04 upper deck is alot more reliable than modern panini or topps. That's why panini and topps moved away from the detailed certificate on the back to "not from a specific game or event".
Such an interesting case. Will be interesting to see the Spiegels response, and ideally the full deposition transcript. Really wish manufacturers would document images of patches, to help prevent these situations from occurring.
Very true. Hopefully, the outcome will be positive for the hobby. With the manufacturer (UD) apparently unable to authentic the patch, this falls back on credibility. Both sides seem to have issues, so it's a fun case to watch.
So he sued Goldin b/c they took the listing down? Am I right about that or wrong? Doesnt Goldin have the right to cancel any listing they want? Why dont these brothers sell the card on another site?
Beckett could be the ultimate defendant here. This is exactly why its impossible to tell who is and who isn't a SCAMMER and what is and what isn't a SCAM!!!!!!
Hopefully this highlights the mythical terms and conditions that apply to card quality out of the pack and when recourse is and isn’t available to consumers for production fails…..heaven forbid upper deck should guarantee the quality control of their cards which are printed via a 3rd party.
You got to remember back when this started and that swapped or whatever it was amateur hour UD had only been around 13 years at that point still young company.
Love the channel Dan.. so you Thursday night at the SCR chat LOL But yeah.. with every auction and large company will be in the terms and conditions "... reserves the right at any time...".. ahhh those pesky terms and conditions ;)
What gets overlooked is the fact that someone at Upper Deck (and I suppose at other card manufactuers) has the equipment and materials to create a "replacement" card complete with patch, autograph and number stamp. In other words, this new card is ginned up in somebody's office or workshop at UD, and was not part of normal manufacturing processes. What's to stop this specialist from staying late one day and creating some valuable chase cards for a friend to sell? For that matter, what's to stop someone with the right stamping equipment from stamping "1/1" or "8/10" on unnumbered cards in their kitchen? Maybe I'm totally not understanding how replacement card creation works. Did UD really have surplus mostly-complete Lebron patch auto cards sitting around or did they create one on the fly from materials at hand? Either scenario is hard to picture.
None of the patches on these are game used anyways! 😂😂😂
04 upper deck is alot more reliable than modern panini or topps. That's why panini and topps moved away from the detailed certificate on the back to "not from a specific game or event".
@johnwayne9828 Yes I know. I am an UpperDeck collector. The 03 limited logos are in fact game worn. The Lebron RPAs are not... That is a fact! 👍
What's your point?
Still don't mean people should be swapping out patches and saying nothing. Altered card when they do that.
Honestly I wouldn’t buy a high value slab from BGS simply because they will not financially guarantee their slab.
Money is a powerful drug 😂 alot of counterfeits out there because of technology 😆 even graded one's
This case is definitely getting strange...especially the allegation that Shyne may have been a consultant at Goldin...in a Spiegels legal filing..
Oh goldin has $ they have scammed a ton of people. But they are smart cookies and put on a rubber before going balls deep up yer arse.
This one is a pain in the butt to cover. So much information that half the video ends up being a recap and I always miss stuff like this 😅
Somehow all the worst people in the hobby were involved
Such an interesting case. Will be interesting to see the Spiegels response, and ideally the full deposition transcript.
Really wish manufacturers would document images of patches, to help prevent these situations from occurring.
I agree, especially for high-end sets!
The outcome to things like this can set a precedent for future such endeavors
Very true. Hopefully, the outcome will be positive for the hobby.
With the manufacturer (UD) apparently unable to authentic the patch, this falls back on credibility. Both sides seem to have issues, so it's a fun case to watch.
So he sued Goldin b/c they took the listing down? Am I right about that or wrong? Doesnt Goldin have the right to cancel any listing they want? Why dont these brothers sell the card on another site?
They permanently destroyed value by labeling it fraudulent and fake
I do appreciate you making these videos
Thank you mate
Beckett could be the ultimate defendant here. This is exactly why its impossible to tell who is and who isn't a SCAMMER and what is and what isn't a SCAM!!!!!!
regulations would have made it easier to indemnify whose doing what
Just billion dollar companies trying to drag it out and blame each other then use a former employee as a scape goat
If the card was replaced how is the signature the same?
Exactly. The lawsuit is arguing that the white patch is photoshopped in that image.
Yay to the lower end of the hobby that I frequent😂
Hopefully this highlights the mythical terms and conditions that apply to card quality out of the pack and when recourse is and isn’t available to consumers for production fails…..heaven forbid upper deck should guarantee the quality control of their cards which are printed via a 3rd party.
You got to remember back when this started and that swapped or whatever it was amateur hour UD had only been around 13 years at that point still young company.
So now there’s a piece of LeBron game used jersey floating around somewhere that came out of the original card as well.
yup
These are not game used. 👍
@@vendora1Nope. Not game used. 👍
Sometimes, the fake is just placed on top of the original material.
@@35auburn None of these from this set were game worn. 👍
So you could destroy a patch card you don’t like and get a better one?
No he said that never happens it just allegedly did this time.
I laughed when the ad played on ur own video
😂😂
Love the channel Dan.. so you Thursday night at the SCR chat LOL But yeah.. with every auction and large company will be in the terms and conditions "... reserves the right at any time...".. ahhh those pesky terms and conditions ;)
pretty sure anyone who watched the collectors thinks that ken is a scumbag
😅
crazy
So... 'someone got a clean card back from ud on the damage replacement and likely swapped the patch ?
yup
What gets overlooked is the fact that someone at Upper Deck (and I suppose at other card manufactuers) has the equipment and materials to create a "replacement" card complete with patch, autograph and number stamp. In other words, this new card is ginned up in somebody's office or workshop at UD, and was not part of normal manufacturing processes.
What's to stop this specialist from staying late one day and creating some valuable chase cards for a friend to sell? For that matter, what's to stop someone with the right stamping equipment from stamping "1/1" or "8/10" on unnumbered cards in their kitchen?
Maybe I'm totally not understanding how replacement card creation works. Did UD really have surplus mostly-complete Lebron patch auto cards sitting around or did they create one on the fly from materials at hand? Either scenario is hard to picture.