I suppose it's because we rarely see blackened armour in films etc (unless it's to make a dramatic point), that I assumed polished armour was "normal" (for want of a better word). But your explanation makes perfect sense. If you're leading a band of mercenaries that you've armed, a-looting and a-pillaging across the land, then more practical considerations than looking hawt come into play.
Well it's also key to note that the Victorians are largely responsible for all the shiny polished armour that we see today - they used to polish armour fit for museums since they believed that people ouldn't want to see painted or blackened armour. Plus they liked the "King Arthur and the shiny knights of Camelot" stories since it fit in with their Imperialism... So I guess we will never know how much armour was actually blackened during the medieval period :O
It would be great to interview Toby Capwell for arms, armor and jousting. Your explanation of the blackened armor make a lot of sense. Are there examples in medieval history of doing this?
As far as I'm aware we dont have any concrete evidence that maille was ever blackened. It makes perfect sense as blackening helps protect it from the elements and inevitably rust - but the maille doesn't rust when worn due to the motion of movement when being worn rubs the rust off automatically before it has time to form. The footage is mainly from various reenactment events such as Barnet and Tewkesbury in England, I film everything myself so I travel all over the UK in my spare time to capture the footage.
Yes indeed you can. There aren't any 100% confirmed surviving pieces of evidence from history though. There is a lot of artwork which clearly shows the same type of maille armour being worn by multiple soldiers however some maille has been painted lighter than others, which may suggest the presence of blackened maille, but this isn't really very strong evidence to go by. You can blacken maille in two ways, either literally paint it black, or burn linseed oil onto it. In both cases, the maille garment will be quite stiff after application, but simply wearing it and moving around in it will make it perfectly flexible again.
This is something I haven't personally researched so I only have second hand knowledge from other people - but apparently yes, maille was sometimes blackened. Again, this was supposed to prevent rest and I personally own a maille hauberk and can confirm it definitely does prevent rust as I've used my hauberk at events for 4 years and never needed to clean it. Although saying that, a normal maille shirt is weirdly self-cleaning as when you wear it, the maille links rub against each other to clean the rust off. So as long as you're wearing it often you shouldn't have to clean it anyway unless you find yourself in a pool of water somehow. Regarding what they used to blacken it - I'm not sure. Possibly linseed oil, possibly a firm of black tar, I haven't looked into it.
@@AlexTheHistoryGuy Yeah I'd heard of mail being self cleaning which is partly why I asked. Do you know if the the blackened finish would also be degraded in the same way rust on mail is?
Tbh I'm not sure, I believe my personal maille is chemical blackened in a modern way so that stays on. I'm getting new maille soon so I could perhaps test it in the future :)
@@Pentagathusosaurus The black layer would be worn off but in the same areas that wearing mail self cleans. Mail is only party self cleaning, in areas where the rings don't rub it will get dull and rusted.
@@AlexTheHistoryGuy I blackened a maille coif using the oil over flame method. The results were good for a time, but eventually the maille rusted and very much did *not* self-clean (despite twice-per-week use in combat practice). It proved impossible to re-blacken adequately due to pitting, even after burnishing in a sand tumbler. I eventually had to discard it because, each time it was hit, a rusty cloud would emerge. My experience only, and not a claim to historical practice.
Most likely not. Maille coifs were mainly from the 11th - 14th centuries, sallets generally 1460s to 1600s so by this time, maille standards (collars) had taken over the role of the coif. So no, I would not wear a coif with a sallet. You can buy a really good 6mm riveted flatring maille standard for about £200 from Habibi Armoury on Facebook who I HIGHLY recommend. My standard is from him and he is amazing at his craft.
Orles and torses are more of a personal thing by the 15th century so yes, I'd be fine with this DEPENDING on your status. What kind of soldier are you looking to portray? Levy/career soldier/professional mercenary/man at arms/knight/noble?
Yes indeed they did! We even have a few original surviving pieces such as Sallet helmets from the 1490s which had marvellously ornate paint jobs on them. Google "Leeds Royal Armouries black sallet" for an example.
@@AlexTheHistoryGuy WHERE DO I GET THIS LINSEED OIL AND HOW DOES IT WORK ? I GOT FEW SETS OF MEDIEVAL ARMOUR AND I WOULD LIKE TO BLACKEN ONE ! soz 4 caps Im excited to try this !
I suppose it's because we rarely see blackened armour in films etc (unless it's to make a dramatic point), that I assumed polished armour was "normal" (for want of a better word).
But your explanation makes perfect sense. If you're leading a band of mercenaries that you've armed, a-looting and a-pillaging across the land, then more practical considerations than looking hawt come into play.
Well it's also key to note that the Victorians are largely responsible for all the shiny polished armour that we see today - they used to polish armour fit for museums since they believed that people ouldn't want to see painted or blackened armour.
Plus they liked the "King Arthur and the shiny knights of Camelot" stories since it fit in with their Imperialism...
So I guess we will never know how much armour was actually blackened during the medieval period :O
@@AlexTheHistoryGuy Ah! "The Victorians"... [sigh]
4:15 same process as conditioning cast iron - very cool :)
Great analysis. I appreciate the effort you put into adding knowledge to lesser-known medieval topics.
Thank you, that's what my channel is all about :)
you're telling me I season my cast iron the same way you blacken armor
Haha apparently so! I guess the reasoning is the same.
Blackened armor also looks unbelievably cool and thats TRULY the most important thing 👏
It would be great to interview Toby Capwell for arms, armor and jousting. Your explanation of the blackened armor make a lot of sense. Are there examples in medieval history of doing this?
Absolutely logical - saving money and time. An excellent assessment.
Thanks I appreciate that - I worked at an armoury for a year and I can confirm that blackened armour was a decent amount cheaper and quicker to make
Love your channel and love medieval history 😊
Much appreciated:)
love your videos dude
Ayy thanks mate I really appreciate it
Two quick questions: Would mail have been blackened in the same way? And what event was the re-enactment footage you showed from?
As far as I'm aware we dont have any concrete evidence that maille was ever blackened. It makes perfect sense as blackening helps protect it from the elements and inevitably rust - but the maille doesn't rust when worn due to the motion of movement when being worn rubs the rust off automatically before it has time to form.
The footage is mainly from various reenactment events such as Barnet and Tewkesbury in England, I film everything myself so I travel all over the UK in my spare time to capture the footage.
is possible to Blackened chain Armor?
Yes indeed you can. There aren't any 100% confirmed surviving pieces of evidence from history though. There is a lot of artwork which clearly shows the same type of maille armour being worn by multiple soldiers however some maille has been painted lighter than others, which may suggest the presence of blackened maille, but this isn't really very strong evidence to go by.
You can blacken maille in two ways, either literally paint it black, or burn linseed oil onto it. In both cases, the maille garment will be quite stiff after application, but simply wearing it and moving around in it will make it perfectly flexible again.
Would mail have been blackened too?
This is something I haven't personally researched so I only have second hand knowledge from other people - but apparently yes, maille was sometimes blackened. Again, this was supposed to prevent rest and I personally own a maille hauberk and can confirm it definitely does prevent rust as I've used my hauberk at events for 4 years and never needed to clean it.
Although saying that, a normal maille shirt is weirdly self-cleaning as when you wear it, the maille links rub against each other to clean the rust off. So as long as you're wearing it often you shouldn't have to clean it anyway unless you find yourself in a pool of water somehow.
Regarding what they used to blacken it - I'm not sure. Possibly linseed oil, possibly a firm of black tar, I haven't looked into it.
@@AlexTheHistoryGuy Yeah I'd heard of mail being self cleaning which is partly why I asked. Do you know if the the blackened finish would also be degraded in the same way rust on mail is?
Tbh I'm not sure, I believe my personal maille is chemical blackened in a modern way so that stays on. I'm getting new maille soon so I could perhaps test it in the future :)
@@Pentagathusosaurus The black layer would be worn off but in the same areas that wearing mail self cleans.
Mail is only party self cleaning, in areas where the rings don't rub it will get dull and rusted.
@@AlexTheHistoryGuy I blackened a maille coif using the oil over flame method. The results were good for a time, but eventually the maille rusted and very much did *not* self-clean (despite twice-per-week use in combat practice). It proved impossible to re-blacken adequately due to pitting, even after burnishing in a sand tumbler. I eventually had to discard it because, each time it was hit, a rusty cloud would emerge. My experience only, and not a claim to historical practice.
Hello,
I have an armour question if I may?
Go ahead!
@@AlexTheHistoryGuy Would a sallet be worn in conjunction with a torse/Orle and/or a mail coif under the helmet?
Most likely not. Maille coifs were mainly from the 11th - 14th centuries, sallets generally 1460s to 1600s so by this time, maille standards (collars) had taken over the role of the coif.
So no, I would not wear a coif with a sallet. You can buy a really good 6mm riveted flatring maille standard for about £200 from Habibi Armoury on Facebook who I HIGHLY recommend. My standard is from him and he is amazing at his craft.
@@AlexTheHistoryGuy Thanks for that, regarding the torse/orle would the y be fitted? I've seen them on kettle hats of a type.
Orles and torses are more of a personal thing by the 15th century so yes, I'd be fine with this DEPENDING on your status. What kind of soldier are you looking to portray? Levy/career soldier/professional mercenary/man at arms/knight/noble?
Did medieval soldiers paint Thier armour ?
Yes indeed they did! We even have a few original surviving pieces such as Sallet helmets from the 1490s which had marvellously ornate paint jobs on them.
Google "Leeds Royal Armouries black sallet" for an example.
Yes with egg tempera! :D
How do you blacken your armour ? I hope not by spraying it black with paint lol
No no of course not! I used boiled linseed oil which is burnt into the metal after I've sanded off the scale.
@@AlexTheHistoryGuy WHERE DO I GET THIS LINSEED OIL AND HOW DOES IT WORK ? I GOT FEW SETS OF MEDIEVAL ARMOUR AND I WOULD LIKE TO BLACKEN ONE ! soz 4 caps Im excited to try this !