The Future of the Empire of the Hand in Thrawn's Revenge
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 13 ต.ค. 2024
- Corey breaks down what's coming for the Empire of the Hand faction in Empire at War Expanded: Thrawn's Revenge through .3 and .4
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To be honest, the main thing that kept me from doing a campaign as the EotH was their outdated ground units, I would usually just play around with them in the battle mode, so I'm happy to hear that their turn is coming around in the near future. Excited for future updates.
Honestly, given that Zahn initially created the Chiss with the introduction of Grand Admiral Thrawn and his continued, dedicated efforts to try to bridge the gap that exists between Canon and Legends, I think your logic is entirely sound. I can't fault your decision and I'm not sure others can as well, unless they really try to do so.
Using cannon sources to help "fill out" a faction without conflicting with existing legends material is a good idea, it makes sense. I don't agree with most post return of the jedi cannon being added but the chiss lore was pretty thin in legends from what i remember.
As much as you may hate or like the lore you have to admit they made some pretty banger ships for all factions which I would like to see in a Star Wars expanded and just added in to fit with legends
@@ManoraManYT which ship?
@@isthisit781 Mainly like the star hawk and resurgent they are very unique in my opinion and they just seem like they would fit into legends somehow and the mc75 is also neat the chiss house ships while not having designs could be unique as well and since the resurgent was built at the capital of the Pentastar alignment it could fit into the Pentastar as a strong and powerful carrier/destroyer for them and the star hawk could be apart of the new class project which would make sense and the mc75 would be a early ships used by the new republic there are some others of course but those are the main ones
@@isthisit781 Another favorite is the mc85 and 95 I like mom calamari ships
@@ManoraManYT mc75 is one of my favorite ships even though i thought the movie was crap. The mc85 on the other hand seems like a reskinned star defender. As far as the star hawk is concerned, i know very little about it. I was under the impression it was supposed to have been made from piecing together several isd's with a tomahawk front and would look more like mels miniatures original design. I think its current design is one of the ugliest is starwars.
Have to hand it to you, I'm excited for this! Their current ground roster in particular is the main reason I've never finished an EotH campaign.
i personally would love to see more videos like this, thank you very much for the update. Im extremely excited to try out the new EOTH once they're ready!
In my most recent playthrough the last two factions were me(empire) and the empire of the hand. Like literally we split the map down the middle. Your points of ground units haunt my dreams
I reckon it would be good if the Empire of the Hand had limited access to some imperial roster units, only one or two ground and space units just to give a bit more speciality and varience to them
I'd love to see the weapons from the thrawn trilogy be added: plasma spheres and spectrum lasers. And in later tiers have those weapons be upgraded into megamasers. I'd think of it as a blending of chiss and imperial technology
This is great Corey, I love playing at the EOTH! Do you think you will re-enable the shorter retreat time? I think that was always such a cool and unique feature of the faction compared to others.
Only if they had some other tradeoff elsewhere. That hasn't been considered yet.
@@CoreyLoses Ok, well, just know it was a really interesting and fun mechanic that set them apart. But I also understanding wanting to make them a bit more aligned with the other faction mechanics.
Maybe even a 7 second vs. 10 second boost would be helpful. Idk, just something to consider!
Oh cool stuff! It's gonna be nice e having more going on on that side of the map.
But man, it's getting hard to watch these previews because I want to play it! I am so excited for the new Dark Empire stuff! You guys took a system I already liked dialed up to 11!
I'm really excited to see Canon timeline content being implemented. 99% of mods are Legends focused so it is nice to have a little more variety.
Keep up the great work and cant wait for .3 and beyond
I love the idea of filling the blanks with canon Chess lore! I personally love the canon Thrawn books, so it'll be cool to be able to play around with heroes from them! But in general it sounds like it'll add a lot of depth and flavor to the faction! I'm hyped for the next few updates!
Love these videos Corey, there's no way I'd go through washing my dishes without them.
So excited for this! Just to be clear, Nightdragon, Groundlion, and Firewolf are names of specific ship classes rather than types. For instance, it would make sense for a ship to be called a Nightdragon Man-Of-War, but not a Phalanx-class Nightdragon. Man-Of-War seems to be the term used for the largest warships in the CEDF, and the name of individual classes seem to follow a standardized naming convention (Adjective+animal)
The point is that we're trying to adapt parts of what they're doing without having to redo and rename the entire faction.
@@CoreyLoses oh absolutely! I'm not suggesting you should rename anything - I'm quite partial to the names you have. I am simply trying to clarify what I heard in the video which seemed to erroneously suggest 'Nightdragon' was a ship type, such as a 'Battleship' rather than the name of a specific class of Man-Of-War. Regardless of what you decide to do, I'm eager for more stunning Chiss ships.
I'm also quite excited to see Paccosh, Paataatus, and Garwian ships make an appearance. Are you able to reveal what sort of niches their ships will fill?
I just recently finished the Thrawn and ascendancy Trilogies, so im quite exited that you are importing some of the people and places from the books, thats awesome!
What a nice surprise to kick off the week.
My biggest issue with the EOTH was their lack of an air troop transport unit (or any reliable troop transport unit for that matter), so hoping to see something like that added for the ground roster!
Yes, though it was always cool that their fast speeder units can capture pads and reinforcement points. That kind of made it up for me.
@@mihajlo961x I actually never realized that! thanks for the tip, I’ll definitely implement that strategy in my next play through
@@iiBlAkE159 my pleasure! Enjoy :)
@@iiBlAkE159 just so you know, eoth speeder bikes cant capture anymore, that has been fixed in 3.2
@@M3TR0POLIS I have experienced a rollercoaster of emotions with this information
Honestly having some stuff from the Ascendancy Trilogy brought into the EOTH might make me play them again.
Nice to see the Empire of the Hand is getting changed and more stuff in the unknown region when i played it was kind of stale.
Awesome stuff Corey! ❤. Thankyou so much! I’m really excited for the new ground roster for Empire of the Hand and the Unknown Regions map! 😍😍
Great work as always! I do hope that the Chiss planet that was used for training pilots will get some use
It's good that you are taking stuff from the Ascendancy trilogy since almost everything fits into the EU and was created by Zahn anyway.
Excited for the rework lol at this point I would be happy with some generic Imperial troops to flesh out their ground roster until 3.4. I miss have a gunship and scout speeders in ground assaults.
Please, don't forget the 501st for the EotH
They've been there for over a decade
just had this video pop up in my feed and it looks super interesting, i just hope they get some new ships and story events as those are kinda lacking, keep up the good work you guys!
Would it be possible for a few more Imperial ship heroes to be included in the roster if certain conditions are met, certain planets lost to New Republic, Era changes, etc to show imperials fleeing to the unknown regions being picked up? The EOTH I think is the only faction without an economic hero too I think. Just some flavor ideas. I like heroes being unlockable based on certain conditions. Adds a bit of structure to a campaign
There are already 5+ factions made entirely of Imperial units, the game doesn't really nbenefit from taking one of the few other unique factions and adding more overlap.
@@CoreyLoses I can understand that. The roster for EOTH heroes just feels a bit sparse. I suppose more heroes could come from the constituent races that contribute ships you mentioned in the video. I haven't read the Ascendency books so I'm not familiar with the source characters. Would you recommend them? I recently finished Thrawn and thought it was ok but Admiral Thrawn can be kind of a boring protagonist just because he is so good at basically everything.
I enjoyed them well enough, but they could also be pretty boring. Me and EckhartsLadder did some reviews of them on our podcast
@@CoreyLoses I'll check those out. Excited for whenever 3.3 drops
I can't wait to play as the chiss ascendancy, favorite star wars faction by far!
I’m always looking forward to new Chiss and EotH content and units, the designs your team has come up with have been amazing and I think demonstrate the amazing potential for fan contributions to fit within the Star Wars universe. Got dang is the ascendancy destroyer pretty
So because you mentioned the Canon novels having their own ship designs, will we be getting the depiction of Ar'alani's Nightdragon from the comics? There is already a design for it and it looks pretty interesting. I see it sort of like the Providence, but minus the large hangar. A vessel made to face off against other capital ships with a variety of torpedoes and lasers.
No, it's a clear trace of a fighter from a different setting, turned upside down, not an original design. We're not redesigning anything to factor in a design that lazy and which would probably get ignored even by future visuals in canon.
@@CoreyLoses Oh wow, I didn't know that. I knew that modern Star Wars comics are pretty lazy, but this is somethind I did not realize. What setting is it from just so I can see the orginal? Your team does great work btw and I have greatly enjoyed playing your mods. Also wanted to mention that some of the bigger Chiss Ships look like Manta Ray's.
@@Lair_of_Adair if I remember correctly it's a fighter from Macross without the wings
@@nerdyspinosaurid VF-25 Messiah from Macross Frontier.
Great News! But what about the Yuuzhan Vong? I always wanted to fight them in Thrawns Revenge.
If you look at the era screen when starting any campaign you can see the intention is to go to the Vong and beyond. There are a total of 11 era settings with only 7 available now.
Vong are being worked on very slowly in the background as they flesh out other stuff
We've made some Vong assets but they're the lowest priority faction. Everyone else is on the map in some form in periods we already cover, so Vong make the most sense to leave aside until we get to a place where everything else is at least somewhat set up.
@@CoreyLoses will the vong be playable
Cory its good to see one of my fav star wars factions getting some love in a mod and your groups are always good and i like them even better as you take the time to get things working right and looking great so as a fan of all your mods dont worry about how long it takes for things to be brought to the game as they are better when they are perfect and the empire of the hand has always been a hard faction due to its makeup and the lack of proper detail on the races in it and the ships other than the empire and chiss ones but you and your team are doing a great job at giving them and their part of space life
I love the last updates of the TR. Your team did outstanding job. But I kept myself from doing a campaign because of domination of chiss content of the faction.
What about idea to add more imperial, human space and ground units - limited numbers, of course?
Cause EotH has imperial military core. It'll be cool to see some VSDs or ISDs, except the hero units. Maybe limited number of imperial infantry or specforce and hovertanks? Thrawn had blueprints, engineers and training programs to do so.
There are already five other factions which are entirely Imperial which we've put a lot of effort into differentiating, so when people want to use Imperial units, they have more than enough opportunities to do so, not to mention the Yevetha definitely having some Imperial units and. There's also the hero flagships the EotH which have a significant amount of Imperial units within that. We don't have any reason to believe the construction of ships within the EotH would have incldued standard Imperial units, and we do know they had the fusion ones like the Chiss Sd and Clawcraft, which is where we've represented that, so if our options are a wholly unique faction vs a seventh Imperial faction, we're going to avoid that overlap as much as we possibly can
I completely agree with thesis about faction uniqueness. But Corporates are not imperials too and they got their Vsds.
Of course it's idea not to rewrite faction or make EotH another imp warlord faction.
But just add some imperial technologies, and of course they must be limited:
They'll be able to build no more than f.e. 6 Isds or 10 vsds or recruit no more than 10 imperial infantry.
Palps sent some reinforcements to Thrawn so it could make the faction more spicy.
I played the most out of TR with Empire of the Hand mainly because of the very familiar design of the threaded tanks EoTH has, Megamaser? Totally Apocalypse Tank from Red Alert Trilogy, RGT? MBT but way cooler, Flame Tank? Chimera smaller but dealier distant cousin. Laser Tank? Way more believable Modernized Saber Tank without missiles
3:55 this sounds cool, but how will it be implemented? Like the voting/legitimacy mechanic? That way you, the player, can tailor the EotH the way you want to?
Those are government mechanics as well, so sort of, but they all work differently. The closest government mechanic to it would be the CSA ship market.
@@CoreyLoses so you would directly buy the other minor faction ships? That's pretty interesting. Are there any additional steps to simulate the factional nature of the help?
Love this!
So 3.3 is just background stuff plus all factions minus vong being placed on map? Or is this also Hutts and SsiRuvi too?
3.4
EOTH update and Hutts if not added 3.3? Or is this a Chaos update with SsiRuvi and Chiss?
Hopefully dreadnaughts for the hand gets added. I know they weren't a huge faction but something to give them some oomf would for sure suck me in.
Nah they don't need it and having another SSD makes faction less unique
People have asked for a hand dreadnought for like ten years now, hasn't happened
@@kR-qj7rw I mean something huge doesnt mean it has to be an SSD it can be closer to a chiss ship in terms of looks but something bigger would make the roster look better when you get into later eras
They are my favorite fact. To play love the ship design
So, one bit of feedback I have on Thrawn's Revenge is that it's kinda difficult to really get anywhere in the early game. A _lot_ of AI-controlled planets tend to have really big fleets on them from the very start, not only the enemy factions but even the independent worlds.
The AI spawns are just as limited as player one. Independent worlds have more so they don't just get rolled over right as the game starts. We don't plan to reduce the AI forces to lower levels than the player, but if you find it to be too many then you can start as a faction which controls more territory, or play on a map with fewer factions.
It'd be sick if you all added Che'ri as a pilot hero, commanding a squadron of fighters. She should be an adult by the point of the Thrawn's Revenge timeline. The books mention her love of flying. It would make sense that she would agree to be a pilot for Thrawn's Empire of the Hand.
It always felt a little goofy to choose rapid fire tanks over flame tanks so hopefully theres a reason to go rapid now. I hope the rgt stays the medium tank role is one not many other factions have a horse in. The rgt outclasses sabres in my experiance so i hope it sticks around in some capacity. Megamaser tanks are wacky i love them dearly. I wonder if it would make sense to have the hand factor in to imperial legitimacy? It sounds like in the future they'll be tied into chiss politics so maybe it wouldn't make sense but their definitely in an odd spot between the imperial and future chiss factions so maybe?
Edit oh also the munificent class you can build by having influence on muunalinst doesn't spawn fighters but a fighter compliment is listed
I just hope they get stronger starting forces some Integos would be great as the EoTH poor economic region combined with their current starting forces puts them at a massive disadvantage when going against the Empire or the PA with their robust economic regions and dreadnoughts.
Pa.doesnt start with a SSD tho, 20 weeks is plenty of time to kill all of the pa with time to spare
And we'll the team has talked about taking away starting forces from factions and Ssds too like Zsnj starting in a victory instead of iron fist
so what are the plans now for empire of the hand? they're still a bit lacking sth. like there could be missions with the chiss ascendency. Is it also possible to recruit imperial models e.g. venator cruiser or ISD models?
Theres a nightdragon in the Thrawn comic when we see general O'relani I believe
That art was made by tracing an upside down marcross fighter, we wouldn't reference it for anything.
EoTH needs a unique way to advance eras in a progressive GC. It just seems weird to me that they have to kill each Imperial leader that pops up like any other faction. Especially when it's Thrawn's turn at the head of the Remnant. They should have some way of advancing while ignoring the Remnant, for that very reason. I understand that you don't want to encourage turtling behavior, but there needs to be another way than the EoTH proactively going after Thrawn's Remnant, or waiting for the other factions to do it (which doesn't seem to ever happen; I've never seen an AI faction kill the leader of another AI faction, just the heroes).
"Era" isn't "tech level", it's time period. We have already done many announcements and shown a bunch of stuff with the new way eras and progression work, though.
@@CoreyLoses I get it.
Side question; do you intend to add back some things that 3.2 doesn't seem to have right now? For example, I see older versions had a "Shadow Hand" campaign, and I see your in progress 3.3 has it, but 3.2 does not.
Yes, Shadow Hand and the Empire's version of FTGU were cut because of save issues which we're hoping have been resolved in .3.
@@CoreyLoses Awesome!
I think that over differentiating Canon from Legends is not a good idea. For example, it would make sense to consider the Bad Batch (not the actual plot but the characters) part of Legends as well because they were conceived and the unfinished episodes were produced before 2014. So I'm glad you'll be using the Ascendancy Trilogy as source material. Either way, better to use official material from the Canon timeline than rely on fanon.
Any word on the Duskhan League?
They'll be playable again at some point in the future
Why does there seem to be a hesitancy to including canon material? I think it should be done whenever it makes sense and doesn’t directly contradict prior EU/Legends material.
Just as an example, someone like Moff Gideon could be added in as a character for the Empire. He wouldn’t (as far as I can recall) directly conflict with EU material.
I really do think a blend of Canon/EU should be embraced wherever it makes sense.
because for the most part what Disney considers canon absolutely sucks
@@cc0767Cry legends is gone.
@@WhenInDarknessSeekTheLight and so is my interest in star wars with dsney just screwing everything up
Are the vagari gonna make a appearance?
They will be a non-playable faction at some point
@@CoreyLoses it will gonna give the chis something something to do
Could the EotH get boarding shuttles?
Always love to play EotH
Do y’all plan on making galactic campaign multiplayer?
I'm glad you're accepting some canon into this, even if it's just to fill out the roster, with both the EotH getting the canon allies of Thrawn, and the Starhawk and MC-75 for the NR.
Wouldn't really make sense for a Legends mod to include contradictory content outside of roster filler/optional unit toggles, now would it? That'd be like adding Halo units to a realistic WWII era RTS. Cool to do as an optional thing or as a mod, but they're clearly out of place and don't belong as "forced" content.
@@chrismdb5686 …none of that is forced? If you don’t like the unit then don’t build it.
@@galaxyforever70367 Thanks for completely missing my point.
@@chrismdb5686 Please elaborate.
How is the content contradictory? How would it be out of place?
Is it because they weren't in that continuity? I hardly see how that would make a difference, because the Chiss are already designed to be translatable between the two continuities with ease, AND a lot of the designs in these factions are custom or interpretations anyway. And I think there's a difference between seeing the Arbiter in the 1940s, and seeing a slightly different looking blue person in the heroes tab.
Any canon unit added probably would've been Legends anyway, if they hadn't stopped making Legends content for the Chiss in 2017.
And the content is hardly forced. Just kill / delete the unit. Make a sub-mod to remove it if you really care that much.
@@tTaseric 99% of canon content doesn't fit into Legends at all. The Chiss are an outlier in that regard which is why they're being included at all.
The whole point of my comment is that people need to stop hoping for canon content to make more than optional appearances in the mod since it's completely out of place here.
Yes, having First Order units (as are commonly asked for) is just as jarring as watching a Halo Spartan clamber up Normandy beach.
what’s the best faction in tharen’s revenge?
Could the Empire of the Hand also have Imperial-class Star Destroyers?
So EotHs roster is basically all fanon?
Yes, we had to design a roster for the factions since it had no canon designs outside of the Clawcraft.
Simple: they better make a permanent alliance with the GFFA, the Smugglers' Alliance, the Hapes Consortium, and other notable groups and factions so to finally try to explore and colonize the outside of the known galaxy for the glory of all... wait, wrong context.
Please give them some better looking infantry. Droids for example.
The Chiss don't use droids.
Ssi Ruuvi Imperium and Yevethan Dushkan League?
I've been playing Thrawn's Revenge for a while and I SUCK at playing EotH,although it's my favorite faction. Anyone have good tips for how to play them (both for skirmish or campaign mode)?
For era progressive, you need to take Yaga Minor on Turn 1 to prevent the PA from turning into a fortress. From there divide your fleet up and guard your two southernmost planets. Then build up a fleet and army and slowly take over the PA territory. Before turn 20 they don’t have a SSD so you can really expand quick. After that, you can expand into the core or Republic territory at your leisure.
@@crimsonfc3616 Oh wow,thank you!
Do we have a timeline for the release of .3?
No release dates or even estimates yet
Is it possible to play them on all maps ?
No, they're only going to be on the maps which include the Unknown Regions
I'm going to admit I disagree with adding disney era content to an EU mod as I believe there shouldn't be any overlap, even if it is filler.
I just now hope Imperial Reign doesn't throw huge chunks of the EU away in favour of the disney era.
The devs can either use unlicensed (to Legends) work about Chiss from the guy who invented Chiss or make it up themselves. This isn’t some usurpation of continuity, it’s fitting some work into the large gaps Legends leaves.
Imperial Reign will have a strict separation between the two continuities because little to nothing will need to be invented.
Cry angel canon is better anyways
comment for the algorithm
I still really wish they had access to something like a SSD, just something really big to slug it out against the other factions instead of relying on smaller ships.
Not even an SSD, and Praetor-II or Mediator equivalent Heavy Battlecruiser would go an long way
That's not the faction design. It would be like the Hapans getting an SSD.
And from a balance perspective, it's not necessary either. The best counter to SSDs *is* smaller ships, not another SSD. If every faction just had the same tools and the same ways to use them, then there's no reason for us to make more than two factions.
@@CoreyLoses Absolutely agree; thematically and gameplay-wise, it makes complete sense, and you've balanced the factions in really interesting and cool ways. I am just bad at the game and wanna hit one big stick with another big stick with the aesthetic of my fav faction. So I want it, but I fully understand why it's a bad and silly idea.
What? Should they just be given a giant flying "hand" as an ssd equivalent?
I love stealing the ships fro EotH their ships are highly effective when matched with MC80 Home Ones.
I don't care about updated ground units, as I will never play on the ground unless I miss click. Star Wars has always been about space battles, and not only that, but why would I want to fight on maps where you get stuck, especially the AT-ATs and other big units, tanks have no direction and routinely move backwards towards the enemy in spite of having mostly forward facing guns, Z levels aren't a thing apparently with both mechanical and bipedal units shooting into a side of a hill, TIE fighters die in the silliest ways, and really all air units are either too weak or too strong, and worse, have pathing issues. Just to name a few common bugs. This is why I like playing TR over AOTR. No matter how complicated you make the ground units, no matter what extra tweaks and "features" you give them, these core mechanics make ground combat totally broken and not fun for me. That being said, if these common core bugs were worked on and fixed, ground combat would be amazing! The diversity is pretty impressive, but I think that's putting the cart before the horse.
ah yes, Star Wars has always been only about space battles, which is why every movie after A New Hope includes fairly large ground battles (or in some cases very large ones)
@@nerdyspinosaurid yeah after, meaning not as good. FIGHT ME!