Radiant Cooling! Oxygen Not Included Experiment
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ต.ค. 2024
- Using cooling loops hidden within the walls opens up a unique and clean method to temperature control your base or critical areas like sleet wheat farms.
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I think this would work even better if the temp. filter was before the water enters tank instead of after, that way you're storing cool water instead of warm water, and when the water gets too warm you don't end up with and empty loop because its all being sucked away to be cooled.
May I correct your denomination there Brothgar?
That floor heating shown in the beginning isn't working with radiation so much as it works with convection. The air flowing over the floor tiles heats up due to (mostly) convection and then starts to rise and give way for more cold air to flow directly over those floor tiles again. The same principle is working on your cooling setup, which renders it a "convective cooling" rather than a "radiant" one. As far as I know ONI doesn't even have radiation in the real sense of the word, that is the only reason why vacuum insulations work so well (afaik perfectly) in the game. In reality thermal energy would still be radiated out by the object the edge is built of and thus transfer a little bit of heat over time, making it an imperfect insulation.
I think it is a fairly big misconception that radiators (like in cars or european heating systems) actually radiate alot of anything, they are built to transfer heat via convection rather than radiation, but are commonly named that way anyway. They do radiate ovbiously, but the amount of energy transfer in that way is dimensions smaller than what they transfer due to convection via the air aroudn them. They really should be called "Convectors" in most cases.
One of the few exceptions would be the heat radiators of the ISS, since the surrounding space is near vacuum there can't be much convection happening, so their energy transfer works nearly exclusively via radiation.
convection its the movement a fluid makes when expoused to two or more, surfaces that have a temperature difference.
radiation its the propagation of non mechanical or chemical energy, light is radiation, heat is radiation, sound its radiation.
in fact, u are proposing a bad used term against a well used term, the only machine that works with convection, is the stirling engine, "convectors" dont exist.
WELCOME BACK, my fellow duplicants, to Oxygen Not in Cooling!
you can't cool what's not there.
WELCOME BACK, my fellow Duplicants, to hot oxygen that you can’t cool like seriously everything is so hot that is should be on fire but it isn’t because game
I will say a heating loop is way better than a space heater on a cold map like Rime. Basically on Rime so far I'll use space heaters at the start to keep things from freezing, then shift to a more centralized heating using Polluted Water and running a loop of pipes in the background of my main facility to radiate the heat around.
Hey Brothgar, I built my first automated train system in Factorio. I was so excited that instead of actually letting it do its job, I rode it around in circles for a while :D
@@brothgar, would totally enjoy watching you playing on Factorio!
Note to self, eat before recording. LOL :)
I do one main loop, then I do "deletion-loops" in rooms where heat is in any way deleted, and "regulating-loops"(yay, creativity) around rooms that need to be temperature controlled.
2 Shutoff Valves, 2 Liquid Pipe Thermo Sensors, and 2 Liquid Reservoirs for each room.. with the exeption of deletion loops that can't handle liquid above a certain temperature, they need a few extra safety guards.
The deletion-loops pull from the main loop when it detects something warm enough for it to delete heat from and puts it in right before the liquid reservoir, and immediately after the liquid reservoir stuff is shoved back into the main loop once the liquid is as cold as it can safely get for that cooling loop. The freshly cooled cooling liquid is then put into the main loop trough another liquid reservoir that acts as a buffer between the two loops.
The regulating-loops are hooked up to the mainline so they pull cooling liquid below a set temperature from the mainline and put it into the regulating-loop just in front of the water liquid reservoir, while cooling liquid that is above a set temperature is pulled out of the regulating-loop right after the liquid reservoir and then put into another liquid reservoir "buffer" that leads to the mainline.
So liquid gets cooled down and heated up in a mish-mash of rooms and systems, but all the little liquid blobs eventually go and get themselves sucked up into a room where its current temperature is exactly what it needs to be. But... unless the base has a nice and systematic grid-like structure.. instant death by spaghetti!
I'd love to see a demonstration of that.
Niiiice! I did something similar with my base's super apartment xD
I ran a radiant pipe from below to the top inside the walls passing super coolant cooled down to 20 degrees! That way I can control the temperature of the building in a easier way then cooling down the air pumped there! Another awesome experiment Brothgar, Thanks!
AAEEE PESTE
dats alot of power just to grow some cold grass
Delicious grass
Brothgar
I made a bristle blossom farm inside my base, keeping it cool by running a radiant pipe loop on the plants themselves rather than the area around. By chilling the plants with conduction contact and radiant pipes, I don't have to worry about cooling the 40 degree incoming water or cooling the air. It averaged out to 23 degree air and 29 degree plants when I set the loop to 16 degrees. I got the water from cold biomes and a cool slush geyser. But, you can do the same with an aquatuner or natural gas generators. The one thing to keep in mind is that I used pipe bridges (using the guide from Emily from discord) to prioritize the loop and not let input in until there is room. I also kept the coolant input pipe full. Bridges are definitely the way. It makes sure the loop is always 100% full, but never overfilled or slowed.
if you want a challange stop using your cool slush geyser ^^
@@Alrion1704 why tho? It outputs 120% the water my steam vent does, it cools my plants, oil processor plant, and bottom of my base, and I use it on a loop for my steam vents and my petroleum loop in my refineries. I could get rid of it and I'd need to start tapping my water geyser I don't use, which is under dozens of tons of oil, and I'd need to basically just use a bunch more natural gas power and heat deletion of steam/coolant. I guess I should do that, but I specifically cheated and used a seed with a medium/high output cool slush.
Auqatuner on top of the liquid bridge, with a liquid pipe thermo sensor (linked to a NOT-gate) connected to the Aquatuner.
If the temperature doesn't engage the aquatuner it will automatically bypass into the cooling loop.
Nice video this has helped me out :D Thanks for making so much amazing content Brothgar you really keep me so motivated to play Oxygen not included and try out all these automated things! I love it :D
Cool.
I really need to chill whit these puns...
@@brothgar you thoroughly enjoy your lenny faces, dont you? XD
@@jackradzelovage6961 the faces are the reason I make jokes at this point
Those reservoirs are a huge epiphany for me, thanks for showing us, again, how its done right! Great job! keep up the good work!
Even though the clean water going to the sleet wheat is in insulated pipes, they are still getting colder and could potentially freeze after many cycles. An easy safety measure would be to circulate the water back to the tank for temperature regulation.
I just use this method as a sleet wheat + pincha farm, but im just using a cooling loop with hydrogen instead, wich is slower, but uses less power. Just throw in a bunch of termal sensors and you're good to go. The heat produced by the thermo regulators goes into the pincha zone, so it's balanced out (heat goes pincha, cold goes sleet) in addition to that, you just use some valves to control de Flow of water into the sleet so you don't end up heating up the enviorment with it, and you can even pre cool it down a little bit. What's important is to cool down the dirt, because you're puting 20kg (I think) of it every day, and that could potentially heat up the enviorment. For the doors I just use a triple door with a weight plate sensor on the first, conected into a buffer gate, and into the middle one, (close, re-open sequence). Once is stabilized, it runs quite smooth, and you can get the best food posible out of it. (60sleet wheat+15 pincha=25 dupes aprox)
Can you share a picture of your farm setup as I really like the notion of using the excess cold to heat a pincha farm?
For a farm, at least mushrooms and lice for glossy drecko you can do a hydrogen filled room with worts using granite pipes also filled with hydrogen cycling through them.
Worts really amp up their effectiveness when in hydrogen.
I don’t think temperature averaging is the way to go. Temperatures change faster the greater the difference, so having spots that are really cold will remove heat from an area faster. Averaging them makes the cooling stall until the liquid kicks out. You don’t notice it so much when you are cooling a 70 degree area and kicking it out at 20 but I use a system where I bring polluted water up to 40 from steam water above 40 and when they are nearly the same it stalls.
That max temp for the sensor is about 10,000 Kelvin, which is the temperature that, when I last tested, crashes the game. You will see that anything that doesn't melt has that melting point, like neutronium and genetic ooze.
This idea i liked from the start. Made sort of an Air conditioner for the base and hydrogen cooling loop for my generator room. Now to see if the temperature can be controlled even with door access/es. Dupe can't get enough frost buns and pepper bread.
Ever since your Flush your Heat Away vid, I've been wanting to see an experiment like this. Thanks.
I love your videos because I can watch and learn then get ideas on how to improve my own base. I have always struggled to find ways of managing the temperature of aqua tuner because eventually everything heats up. I got an idea (though basic) was to just have a cycling reservoir of cold Polluted Water from a Slush Geyser that refills itself once it gets too hot. If there is no slush on the map I was thinking of using the Polluted from Natural Gas Generators as that makes it based off temp.
You can use cooling loops with crude oil, then destroy the heat in a petroleum generator. Use water to cool then destroy the heat in a carbon skimmer.
The best thing you can do is using the aquatuner in a steam enviroment with a steam turbine to destroy a lot of heat.
I feel sometimes kind of cheating when using stuff like that, but in the end the game creates heat. So in all fairness its ok to destroy it.
So, how about a base wide "In-floor" heating/cooling system for all non-exosuit areas for the ultimate automation challenge? Perhaps add in the toilet-based heat-flusher system to handle all the aqua-tuner heat?
Broth, would you be interested in doing a video talking about the science behind thermal conductivity, mass and any other relevant concepts?
"I'm tired of being cold!"
*Wears only a t-shirt*
I noticed the petroleum going into the system was really cold @ 17:17. Does that affect the amount of heat being output by the presses? Would the cooling loop still be as efficient with hot petroleum input?
So, if I'm hearing this right, that means we should be using the petroleum for cooling purposes so that we can delete even more heat.
I know you were done with How to start tutorials, but I enjoy watching bases start from scratch to super bases. I can usually only make it to about cycle 98 ish before I lose.
"All the petroleum in the worl---"
"DID SOMEBODY SAY OIL?!!" (US invasion in progress)
Hey Brothgar,
You almost have the radiator in the first part correct. You however mixed up the order of the bridges. You want the water entering the system to drop in after the bridge coming off the valve. Because bridges only drop in liquid if there is room the the pipe. That is why yours backed up. You have the bridge order reversed. Check out a post on Reddit called "taming cool steam vents" it has a diagram for how to do it properly.
Good luck!!
The water going to the plants could potentially cool down too much. Wouldn't it be better to keep temperature controlling that?
What about reversing the process, mid to late game auto kiln similar to you egg cooker?
Using the iron meteors for materials you can get a hot side around 250C, enough to boil polluted water for a steam engine. Taking the same idea, use the metal refinery for heating and liquid glass for a hot oven. Interested to see what other ideas people can come up with.
brothgar Im struggling really bad with making steel do you have any tips or blueprints for a metal refinery.
Towards the end where you have 3 aquatuners in water with steam on top:
Why not use a steam generator to delete the heat and pick up some power and could you find out if that's enough heat to be power positive?
Brothgar sensei has given me what my dumb brain never did, thank you. finally i'll have a Sleet Wheat farm after so many fails, again, thank you.
The heat transfert is better with the pipes inside the tiles? What if the room was full of hydrogen?
Yes, please an experiment about the best conductivity for cooling a gas (especially hydrogen) or does it only worth to save some cooling energy on a place?
@@flexoking8047 do you mean what would be the best cool stuff arround a gas pipe filled with hot hydrogen? > metal or liquid tile. both can store a lot of "cool" and excange the temp farly quickly.
or do you just want liquid hydrogen? than he allredy has a video for that
Argh thank you so much. My poor bases always end in horrible heat death.
On the new Rime map, the heating loop is quite useful!
dont know if youve done this yet but, is it possible to build separate sealed off rooms underwater connected with transit tubes?
i belive i watched all his videos, he never done it cause had no reason to. but yes its absolute posible.
only channel i watch with AD block disabled
great video. gives me some ideas that will help simplify cooling solutions for my bases. I'm curious how much videos like these affect the development of the game. I wonder if they will change the buildings that delete heat, or if they did that on purpose to make the game more sustainable over the long run. ONI has come a long way since i first purchased it, and you were incredibly lucky to make it to 100 cycles before heat death and misery destroyed everything.
dev was asked many time, same answer; fix output temp is here to stay.
@@Alrion1704 thanks for the response, that's good to know. So many tips to playing this game it's hard to know whats a planned outcome and what is going to get patched or changed in the future.
Damn you did a sleet wheat farm I am happy
Hey, can this cooling loop be used to heat a base? With the right conversion, of course.
13:25 Thank you for your help : I'll pretend like you were never here ^^ Disrespect spotted ^^ Case raised to Duplicant's Right League ^^ :)
Hey Brothgar, you make great stuff, but could you help out ? Every ONI player knows that what plagues most late game bases is overheating problem, which will surely come to mine once i feed base 70 C oxygen from electrolyzer. So, some clever ideas, preferably some that dont need rows of thermal regulators consuming every bit of energy or wheezeworts everywhere (need them for other apllications) ?
you know what your problem is, 70C° oxygen
! dont cool hydrogen cause its waste
1. use water if cooler as 70C° to cool down oxygen exiting your electrolyser bevor destroing the water/heat in the electrolyser. if you using water from watersieve you get oxygen down to 45c° allready
2. 4x wheezewort in hydrogen room can cool down 1kg/s of oxygen from 70c° to 20c° (if you cool your oxygen you can spare them in your base)
3. cold biome (should hold for 200 cycles+)
4. aquatuner + steamturbine for lategame and mass oxygen/hydrogen cooling till its liquid even. (it does not use 1200w constant)
choose 1, cause in the end you will have to cool it or watch your dupes melt =)
Great video, as ever. Love the concept, much cleaner than running a bunch of spaghetti pipes in the background. A question I have though - for all these cooling things that use aquatuners, how best do you keep the liquid they're submerged in cool, or where is the best source for that liquid? A cool slush geyser? Or can you just use any liquid, and hope that running a radiant pipe full of PH2O through it (before it heads to a water sieve to delete the heat) is enough?
How about gasoline? You can dump much more heat (even more than tuners from usual materials can handle) and delete it with gas engine. Though, most people use steam turbines due to abundance of hot water.
to keep them cool you can use a steam turbine and water, when the steam gets too hot it passes trough a steam turbine and its temperature gets lowered, aquatuners need to be made out of steel but it's not much of a problem in my opinion
in the end you need to destroy heat; wheezewort for small cooling / watersieve + co2 scruber for medium /aquatuner + steamturbine for large amounts of heat
Thanks for the video
What if you put a vent for the carbon dioxide being produced right next to the respective polymer presses, and then used the fixed temperature polluted water output of skimmers to cool down the polymer presses?
would lower the temp, but cause its only few g/s of carbon dioxite the cooling potential would be not that great.
@@Alrion1704 seems like the same deal here, though, isn it?
Cold... COLD?!?
*Looks outside* - Snow and ice melting everywhere, big puddles of slushy water on the roads...
Snow and ice? Look outside - it's basically spring outside...
...At least here, in Hungary.
@@petint spring was outside today in England too
Now here's a little lesson in Plumbery
@@cannedjd3289 If you wanna be a plumber number one, you have to never do any plumbing ever and stomp poor creatures just for fun
8:00 i keep looking for reservour in the plumbing tab to =)
What do you use to edit videos?
But for what? you can create free cooling system with Wheezeworts, hudrogen and pipe loop.
I need only 2 to cool oxygen from 70'C to 15'C. Also move hudrogen is not such a problem, after air botteler was added.
you can do this before finding any weezeworts, considering that cold biomes rarely spawn next to the starting biome.
@@Ghorda9 oh yee, create about 1.5k energy/sec before finding cold biome...
@@artemonikon not everyone wants to explore deep "early".
this is why i cool almost all the water entering my base, and wonder why everyone complains about heat creep. literally flushing out the heat. have been using this and similar . was the only way to survive thermal updates temp reset problems if you were not using them for too many glitches
Floor heating? Yes we have that built beneath our living room floor
jelauos
I fkin love your videos. Subbed
If you did some live streams you can get tips and subs that way as well. Maybe a Friday night live stream of killing Dupes in funny ways....but also doing real time challenges for donations, like 20$ have all your dupes only work 4 hours a day or something for 30 minutes...
Also you need a merch store if you don't already have one. I bought the quad copter you showcased and would like carbon fiber wings...my wife is mad of my flying it around inside the house....very fun though and fits in your pocket. Excellent content.
What's keeping the Aquatuner and water around it from overheating/boiling ??
they not running all the time
nothing, it would overheat in some cycles. you can imagine a steamturbine over them if you would use it in real play
Just his morning I googled sleetwheat farm...are you a sorcerer Brothgar?
have fun building one to get the mechanics learned, but if you realy want food meat is the way to go. you get more kcal for dupes and resources invested. drecko+balmlilly in chlorine set it and forget it meat farm =)
@@Alrion1704 I've just been doing it to have one of everything tbh. I've just never managed to get the sleetwheat temperature stable
If you use metal tiles it wouls increase even more The heat tranafer
I want to know how you'd deal with playing on the ice world map
what a you refering to? naver had a ice map random generated, challenge map?
do you play VR games still?
...this week on Brother gets baked...
you are standing up>?
where did "brothgar" come from?
I think it's referring to microbiological growth media. I.E. agar plates and bacterial broth tubes.
@@crubs83 would make sense lol
How do you do insta-dig and insta-deconstruct?
Developer hotkeys
look up dev tools
hey there anyone here who know how to instant destroy only the piping? my sandbox destroy button just destroy everything in the square, not only the plumbing ?
blown air heating is far more effective than radiant heating
1:00 welcome to canada
how about gas looping?
same princip, but gas has less mass. for small rooms ok.
Maybe heat some gas with the heat and shoot it into space!
I cool my petroleum generator to -18°C so they make more cool polluted water
ITS OVER 9000! lol
i did natsee that coming
Can this idea be BLOWN UP TO BASE SIZE LEVELS!?!!!!?!!!!!
could you think of a reason that could stop you?
Might need booster stations to keep the temp down, but other than that, it should work.
U should play a mobile game so I can play along
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