Everybody can think whatever he or she wants, but Santos-Dumont, A Brazilian, from Brazil, a great and beautiful American nation (for fools in the USA, America is a continent, not a nation) is the great aviation pioneer and the first to fly an airplane WITHOUT a catapult. Not just an opinion, but an opinion based on facts.
The Wright Flyer (often retrospectively referred to as Flyer I and occasionally Kitty Hawk) was the first powered aircraft designed and built by the Wright brothers. The Wright Flyer's first flight on December 17, 1903 at Kitty Hawk is recognized by the Fédération Aéronautique Internationale, the standard setting and record-keeping body for aeronautics and astronautics, as "the first sustained and controlled heavier-than-air powered flight". *Fact.*
Federative Republic of Brazil / República Federativa do Brasil (Portuguese) Motto: Ordem e Progresso (Portuguese) / (English: "Order and Progress") Anthem: Hino Nacional Brasileiro / (English: "Brazilian National Anthem") Demonym: *Brazilian* United States of America Motto: "In God We Trust" Anthem: "The Star-Spangled Banner" Demonym: *American* Compreendo?
@@cilsval Sadly, most Brazilians don't understand the cultural differences between Brazil and the USA. One major difference is that those in the Brazil are taught the world consists of 5 continents, while people in the USA are taught that the world consists of 7. This has a profound effect. To people from the United States. There is no continent called "America". There are two continents called "North America" and "South America". Thus, when referring to a continent, a person from the USA will say "North America" or "South America". When saying "America" without designating North or South, it refers to the country, and not a continent. Meanwhile, in SOUTH AMERICA, some idiot gets all offended thinking "the Yankees" have arrogantly stolen the demonym for the entire continent, and nobody in the USA knows what the hell they are even talking about. Further "United Stations" is not a good demonym, and "people from the USA" is wordy. WHAT THE HELL DO BRAZILIANS EXPECT?????? Also, it is mildly offensive to hear yourself called "North Americans" when "Americans" is your chosen demonym. You want to be called Brazilians?.. How about I just call you "Americans", since that's what you seem to want, and secretly laugh because I refused to refer to you by your chosen demonym??
At 6:00 the narrator said Santos Dumont created the Demoselle # 19 in 1909 BIG MISTAKE OR INTENTIONALLY Demoiselle # 19 was created on Nov.17 in 1907 before Wright Brothers showed up in1908. Santos-Dumont made three flights on 17 November 1907 at Issy-les-Moulineaux. In Sep 13, 1909 he created the Demoiselle # 20
+Verdelufe You will doubtless find it interesting to learn Santos Dumont incorporated a Wright-style wing warping system in his Demoiselle No 20, and installed a copy of a Wright-manufactured propeller. This you can see for yourself by comparing the propeller seen in photos of the Demoiselle No. 19 to that seen in photos of the Demoiselle No 20.
Louis Daguerre Santos Dumont already had ailerons in the historical 14-bis flights in 1906, separated surfaces . Not just wing warping. The three axis control and the propeller airfoil shape was not created by the Wrights, but earlier inventors. You can find that on the book of Joe Bullmer. They did not even discovered the principles of flight , just grabbed it from earlier inventors as well.
@@sanpol4399 - "Santos-Dumont's 14BIS had ailerons ( )" "3 axis control and airfoil propellers were invented before they were used by the Wrights." SB: Santos-Dumont frequently added features before he understood how to use them. Farman had ailerons on his planes but did not use them to bank and turn before 1909. There is no good evidence that he used them for his JAN 1908 contest winning i km circuit. If you check some of the films of the 14BIS, you will see the ailerons flapping indicating they were not used for lateral control. Unlike the Wrights and a few other pioneers of flight, SD had no experience gliding and only about 5 min. of air time in fixed wing flying machines. AC who built the look-alike replicas of the 14 BIS had functional ailerons and knew how to use them. He seems to have avoided demonstrating anything that would be beyond what Santos-Dumont could do in 1906. No U-turns, no bank & turn, no flying in circles. There were certainly publications on airfoil propellers before the Wrights. Chanute sent one paper by Stefan Drzewiecki to Wilbur Wright. Here is Wilbur's response: July 2, 1903 "My delay in writing you was chiefly due to a desire to first obtain a clear understanding of the Drzewiecki article on screws. [2] This author's methods of thought and expression are so different from my own that it has been no easy matter to master his paper. It shows a very clear understanding of some features of the question. Stefan Drzewiecki, born in 1844, Poland, was the originator of the blade element theory of screws, which considers the blades of a screw as being composed of an infinite number of aerofoil section Source: invention.psychology.msstate...Chanute_Wright_correspond/1903/Jul2-1903.html. Cayley had quite a lot to say about the the forces of flight. I
WRIGHT BROTHERS FIRST IN FLIGHT IN 1903 AND ALWAYS WRIGHT!!! ALBERT SANTOS DUMONT WAS A BRAZILLIAN NUT WHO COMMITTED SUICIDE IN 1932 BECAUSE HE WAS A PETER PAN WANNABE WHO COULD NOT FLY BUT HE SPRINKLED FAIRY DUST! Santos Dumont was a hoax, quack, fake and Peter Pan Wannabe who sprinkled Fairy Dust every were. They Wright Brothers made the first controlled, sustained flight of a powered, heavier-than-air aircraft with the Wright Flyer on December 17, 1903, 4 mi (6 km) south of Kitty Hawk, North Carolina. In addition in 1904-05, the Wright Brothers developed their flying machine into the Worlds First Practical Fixed-Wing Aircraft, the Wright Flyer III. The Wright Brothers where the first to build experimental aircraft, the Wright brothers were the first to build and invent aircraft controls that made fixed-wing powered flight possible. Santos Dumont the exlpoitator was a mentally deranged spoiled brat who never worked an honest day in his life and he hanged himself to death in 1932. However let be known that the Wright Brothers were hard working Americans with intuitive natural aviation abilities and the Wright Flyer Planes were the first heavier-than-air aircraft in the known world to fly. Down with Santos Albert Dumont the exploitator of poor Brazilians workers and slaves plus Santos was a Cuckooo-Nutcake who stole others ideas from the French people and thats why they put him in jail for a while a while. God Bless America and the Wright Brothers because they where the worlds first aviators who were alway right!!! The Wright Brothers were first to invent the true wing with built in airerlons and their 212 US and European Patent prove ir true.
Sou orgulhoso de ser brasileiro e mais ainda de ser um brasileiro o primeiro homem a mostrar ao mundo que seria possível o ser humano voar. Alberto Santos Dumont, pai da aviação. Abraço. Genilson Oliveira
@@iv1729 Sim, Da Vince idealizou, mas quem colocou em pratica foram os homens modernos. Como sabemos, muitos fizeram aeroplanos pelo mundo além de Santos Dumont, porém ele foi o único que não ligou que o mundo visse seus projetos e também foi o primeiro a demonstrar seu "invento" em um concurso que foi aberto a todos os inventores do mundo. Só não participou quem não quis.
@@evolucaodamente4902 Atualmente estoy lendo a biografia de Roland Garros quem foi influenciado por Alberto Santos Dumont. Mesmo quando Dumont fechou sua fábrica, ele deu a Garros seu avião 14 bis. O livro também fala sobre como os irmãos Wright tentaram processar qualquer pessoa pensando que lhes roubaram suas idéias, enquanto Santos Dumont, como o vídeo menciona, foi muito generoso com suas idéias. Ainda espero um dia ir ao Rio de Janeiro, visitar o local de descanso de Alberto Santos Dumont para prestar minhas homenagens.
@@alanabdelnour2870 @Alan Abdelnour Verdade Alan, Santos Dumont era uma pessoa generosa que estava em outro nível de evolução muito acima de nós. Ao meu ver, só o fato de não ter sido ganancioso já fazia dele um super ser humano pra mim. Eu moro em São Paulo e também pretendo um dia visitar a casa museu de santos Dumont no Rio. Eu fiz um vídeo denuncia aqui no meu canal a respeito do monumento em homenagem prestado a ele aqui na zona norte de São Paulo na praça Campo de Bagatelle... busca essa praça no Google. Vira e mexe eu passo por lá e nessas passagens, vi que o 14Bis e o busto de Dumont estavam quase em ruínas. Fiquei triste com a situação e gravei um vídeo e postei. Abraço meu caro. Estamos juntos.🤜🏽🤛🏽
WRIGHT BROTHERS FIRST IN FLIGHT IN 1903 AND ALWAYS WRIGHT!!! Santos Dumont was a hoax, quack, fake and Peter Pan Wannabe who sprinkled Fairy Dust every were. They Wright Brothers made the first controlled, sustained flight of a powered, heavier-than-air aircraft with the Wright Flyer on December 17, 1903, 4 mi (6 km) south of Kitty Hawk, North Carolina. In addition in 1904-05, the Wright Brothers developed their flying machine into the Worlds First Practical Fixed-Wing Aircraft, the Wright Flyer III. The Wright Brothers where the first to build experimental aircraft, the Wright brothers were the first to build and invent aircraft controls that made fixed-wing powered flight possible. Santos Dumont the exlpoitator was a mentally deranged spoiled brat who never worked an honest day in his life and he hanged himself to death in 1932. However let be known that the Wright Brothers were hard working Americans with intuitive natural aviation abilities and the Wright Flyer Planes were the first heavier-than-air aircraft in the known world to fly. Down with Santos Albert Dumont the exploitator of poor Brazilians workers and slaves plus Santos was a Cuckooo-Nutcake who stole others ideas from the French people and thats why they put him in jail for a while a while. God Bless America and the Wright Brothers because they where the worlds first aviators who were alway right!!! The Wright Brothers were first to invent the true wing with built in airerlons and their 212 US and European Patent prove ir true.
@@kimberlywilliams7543 poor whit brothers were called crazy in the city where they lived, even shit flies with a catapult, the brothers' invention had no evidence that they flew today with several attempts to no one has managed . unlike Santos Drumond, who even has a traveler showing the working invention of a Brazilian, I just feel sorry that in the United States I don't know the real inventor of the airplane . And live "America" the continent not your country called the United States not America the continent hahahahah.
The Aero Club of America, Aero Club de France, the Federation Aeronautique Internatioinale, Octave Chenault, Ferdinand Ferber, and the French Government all certified the Wrights as having flown in 1903. The December 1905 and January 1906 issues of L'Aerophile documented the Wrights' successful flights at Kitty Hawk, North Carolina and Dayton, Ohio. In point of fact, it was L'Aerophile's reportage of the Wrights that motivated Santos Dumont to cease experimentation with lighter-than-air aircraft and instead concentrate on heavier-than-air aircraft. Why do you accuse the French of lying? Why do you hate France?😊😊😊😊😊
@@louisdaguerre6002 SB: Good point but you have to provide the documentation. It is easy to find hearsay quotes that would support your thesis. Those would be summarily dismissed. See if you can find better evidence. The 1905 and 1906 issues of L'Aerophile are available on line. See if you can find the short articles by Ferber. (to locate, just Google the name of the monthly magazine) Feber had attempted to build a Wright Glider based on the descriptions he read. He also attempted to fly a Wright Flyer that Archdeacon had purchased. He was not successful. He went to Dayton as a critic to prove the Wrights were exaggerating the performance of their craft. He arrive to late to witness a flight of the Wright Flyer III but he was given a list of 30 prominent citizens who had witnessed the flights. He left Dayton and returned to Paris, not as a critic but as a convert. SB: The Angry Birds epithet refers to the movie where flightless birds have to be catapulted over the wall with a sling shot. The Wright Brothers created flying machines that couldn't fly without a catapult. This is a total misunderstanding of the Wright experiments. Their early porotypes could not fly without the assistance of a weak motor and a strong headwind. In Ohio, they needed the motor, some headwind, and a derrick catapult that supplied the equivalent of about 6 mph of forward momentum. if the motor wasn't working right, the could not fly. If the wind was under 6 mph, they couldn't take off. In 1905, the motor could produce about 18 hp. That still might not been enough to take off from an extended wooden track. The catapult is just a way to shorten the runway.
Good God, I'm glad to know the truth that is most likely. But, what a tragic end. He must have felt anguish about his unintended contribution as an accomplice to human destruction. How sad.
Santos was a dreamer, a man full of ideas and his ambitious goal was to take people up there in the air. He was obsessed with the idea of flying and dedicated his life to get there and fly... and he did many times, and all his projects and tests were public. People literally followed him wherever he went carrying his flying sources and machines. People loved him. He did all this for you for me for people, and after many accidents he became weak. When he saw his invention and all his life dedication to take people up there, flying, as a war aircraft weapon to kill people, he felt guilty and wounded in his heart. I know its a bit difficult to understand but flying was his goal not using it to kill others.
Santos used to donate part of his money prizes from flying competitions to the poor in France as he received the money from France, the french deverved part of it, so he gave the money to the poor
@ooosadaze, @itis4peace SB: Duvido que você possa obter muita verdade de uma afirmação sem fundamento que beira uma teoria da conspiração. O Prof. Lins de Barros falou a verdade quando disse: “ventos fortes e constantes em Kitty Hawk foram cruciais para a decolagem do Flyer, desqualificando o voo por não haver prova disso poderia decolar por conta própria. ” Isso foi em 2000. Agora temos provas. A tentativa de voar a réplica exata em 17 de dezembro de 2002, um dia incomum sem vento em Kitty Hawk, provou que esta nave não poderia decolar sem um forte vento contrário, além de um fraco motor de 12 hp. Ele poderia voar de 100 a 120 pés (50+ metros) quando houvesse um vento contrário a 14 mph. Houve 2 voos de teste bem-sucedidos. Em 20 de novembro de 2003, o Dr. Kevin Kochersberger pilotou o 1903 Wright Experience Replica Flyer. Com um vento de 15 mph, ele voou uma distância de 100 pés. A famosa foto deste vôo não foi divulgada até 1905 na exposição American Aero-Clubs NYC. Wright também emprestou peças do motor original para exibição. Estas peças nunca foram devolvidas. Isso está perto da distância estimada de 120 pés que Orville voou em 1903. Mais tarde no mesmo dia, com um vento contrário de 27 mph, Wilbur Wright afirma ter voado uns incríveis 852 pés em 59 segundos. th-cam.com/video/o1mscspl-VU/w-d-xo.html (Voo John Denver: assistir? V = yHxvdV9elL8 e recurso) PS: Quando minha esposa tinha 4 anos, ela e sua família moravam em Minas a cerca de 50 milhas da Fazenda Santos-Dumont. Foi vendido quando o pai de Alberto foi para a Europa em busca de alívio para o doloroso ferimento causado pela queda de um cavalo. Posteriormente, o colégio de elite que Santos Dumont frequentou em Ribeirão Preto mudou de nome para homenagear o aviador. Como professora do ensino fundamental (posteriormente diretora) dava aulas sobre Santos Dumont.SB: I doubt if you can get much truth from an unsupported claim that borders on a conspiracy theory. (In English) Prof. Lins de Barros spoke the truth when he said: “strong, steady winds at Kitty Hawk were crucial for the Flyer’s take-off, disqualifying the flight because there was no proof it could lift off on its own.” That was back in 2000. Now we have proof. The attempt to fly the exact replica on Dec. 17, 2002, an unusual windless day at Kitty Hawk, proved that this craft could not achieve lift off without a strong headwind in addition to a weak 12 hp motor. It could sort of fly 100 to 120 ft. (50+ meters) when there was a 14+ mph headwind. There were 2 successful test flights. On November 20, 2003, Dr. Kevin Kochersberger piloted the 1903 Wright Experience Replica Flyer. With a 15 mph wind, he flew a distance of 100 feet. The famous picture of this flight was not released until 1905 at the American Aero-Clubs NYC exhibition. Wright also lent parts of the original motor to display. This parts were never returned. That is close to the estimated 120 ft. distance that Orville flew in 1903. Later on the same day with a 27 mph headwind Wilbur Wright claims to have flown an incredible 852 ft. in 59 sec. th-cam.com/video/o1mscspl-VU/w-d-xo.html (John Denver flight: watch?v=yHxvdV9elL8&feature) PS: When my wife was 4 years old, she and her family lived in Minas about 50 miles from the Santos-Dumont coffee plantation. It was sold when Alberto's father went to Europe to find relief for his painful injury from falling off a horse. Later the elite high school Santos Dumont attended in Ribeirão Preto changed its name to honor the airman. As an elementary school teacher (later principal) she taught her classes about Santos Dumont.
Nobody would risk their neck in a Flyer today. I'll hop in a Demoiselle any day of the week. It was the original ultralight 170 years ahead of its time. I'm American and I'm giving it to Dumont.
Good point, but the Demoiselle flew 6 years later. The Wrights, Santos Dumont, Bleriot and others had already flown in a variety of designs. The Demoiselle is indeed a engineering marvel. Where I can see a picture of your plane?
+Alejandro Irausquin Actually not. the Demoiselle flew before the Bleriot models. And the Wright Brothers had just the same design concept always. The Demoiselle was the first plane using the rudder and elevator in the back and the first to use a spinner.
San Pol Bleriot's first flight was in his Bleriot VI, in March 1907, followed by flights in the same plane in July 25, August 6, and September 17, 1907. Demoiselle flew in November 1907. Nobody is discussing configurations here. I do love the Demoiselle and do really want to built a modified one for myself!
why appeared after Santos Dumont: the global aviation, flights over cities, flights over various locations, aircraft's builders and Wright Bros in First flight?
Do you have a link to the FAI records you mention. The first FAI record that I find listed is the one for circular flight in 1908. It was won by a voisin-farman.
THE FACT IS THAT, SANTOS DUMONT WAS THE FIRST, THE REST IS HISTORY, OF PEOPLE WHO CAN NOT ANALYZE AND RECOGNIZE A GREAT, CHARACTER OF THE HISTORY OF HUMANITY, SANTOS DUMONT, BORN IN BRAZIL, THE FATHER OF AVIATION ....
@MB Rodrigues: "Santos Dumont was the first..." SB: Santos Dumont was not the first unless you redefine or restrict the concept of what it means to fly. 20 others have claimed to have been first before 1903. Santos was the first to fly a manned rigid wind machine that was witnessed by officials from the AeroClub and certified by the FAI. It was the first official flight over a distance of 50 m. and later 100 m. The Wrights had observers from the American Aero Club at some of their flights. However, they were not official witnesses and they were not French. The Wrights claim to have covered an incredible 873 ft. on their 4th flight. Santos only had to cover 100 m. or roughly 300 ft. to win the Deutsche-Archdeacon prize. There is no doubt that Santos Dumont flew for 100 m or more in less than 22 sec. There is no incontestable evidence that the Wrights flew 873 ft. in 59 sec. in 1903. Being the first to fly does not make you the undisputed father of aviation. Sir George Caley (1780's) had his driver pilot his flying contraption a few feet. Should the driver be hailed as the father of aviation?
The Wright Brothers flew 3 years before Santos Dumont. Even the Deutsche-Archdeacon prize was only willing to claim that his was the first "powered flight in Europe". Why? Because people had flown before, just not in Europe. The Wright brothers and Dumont should all three be honored as scientists who contributed to modern aviation. The Wrights flew first, but Dumont's design included landing gear (wheels), and stabilization (tail lift) that the Wright's machine didn't.
@@YeshuaIsTheTruth The anti-wright crowd will dispute that the Wrights did anything before 1908 because they refused to supply proof without an up front payment in the neighborhood of $35,000. Their argument is without incontestable evidence, there is no proof. Since Santos Dumont's flight had incontestable proof, it was the first powered aircraft anywhere for all time. For Cayley's short hop in a manned flying machine to count, he would have had to set a contest and have the winner determined by expert witnesses from the Aero Club. Without this set up, there would be no incontestable proof that the fight of his coachman ever happened.
@@YeshuaIsTheTruth: wrote: The Brazilian critics are wrong. People talked about the WB before 1906. You did not document your claim. The easiest evidence can be found in the articles by Octave Chanute. The Wrights got their start by copying the bracing on the Chanute-Herring Glider. Chanute did not use wing warping. This was a feature they added and it gave them more control in high winds. Chanute wrote about the Wright glider experiment in French so the efforts were well known in Paris. I don't have a good reference so if you know of a couple, please provide them. I don't think anyone is claiming that the Wrights were not talked about. The claim was that their experiments were imaginary. The Wrights were bluffers and hoaxers. For many critics, even the efforts of the Wrights to demonstrate their mastery of the air by flying in circles in front of a crowd of witnesses doesn't count as evidence. Some think that the testimony of witnesses was part of the conspiracy. Others think that historical proofs don't count because they are not sufficient evidence of the quality they demand. The proof of performance has to be incontestable. Parts of a historical narrative might be built on facts but the narrative itself almost always goes beyond what cannot be disputed. In short, they try to throw out all historical narratives. Their high requirements for evidence rarely applies to their own arguments.
ALBERT SANTOS DUMONT WAS A BRAZILLIAN NUT WHO COMMITTED SUICIDE IN 1932 BECAUSE HE WAS A PETER PAN WANNABE WHO COULD NOT FLY BUT HE SPRINKLED FAIRY DUST!
Santos was a dreamer, a man full of ideas and his ambitious goal was to take people up there in the air. He was obsessed with the idea of flying and dedicated his life to get there and fly... and he did many times, and all his projects and tests were public. People literally followed him wherever he went carrying his flying sources and machines. People loved him. He did all this for you for me for people, and after many accidents he became weak. When he saw his invention and all his life dedication to take people up there, flying, as a war aircraft weapon to kill people, he felt guilty and wounded in his heart. I know its a bit difficult to understand but flying was his goal not using it to kill others.
Santos used to donate part of his money prizes from flying competitions to the poor in France as he received the money from France, the french deverved part of it, so he gave the money to the poor
Why didn't the Wright brothers present the plane to the American trademarks for registration? Note that the patent took three years to be filed and the plane was not registered !!
Be careful about putting too much faith or credence in the Vargas created legend of Santos-Dumont. He may have been a good man but in his later years he suffered from terrible physical and mental problems. Santos didn't need the money from the prizes. The story I read said he gave it to his workers. He moved from Paris to a small seaside town. He was charged with being a foreign spy mainly because he owned a telescope. After being charged he became very depressed and paranoid. He destroyed most of his papers. After being acquitted, he moved to Switzerland where he took up residence in a swiss sanitarium. He could and did leave from time to time since he was not required to stay there. One of his brothers picked him up at the Sanitarium and took him back to Brazil where he left him unattended in a hotel. He committed suicide a day later. Can anyone recommend a biography that attempts to be objective?
The discussion about who flew an airplane first is endless. At one side we have people that are sure about Santos Dumont flight. At the other side we have people that believe the Wright Brothers flew before 1906, but they can not show any proof about that, they are not sure about that , just believe, and that is it.
Wrights used a catapult to help speed up on their short track. They used track to take off from rough grass fields. If they had Dumonts money they could have had an airstrip built.
He was a true early aviator but not the first to achieve controlled powered flight. His 1906 historic flight in Paris had only 2 axis control, not the 3 needed to actually control the plane. They were essentially powered hops. The Wrights for years already had 3 axis control and a year before had flown 39 km!!! Dumont's best flight that day was 220 m. It's not even close. It doesn't matter how the Wrights got in the air, they stayed in the air and controlled their machine for kms when everyone else were struggling for metres!
1903 is 3 years before 1906. 1904 the Wrights did a 2.75 mile flight. 1905 a 24 mile flight!!! A passenger in 1908. 1908 Wilbur flew for 124 kilometres, in Europe.
Santos Dumont certamente reconhecido como o pai da aviação no Brasil. A maioria dos países tem um herói local que consideram o pai da aviação. Não creio que alguém possa ser reconhecido como o único inventor do avião. Eles podem ser reconhecidos como sendo um dos principais contribuintes. Havia pelo menos 200 colaboradores antes de 1910. (in English) Santos Dumont certainly recognized as the father of aviation in Brazil. Most countries have a local hero they consider to be the father of aviation. I don't think that anyone can be recognized as the sole inventor of the airplane. They can be recognized as being a major contributor. There were at least 200 contributors before 1910.
The early wind tunnel test at NASA used a defective propeller design based on a museum replica. Museum replicas rarely make a claim to authenticity. They are look alikes and not meant to fly. The museum replica that NASA used to make a replica of the propeller couldn't fly but it did resemble an early Wright Flyer. The particular prop produced more Drag than Thrust. A plane with this propeller would not fly. We know that the 1903 Flyer did not use this prop because Thrust was measured by a spring scale and found to be more efficient than the Wrights had calculated.. The early Wright flyers required strong headwind and engine power. Without the assistance provided by a strong headwind, the Flyer would not take off. This is what the 2003 Centennial flight proved. There were two test flights before Dec. 17, 2003. Both times the replica flew about 100 ft. It was consistent with what the NASA engineers predicted if the pilots were not experienced. The 1903 Wright Flyer was next to impossible to fly. On November 20, 2003, Dr. Kevin Kochersberger piloted the 1903 Wright Experience Replica Flyer. With 15-18 mph winds he flew a distance of nearly 100 feet. th-cam.com/video/o1mscspl-VU/w-d-xo.html
@GNJ: SB: NASA did not lie. In 2003 the Wright replica did not fly. In other words, Wright brothers WON'T FLY NASA used a replica of a bad replica of the propellers used by the Wrights. They reported that this prop would not produce more Thrust than Drag. In other words, a flying machine that used such a prop would not fly. I am not sure you could say that those who built the museum replicas were liars unless they claimed that the facsimile props on the museum display were the ones actually used or would actually fly. Museum Wright Flyer replicas usually don't fly. They are look alike replicas. We know that the original Wright flyer used efficient props because they were tested on site and produced more thrust that the Wright's had calculated they would produce. Here is an exact replica of the Wright Flyer. It does not fly well, but it does fly about 100 ft. Its failure to fly 200 ft. cannot be attributed to defective propellers. On November 20, 2003, Dr. Kevin Kochersberger piloted the 1903 Wright Experience Replica Flyer. With 15 mph winds he flew a distance of nearly 100 feet. th-cam.com/video/o1mscspl-VU/w-d-xo.html
@@stevebett4947 *NASA REPORT >>>>"Wright Flyer", A look at handling qualities of canard configurations, Nasa , p. 8, TM 88354, ...the Flyer was highly unstable... The lateral/directional stability and control of the Flyer were marginal."
Our immortal Father global aviation proved that heavier than air would rise without any catapult or human strength, proving before the aéro club of France and a large crowd in Paris and proved that his invention the 14 Bis was the aviation pioneer . While Wrigt brothers without any proven witness became in the mouths of North American pioneers of this invention. But Alberto Santos Dumont from the top of its simplicity and honesty proved its success becoming the king of France, and Laureate recognized by many countries, especially the nation that always loved the Brazilian people.
Santos Dumont would never give up his planes for the First and Second World Wars, and as he closed the factory because of the war, the French became resentful of Santos Dumont and simply ceased to recognize him as the father of aviation, the one who actually flew first, giving this place to the Wright Brothers to please the United States who were now mass-manufacturing planes for France. Nothing is as simple as it seems, there's geopolitics in between.
Actually, the truth is much simpler than this strange fiction you created. It was Dumont who destroyed the 14 Bis and all its design drawings shortly after its last flight because he knew it was a dead end. The next one the 15 Bis was even worse.
@@raymondjensen4603 he destroyed only a few recent inventions and at the end of his life, he did so after he saw planes, planes that he had created, bombing São Paulo, in the attempt of a coup d'état in 1930. but his relevant inventions such as the 14 Bis and the Demoiselle which you call the 15 Bis (NOTE: 15 bis never existed, he stopped at the 14 Bis, the Demoiselle being a new model of his experiments) were used in world aviation as models to be followed and were opened for the whole world to use and make their own planes. Santos Dumont donated his designs to the world airplane because he believed that something like this should not be patented. he destroyed his other projects because he was disgusted with life, because he felt guilty for having invented something so destructive because his models were used in World War I. No, it's not that simple. In addition, he was the first man to actually fly in an airplane, while the brothers had a glider that only took off with a catapult.
1903 is 3 years before 1906. 1904 the Wrights did a 2.75 mile flight. 1905 a 24 mile flight!!! A passenger in 1908. 1908 Wilbur flew for 124 kilometres, in Europe.
The Wright brothers built a pusher style/front canard aircraft that required an daredevil to fly. Santos-Dumont built tractor style aircraft that were easier to fly and became the dominant layout for modern aircraft. Both came to decry the use of aircraft as weapons of war.
The Wright's first machine took off from a 60 ft rail into 25+ mph wind that probably would have shredded the 14bis, and it had lateral control that the 14bis totally lacked, so I don't know who the greater daredevils were here. Contrary to popular belief, the Wrights did not use a catapult for their first flights. Their takeoff rail was too short to permit a long takeoff run to build sufficient airspeed so the headwind was necessary. They built their catapult later in order to fly off of their short rails back in Ohio on days when the wind was calm. The catapult was not used on days with sufficient breeze. They did not like using wheels in flight as they added drag and weight but when the Army requested wheels on the Wright Model B, they begrudgingly acquiesed and provided them. No rail was required for takeoff and ground handling became much easier.
@@Otokichi786 A further note is that the Santos-Dumont 14bis was also a "tail-first" canard pusher design. I believe his first successful tractor-type airplanes were the different versions of the Demoiselle, for which he offered plans for sale to the public, making Alberto Santos-Dumont the father and founder of the entire amateur-built experimental aircraft branch of the aviation industry. The first Demoiselles were designed around a 25 hp Darracq engine, and number of builders could not get them off the ground if their butts were a bit on the heavy side...
The Flyer depended on catapults until 1908. in fact, the U>S. military considered the Flyer but did not approve because they needed a machine that would be able to turn around in the battle environments where catapults would be be unfeasible. the Wrights were aware of the Aeroclub de France prize for the first heavier-than-air to fly for a certain distance and height but chose not to participate. Among others including Louis Bleriot, Santos took the prize and was issued pilot licence number one, wich stands as the first official brevet until today.
+PUMA PRETO the catapult iS not the issue, it never was an issue (only recently it has become an issue) if you understand anything about the development of the early Wright Flyers-then the use of a catapult is negligible. When Wilbur first flew in Europe in August 1908, his two minute flight confirmed everything that the Wrights had claimed up until that time. I would suggest you read ANY periodical, as well as statements from all the leading aviators, the Wrights were hailed as the true inventors of flight. There are eyewitness accounts and published accounts prior to 1908, look them up. THe true solution was about "riding the horse" as Wilbur wrote, that was the real problem to be solved. By August 1908 no one on the planet had more hours in the air then the Wright brothers, this is an undisputed FACT.
Gaitaboa Gaitaboa We've had this conversation a hundred times, so here we go again. What year was the letter? 1907? The Wrights were gathering information to see if Dumont had infringed on the Wright patent. Very simple. That is why they wanted exact information-nothing more. By 1905 they could fly much further and much higher. It is pitiful to see so many Dumont supporters look at this as though the wrights were stealing design information-WRONG.
th-cam.com/video/3NWFFSx5lSE/w-d-xo.html Santos was using bike's pieces since his early start with his extravagant attempts to construct an aircraft to fly in France, Paris. And note that Santos was also a pioneer using these materials.
@@itis4peace The one video of 14 flying does not show it at the 15 foot height, however, nor of it doing any turns. I suspect it never did and couldn't turn very well, if at all. His dragonfly looked quite bit better, but a more soon-to-be conventional configuration with rear tail
I think it all boils down to "definition." The Wright Brothers plane was the first heavier than air machine, but Santos-Dumont's craft was far closer to the conventional function of an actual working airplane.
Shivkar Bapuji Talpade an indian is the first inventor of Aeroplane which take off but couldn't fly due to tecnical issues. The design is presented and based on facts of some thousand years of ancient texts in the VYMANIKA SASTRA.
You know I often see bickering about who when where. Catapults and track takeoff or wheels and long smooth runways. Flights of single digit inches in altitude in straight lines for tens of seconds accounting as modern controlled engine flight. Give it up folks. The Wrights studied the hundred years of known aerodynamics, experimented with scale gliders and props in wind tunnels they built to achieve best foil shape, hp requirements and the control method. Most of the failed or uncontrolled attempts by German, French, US and Brazilian developers from 1890-1906 were due to a lack of scientific/engineering approach or a purchased engine that was way too heavy. Air development was a big push around 1900 and people took dreadful risks without enough engineering. The Wright's designed their own engine that was stripped of all covers and cowlings. Thin walled blocks and open air valves and sparks. They built their own prop drive from their bicycle chains, control flaps/warps with bike cables, they built the whole thing, not just assembled parts. Witnesses observed and testified to controlled flight in 1903 including turns on the beach. Many more flights leading up to a European demonstration three years later. While other gentlemen aviators later in the decade were trying to win Daily Mail prize money or bragging rights (while studying the Wright patent and engine)... The Wrights were ignoring all that to focus on selling their planes as practical tools to various governments and build a flying school in Montgomery, AL for the Air Corp. While men were getting novelty prizes in Europe for 5, 10 or 30 minutes of flight, the Wrights had achieved flights of well over an hour by mid decade, AND they were selling airplanes. The track and catapult was a practical device for a world not yet fitted with takeoff fields aimed at any point of prevailing wind, and to demonstrate the use of airplanes to armies and navies. Naval aircraft still take off with catapult and rail. I think they're flying people. Every early developer eventually acknowledged the Wrights' detailed, consistent, well documented and quiet work was what got incorporated into all airplanes by 1913. They are still just a milestone in the timeline of human flight, just as Chuck Yeager flew faster than sound. Or did he, as he was launched in flight from a larger bomber. Yes he did, the start method notwithstanding. Santos-Dumont was a brave and Imaginative air pioneer. First, second or third, the industry eventually used Wrights' design and weight to hp methods.
I'm not saying it is as big of a deal as the first human to fly, but the first ion propelled craft to carry its power supply, can be seen in flight, by clicking the purple channel icon to the left. It took a large power to weight ratio increase to lift the power supply with just ions. Many of the news programs claim MIT did it first, but they are very clearly incorrect.
I only see a bunch of mad Wrong brother's fans that can't recognize who invented an actual plane instead of a slingshot 👌proceed to stay upset imperial system users
Santos Dumont foi pioneiro em máquinas voadora mais leve que o ar, e no mais pesado que o ar. O engraçado e os americanos falando que o 14 bis era uma máquina desajeitado sendo que o Flyers nunca vôo! Como o flyers vôo tendo mais peso e pouca potência?
When Santos Dumont flew the 14 bis in 1906, the Wright Brothers had already built and flown three different heavier-than-air flying machines: 1) The 1903 Flyer, which took off under its own power and flew 852 feet (260 m) in 59 seconds; 2) The 1904 Flyer which also took off under its own power and was the first heavier-than-air craft to fly in a complete circle as well as covering a distance of 4,080 feet; and 3) the 1905 Flyer which also took off under its own power and flew a distance of twenty-four miles, including several circular maneuvers. On the other hand, Santos Dumont's 14 bis was essentially uncontrollable and was only capable of flying short distances in a straight line.
- Where is it possible to find the official proofs about those flights? Who provided that information? - Could you explain why the 14-bis would just be able to fly straight line? Or short distances ?
+San Pol >>>San Pol said: "Where is it possible to find the official proofs about those flights? Who provided that information?" For archival information and primary source documentation concerning the dates and times of their flights, consult the Smithsonian National Air and Space Museum. For information concerning the Federation Aeronautique Internationale's (FAI's) recognition and certification of the Wrights as having built the world's first practical aircraft, contact the FAI. If memory serves, the FAI specifically considers the flight of December 17 1903 at Kitty Hawk, North Carolina as first flight of a practical aircraft. The FAI also awarded the Great Medal to the Wrights in recognition of their flights both in France and in the United States. (Santos Dumont also received the Great Medal, but it was for his invention of the powered airship and not for the 14 bis.) Not to be outdone by the FAI, the French Government awarded the Legion of Honour to the Wrights, also in recognition for their flights in France and the United States. >>>San Pol said: "Could you explain why the 14-bis would just be able to fly straight line? The easiest answer is that the 14 bis lacked an effective three-axis control system. The 14 bis was primarily designed to fly in a straight line, sacrificing maneuverability for stability. Maneuverability was unnecessary because the 14 bis was built to compete for the Deutsch-Archdeacon prize, which required nothing more than a flight in a straight line. After winning the Deutsch-Archdeacon prize, Santos Dumont quickly abandoned the 14 bis and began work on other designs, most notably the Demoiselle series. >>>San Pol said: "Or short distances ?" The 14 bis' Antoinette 50 hp engine was unquestionably the most advanced power plant available in 1906, but unfortunately most of its impressive power was wasted by the 14 bis' crude, inefficient propeller. In other words, the 14 bis lacked sufficient thrust for anything more than short hops. In contrast, the Wrights' contra-rotating propellers were, even by today's standards, extremely efficient. The combination of the Wrights' 25 hp engine (in the 1905 Flyer) and their efficient propellers generated more thrust than Santos Dumont's 50 hp Antionette and its single crude propeller.
+PUMA PRETO You are sorely mistaken. In point of fact, the 1903 Flyer, the 1904 Flyer, and the 1905 Flyer all flew both with and without the aid of a catapult.
Histórias de Santos Dumont nas publicações americanas: As páginas do Wright-Brothers.org podem ser lidas em português. www.wright-brothers.org/History_Wing/History_of_the_Airplane/Who_Was_First/Santos_Dumont/Santos_Dumont.htm WBO: In 1904 -- a year after the Wright brothers had made their first powered flight-- Santos Dumont turned his attention to heavier-than-air flying. He began with a glider, then built an unsuccessful helicopter in 1905. In 1906, he built a strange-looking flying machine -- a biplane of what the French had begun to call the type du Wright, loosely based on the Wright biplane plans that had been published in several European magazines. SB: The author is wrong. Santos-Dumont commissioned Voisin to build him an airframe with wheels. Voisin's pontoon gilder with dihedral box kite wings was the inspiration. I see little resemblance to the Wright Glider or Flyer. It was not a type du Wright. The prototypes of Farman an Feber can be so designated. After SDs success, they added boxkite tails to their flying machines. WBO: The box-like elevator and rudder protruded in front of the wings like the head of a duck in flight. It was promptly dubbed a canard (French for "duck"), and the name was incorporated into the growing aeronautical lexicon. WIKIPEDIA: By 1905, he had finished his first fixed-wing aircraft design, and also a helicopter. Santos-Dumont finally succeeded in flying a heavier-than-air aircraft on 23 October 1906, piloting the 14-bis before a large crowd of witnesses at the grounds of Paris' Château de Bagatelle in the Bois de Boulogne for a distance of 60 metres (197 ft) at a height of about five meters (16 ft).[24] This was the first flight of a powered heavier-than-air machine in Europe to be certified by the Aéro-Club de France, and won the Deutsch-Archdeacon Prize for the first officially observed flight of more than 25 meters. On 12 November 1906 Santos-Dumont set the first world record recognized by the Federation Aeronautique Internationale, by flying 220 metres (722 ft) in 21.5 seconds.[25][26][27] On that date he became the first person to be filmed in an airplane in flight.[28] As late as 1906 he was reported as stating that the Wright Brothers claim to have flown for thirty miles was mere bluff.[29] en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alberto_Santos-Dumont#:~: The modern critique is that the Wrights claims before 1918 were not observed by official witnesses and are not incontestable. The Wrights were not interested in proving anything without a $50,000 investment. They didn't receive the required investment until late 1906.
When Santos Dumont flew the 14 bis in 1906, the Wright Brothers had already built and flown three different heavier-than-air flying machines: 1) the 1903 Flyer, which took off under its own power and flew 852 feet (260 m) while remaining in the air 59 seconds; 2) the 1904 Flyer which also took off under its own power and was the first heavier-than-air craft to fly in a complete circle as well as covering a distance of 4,080 feet; and 3) the 1905 Flyer which also took off under its own power and flew a distance of twenty-four miles, including several circular maneuvers. On the other hand, Santos Dumont's 14-bis was uncontrollable and was only capable of flying short distances in a straight line.😊😊😊😊😊😊
@@gilberto2056 So, when a tree falls in a forest, it doesn't make a sound unless the Federation Aeronautiques International say's it does. Brillant..., there is no virtue in ignorance.
Santos Dumont of Brasil🇧🇷, the real one, the FIRST to fly "the heaviest in the air" by OWN MEANS without needing a catapult, audited by the Paris Aéroclub. Undisputed ... the selfish centrism of North American history wanting to cover the truth, you are not to blame are years of ignorance of historiography.
You display the same kind of cultural prejudice that you criticize. Can you make an objective, evidence-based case for the primacy of Santos Dumont, without framing it in cultural or national terms?
The greatest myth regarding first flight was that the Wrights used a catapult..., they did not. The 1903 flyer took off on its own power. It was launched on a rail without assistance. A rail was used because the ground was sand. This is not my opinion, this is fact. Reply
Seems that Brazil has a problem with dates. 1903 is 3 years before 1906. 1904 the Wrights did a 2.75 mile flight. 1905 a 24 mile flight!!! A passenger in 1908. 1908 Wilbur flew for 124 kilometres, in Europe.
The 14-bis , was created by Alberto Santos Dumont. Before he invented the plane, he created the first dirigible. The 14-bis flew in front of hundreds of people, including specialists in aviation at the time. It was the first time the world saw an airplane flying. The plane had a tremendous lift and the elevator and rudder were very efective. Despite of the flights been executed in straight line , the plane could turn in any direction and fly as long as the fuel tank had fuel. The proposition of the plane was to prove the heavy than air could fly. After all the world knew the plane could fly, many other planes were made and flew, but the first one was the 14-bis.
+San Pol No, not according to the Federation Aeronatique Internationale (FAI). The FAI officially credits the Wright Brothers as building and flying the world's first practical airplane on December 17, 1903. Not to be outdone, the French government awarded the Legion of Honour to the Wrights in recognition for creating the first practical airplane.
+Jindle Spog please....just present some proof about it. There is no proof . Proof = 14-bis Evidences = flyer before 1908 I stay with the proof . 14-bis flew first.
14-bis never flew for more than 220 meters, and never climbed out of ground effect (6 meters for that wingspan). It never performed a controlled turn. It is a fact that all Santos-Dumont demonstrated was an "uncontrolled hop" with a dead-end design. That's all he had up until Wilbur Wright blows every with the Wright Flyer III at Le Mans in 1908. That was a "powered, sustained, controlled, manned" flight -- something Santos-Dumont was *still* not capable of yet. That is proof that the Wrights were first, even if you reject all of the other evidence. We are talking verifiable proof, and speaking nothing of faith. Now, can you please explain why you continue to praise Santos-Dumont for his uncontrolled hop?
@@iChiphead Are you kidding? You believe the Flyer with 340 kg , 12 hp and propellers turning at ceiling fan rpm , could fly sustainable ? The 14-bis was controllable in 3 axis. Any copy of it flies easily. The same does not happen with the Flyer copies because it is impossible if no power or design modification are made. 14-bis had a V8 engine with 50hp, the weight was 272 kg, it had ailerons, rudder and elevator. At the time he flew just 220 because it was enought to prove an airplane could fly. And was much over the required distance to be considered a flight. This thing about ground effect is a complete non sense for a plane with lots of available power like the 14-bis as you can see in this video. th-cam.com/video/b95OruHb1Xc/w-d-xo.html
@@sanpol4399 The linked video is not an exact replica, and historically, 14-bis had control issues and never performed a turn. That's why Santos-Dumont considered it a dead-end and started over on a different plane. Plus, 14-bis came after the Wright Brothers had flown farther, higher, and longer. Sorry dude. This was all settled over a hundred years ago.
I've watch the 1906 Pathé News several times which shows the 14-bis rising only a few inches above the ground, and that its ailerons are completely ineffective. This footage makes its clear that the 14-bis lacks sufficient thrust, which is understandable considering the gross inefficiency of its primitive propeller. The 14-bis was obviously doomed to fail from the start.😁😁😁😁😁😁
Good comment but you should include some links. I didn't find your referenced 1906 Pathe News video. I did find this: th-cam.com/video/vhE7UPOlmeQ/w-d-xo.html
Take your own conclusion: m.th-cam.com/video/b95OruHb1Xc/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/yHxvdV9elL8/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/o1mscspl-VU/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/u3ZsvctI3IQ/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/o-wne_bQZjA/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/gmVf023EvWA/w-d-xo.html
i.imgur.com/oAtpvlu.jpg Here's the 14-bis out of control and barely off the ground, just as the 1906 Pathé footage proves. the 14-bis never flew, just an uncontrolled hop.🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Unfortunately, as before and nowadays, Brazilians inventors has to leave Brazil to have some sponsor, infrastructure and technology to support their inventions... too sad...
Dumont's 14bis was a serious attempt to fly, based on European ideas that were flawed at the time. The Wrights were not going to demonstrate the performance of their flyer till their patent was approved in May 1906. The demonstrations in France in 1908 proved their concepts, and the patent laid out in detail what they were. With these concepts, and their own knowledge for building light engines and aircraft structures the Europeans were back in the game. Further, the demonstrations changed mainstream thought that flight was impossible to creating a demand that hadn't existed. Santos-Dumont demolished his 14bis and its design..., and in truth, it made no lasting contribution. But in this flourishing time, Santos-Dumont designed and built a delightful airplane called the Demoiselle. You can still get the plans for this airplane. It was small, simple, and light, his idea of an airplane for everyone, this had lasting value. So, he may not have been an Edison, he was kind of like a Henry Ford.
Anglo-Saxons recognizes Brothers Wright, Latins Santos Dumont and that's ok, everyone believes in their own heroes, Why should I care about some guys from North American flew over Virginia if I'm from Brazil and this guy from my own country (and state) created a plane that flew over Paris....
+imtv As a homosexual, Santos Dumont was driven out of his deeply Catholic and highly conservative homeland. It's only natural that he would seek acceptance in Paris. How ironic then that Brazil, which virtually expelled him, now seeks to unjustly appropriate his legacy as an aviation pioneer.
+Louis Daguerre What are you talking about, Dumont´s father fell from a horse could not work again in his coffee plantation, a very rich man who sent his young son to Paris to study Engineering and Science who evolved in all his inventions from balloon, dirigible and heavier than air from Project No1 to No 20. Wright´s Flyer was the same junk glider from 1903 to 1915. Took the design from Herring and Chanute and put a 2 propellers at rear like Dumont in his dirigible. The brothers did not have enough brains to put a couple of their bikes wheels under instead they used a catapult and no wind no flying.
Interesting idea. It would be more correct the other way around. The 14 bis was really crude by comparison with the Flyer, a product of tinkering like Edison, The Wright Flyer was a product of their scientific wind tunnel and flight control experiments. Two years before the 14 bis hopped and dropped, the Wright flyer could fly, maneuver, and stay aloft till it ran out of gas. Yes, more like Tesla.
Um ano antes de Alberto Dumont exibir-se com o balão N-14 (14-Bis), voar era uma rotina para os irmãos Wright. Graças aos irmãos Wright estamos voando em aviões, não em balões.
Os estadunidenses são mt bons em negócio. Não em verdades. Fora q os projetos de Stos Dumont eram abertos, projetos que os proprios writing e outros usaram posteriormente.
Antes de 1948 os wright nao eram conhecidos porque jamais participaram do clube dos inventores e nunca disputaeam nenhuma competiçao aberta .e nao ha registros do voo de 1903 somente em 1908 eles compraram um motor na europa e voaram mas ja era comum muitos voarem.
I'm British, so I don't have any nationalistic pride in this discussion. Wilbur flew for 40 minutes in 1905. Dumont flew 197 feet in 1906. Dumont wasn't the first to fly.
Modern replicas replicas of the 14-bis incorporate modern alloys fabricated with modern technology (i.e. arc welding) and are equipped with modern Rotax aero engines & propellers. Any resemblances between them and the original are purely cosmetic. Furthermore, the primitive "air paddle" installed on the original was only 12% efficient. Combined with the high parasitic drag coefficient of the original and its inadequate (not to say non-existent) controls, the original 14-bis only ever achieved short hops in conditions of complete calm. Moreover, the excess dihedral of the 14-bis only served to increase its instability in even the gentlest cross winds.😁😁😁😁
The modern Wright replicas built with lighter materials and with engines four or five times more powerful did nothing. FORGET the wrights didn't invent the plane.
TO QUOTE ... "They are today hallowed in France, and I feel an intense pleasure to be among the first to make amends!"...Ernest Archdeacon "Wilbur Wright has completely dissipated all doubts. Not one of the former detractors of the Wrights dare question, today, the previous experiments of the men who are truly the first to fly….."Georges Beancon "...the Wrights have beaten us all with their machine and I want one!" Leon Delagrange ( "The most beautiful dream that has haunted the heart of man since Icarus is today reality. I would have waited ten times as long to see what I have seen today, Monsieur Wright has us all in his hands!" Louis Blériot.. JUST THE FACTS-SINCE THERE HAVE BEEN SO MANY LIES.
+warp13 You want to create another bullshit massive USA media propaganda that says: the Wright weak brothers are the creators!! hahahahahahahahahahahahahhhahaahhhahahahhaahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhhahaahhhahahahhaahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!! You should spent more money on it! You will never change the history, but you are still buying new friends for agreement with you! hahaha
Gaitaboa Gaitaboa Absolutely wrong-If you took the time to actually read my posts you would see that I have answered all of these questions many times. Maybe you just have a hard time accepting an opinion that is different than yours? Maybe this is why you often change your user name? Why you have over a half dozen aliases that I am aware of and post supporting arguments to yourself. I will not continue to repeat myself, the answers to all of your questions are in my previous posts.
The Flyer never took off on its own merit because it did not have a powerful engine to get it off the ground. It was a very heavy machine with an extremely weak engine. The United States military did several tests and created a perfect replica and put it to flight. It did not fly; it crashed and broke. Santos Dumont's plane flew and stayed fully in the air, even with a very heavy engine, because its duck design helped with air resistance and it took off high because of the power of the engine used. So yes, Santos Dumont was the first to invent the airplane. The brothers only created the Flyer, which was a glider.
_”The Flyer never took off on its own merit because it did not have a powerful engine to get it off the ground.”_ That claim requires a calculation that assimilates factors such as horsepower, torque, gearing, propeller efficiency, coefficients of lift and drag, and others. If you haven’t performed this calculation, then you’re just guessing. _”It was a very heavy machine with an extremely weak engine.”_ Yes, and that’s helps explain why it was a marginal performer. But it does not prove that the engine was insufficient. _”The United States military did several tests and created a perfect replica and put it to flight. It did not fly; it crashed and broke.”_ There have been no attempts to fly a genuine Flyer I replica in equal physical conditions. There have been no 14-bis replicas at all, only what are known as “look-alikes”, aircraft which are largely like the originals, but which also have modifications and upgrades. In short, the performance of reproduction aircraft so far neither proves nor disproves the claims for the Wrights and Santos-Dumont. _”The brothers only created the Flyer, which was a glider.”_ The Wright Flyers were powered aircraft, not gliders.
Helga Schmidlap were are the proves? the project from Wright brothers... the reproduced working aircraft to celebrate the centenary of their inventions? Come on! USA are a great country with a great people! Just leave this credit for Brazilians because that's the true! Just let it be!
Helga Schmidlap No Helga. Not Wright...Wrong! Not brothers but one man: Santos Dumont. Sorry disappointing you, but the brothers are, as many others, another making believe.
Otto Lilienthal (05/23/1848 - 08/10/1896) was a German pioneer of aviation who became known as the Glider King. He was the first person to make well-documented, repeated, successful gliding flights. Newspapers and magazines published photographs of Lilienthal gliding, favorably influencing public and scientific opinion about the possibility of flying machines becoming practical.
Partial answer to the claims that the Centennial failure and the first NASA study prove the 1903 Wright Flyer could not fly. The failure to fly on Dec. 17, 2003 only proves that an exact replica of the Wright Flyer cannot fly without assistance from a strong headwind. There were several NASA wind tunnel tests. The first used a bad prop copied from a museum replica. This prop generated more Drag than Thrust. This was not the prop that the Wrights used in 1903 which was tested on site with a spring gauge and found to deliver more thrust than anticipated. The museum replica was a look alike. It was never supposed to fly. FLYING IN CIRCLES: www.thisdayinaviation.com/13-january-1908/voisin-farman-i-winning-the-grand-prix-de-laviation-13-january-1908-2-3/ Henry Farman flew a circular one kilometer course at Issy-les-Moulineaux, France, in 1 minute, 28 seconds in 1908 to win the Grand Prix de l’aviation, a prize of 50,000 francs, which had been offered by Henri Deutsch de la Meurthe. SB: I think this was only one lap around a 1 km ( 3280 ft.) circle. This is about the same as what the Wrights achieved 4 years earlier in 1904. It could even be the source for the French prize. On September 20, 1904, the Wrights flew their first complete circle. The flight lasted 1 minute, 36 seconds and covered 4,080 feet. The flight was photographed but the date of the photograph is not established. The flight was allegedly witnessed by Amos Root who published his account in Gleanings in Jan, 1905 SanPol wrote: As you said above about the Wright brothers closed circuit flight claim. " There is room for doubt." That is EXACTLY the point since the beginning of our posts.👍👍 And the room for doubt is present not only in the first closed circuit flight,( even without landing gear and catapulted) , but also on the first airplane flight claim. For some, there is plenty of room for doubt, for others there is some room for doubt on both Wright claims. Depending on how demanding each one is, leaving with that doubt is still ok to continuing believing in Wright's claims, for others not. It is a matter of personal choice. I still prefer the facts. SB: You are not concerned with facts when it comes to proving your claim that the Wrights were liars. We all prefer facts when they are available. Usually we have to make do with stories that seem consistent. The facts would be found in the original description of the performance specified in the prize rules. I think the only fact is that the bis-14 flew over the required 100m. and was observed by official witnesses. That is what is indisputable. I don't think the rules say anything about there having to be public witnesses or film evidence. There was no film evidence for the 100 meter flight. There was no time requirement. Please prove me wrong. There are few facts available. One is that the longer flight of the BIS-14 surpassed the 100 m. mark. It was probably over 200 m. We don't know because it was not measured. The time is not recorded. That has not prevented some from using the plausible estimates: 220 m. in 21 sec. Not exactly what you would expect from an expert witnesses. Shouldn't at least one have a stop-watch and a way to measure the distance? They seem to have been satisfied with estimates because they were so excited that the 14-bis had exceeded the require distance by over 100 m.
He wasn't the first one to fly an aircraft heavier than air, but he certainly invented an airplane "on his own" {Santos and his team}, and that airplane is called 14 Bis.
When Santos Dumont attempted to fly the 14 bis in 1906, the Wright Brothers had already built and flown three different heavier-than-air flying machines: 1) The 1903 Flyer, which Took off under its own power and flew 852 feet (260 m) in 59 seconds. 2) The 1904 Flyer, which Took off under its own power and was the first heavier-than-air craft to fly in a complete circle as well as covering a distance of 4,080 feet during the same flight. Aviation pioneer Octave Chanute Observed many of the Flyer's 2 flights. 3) The 1905 Flyer, which Took off under its own power and flew a distance of twenty-four miles, including circular several maneuvers. The Flyer was Also the world's first aircraft capable of carrying a passenger.
Some commission saw it? Or just friends and close people to the Wrights ? Put here any proof about any Wright brothers flight before 1908. If you have faith, then do not need to find any proof.
@@sanpol4399 Still waiting for proof that the mythical phantom tentatively identified as Alberto Santos DuMont never existed! The myth of Santos Dumont was fabricated by the corrupt government of a third world country to compensate for their inadequate national identity. This explains why no one from this sad little country can present clear, compelling proof that Santos Dumont ever existed--because he didn't.
@@sanpol4399 "Put here any proof about any Wright brothers flight before 1908." Silly boy, I don’t need to show you anything because the Aero Club of America, Aero Club de France, the Federation Aeronautique Internatioinale, Octave Chenault, Ferdinand Ferber, and the French Government all certified the Wrights as having flown in 1903. The December 1905 and January 1906 issues of L'Aerophile documented the Wrights' successful flights at Kitty Hawk, North Carolina and Dayton, Ohio. In point of fact, it was L'Aerophile's reportage of the Wrights that motivated Santos Dumont to cease experimentation with lighter-than-air aircraft and instead concentrate on heavier-than-air aircraft. Why do you accuse the French of lying? Why do you hate France?
Anyone have doubt that Dumont was the real inventor of airplaine? only a stupid, i mean american, thinks this. He just not invented the first real airplane, He was responsible for all development in aviation, if you nowadays can fly in jets etc, give him thanks .
Just because he was "the first" to fly an airplane in Paris does NOT mean he was the inventor of an airplane!! Dumont was seeking glory and fame, copied lots of airplane features from many other aficionados at the time, and still had no "controls". The Bros were businessmen and were seeking money, contracts, and had already PATENTED the first airplane that flew (not glided) !! After a patent and contract with the US Army, then the Bros started to show what they had invented with CONTROLS to fly!!
And he was the first to do It right , an airplane that could propel it self with it's own power , and like the Chad Drumond is he latter went to shit on Wright Brother's design on how bad It was
When Santos Dumont attempted to fly the 14-bis in 1906, the Wright Brothers had already built and flown three different heavier-than-air flying machines: 1) the 1903 Flyer, which Took off under its own power and flew 852 feet (260 m) in 59 seconds, 2) the 1904 Flyer, which Took off under its own power and was the first heavier-than-air craft to fly in a complete circle as well as covering a distance of 4,080 feet during the same flight. Aviation pioneer Octave Chanute Observed many of the Flyer's 2 flights, and 3) the 1905 Flyer, which Took off under its own power and flew a distance of twenty-four miles, including circular several maneuvers. The Flyer was Also the world's first aircraft capable of carrying a passenger. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
When Santos Dumont attempted to fly the 14-bis in 1906, the Wright Brothers had already built and flown three different heavier-than-air flying machines: 1) the 1903 Flyer, which Took off under its own power and flew 852 feet (260 m) in 59 seconds, 2) the 1904 Flyer, which Took off under its own power and was the first heavier-than-air craft to fly in a complete circle as well as covering a distance of 4,080 feet during the same flight. Aviation pioneer Octave Chanute Observed many of the Flyer's 2 flights, and 3) the 1905 Flyer, which Took off under its own power and flew a distance of twenty-four miles, including circular several maneuvers. The Flyer was Also the world's first aircraft capable of carrying a passenger.😁😁😁😁😁
@@gilberto2056 Of course there is evidence. Just not the kind of evidence that you want. You want it free. The Wrights were not interested in providing it unless you were willing to bet $35,000 that they couldn't meet or exceed any performance objectives that you might want. I think you want evidence of a flight of 100 m. (Roughly 100 yds. or the length of a football field.). The Wrights would call a flight of 100 m to be a mere HOP. The 14-bis probably flew over 220 m. but there is no incontestable evidence for this. There is only incontestable proof that they did not touch the ground for 100 m. By flying 200 m, they proved that the 14-bis had flown at least 100 m. and deserved the prize.
Here's a small sampling of reportage devoted to the Wrights' flights during 1903-1905: *"Airship Flight is a Success," The San Francisco Call, December 18, 1903, Page 1, Image 1, col. 7. *"A Machine that Flies," The Times Dispatch (Richmond, VA)0, December 19, 1903, Page 5, Image 5, col. 1. *"High Gale No Bar to Flying Machine," The Washington Times (Washington, DC), December 19, 1903, Page 10, Image 10, col. 1" *"Airship was a Great Success: The Wright brothers Give Out a Statement Regarding Their Recent Experiments," The Minneapolis Journal (Minneapolis, MN), January 5, 1904, Page 1, Image 1, col. 1. *"Ohio Inventors Claim Success in Flight," The Washington Times (Washington, DC), January 7, 1904, Page 3, Image 3, col. 4. "*A Machine that Flies: The Wright Brothers Declare that They Have Solved the Problem of Navigating the Air," The Watchman and Southern (Sumter, SC), January 13, 1904, Page 7, Image 7, col. 3. *"Flying machine that Flies," The San Francisco Call, (San Francisco, CA), October 9 1904, Page 13, Image 13, col 5-7. I could continue for another one hundred pages, but I've made my point. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
My point, present here one of these reports with photo and photo from the newspaper. And justify why they did not present the machine to trademarks and patents.
After all I have seen and the way the wright brothers acted regarding the invention of flying aircrafts by Alberto Santos Dumont, his death became in doubt and should be investigated by Serious Brazilian Authorities. Suicide in a hotel room by a man who loved life and adventures does not match in this case! Too much interest in his invention! The death of Alberto Santos Dumont was not a suicidal event!!!!
So, the Wright brothers killed Santos-Dumont. Too much interest in the 14bis (bird of prey)? I can honestly say that this is stupidest opinion on first flight I have ever read.
The Aero Club de France, the Aero Club of America, the Federation Aeronautique Internatioinale, Octave Chanute, Ferdinand Ferber, and the French Government all certified the Wrights as having flown in 1903. The December 1905 and January 1906 issues of L'Aerophile documented the Wrights' successful flights at Kitty Hawk, North Carolina and Dayton, Ohio. In point of fact, it was L'Aerophile's reportage of the Wrights that motivated Santos Dumont to cease experimentation with lighter-than-air aircraft and instead concentrate on heavier-than-air aircraft.🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
i.imgur.com/a2dDCpC.jpg This the 14-bis propeller. There's no way it flew with this propeller. This and the 1906 Pathé footage proves the 14-bis accomplished nothing more than an uncontrolled hop. Pictures don't lie. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Why not? They are all mentioned in the large Wright Brothers web sites. e.g. wright-brothers.org, en.wikipedia.org › wiki › Wright_brothers There are a couple of others.
The Montgolfier Brothers and Santos-Dumont were not just pioneers, they were the greatest innovators when it came to lighter than air, aircraft. Santos-Dumont's light airplane Demoiselle was pretty cool but flew after the basic ideas of flight were understood. His 14bis (bird of prey) was obsolete before the engine was ever started. Clement Ader was a fraud.
@@ChuckMarteau You're in good company, Octave Chanute at one point intended to buy the wreckage and bring it to America to restore and further develop it. His idea to "steer" the craft by controlling the propeller thrust from side to side was one he shared with Whitehead, something we know today could not possibly work, in fact would destabilize the craft. His claims and witnesses also seemed to fall apart after his death. He was a serious man, and respected, man, but I'm not sure he was an honest man. I have not investigated Ader as deeply as others, so if you have a reference, I will take a look at it.
The Aero Club de France, the Aero Club of America, the Federation Aeronautique Internatioinale, Octave Chanute, Ferdinand Ferber, and the French Government all certified the Wrights as having flown in 1903. The December 1905 and January 1906 issues of L'Aerophile documented the Wrights' successful flights at Kitty Hawk, North Carolina and Dayton, Ohio. In point of fact, it was L'Aerophile's reportage of the Wrights that motivated Santos Dumont to cease experimentation with lighter-than-air aircraft and instead concentrate on heavier-than-air aircraft.🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
@@tapotente6130 SB: Your comment does not answer my question. I would argue that 30% will accept the argument that before 1908 the Wrights did not provide indisputable proof that they were the first to fly. There is also no indisputable proof of the the usual Brazilian counter-argument. Are you using two different standards? What is in dispute is the whether or not the accounts of aviation historians are more plausible than the argument that the Wrights were lying and it was all a sham or hoax. I was an electrical engineer for Allison turboprops and spent time in Brazil working with the Brazilian space agency before becoming a college professor. What is your background?
@TP: "Gringos said that Santos Dumont invented the airplane." Where is the evidence? Can you provide a link to the quote? Most people accept the empirical evidence that the 14-bis flew over 100 m. in 1906. Winning a contest in an airplane, however, is not the same as inventing the airplane. Statements about who was the first to invent something is usually not a fact. It may be a statement supported by facts related to a clear explanation of what it means to invent. GRINGO (slang) Among Latin Americans, gringo is a term for a "foreigner," often a white person from the United States. It can also refer to a person who doesn't speak Spanish or is out of touch with Latin culture, including people of Hispanic descent. (Dictionary.com).
A madman invented a costume and said that with him he would fly. He threw himself from the top of the eiffel tower and actually flew, before he smashed to the ground. If Brother Right flew with something thrown by a catapult and they said that they invented the airplane then the madman invented the jetman.
The Americans used a catapult Flight more was not an appropriate flight, and it did not work, and that is not flying, Santos Dumont has already started flying like today's airplanes.
@Açúcar Chocolate wrote: The WB did not fly in France in 1907-8 because they had no engines. The new 1906 Wright vertical 4 had to be proportionally heavier than their 2 old engines. Only the engine building genius of Santos Dumont would enable someone to double the power of an engine without doubling the weight @ Gilberto Nedel Junior wrote: The failure to fly at the 2003 Centennial proves they couldn't fly The first NASA wind tunnel test proves the Flyer could not fly. SB: The Dec. 17, 2003 failure only proves that the Flyer could not fly without a strong headwind. It the exact replica did fly on two test flights before Dec. 17. @luiz wrote: Santos Dumont tem uma carreira inegável de gênio e inventor bem diferente dos Wrigth , que nada comprovaram. Santos Dumont was a great inventor and a genius. The Wrights were neither. Santos proved flight was possible, The Wrights proved nothing. SB: Perhaps this will generate some comments. @Steve Bett Açúcar Chocolate wrote: The Wrights did not FLY because they had no engines to fly. In the wright period the engine block weighed a lot, consequently, the greater the power of the engine, the greater its weight. The genius of Brazilian, ALBERTO SANTOS DUMONT, was so great that he could transform the 25 hp antoinette engine into a lighter and more powerful engine generating 50 hps (This is a historical fact). SB: In the case of the bis-14, he unbolted the 25 hp engine that was not powerful enough for a long hop and installed an off the shelf 50hp Antoinette 8V. This certainly was a contribution to aviation since it was it was copied by at least 4 other aviation pioneers. When they installed the engine on their prototype they could duplicate the hop made by the 14-bis in 1906. To to say it was evidence of genius is counter-factual misinformation. There are better examples. SB: comments welcomed. @Açúcar Chocolate SB: Have you read Lins de Barros articles? The Brazilian physicist wrote a paper circa 2000 that made the case for Santos Dumont without the use of misinformation and conspiracy theories. I will send you the link if you haven't. Just ask for it. None of the claims of the Wrights are indisputable or beyond doubt. This is because they were not witnessed and certified by the FAI. That was not even possible before 1905. Some of the flights were witnessed by members of the American Aero Club but that would not count. They were not French and they were not official witnesses. The second kind of doubt is with respect to flights that seem too incredible to be accurate. That applies only to the 873 ft. 4th and final flight of Wilbur Wright. I can't prove that it didn't happen but I don't think the Wrights proved that it did. AC: "the greater the power of the engine, the greater its weight" SB: Before you speculate on the weight of the 1906 Dayton engine, read up on it. The 1906 Vertical 4 was not any heavier than the 2 earlier engines the Wrights used from 1903 to 1905, but it produced almost double the horsepower. Google Wright vertical 4. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wright_Vertical_4 weight: 160-180 lbs. (70-80 kg) power: 28 hp. at 1325 rpm 42 hp at 1500 rpm *31 kw AC: Santos Dumont "...was so great that he could transform the 25 Hp antoinette engine into a lighter & more powerful engine generating 50 hps." SB: So Santos could do this but not the Wrights. Where is the evidence? Santos Dumont had no role in the design and production of the Antoinette engines. He did switch from a 25 hp engine to a 50 hp Antoinette 8V (209 lb) engine when it became available in 1906. Wikipedia also has an article on the Antoinette engines. They were designed and built by Leon Levavasseur en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antoinette_8V SD made a number of contributions to aviation. This is not one of them. There are better examples of his genius. What is the source of your "historical facts"?
In Portuguese (the sources are also available in Portuguese) produção do Motores Antonieta. Ele mudou de um motor de 25 hp para um Motor Antoinette 8V de 50 hp (209 lb) quando ficou disponível em 1906. A Wikipedia também tem um artigo sobre os motores Antoinette. Eles foram projetados e construídos por Leon Levavasseur en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antoinette_8V SD fez uma série de contribuições para a aviação. Este não é um deles. Há melhores exemplos de sua genialidade. Qual é a fonte de seus "fatos históricos"?
The Aero Club de France, the Aero Club of America, the Federation Aeronautique Internatioinale, Octave Chanute, Ferdinand Ferber, and the French Government all certified the Wrights as having flown in 1903. The December 1905 and January 1906 issues of L'Aerophile documented the Wrights' successful flights at Kitty Hawk, North Carolina and Dayton, Ohio. In point of fact, it was L'Aerophile's reportage of the Wrights that motivated Santos Dumont to cease experimentation with lighter-than-air aircraft and instead concentrate on heavier-than-air aircraft.🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Who flew first in a legit plane? If in the rules an airplane is only a heavier-than-air vehicle that can fly, then this is an airplane, even using outside help like catapults, as the Wright Brothers did, then the Wright brothers made the airplane first, but if in the rules an airplane needs to be a lighter-than-air vehicle, that can fly, but being fully autonomous, without needing external help such as catapults, then Santos Dumont created the first airplane.
There are no rules, only the subjective definitions of various groups and individuals. This is why _official_ recognition of who flew first is meaningless. And you misunderstand the role of a catapult, because it only affects takeoff distance, and is unrelated to self-sustaining flight.
Everybody can think whatever he or she wants, but Santos-Dumont, A Brazilian, from Brazil, a great and beautiful American nation (for fools in the USA, America is a continent, not a nation) is the great aviation pioneer and the first to fly an airplane WITHOUT a catapult. Not just an opinion, but an opinion based on facts.
The Wright Flyer (often retrospectively referred to as Flyer I and occasionally Kitty Hawk) was the first powered aircraft designed and built by the Wright brothers. The Wright Flyer's first flight on December 17, 1903 at Kitty Hawk is recognized by the Fédération Aéronautique Internationale, the standard setting and record-keeping body for aeronautics and astronautics, as "the first sustained and controlled heavier-than-air powered flight".
*Fact.*
Federative Republic of Brazil / República Federativa do Brasil (Portuguese)
Motto: Ordem e Progresso (Portuguese) / (English: "Order and Progress")
Anthem: Hino Nacional Brasileiro / (English: "Brazilian National Anthem")
Demonym: *Brazilian*
United States of America
Motto: "In God We Trust"
Anthem: "The Star-Spangled Banner"
Demonym: *American*
Compreendo?
América is Portuguese name!
Demonym: American or Yankees
@@cilsval Sadly, most Brazilians don't understand the cultural differences between Brazil and the USA. One major difference is that those in the Brazil are taught the world consists of 5 continents, while people in the USA are taught that the world consists of 7. This has a profound effect. To people from the United States. There is no continent called "America". There are two continents called "North America" and "South America". Thus, when referring to a continent, a person from the USA will say "North America" or "South America". When saying "America" without designating North or South, it refers to the country, and not a continent. Meanwhile, in SOUTH AMERICA, some idiot gets all offended thinking "the Yankees" have arrogantly stolen the demonym for the entire continent, and nobody in the USA knows what the hell they are even talking about.
Further "United Stations" is not a good demonym, and "people from the USA" is wordy. WHAT THE HELL DO BRAZILIANS EXPECT??????
Also, it is mildly offensive to hear yourself called "North Americans" when "Americans" is your chosen demonym. You want to be called Brazilians?.. How about I just call you "Americans", since that's what you seem to want, and secretly laugh because I refused to refer to you by your chosen demonym??
At 6:00 the narrator said Santos Dumont created the Demoselle # 19 in 1909 BIG MISTAKE OR INTENTIONALLY Demoiselle # 19 was created on Nov.17 in 1907 before Wright Brothers showed up in1908. Santos-Dumont made three flights on 17 November 1907 at Issy-les-Moulineaux. In Sep 13, 1909 he created the Demoiselle # 20
+Verdelufe Correct, however #19 had no means for lateral control. Wing warping would be added to the #20 AFTER the Wright brother flights in 1908.
+Verdelufe You will doubtless find it interesting to learn Santos Dumont incorporated a Wright-style wing warping system in his Demoiselle No 20, and installed a copy of a Wright-manufactured propeller. This you can see for yourself by comparing the propeller seen in photos of the Demoiselle No. 19 to that seen in photos of the Demoiselle No 20.
Louis Daguerre Santos Dumont already had ailerons in the historical 14-bis flights in 1906, separated surfaces . Not just wing warping.
The three axis control and the propeller airfoil shape was not created by the Wrights, but earlier inventors. You can find that on the book of Joe Bullmer.
They did not even discovered the principles of flight , just grabbed it from earlier inventors as well.
@@sanpol4399 👍👍👍👍👍
@@sanpol4399 - "Santos-Dumont's 14BIS had ailerons ( )"
"3 axis control and airfoil propellers were invented before they were used by the Wrights."
SB: Santos-Dumont frequently added features before he understood how to use them.
Farman had ailerons on his planes but did not use them to bank and turn before 1909.
There is no good evidence that he used them for his JAN 1908 contest winning i km circuit.
If you check some of the films of the 14BIS, you will see the ailerons flapping indicating they were not used for lateral control. Unlike the Wrights and a few other pioneers of flight, SD had no experience gliding and only about 5 min. of air time in fixed wing flying machines. AC who built the look-alike replicas of the 14 BIS had functional ailerons and knew how to use them. He seems to have avoided demonstrating anything that would be beyond what Santos-Dumont could do in 1906. No U-turns, no bank & turn, no flying in circles.
There were certainly publications on airfoil propellers before the Wrights.
Chanute sent one paper by Stefan Drzewiecki to Wilbur Wright.
Here is Wilbur's response: July 2, 1903
"My delay in writing you was chiefly due to a desire to first obtain a clear understanding of the Drzewiecki article on screws. [2] This author's methods of thought and expression are so different from my own that it has been no easy matter to master his paper. It shows a very clear understanding of some features of the question.
Stefan Drzewiecki, born in 1844, Poland, was the originator of the blade element theory of screws, which considers the blades of a screw as being composed of an infinite number of aerofoil section
Source: invention.psychology.msstate...Chanute_Wright_correspond/1903/Jul2-1903.html.
Cayley had quite a lot to say about the the forces of flight. I
Santos Dumont Father Of Aviation.( Brazil)
@Roberto ximangobom vc quer dizer Global aviation?
@Roberto ximangobom mundial não existe em inglês
it was Santos Dumont why he didn't need a catapult to fly he flight on his own without catapult without anything to give impetus
WRIGHT BROTHERS FIRST IN FLIGHT IN 1903 AND ALWAYS WRIGHT!!!
ALBERT SANTOS DUMONT WAS A BRAZILLIAN NUT WHO COMMITTED SUICIDE IN 1932 BECAUSE HE WAS A PETER PAN WANNABE WHO COULD NOT FLY BUT HE SPRINKLED FAIRY DUST! Santos Dumont was a hoax, quack, fake and Peter Pan Wannabe who sprinkled Fairy Dust every were. They Wright Brothers made the first controlled, sustained flight of a powered, heavier-than-air aircraft with the Wright Flyer on December 17, 1903, 4 mi (6 km) south of Kitty Hawk, North Carolina. In addition in 1904-05, the Wright Brothers developed their flying machine into the Worlds First Practical Fixed-Wing Aircraft, the Wright Flyer III. The Wright Brothers where the first to build experimental aircraft, the Wright brothers were the first to build and invent aircraft controls that made fixed-wing powered flight possible. Santos Dumont the exlpoitator was a mentally deranged spoiled brat who never worked an honest day in his life and he hanged himself to death in 1932. However let be known that the Wright Brothers were hard working Americans with intuitive natural aviation abilities and the Wright Flyer Planes were the first heavier-than-air aircraft in the known world to fly. Down with Santos Albert Dumont the exploitator of poor Brazilians workers and slaves plus Santos was a Cuckooo-Nutcake who stole others ideas from the French people and thats why they put him in jail for a while a while. God Bless America and the Wright Brothers because they where the worlds first aviators who were alway right!!! The Wright Brothers were first to invent the true wing with built in airerlons and their 212 US and European Patent prove ir true.
@@kimberlywilliams7543 You are wrong.
Sou orgulhoso de ser brasileiro e mais ainda de ser um brasileiro o primeiro homem a mostrar ao mundo que seria possível o ser humano voar.
Alberto Santos Dumont, pai da aviação.
Abraço.
Genilson Oliveira
Acho que foi o da vinci
YES! He is!
@@iv1729
Sim, Da Vince idealizou, mas quem colocou em pratica foram os homens modernos.
Como sabemos, muitos fizeram aeroplanos pelo mundo além de Santos Dumont, porém ele foi o único que não ligou que o mundo visse seus projetos e também foi o primeiro a demonstrar seu "invento" em um concurso que foi aberto a todos os inventores do mundo.
Só não participou quem não quis.
@@evolucaodamente4902 Atualmente estoy lendo a biografia de Roland Garros quem foi influenciado por Alberto Santos Dumont. Mesmo quando Dumont fechou sua fábrica, ele deu a Garros seu avião 14 bis. O livro também fala sobre como os irmãos Wright tentaram processar qualquer pessoa pensando que lhes roubaram suas idéias, enquanto Santos Dumont, como o vídeo menciona, foi muito generoso com suas idéias. Ainda espero um dia ir ao Rio de Janeiro, visitar o local de descanso de Alberto Santos Dumont para prestar minhas homenagens.
@@alanabdelnour2870
@Alan Abdelnour
Verdade Alan, Santos Dumont era uma pessoa generosa que estava em outro nível de evolução muito acima de nós.
Ao meu ver, só o fato de não ter sido ganancioso já fazia dele um super ser humano pra mim.
Eu moro em São Paulo e também pretendo um dia visitar a casa museu de santos Dumont no Rio.
Eu fiz um vídeo denuncia aqui no meu canal a respeito do monumento em homenagem prestado a ele aqui na zona norte de São Paulo na praça Campo de Bagatelle... busca essa praça no Google.
Vira e mexe eu passo por lá e nessas passagens, vi que o 14Bis e o busto de Dumont estavam quase em ruínas.
Fiquei triste com a situação e gravei um vídeo e postei.
Abraço meu caro.
Estamos juntos.🤜🏽🤛🏽
Santos Dumont tem uma carreira inegável de gênio e inventor bem diferente dos Wrigth , que nada comprovaram.
As a great philosopher said
"With catapult even shit flies"
Santos Dumont pai da aviação
WRIGHT BROTHERS FIRST IN FLIGHT IN 1903 AND ALWAYS WRIGHT!!!
Santos Dumont was a hoax, quack, fake and Peter Pan Wannabe who sprinkled Fairy Dust every were. They Wright Brothers made the first controlled, sustained flight of a powered, heavier-than-air aircraft with the Wright Flyer on December 17, 1903, 4 mi (6 km) south of Kitty Hawk, North Carolina. In addition in 1904-05, the Wright Brothers developed their flying machine into the Worlds First Practical Fixed-Wing Aircraft, the Wright Flyer III. The Wright Brothers where the first to build experimental aircraft, the Wright brothers were the first to build and invent aircraft controls that made fixed-wing powered flight possible. Santos Dumont the exlpoitator was a mentally deranged spoiled brat who never worked an honest day in his life and he hanged himself to death in 1932. However let be known that the Wright Brothers were hard working Americans with intuitive natural aviation abilities and the Wright Flyer Planes were the first heavier-than-air aircraft in the known world to fly. Down with Santos Albert Dumont the exploitator of poor Brazilians workers and slaves plus Santos was a Cuckooo-Nutcake who stole others ideas from the French people and thats why they put him in jail for a while a while. God Bless America and the Wright Brothers because they where the worlds first aviators who were alway right!!! The Wright Brothers were first to invent the true wing with built in airerlons and their 212 US and European Patent prove ir true.
YOU SHOULD SEE AMERICAN USAF FIGHTER JETS TAKE OFF AN AIRCRAFT CARRIER HOWEVER DUMONT WAS A BRAT NUTCAKE WHO COMMITED SUICIDE1932! WHAT A WASTE!
A melhor frase a respeito dos Wrigtht . A flyer shit.
@@kimberlywilliams7543 poor whit brothers were called crazy in the city where they lived, even shit flies with a catapult, the brothers' invention had no evidence that they flew today with several attempts to no one has managed . unlike Santos Drumond, who even has a traveler showing the working invention of a Brazilian, I just feel sorry that in the United States I don't know the real inventor of the airplane . And live "America" the continent not your country called the United States not America the continent hahahahah.
Not surprise usa is a country of thieves
S.Dumont genius
@@ianoneill5905 angry birds first
The Aero Club of America, Aero Club de France, the Federation Aeronautique Internatioinale, Octave Chenault, Ferdinand Ferber, and the French Government all certified the Wrights as having flown in 1903. The December 1905 and January 1906 issues of L'Aerophile documented the Wrights' successful flights at Kitty Hawk, North Carolina and Dayton, Ohio. In point of fact, it was L'Aerophile's reportage of the Wrights that motivated Santos Dumont to cease experimentation with lighter-than-air aircraft and instead concentrate on heavier-than-air aircraft. Why do you accuse the French of lying? Why do you hate France?😊😊😊😊😊
@@louisdaguerre6002
SB: Good point but you have to provide the documentation. It is easy to find hearsay
quotes that would support your thesis. Those would be summarily dismissed.
See if you can find better evidence. The 1905 and 1906 issues of L'Aerophile are available on line. See if you can find the short articles by Ferber. (to locate, just Google the name of the monthly magazine)
Feber had attempted to build a Wright Glider based on the descriptions he read. He also attempted
to fly a Wright Flyer that Archdeacon had purchased. He was not successful. He went to Dayton
as a critic to prove the Wrights were exaggerating the performance of their craft. He arrive to late
to witness a flight of the Wright Flyer III but he was given a list of 30 prominent citizens who had
witnessed the flights. He left Dayton and returned to Paris, not as a critic but as a convert.
SB: The Angry Birds epithet refers to the movie where flightless birds have to be catapulted over the wall with a sling shot. The Wright Brothers created flying machines that couldn't fly without a catapult.
This is a total misunderstanding of the Wright experiments. Their early porotypes could not fly without
the assistance of a weak motor and a strong headwind. In Ohio, they needed the motor, some headwind, and a derrick catapult that supplied the equivalent of about 6 mph of forward momentum.
if the motor wasn't working right, the could not fly. If the wind was under 6 mph, they couldn't take
off. In 1905, the motor could produce about 18 hp. That still might not been enough to take off
from an extended wooden track. The catapult is just a way to shorten the runway.
Wright brothers were flying 20 miles flights in 1905 Dumont was hopping like a frog in 1906. You are a maroon
@@hyzercreek your source = "trust me bro"
Good God, I'm glad to know the truth that is most likely. But, what a tragic end. He must have felt anguish about his unintended contribution as an accomplice to human destruction. How sad.
Santos was a dreamer, a man full of ideas and his ambitious goal was to take people up there in the air. He was obsessed with the idea of flying and dedicated his life to get there and fly... and he did many times, and all his projects and tests were public. People literally followed him wherever he went carrying his flying sources and machines. People loved him. He did all this for you for me for people, and after many accidents he became weak. When he saw his invention and all his life dedication to take people up there, flying, as a war aircraft weapon to kill people, he felt guilty and wounded in his heart. I know its a bit difficult to understand but flying was his goal not using it to kill others.
Santos used to donate part of his money prizes from flying competitions to the poor in France as he received the money from France, the french deverved part of it, so he gave the money to the poor
@ooosadaze, @itis4peace
SB: Duvido que você possa obter muita verdade de uma afirmação sem fundamento que beira uma teoria da conspiração.
O Prof. Lins de Barros falou a verdade quando disse: “ventos fortes e constantes em Kitty Hawk foram cruciais
para a decolagem do Flyer, desqualificando o voo por não haver prova disso poderia decolar por conta própria. ”
Isso foi em 2000. Agora temos provas. A tentativa de voar a réplica exata em 17 de dezembro de 2002, um dia incomum sem vento em Kitty Hawk, provou que esta nave não poderia decolar sem um forte vento contrário, além de um fraco motor de 12 hp.
Ele poderia voar de 100 a 120 pés (50+ metros) quando houvesse um vento contrário a 14 mph. Houve 2 voos de teste bem-sucedidos.
Em 20 de novembro de 2003, o Dr. Kevin Kochersberger pilotou o 1903 Wright Experience Replica Flyer.
Com um vento de 15 mph, ele voou uma distância de 100 pés. A famosa foto deste vôo não foi divulgada até 1905 na exposição American Aero-Clubs NYC.
Wright também emprestou peças do motor original para exibição. Estas peças nunca foram devolvidas.
Isso está perto da distância estimada de 120 pés que Orville voou em 1903. Mais tarde no mesmo dia, com um vento contrário de 27 mph, Wilbur Wright afirma ter voado uns incríveis 852 pés em 59 segundos.
th-cam.com/video/o1mscspl-VU/w-d-xo.html
(Voo John Denver: assistir? V = yHxvdV9elL8 e recurso)
PS: Quando minha esposa tinha 4 anos, ela e sua família moravam em Minas a cerca de 50 milhas da Fazenda Santos-Dumont. Foi vendido quando o pai de Alberto foi para a Europa em busca de alívio para o doloroso ferimento causado pela queda de um cavalo. Posteriormente, o colégio de elite que Santos Dumont frequentou em Ribeirão Preto mudou de nome para homenagear o aviador. Como professora do ensino fundamental (posteriormente diretora) dava aulas sobre Santos Dumont.SB: I doubt if you can get much truth from an unsupported claim that borders on a conspiracy theory.
(In English)
Prof. Lins de Barros spoke the truth when he said: “strong, steady winds at Kitty Hawk were crucial for the Flyer’s take-off, disqualifying the flight because there was no proof it
could lift off on its own.”
That was back in 2000. Now we have proof. The attempt to fly the exact replica on Dec. 17, 2002, an unusual windless day at Kitty Hawk, proved that this craft could not achieve lift off without a strong headwind in addition to a weak 12 hp motor.
It could sort of fly 100 to 120 ft. (50+ meters) when there was a 14+ mph headwind. There were 2 successful test flights.
On November 20, 2003, Dr. Kevin Kochersberger piloted the 1903 Wright Experience Replica Flyer.
With a 15 mph wind, he flew a distance of 100 feet. The famous picture of this flight was not released until 1905 at the American Aero-Clubs NYC exhibition.
Wright also lent parts of the original motor to display. This parts were never returned.
That is close to the estimated 120 ft. distance that Orville flew in 1903. Later on the same day with a 27 mph headwind Wilbur Wright claims to have flown an incredible 852 ft. in 59 sec.
th-cam.com/video/o1mscspl-VU/w-d-xo.html
(John Denver flight: watch?v=yHxvdV9elL8&feature)
PS: When my wife was 4 years old, she and her family lived in Minas about 50 miles from the Santos-Dumont coffee plantation. It was sold when Alberto's father went to Europe to find relief for his painful injury from falling off a horse. Later the elite high school Santos Dumont attended in Ribeirão Preto changed its name to honor the airman. As an elementary school teacher (later principal) she taught her classes about Santos Dumont.
He killed himself
Nobody would risk their neck in a Flyer today. I'll hop in a Demoiselle any day of the week. It was the original ultralight 170 years ahead of its time. I'm American and I'm giving it to Dumont.
Good point, but the Demoiselle flew 6 years later. The Wrights, Santos Dumont, Bleriot and others had already flown in a variety of designs. The Demoiselle is indeed a engineering marvel. Where I can see a picture of your plane?
+Alejandro Irausquin Actually not. the Demoiselle flew before the Bleriot models. And the Wright Brothers had just the same design concept always.
The Demoiselle was the first plane using the rudder and elevator in the back and the first to use a spinner.
San Pol Bleriot's first flight was in his Bleriot VI, in March 1907, followed by flights in the same plane in July 25, August 6, and September 17, 1907. Demoiselle flew in November 1907.
Nobody is discussing configurations here. I do love the Demoiselle and do really want to built a modified one for myself!
Out of any machine of that era, I personally would favor a Bleriot. It is a beautiful machine.
warp13 I guess you mean the model XI. Being a 1909 plane, it was most advanced than the rest.
why appeared after Santos Dumont: the global aviation, flights over cities, flights over various locations, aircraft's builders and Wright Bros in First flight?
"FIRST AVIATION RECORD OF THE WORLD."
FAI records. Paris NOVEMBER, 12 1906.
The Dumont event was immortalized at a monument in Bagatelle.
Do you have a link to the FAI records you mention.
The first FAI record that I find listed is the one for circular
flight in 1908. It was won by a voisin-farman.
@@stevebett4947
th-cam.com/video/ZqfP7nvY5zw/w-d-xo.htmlsi=Rbgo3QipOrFVdRZs
It was the brazilian ALBERTO SANTOS DUMONT
Falou bobagens talvez por nao fazer pesquisas!!!. Assista este video para saber a verdade: th-cam.com/video/NzhayuYwLDk/w-d-xo.html
THE FACT IS THAT, SANTOS DUMONT WAS THE FIRST, THE REST IS HISTORY, OF PEOPLE WHO CAN NOT ANALYZE AND RECOGNIZE A GREAT, CHARACTER OF THE HISTORY OF HUMANITY, SANTOS DUMONT, BORN IN BRAZIL, THE FATHER OF AVIATION ....
@MB Rodrigues: "Santos Dumont was the first..."
SB: Santos Dumont was not the first unless you redefine or restrict the concept of what it means to fly. 20 others have claimed to have been first before 1903.
Santos was the first to fly a manned rigid wind machine that was witnessed by
officials from the AeroClub and certified by the FAI.
It was the first official flight over a distance of 50 m. and later 100 m.
The Wrights had observers from the American Aero Club at some of their flights.
However, they were not official witnesses and they were not French.
The Wrights claim to have covered an incredible 873 ft. on their 4th flight.
Santos only had to cover 100 m. or roughly 300 ft. to win the Deutsche-Archdeacon prize.
There is no doubt that Santos Dumont flew for 100 m or more in less than 22 sec. There is no incontestable evidence that the Wrights flew 873 ft. in 59 sec. in 1903.
Being the first to fly does not make you the undisputed father of aviation.
Sir George Caley (1780's) had his driver pilot his flying contraption a few feet. Should the driver be hailed as the father of aviation?
The Wright Brothers flew 3 years before Santos Dumont.
Even the Deutsche-Archdeacon prize was only willing to claim that his was the first "powered flight in Europe".
Why? Because people had flown before, just not in Europe.
The Wright brothers and Dumont should all three be honored as scientists who contributed to modern aviation.
The Wrights flew first, but Dumont's design included landing gear (wheels), and stabilization (tail lift) that the Wright's machine didn't.
@@YeshuaIsTheTruth The anti-wright crowd will dispute that the Wrights did anything before 1908
because they refused to supply proof without an up front payment in the neighborhood of $35,000.
Their argument is without incontestable evidence, there is no proof. Since Santos Dumont's flight
had incontestable proof, it was the first powered aircraft anywhere for all time. For Cayley's short hop
in a manned flying machine to count, he would have had to set a contest and have the winner determined
by expert witnesses from the Aero Club. Without this set up, there would be no incontestable proof that
the fight of his coachman ever happened.
@@stevebett4947 yeah... but they're still wrong. I guarantee there is documentation of people talking about the Wright brothers flight before 1906.
@@YeshuaIsTheTruth: wrote: The Brazilian critics are wrong. People talked about the WB before 1906.
You did not document your claim. The easiest evidence can be found in the articles by Octave Chanute.
The Wrights got their start by copying the bracing on the Chanute-Herring Glider. Chanute did not use wing warping. This was a feature they added and it gave them more control in high winds.
Chanute wrote about the Wright glider experiment in French so the efforts were well known in Paris.
I don't have a good reference so if you know of a couple, please provide them.
I don't think anyone is claiming that the Wrights were not talked about. The claim was that their
experiments were imaginary. The Wrights were bluffers and hoaxers.
For many critics, even the efforts of the Wrights to demonstrate their mastery of the air by flying
in circles in front of a crowd of witnesses doesn't count as evidence.
Some think that the testimony of witnesses was part of the conspiracy.
Others think that historical proofs don't count because they are not sufficient evidence
of the quality they demand. The proof of performance has to be incontestable.
Parts of a historical narrative might be built on facts but the narrative itself almost always
goes beyond what cannot be disputed. In short, they try to throw out all historical narratives.
Their high requirements for evidence rarely applies to their own arguments.
Santos Dumont is Hero in the Brazil R.I.P Santos Dumont
ALBERT SANTOS DUMONT WAS A BRAZILLIAN NUT WHO COMMITTED SUICIDE IN 1932 BECAUSE HE WAS A PETER PAN WANNABE WHO COULD NOT FLY BUT HE SPRINKLED FAIRY DUST!
Kimberly Williams Really ? th-cam.com/video/b95OruHb1Xc/w-d-xo.html
brasileiros Silva Perfectly said .
brasileiros Silva Yes, for sure. We bring facts to the discussion and many guys take it personally . :-)
@brasileiros Silva You known that Dumont invented the first airplane right?
OMG What a sad end for this brave pioneer!
And I do think he was right that planes should not take part in wars...
RIP.
Santos was a dreamer, a man full of ideas and his ambitious goal was to take people up there in the air. He was obsessed with the idea of flying and dedicated his life to get there and fly... and he did many times, and all his projects and tests were public. People literally followed him wherever he went carrying his flying sources and machines. People loved him. He did all this for you for me for people, and after many accidents he became weak. When he saw his invention and all his life dedication to take people up there, flying, as a war aircraft weapon to kill people, he felt guilty and wounded in his heart. I know its a bit difficult to understand but flying was his goal not using it to kill others.
Santos used to donate part of his money prizes from flying competitions to the poor in France as he received the money from France, the french deverved part of it, so he gave the money to the poor
Why didn't the Wright brothers present the plane to the American trademarks for registration? Note that the patent took three years to be filed and the plane was not registered !!
So?
Alberto was a good man. May he rest in peace 🙏🏽
Santos used to donate part of his money prizes to the poor in France as he received the money from france, the french deverved part of it
Be careful about putting too much faith or credence in the Vargas created legend of Santos-Dumont.
He may have been a good man but in his later years he suffered from terrible physical and mental problems.
Santos didn't need the money from the prizes. The story I read said he gave it to his workers.
He moved from Paris to a small seaside town. He was charged with being a foreign spy mainly
because he owned a telescope. After being charged he became very depressed and paranoid.
He destroyed most of his papers. After being acquitted, he moved to Switzerland where he took
up residence in a swiss sanitarium. He could and did leave from time to time since he was not required
to stay there.
One of his brothers picked him up at the Sanitarium and took him back to Brazil where he left him unattended
in a hotel. He committed suicide a day later.
Can anyone recommend a biography that attempts to be objective?
The discussion about who flew an airplane first is endless.
At one side we have people that are sure about Santos Dumont flight.
At the other side we have people that believe the Wright Brothers flew before 1906, but they can not show any proof about that, they are not sure about that , just believe, and that is it.
Keep telling yourself that.
@@iChiphead Problem is, he keeps telling EVERYONE that... :) But repetition doesn't make it less false
The Wrights took a picture.
@@inthemoment8791 kkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk
A film has been made of Santos Dumont flying
Whigth brothers make catapult.
Santos Dumont makes the flight fly.
Santos Dumont is the father of aviation.
Wright brothers are the father of the Angry Birds
During their first flight Wright didn'y use a catapult. Moreover, CATAPULTS DON"T MAKE THINGS FLY YOU MORONS!
@@kawahenry8716 Wright brothers were flying 20 miles flights in 1905 Dumont was hopping like a frog in 1906. You are a maroon
Wrights used a catapult to help speed up on their short track. They used track to take off from rough grass fields.
If they had Dumonts money they could have had an airstrip built.
@@hyzercreek LOL By your poor spelling YOU are a MORON
He was a true early aviator but not the first to achieve controlled powered flight. His 1906 historic flight in Paris had only 2 axis control, not the 3 needed to actually control the plane. They were essentially powered hops. The Wrights for years already had 3 axis control and a year before had flown 39 km!!! Dumont's best flight that day was 220 m. It's not even close. It doesn't matter how the Wrights got in the air, they stayed in the air and controlled their machine for kms when everyone else were struggling for metres!
zero evidence of that, only "trust me bro"... A couple of years from now, north americans will claim they discovered america as well
Our Santos Dumont! 🇧🇷❤
Santos is Winner
1903 is 3 years before 1906. 1904 the Wrights did a 2.75 mile flight. 1905 a 24 mile flight!!! A passenger in 1908. 1908 Wilbur flew for 124 kilometres, in Europe.
Esses americanos querem ter em razão em tudo , QUEM INVENTOU O AVIÃO FOI SANTOS DUMONT .🇧🇷🇧🇷🇧🇷🇧🇷
Verdade
Santos Dumont certamente reconhecido como o pai da aviação no Brasil.
A maioria dos países tem um herói local que consideram o pai da aviação.
Não creio que alguém possa ser reconhecido como o único inventor do avião.
Eles podem ser reconhecidos como sendo um dos principais contribuintes. Havia pelo menos 200 colaboradores antes de 1910.
(in English)
Santos Dumont certainly recognized as the father of aviation in Brazil.
Most countries have a local hero they consider to be the father of aviation.
I don't think that anyone can be recognized as the sole inventor of the airplane.
They can be recognized as being a major contributor. There were at least 200 contributors before 1910.
A nasa não mentiu. Em 2003 a réplica dos Wright não voou. Ou seja😄irmãos Wright não VOAVAM 😆😆😆😆😆😆😆😆
The early wind tunnel test at NASA used a defective propeller design based on a museum replica.
Museum replicas rarely make a claim to authenticity.
They are look alikes and not meant to fly.
The museum replica that NASA used to make a replica of the propeller
couldn't fly but it did resemble an early Wright Flyer.
The particular prop produced more Drag than Thrust.
A plane with this propeller would not fly.
We know that the 1903 Flyer did not use this prop because Thrust
was measured by a spring scale and found to be more efficient than the Wrights had calculated..
The early Wright flyers required strong headwind and engine power.
Without the assistance provided by a strong headwind, the Flyer would not take off.
This is what the 2003 Centennial flight proved.
There were two test flights before Dec. 17, 2003. Both times the replica flew about 100 ft.
It was consistent with what the NASA engineers predicted if the pilots were not experienced.
The 1903 Wright Flyer was next to impossible to fly.
On November 20, 2003, Dr. Kevin Kochersberger piloted the 1903 Wright Experience Replica Flyer.
With 15-18 mph winds he flew a distance of nearly 100 feet.
th-cam.com/video/o1mscspl-VU/w-d-xo.html
@GNJ:
SB: NASA did not lie. In 2003 the Wright replica did not fly. In other words, Wright brothers WON'T FLY
NASA used a replica of a bad replica of the propellers used by the Wrights.
They reported that this prop would not produce more Thrust than Drag.
In other words, a flying machine that used such a prop would not fly.
I am not sure you could say that those who built the museum replicas were liars
unless they claimed that the facsimile props on the museum display were the ones
actually used or would actually fly. Museum Wright Flyer replicas usually don't fly. They are look alike replicas.
We know that the original Wright flyer used efficient props because they were tested on site and produced more thrust that the Wright's had calculated they would produce.
Here is an exact replica of the Wright Flyer.
It does not fly well, but it does fly about 100 ft.
Its failure to fly 200 ft. cannot be attributed to defective propellers.
On November 20, 2003, Dr. Kevin Kochersberger piloted the 1903 Wright Experience Replica Flyer. With 15 mph winds he flew a distance of nearly 100 feet.
th-cam.com/video/o1mscspl-VU/w-d-xo.html
@@stevebett4947 *NASA REPORT >>>>"Wright Flyer", A look at handling qualities of canard configurations, Nasa , p. 8, TM 88354, ...the Flyer was highly unstable... The lateral/directional stability and control of the Flyer were marginal."
Another fact.
The Demoiselle was also the first airplane to use spinner at the propeller. 6:32
+Fly Radio FACT-it initially had an air PADDLE, until the Wright brothers.
It does not matter. The first spinner someone put in an airplane propeller was Santos Dumont (in his Demoiselle.)
It does not matter. The first spinner someone put in an airplane propeller was Santos Dumont (in his Demoiselle.)
It does not matter. The first spinner someone put in an airplane propeller was Santos Dumont (in his Demoiselle.)
Thanks, that was excellent!
Our immortal Father global aviation proved that heavier than air would rise without any catapult or human strength, proving before the aéro club of France and a large crowd in Paris and proved that his invention the 14 Bis was the aviation pioneer . While Wrigt brothers without any proven witness became in the mouths of North American pioneers of this invention. But Alberto Santos Dumont from the top of its simplicity and honesty proved its success becoming the king of France, and Laureate recognized by many countries, especially the nation that always loved the Brazilian people.
Herói mineiro ! O homem mais inteligente do mundo é do brasil e do meu estado " minas gerais " ! Santos drummond is the father of aviation !
Do mundo já e exagero
@@iv1729 porquê?
Sabias que no monumento em bagatelle tá lá desde 1910.
FIRST AVIATION RECORD OF THE WORLD.
há muito tempo e destacando o ano de 1906.
I think the Wrights and Santos Dumont are great aviation pioneers!!!
Santos Dumont would never give up his planes for the First and Second World Wars, and as he closed the factory because of the war, the French became resentful of Santos Dumont and simply ceased to recognize him as the father of aviation, the one who actually flew first, giving this place to the Wright Brothers to please the United States who were now mass-manufacturing planes for France. Nothing is as simple as it seems, there's geopolitics in between.
Actually, the truth is much simpler than this strange fiction you created. It was Dumont who destroyed the 14 Bis and all its design drawings shortly after its last flight because he knew it was a dead end. The next one the 15 Bis was even worse.
@@raymondjensen4603 he destroyed only a few recent inventions and at the end of his life, he did so after he saw planes, planes that he had created, bombing São Paulo, in the attempt of a coup d'état in 1930. but his relevant inventions such as the 14 Bis and the Demoiselle which you call the 15 Bis (NOTE: 15 bis never existed, he stopped at the 14 Bis, the Demoiselle being a new model of his experiments) were used in world aviation as models to be followed and were opened for the whole world to use and make their own planes. Santos Dumont donated his designs to the world airplane because he believed that something like this should not be patented. he destroyed his other projects because he was disgusted with life, because he felt guilty for having invented something so destructive because his models were used in World War I. No, it's not that simple. In addition, he was the first man to actually fly in an airplane, while the brothers had a glider that only took off with a catapult.
Wondering why this isn't taught in history class... school 😑
Jealousy, they wanna make you believe that brothers Wright invented.
Americans never learn about it is a pity
In the united states the schools teach that two idiots invented the airplane
1903 is 3 years before 1906. 1904 the Wrights did a 2.75 mile flight. 1905 a 24 mile flight!!! A passenger in 1908. 1908 Wilbur flew for 124 kilometres, in Europe.
@@BornAgainCynic0086 so what?
Thanks you For your wonderful contribution. I enjoyed.
The Wright brothers built a pusher style/front canard aircraft that required an daredevil to fly. Santos-Dumont built tractor style aircraft that were easier to fly and became the dominant layout for modern aircraft. Both came to decry the use of aircraft as weapons of war.
Bleriot invented the monoplane with front tractor. Dumont invented the box kite
The Wright's first machine took off from a 60 ft rail into 25+ mph wind that probably would have shredded the 14bis, and it had lateral control that the 14bis totally lacked, so I don't know who the greater daredevils were here.
Contrary to popular belief, the Wrights did not use a catapult for their first flights. Their takeoff rail was too short to permit a long takeoff run to build sufficient airspeed so the headwind was necessary.
They built their catapult later in order to fly off of their short rails back in Ohio on days when the wind was calm. The catapult was not used on days with sufficient breeze. They did not like using wheels in flight as they added drag and weight but when the Army requested wheels on the Wright Model B, they begrudgingly acquiesed and provided them. No rail was required for takeoff and ground handling became much easier.
@@rescue270 zero evidence
@@agauerm
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Tons of proof that you refuse to acknowledge.
@@Otokichi786
A further note is that the Santos-Dumont 14bis was also a "tail-first" canard pusher design. I believe his first successful tractor-type airplanes were the different versions of the Demoiselle, for which he offered plans for sale to the public, making Alberto Santos-Dumont the father and founder of the entire amateur-built experimental aircraft branch of the aviation industry. The first Demoiselles were designed around a 25 hp Darracq engine, and number of builders could not get them off the ground if their butts were a bit on the heavy side...
The Flyer depended on catapults until 1908. in fact, the U>S. military considered the Flyer but did not approve because they needed a machine that would be able to turn around in the battle environments where catapults would be be unfeasible. the Wrights were aware of the Aeroclub de France prize for the first heavier-than-air to fly for a certain distance and height but chose not to participate. Among others including Louis Bleriot, Santos took the prize and was issued pilot licence number one, wich stands as the first official brevet until today.
+PUMA PRETO the catapult iS not the issue, it never was an issue (only recently it has become an issue) if you understand anything about the development of the early Wright Flyers-then the use of a catapult is negligible. When Wilbur first flew in Europe in August 1908, his two minute flight confirmed everything that the Wrights had claimed up until that time. I would suggest you read ANY periodical, as well as statements from all the leading aviators, the Wrights were hailed as the true inventors of flight.
There are eyewitness accounts and published accounts prior to 1908, look them up.
THe true solution was about "riding the horse" as Wilbur wrote, that was the real problem to be solved. By August 1908 no one on the planet had more hours in the air then the Wright brothers, this is an undisputed FACT.
Gaitaboa Gaitaboa We've had this conversation a hundred times, so here we go again. What year was the letter? 1907? The Wrights were gathering information to see if Dumont had infringed on the Wright patent. Very simple. That is why they wanted exact information-nothing more. By 1905 they could fly much further and much higher. It is pitiful to see so many Dumont supporters look at this as though the wrights were stealing design information-WRONG.
Santos ✈
Are there any videos of the 14-bis flights available on-line?
Probably, yes. It was a public event as all his work.
@@itis4peace and so there are with no effort,,, th-cam.com/video/3NWFFSx5lSE/w-d-xo.html
@@Observ45er yes! Thank you
th-cam.com/video/3NWFFSx5lSE/w-d-xo.html
Santos was using bike's pieces since his early start with his extravagant attempts to construct an aircraft to fly in France, Paris. And note that Santos was also a pioneer using these materials.
@@itis4peace The one video of 14 flying does not show it at the 15 foot height, however, nor of it doing any turns. I suspect it never did and couldn't turn very well, if at all. His dragonfly looked quite bit better, but a more soon-to-be conventional configuration with rear tail
I think it all boils down to "definition." The Wright Brothers plane was the first heavier than air machine, but Santos-Dumont's craft was far closer to the conventional function of an actual working airplane.
Wright brothers were flying 20 miles flights in 1905 Dumont was hopping like a frog in 1906. You are a maroon
Shivkar Bapuji Talpade an indian is the first inventor of Aeroplane which take off but couldn't fly due to tecnical issues. The design is presented and based on facts of some thousand years of ancient texts in the VYMANIKA SASTRA.
You know I often see bickering about who when where. Catapults and track takeoff or wheels and long smooth runways. Flights of single digit inches in altitude in straight lines for tens of seconds accounting as modern controlled engine flight. Give it up folks.
The Wrights studied the hundred years of known aerodynamics, experimented with scale gliders and props in wind tunnels they built to achieve best foil shape, hp requirements and the control method. Most of the failed or uncontrolled attempts by German, French, US and Brazilian developers from 1890-1906 were due to a lack of scientific/engineering approach or a purchased engine that was way too heavy. Air development was a big push around 1900 and people took dreadful risks without enough engineering.
The Wright's designed their own engine that was stripped of all covers and cowlings. Thin walled blocks and open air valves and sparks. They built their own prop drive from their bicycle chains, control flaps/warps with bike cables, they built the whole thing, not just assembled parts. Witnesses observed and testified to controlled flight in 1903 including turns on the beach. Many more flights leading up to a European demonstration three years later. While other gentlemen aviators later in the decade were trying to win Daily Mail prize money or bragging rights (while studying the Wright patent and engine)... The Wrights were ignoring all that to focus on selling their planes as practical tools to various governments and build a flying school in Montgomery, AL for the Air Corp. While men were getting novelty prizes in Europe for 5, 10 or 30 minutes of flight, the Wrights had achieved flights of well over an hour by mid decade, AND they were selling airplanes.
The track and catapult was a practical device for a world not yet fitted with takeoff fields aimed at any point of prevailing wind, and to demonstrate the use of airplanes to armies and navies. Naval aircraft still take off with catapult and rail. I think they're flying people.
Every early developer eventually acknowledged the Wrights' detailed, consistent, well documented and quiet work was what got incorporated into all airplanes by 1913. They are still just a milestone in the timeline of human flight, just as Chuck Yeager flew faster than sound. Or did he, as he was launched in flight from a larger bomber. Yes he did, the start method notwithstanding.
Santos-Dumont was a brave and Imaginative air pioneer. First, second or third, the industry eventually used Wrights' design and weight to hp methods.
Well put. Thank you!
fuck you. Santos Dummont pai da aviação.
they were called crazy until today they couldn't fly their plane, even shit flies with catapult
@@bleecker8056 Get a new joke. That one's old. It's also rude.
@@iChiphead Wind tunnel tests shows the Flyer 1 could not fly using its own power.
T
I'm not saying it is as big of a deal as the first human to fly, but the first ion propelled craft to carry its power supply, can be seen in flight, by clicking the purple channel icon to the left.
It took a large power to weight ratio increase to lift the power supply with just ions. Many of the news programs claim MIT did it first, but they are very clearly incorrect.
The Americans have invented the angry birds
Yes. The closest flyers they got: angry birds
Is that supposed to mean something.
Irmãos brothers de fato foram os primeiros a inventar o planador com motor sem força de decolagem
Criaram um planador, conquistaram um prêmio que não pertencia a eles e ainda por cima o """avião""" é brocha😂
Santos Dumont invented the first airplane.
He did a lot of great things, but he didn't do that.
May he rest in peace
My great Uncle
Hmmm totally.
Bunch of mad people in the comments can't except the Wright Brothers are the first and the world recognizes them aswell👏
I only see a bunch of mad Wrong brother's fans that can't recognize who invented an actual plane instead of a slingshot
👌proceed to stay upset imperial system users
Santos Dumont foi pioneiro em máquinas voadora mais leve que o ar, e no mais pesado que o ar.
O engraçado e os americanos falando que o 14 bis era uma máquina desajeitado sendo que o Flyers nunca vôo!
Como o flyers vôo tendo mais peso e pouca potência?
When Santos Dumont flew the 14 bis in 1906, the Wright Brothers had already built and flown three different heavier-than-air flying machines: 1) The 1903 Flyer, which took off under its own power and flew 852 feet (260 m) in 59 seconds; 2) The 1904 Flyer which also took off under its own power and was the first heavier-than-air craft to fly in a complete circle as well as covering a distance of 4,080 feet; and 3) the 1905 Flyer which also took off under its own power and flew a distance of twenty-four miles, including several circular maneuvers. On the other hand, Santos Dumont's 14 bis was essentially uncontrollable and was only capable of flying short distances in a straight line.
- Where is it possible to find the official proofs about those flights? Who provided that information?
- Could you explain why the 14-bis would just be able to fly straight line? Or short distances ?
+San Pol
>>>San Pol said: "Where is it possible to find the official proofs about those flights? Who provided that information?"
For archival information and primary source documentation concerning the dates and times of their flights, consult the Smithsonian National Air and Space Museum. For information concerning the Federation Aeronautique Internationale's (FAI's) recognition and certification of the Wrights as having built the world's first practical aircraft, contact the FAI. If memory serves, the FAI specifically considers the flight of December 17 1903 at Kitty Hawk, North Carolina as first flight of a practical aircraft.
The FAI also awarded the Great Medal to the Wrights in recognition of their flights both in France and in the United States. (Santos Dumont also received the Great Medal, but it was for his invention of the powered airship and not for the 14 bis.)
Not to be outdone by the FAI, the French Government awarded the Legion of Honour to the Wrights, also in recognition for their flights in France and the United States.
>>>San Pol said: "Could you explain why the 14-bis would just be able to fly straight line?
The easiest answer is that the 14 bis lacked an effective three-axis control system. The 14 bis was primarily designed to fly in a straight line, sacrificing maneuverability for stability. Maneuverability was unnecessary because the 14 bis was built to compete for the Deutsch-Archdeacon prize, which required nothing more than a flight in a straight line. After winning the Deutsch-Archdeacon prize, Santos Dumont quickly abandoned the 14 bis and began work on other designs, most notably the Demoiselle series.
>>>San Pol said: "Or short distances ?"
The 14 bis' Antoinette 50 hp engine was unquestionably the most advanced power plant available in 1906, but unfortunately most of its impressive power was wasted by the 14 bis' crude, inefficient propeller. In other words, the 14 bis lacked sufficient thrust for anything more than short hops.
In contrast, the Wrights' contra-rotating propellers were, even by today's standards, extremely efficient. The combination of the Wrights' 25 hp engine (in the 1905 Flyer) and their efficient propellers generated more thrust than Santos Dumont's 50 hp Antionette and its single crude propeller.
+Louis Daguerre sou brazileiro
+Louis Daguerre not really. the Flyer depended on a catapult until 1908.
+PUMA PRETO You are sorely mistaken. In point of fact, the 1903 Flyer, the 1904 Flyer, and the 1905 Flyer all flew both with and without the aid of a catapult.
Histórias de Santos Dumont nas publicações americanas:
As páginas do Wright-Brothers.org podem ser lidas em português.
www.wright-brothers.org/History_Wing/History_of_the_Airplane/Who_Was_First/Santos_Dumont/Santos_Dumont.htm
WBO: In 1904 -- a year after the Wright brothers had made their first powered flight-- Santos Dumont turned his attention to heavier-than-air flying. He began with a glider, then built an unsuccessful helicopter in 1905.
In 1906, he built a strange-looking flying machine -- a biplane of what the French had begun to call the type du Wright, loosely based on the Wright biplane plans that had been published in several European magazines.
SB: The author is wrong. Santos-Dumont commissioned Voisin to build him an airframe with wheels. Voisin's pontoon gilder with dihedral box kite wings was the inspiration. I see little resemblance to the Wright Glider or Flyer. It was not a type du Wright. The prototypes of Farman an Feber can be so designated. After SDs
success, they added boxkite tails to their flying machines.
WBO: The box-like elevator and rudder protruded in front of the wings like the head of a duck in flight. It was promptly dubbed a canard (French for "duck"), and the name was incorporated into the growing aeronautical lexicon.
WIKIPEDIA:
By 1905, he had finished his first fixed-wing aircraft design, and also a helicopter. Santos-Dumont finally succeeded in flying a heavier-than-air aircraft on 23 October 1906, piloting the 14-bis before a large crowd of witnesses at the grounds of Paris' Château de Bagatelle in the Bois de Boulogne for a distance of 60 metres (197 ft) at a height of about five meters (16 ft).[24] This was the first flight of a powered heavier-than-air machine in Europe to be certified by the Aéro-Club de France, and won the Deutsch-Archdeacon Prize for the first officially observed flight of more than 25 meters. On 12 November 1906 Santos-Dumont set the first world record recognized by the Federation Aeronautique Internationale, by flying 220 metres (722 ft) in 21.5 seconds.[25][26][27] On that date he became the first person to be filmed in an airplane in flight.[28] As late as 1906 he was reported as stating that the Wright Brothers claim to have flown for thirty miles was mere bluff.[29]
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alberto_Santos-Dumont#:~:
The modern critique is that the Wrights claims before 1918 were not observed by official witnesses and are not incontestable. The Wrights were not interested in proving anything without a $50,000 investment.
They didn't receive the required investment until late 1906.
santos had a real plane! he is first for a plane but wrigt bros had 1st flying machine
The Wright bros didn't make a flying machine. Because it needed a catapult or impulse. And needed also a high wind.
+The Military
the point is that there is no proof that the Wright fleew when they said.
People always present evidences, but PROOF ....never.
San Pol Haha, they can't admit it.
+rodolfo scwartzman
great links you posted !
rodolfo scwartzman 14bis flew in 1906.
When Santos Dumont flew the 14 bis in 1906, the Wright Brothers had already built and flown three different heavier-than-air flying machines: 1) the 1903 Flyer, which took off under its own power and flew 852 feet (260 m) while remaining in the air 59 seconds; 2) the 1904 Flyer which also took off under its own power and was the first heavier-than-air craft to fly in a complete circle as well as covering a distance of 4,080 feet; and 3) the 1905 Flyer which also took off under its own power and flew a distance of twenty-four miles, including several circular maneuvers. On the other hand, Santos Dumont's 14-bis was uncontrollable and was only capable of flying short distances in a straight line.😊😊😊😊😊😊
Official evidence, please. The Wrights never proved anything before Dumont.
FAI records do not confirm anything you claim here.
😄😄😄😄😄😄great lie
@@gilberto2056 Have you received your latest copy of "Gleanings in Bee Culture".
@@gilberto2056 So, when a tree falls in a forest, it doesn't make a sound unless the Federation Aeronautiques International say's it does. Brillant..., there is no virtue in ignorance.
Santos Dumont of Brasil🇧🇷, the real one, the FIRST to fly "the heaviest in the air" by OWN MEANS without needing a catapult, audited by the Paris Aéroclub. Undisputed ... the selfish centrism of North American history wanting to cover the truth, you are not to blame are years of ignorance of historiography.
You display the same kind of cultural prejudice that you criticize. Can you make an objective, evidence-based case for the primacy of Santos Dumont, without framing it in cultural or national terms?
The greatest myth regarding first flight was that the Wrights used a catapult..., they did not. The 1903 flyer took off on its own power. It was launched on a rail without assistance. A rail was used because the ground was sand. This is not my opinion, this is fact.
Reply
Seems that Brazil has a problem with dates. 1903 is 3 years before 1906. 1904 the Wrights did a 2.75 mile flight. 1905 a 24 mile flight!!! A passenger in 1908. 1908 Wilbur flew for 124 kilometres, in Europe.
With proof and documentation, that's the problem.
The 14-bis , was created by Alberto Santos Dumont.
Before he invented the plane, he created the first dirigible.
The 14-bis flew in front of hundreds of people, including specialists in aviation at the time. It was the first time the world saw an airplane flying.
The plane had a tremendous lift and the elevator and rudder were very efective.
Despite of the flights been executed in straight line , the plane could turn in any direction and fly as long as the fuel tank had fuel.
The proposition of the plane was to prove the heavy than air could fly.
After all the world knew the plane could fly, many other planes were made and flew, but the first one was the 14-bis.
+San Pol No, not according to the Federation Aeronatique Internationale (FAI). The FAI officially credits the Wright Brothers as building and flying the world's first practical airplane on December 17, 1903. Not to be outdone, the French government awarded the Legion of Honour to the Wrights in recognition for creating the first practical airplane.
+Jindle Spog
please....just present some proof about it.
There is no proof .
Proof = 14-bis
Evidences = flyer before 1908
I stay with the proof .
14-bis flew first.
14-bis never flew for more than 220 meters, and never climbed out of ground effect (6 meters for that wingspan). It never performed a controlled turn. It is a fact that all Santos-Dumont demonstrated was an "uncontrolled hop" with a dead-end design. That's all he had up until Wilbur Wright blows every with the Wright Flyer III at Le Mans in 1908. That was a "powered, sustained, controlled, manned" flight -- something Santos-Dumont was *still* not capable of yet. That is proof that the Wrights were first, even if you reject all of the other evidence. We are talking verifiable proof, and speaking nothing of faith.
Now, can you please explain why you continue to praise Santos-Dumont for his uncontrolled hop?
@@iChiphead Are you kidding?
You believe the Flyer with 340 kg , 12 hp and propellers turning at ceiling fan rpm , could fly sustainable ?
The 14-bis was controllable in 3 axis.
Any copy of it flies easily. The same does not happen with the Flyer copies because it is impossible if no power or design modification are made.
14-bis had a V8 engine with 50hp, the weight was 272 kg, it had ailerons, rudder and elevator.
At the time he flew just 220 because it was enought to prove an airplane could fly. And was much over the required distance
to be considered a flight.
This thing about ground effect is a complete non sense for a plane with lots of available power like the 14-bis as you can see in this video.
th-cam.com/video/b95OruHb1Xc/w-d-xo.html
@@sanpol4399 The linked video is not an exact replica, and historically, 14-bis had control issues and never performed a turn. That's why Santos-Dumont considered it a dead-end and started over on a different plane. Plus, 14-bis came after the Wright Brothers had flown farther, higher, and longer. Sorry dude. This was all settled over a hundred years ago.
I've watch the 1906 Pathé News several times which shows the 14-bis rising only a few inches above the ground, and that its ailerons are completely ineffective. This footage makes its clear that the 14-bis lacks sufficient thrust, which is understandable considering the gross inefficiency of its primitive propeller. The 14-bis was obviously doomed to fail from the start.😁😁😁😁😁😁
Good comment but you should include some links.
I didn't find your referenced 1906 Pathe News video.
I did find this: th-cam.com/video/vhE7UPOlmeQ/w-d-xo.html
also found this crash of the 14-bis after 2.0 and repeated at 3.37
th-cam.com/video/GKhAZgQd_F4/w-d-xo.html
Were did the Wright brother planes flew ? I don't see It ... Where ?
Take your own conclusion:
m.th-cam.com/video/b95OruHb1Xc/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/yHxvdV9elL8/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/o1mscspl-VU/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/u3ZsvctI3IQ/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/o-wne_bQZjA/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/gmVf023EvWA/w-d-xo.html
@@megaoof7184 Seek, and yea shall find.
Santos!
i.imgur.com/oAtpvlu.jpg
Here's the 14-bis out of control and barely off the ground, just as the 1906 Pathé footage proves. the 14-bis never flew, just an uncontrolled hop.🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Unfortunately, as before and nowadays, Brazilians inventors has to leave Brazil to have some sponsor, infrastructure and technology to support their inventions... too sad...
Dumont's 14bis was a serious attempt to fly, based on European ideas that were flawed at the time. The Wrights were not going to demonstrate the performance of their flyer till their patent was approved in May 1906. The demonstrations in France in 1908 proved their concepts, and the patent laid out in detail what they were. With these concepts, and their own knowledge for building light engines and aircraft structures the Europeans were back in the game. Further, the demonstrations changed mainstream thought that flight was impossible to creating a demand that hadn't existed. Santos-Dumont demolished his 14bis and its design..., and in truth, it made no lasting contribution. But in this flourishing time, Santos-Dumont designed and built a delightful airplane called the Demoiselle. You can still get the plans for this airplane. It was small, simple, and light, his idea of an airplane for everyone, this had lasting value. So, he may not have been an Edison, he was kind of like a Henry Ford.
Aqui é 14-Bis porra birl !
They actually only used a catipult on the eroupian flights
Anglo-Saxons recognizes Brothers Wright, Latins Santos Dumont and that's ok, everyone believes in their own heroes, Why should I care about some guys from North American flew over Virginia if I'm from Brazil and this guy from my own country (and state) created a plane that flew over Paris....
+imtv It was North Carolina, not Virginia-major difference.
I made my point...
+imtv I understand, but at least have the correct information, it would be like me saying Dumont was from Uruguay or Argentina.
+imtv As a homosexual, Santos Dumont was driven out of his deeply Catholic and highly conservative homeland. It's only natural that he would seek acceptance in Paris. How ironic then that Brazil, which virtually expelled him, now seeks to unjustly appropriate his legacy as an aviation pioneer.
+Louis Daguerre What are you talking about, Dumont´s father fell from a horse could not work again in his coffee plantation, a very rich man who sent his young son to Paris to study Engineering and Science who evolved in all his inventions from balloon, dirigible and heavier than air from Project No1 to No 20. Wright´s Flyer was the same junk glider from 1903 to 1915. Took the design from Herring and Chanute and put a 2 propellers at rear like Dumont in his dirigible. The brothers did not have enough brains to put a couple of their bikes wheels under instead they used a catapult and no wind no flying.
He's the Tesla to the Wright brother's Edison.
Interesting idea. It would be more correct the other way around. The 14 bis was really crude by comparison with the Flyer, a product of tinkering like Edison, The Wright Flyer was a product of their scientific wind tunnel and flight control experiments. Two years before the 14 bis hopped and dropped, the Wright flyer could fly, maneuver, and stay aloft till it ran out of gas. Yes, more like Tesla.
@@raymondjensen4603 nope, no evidence of that, only "trust me bro"
Um ano antes de Alberto Dumont exibir-se com o balão N-14 (14-Bis), voar era uma rotina para os irmãos Wright. Graças aos irmãos Wright estamos voando em aviões, não em balões.
Eles voavam em um avião puxado por um carro manezão.
Terezinha Cândido Ninguém fabrica hoje balões Dumont, fabricam Wright Flyer. O importante é que o planador tornou-se controlado por um homem.
hahahaha errado.
muito discovery Channel :-)
Santos Dumont foi o primeiro a voar um avião.
San Pol Balão Dumont é avião! hehehehe
Os estadunidenses são mt bons em negócio. Não em verdades. Fora q os projetos de Stos Dumont eram abertos, projetos que os proprios writing e outros usaram posteriormente.
Antes de 1948 os wright nao eram conhecidos porque jamais participaram do clube dos inventores e nunca disputaeam nenhuma competiçao aberta .e nao ha registros do voo de 1903 somente em 1908 eles compraram um motor na europa e voaram mas ja era comum muitos voarem.
You are mistaken. I encourage you to do some genuine research.
Thank you Wright Brothers for changing the world.
thanks santos dumont, for changing the wright Brothers
Diêgo Curcino Santos Dumont? Never heard of him.
+EdLillywhiteNorton Till a pig flies with catapult.
Wandson De Oliveira Your government really hit all of you fools hard with the 'catapult' lie.
I'm British, so I don't have any nationalistic pride in this discussion. Wilbur flew for 40 minutes in 1905. Dumont flew 197 feet in 1906. Dumont wasn't the first to fly.
Modern replicas replicas of the 14-bis incorporate modern alloys fabricated with modern technology (i.e. arc welding) and are equipped with modern Rotax aero engines & propellers. Any resemblances between them and the original are purely cosmetic. Furthermore, the primitive "air paddle" installed on the original was only 12% efficient. Combined with the high parasitic drag coefficient of the original and its inadequate (not to say non-existent) controls, the original 14-bis only ever achieved short hops in conditions of complete calm. Moreover, the excess dihedral of the 14-bis only served to increase its instability in even the gentlest cross winds.😁😁😁😁
The modern Wright replicas built with lighter materials and with engines four or five times more powerful did nothing. FORGET the wrights didn't invent the plane.
You do not justify this argument because Dumont flew in 1906.
TO QUOTE ...
"They are today hallowed in France, and I feel an intense pleasure to be among the first to make amends!"...Ernest Archdeacon
"Wilbur Wright has completely dissipated all doubts. Not one of the former detractors of the Wrights dare question, today, the previous experiments of the men who are truly the first to fly….."Georges Beancon
"...the Wrights have beaten us all with their machine and I want one!" Leon Delagrange (
"The most beautiful dream that has haunted the heart of man since Icarus is today reality. I would have waited ten times as long to see what I have seen today, Monsieur Wright has us all in his hands!"
Louis Blériot..
JUST THE FACTS-SINCE THERE HAVE BEEN SO MANY LIES.
+Gaitaboa Gaitaboa I have already answered these items a hundred times. Review my posts. We are in no position to rewrite history.
+warp13 You want to create another bullshit massive USA media propaganda that says: the Wright weak brothers are the creators!! hahahahahahahahahahahahahhhahaahhhahahahhaahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhhahaahhhahahahhaahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!! You should spent more money on it! You will never change the history, but you are still buying new friends for agreement with you! hahaha
Gaitaboa Gaitaboa Absolutely wrong-If you took the time to actually read my posts you would see that I have answered all of these questions many times.
Maybe you just have a hard time accepting an opinion that is different than yours?
Maybe this is why you often change your user name?
Why you have over a half dozen aliases that I am aware of and post supporting arguments to yourself.
I will not continue to repeat myself, the answers to all of your questions are in my previous posts.
+warp13
the discussion is endless.
No proof about the Wright flight s before 1908.
That is a fact.
Evidence is not proof.
1908, declaration.
The Flyer never took off on its own merit because it did not have a powerful engine to get it off the ground. It was a very heavy machine with an extremely weak engine. The United States military did several tests and created a perfect replica and put it to flight. It did not fly; it crashed and broke. Santos Dumont's plane flew and stayed fully in the air, even with a very heavy engine, because its duck design helped with air resistance and it took off high because of the power of the engine used. So yes, Santos Dumont was the first to invent the airplane. The brothers only created the Flyer, which was a glider.
_”The Flyer never took off on its own merit because it did not have a powerful engine to get it off the ground.”_
That claim requires a calculation that assimilates factors such as horsepower, torque, gearing, propeller efficiency, coefficients of lift and drag, and others. If you haven’t performed this calculation, then you’re just guessing.
_”It was a very heavy machine with an extremely weak engine.”_
Yes, and that’s helps explain why it was a marginal performer. But it does not prove that the engine was insufficient.
_”The United States military did several tests and created a perfect replica and put it to flight. It did not fly; it crashed and broke.”_
There have been no attempts to fly a genuine Flyer I replica in equal physical conditions. There have been no 14-bis replicas at all, only what are known as “look-alikes”, aircraft which are largely like the originals, but which also have modifications and upgrades. In short, the performance of reproduction aircraft so far neither proves nor disproves the claims for the Wrights and Santos-Dumont.
_”The brothers only created the Flyer, which was a glider.”_
The Wright Flyers were powered aircraft, not gliders.
Wright Brothers first in flight!
Helga Schmidlap he was catapulted to fly not like santos dumont that build a plane that didn´t need a catapult to fly
Helga Schmidlap were are the proves? the project from Wright brothers... the reproduced working aircraft to celebrate the centenary of their inventions? Come on! USA are a great country with a great people! Just leave this credit for Brazilians because that's the true! Just let it be!
Helga Schmidlap No Helga. Not Wright...Wrong! Not brothers but one man: Santos Dumont. Sorry disappointing you, but the brothers are, as many others, another making believe.
Otto Lilienthal (05/23/1848 - 08/10/1896) was a German pioneer of aviation who became known as the Glider King. He was the first person to make well-documented, repeated, successful gliding flights. Newspapers and magazines published photographs of Lilienthal gliding, favorably influencing public and scientific opinion about the possibility of flying machines becoming practical.
Asusbahssahu here is Brazil. White is fake.
Partial answer to the claims that the Centennial failure and the first NASA study prove the 1903 Wright Flyer could not fly.
The failure to fly on Dec. 17, 2003 only proves that an exact replica of the Wright
Flyer cannot fly without assistance from a strong headwind.
There were several NASA wind tunnel tests. The first used a bad prop copied from a museum replica. This prop generated more Drag than Thrust.
This was not the prop that the Wrights used in 1903 which was tested on site with a spring gauge and found to deliver more thrust than anticipated. The museum replica was a look alike. It was never supposed to fly.
FLYING IN CIRCLES:
www.thisdayinaviation.com/13-january-1908/voisin-farman-i-winning-the-grand-prix-de-laviation-13-january-1908-2-3/
Henry Farman flew a circular one kilometer course at Issy-les-Moulineaux, France, in 1 minute, 28 seconds in 1908 to win
the Grand Prix de l’aviation, a prize of 50,000 francs, which had been offered by Henri Deutsch de la Meurthe.
SB: I think this was only one lap around a 1 km ( 3280 ft.) circle. This is about the same as what the Wrights
achieved 4 years earlier in 1904. It could even be the source for the French prize. On September 20, 1904, the Wrights flew their first complete circle. The flight lasted 1 minute, 36 seconds and covered 4,080 feet.
The flight was photographed but the date of the photograph is not established.
The flight was allegedly witnessed
by Amos Root who published his account in Gleanings in Jan, 1905
SanPol wrote: As you said above about the Wright brothers closed circuit flight claim.
" There is room for doubt." That is EXACTLY the point since the beginning of our posts.👍👍
And the room for doubt is present not only in the first closed circuit flight,( even without landing gear
and catapulted) , but also on the first airplane flight claim. For some, there is plenty of room for doubt, for others there is some room for doubt on both Wright claims. Depending on how demanding each one is, leaving
with that doubt is still ok to continuing believing in Wright's claims, for others not.
It is a matter of personal choice. I still prefer the facts.
SB: You are not concerned with facts when it comes to proving your
claim that the Wrights were liars. We all prefer facts when they are
available. Usually we have to make do with stories that seem consistent.
The facts would be found in the original description of the performance
specified in the prize rules. I think the only fact is that the bis-14 flew over
the required 100m. and was observed by official witnesses. That is what is indisputable. I don't think the rules say anything about there having to be
public witnesses or film evidence. There was no film evidence for the
100 meter flight. There was no time requirement. Please prove me wrong.
There are few facts available. One is that the longer flight of the BIS-14 surpassed the 100 m. mark. It was probably over 200 m. We don't know because it was not measured. The time is not recorded. That has not prevented some from using the
plausible estimates: 220 m. in 21 sec.
Not exactly what you would expect from an expert witnesses. Shouldn't at least
one have a stop-watch and a way to measure the distance? They seem to have been satisfied with estimates because they were so excited that the 14-bis had exceeded the require distance by over 100 m.
He wasn't the first one to fly an aircraft heavier than air, but he certainly invented an airplane "on his own" {Santos and his team}, and that airplane is called 14 Bis.
So Who invented airplane?
12 Bis had no lateral control, it couldnt fly
When Santos Dumont attempted to fly the 14 bis in 1906, the Wright Brothers had already built and flown three different heavier-than-air flying machines: 1) The 1903 Flyer, which Took off under its own power and flew 852 feet (260 m) in 59 seconds. 2) The 1904 Flyer, which Took off under its own power and was the first heavier-than-air craft to fly in a complete circle as well as covering a distance of 4,080 feet during the same flight. Aviation pioneer Octave Chanute Observed many of the Flyer's 2 flights. 3) The 1905 Flyer, which Took off under its own power and flew a distance of twenty-four miles, including circular several maneuvers. The Flyer was Also the world's first aircraft capable of carrying a passenger.
Some commission saw it? Or just friends and close people to the Wrights ?
Put here any proof about any Wright brothers flight before 1908.
If you have faith, then do not need to find any proof.
@@sanpol4399 Still waiting for proof that the mythical phantom tentatively identified as Alberto Santos DuMont never existed! The myth of Santos Dumont was fabricated by the corrupt government of a third world country to compensate for their inadequate national identity. This explains why no one from this sad little country can present clear, compelling proof that Santos Dumont ever existed--because he didn't.
@@sanpol4399 Here's your proof of santos-dumont's fish tacos right here:
www.yelp.com/biz/mariscos-el-mazate%C3%B1o-tijuana-3?osq=Fish+Tacos
@@sanpol4399 I've already shown you proof of santa-dumont's amazing fish tacos.
@@sanpol4399 "Put here any proof about any Wright brothers flight before 1908." Silly boy, I don’t need to show you anything because the Aero Club of America, Aero Club de France, the Federation Aeronautique Internatioinale, Octave Chenault, Ferdinand Ferber, and the French Government all certified the Wrights as having flown in 1903. The December 1905 and January 1906 issues of L'Aerophile documented the Wrights' successful flights at Kitty Hawk, North Carolina and Dayton, Ohio. In point of fact, it was L'Aerophile's reportage of the Wrights that motivated Santos Dumont to cease experimentation with lighter-than-air aircraft and instead concentrate on heavier-than-air aircraft. Why do you accuse the French of lying? Why do you hate France?
About the brothers Wright... Flying in Kansas until Dorothy Gale flew!
man, it just keeps getting worse.
Anyone have doubt that Dumont was the real inventor of airplaine? only a stupid, i mean american, thinks this. He just not invented the first real airplane, He was responsible for all development in aviation, if you nowadays can fly in jets etc, give him thanks .
Just because he was "the first" to fly an airplane in Paris does NOT mean he was the inventor of an airplane!! Dumont was seeking glory and fame, copied lots of airplane features from many other aficionados at the time, and still had no "controls". The Bros were businessmen and were seeking money, contracts, and had already PATENTED the first airplane that flew (not glided) !! After a patent and contract with the US Army, then the Bros started to show what they had invented with CONTROLS to fly!!
And he was the first to do It right , an airplane that could propel it self with it's own power , and like the Chad Drumond is he latter went to shit on Wright Brother's design on how bad It was
i'll always remember a sb
Flight has many fathers ...
When Santos Dumont attempted to fly the 14-bis in 1906, the Wright Brothers had already built and flown three different heavier-than-air flying machines: 1) the 1903 Flyer, which Took off under its own power and flew 852 feet (260 m) in 59 seconds, 2) the 1904 Flyer, which Took off under its own power and was the first heavier-than-air craft to fly in a complete circle as well as covering a distance of 4,080 feet during the same flight. Aviation pioneer Octave Chanute Observed many of the Flyer's 2 flights, and 3) the 1905 Flyer, which Took off under its own power and flew a distance of twenty-four miles, including circular several maneuvers. The Flyer was Also the world's first aircraft capable of carrying a passenger. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
NASA proved in 2003 that this did not happen.
Withouth proofs.
nope
Hj todas as criaçoes semelhantes a dos wrightt nao se sustentam no ar ja as replicas do 14 bis voam sem serem catapultados.
You are mistaken. I encourage you to do some genuine research.
neither was Clement Ader's father "avion"
When Santos Dumont attempted to fly the 14-bis in 1906, the Wright Brothers had already built and flown three different heavier-than-air flying machines: 1) the 1903 Flyer, which Took off under its own power and flew 852 feet (260 m) in 59 seconds, 2) the 1904 Flyer, which Took off under its own power and was the first heavier-than-air craft to fly in a complete circle as well as covering a distance of 4,080 feet during the same flight. Aviation pioneer Octave Chanute Observed many of the Flyer's 2 flights, and 3) the 1905 Flyer, which Took off under its own power and flew a distance of twenty-four miles, including circular several maneuvers. The Flyer was Also the world's first aircraft capable of carrying a passenger.😁😁😁😁😁
OFFICIAL proofs, please.
There is no evidence of flights.
@@gilberto2056 Of course there is evidence. Just not the kind of evidence
that you want.
You want it free. The Wrights were not interested in providing it unless you were
willing to bet $35,000 that they couldn't meet or exceed any performance objectives
that you might want.
I think you want evidence of a flight of 100 m. (Roughly 100 yds. or the length of a
football field.). The Wrights would call a flight of 100 m to be a mere HOP.
The 14-bis probably flew over 220 m. but there is no incontestable evidence for
this. There is only incontestable proof that they did not touch the ground for
100 m. By flying 200 m, they proved that the 14-bis had flown at least 100 m.
and deserved the prize.
Here's a small sampling of reportage devoted to the Wrights' flights during 1903-1905: *"Airship Flight is a Success," The San Francisco Call, December 18, 1903, Page 1, Image 1, col. 7. *"A Machine that Flies," The Times Dispatch (Richmond, VA)0, December 19, 1903, Page 5, Image 5, col. 1. *"High Gale No Bar to Flying Machine," The Washington Times (Washington, DC), December 19, 1903, Page 10, Image 10, col. 1" *"Airship was a Great Success: The Wright brothers Give Out a Statement Regarding Their Recent Experiments," The Minneapolis Journal (Minneapolis, MN), January 5, 1904, Page 1, Image 1, col. 1. *"Ohio Inventors Claim Success in Flight," The Washington Times (Washington, DC), January 7, 1904, Page 3, Image 3, col. 4. "*A Machine that Flies: The Wright Brothers Declare that They Have Solved the Problem of Navigating the Air," The Watchman and Southern (Sumter, SC), January 13, 1904, Page 7, Image 7, col. 3. *"Flying machine that Flies," The San Francisco Call, (San Francisco, CA), October 9 1904, Page 13, Image 13, col 5-7. I could continue for another one hundred pages, but I've made my point. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Where's the official records with photos. The lies written by them and friends were not accepted.
My point, present here one of these reports with photo and photo from the newspaper. And justify why they did not present the machine to trademarks and patents.
This is Wright lies.
They were not comproving, just news speaking about the rumors, since the Wright brothers didnt let anyone see their project
After all I have seen and the way the wright brothers acted regarding the invention of flying aircrafts by Alberto Santos Dumont, his death became in doubt and should be investigated by Serious Brazilian Authorities.
Suicide in a hotel room by a man who loved life and adventures does not match in this case!
Too much interest in his invention!
The death of Alberto Santos Dumont was not a suicidal event!!!!
So, the Wright brothers killed Santos-Dumont. Too much interest in the 14bis (bird of prey)? I can honestly say that this is stupidest opinion on first flight I have ever read.
The Aero Club de France, the Aero Club of America, the Federation Aeronautique Internatioinale, Octave Chanute, Ferdinand Ferber, and the French Government all certified the Wrights as having flown in 1903. The December 1905 and January 1906 issues of L'Aerophile documented the Wrights' successful flights at Kitty Hawk, North Carolina and Dayton, Ohio. In point of fact, it was L'Aerophile's reportage of the Wrights that motivated Santos Dumont to cease experimentation with lighter-than-air aircraft and instead concentrate on heavier-than-air aircraft.🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
The nasa to prove that they did not FLY. See for yourself, with your eyes. The Nasa proved this against the Wright😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁
i.imgur.com/a2dDCpC.jpg
This the 14-bis propeller. There's no way it flew with this propeller. This and the 1906 Pathé footage proves the 14-bis accomplished nothing more than an uncontrolled hop. Pictures don't lie. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Forget it, NASA proved they didn't FLY😆😆😆😆😆😆😆😆😆
Nasa didn't lie either. The Wrights WON'T FLY 😆 😆😆😆😆
2003 Centennial don't lie.😆😆😆😆
Don't ever mention the Mongolfier Brothers, Clément Ader or Santos-Dumont to an American.
Why not? They are all mentioned in the large Wright Brothers web sites.
e.g. wright-brothers.org,
en.wikipedia.org › wiki › Wright_brothers
There are a couple of others.
The Montgolfier Brothers and Santos-Dumont were not just pioneers, they were the greatest innovators when it came to lighter than air, aircraft. Santos-Dumont's light airplane Demoiselle was pretty cool but flew after the basic ideas of flight were understood. His 14bis (bird of prey) was obsolete before the engine was ever started. Clement Ader was a fraud.
@@raymondjensen4603 Not sure about being a fraud... and in fact, the word "aviation" derives from Ader's "Avion" prototype.
@@ChuckMarteau You're in good company, Octave Chanute at one point intended to buy the wreckage and bring it to America to restore and further develop it. His idea to "steer" the craft by controlling the propeller thrust from side to side was one he shared with Whitehead, something we know today could not possibly work, in fact would destabilize the craft. His claims and witnesses also seemed to fall apart after his death. He was a serious man, and respected, man, but I'm not sure he was an honest man. I have not investigated Ader as deeply as others, so if you have a reference, I will take a look at it.
Suck it US.he flew above Ground with his own power,in Paris.
The Aero Club de France, the Aero Club of America, the Federation Aeronautique Internatioinale, Octave Chanute, Ferdinand Ferber, and the French Government all certified the Wrights as having flown in 1903. The December 1905 and January 1906 issues of L'Aerophile documented the Wrights' successful flights at Kitty Hawk, North Carolina and Dayton, Ohio. In point of fact, it was L'Aerophile's reportage of the Wrights that motivated Santos Dumont to cease experimentation with lighter-than-air aircraft and instead concentrate on heavier-than-air aircraft.🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
NASA proved that this did not happen.
gringos admitted that invented the airplane was Santos Dumont 🇧🇷
If they did, then what is the complaint?
no homie and just a fact that no gringo accepts
@@tapotente6130
SB: Your comment does not answer my question.
I would argue that 30% will accept the argument that before
1908 the Wrights did not provide indisputable proof that they were the first to fly. There is also no indisputable proof of the
the usual Brazilian counter-argument. Are you using two different standards?
What is in dispute is the whether or not the accounts of aviation historians are more plausible than
the argument that the Wrights were lying and it was all a sham or hoax.
I was an electrical engineer for Allison turboprops and spent time in Brazil working with the Brazilian space agency before becoming a college professor. What is your background?
@TP: "Gringos said that Santos Dumont invented the airplane."
Where is the evidence?
Can you provide a link to the quote?
Most people accept the empirical evidence that the 14-bis flew over 100 m. in 1906.
Winning a contest in an airplane, however, is not the same as inventing the airplane.
Statements about who was the first to invent something is usually not a fact.
It may be a statement supported by facts related to a clear explanation of what it means to invent.
GRINGO (slang)
Among Latin Americans, gringo is a term for a "foreigner," often a white person from the United States.
It can also refer to a person who doesn't speak Spanish or is out of touch with Latin culture, including people of Hispanic descent. (Dictionary.com).
@@stevebett4947 pra que esse texto todo lek
The North Americans may have been the first to fly, but Santos Dummont invented the plane. The Flyer of 1903 was not a plane at all.
You have that backwards.
A madman invented a costume and said that with him he would fly. He threw himself from the top of the eiffel tower and actually flew, before he smashed to the ground. If Brother Right flew with something thrown by a catapult and they said that they invented the airplane then the madman invented the jetman.
Só falta as provas, enquanto isso S.Dumont first!!!
Wal Zayit os anos passam e nada das provas, hehe.
O primeiro a voar um avião foi Santos Dumont. O resto são apenas falácias.
The Americans used a catapult Flight more was not an appropriate flight, and it did not work, and that is not flying, Santos Dumont has already started flying like today's airplanes.
Ahhhh yes, the great Brazilian delusion.
"delusion" ... Projecting much my guy ?
Shut up
@@megaoof7184 Hardly. Wrights were flying for 3 years before Dumont made his first flight.
Santos Dumont the father of aviation
And the bullet man? He was NASA's first rocket
@Açúcar Chocolate
wrote:
The WB did not fly in France in 1907-8 because they had no engines.
The new 1906 Wright vertical 4 had to be proportionally heavier than their 2 old engines.
Only the engine building genius of Santos Dumont would enable someone to double the power of an engine without doubling the weight
@
Gilberto Nedel Junior wrote:
The failure to fly at the 2003 Centennial proves they couldn't fly
The first NASA wind tunnel test proves the Flyer could not fly.
SB: The Dec. 17, 2003 failure only proves that the Flyer could not fly without a strong headwind.
It the exact replica did fly on two test flights before Dec. 17.
@luiz wrote:
Santos Dumont tem uma carreira inegável de gênio e inventor bem diferente dos Wrigth ,
que nada comprovaram. Santos Dumont was a great inventor and a genius. The Wrights were neither.
Santos proved flight was possible, The Wrights proved nothing.
SB:
Perhaps this will generate some comments.
@Steve Bett
Açúcar Chocolate
wrote: The Wrights did not FLY because they had no engines to fly. In the wright period
the engine block weighed a lot, consequently, the greater the power of the engine, the greater its weight.
The genius of Brazilian, ALBERTO SANTOS DUMONT, was so great that he could transform the 25 hp antoinette engine into a lighter and more powerful engine generating 50 hps (This is a historical fact).
SB: In the case of the bis-14, he unbolted the 25 hp engine that was not powerful enough for a long hop
and installed an off the shelf 50hp Antoinette 8V. This certainly was a contribution to aviation since it was it was copied by at least 4 other aviation pioneers. When they installed the engine on their prototype they could duplicate the hop made by the 14-bis in 1906. To to say it was evidence of genius is counter-factual misinformation. There are better examples.
SB: comments welcomed.
@Açúcar Chocolate
SB: Have you read Lins de Barros articles?
The Brazilian physicist wrote a
paper circa 2000 that made the case for Santos Dumont without the use of misinformation
and conspiracy theories. I will send you the link if you haven't. Just ask for it.
None of the claims of the Wrights are indisputable or beyond doubt.
This is because they were not witnessed and certified by the FAI.
That was not even possible before 1905.
Some of the flights were witnessed by members of the American
Aero Club but that would not count. They were not French and they
were not official witnesses.
The second kind of doubt is with respect to flights that seem too incredible to be accurate. That applies only to the 873 ft. 4th and final flight of Wilbur Wright. I can't prove that it didn't happen but I don't think the Wrights proved that it did.
AC: "the greater the power of the engine, the greater its weight"
SB: Before you speculate on the weight of the 1906 Dayton engine, read up on it. The 1906 Vertical 4 was not any heavier than the 2 earlier engines the Wrights used from 1903 to 1905, but it produced almost double the horsepower.
Google Wright vertical 4.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wright_Vertical_4
weight: 160-180 lbs. (70-80 kg)
power: 28 hp. at 1325 rpm
42 hp at 1500 rpm *31 kw
AC: Santos Dumont "...was so great that he could transform the 25 Hp antoinette engine into a lighter & more powerful engine generating 50 hps."
SB: So Santos could do this but not the Wrights. Where is the evidence?
Santos Dumont had no role in the design and production of the
Antoinette engines.
He did switch from a 25 hp engine to a
50 hp Antoinette 8V (209 lb) engine when it became available in 1906.
Wikipedia also has an article on the Antoinette engines.
They were designed and built by Leon Levavasseur
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antoinette_8V
SD made a number of contributions to aviation. This is not one of them.
There are better examples of his genius.
What is the source of your "historical facts"?
In Portuguese (the sources are also available in Portuguese)
produção do
Motores Antonieta.
Ele mudou de um motor de 25 hp para um
Motor Antoinette 8V de 50 hp (209 lb) quando ficou disponível em 1906.
A Wikipedia também tem um artigo sobre os motores Antoinette.
Eles foram projetados e construídos por Leon Levavasseur
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antoinette_8V
SD fez uma série de contribuições para a aviação. Este não é um deles.
Há melhores exemplos de sua genialidade.
Qual é a fonte de seus "fatos históricos"?
Proud of you Brazil 🇧🇷💐greetings from Brazil.
The Aero Club de France, the Aero Club of America, the Federation Aeronautique Internatioinale, Octave Chanute, Ferdinand Ferber, and the French Government all certified the Wrights as having flown in 1903. The December 1905 and January 1906 issues of L'Aerophile documented the Wrights' successful flights at Kitty Hawk, North Carolina and Dayton, Ohio. In point of fact, it was L'Aerophile's reportage of the Wrights that motivated Santos Dumont to cease experimentation with lighter-than-air aircraft and instead concentrate on heavier-than-air aircraft.🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
NASA did not lie. A perfect replica of the flyer was built, but it didn't fly. In other words, Wright brothers did not fly.
Who flew first in a legit plane? If in the rules an airplane is only a heavier-than-air vehicle that can fly, then this is an airplane, even using outside help like catapults, as the Wright Brothers did, then the Wright brothers made the airplane first, but if in the rules an airplane needs to be a lighter-than-air vehicle, that can fly, but being fully autonomous, without needing external help such as catapults, then Santos Dumont created the first airplane.
There are no rules, only the subjective definitions of various groups and individuals. This is why _official_ recognition of who flew first is meaningless. And you misunderstand the role of a catapult, because it only affects takeoff distance, and is unrelated to self-sustaining flight.