mmm. I don't know, but I believe. I understand that belief does not have a good foundation, but believe anyhow would be a coherent position. Noone ever calls in and actually acknowledges that position.
When I was a child the christian community told me, that faith can move mountains. I gave it an heart felt try, and saw zero results. So, before I turned 6 I was completely unwilling to accept it. have a nice day.
I went to Christian schools thru 8th grade. I was the kid raising his hand and pointing out things like: "Wait... Adam and Eve didn't know the difference between right and wrong until AFTER they ate the fruit, but we are all sinners at birth due to their uninformed decision? God can speak a universe into existence, but he can't 'create' a fence around a tree? And why would he want them to remain ignorant?". The response was always an excuse... a lame justification... "We cannot understand the mind of God" or "The Lord works in mysterious ways". That's just the first chapter in the silly story of God's failures we call The Bible. The indoctrination didn't work on me. I would expect God to be smarter than I am... but apparently he isn't.
@@KeesKouwenberg The Priest: If you don't have faith, why are you in youth group and an altar boy and help out around here so much? Me: Honestly, because it makes my mom happy, the youth group leader is hot, and when you're not looking, I drink the wine.
@@KeesKouwenberg Well, Happy Birthday! I turned 64 in May. I was thinking this morning about the times I had the priest backed in a corner with a question or a bible contradiction he couldn't explain. His Olympic level mental gymnastics in response never made any sense to me. I'm pretty sure he hated me.
Could one religious person not tapdance around when questioned, be honest and say "I have no evidence to believe god exists" or say "I believe because I'm gullible", which is the position of EVERY religious person
@rbwinn3 We have a free life, not restricted by what you think god wants you to do. Nothing about religion is a positive to me. If god is real, he was responsible and could have stopped all the horrors throughout history. If he could have stopped them happening, but chose not to, he's nothing but a horrible entity who DESERVES zero praise or worship. He's a monster and is evil
Note that this thread contains several examples of folks supporting OP’s claim by failing to provide any convincing reason to believe in the existence of any god, gods or other divine or supernatural beings.
This call, in a nutshell: If you believe the claims, then they must be true. For this caller, the claim itself is all the evidence needed-no need for pesky things like facts or logical consistency. It’s like saying, “I’m convinced because I’m convinced,” and calling it a day. It’s a masterclass in circular reasoning, where the only evidence you need is your own conviction.
@@mattjindrak To whatever degree choice is involved, it's made under duress. Thankfully, trying to affirm my belief, actually reading the damn book, broke it beyond repair. Isaiah 45:7 is clear, God is not the good guy if he's behind everything good And evil. Once its moral authority was busted, i felt free to doubt and question. Andrew Seidel is right, the road to atheism is littered with bibles read cover to cover.
The idea that at one point gods were showing up, walking around, walking on water, making animals talk, etc and that this happens to coincide with a time that humans were ignorant of the scientific method, largely illiterate, superstitious, and largely consumed with concerns of survival and procreation is so ridiculous as to be utterly absurd.
The idea that the chirpy god of the OT is the same character as the absent father god in the NT is hilarious. I have absolutely no issue with how the NT pressed how people should treat one another. Connecting that back to the Bronze Age Palestinian god of judgement is really f*ckin rich though 😂
It isn't lost on me that the bible reads like it was written by MEN in the iron age... Women have no rights and, unless they're a virgin, no value either. The Christian faith is absurd from start to finish.
Indeed. As a child, I was a Roman Catholic. If I'd been born in Tel Aviv instead of where I was, I'd almost certaly have been Jewish as a child. Eventually I came to the position of "I'm told that god exists and knows everything and can do anything. If I make an assumption that god exists, then I have to conclude that either god doesn't know about huge numbers of events, or that god can't intervene, or that god is an asshole." Went from there to either god doesn't exist, or is impotent, or is an asshole and in all three cases, no point in being Roman Catholic anymore.
@@ngcastronerd4791 In order to present an original thought, he would first need the intelligence to formulate one. Then again, if he could think for himself, he wouldn't be calling in to the show and embarrassing himself.
I think I've discovered a new law: As the amount of evidence for a claim increases, the ability of a theist to cite one of those pieces of evidence decreases.
What would be a good name for this new law? Hmmm…how about “law of inverted rationality” or “law of reduced rationality”? If anyone has better, I’d like to hear it lol.
The frustration in listening callers of Tyler's ilk is their comments about "historical evidence" indicates they haven't a clue what hIstorical evidence actually is.
Lmaoo this argument reminds me of the Boondocks “there’s things we know we know, things we know we know we don’t know, also things we don’t know we don’t know.” 😂 The absent of evidence is not the evidence of absence.
If there was historical documentation about Jesus being god, it will officially terminate all other religions. From that point in time there will be no atheism, no Judaism, no Budism, nothing! we will all be Christians. What a ridiculous thing to say.
@@joshsheridan9511 absolutely. I hate the results of bombs, nevertheless I can't state I am not a science adept. You will be a different kind of christian. One who know there's a god and how he is, but who does not worship him. Because it won't be a belief, it would be a knowledge.
The problem with documentation is that it is hard to know the extent to which the views of the author coloured it. Sometimes it's hard to know what the actual purpose was. Galaxy Quest having an alien race mistake television for historical records was a great example.
It also depends on what you think a Christian actually is. We would probably all be theists but not really Christians, depending on what you would consider a Christian. Then there would probably still be atheists, because there would still be some that wouldn't accept the evidence. Also, with just taking what's said here, having factual data of Jesus being god outside of the bible doesn't necessarily prove the bible though. Jesus could be God and a lot of stuff about Jesus in the bible could be wrong. Then Jesus himself in the bible wasn't necessarily trying to create a new religion, he might still want people to be Jewish, and all he wanted was for Judaism to be what he considered was true. Jesus could be a real god and never actually "died" for our sins. This also wouldn't inherently disprove other theistic religions who believe in different gods, that would just be proof of gods existing not that no other gods exist.
The bible is true because it says in the bible that the bible is true. The claim in Chapter 1 Verse 2 is true because it says so in Chapter 3 Verse 4 Circular reasoning loves me, this I know, because Circular Reasoning tells me so. LOLZ
This show has the longest pauses of dead air. It happens when theists are asked a question that they immediately know the right answer to, but they have to think about how to word it in a way that doesn't expose their own assertions as either hypocritical or just plain wrong.
I have faith that this caller wants to say that atheists and theists use the same methods to come to their beliefs and will fail miserably in his presentation.
@@JimCastleberryIt’s a fallacy to give a huge amount of examples to overwhelm the other person. Only pick two of them (the two examples you’re the most sure we can’t have any reply), explain them in a few lines instead of just the name, and we will see if they are really evidence or not. If you avoid the question and not pick two of them, i’ll pick them myself and it will also show your dishonesty
Tyler has boarded a train, without a driver, conductor, a braking system, a destination, with one simple belief that it will take him to a promised land!
We should believe in God on faith because we don't know everything? GREAT! Does Tyler believe in Santa Claus, fairies, leprechauns, mermaids and unicorns on faith because he doesn't know everything? The CONTORTIONS of logic that theists are willing to use are just STAGGERING!
"I am primarily the creator of a new code of morality which has so far been believed impossible, namely a morality not based on faith, not on arbitrary whim, not on emotion, not on arbitrary edict, mystical or social, but on reason; a morality that can be proved by means of logic which can be demonstrated to be true and necessary. Now may I define what my morality is? Since man’s mind is his basic means of survival […] he has to hold reason as an absolute, by which I mean that he has to hold reason as his only guide to action, and that he must live by the independent judgment of his own mind; that his highest moral purpose is the achievement of his own happiness […] that each man must live as an end in himself, and follow his own rational self-interest." -Ayn Rand-
Why can theists just admit that they can not prove their belief ??? Their explanation is always based on FEELINGS !!! “I feel blah blah blah so is true” 😖
When people are surrounded by other people that are convinced of a religion, those people can and do also often become convinced of that religion. It happens with every religion and the results are similar - lives are changed. But all religions cannot be true as they make different claims. This means reasonably (if we want to believe true things) we must FIRST test any testable claims before accepting one of the religion's claims. If any claim is untestable, again we must wait for it to become testable and then test it BEFORE accepting any claim. Of course, if one's purpose for accepting the claim is for reasons OTHER than confirming the claim true (comfort, always been told, provides a sense of purpose, made me feel better when I was down, placates one's existential dread and fear of the unknown, etc.) - then to be honest, admit that, and then have fun with it, because the reason for accepting the claim is NOT because the claim is demonstrably true.
It would be refreshing if theists would just admit they do not know if their religion is true, but that they believe it because they benefit (feel better) from the belief. Tip: the moment it stops making you feel better, dump it, as there are other religions, or you can choose none.
That argument is promoted often. "The effect of belief in God is more important than whether the belief is true." Jpordan Peterson runs with that all the time, claiming that wihtout a belief in God, there would be no art, no literature, no philosophy, all because humans would lack a "metaphorical substrate." it's hilariously silly.
I’ve never met a theist who doesn’t fall victim to the following belief: “If I really want something to be true, then it must be true.” Every theist confuses desire for knowledge.
Columbus had the false belief that he could more easily get to India by sailing west across the Atlantic. That false belief had one of the most significant impacts on the world ever.
Tyler you're making Maryland look really stupid, and this with the poll yesterday that 26% of Kamala Harris's voter have decides to vote for Larry Hogan, it is asinine, voting for Harris while not giving her the Senate to do anything, I'm so pissed at my state right now
You just can’t spell theism correctly can you? “Theism is a denial of reason - the inability to reason through uncertainty.” You’re welcome Edith.
The impact of a crucifixion on my life was guilt and worried and concern that this would ever happen for me or in my name for things that I had not even done before I was born. That's gross manipulation to say I'd killed myself for you. And it's even grosser to say I killed my son for you. No thank you
@@adelMN2 i don't think that's the case. Speculations are rarely an acceptance of anything as true without proof. they are without proof, but they are not an acceptance of something as true. They wouldn't be speculations otherwise.
What Christians seem not to understand is that it does not matter whether Jesus ever existed, or not - and, here's why: If Jesus was a real person who actually lived upon the Earth, all we have left of him are the words and events ascribed to him by others. And, if Jesus never existed as a real person who actually lived upon the Earth, all we have left of him are the words and events ascribed to him by others. See? No difference. Jesus was ostensibly a teacher. So, what matters are his teachings and whether, or not, they have application in our lives today. And, that is something we can each discern for ourselves, whether Jesus ever actually existed, or not.
Science isn't faith that the future will be similar to the past, it's a record keeping that all things that have ever happened have all adhered to the same fundamental principals, and the prediction that this is what will happen next. The moment a future event doesn't conform to theories about how all past events happen, we will change our theory. That's how science works; we use the best explanation to fit our data, and if that explanation doesn't work, we adjust our explanation to accommodate the new data.
Not personally, as far as I can recall, but definitely seen videos over the years of the more fire and brimstone type of preachers use that kinda language.
Faith is the tool of deceivers and those who would allow themselves to be deceived. If someone, anyone, demands your faith, look to why they might be trying to deceive you - because, they are. Doubt is the tool of those who would earnestly seek the truth. If something is true, it will be able to withstand and assuage doubt. That Christianity glorifies faith, while demonizing doubt, indicts it as a deception. Having said that, though, faith does have its application in our lives. For example, it is through having faith in ourselves that we develop the confidence we need to overcome challenges that we face. We have no evidence that we will accomplish tasks we have never attempted - but, our faith in ourselves empowers us to make the attempt, anyway. Furthermore, we have faith in our scientific principles and processes - even though, we have no way of knowing whether they will always be sound. All we can do is the best we can do and have faith in the processes, while being willing to be incorrect about it all for the sake of learning something new. Finally, even as an atheist, if there is a God (whatever that is) and it has anything to say to me, I have faith that he knows where I am and how to say it so I know it is really him. Therefore, I ignore anyone and everyone who would claim to speak on God's behalf - especially, if they lived and died thousands of years ago. That "God" has never reached out to tell me anything tells me that he must think I am getting along just fine without him.
"Faith is a malignancy that no system can tolerate with impunity ; and the man who succumbs to it , will call on it in precisely those issues where he needs his reason the most." -Nathaniel Branden-
@@BeefT-Sq Do you understand what kind of faith I mean? *Supported by reason and reality.* I.e. faith I will return to home without being killed in car accident. Faith I will wake up alive tomorrow. Faith I will not get some bad illness. That kind of faith. 🙂
The gospel of John was written in 90-100 AD = DECADES after Jesus was dead. Josephus born 37 AD - AFTER Jesus was dead. Tacitus born 56 AD - AFTER Jesus was dead. They wrote DECADES after the fact. Jesus was performing MAGIC TRICKS in front of all these people and conveniently NO ONE WROTE about it while he was ALIVE. LOLZ
I learned an Old testament history as a freshman at college that the word for God was never meant to be male. And was definitely plural. Imagine 50% of the population, us women, being told that God is a man. It's very annoying
The Bible says Jesus said He came to speak of his father. So even according to their book Jesus did not say he was God ever. You would have to rewrite John 3:16. So God so loved the world that God gave himself
It's funny how these religious people will say an outlandish statement followed with, right? And then they talk fast trying to get past that point before they always get called back with, wait! What?!
For years, I've said that an all powerful being could write a book that everyone could unambiguously understand it. No matter how smart or dumb they are. No matter the language they speak. It wouldn't even matter if they could read. Rather than do that, God supposedly inspired a book that was written in vagueness, ambiguity and riddles and expects there to be no confusion. That is pure idiocy.
If this guy's so impressed by numbers, the Egyptian pantheon was worshipped (as far as we know far more consistently than Christianity) for more than 3 000 years. And the impact of it - he can have a look, bit southwest from the Nile delta. The huge-ass triangles. That's impact. Does this make Horus, Hathor or Amon any more real? (It'd be nice if it did, but I don't think it does)
An antelope is innocently munching grass on the African savannah. A lion sneaks up and tears that antelope to pieces. Can you imagine the pain and suffering involved ??? God designed the universe, we are told therefore ultimately God is responsible. If God exist, are we talking about a good God or an evil God or no God at all ???
Of course Santa Claus is real, he gives me Christmas presents every year tagged "from Santa." He always gives me exactly what I ask for in the letters I write to him that Mom mails for me. I love Christmas. I get presents from Mom and Dad and, hey wait a minute.........!
@@johns1625 - No, unfortunately that's not it. There is something specific about certain AXP member videos that cannot be played in the background - despite me having TH-cam Premium. It doesn't happen with any other videos ever.
Before you can claim that something is the most likely explanation, you first need to demonstrate that it even can be an explanation. In this point, to make the case that the most likely explanation is that Jesus was God, you first need to demonstrate that there even is a God for Jesus to be.
It's cute when theists think they're the first ones to come up with an argument that you've shot down thousands of times before. The best callers on this show, though, are the ones that heard their preachers say something profound, and they try and fail miserably to blow your minds with it. They're not usually as well spoken as the preacher, those snake oil salesmen really know how to polish a turd, so it ends up sounding like the turd it always was.
non-theist here, but not sure how “atheism requires a degree of faith” turns into “but you can’t prove jesus was god, go back in time and video record him flying and flinging loaves and fishes from his hands”
@@joecoolioness6399 Irrelevant to the comment I made which was about HOW the caller’s argument was “debunked” not the caller’s argument’s validity, but sure I’ll answer your question. Imagine you’re 5, you never caught your parents hiding presents, you don’t yet understand how hard it would be running a global distribution business from the north pole, and don’t know how to do the math on minutes in a night to chimneys around the world, but little Timmy from the playground says “Santa’s not real“, yeah, that would require a small leap of faith since you don’t have the resources and knowledge to discount Santa on your own. If you’d like me to use the same example for defending a god’s existence which I don’t have any interest in doing in the first place, I would say by comparison, we are five-year-olds in the universe who never caught their mommy tiptoeing around at night, making spacetime expand exponentially faster, or conjuring quarks from energy, and even though it’s clear that the pope is just a man in a costume, we still lack the knowledge to completely explain away what we don’t understand, especially since there’s any number or manner of possible Santas that could be out there. Hey I never realized how valid the Santa argument actually is AGAINST atheism, this has been interesting thanks.
Not a religious person myself but I happen to live in a so called "third world country" which has been struggling to maintain peace between its different religious communities since its birth. So, I am the last person who needs to be convinced of the social curse that is religious fundamentalism. But I see numerous people around me who are empowered by their religious beliefs to dedicate their lives in the service of humanity without asking for anything in return. And I also see countless people who have been born into impossibly difficult circumstances and who should literally have no material reason to want to live. There's no light at the end of the tunnel for those folks. They don't have the luxury of sitting in air conditioned rooms and debating the philosophy of religion. Their faith in a higher power is the only thing that keeps them going. You guys might look at those people and call them fools but it'll never not be cruel to try to talk them out of their faith.
Even if their circumstances are crap believing in a deity or not will not change those circumstances... so i don't think it matters at all, in fact it tend to make things worse by adding problems (religious rules/indoctrination/abuse) on top of the already existing ones, which is why i always have to explain that reality is independant to your way of thinking/perception you won't solve anything if you keep finding excuses and rationalizations.
@@adelMN2 In my admittedly limited personal experience, I haven't met anyone who believes that God will come down and lead them out of their misery by the hand. Almost every religious person understands that it is only through effort that things improve. But many people find it fulfilling to center their existence around the doctrine of a higher power. When you're about to step off a ledge and end it all, it's not cold hard logic and argument that holds you back. There's no right or wrong in all this. Just fundamentally different ways of living life. The truth is, when you find something that truly works, you lose interest in everything else including the urge to convince others of your point of view. ✌
Caller: “I believe this bullshit, theology, ‘cause I was culturally, brought up with it and told to believe it even though there is no evidence to base my beliefs on!” Welcome to religion!
Tyler: "What's the most likely explanation for this?" Well it sure isn't some eternal supernatural being that can exist in non-existence, with all the magical powers and sheer intellect, to be able to create a universe out of nothing. The probability for a naturalistic solution to existence, is a near certainty, compared to the insane improbability of a magical God existing before existence. This perfect being the religious believe in, is absolutely destroyed by their own religion. A perfect being would need and want for nothing. Yet their religion claims this thing created the universe, and populated a planet with people, for the sole purpose of believing-in and worshipping 'It', or else you'll burn in hell. These are not the actions of a perfect being, they're more akin to that of a sadistic, psychotic, egomaniac - ergo, their perfect God simply doesn't exist, as a direct consequence of their religious beliefs. And we've not even hit on the utter insanity of insisting on a blood sacrifice of your supposed only son, to somehow pay for all our sins. What the hell is this thing smoking? Is this the best a perfect God could come up with? It's a joke. It's a very, very, very, sick joke. How far along the utterly insane scale do you have to be, to believe any of this garbage is 'The Truth'?
@@freakishuproar1168 Thank you for the support. I'm preaching to the converted here, but imagine the reaction I'd get on a Christian channel...!!! I don't think it would be pretty ;)
@@ijaygee1 No problem dude! :D The best defence I can think of this proposed god's actions is that it's too catastrophically stupid to know that what it's doing is ineffective, that's the _best case_ scenario for why it'd want to be worshipped, despite how it's set up the universe and despite it's supposed efforts to make itself known. If there is a god and it's genuinely omnipotent, omnipresent and omnibenevolent, then it is uniquely burdened with a responsibility for demonstrating it's own existence and justifying it's actions. Even if people have grotesquely misrepresented it's nature and values, it'd still ultimately be responsible for our confusion regarding it for it _specifically_ made us that way. As an atheist I'm genuinely less offended that people might believe in a creator of some kind, but more bewildered why somebody would want to prostrate themselves before such a being and explain away it's catalogue of cosmically scaled squalid failures.
@@freakishuproar1168 I try to keep an open mind, but I draw the line at magic. I don't claim to know there is no God - something kicked all this off, but I tend toward a naturalistic explanation. I'm however convinced the Biblical God is complete fiction - there are too many errors, cock-ups, and things we know for certain simply didn't happen. The whole idea of using a book to tell us anything of its existence, is risible - but a handy tool to control the illiterate masses of yesteryear, and all those foolish enough to believe anything on blind faith alone...
Why do religious people require your belief, faith, obedience? They believe that god created, owns everything, like a giant HOA. These religious people have appointed themselves to be god’s HOA property managers. They make the rules, post those annoying signs, collect the rents, impose penalties and keep a large slice of god’s property rent income. Power for themselves.
If a child absorbs the arrogant disdain of atheist parents, watches how their role models label people of faith as inferior, stupid, ignorant, what are they teaching? If the eradication of religion were an ultimate goal for The Freedom From Religion Foundation, would this affect the younger generations' overall level of compassion towards those who think differently? Religious folk are held to a standard of, "love your neighbors, and your enemies." I assume all who wish to stamp out religion constitute enemies of people of faith. There is a difference between empathy and pity. Empathy means viewing another as your equal. Pity means they are your inferior. On this basis, i must conclude the world would be overall a better place with more people of faith who practice love than those who desire it's eradication.
Being an atheist has nothing to do with faith. It’s about logic and reason. Faith is something we don’t respect because having faith in something without concrete empirical evidence for a god or gods is the very definition of blind faith. You have it backwards
@@ZeitgeistOmega My point exactly- you don't recognize it as faith. "concrete empirical evidence" for which naturalistic creative mechanism for the universe... multiverses? string theory? DNA being created by lighting hitting a puddle? A bacteria accidentally mutating into a human? We all believe in something, there's nothing wrong with that. And when we recognize our beliefs as such we can all get along. But denying faith and claiming 'undeniable fact' is where the problems usually begin, don't you think?
@@SteveLomas-k6k You don’t seem to understand the concept of blind faith. At least with scientific research, you can actually see the how and the why of reality and have an understanding of the world around us. Taking things on faith alone is naive and ignorant. Yes, it can bring like minded people together, but if the faith is shattered because of new information that contradicts it then what do you have then? At least when you have some evidence to validate your claims, you have something to work with. Not all evidence may be able to explain something but it can point us in the right direction. Belief in something that is unsubstantiated and unverifiable is, by definition, blind faith. As for your rant on how life came to be. You are guilty of oversimplifying complex processes that took hundreds of thousands, if not millions of years, for these processes to bear fruit. So Steve, stop using these tired arguments that you seemingly have no idea what you are talking about.
@@ZeitgeistOmega "You are guilty of oversimplifying complex processes that took hundreds of thousands, if not millions of years, for these processes to bear fruit." So it's not so simple? not so concrete after all? Then how about just the very first baby step in Darwinian evolution; a bacteria mutating into anything other than more bacteria? That leaves a lot of speculation, not direct empirical evidence. If you dig up the Rosetta stone and deduce an act of creative intelligence, this is not blind faith, it's recognizing the objective fingerprints of creative intelligence- even if you have no direct evidence of the creator. Forensic scientists, archeologists, insurance adjusters, use the same scientific methods to determine agency v naturalistic causes.
How is Atheism a faith based position? Faith = Belief without Evidence. Atheism = A lack of belief due to a Lack of evidence. Theist - “There is a god” Atheist - “Can you demonstrate that?” Theist - “No” Atheist - “I’ll believe you when you can” Replace the word “God” with “Bigfoot” or “The Loch Ness Monster” …..and explain how that’s a Faith based position.
The cognitive dissonance of every theist who admits that every religion (aside from the very specific version of religion they subscribe to) could be wrong, and still be impactful, formative, beneficial, etc, and then they will immediately do a special pleading for their religion being the truth, even though they have zero evidence that proves their religion is true compared to all the other religions they just dismiss out of hand. They deserve no credibility.
Call it religion if you want, I call it lies and fantasy at gunpoint! I have no respect for people of faith. Not being satisfied with the freedom to believe in their own religion they far to often insist on forcing me to believe, listen to them “Respectfully,” obey them and their rules, live my life the way they order me to live and give them my money, either directly or through the taxes that I pay.
Why would you base your entire worldview around something you don't know or probably can never fully know? And why do so many of these theists think we're doing the same thing they're doing when analyzing our worldview? "How we got here" or whatever the theist will say isn't really a foundation for my worldview, it really wasn't as much when I was a believer either.
If I don't know, I don't know. "I dont know, therefore I do know through faith" is an incoherent position.
mmm.
I don't know, but I believe. I understand that belief does not have a good foundation, but believe anyhow would be a coherent position.
Noone ever calls in and actually acknowledges that position.
Someone calling in with that position will not pass the call screeners.
As an atheist I am fine with saying I don't know. I don't believe in nonsense to fill that void.
When I was a child the christian community told me, that faith can move mountains. I gave it an heart felt try, and saw zero results. So, before I turned 6 I was completely unwilling to accept it. have a nice day.
I went to Christian schools thru 8th grade. I was the kid raising his hand and pointing out things like:
"Wait... Adam and Eve didn't know the difference between right and wrong until AFTER they ate the fruit, but we are all sinners at birth due to their uninformed decision? God can speak a universe into existence, but he can't 'create' a fence around a tree? And why would he want them to remain ignorant?".
The response was always an excuse... a lame justification... "We cannot understand the mind of God" or "The Lord works in mysterious ways".
That's just the first chapter in the silly story of God's failures we call The Bible.
The indoctrination didn't work on me. I would expect God to be smarter than I am... but apparently he isn't.
@@HalfCrazy520 Could be my life story :) I was exactly the same.
@@KeesKouwenberg The Priest: If you don't have faith, why are you in youth group and an altar boy and help out around here so much?
Me: Honestly, because it makes my mom happy, the youth group leader is hot, and when you're not looking, I drink the wine.
@@HalfCrazy520 HAHAHAHA, I was an altar boy too when in grammar school (60 in two days now), I was there for the annual trip :)
@@KeesKouwenberg Well, Happy Birthday! I turned 64 in May.
I was thinking this morning about the times I had the priest backed in a corner with a question or a bible contradiction he couldn't explain. His Olympic level mental gymnastics in response never made any sense to me. I'm pretty sure he hated me.
Could one religious person not tapdance around when questioned, be honest and say "I have no evidence to believe god exists" or say "I believe because I'm gullible", which is the position of EVERY religious person
I have the scriptures, personal revelation, and can look at what atheists have and see that they have nothing that I want.
@rbwinn3 We have a free life, not restricted by what you think god wants you to do. Nothing about religion is a positive to me. If god is real, he was responsible and could have stopped all the horrors throughout history. If he could have stopped them happening, but chose not to, he's nothing but a horrible entity who DESERVES zero praise or worship. He's a monster and is evil
Note that this thread contains several examples of folks supporting OP’s claim by failing to provide any convincing reason to believe in the existence of any god, gods or other divine or supernatural beings.
@@JimCastleberryAnd you’re no better. You come claiming this and that but can’t give one shred of evidence to back them up.
@@rbwinn3are you aware of the eternal consequences if you don't accept atheism into your heart?
This call, in a nutshell: If you believe the claims, then they must be true. For this caller, the claim itself is all the evidence needed-no need for pesky things like facts or logical consistency. It’s like saying, “I’m convinced because I’m convinced,” and calling it a day. It’s a masterclass in circular reasoning, where the only evidence you need is your own conviction.
Can you imagine what it would be like seeing a sci-fi movie with them?
Maddening.
@@jayrose8638that is a terrible thought…ugh..
No, if people believe in MY preferred claims then it's enough evidence they're true. As for other claims, they're delusional and manipulated
That's why I do think belief is a choice
@@mattjindrak To whatever degree choice is involved, it's made under duress. Thankfully, trying to affirm my belief, actually reading the damn book, broke it beyond repair. Isaiah 45:7 is clear, God is not the good guy if he's behind everything good And evil. Once its moral authority was busted, i felt free to doubt and question. Andrew Seidel is right, the road to atheism is littered with bibles read cover to cover.
Faith is good for fooling yourself that you have evidence.
Why didn't you tell me this earlier lmao
The idea that at one point gods were showing up, walking around, walking on water, making animals talk, etc and that this happens to coincide with a time that humans were ignorant of the scientific method, largely illiterate, superstitious, and largely consumed with concerns of survival and procreation is so ridiculous as to be utterly absurd.
@@MrMattSax Yet, the theists that crop up here can’t seem to understand that simple fact
The idea that the chirpy god of the OT is the same character as the absent father god in the NT is hilarious. I have absolutely no issue with how the NT pressed how people should treat one another. Connecting that back to the Bronze Age Palestinian god of judgement is really f*ckin rich though 😂
It isn't lost on me that the bible reads like it was written by MEN in the iron age... Women have no rights and, unless they're a virgin, no value either. The Christian faith is absurd from start to finish.
Also,no widespread use of cell phone cameras
And then we began developing systematic examinations to explain the world and to ask questions and God was like "Well now I'm not doing it!"
When you get down to the nitty gritty his beliefs were handed down to him and are contingent on his latitude and longitude.
Indeed. As a child, I was a Roman Catholic. If I'd been born in Tel Aviv instead of where I was, I'd almost certaly have been Jewish as a child.
Eventually I came to the position of "I'm told that god exists and knows everything and can do anything. If I make an assumption that god exists, then I have to conclude that either god doesn't know about huge numbers of events, or that god can't intervene, or that god is an asshole."
Went from there to either god doesn't exist, or is impotent, or is an asshole and in all three cases, no point in being Roman Catholic anymore.
He's so confused; Confucius say 'it is impossible to wake someone who is pretending to be asleep'....
the brain gymnastics required for religion is truly amazing ...
I think in his case its more of a failure to compute. I posit that he did not present one original thought of his own during this call.
@@ngcastronerd4791 In order to present an original thought, he would first need the intelligence to formulate one. Then again, if he could think for himself, he wouldn't be calling in to the show and embarrassing himself.
@@ngcastronerd4791I don’t think I’ve heard a presup conclude their “argument” with “swish”, so that’s original I guess 🤷
@@eukaryote-prime i wasnt being serious. Not that the call deserved serious thought.
And it requires copious amounts of self deception.
Faith is the art of lying to yourself. Critical thinking is the art of questioning yourself.
Neither of those are arts.
@@reefhog i think it's meant as a metaphor
@@reefhog but they are,if you know what art means....
@@misscameroon8062 Not at all. Tell me why I should take someone who is barely literate, seriously.
@@reefhog reef head;what the fuck do you know about literacy;bozo ?!
Tyler is the grand master of circular argument.
no,he is grand master of religious idiocy...
I think I've discovered a new law: As the amount of evidence for a claim increases, the ability of a theist to cite one of those pieces of evidence decreases.
The purported magnitude of evidence is inversely related to the ability to cite said evidence
What would be a good name for this new law? Hmmm…how about “law of inverted rationality” or “law of reduced rationality”?
If anyone has better, I’d like to hear it lol.
@@ZeitgeistOmega How about the law diminished capacity
@@ZeitgeistOmega Can you see my replies?
I can see your replies, and yes, I like that answer better than mine.
Tyler has the ability to be honest, but he only uses it when he's cornered. Keep at it Tyler, you just need to leap past the hurdle of denial,
The frustration in listening callers of Tyler's ilk is their comments about "historical evidence" indicates they haven't a clue what hIstorical evidence actually is.
Very depressing that so many people have the same skewed reasoning on this planet as Tyler
Lmaoo this argument reminds me of the Boondocks “there’s things we know we know, things we know we know we don’t know, also things we don’t know we don’t know.” 😂
The absent of evidence is not the evidence of absence.
But it feels so real to Tyler 🥴
2 minutes in you can tell this caller wasn't going to say anything of substance
Faith is good, but Beer is definitely better 🍺
And a good Saturday Morning 🌞 AXP Fans and Theists ❤❤❤
Peace Love Empathy From Australia 💪🤠☝️
Only if it's home brewed or German.
@@joshsheridan9511 Belgian, you heathen!
I love the long gaps of silence while the callers are scratching their heads, trying to come up with a reply.
Perhaps Tyler should consider we have no contemporary historical records or evidence from the reign of Augustus or Tiberius Caesar for jesus
If there was historical documentation about Jesus being god, it will officially terminate all other religions. From that point in time there will be no atheism, no Judaism, no Budism, nothing! we will all be Christians. What a ridiculous thing to say.
I wouldn't be a Christian, belief and worship are not mutually inclusive.
@@joshsheridan9511 absolutely. I hate the results of bombs, nevertheless I can't state I am not a science adept.
You will be a different kind of christian. One who know there's a god and how he is, but who does not worship him.
Because it won't be a belief, it would be a knowledge.
So you obviously don’t know that Buddhism is a non theistic religion and there are many other non theistic religions.
The problem with documentation is that it is hard to know the extent to which the views of the author coloured it.
Sometimes it's hard to know what the actual purpose was.
Galaxy Quest having an alien race mistake television for historical records was a great example.
It also depends on what you think a Christian actually is. We would probably all be theists but not really Christians, depending on what you would consider a Christian. Then there would probably still be atheists, because there would still be some that wouldn't accept the evidence. Also, with just taking what's said here, having factual data of Jesus being god outside of the bible doesn't necessarily prove the bible though. Jesus could be God and a lot of stuff about Jesus in the bible could be wrong. Then Jesus himself in the bible wasn't necessarily trying to create a new religion, he might still want people to be Jewish, and all he wanted was for Judaism to be what he considered was true. Jesus could be a real god and never actually "died" for our sins. This also wouldn't inherently disprove other theistic religions who believe in different gods, that would just be proof of gods existing not that no other gods exist.
Tyler, you're in way over your head
The bible is true because it says in the bible that the bible is true.
The claim in Chapter 1 Verse 2 is true because it says so in Chapter 3 Verse 4
Circular reasoning loves me, this I know, because Circular Reasoning tells me so.
LOLZ
This show has the longest pauses of dead air. It happens when theists are asked a question that they immediately know the right answer to, but they have to think about how to word it in a way that doesn't expose their own assertions as either hypocritical or just plain wrong.
@@RighteousnessWillPrevail I don't care what you think of my profile picture.
I have faith that this caller wants to say that atheists and theists use the same methods to come to their beliefs and will fail miserably in his presentation.
@@JimCastleberrywhen I convert will you attend my baptism?
@@JimCastleberryI’d rather follow the evidence of how reality ACTUALLY works then any “evidence” you spew, which is to say, none at all.
@@JimCastleberrythat's really interesting. So did the caller do a good job of making a case for faith?
@@JimCastleberryif there's fine tuning and intelligent design then why did your god put you so deep on the spectrum to make you this way?
@@JimCastleberryIt’s a fallacy to give a huge amount of examples to overwhelm the other person. Only pick two of them (the two examples you’re the most sure we can’t have any reply), explain them in a few lines instead of just the name, and we will see if they are really evidence or not. If you avoid the question and not pick two of them, i’ll pick them myself and it will also show your dishonesty
Tyler has boarded a train, without a driver, conductor, a braking system, a destination, with one simple belief that it will take him to a promised land!
Public schools need to spend a LOT more time teaching students about the definition of “proof,” or what constitutes evidence.
I'm so sick of these dumb callers.
If they were smart then they wouldnt be religious
So why do you click on it?
Believing and fate are the gold plated excuses to stop thinking: Daniel Denneth.
Believe in me, have fate in me. First words of every conman
Dennett
For thousands of years humanity believed the Earth was flat.
Case closed.
Don't you think Joseph Smith made a typo?... 🤔
We should believe in God on faith because we don't know everything? GREAT! Does Tyler believe in Santa Claus, fairies, leprechauns, mermaids and unicorns on faith because he doesn't know everything? The CONTORTIONS of logic that theists are willing to use are just STAGGERING!
"I am primarily the creator of a new code of morality which has so far been believed impossible, namely a morality not based on faith, not on arbitrary whim, not on emotion, not on arbitrary edict, mystical or social, but on reason; a morality that can be proved by means of logic which can be demonstrated to be true and necessary.
Now may I define what my morality is? Since man’s mind is his basic means of survival […] he has to hold reason as an absolute, by which I mean that he has to hold reason as his only guide to action, and that he must live by the independent judgment of his own mind; that his highest moral purpose is the achievement of his own happiness […] that each man must live as an end in himself, and follow his own rational self-interest."
-Ayn Rand-
Why can theists just admit that they can not prove their belief ??? Their explanation is always based on FEELINGS !!!
“I feel blah blah blah so is true” 😖
you answered your own question it's => feelings
It is not only the case that one "doesn't know", but that we don't know if the believer KNOWS what he/she is talking about.
I remember sounding just like this caller.
When people are surrounded by other people that are convinced of a religion, those people can and do also often become convinced of that religion. It happens with every religion and the results are similar - lives are changed. But all religions cannot be true as they make different claims.
This means reasonably (if we want to believe true things) we must FIRST test any testable claims before accepting one of the religion's claims. If any claim is untestable, again we must wait for it to become testable and then test it BEFORE accepting any claim.
Of course, if one's purpose for accepting the claim is for reasons OTHER than confirming the claim true (comfort, always been told, provides a sense of purpose, made me feel better when I was down, placates one's existential dread and fear of the unknown, etc.) - then to be honest, admit that, and then have fun with it, because the reason for accepting the claim is NOT because the claim is demonstrably true.
This guy saying other people rationalize their mistaken beliefs in order to believe in their untrue religions is just amazing.
It would be refreshing if theists would just admit they do not know if their religion is true, but that they believe it because they benefit (feel better) from the belief. Tip: the moment it stops making you feel better, dump it, as there are other religions, or you can choose none.
That argument is promoted often. "The effect of belief in God is more important than whether the belief is true." Jpordan Peterson runs with that all the time, claiming that wihtout a belief in God, there would be no art, no literature, no philosophy, all because humans would lack a "metaphorical substrate." it's hilariously silly.
Ask god to send someone with more legible grammar next time.
I’ve never met a theist who doesn’t fall victim to the following belief: “If I really want something to be true, then it must be true.” Every theist confuses desire for knowledge.
Columbus had the false belief that he could more easily get to India by sailing west across the Atlantic. That false belief had one of the most significant impacts on the world ever.
Tyler you're making Maryland look really stupid, and this with the poll yesterday that 26% of Kamala Harris's voter have decides to vote for Larry Hogan, it is asinine, voting for Harris while not giving her the Senate to do anything, I'm so pissed at my state right now
Why some theists believe faith is a sign of virtue or belief😳
Because their bible tells them to use the force, oops I mean faith 😁😁😁
Becase the bible says so...
@@JimCastleberryOr you just say "it’s probably true, but i don’t know" instead of "having faith"
@@JimCastleberry Atheism is primarily on reason and facts. To be gullible enough as faith belief means falling for to much😡
You just can’t spell theism correctly can you?
“Theism is a denial of reason - the inability to reason through uncertainty.”
You’re welcome Edith.
Tyler’s entire argument process Buddhism if he lived in Asia.
circular thinking...
The impact of a crucifixion on my life was guilt and worried and concern that this would ever happen for me or in my name for things that I had not even done before I was born. That's gross manipulation to say I'd killed myself for you. And it's even grosser to say I killed my son for you. No thank you
SPECULATIONS ARE NOT BELIEFS.
technically it is when you look at the definition of belief
@@adelMN2 i don't think that's the case. Speculations are rarely an acceptance of anything as true without proof. they are without proof, but they are not an acceptance of something as true. They wouldn't be speculations otherwise.
What Christians seem not to understand is that it does not matter whether Jesus ever existed, or not - and, here's why:
If Jesus was a real person who actually lived upon the Earth, all we have left of him are the words and events ascribed to him by others. And, if Jesus never existed as a real person who actually lived upon the Earth, all we have left of him are the words and events ascribed to him by others. See? No difference.
Jesus was ostensibly a teacher. So, what matters are his teachings and whether, or not, they have application in our lives today. And, that is something we can each discern for ourselves, whether Jesus ever actually existed, or not.
You may have hit nail on head
I think the caller just invented a new logical fallacy.
The fallacy of impact.
The claim impacted many people, therefore, the claim is true-ish.🙄
Science isn't faith that the future will be similar to the past, it's a record keeping that all things that have ever happened have all adhered to the same fundamental principals, and the prediction that this is what will happen next.
The moment a future event doesn't conform to theories about how all past events happen, we will change our theory. That's how science works; we use the best explanation to fit our data, and if that explanation doesn't work, we adjust our explanation to accommodate the new data.
Has anyone encountered someone that thinks if you don't believe in their christian god, Therefore you must believe in Satan.
Not personally, as far as I can recall, but definitely seen videos over the years of the more fire and brimstone type of preachers use that kinda language.
yes occasionally, it's rare tho
Faith is the tool of deceivers and those who would allow themselves to be deceived. If someone, anyone, demands your faith, look to why they might be trying to deceive you - because, they are.
Doubt is the tool of those who would earnestly seek the truth. If something is true, it will be able to withstand and assuage doubt. That Christianity glorifies faith, while demonizing doubt, indicts it as a deception.
Having said that, though, faith does have its application in our lives. For example, it is through having faith in ourselves that we develop the confidence we need to overcome challenges that we face. We have no evidence that we will accomplish tasks we have never attempted - but, our faith in ourselves empowers us to make the attempt, anyway.
Furthermore, we have faith in our scientific principles and processes - even though, we have no way of knowing whether they will always be sound. All we can do is the best we can do and have faith in the processes, while being willing to be incorrect about it all for the sake of learning something new.
Finally, even as an atheist, if there is a God (whatever that is) and it has anything to say to me, I have faith that he knows where I am and how to say it so I know it is really him. Therefore, I ignore anyone and everyone who would claim to speak on God's behalf - especially, if they lived and died thousands of years ago. That "God" has never reached out to tell me anything tells me that he must think I am getting along just fine without him.
"A man of reason does not accept ideas on faith. "
-Nathaniel Branden-
Evert time a christian mentions tactius, none of them can say what tactius said. they are just parroting
Yes, faith is good, faith supported by reason and reality. Definitely not faith in some iron age ridiculous mythology.
"Faith is a malignancy that no system can tolerate with impunity ; and the man who succumbs to it , will call on it in precisely those issues where he needs his reason the most."
-Nathaniel Branden-
@@BeefT-Sq Do you understand what kind of faith I mean? *Supported by reason and reality.* I.e. faith I will return to home without being killed in car accident. Faith I will wake up alive tomorrow. Faith I will not get some bad illness. That kind of faith. 🙂
I want to see the notepad by Tyler’s bed, the one where he writes down what he dreams at night.
Belief in the absence of sufficient evidence...is a virtue?
How?
Why?
"Impact" 😭
The gospel of John was written in 90-100 AD = DECADES after Jesus was dead.
Josephus born 37 AD - AFTER Jesus was dead. Tacitus born 56 AD - AFTER Jesus was dead.
They wrote DECADES after the fact.
Jesus was performing MAGIC TRICKS in front of all these people and conveniently NO ONE WROTE about it while he was ALIVE.
LOLZ
@@sanjeevgig8918 preach brother! Spread the good word on how ignorant these theist trolls are!
I learned an Old testament history as a freshman at college that the word for God was never meant to be male. And was definitely plural. Imagine 50% of the population, us women, being told that God is a man. It's very annoying
The Bible says Jesus said He came to speak of his father. So even according to their book Jesus did not say he was God ever. You would have to rewrite John 3:16. So God so loved the world that God gave himself
It's funny how these religious people will say an outlandish statement followed with, right? And then they talk fast trying to get past that point before they always get called back with, wait! What?!
This topic has been thrashed to death !
If Jesus is God incarnate and referred to as the word of God, how absurd is it that he didn't write words when he supposedly walked the earth?
For years, I've said that an all powerful being could write a book that everyone could unambiguously understand it. No matter how smart or dumb they are. No matter the language they speak. It wouldn't even matter if they could read. Rather than do that, God supposedly inspired a book that was written in vagueness, ambiguity and riddles and expects there to be no confusion. That is pure idiocy.
If this guy's so impressed by numbers, the Egyptian pantheon was worshipped (as far as we know far more consistently than Christianity) for more than 3 000 years. And the impact of it - he can have a look, bit southwest from the Nile delta. The huge-ass triangles. That's impact. Does this make Horus, Hathor or Amon any more real? (It'd be nice if it did, but I don't think it does)
An antelope is innocently munching grass on the African savannah. A lion sneaks up and tears that antelope to pieces. Can you imagine the pain and suffering involved ??? God designed the universe, we are told therefore ultimately God is responsible. If God exist, are we talking about a good God or an evil God or no God at all ???
Think ur antelope and lion example sums things up nicely. The universe seems indifferent more than anything else
It must always come back to what created the creator
Comets had a major impact on the way people thought. Is Halley's comet God then, Tyler?
I guess so.
My life was massively changed for the better when I was diagnosed and treated for ADHD. Does that make Vyvance God?
belief = conviction, or confidence in something without necessarily having evidence. It's opinion, not truth.
Of course Santa Claus is real, he gives me Christmas presents every year tagged "from Santa." He always gives me exactly what I ask for in the letters I write to him that Mom mails for me.
I love Christmas. I get presents from Mom and Dad and, hey wait a minute.........!
The most likely explanation? Magic 🙄
Ghandi had significant impact on those around him, so did Buddha and Alexander the great and Michael Jackson, big hairy deal. It proves nothing
Well sure, If I imagine spider man is real then doctor octopus becomes a foregone conclusion...
It's like shooting fish in a barrel.
Why does this video say "background play is unavailable for this video"?
Press ALT+F4
@@Wilhelm-100TheTechnoAdmiral - on my phone?
You lost connection briefly or your screen locked while loading. Just refresh.
@@steveymoon I'm not being helpful
@@johns1625 - No, unfortunately that's not it. There is something specific about certain AXP member videos that cannot be played in the background - despite me having TH-cam Premium. It doesn't happen with any other videos ever.
The idea of slavery lasted for a long long time. Does that make it right? And correct?
Before you can claim that something is the most likely explanation, you first need to demonstrate that it even can be an explanation. In this point, to make the case that the most likely explanation is that Jesus was God, you first need to demonstrate that there even is a God for Jesus to be.
It's cute when theists think they're the first ones to come up with an argument that you've shot down thousands of times before. The best callers on this show, though, are the ones that heard their preachers say something profound, and they try and fail miserably to blow your minds with it. They're not usually as well spoken as the preacher, those snake oil salesmen really know how to polish a turd, so it ends up sounding like the turd it always was.
non-theist here, but not sure how “atheism requires a degree of faith” turns into “but you can’t prove jesus was god, go back in time and video record him flying and flinging loaves and fishes from his hands”
Not believing in santa claus requires faith then?
@@joecoolioness6399 Irrelevant to the comment I made which was about HOW the caller’s argument was “debunked” not the caller’s argument’s validity, but sure I’ll answer your question. Imagine you’re 5, you never caught your parents hiding presents, you don’t yet understand how hard it would be running a global distribution business from the north pole, and don’t know how to do the math on minutes in a night to chimneys around the world, but little Timmy from the playground says “Santa’s not real“, yeah, that would require a small leap of faith since you don’t have the resources and knowledge to discount Santa on your own. If you’d like me to use the same example for defending a god’s existence which I don’t have any interest in doing in the first place, I would say by comparison, we are five-year-olds in the universe who never caught their mommy tiptoeing around at night, making spacetime expand exponentially faster, or conjuring quarks from energy, and even though it’s clear that the pope is just a man in a costume, we still lack the knowledge to completely explain away what we don’t understand, especially since there’s any number or manner of possible Santas that could be out there. Hey I never realized how valid the Santa argument actually is AGAINST atheism, this has been interesting thanks.
Not a religious person myself but I happen to live in a so called "third world country" which has been struggling to maintain peace between its different religious communities since its birth. So, I am the last person who needs to be convinced of the social curse that is religious fundamentalism. But I see numerous people around me who are empowered by their religious beliefs to dedicate their lives in the service of humanity without asking for anything in return. And I also see countless people who have been born into impossibly difficult circumstances and who should literally have no material reason to want to live. There's no light at the end of the tunnel for those folks. They don't have the luxury of sitting in air conditioned rooms and debating the philosophy of religion. Their faith in a higher power is the only thing that keeps them going. You guys might look at those people and call them fools but it'll never not be cruel to try to talk them out of their faith.
Even if their circumstances are crap believing in a deity or not will not change those circumstances... so i don't think it matters at all, in fact it tend to make things worse by adding problems (religious rules/indoctrination/abuse) on top of the already existing ones, which is why i always have to explain that reality is independant to your way of thinking/perception you won't solve anything if you keep finding excuses and rationalizations.
@@adelMN2 In my admittedly limited personal experience, I haven't met anyone who believes that God will come down and lead them out of their misery by the hand. Almost every religious person understands that it is only through effort that things improve. But many people find it fulfilling to center their existence around the doctrine of a higher power. When you're about to step off a ledge and end it all, it's not cold hard logic and argument that holds you back. There's no right or wrong in all this. Just fundamentally different ways of living life. The truth is, when you find something that truly works, you lose interest in everything else including the urge to convince others of your point of view. ✌
Caller: “I believe this bullshit, theology, ‘cause I was culturally, brought up with it and told to believe it even though there is no evidence to base my beliefs on!”
Welcome to religion!
Faith is, what made the Canaanites sacrifice some of their babies to their gods.
So faith is a mental illness?
Ad Populum
do theists call in to these shows JUST to get on the air? So many of them (tyler) are not remotely prepared for the conversation.
Tyler: "What's the most likely explanation for this?" Well it sure isn't some eternal supernatural being that can exist in non-existence, with all the magical powers and sheer intellect, to be able to create a universe out of nothing. The probability for a naturalistic solution to existence, is a near certainty, compared to the insane improbability of a magical God existing before existence.
This perfect being the religious believe in, is absolutely destroyed by their own religion. A perfect being would need and want for nothing. Yet their religion claims this thing created the universe, and populated a planet with people, for the sole purpose of believing-in and worshipping 'It', or else you'll burn in hell. These are not the actions of a perfect being, they're more akin to that of a sadistic, psychotic, egomaniac - ergo, their perfect God simply doesn't exist, as a direct consequence of their religious beliefs. And we've not even hit on the utter insanity of insisting on a blood sacrifice of your supposed only son, to somehow pay for all our sins. What the hell is this thing smoking? Is this the best a perfect God could come up with? It's a joke. It's a very, very, very, sick joke.
How far along the utterly insane scale do you have to be, to believe any of this garbage is 'The Truth'?
This is a massively underrated comment. If the Abrahamic god exists, then it seems suspiciously desperate to be worshipped.
@@freakishuproar1168 Thank you for the support. I'm preaching to the converted here, but imagine the reaction I'd get on a Christian channel...!!! I don't think it would be pretty ;)
@@ijaygee1 No problem dude! :D The best defence I can think of this proposed god's actions is that it's too catastrophically stupid to know that what it's doing is ineffective, that's the _best case_ scenario for why it'd want to be worshipped, despite how it's set up the universe and despite it's supposed efforts to make itself known. If there is a god and it's genuinely omnipotent, omnipresent and omnibenevolent, then it is uniquely burdened with a responsibility for demonstrating it's own existence and justifying it's actions. Even if people have grotesquely misrepresented it's nature and values, it'd still ultimately be responsible for our confusion regarding it for it _specifically_ made us that way. As an atheist I'm genuinely less offended that people might believe in a creator of some kind, but more bewildered why somebody would want to prostrate themselves before such a being and explain away it's catalogue of cosmically scaled squalid failures.
@@freakishuproar1168 I try to keep an open mind, but I draw the line at magic. I don't claim to know there is no God - something kicked all this off, but I tend toward a naturalistic explanation. I'm however convinced the Biblical God is complete fiction - there are too many errors, cock-ups, and things we know for certain simply didn't happen. The whole idea of using a book to tell us anything of its existence, is risible - but a handy tool to control the illiterate masses of yesteryear, and all those foolish enough to believe anything on blind faith alone...
Why do religious people require your belief, faith, obedience? They believe that god created, owns everything, like a giant HOA. These religious people have appointed themselves to be god’s HOA property managers. They make the rules, post those annoying signs, collect the rents, impose penalties and keep a large slice of god’s property rent income. Power for themselves.
If a child absorbs the arrogant disdain of atheist parents, watches how their role models label people of faith as inferior, stupid, ignorant, what are they teaching?
If the eradication of religion were an ultimate goal for The Freedom From Religion Foundation, would this affect the younger generations' overall level of compassion towards those who think differently?
Religious folk are held to a standard of, "love your neighbors, and your enemies." I assume all who wish to stamp out religion constitute enemies of people of faith.
There is a difference between empathy and pity. Empathy means viewing another as your equal. Pity means they are your inferior.
On this basis, i must conclude the world would be overall a better place with more people of faith who practice love than those who desire it's eradication.
Cool story bro. Still no proof for god.
You be you ,dude
If they all practiced love, and that's it, we would not have any issues with them.
What about any of the old gods.....
He's like a stuck record
I'd say having faith in something like atheism, without recognizing that faith as such, is just blind faith.
Being an atheist has nothing to do with faith. It’s about logic and reason. Faith is something we don’t respect because having faith in something without concrete empirical evidence for a god or gods is the very definition of blind faith.
You have it backwards
@@ZeitgeistOmega My point exactly- you don't recognize it as faith.
"concrete empirical evidence"
for which naturalistic creative mechanism for the universe... multiverses? string theory?
DNA being created by lighting hitting a puddle?
A bacteria accidentally mutating into a human?
We all believe in something, there's nothing wrong with that. And when we recognize our beliefs as such we can all get along.
But denying faith and claiming 'undeniable fact' is where the problems usually begin, don't you think?
@@SteveLomas-k6k You don’t seem to understand the concept of blind faith. At least with scientific research, you can actually see the how and the why of reality and have an understanding of the world around us.
Taking things on faith alone is naive and ignorant. Yes, it can bring like minded people together, but if the faith is shattered because of new information that contradicts it then what do you have then?
At least when you have some evidence to validate your claims, you have something to work with. Not all evidence may be able to explain something but it can point us in the right direction. Belief in something that is unsubstantiated and unverifiable is, by definition, blind faith.
As for your rant on how life came to be. You are guilty of oversimplifying complex processes that took hundreds of thousands, if not millions of years, for these processes to bear fruit.
So Steve, stop using these tired arguments that you seemingly have no idea what you are talking about.
@@ZeitgeistOmega "You are guilty of oversimplifying complex processes that took hundreds of thousands, if not millions of years, for these processes to bear fruit."
So it's not so simple? not so concrete after all? Then how about just the very first baby step in Darwinian evolution; a bacteria mutating into anything other than more bacteria?
That leaves a lot of speculation, not direct empirical evidence.
If you dig up the Rosetta stone and deduce an act of creative intelligence, this is not blind faith, it's recognizing the objective fingerprints of creative intelligence-
even if you have no direct evidence of the creator.
Forensic scientists, archeologists, insurance adjusters, use the same scientific methods to determine agency v naturalistic causes.
How is Atheism a faith based position?
Faith = Belief without Evidence.
Atheism = A lack of belief due to a Lack of evidence.
Theist - “There is a god”
Atheist - “Can you demonstrate that?”
Theist - “No”
Atheist - “I’ll believe you when you can”
Replace the word “God” with “Bigfoot” or “The Loch Ness Monster” …..and explain how that’s a Faith based position.
CIRCULAR !!!!
There is only one answer
If you can prove a God there would be no atheist
The cognitive dissonance of every theist who admits that every religion (aside from the very specific version of religion they subscribe to) could be wrong, and still be impactful, formative, beneficial, etc, and then they will immediately do a special pleading for their religion being the truth, even though they have zero evidence that proves their religion is true compared to all the other religions they just dismiss out of hand.
They deserve no credibility.
People who become rich in a capitlistic society believe in God. And so do all of their victims. Cheers!
Call it religion if you want, I call it lies and fantasy at gunpoint! I have no respect for people of faith. Not being satisfied with the freedom to believe in their own religion they far to often insist on forcing me to believe, listen to them “Respectfully,” obey them and their rules, live my life the way they order me to live and give them my money, either directly or through the taxes that I pay.
Why are theists unable to admit that they dont know? Why do they so desperately need to believe an invisible sky Grandad did it all by magic?
Even if the story is true in the Bible is true and God is real it's a horrible story from a horrible being
Why would you base your entire worldview around something you don't know or probably can never fully know? And why do so many of these theists think we're doing the same thing they're doing when analyzing our worldview? "How we got here" or whatever the theist will say isn't really a foundation for my worldview, it really wasn't as much when I was a believer either.
Plus bunch bible sounds like annuaki tablets