think. Even a capacitor is a conductor with high dielectric resistance. Sparks/lightning are dielectric breakdown, but there is also less violent transfer of charge, which accumulates gradually. In this case, charge was diverted away from the sensor to his finger. Likely, if the finger was insulated, once it accumulated enough charge, the diversion would cease and the sensor would light up again.
Wow! I don't know those exist. Why don't people talk about it more?
Very cool! Interesting concept having a permanent magnet but for electric fields instead of magnetic ones!!
Do it, do the larger version, please. I legitimately won't mind the wait.
Ok, I just learned a bunch I didn’t know. This dude is the best! I love his passion for plasma physics and attention to detail on all the builds. Thank you!!!
That detector array seems like a perfect candidate for some creative PCB design. Make a 5x5 array on a maybe 50mm square board with strategically located power pads around the edges and solder as many as you want into a plane.
Can't believe I've never heard of this effect before. This might be the coolest thing I've seen all year, and I spend an unhealthy amount of time watching interesting science on TH-cam.
How permanent is that electret?
I'm mad but happy at the same time with this video. I'm naturally a competitive guy so when i saw (electret) in the title I was furious... and that's because for the past 3 months ive been on a mission to make one of these. I'd be down for a chat to learn from your experience. I'm currently on the stage of building a high DC power supply (first step i know haha).
I love how eye opening these videos are and I love that he explains things in a way rly anyone can understand and be able to learn new things
This is great, There had to be something like a permanent magnet that would give us an electric field, and now it is here.
I sure hope this pasta tastes delicious!
imagine how strong it would be charged if you apply a voltage across thats at 95% of the dielectric breakdown for that thickness.
40kv for PE this thick is nothing. 1 inch would be able to withstand at least half a megavolt. (>19MV/m for solid PE)
you could stick two electret discs together with this field strength
theres a method of forming lichtenberg figures inside clear acrylic plastic by bombarding it with a electron accelerator to charge it up massively and then ram a grounded spike into it to discharge it in one snap.
The pattern will change depending on polarity too, negative has some truly beautiful fern like patterns.
Yo! Nice! Hey, for the mold for the static curing you need to think of how they do the sides of large powerline insulators with the ribs, all the surface area makes it harder for the break down to happen. This should allow for higher voltages during curing. Maybe even try some ceramic paint on the 3d print too on the edges. Nice work! I a fan of Gabriel Kron, so I will be following this project close! (Edit, I see you got one rub now. 😂 should comment after I watch)
Holy shit please PLEASE make an electret speaker.
Also THANK YOU for making this video.
Fantastic video! I have a question: what happens if you place the electret in an electrolyte solution? I would expect that free charge carriers in the electrolyte would accumulate on either side of the electret, effectively shielding the electric field. However, I’m unsure about this because a similar effect should occur when touching the electret with your hand.
It's surprising that the electric field can persist permanently. I would expect that over time, ions or molecules in an ionized state within the surrounding medium would migrate to opposite sides of the electret due to the electric field, eventually neutralizing the field. However, this might not occur if the process is energetically unfavorable-for instance, if the repulsive potential of the charges accumulating on the surface is greater than the work done by the electric field in moving the charges to the surface.
In any case, this phenomenon is incredibly surprising and super cool!
Could you use it to power your Corona Motor, using a fan or something to shield and unshield the static field?
For an even more amazing detector: 1) use an array of detectors to figure out the direction of the field, and then 2) use RGB leds to display both hue (which would indicate direction) and brightness (which would indicate strength). 0 strength has no defined direction, so it’s best to make it off-by-default and make it light up when in presence of an electric field.
These are also used in commercial radon detection systems as well. A small disc electret (with both plates permanently attached) is charged (by the manufacturer) to a known static voltage, sent out to vendors, which take them the locations (to be evaluated for radon) and placed in a reusable chamber with known air volume exposed to its surface. To activate the detector you simply expose opening of the chamber to the location air. After x number of hours (or days) the electrets charge voltage is read out on a handheld device, and the amount of radon it was exposed to is calculated based in the size of the container and the net decrease in the electrets charge voltage. The principal of these systems is Radon's decay products (in the air) will slowly strip the electret of its charge, and can be easily read out with a static detector (in the handheld device). After several exposures the electret will no longer have enough charge for the reader to detect and you will have to send your electrets back to the manufacture for "refurbishment" I think I'm going to try to remelt them (after they are fully discharged from use) and cool under a high voltage source and see if I can find out the range needed to "refurbish" them myself!😁
Awesome stuff once again! I would have loved to have seen an array of those small sensors next to your VanderGraaff generator to see them all light up in a row. I bet if you put the sensors in a line that's pointing away from the generator, they will light up consecutively while the charges build up and make a bigger and bigger field. Then it becomes really clear how you can modulate the field size by moving your finger closer and further away from the generator :)
Ah, thank you for doing all the work behind this video! I want to make electrets, myself, and your video is now the gold standard for how. Thank you!
So, if you want to make a higher res version of that sensor array, Do it using tiny surface mount components on a PCB, use one of the online services, have them mount tiny transistors led arrays, and make the antenna with an open trace (Similar to how PCB antennae are done)
if you wanted to go all out, you could (in theory) achieve a heatmap style array using RGB LEDs and bias the green/blue LEDs with higher value resistors in line to raise their forward threshold.
This is spectacular! I heard the term electret before, but didn't know it's so similar to magnets!! Also, PE is such a commonplace material...
when you point at the detector you're basically grounding it with your finger through the static field and the magnetic field. Your proposition aims to create a model in which a photon's past and future trajectories around its current position can be represented as volumes in space, which would then allow you to hypothetically deduce the photon’s current position and speed. Let's break down this idea:
1. Visualizing Motion in Space:
In a classical physics framework, you can indeed represent the path of a photon (or any object) as a line or volume in space as it moves through time. If you imagine a 3D space where the photon travels, its past trajectory could be represented as a volume through which it has moved, while its future trajectory might expand in the direction of its travel.
2. Current Position and Speed:
If you know the speed of the photon (which is constant at the speed of light in a vacuum) and the volumes representing its past and future paths, you could theoretically deduce its current position. If we assume the paths are linear and not influenced by external factors, understanding the lengths of time it has traveled and the corresponding distances would give you a precise snapshot of where it is.
3. Predicting the Position:
If you have the volumes of its past and future trajectories defined mathematically (for instance, as lines extending in both directions along its path), then you could calculate the present position as the intersection of these volumes at any given moment in time. This would work well in a model where you assume no interactions that would alter the photon's course.
4. Geometric Representation:
In geometric terms, the current position of the photon could indeed be thought of as the "meeting point" of the volumes representing past and future paths, providing a visually appealing way to understand its motion. The speed remains constant, so you can derive future positions based on the current one and the interval you wish to predict forward.
5. Practical Limitations:
While this approach is conceptually sound within the classical framework, it's essential to remember that in the context of quantum mechanics-which governs the behavior of photons and other subatomic particles-this model may not hold. Quantum behavior can lead to phenomena such as superposition and entanglement that complicate definitive predictions about past and future positions.
6. Spacetime Concepts:
This thought experiment resonates with concepts in relativity and spacetime, where we often visualize events in four dimensions (three dimensions of space plus time). In relativity, knowing an object's past and future trajectory can often inform you about its current state.
Conclusion:
In summary, your thought experiment regarding the relationship between a photon's past and future volumes in relation to its current state is a valid and intriguing way to think about motion and predictability. It does rely on assumptions characteristic of classical physics and does not account for the complexities introduced by quantum mechanics. It serves as a useful conceptual model, particularly when considering idealized situations without interaction or perturbation.
I wish I had a classical understanding of quantum dynamics
Great work Jay!!!!!! Impressive and encouraging.
Holy freaking moly I didn't know a static electric field was possible! But I'm relieved that there's an equivalent to a magnet 🧲 for electricity. It always felt weird to me that they were supposed to be closely related, but permanent magnets always seemed magical.
I had no idea that a material could have a permanent static charge. Very cool video. Thank you for sharing with us.
450 solder points. When I did my apprenticeship, each apprentice had to make a bird cage from tinned copper wire. Every piece of wire had to be perfectly straight and each of the 1,200 solder joints had to be to defence standard 57/21. We were given a week to do it.
Possibly having only the metal on the inside of the mold with one connection point would make a smaller chance of discharge.
Really entertaining video. I had no idea what an Electret was but now I do, pretty neat. Good job!
Rather than making a 10 by 10 sensor field: Mount your current sensor field on a jig that you can move both horizontally and vertically, either manually or by stepper motors with belts. Then you can mount your electret in front of the sensor field and move the field about while recording the results with a static (non moving in this case) camera on a tripod.
That should give you an immense amount of data if you overlay the frames additively.
I'd love to see this in action if you have a chance.
Every time I watch your work, I feel that you enjoy it, the positive energy that radiates from you is amazing. Keep it up, your content is amazing 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
great work as always.
You are very dedicated to obtain your results. An inventive mind at work. One more step inn reaching your goal!
You always manage to make videos about things I've never heard of, kudos.
If you want to go high res, you could mount the detectors on a rotating mount like a ventilator. This will spare you a lot of soldering and you can increase the sensor density along the radial axis.
You are way more than just plasma channel, and it’s great!
There's probably a billion electret microphones in use.
Recently, phones have switched to MEMS microphones but electret ones were the main ones up to several years ago. But say those shady Welcome phones that are still in use around poorer countries, those are still usually electret. Action cameras, wired headsets where you have this button module with a mic, video lavalier mic, PC gaming/comm headset, that's all electret condenser microphones. You can get them up to 24mm in size, but 6mm and 9mm are most popular.
Large membrane condensers use an active polariser instead that supplies about 100V to the capsule.
Amazing ! Hope to see the next steps !!
Static Field Detector:
The problem can be modeled in many ways, but the way I chose to see it for this explanation is by modeling both the resistor and your finger as charged particles approaching the source, modeled as another charged particle. Your finger has a charge closer to the one of the source, but is much closer when you approach it, so the the electrically charged "particles" that were going to the resistor are pulled away to go to your skin and vice-versa.
for your next video please make carbon nanotubes from acetylene soot. you could even use the soot from copper acetylide, Iron Acetylide Cobalt Acetylide or Nickel Acetylide because these metals are already used as catalyst in nanotube production. I have always wanted to try this experiment
Careful with copper acetylide, it's a really sensitive primary explosive
This is absolutely mind-blowing and super fascinating! I wonder how this could potentially be used in the field of chemistry. For example I read a paper a few years back about using magnets to separate chiral enantiomers during crystallization. I wonder if this could be harnessed in an application where glass is the insulating material, and it is then implemented into a still, separating the enantiomers that way. This could completely change the field of chemistry!
OH HELL YEAH
THESE THINGS NEED TO BE MADE MORE
Man this is cool. How long is the static field retained for? And what can you do to extend the lifespan of the charge when in storage?
Magnets aren't really permanent, it's just that left on their own they'll retain their magnetism for longer than you will live. However, each time the field interacts it degrades a little. You could attach a magnet to the end of a rotating armature and affix a metal plate just outside of its rotational path and measure its magnetic field strength every day. It shouldn't be a huge change, but you'll be able to see it within a relatively short period of time, for a magnet.
Well I have admit, you reacted badly when you got called out for using BetterHelp as your sponsor but none the less it’s good to see you’ve chosen morally acceptable sponsors since then. Nice. Also really cool to see that your projects have become even more freakin awesome and bigger over time. Good for you dude. Keep up the good work
This is wonderful . . . the magic of the universe is hidden in electrets & magets.
Chalk up another win for Jay's persistence!
This is one of my favorite videos from you. I really hope you end up making a higher resolution detector. Great video!
So cool. Thanks for teaching me.
As I watched you cook up that recipe I realized that you actually do know how to cook.
Crazy idea: can you think of a way to somehow amplify the force emanating the electret material? Bonus points for passive approaches
I want to make a very high resolution version of the detector! I may create one on a livestream. I have a curious question, can the PE be cut out in the mold shape and charged, or does it need to be molded?
Triboelectricity is the key to consistent charge power without consumption
I believe the reason for the Van deGraffe generator being affected by your finger is a simple one. The field is radiated outward in a toroid, and you finger is essentially grounding it out at that distance. Just a guess, but an easy place to start. Simply put you little detector closer.
Wow that is so cool especially when using the detector.
How great it would be to make a wimshurst machine out of this stuff.
How come I never heard about an electret or your channel? This is awesome!
Hello, my suggestion is to do it in 3 stages; one of 2 cm with a hole and add several aluminum balls on both sides and complete the piece with a total coverage, all stages cooling in the middle of the electric field. Tank´s for share (this is new to me)!
Fantastic video! I might have to build one of these and make a video doing experiments with it.
It would be cool if you reworked your field sensors so that instead of being on/off, you could measure the strength. A quick google search shows some field sensing circuits that use op-amps. You couid probably have an arduino or something continuously varying the gain/feedback of the op-amp to find the threshold where the sensor is activated, and then have the arduino control an RGB LED to reflect that field strength. You'd presumably be able to see something akin to the electric field lines.
An electrostatic speaker is essentially a "real charge" electret. This could be fun to build. And depending on size, it has excellent freqency responce at high and mid range freqency, but you have to go huge to get good base response.
Bro it's great to learn something new
Thank you 🙏 for the videos
I’m guessing the van de graff generator produces a positive charge on its dome, pointing your finger at it gives a spiky shape for electrons to bunch up on and more easily get attracted through the air back across to the dome. I think it’s because the electric field density is much higher pointing into sharper shapes, making it easier to ionise the air.
Also electrets are really cool, I’ve wanted to make one myself for ages. It would be really cool to see you make a capacitive motor using electrets and plates.
I'm not an electrical engineer, but I was curious about the difference between north/south and positive/negative. N/S seems to strictly describe the flow direction, and P/N refers to the alignment of quanta that's channelling the flow of electrons.
Magnets do not "hold" a magnetic field so much as a field is expressed by the alignment of the quanta directing those electrons.
I'd look forward to corrections or alternative models.
That is very cool! You can use this to add lightning to that Tornado cannon that you are totally not building. =]
Bro, perfect, now I can make something amazing out of this.
Static is attracted to points. Thanks for doing this. Ever since I saw a Lord Kelvins thunderstorm I've wanted to use the static field from that and cool iron. However Ive gotten a custom to breathing and id probably stop if I screwed up
This is great work, keep it up!
Slowing the cooling process will lead to better results. Repeat the whole process using the PE in a hotter environment within 50 -80 deg celsius . You would need a better mould probably printed or made from high temp material.
I am fairly certain you just invented the basic Life Form detector...
'Scanning the planet surface now, Captain...'
On this principle we can make lightning detector, which will show us where it's will be in several next moments, or more. If we place on back side your electret, and then place between this and cloud electrostatic detector with reduce sensitivity. When we will direct that sandwich on a cloud with a fairly large negative charge, it's power lines will direct to electret, and as concequence on electrostatic detector, which will show us where will be lightning. And THANK YOU, cause I was interested about this question.
I do not know how the charges are distributed within the electret, in case each side would carry only one type of charge, cutting it in two would then allow to increase significantly the electric field. I explain: I think the electric field of your electret is due to the difference in position between positive and negative charges, when you approach the electret of an object, one type of charge is closer than the other, this difference in distance between the charge poles thus creates an electric field. If there were only one type of charge, the field generated by the potential difference would be much larger, because there would no longer be the decrease due to the other type of load.
I am very intrigued by this hypothesis.
It would be great if you make a second video with all the improvements made to your electret.
7:55 it was originally called "aluminum" by Sir Humphry Davy, the British chemist who first identified the metal in 1808 so im sticking with the original spelling & pronunciation. So the next time a European calls you out just to blame it on them because it was the British that named it that originally.
I liked the DIY single LED sitting on top of the AA batteries, would you be able to provide instructions on how to build that for the newbies please. Cool video, and thanks for your energy and possitivity!
This is Awesome!!! I am going to make one too… many interesting thoughts I have…
A coffee table made of an array of these detectors and coasters made of electrets... ✨
Don't forget that a magnet can also repel water because water is diamagnetic (weakly repelled by magnetic fields).