Subtle changes over time can lead to huge deviations. People often point one step back and say things are almost the same. However of course this is not a true comparison.
@@uncorrelatedmormonism00000000000b0000000000000b00000000000000000000000000000000000000000b00000b0000b0000000000000000b0000000000b000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000b0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000b0b0b0b0bb0b0b0b0b0b0b0b00b0b0b0b0b0b000b00b0b0b0b0b00bb0bb00bb00b0000b00b0b0b0b000bb0bb0b0b0b0b00bb0b0b00b0bb0bb0b0 b00b0b0b0b0b00bb0b0bb0bb0bb0b0b0b00bbb0b00b000bb0b00b0b0b00b0b00bb00b000b0b0b00b0000b0b0b0 0b00bbb0b0b00b0b0b00b0b00bb0b0b00b00b00b00b0b0000b0b0b00bb0b00b0b00b0b0bo 0b0b0b0b0b b0b0b0o b0b00b0b00b0b0bb000b00b0b00 b0b0bb00bb00b0b00b0b0bb00bb 00b0b00b0 b000b0b0b 00b0bb0b00b000b0b0b00bb00b0bb0000b0 00b00b 0 00b 0bb0 0b 0b00b0b0 0b0b0 b00 j 0b00b0ob0b bb0 b; b ; b; b b b b b b o b. 9bb b b biob; b ib b n b i ; 9b b b i9b i ii b 9b b o i i i oi i ii i i i i i i i i i i i ii i i i i 0b 0 0 b 0b0. 0b0 0b0. 0 b o
Conference has little to do with leading others to Christ. Rather, the objective is to self-sustain one another's authority and teach "doctrines" that only enrich the church. You're doing a great job exposing these fraudsters.
@uncorrelatedmormonism Furthermore, we see many members, immediately after or even during a specific talk, rush to social media, gushing over the words of these men. It's a strange form of virtue signaling within this culture and little to do with the love of truth.
So I just read and highlighted Bednar's talk and what I found most disturbing is that not once did he mention the necessity for repentance. He quoted a scripture that refers to having "faith in him", but that's it. The entire focus of the talk is in participating in priesthood/church ordinances and rituals. He speaks about going to church and going to the temple to experience peace, reflect on things, and focus on teachings, in order to "be still and know that I am God." I find it most alarming and incredible that he does not teach repentance as the foremost requirement for receiving peace and the blessings of the gospel. Bednar is a false prophet. That much is clear. All true prophets teach faith in Christ, repentance, baptism, and the gift of the Holy Ghost. The whole thing hinges on repentance. Repentance is vital. But Bednar teaches ordinances and renewing covenants, without repentance, like these are some king of magic wand to magic us into God's good favor and to receive the peaceable things of the Spirit without the prerequisite repentance required for qualifying ourselves for such things.
That is a good observation. Essentially, he is subtly moving Christ to the backburner and switching him with the LDS church. In the LDS church, there is no need to change inwardly. You just have to be temple worthy (obedient to leaders) and you will be fine.
You reference the second half of Ephesians 2:20 that says Jesus is the chief cornerstone. But why did you ommit the first half Ephesians 2:20? That says: "And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets...."
Because that had nothing to do with the subject and no one was disagreeing with that. In LDS belief we assume that means current leaders, however Paul would never have meant that. He would never have assumed that just because you have a title then you have authority from God. The NT church was build upon the apostles (NT) and the prophets (OT). Yes, I do think the LDS leaders are apostles of Christ's name. However the NT apostles were apostles of Christ himself. This is a massive difference.
Psalms 46 writen by the guys that started a coo against Moses Now keep in mind Moses Aaron Miriam Joseph Abinadie Moroni Coriantum Lot ect all followed God and had sad endings
Yes, and our rebellion is much deeper than you know... The church teaching that coming here to gain a body being a rightous decision is a grand diabolical lie that right off the bat puts us on a false foundation and path.
I find it funny how all these men pride themselves in speaking pretended parables of the kingdom of heaven. In reality it makes them look all the more insecure of what is happening to the church and it's shaky doctrines and behaviors that fail to align with the Word of God.
I understand that the fancy language and teaching appeals to some people. I get that. However, as I have been going through these talks the more I realize how basic things really are and should be. All Bednar really needs to do is stand up there and talk about what Christ means to him and how Christ has changed his life. Then he can sit down and the next person can do the same.
@@uncorrelatedmormonism A! MEN! I keep thinking how unalive too many messages are because they don't expound nor share how these words are fulfilled in their own life. That is not a testimony but rather a lecture.
You added words to Bedbar's talk. He didn't say the only places you can meet is in church, the temple, and the approved places. He said this is where the church meets or has its meetings, which is correct for our day. We have meeting places while the early church did not, so they met in someone's house. If they had a meeting house or chapel, I'm pretty sure they would have met there rather than in a house. Bednar didn't say that Jesus or the spirit doesn't come to people who meet in other places. The church teaches that we should make our homes temples. Your comparison with the early church and today was not a fair or accurate one. If your focus is to attack church leaders or what other people say rather than just preaching the gospel I suggest you think about Isaiah 53:6 which says like sheep we have all gone astray eveyone his own way. Or D&C 84 it says condemnation rests on the children of Zion, even all. We have been asked by Jesus to feed his sheep. Tearing down others or criticizing leaders is not the way to share the gospel. As members of the church, we are all supposed to be watchmen, it's not talking about just the leaders of the church today. We need to include ourselves with the watchmen. I think a lot of people who only focus on the sins and short comings of church leaders are in for a big surprise when they also don't measure up to the Lord's standards and will be swept off the land with the very leaders they are condemning.
I didn't add anything. I may have interpreted them incorrectly, but I didn't add anything. I do agree with you that we should be introspective. Jesus' entire sermon on the mount was an exercise in introspection. Lets be honest though, if a Bishop said he didn't want to meet at the church building anymore but a local park, do you think the leaders would be okay with that?
@@uncorrelatedmormonism Again, you claimed that Bednar said we can only meet in the church or approved buildings. He didn't say that. He said this is where the church meets. Obviously, we can gather outside of official church meetings and the spirit can be there. This is supposed to happen with ministering visits and missionary visits etc and etc. He also didn't claim that Jesus or the Holy Ghost only comes to people meeting in approved places as you implied. As long as church buildings are available I don't see a Bishop suggesting meeting in a park. I can see it happening if no church is available. I'm pretty sure the pioneers had church meeting outside of churches as they traveled to Utah.
@@MarkHigbee His language was "meetinghouses and other approved facilities". Based on my reading then he is saying those are the only places we can appropriately worship God. I don't think he was saying those are the only places, but they would be the only places to do it in an LDS way. You didn't answer my question though. If an LDS bishop just wanted to permanently meet in a park, would the leadership allow it? If not then why?
@@uncorrelatedmormonism Again Bednar didn't say meeting houses or approved facilities were the only places that the spirit or Jesus would come to as you claim. The church uses tithing money to build meetinghouses. It would make little sense that a Bishop would want to take church to a park when a church is available so your question is not very relevant. But, yes if a church is available and a Bishop decided to hold all the meetings in a park indefinitely, his Stake President would probably have issues with that, and rightly so.
@@MarkHigbee I didn't say he said that. You are shifting the goal post. If the church had issues with a Bishop doing what he felt best, in this hypothetical case, then what does that say about the overall concept?
Are you saying that because I am not an apostle then I can't have an opinion on something. As I showed Psalms would have been a better choice. Can you show how I was wrong?
Are the apostles' opinions any better than the opinion of somebody else? It sounds like someone may be allowing power and authority to be maintained by virtue of the priesthood.
Nope...never said you can't have an opinion. Have a million of em. What I am saying is when it comes to matters of the gospel I will listen to the Apostles and Prophets opinions over almost anybody else...
@@rdancranston so what about their opinions makes them more valuable than others' opinions. Imagine if these men were just leaders of any church speaking the same words but weren't apostles and prophets, would you value these exact same opinions less because of their change in priesthood office?
@@rdancranston I think we should start with the assumption that the leaders of a group are correct when discussing things of their group. However, we should never assume they are always correct. The leaders of the LDS church have been wrong about things numerous times.
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hope you do more analysis of the talks
Fantastic analysis and thoughts, as usual. False doctrine is almost always very subtle, so these critiques are very useful. Thank you.
Subtle changes over time can lead to huge deviations. People often point one step back and say things are almost the same. However of course this is not a true comparison.
@@uncorrelatedmormonism00000000000b0000000000000b00000000000000000000000000000000000000000b00000b0000b0000000000000000b0000000000b000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000b0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000b0b0b0b0bb0b0b0b0b0b0b0b00b0b0b0b0b0b000b00b0b0b0b0b00bb0bb00bb00b0000b00b0b0b0b000bb0bb0b0b0b0b00bb0b0b00b0bb0bb0b0 b00b0b0b0b0b00bb0b0bb0bb0bb0b0b0b00bbb0b00b000bb0b00b0b0b00b0b00bb00b000b0b0b00b0000b0b0b0 0b00bbb0b0b00b0b0b00b0b00bb0b0b00b00b00b00b0b0000b0b0b00bb0b00b0b00b0b0bo 0b0b0b0b0b b0b0b0o b0b00b0b00b0b0bb000b00b0b00 b0b0bb00bb00b0b00b0b0bb00bb 00b0b00b0 b000b0b0b 00b0bb0b00b000b0b0b00bb00b0bb0000b0 00b00b 0 00b 0bb0 0b 0b00b0b0 0b0b0 b00 j 0b00b0ob0b bb0 b; b ; b; b b b b b b o b. 9bb b b biob; b ib b n b i ; 9b b b i9b i ii b 9b b o i i i oi i ii i i i i i i i i i i i ii i i i i 0b 0 0 b 0b0. 0b0 0b0. 0 b o
Conference has little to do with leading others to Christ. Rather, the objective is to self-sustain one another's authority and teach "doctrines" that only enrich the church.
You're doing a great job exposing these fraudsters.
Conference does seem to be a time to make sure everyone is in alignment with whatever the new policy is.
@uncorrelatedmormonism
Furthermore, we see many members, immediately after or even during a specific talk, rush to social media, gushing over the words of these men. It's a strange form of virtue signaling within this culture and little to do with the love of truth.
Church is a people not a building
So I just read and highlighted Bednar's talk and what I found most disturbing is that not once did he mention the necessity for repentance. He quoted a scripture that refers to having "faith in him", but that's it. The entire focus of the talk is in participating in priesthood/church ordinances and rituals. He speaks about going to church and going to the temple to experience peace, reflect on things, and focus on teachings, in order to "be still and know that I am God." I find it most alarming and incredible that he does not teach repentance as the foremost requirement for receiving peace and the blessings of the gospel. Bednar is a false prophet. That much is clear. All true prophets teach faith in Christ, repentance, baptism, and the gift of the Holy Ghost. The whole thing hinges on repentance. Repentance is vital. But Bednar teaches ordinances and renewing covenants, without repentance, like these are some king of magic wand to magic us into God's good favor and to receive the peaceable things of the Spirit without the prerequisite repentance required for qualifying ourselves for such things.
That is a good observation. Essentially, he is subtly moving Christ to the backburner and switching him with the LDS church.
In the LDS church, there is no need to change inwardly. You just have to be temple worthy (obedient to leaders) and you will be fine.
Agreed. It is now the church of follow the prophet, pay your tithing, and attend the temple. @@uncorrelatedmormonism
You reference the second half of Ephesians 2:20 that says Jesus is the chief cornerstone.
But why did you ommit the first half Ephesians 2:20?
That says:
"And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets...."
Because that had nothing to do with the subject and no one was disagreeing with that. In LDS belief we assume that means current leaders, however Paul would never have meant that. He would never have assumed that just because you have a title then you have authority from God.
The NT church was build upon the apostles (NT) and the prophets (OT). Yes, I do think the LDS leaders are apostles of Christ's name. However the NT apostles were apostles of Christ himself. This is a massive difference.
Psalms 46 writen by the guys that started a coo against Moses
Now keep in mind Moses Aaron Miriam Joseph Abinadie Moroni Coriantum Lot ect all followed God and had sad endings
That is a good observation. I think we all are rebellious against God though.
Yes, and our rebellion is much deeper than you know... The church teaching that coming here to gain a body being a rightous decision is a grand diabolical lie that right off the bat puts us on a false foundation and path.
I find it funny how all these men pride themselves in speaking pretended parables of the kingdom of heaven. In reality it makes them look all the more insecure of what is happening to the church and it's shaky doctrines and behaviors that fail to align with the Word of God.
I understand that the fancy language and teaching appeals to some people. I get that.
However, as I have been going through these talks the more I realize how basic things really are and should be. All Bednar really needs to do is stand up there and talk about what Christ means to him and how Christ has changed his life. Then he can sit down and the next person can do the same.
@@uncorrelatedmormonism A! MEN! I keep thinking how unalive too many messages are because they don't expound nor share how these words are fulfilled in their own life. That is not a testimony but rather a lecture.
You added words to Bedbar's talk. He didn't say the only places you can meet is in church, the temple, and the approved places. He said this is where the church meets or has its meetings, which is correct for our day. We have meeting places while the early church did not, so they met in someone's house. If they had a meeting house or chapel, I'm pretty sure they would have met there rather than in a house.
Bednar didn't say that Jesus or the spirit doesn't come to people who meet in other places. The church teaches that we should make our homes temples. Your comparison with the early church and today was not a fair or accurate one.
If your focus is to attack church leaders or what other people say rather than just preaching the gospel I suggest you think about Isaiah 53:6 which says like sheep we have all gone astray eveyone his own way. Or D&C 84 it says condemnation rests on the children of Zion, even all.
We have been asked by Jesus to feed his sheep. Tearing down others or criticizing leaders is not the way to share the gospel.
As members of the church, we are all supposed to be watchmen, it's not talking about just the leaders of the church today. We need to include ourselves with the watchmen.
I think a lot of people who only focus on the sins and short comings of church leaders are in for a big surprise when they also don't measure up to the Lord's standards and will be swept off the land with the very leaders they are condemning.
I didn't add anything. I may have interpreted them incorrectly, but I didn't add anything.
I do agree with you that we should be introspective. Jesus' entire sermon on the mount was an exercise in introspection.
Lets be honest though, if a Bishop said he didn't want to meet at the church building anymore but a local park, do you think the leaders would be okay with that?
@@uncorrelatedmormonism Again, you claimed that Bednar said we can only meet in the church or approved buildings. He didn't say that. He said this is where the church meets. Obviously, we can gather outside of official church meetings and the spirit can be there. This is supposed to happen with ministering visits and missionary visits etc and etc.
He also didn't claim that Jesus or the Holy Ghost only comes to people meeting in approved places as you implied.
As long as church buildings are available I don't see a Bishop suggesting meeting in a park. I can see it happening if no church is available. I'm pretty sure the pioneers had church meeting outside of churches as they traveled to Utah.
@@MarkHigbee His language was "meetinghouses and other approved facilities". Based on my reading then he is saying those are the only places we can appropriately worship God. I don't think he was saying those are the only places, but they would be the only places to do it in an LDS way.
You didn't answer my question though. If an LDS bishop just wanted to permanently meet in a park, would the leadership allow it? If not then why?
@@uncorrelatedmormonism Again Bednar didn't say meeting houses or approved facilities were the only places that the spirit or Jesus would come to as you claim.
The church uses tithing money to build meetinghouses. It would make little sense that a Bishop would want to take church to a park when a church is available so your question is not very relevant. But, yes if a church is available and a Bishop decided to hold all the meetings in a park indefinitely, his Stake President would probably have issues with that, and rightly so.
@@MarkHigbee I didn't say he said that. You are shifting the goal post.
If the church had issues with a Bishop doing what he felt best, in this hypothetical case, then what does that say about the overall concept?
You believe such and such would've been better in your opinion?... Well...that's why your not an Apostle...thank goodness...
Are you saying that because I am not an apostle then I can't have an opinion on something. As I showed Psalms would have been a better choice. Can you show how I was wrong?
Are the apostles' opinions any better than the opinion of somebody else? It sounds like someone may be allowing power and authority to be maintained by virtue of the priesthood.
Nope...never said you can't have an opinion. Have a million of em. What I am saying is when it comes to matters of the gospel I will listen to the Apostles and Prophets opinions over almost anybody else...
@@rdancranston so what about their opinions makes them more valuable than others' opinions. Imagine if these men were just leaders of any church speaking the same words but weren't apostles and prophets, would you value these exact same opinions less because of their change in priesthood office?
@@rdancranston I think we should start with the assumption that the leaders of a group are correct when discussing things of their group. However, we should never assume they are always correct. The leaders of the LDS church have been wrong about things numerous times.