The Designer Debate: Balenciaga vs. Givenchy
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 12 เม.ย. 2021
- Cristóbal Balenciaga and Hubert de Givenchy are two designers that face constant comparison, but each have made their mark on the history of fashion in their own right. This video explores the Balenciaga vs. Givenchy debate further 💙
Website: www.henryjjwilkinson.com
Instagram: @henryjjwilkinson
I’m more interested in how these designers became the corporate brands they are today. That’s the mystery I haven’t really found the answer to. How you get from Balenciaga’s 1960’s designs to Cardi B admiring the shoes that look like socks? It’s such a departure, and for somebody not really into fashion pretty baffling.
Exactly. It's like listening Pink Floyd in the 2020 with Bad Bunny as leader of the band...
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Once founders make a huge company and die, everything turns left. When they started it, we got to see THEIR creativity. It’s not belanciaga’s ideas and he would be in distraught too. But now it feels like fashion tries to be unique and different when fashion artist back then was because of their creativity and using their own lens. Some of these designer fashions are truly ridiculous.
@@lemonscenic6207 you should watch Halston on Netflix! So well done and fascinating.
Shows you that designers have allllways been searching for a unique style of their own
@Jay McKenzie Thank you! I will definitely be watching!
it's weird to see someone put Givenchy as in rivalry with Balenciaga, because people who follow the history will know that Givenchy is mentored and loved by Balenciaga. I never see them to be a head to head comparison, instead I always see Givenchy as a protégé of Balenciaga.
Thank you for the wonderful video, love your calm and soothing presentation and explanation.
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It’s unfortunate that people don’t know about how close Givenchy and Balenciaga were. I never think of them as “competitors”. They had similar aesthetics (especially in Balenciaga’s most innovative years in the 60s), but there was a level of austerity in Balenciaga’s work that wasn’t in Givenchy’s.
They were very, close these two. To say they were competitors is so far from the truth. Balenciaga's work was very austere indeed yes.
Hmmm....so basicaly:
Balenciaga Fanatics: HE'S THE BEST!!!!!!
Givenchy Fanatics: NO, HE'S EVEN BETTER!!!!!!
Balenciage & Givenchy from afar: 😑😑😑😑😑😑
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Respectfully, any aficionado with an 👁 for style and structure should be able to see the close kinship between these two brilliant designers, as so clearly set out in this presentation. Question: Would you consider it worthwhile to discuss the place of Halston in the context of the style of ‘chic and glamorous’ which aforementioned couturiers share? 🕊
Of course people know..Same fabric- different style.
"Having a favorite does not warrant demeaning other people's ideas nor preferences" Well said!
Perhaps it is an urban myth; but I once read that when Balenciaga closed his house, Mrs. Paul (Bunny) Mellon asked him who should do her clothes going forward and Mr. Balenciaga walked her across the street to Givenchy. And a great friendship was formed between Mrs. Mellon and Hubert de Givenchy.
Sorry', I should have begun with mentioning what a fascinating video this is.
That story is very much true! Many of the wonderful seamstresses from Balenciaga also went to Givenchy after the house closed.
Givenchy was the lighter, smoother, cleaner stricter look with hints of whimsy. Balenciaga ran towards the theatrical featuring a more animated presentation with unusual shapes. Both were highly successful with enormous contribution.
Producing a thoughtful video is difficult--especially one that's thoroughly researched such as this one. On top of that, one that has a nice aesthetic and finely edited. But man... Henry, you've got to make more videos. I'm dying waiting for your new upload!
So pleased you enjoyed it, thank you! Stay tuned for more 💙
@@henryjjwilkinson Can't wait. You don't know how many times I rewatched your videos just to satisfy my needs... Ok, that sounds weird. But I'm pretty normal otherwise 😂. I guess the reason people want other to agree with their choices is down to getting approval and validation. And I admit, it's nice when people agree with your opinion. It's the press who often pit one another into a rivalry. If things are all peaceful and hunky dory, where's the story in that. And they have a paper to sell.
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Just post a video of you pronouncing his name on a loop “Hubert de Givenchy”.... love it
Very sad that now balenciaga is known to the general public as some "high fashion streetwear" brand :(
Givenchy as well. Sad times for fashion
That’s true
People don’t care. As long as wearing these brands gave them the advantage/upper hand in social interaction, it’s ok. People buy these to serve their own social purpose.
@@uropy I buy it cause I like how it looks
@@uropy because nobody could ACTUALLY enjoy innovative designs and challenging the norm right? I think what ruins fashion is people being so judgey instead of focusing on their own style and what they like.
Oh the joy of wondering if Henry has posted another video and seeing one pop up as fast as the thought it your head!
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Before this video, I only knew the two names as fashion designers that were only relevant to me via their perfumes. I’m in awe. Oh my gosh, and that cape at the end! Even with my fashion ignorant eyes, I’m blown away.
One small detail : The origin of Cristobal Balenciaga was in Spain not in Paris.
Because his mother had a couturier store or something like that in Pais Vasco (Spain) and him from childhood help her.
Great video
Great video. I agree 100%. Whoever states that Givenchy won’t be remembered in the history of fashion must have been born in the nineties or early 2000’s. He was one of the most exquisite creators of the 20th century. Who cares what fashionistas wannabe geniuses opine when in the end Balenciaga himself turned his clients to Givenchy when he retired. Givenchy earned the respect and admiration of Balenciaga and that’s the only opinion that matters.
As far as that same fabric used by other designers Givenchy’s take for the Funny Face gown is hands down the most modern and more flattering of them all. Those images at the en of the 1967 Givenchy collection are often featured as Balenciaga’s ironically.
2:42 mins in, you are so classy and articulate and your opinions and information are proclaimed with grace. I wish more TH-camrs were as intelligent and respectful as yours 🙏🏼 🇦🇺 xx
Thank you! So pleased you enjoyed it 💙
You offered a balanced and intelligent perspective on both designers. I personally believe that both gentlemen were genius in their execution, and I cannot say which I prefer more. However, I do have a soft spot for the English-American designer, Charles James. Also, I want to thank you for including Edie Biel Bouvier in this vlog. She had her own idiosyncratic sense style.
Charles James was just wonderful. Such fascinating shapes and construction techniques! 💙
Amazing video. My school teacher African American mom was a huge Givenchy fan. We couldn’t afford Haute Couture but she bought his RTW and wore it like HC. She also made his design at home on her Singer sewing machine. Thank you for a good and warm memory of my “overdressed to teach 1st graders” mother.
Thank you for this informative video.
fashion lineage is so amazing, to think that giambattista valli who was mentored by ungaro who was then mentored by balenciaga and then you trace their aesthetic and creative tendencies its so fascinating.
Or like how Jean Paul Gaultier was trained by Pierre Cardin, who himself learned the trade of the couturier from Elsa Schiaparelli and later in Christian Dior’s atelier.
In 1964, my grandmother, an excellent seamstress, copied from a store window, a white cotton piqué Givenchy dress for me to wear for school promotion. Boat neckline, piped waistline, inverted front pleat on a tulip skirt, all edged with narrow cotton Swiss Venice lace. It was a stunningly simple dress that was so chic and elegant, all for a 12 year old girl! I still have that dress, worn so long ago, which made me feel incredibly sophisticated and grown up. Givenchy designs always framed the person wearing it. His fabrics were flawless, accenting the movement of the wearer. None like him now, when couture is largely a joke.
I love to hear nuanced, informed viewpoints rather than hyperbolic, oppositional proclamations. This is a beautiful essay. Well done.
One of the gifts Mr Wilkinson kindly gives is to the imagination - I can see myself wearing so many of these exquisite designs! Then the gentle insights of the designers' worlds. I find these videos most interactive, even if the action is all mental.
What a wonderful comment to read! So pleased you enjoyed it 💙
When you’ve been in China for too long, all you’ll think of when you hear “balenciaga” are plain t-shirts with the brand name printed somewhere on the front and those sock shoes :(
Yes! You just reminded me of the time I was stuck in an airport in Shanghai watching this 19 year old Chinese kid with his givenchy bucket hat, balenciaga t-shirt, supreme belt bag, sitting on his rimowa luggage with his dior high tops. smh.
For me it was always Givenchy. He had style, class and a great sense of a woman's femininity.
Agreed!
🥰Thank you Henry! I found it fascinating that 4 important designers all chose the same fabric to use in their collection! 🥰 (Givenchy’s interpretation was my favorite😊)
Thank you for watching Maria! 💙
Absolutely love your videos I'm so glad to know I'm not the only fashion fanatic on this planet hahah
A wonderful clarity describing the gifts and genius of both designers. Thank you ❤️
Thank Henry for a lovely Tuesday morning with my tea. Balenciaga and Givenchy met in the 50s in New York. Their friendship was a wonderful one which is rare in fashion. Balenciaga liked Givenchy and mentored him.
I love your channel and look forward to your stories.
fascinating. My great grandfather was a civil engineer from Russia-he became a pattern maker for Balenciaga among other designers of his time. Love learning more about him.
Henry your channel is such an amazing collage of information! New subbie here and I am so glad I stumbled upon your channel. Such an interesting young man you are. Cheers!
Thank you for another well researched and entertaining video! I love finding a new video essay .
I got the Givenchy bug when my parents bought that outrageous Lincoln with his name on it. My mom wanted the Dior but dad won and got it green, the color of money he’d say (I grew up in Wyoming...
When I was going to school anf working at a boutique bank in the city, I would spend hours at the high end consignment shops on Madison. My wardrobe budget went a lot farther if I could find worn suits and tailor them myself. And I was always drawn to his suits. Idk how much he actually did on his menswear, but they fit my square body perfectly.
I also studied millinery while in the Navy, and opened up a hat shop there. But you know hats, they’re always coming back in style, yet never do...
And my best friend bought me a pair of Givenchy sneakers. Outrageous, but they do feel wonderful. I think it’s a gay trait; we are drawn to the most expensive in the store!
Long winded, just a thanks. Oh, did you study any design? I studied architecture, but good design is good design. Did you or do you ever design clothes?
Tyia
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Finally the content I been looking for ❤️😍
Beautiful video very educative as well ❤️ Greetings from a small Himalayan Kingdom in Asia ... Bhutan 🙏❤️
Thank you Henry...great video! 🇦🇺🦘 greetings from Australia!
Thank you, you put so much work to create this video for us ❤️🙌🏼
this video is so well-researched. thank you for the information!
Production and voiceover were also really well-done.
And I also appreciate your perspective of accepting art from all artists and respecting individual preferences.
Thank you! So pleased you liked it 💙
Henry your videos are so great- I am enjoying and learning from every one! And you have reawakened my love for Givenchy and Audrey-I am so glad I found you!! :)
Love love love your videos. Please keep them coming.❤👌👏
I will always hold all of these designers in the highest regard, but for sure my favourite will be Balenciaga. However, I never understood why Balenciaga is pitted against Givenchy. Also wasnt Balenciaga also Givenchy’s teacher at some point? Anyway, the way I see it is that Givenchy was sort of a continuation of Balenciaga’s work or rather someone who built upon and continued to innovate upon Balenciaga’s pieces.
Also love ur stubble roast on the haters.
ranking creators in any field is so irritating to me
A very well thought out & argued presentation. Bravo 🙌🏻
Thank you!
Such a beautiful and insightful video essay. More please!
I want more videos from you, what a voice, what a knowledge about fashion. Loved it!
So excited to see a new video from you. Fantastic!
DUE grandi artisti hanno lasciato nel mondo della moda un segno indelebile di classe ,eleganza,innovazione,gusto nel fare apparire le donne sempre perfette le vestivano non le travestivano esaltando in ogni loro creazione il corpo delle donne.Dopo il loro ritiro il diluvio a parte qualche eccezione gli altri hanno contribuito a riempire il mondo di stracci inutili che hanno mortificato molte volte le donne senza esaltare la loro bellezza.Il bello per loro era tutto si notava in ogni singola creazione capolavori unici che rimarranno per sempre nella storia della moda.
I love the masters as well, I studied fashion and have always gravitated towards the classic lines, elegant fabrics. I have always admired both Balenciaga and Givenchy. Also Valentino, De La Renta, Coco Chanel, Lagerfeld. I also like a little flash, like Mackie, and Versace
Wow, just discovered your videos, I’m in love !😍
What an excellent video. Your perspective is quite refreshing. All these designers have something different to offer their creations, but the illustration you made about how the greats have collaborated and even tutored the next generation of designers is spot on, as seen in the examples provided. In addition, I have to say, your video quality (content, editing, sound) are top notch. We are looking forward to seeing more videos soon. ✨ Personally, I too prefer Givenchy's clean, classic lines.
Always enjoy your presentations and background history of content. I must admit though, I miss a glimpse or cameo of your smile and beautiful bright blue eyes.
I love your channel!!
I could say thank you a million times! This was an excellent piece.
Balenciaga would be very very disappointed in whats in his shop today. SMH
Or would he be pleased that his brand is still running strong in 2021.
Those black slip on sneakers are everywhere and permeated pop culture. That’s a legacy. 💯
Mentorship is a gift, for both parties, and an underrated skill in our more isolated and selfish artistic and cultural climate. I wish more people understood that
Givenchy's silhouettes are still relevant and frequently referenced today, they're timeless and chic.
Found another good fashion YTer! Subscribed!
This is a very well researched and presented video, and one that helps me develop an appreciation for Givenchy. I have long been in the camp that regards him as a designer of pretty, ladylike fashions that lack a strong point of view. I now understand that he was working deliberately on a particular palette of ideas that he refined gradually. It is clear from your comparisons that Givenchy kept his focus on his clients' needs. In most of the direct comparisons, I agree that the Givenchy version was cleaner and likely to flatter more women. Balenciaga could sometimes over-conceptualize. If I were to think of a pair of analogous American designers, I would offer Geoffrey Beene and Oscar de la Renta. Beene was the creative master, concerned with making designs light, seamless and geometric. De la Renta was concerned with making women look pretty.
I thoroughly enjoyed this, thank you!
love your editing
Thank you for a beautifully written and narrated video. So insightful.
Wonderful video!!!! I totally agree with everything here. Many designers in the history of fashion had contributed something worthy, all of which added to the richness and diversity of that history... People forget that Givenchy first made his name in the Haute Couture with separates for evening that could be mixed or matched;- something that is so commonplace in modern dressing now, but was a revelation back in those days of head-to-toe Couture. Even though people of course will have favourites, It is very narrow minded- even quite ignorant!- to think only one of those talents counted. I'm also so glad that you showed that an essential part of their creativity was the dialogue they had with each other, and their generosity in imparting their knowledge and ideas to the following generation. They were all intelligent enough to realize that this only helped to foster and develop everyone's creative talents, which in turn would benefit fashion itself. Sure, there was rivalry and competition... that exists to this day! But creativity can never exist in a vacuum.
Madeleine Vionnet was a genius also. Her clever construction techniques were avant-garde and became hugely influential on fashion design that followed.
Love this video!
Wow, your attention to detail is remarkable. I truly enjoyed every minute. Thank you.
Thank you for watching, Kristin! 💙
I just watched Balenciaga's new TV series on Disney+. Very interesting very very well done and there they refer to this friendship. Personally they are 2 of my favorite couturiers. If poor Balenciaga saw what they do these days with his name. I would go back to the grave.
I loved the series! The way they portrayed their relationship, and just how much Hubert admired him, was wonderful.
Again I enjoy your knowledge of design and designers thank you so much
What a great video. And let us not forget that non only they were friends, but when Balenciaga closed his atelier, he introduced to Givenchy all his clients, including Bunny Mellon etc...
Great video!
Stellar video once again.
This was fantastic ✨
What a fantastic video and topic! Yes, there are many unknown clothes makers all around the world that nobody knows about them and create wonderful garments. Many times clothes when are copied are also improved, many times as the process of coping happens a change in the way of doing things take place. Prime example was given once by Dolce & Gabbana who have seen copies of their designs done even better than the one they made. Funny how both houses Balenciaga and Givenchy still exist yet the new creative teams have had to make it profitable and relevant for todays world and market.
I like to believe popularly known rivalries like armani and versace, Schiaparelli and Chanel and many more were just popularized by the media and the designers were probably laughing about this in real life
Not Armani and Versace, they did go at each other in the wildest possible way
I love this video, thank you
I appreciate your presentation. I know many who don't understand or appreciate Hi End Fashion. Trying to be patient!
Going through Givenchy's archives online, I found a fantastic photo taken by Hiro Wakabayashi in 1967, it looks so modern ! Sometimes I find it quite hard to tell the difference between a look by Hubert de Givenchy, Cristobal Balenciaga, Yves Saint Laurent ... And at the end of the day, it doesn't really matter, if it looks good !
Thank you for this clear and sensitive statement! Like you, I admire Balenciaga's works (for sometimes, they seem like arts and crafts) and his distinctive style. I see Givenchy as an interpretor, giving his clientele an impeccable, elegant look. It always leads to the question: what is elegant? I think, elegant is the art of knowing how to wear a fine couture work: on YSL it is said to need a very present, strong woman, aware of her feminity with a slight twist of rebellion. In a Balenciaga piece, you needed to have the inner power and souverenity: they sometimes were like a perfect, glittering shield against the world. In Givenchy, you knowed, you are dressed at the finest, but would need personality. New Couture clientele always needs some time to see who's best for them. I think, Givenchy was very dedicated to his clients and eager to please them: a sensitive interpretor. And I LOVE the colours of Givenchy!!! He knew about colours!
Well said Henry! I have great admiration for both designers, and as you say, each one for his own worth and contribution.
Fashion is so subjective. Thank you pointing this out. Although I love classic designers, my favorite designer is Armani...he learned his craft as a tailor's son. I really appreciate cut, tailoring and detail.
So very enjoyable, thank you.
It’s Givenchy for me..... much rather their design to that of balenciaga as of recent!
Lordt why did I found this channel now, when I said I am going to focus on my brand. Now I am about to binge watch all this damn videos 🥺🥺🥺❤️❤️😬😇☝🏼. Why do I like this mans voice behind the audio 🥴😆😆😆
Thankyou for this very thoughtful narrative, I always thought Givenchy had been a junior at Balenciaga,as were Ungaro and Courrèges and that is why the influence in his work was so strong at Givenchy, but yes they did have a very close relationship/ friendship/ mentorship..... to your point on the use of the floral fabric 'the who did it better challenge" I think at this level of couture perhaps we may need to look at who had the better collection or more innovative and cohesive collection. Thank you again and I am looking forward to seeing more of your work.
I love this video this is the fourth time I’ve watched.
Outstanding presentation!
I'm a big YSL fan, but it's his 1960s through his late 1970s Russian collection that do it for me.
I agree. I don't think of YSL as an "80s designer," as is suggested here. By the 80s, YSL had largely stopped innovating and was operating in an "elder statesman" capacity, recrafting beautiful iterations of his masterly cut suits and dresses in beautiful colors. I think his greatest period is the 60s and 70s, especially his famous 1940s-inspired collection. I do agree with Henry that the 80s just don't do it for me!
@@nycp1969 I really think the Russian inspired collection from the mid-late 1970s was his last GREAT collection. By the 1980s, you're absolutely right, he's spinning his wheels a bit.
@@fabrisseterbrugghe8567 I'm not a big fan of the Russian and Chinese collections. I don't think they advanced fashion esthetically or in terms of fabrication, although you might say they anticipated the opulence of the 1980s. What's interesting is that YSL actually had Russian looks in his Rive Gauche line several years earlier. For much of the 70s, Rive Gauche was where his most creative ideas originated.
@@nycp1969 Yes, YSL was a big follower, and leader, of street style and got it back to the older generation. I remember buying Rive Gauche perfume in Paris before it was available in the US. As far as fabrication goes, one of the points of the Russian collection, if I'm remembering 50 year old Vogues correctly, was to show the skills that were being lost and create a new demand for them.
@@fabrisseterbrugghe8567 That I don't know. I just think that YSL was extremely artistic and took inspiration and appreciation from everywhere. He could appropriate anything into fashion, usually masterfully but other times less successfully. I learned a great deal about him from the FIT Museum's 2015 exhibition YSL + Halston: Fashioning the 70s, a thrilling exhibition comparing the two designers' output during this decade. You can see the entire exhibit on the museum's website or buy the comprehensive book for a reasonable price on Amazon.
What a wonderful video - thank you.
What a beautiful and informative essay. Thank you.
wonderful comparison thank you
I loved the clip of the YSL show, d'you know where I can find more photos/videos of it?
Thank you for this wonderful comparison of two men of different times and origins and their tete a tete
Rivalries come and go as seasons and collections do. We are left, happily, with the brilliance of all these visionary artists. I do wish that more people also remember Jacques Fath.
Absolutely , a wonderful point of view 👑👏🏿👏🏿👏🏿🎩 On not only fashion but other forms of Art as well . I feel any Fashion Designer is to be respected and or loved ...for what they do ,their
vision. Rather it's agreed with or seen for that matter !
if Cristobal were to raise his head and see what they have done to his couture house, he would ask to be buried again but face down, so that he could not get up never again ....
Masterful analysis 👌
Can France stop appropriating things? *BALENCIAGA* was a SPANISH designer. He stablished his first shop in San Sebastian, Spain and his works for the Spanish Royal Family are famous worldwide.
What I don't understand is why OTHERS continue to use the designers name for their own designs.
I love all the Jacqueline Kennedy givenchy designs. I love them both. Don’t see them as competitors at all. I love the deceiving simplicity of givenchy lines. But they aren’t simple at all. That’s his deception.
@Vintage-Vintage stop it
Loved this video! I'd love to hear what you think about the evolution of both brands 🤔
Henry Wilkinson Thank you very much.
What a brilliant depiction on the topic by you. Thorough and while it's an opinion piece it's almost like a professional documentary.
You have the rare and wonderful ability of demonstrating diplomacy. I observe that many people have the tendency to engage, on a continuum (to a lesser or greater degree), in what psychologists call “splitting.” This is a psychological phenomenon whereby people have the urge to pit one person against another, to value one and devalue another, to choose sides. It’s an unconscious, primitive drive, born out of early emotional experiences. There’s also a component to splitting that’s evolutionary in nature - it was necessary to identify the “good object” because it meant survival, whereas the “bad object” meant potential danger. People tend to have the need to organize others and the world at large into “good” or “bad” in this primitive fashion (no pun intended!). You don’t often see people with your emotional maturity, which permits the holding of two “good objects” simultaneously.
In any case, I don’t know as much about Balenciaga’s work as I do Givenchy’s and found this video fascinating and enlightening. It’s nice to know about their friendship and the generosity the former/elder showed the latter/younger. Being kind, and witnessing kindness in others, always feels much nicer than the alternative. Personally, I sometimes fall into the primitive inclination of picking sides (splitting), but when I observe someone like you I’m reminded it’s not necessary.🌷
Beautifully presented.
Ha, found a new proper Fashion channel! Sehr guuuut! Grazie