I Resubmitted 100 CGC Graded Comic Books
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 18 ก.ย. 2023
- I didn't like the grades these 100 comic books got from CGC so I sent htem in again, what grades did they get this time, you'll be surprised!
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CGC's inconsistency is really scary.
It's like home plate umpires calling balls and strikes. Unless it's the same person grading everything there will always be inconsistencies. Even the same person can see things differently at different times. It's all a crapshoot.
This is why I rarely ever submit comics to CGC. I'd rather just buy graded books with the grade I want. I prefer the majority of my collection raw anyway.
It would be interesting to know what the totall value bump was , you spent "X" to submit the 100 books, that where valued at "Y" and after you got them back with the ups and downs the new total value of the 100 books is now "Z" .. so Z - X = your potential overall net profit from the exercise. This was a great entertaining piece of content , btw.. thanks!
Thanks. Maybe I’d this is a hit video I’ll do another one and add that in there
Loved this episode, really interesting exercise! Net profit (or loss if negative) would be Z - (X + Y) = Z - X - Y .
Yes net would be great or just some of the expenses and value bumps
The amount of grades that changed was crazy. Some of those jumps were troubling. I don't know how they can misgrade the book that bad. Makes me hesitant to send books in.
Seems more like a money maker for cgc just think if they under grade all books hoping they get resubmitted to get graded again how much money it makes the company
Not really. Grading ultimately is subjective, and it’s always the average of 3 graders per book. Due to that method, changes can occur consistently if you resubmit a book. This activity actually makes sense. And the 8.5 to 9.8 makes sense. Unfortunately it was likely mis graded the first time around. Just correctly graded this time.
@@Comicbookyoutubersrock you think cgc still actually has 3 graders grade every book? I highly doubt that. How could 3 graders give a book a 7.5 and then it gets graded a 9.4 or higher. I would bet my bottom dollar that most books are graded by one person. Especially moderns.
@@moodswing4460 Yeah I mean I just go by what they tell you the process is. Is it possible you’re right, yeah, but until there’s proof of it I have to assume it’s the average of 3 graders per book as they state is the process for every book. As far as the 7.5 to 9.4 situation, I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, these are not machines. These are humans grading comics, and humans are inherently prone to make mistakes. So in that instance, if a book was just resubmitted, not pressed/cleaned or anything like that before being sent back in, than it’s extremely likely “they” as in 3 graders messed up the first time around. I mean we’re talking thousands of books daily. Even with a system where 3 people routinely check books out, assuming that’s the case, I highly doubt mistakes don’t happen.
They seem to have zero quality control like they must just have people grading however they’re feeling that day 😭
Very interesting and expensive experiment. I recognized years ago that the slabbers are totally inconsistent. I first submitted books around 2003. Back then CGC had some credibility, was reasonably priced and typically got books back in six weeks. Then along came CBCS. Both graders quickly became equally erratic and terrible. I haven’t submitted any books to be plasticized in over 2 years. Instead, I have sold off many slabs and cracked open many in my pc. I’m much happier with raw books. I spent 25+ years owning comic shops and using Overstreet grading guidelines. Henceforth, that’s what I’m doing every time. To the devil with CGC, CBCS and PGX.
That xmen 266 from a 9.6 and trying for a 9.8 and comes back a 7.0? Did you see what the grader notes were?
“Maybe I’ll be dead and you’ll never see this video”. Lol. Funny and dark at the same time.
Hahaha and true. But I’m alive. Or I’m just an AI and I died long ago
Just realistic, noone is a special case lol
I find these types of videos pretty entertaining. Definitely should do more of these.
Well I would but it’s hard to have 100 resubmits
@@ComicBookInvestments Yeah, you definitely had a lot.
@@ComicBookInvestmentswell I will send you a bunch of resubmits you can crack them, send them in, shoot the video and send them back to me? What do you say? 😂
Amazing video! Thank you for taking the time to post this video and all the editing. Keep uo the great work and video content.
I really really enjoyed this video. Watching some of the grade drops makes me feel better about my purchasing lower 9 grades instead always shooting for the 9.8. Thanks for all your hard work editing and putting together this video. Well done! 😊
Thanks
Amazing video! Thanks for the effort and insight!!
That was a ton of fun to watch. Thanks my man
That was a awesome video man. Thank you for taking the time to put that out.
Shocking to see how grades vary for the same comic!! It all goes to show you the grading process is mostly subjective. I wouldn’t be surprised if the grader flips a coin to decide to go half point up or down. I feel CGC needs to eliminate so many grade points and just have only five different grading numbers. It’s way to chaotic in determining the grade of a comic. Very informative content Dave! 👏👏👏👍
First, I do truly enjoy watching this video. My issue is that doing this does ultimately make the census completely unreliable on an EPIC level. When calculating the fair market value, many rely upon the census as part of the equation. Again, I appreciate and respect your experiment and the outcome, but I can’t help but wonder how the census is even remotely accurate or worthwhile anymore. Thoughts? I am kinda sad with the loss of this resource when assessing fair value…
I really hope you don’t take this personal! I enjoy you and your channel tremendously!
Sorry but thank you kindly for your awesome content!!! ❤
Really nice way to say CGC is bullshit and graded slabs dont mean anything in regards to actual quality assessment
excellent thanks for the hard work you do on these videos
Great video! Appreciate the amount of work that went into it. Would be interesting to hear what CGC said about it all!
That had to be so much work! Thanks for this, really enjoyed it!
Glad you enjoyed it!
I really enjoyed this video and found it fascinating… and troubling. The swings in grade are just crazy in some cases, particularly with no re-press in between. I appreciated that you did not re-press the books, for the sake of the experiment, but if it was me, I would feel like that was leaving money on the table. Also, it really bugs me tbh that you don’t send your old labels back in; if not with this submission then separately or with a future submission. I think everyone should do this, for the integrity of the census, but particularly with someone doing as much volume as you do, and with as big of a platform as you have.
Lmfao if CGC actually did what they purport to- grade accurately, then the grades would have all come back the same & the census data would be fine... but they don't. Cuz grading doesn't mean shit.
Man, this video is awesome. Yeah, making a seperate quick video to look at potential profit margin after resubmitting the 100 would be pretty cool. This was an excellent video.
Awesome video, very much enjoyed it. Dave I would love a video of you grading books before ypu send them. You are very good at rough grading, would love to see what you look for and how your process for grading the way you do. I shall call you Sensei Dave. Lol😅. Teach us hacks the way of the grading force
Great job in production presentation and must have taken a long time to put together. I enjoyed watching this despite the annoying background music so Thanks for going thru this experiment which we all think of doing at some point.
Great video, appreciate the editing work
Thanks. Ya lots of edits
Good segment! Keep these resubmit shows going.
Great video. I hope to see more of these.
Cool video man I like how you did it seems like a lot of work, good job
Great video. Gratz on your triumphs.
Love the cuts from .. OLD Dave -to- NEW Dave .. I was cracking up. BTW, happy you didn't die!
Hahah thanks. I could be dead though. This might just be imposter Dave
Amazing!!! Nicely done.
I laughed so hard when you jumped from a new t-shirt to maybe I'll dead.
(Slight differences there Davo.) 😂
Great video, very entertaining. Nice job on your grading skills.
Thanks so much!
Great video, really enjoyed this one
Thanks. Glad you liked it
Congrats on all the bumps!
don't forget to send in the old grader tags to keep the census more accurate. every little bit helps the community.
I have a couple of comics I'm going to open up to get signed and then resubmit. What's the best way to do it? Submit in the same slabs as before?
This was a fun video to watch. Thanks!
Glad you enjoyed it!
I definitely appreciate seeing the results from this and the afterwards data from it. I do larger submissions to cgc a few times a year and this is also something I've considered doing when I don't agree with the graders notes or grades assigned to books I've submitted.
Great video. One of your best.
Thanks
Amazes me that the time and cost of resubmission would make it (potentially) worth it (with a lot of them). Really interesting vid. Wonder if CGC will see this as a good or bad thing. Pretty consistent but those big swings in grade on a couple can't be good.
I enjoy your videos. Thanks for sharing
Congrats on most of those grades Dave🙂 I am so happy for you 🙂
Thank you
This is inspiring. I have a few books I don't agree with and think I'll resend. 8.5-9.8 though, crazy.
Love this idea for a post! I always wanted to send a group of 9.8 pre-screens that didn't make the cut the first time and see if some received 9.8 the second go around?
Wow...Awesome brother. Sure wish I could grade that well. I always end up between 8.5-9.6
I really enjoyed this video! I know you must have busted your rear end editing, but it was worth it for the viewing pleasure. Do it again, please!❤
Thanks. Ya I might do another like this but I have to have enough books to get regraded
This video makes me want to go thru my slabs again. There have been many comics I've submitted that I really thought were under graded. This vid makes me think I should give resubbing a try.
Always worth a try
Great Video! So anyone who puts faith in the CGC grade should think about this... ANYTIME a highly experienced person (as you certainly are) gets a grade that's lower than they think it should be on a big book, they're going to crack it and resubmit... and they're more than likely to get the grade "corrected"... Right? Sounds reasonable... but here's the flip side... every time such a person gets a grade that is higher than it should be... They do a happy dance and they sell it based on the grade that's too high. So... what that means is that the grade that collectors see on a big book is either accurate, or a little high (because it was accurate or too high in the first place, or it's over-stated (in the case where they got lucky and didn't resubmit). So, as more and more people have big books cracked and re-graded that they think are under-graded, the AVERAGE CGC grade on big books are actually over-stated - they will tend to skew too high because of the ones that are over-graded are accepted as is. Simple math. Collectors should keep that in mind when buying a big book that they can't hold in their hands and be happy about themselves. And collectors who aren't experts shouldn't be buying big books based on the CGC grade without a consultant - because the grade (which creates the price) isn't necessarily accurate (it may be over-stated by a lot). You only submitted books that you thought were UNDER-graded. Right? Had you put aside every "gift grade" you got over the past 2 years, you'd probably have gotten 69 downgrades. CGC grades are not adequate indicators of value. But great video.
This my favorite vid ever!! You can return old labels so they can update the census.
back in 1999 ebay was rampant with sneaky dealers and in 2001 cgc came out as a third party grading service to level the playing field for buyers and put sellers on notice that over grading was looked down upon. I would never have thought I would be watching a video on reslabbing comics so u can have a grade increase good video lol
Crazy video love it
Interesting video and a credit to your grading ability.
Thanks
Thanks4 making this vid... it just shows the inaccuracies and inconsistent grading from a 3rd party company... from the grades u received, 2even u pointing out that the census is messed up from people CPR graded books... I'm not against slabbing books, by any means. Especially 4preservation purposes. But this vid is an eye opener 4sure. Thx David 👍
Dude awesome experiment. It took A TON of work though! I get batches back where I can tell the grader was having a bad day...
I’m at the beginning of the video and I think that this will be very eye-opening.
Dave.
I’ve got about a dozen I need you to look at that I’d love to know if I should resubmit.
You could have a business just doing that.
😂
Great video, keep up the good work.
This enforces my belief every book exists in a range. Most went up a grade (4.5-5.0 or 7.5-8.0) and to me that also speaks to CGC consistency which is a good thing. The ones that came back same obviously are probably maxed out and he one that dropped a grade well you lucked out getting the higher or their range originally.
The ones that bear investigation are the ones going from 7s to 9s with no work done. Or down the same way. That Xmen 266 needs some explaining. My guess is the Mario was graded by a rookie who didn’t know about the printing flaw that can exist on that book
All these were cherry picked as getting bad grades to begin with. So it was mostly just upside. The ones that got huge swings. Got really really bad grades to begin with then for way too good of grades after
@@ComicBookInvestments that makes sense that most would go up slightly or down or stay the same. It also makes sense that out of 100, bound to get 1-2 that were grossly undergraded or over graded as it is human error
I completely agree with your viewpoint and concur that CGC did pretty good existing in that range given that these books were specifically selected as likely under-graded candidates by a very experienced seller. Many sellers seem to like to always add the 'grading is subjective' line to their listings to cover their butts - and it is, but generally only to a point. A grade within 1 grade above it or below is 'subjective'. Calling stuff 'near mint' that is really in the 7-8 range, as many onile sellers do, is just trying to take advantage of people and the disadvantages of online dealing.
The strangest one here appears to be the 9.8 Swamp Thing, apparently going from severely under-graded to marginally over-graded based on his expectations. To an 'expert' 9.6-9.8 should be fairly apparent. An expert should be able to tell if a book is in 'perfect' condition.
Interesting video. Do you plan on sending in a batch of cgc labels to them so they fix the census?
Also wondering.
Thanks for sharing all of the results. Crazy swings! So did you do anything to them after cracking out? Re-press? And did you send them in under the "resubmit" option? What is that option and would it have given any better results? Thanks!
Hi David love the video as always man.I really hope you reply to this.I am going to on Collectors Comics for the first time tonight.Does every seller on Collectors Comics ship Internationally. Maybe if I buy of any seller then Collectors Comics Ships on behalf of the seller.I really have been struggling now for 7 months now with those ridiculous Ebay restrictions to South Africa. Really appreciate the help David.
Crazy congratulations
WOW! 69 out of 100 got a bump! Shows you know what you're doing. Great video!
Amazing video and demonstrates the vagaries, but also, some of the consistency of the CGC grading system. Like you said, these were hand picked because you would grade them differently. Do you think the overall cost of resubmitting these hundred books was worth the gain, and occasional lost, in value? lol, I'm sure it was as there was $2300 value chage just in the Doom book. Nice work.
can't you send the cracked labels back to CGC so they can remove them from the census? That way there won't be two 7.5s of the Fighting Man Annual.
Ya I do that after. If I send it in with the label they will give it the same grade
This is impressive work. I have a copy of Uncle Scrooge #36 in a 9.6. Labeled OW Pages and slight staple rust but it wasn't graded since 2009. Thing is, I see absolutely nothing wrong with it. I see no defects to the cover as far as I can see.
Really tempted to resubmit but nervous it might drop.
One thing that has changed from 2009, and this is documented, is that if your book is resubmitted, you'll likely at least get Off White-White Pages vs OW Pages. They've relaxed their page quality grading since then.
@@kevinrcolvin6301 I appreciate the reply. I noticed that about the page quality reading about re-submits on older graded books. Only thing that's bothering me is that staple. Its not bad but I could see a tiny bit of rust (25-30%)
Its frustrating but I think I'm going to wait until I can give this book to CGC at a live event. No way am I cracking it on my own and worried about it getting damaged. Finding this issue is one thing, but in good condition is a real challenge.
I always send the blue labels back in another shipment after my re-grades come back. Just in case there is a rule where they compare the two. Tin foil hat style.
Love to see how CGC and CBCS compare in consistency.
Very cool video
As I understand it, you must mail the old labels to CGC to update the registry. Did you keep the old labels?
Great video !!!
Glad you enjoyed it
It’s frustrating when the grade goes down.
I had one that went from 9.0 to 8.5 and 9.6 to 9.2
Yes it is
Great video!! I’m curious did cgc give you grader notes for the Xmen 266?!? Because 2.6 grade point difference is crazy!! Like a 9.6 and a 7.0 present totally different!
It got damaged
Fantastic video David! Informative and funny, your dialogue to future you was hilarious! Takeaways, it is important to know how how to grade to spot the times CGC makes a human error and then resubmit when we disagree with them. I am certain, many of your viewers who got slabs back where they disagreed with the grade will be going to look at them closely. Cheers!...:)
Thanks. Yes it pays to know how to grade
Sometimes when you go to a restaurant your portion of fries are way bigger than usual and your burger tastes better, because someone decided to hook you up by putting on an extra patty, extra tomato and more pickles on it . But sometimes they burn the burger and forget your fries.
Yes, some shockers. Need to compare grader notes. Pleasantly surprised how the lower to mid grades come back within 0.5 or 1.0 of original, as that range seems much more subjective in nature.
Great work
Thanks
just curious, does this mess with the census numbers? For example on the fighting man comic you said theres only a few in that grade. is now there another? or do you let them know after that the origional cracked one got replaced?
It does mess with the census. So there is actually a lot less that exist
@@ComicBookInvestments A pity you can't submit the labels (post grading I can see why you souldn't do it with the books for grading) to get the census down which would also help with your books worth in future?
Wow that was a lot of cracking out ! Did you do any work to any of the books ?
That Xmen 266 was painful! Does it look like it was damaged? On the whole though it shows how subjective and volitile grading can be, especially in those mid grades. Great video though, we need to see the dollars and cents breakdown though, that will tie this all together.
I don't wanna know how much editing that was😂
It all depends on the mood of the grader. There is little that prevents resins from bouncing grades. If you have the time & money just keep subbing 9.6s.
My favourite type of video
Did you send any for a clean and press? The second time?
And do you send them in slabbed? Or crack them out sebd them raw on the re submission?
What the heck went wrong with xmen 266!? Geez that's a big drop. Was there damage from cracking the slab?
Re: Fighting Man - is there a way to send back labels or something like that, to have the books removed from the census?
Very informative video here. Any you say you did NOTHING but crack and resubmit? Can you do a video on how you crack books out of these new cases? I am tempted to do a few of these. I think the graders are hung over on some of the days they grade my books.
Agree... and Dave... Please video on cracking books
And you said Raw grades were too subjective. If you have enough experience, you can trust a raw grade.
So Dave, you just cracked them out of their slabs and resubmitted without at least a C&P? Do you think it would have made a difference on the books that came back at the same grade before the resubmit? Do you send them in with the previous label or not? This was a fun video. Thanks for posting.
Can you comment on next video if and your brother do pressing to improve grades and if so how/where do you press?
Yes we do sometimes. If it needs it. Many times people think pressing helps when it really doesn’t do much. It’s a case by case. And we do it ourselves
What were the grader notes on the one that dropped from 9.6 to 7.0? That seems like a crazy drop.
Yeah, please share. A 2.6pt decrease is significant. You didn’t explain the reasons
im here for the thumbnails
If i had the money I'd buy all the ones that got downgraded. They probably look a LOT nicer than the assigned grade.
I’m here on behalf of CGC, thanking you for wasting your money and providing us with the additional profit.
Overall the grades were consistent because grading is subjective. Great video possibly the best for ppl learning about why grading is not a perfect science.
Very interesting video. Most were in the margin of error you would expect in something as subjective as grading. However, the ones going from an 8.5 to a 9.8 or down by 4 grades are very troubling. I hope CGC sees this video and makes a concerted effort to address these inconsistencies. CGC's business model of grading comics lower than they should just to get people to resubmit them borders on criminal. This video perfectly illustrates that no one but CGC wins in this scenario. While you might get more when selling these comics when they received a grade bump, you never should have had to resubmit in the first case. So, you get to sell a book for what it should have been worth when you made the original submission--but, you are out the regrade fees while CGC gets twice the money for each of the books. Might be time for a class-action lawsuit against CGC.
A professional grading service shouldn’t have to depend on the mood of the grader. They just have zero standards or consistency, but at least they sure can charge a lot for amateur grading.
On high value books do you use a 3rd party for CPR?
Sending another box of 9 tomorrow for auction
There's a Nice GA Cap #72
Some of those grade jumps were absolutely ridiculous. My question is, did you do anything other than remove them from the containers? Were any of them pressed or cleaned?
I think as someone who has hundreds of graded books, that feels very hopeful. I have a ton of 9.6s that i can't believe they were lower than that. However, why grade and pay the money if the variation is so ridiculous. Thousands are lost on this and it is not fair to the collector
Do you ever return your old Labels from cracked slabs for CGC to correct/amend the Census?
Wouldn't it be interesting to know who the grader was each time? Especially on the big jumps and downgrades. Grader vs grader lol.
GREAT video! I'm not done watching, yet, but I had to pause and ask you a few questions. Are these all just regular re-submissions, no pressing by you or CCS? And early in the video there was a 7.5 book that you said was tied for the highest and you were hoping for an 8.0. On the reveal, it was still a 7.5, but then you stated the two books on the census were both that book you had. If you send a book to CGC to regrade, do they not remove the original CGC number from the official census?
No. They don't.
CGC will remove the original census number if the original label is returned with your resubmission or anytime after. With these crack and resubmits most ppl don’t return them. Census data isn’t accurate
So glad I don’t need the opinion of a stranger to enjoy my paper products.