Hi, glad you like it! Yeah I'd like to go again but spend a bit more time over it. This trip I was squeezing in to a Monday to Friday to include driving each way from Yorkshire too, hence why I had to get some decent distances in each day. I've only done the Spey this one time in October, I'd like to try it in the Spring. I've done several other Scotland trips also around September/October, dunno why that just seems to be when I get a bit more free time. I'd like to do a few more videos when we're allowed out again..... Not long now!
Hi, currently planning a trip from Aviemore to Spey Bay. Wanting to camp by the river near Grantown so we can walk in and also near Aberlour to do the same. You don't happen to know the coordinates of where you camped? Don't want to be next to peoples houses or disrupting fishing or anything.
Hi Cameron, I'm afraid I had the opposite approach and camped away from the towns, so the places I stayed probably won't be any good for you, certainly not a short walk away anyway! I hadn't pre-planned where to stay, I just eyeballed some probable options ahead of me on the map and had a look at them when I got there. I guess for camping closer to the towns, it'll depend what time of year you go and how big your group is. Plenty of guidance available though about wild camping in Scotland, hope you find somewhere suitable and have a good trip. Anyway, this is where I stayed (had to look up the grid reference's again, these are from Bing maps so hope they're right!) Night 1 was just above Newtonmore (697971), so won't be on your journey. Night 2 was at the confluence of the Nethy, (993223). NIght 3 was on the edge of a forest, Rothes being the nearest place on the map I guess, (297498).
Hi Dave, This is the Venture Prospector 155 Corelite X. I've got a few Prospectors and they seem to be a good all-rounder when considering this type of mixed use (white water, open water, sailing, handling in wind, luggage, poling etc), along with a reasonable purchase cost. It also appears to be quite hard-wearing having put it through a fair bit of hard use over the years! Compared to other similar sized boats, it does seem to track well in a straight line, or to put it another way, lack maneuverability - the bows are pretty sharp in the water, so to really spin it around you need some good edge or to utilise the river features. This effect is worsened when fully loaded with gear as in this vid. The bows are pretty high though so it's a fairly dry boat. I've also been looking at other options recently - I'm happy with the boat but I think I'd appreciate something a bit lighter. Venture do 'Corelite' and 'Trilite' material options but they still come in at 34 & 36kg. The Novacraft Prospector is also a nice boat, and I think nicer to paddle, 10kg lighter and with a more hefty price tag! Also slightly higher sided I recall and thus a bit drier. I'm also considering Esquif's prospecteur options or a pocket canyon. Hope this helps - overall I think it's a good all-rounder towards the lower cost end of the market. Good luck anyway!
Phil mate how are you? Thought I'd reach out to ask you for advice if possible! Have you paddled the Royal Dee? I'm considering going at it alone... quite a bit of class 3 rapids... any insights? THANKS my friend hope you are well!!
Eze mate, yeah I'm good thanks, hope you are too, I keep seeing your trips! No I haven't paddled the Royal Dee yet - it's on my to do list though, I hear it's a good trip. Insights? Not for the Dee specifically. Generally, if I'm paddling alone, I take a more cautious approach than normal, especially on a multi-day exped - I'm always prepared to get out and inspect, line or portage anything I'm not happy about - minor issues can escalate quickly if you're by yourself in the middle of nowhere, and there’s no point getting everything soaking wet at the start of a 5 day trip. Having seen your videos I think you have a similar approach. If I want to push the limits on harder grade waters, I'll go with a group of a similar ability so we can help rescue each other & kit if need be. The difficulty with an unknown river is deciding whether to explore it alone or not! River guides and gradings never give the full picture, we can only do some research and then decide whether to set off - once we've set off, we should constantly decide whether or not to continue - I think good decision making is one of the most important things. I know you’ll do your homework properly, if you do go, I’m keen to see the vid afterwards! Happy Paddling!
@@philswatersports Buddy totally agreeee!! Ahh Mann I'll give you a shout if/when the trip is confirmed in case you want to join?? I hear you on all fronts and totally agree that something minor can turn quick. Everything seems to happen from one second to the next.. If I go at it alone, I'll definitely be inspecting and line/portage accordingly. I know mate, it gets to a point where the research can only take you so far.. then you gotta be there on the ground and call it as it is, step by step. I'll keep you posted mate!
Yeah let me know when you're going. I'm getting pretty busy with work now but we should have a paddle some time. Have a good trip and let us know how you get on!
Hi, glad you liked the vid. The sail & poles are from Endless River, others do exist of course. Yes I was surprised at progress, a good combination of the wind in the right direction and a good flow too. And being by myself I wasn't stopping as much as you would with a group. I'm hoping to go back with friends but will probably start lower down and take a bit longer over it. I had quite a short time window to get this trip in this time. You can see on the last morning I look pretty knackered!
@@philswatersports Buddy just saw your reply now, sorry! This is even more epic now than when I first watched it! You are a madman - love it!!! I'm going to do this in a few weeks. Solo as well and also going to start a bit lower down and allowing maybe 4-5 days to do it. Any essential tips you can offer would be GREATLY appreciated! At the moment river levels are low, not sure if you have experience with this section in lower water? Maybe you don't get out of bed if river level is below 3m!!!! hahaha! All the best my friend. You are crazy, and I respect you muchly for it!!
@Outdoor Adventures No worries. Lol, I think everyone needs a little bit of crazy! Have a look at my other vids for more crazy - some grade 3/4 on the river Leven and Abbey rapids. I should take my camera with me more! I've only done it once tbh, would like to go again. I got lucky to have enough water to get on at Laggan, even then some of it was very shallow - the usual starting point seems to be Newtonmore because of the confluence of the 2 rivers just above the road bridge, although many start lower down. Actually some of the features will wash out at higher levels, a low level can often make more technical paddling. I guess in general I'd suggest: 1. Know your ability, which more importantly includes knowing when to play it safe and decide not to run something - this is especially important when paddling alone in such a remote environment, and being able to self rescue is essential (eg you can see me taking a dry line rather than the exciting line through Knockando rapids). When wanting to 'push the limits' I'd always go with a competent buddy or two. 2. Think carefully about what kit to take, allowing for Scottish weather! Probably want midge nets & insect repellant this time of year, and think about taking spare sets of waterproofs etc so that if you do swim you have a dry alternative (I had a drysuit as well as seperate dry trousers & coat/cag, plenty of warm spare clothes, maybe less of an issue if it's warm and dry still). I took simple boil in the bag meals which were quick and easy to get a warm meal in the wind & rain, and meant I only needed one stove and pan set. When the foods warmed in the hot water, make up a flask with it. Again, probably easier if you get good weather. Decent first aid kit (you' could be on your own for some time if you need to paddle to the next access/egress); spare paddle; decent length swim line as the river gets pretty wide (I had 25m). I had a 2/3man tent so room to bring kit inside, also took a tarp to provide more outdoor shelter (eg you could rig up an outside washing line if you have wet kit). Waterproof map, or at least a map in a waterproof case. (The Harvey Maps Speyside Way map will cover all the section you want to do in one map). Maintaining phone battery is important on a multi day trip, either use as little as possible, take a power bank, and/or a spare emergency phone. Just bear in mind that all this kit makes the boat very heavy! Pack the weight in the middle of the boat and the lighter stuff at the ends so the boat can still pitch over the waves. Could probably think about it all day! Have a good trip
@@philswatersports Thanks for taking the time to provide AWESOME info man! Checked out your other videos, yes confirms you are indeed a madman. I agree we all need a bit of crazy. Sub from me :-) I know exactly what you mean by lower levels making a more technical river. I encountered this on the Eden River this summer. I had done it before in winter in higher water and remembered it as a easy tour. It was much more technical this time around, here is the video: th-cam.com/video/MzxRSfrQV8Y/w-d-xo.html -I'm definitely going to take the safest routes possible - dry line preference for sure. I'll scout anything that doesn't look straight forward. -Definitely taking a midge head net. -Taking a good time to plan kit, extra clothing etc. -Food planning essential and undertood. - OK so I'm thinking of going with my Amok Draumr 5.0 hammock, winter sleep pad and tarp set up. I figured this would give me more versatility for camping if i'm struggling to find flat ground? How did you find the campsite opportunities for your tent? Got you re extra tarp, makes sense. -Paddles defo an extra one. What do you think about taking a double blade paddle for the stiller longer sections? I thought it may be a good idea to boost speed a bit? -Taking big battery bank, Garmin inreach mini for satellite messaging and SOS. - Weight packing makes sense, I'm gonna use some airtight drums I think to keep everything tidy and add some buoyancy too. -Long swim line makes sense. Also buoyancy bags for the canoe (are a must?) Thanks once again Philfor the invaluable feedback, it's v much appreciated! ATB, Eze
@@EzeAdventurer No worries. Hope you have a great trip. Sounds like you've got a good plan sorted out. Yes a hammock is probably a good idea, it will open up a lot more camping opportunities. I didn't take mine, wish I had, probably far more hammocking options than nice flat level grass options! I just looked at the map to see where there might be some options and explored when I got there, moving on if not a great spot. Lots of islands as well which are generally just full of trees. It's personal preference about paddles, I only use single blades myself. I know some canoes come set up to be paddled like a kayak (ie with seat, footpegs and backrest), typically 'Pack canoes' are paddled with a double bladed paddle although they're generally smaller, and the narrower beam allows you to get the paddle more upright to be more efficient. What you might find in your silverbirch, is that if you're sat in the middle of a wider boat, and the paddle obviously has to go over the gunwhales, it'll be like you're doing sweep strokes the whole way with the boat turning side to side. Might not be as bad as I'm thinking though, canoes generally have more straight line stability than kayaks. I'd imagine a pair of splits will be easier to stow in the boat than a complete paddle. If you're wanting to boost speed and/or save energy then some kind of sail is probably a good idea, even improvising with a Tarp or something. I did a fair amount of sailing on the flat sections of river. Although pot luck if you get any wind! As you get lower down the river the white water sections become more frequent than in the highlands, so I used the sail less and less as I got further down. Best wishes Phil
Hi, Thanks for commenting. It's a great trip. The River Spey canoe guide by Presda Press / Nancy Chambers is useful for info. Also I got a Speyside Way map by Harvey Maps (also waterproof), which has all the river from Newtonmore on one map instead of needing multiple OS maps. Hope this helps and have a great trip.
Good tips and info included, Thanks for sharing!
Glad it was helpful!
Nice work!
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it
An epic adventure - Well done..
Thanks, yes it was great, aiming to go again some time!
enjoying this vid yet again - lockdown giving me itchy feet! Have you paddled the Spey in springtime/early summer Phil? atb
Hi, glad you like it! Yeah I'd like to go again but spend a bit more time over it. This trip I was squeezing in to a Monday to Friday to include driving each way from Yorkshire too, hence why I had to get some decent distances in each day.
I've only done the Spey this one time in October, I'd like to try it in the Spring. I've done several other Scotland trips also around September/October, dunno why that just seems to be when I get a bit more free time.
I'd like to do a few more videos when we're allowed out again..... Not long now!
Hi, currently planning a trip from Aviemore to Spey Bay. Wanting to camp by the river near Grantown so we can walk in and also near Aberlour to do the same. You don't happen to know the coordinates of where you camped? Don't want to be next to peoples houses or disrupting fishing or anything.
Hi Cameron,
I'm afraid I had the opposite approach and camped away from the towns, so the places I stayed probably won't be any good for you, certainly not a short walk away anyway!
I hadn't pre-planned where to stay, I just eyeballed some probable options ahead of me on the map and had a look at them when I got there. I guess for camping closer to the towns, it'll depend what time of year you go and how big your group is. Plenty of guidance available though about wild camping in Scotland, hope you find somewhere suitable and have a good trip.
Anyway, this is where I stayed (had to look up the grid reference's again, these are from Bing maps so hope they're right!)
Night 1 was just above Newtonmore (697971), so won't be on your journey.
Night 2 was at the confluence of the Nethy, (993223).
NIght 3 was on the edge of a forest, Rothes being the nearest place on the map I guess, (297498).
Great vid Phil. What boat are you paddling? I’m tossing up between 2 so interested in what you use.
Hi Dave, This is the Venture Prospector 155 Corelite X. I've got a few Prospectors and they seem to be a good all-rounder when considering this type of mixed use (white water, open water, sailing, handling in wind, luggage, poling etc), along with a reasonable purchase cost. It also appears to be quite hard-wearing having put it through a fair bit of hard use over the years!
Compared to other similar sized boats, it does seem to track well in a straight line, or to put it another way, lack maneuverability - the bows are pretty sharp in the water, so to really spin it around you need some good edge or to utilise the river features. This effect is worsened when fully loaded with gear as in this vid. The bows are pretty high though so it's a fairly dry boat.
I've also been looking at other options recently - I'm happy with the boat but I think I'd appreciate something a bit lighter. Venture do 'Corelite' and 'Trilite' material options but they still come in at 34 & 36kg. The Novacraft Prospector is also a nice boat, and I think nicer to paddle, 10kg lighter and with a more hefty price tag! Also slightly higher sided I recall and thus a bit drier. I'm also considering Esquif's prospecteur options or a pocket canyon.
Hope this helps - overall I think it's a good all-rounder towards the lower cost end of the market. Good luck anyway!
Phil mate how are you? Thought I'd reach out to ask you for advice if possible!
Have you paddled the Royal Dee? I'm considering going at it alone... quite a bit of class 3 rapids... any insights? THANKS my friend hope you are well!!
Eze mate, yeah I'm good thanks, hope you are too, I keep seeing your trips! No I haven't paddled the Royal Dee yet - it's on my to do list though, I hear it's a good trip.
Insights? Not for the Dee specifically. Generally, if I'm paddling alone, I take a more cautious approach than normal, especially on a multi-day exped - I'm always prepared to get out and inspect, line or portage anything I'm not happy about - minor issues can escalate quickly if you're by yourself in the middle of nowhere, and there’s no point getting everything soaking wet at the start of a 5 day trip. Having seen your videos I think you have a similar approach. If I want to push the limits on harder grade waters, I'll go with a group of a similar ability so we can help rescue each other & kit if need be. The difficulty with an unknown river is deciding whether to explore it alone or not!
River guides and gradings never give the full picture, we can only do some research and then decide whether to set off - once we've set off, we should constantly decide whether or not to continue - I think good decision making is one of the most important things.
I know you’ll do your homework properly, if you do go, I’m keen to see the vid afterwards! Happy Paddling!
@@philswatersports Buddy totally agreeee!! Ahh Mann I'll give you a shout if/when the trip is confirmed in case you want to join??
I hear you on all fronts and totally agree that something minor can turn quick. Everything seems to happen from one second to the next.. If I go at it alone, I'll definitely be inspecting and line/portage accordingly.
I know mate, it gets to a point where the research can only take you so far.. then you gotta be there on the ground and call it as it is, step by step.
I'll keep you posted mate!
Yeah let me know when you're going. I'm getting pretty busy with work now but we should have a paddle some time. Have a good trip and let us know how you get on!
@@philswatersports Sounds good bud!
awesome dude! the sail is so cool and 50km in day 2 in immense!!
Hi, glad you liked the vid. The sail & poles are from Endless River, others do exist of course. Yes I was surprised at progress, a good combination of the wind in the right direction and a good flow too. And being by myself I wasn't stopping as much as you would with a group. I'm hoping to go back with friends but will probably start lower down and take a bit longer over it. I had quite a short time window to get this trip in this time. You can see on the last morning I look pretty knackered!
@@philswatersports Buddy just saw your reply now, sorry! This is even more epic now than when I first watched it! You are a madman - love it!!! I'm going to do this in a few weeks. Solo as well and also going to start a bit lower down and allowing maybe 4-5 days to do it. Any essential tips you can offer would be GREATLY appreciated! At the moment river levels are low, not sure if you have experience with this section in lower water? Maybe you don't get out of bed if river level is below 3m!!!! hahaha! All the best my friend. You are crazy, and I respect you muchly for it!!
@Outdoor Adventures No worries. Lol, I think everyone needs a little bit of crazy! Have a look at my other vids for more crazy - some grade 3/4 on the river Leven and Abbey rapids. I should take my camera with me more!
I've only done it once tbh, would like to go again. I got lucky to have enough water to get on at Laggan, even then some of it was very shallow - the usual starting point seems to be Newtonmore because of the confluence of the 2 rivers just above the road bridge, although many start lower down. Actually some of the features will wash out at higher levels, a low level can often make more technical paddling.
I guess in general I'd suggest:
1. Know your ability, which more importantly includes knowing when to play it safe and decide not to run something - this is especially important when paddling alone in such a remote environment, and being able to self rescue is essential (eg you can see me taking a dry line rather than the exciting line through Knockando rapids). When wanting to 'push the limits' I'd always go with a competent buddy or two.
2. Think carefully about what kit to take, allowing for Scottish weather! Probably want midge nets & insect repellant this time of year, and think about taking spare sets of waterproofs etc so that if you do swim you have a dry alternative (I had a drysuit as well as seperate dry trousers & coat/cag, plenty of warm spare clothes, maybe less of an issue if it's warm and dry still). I took simple boil in the bag meals which were quick and easy to get a warm meal in the wind & rain, and meant I only needed one stove and pan set. When the foods warmed in the hot water, make up a flask with it. Again, probably easier if you get good weather.
Decent first aid kit (you' could be on your own for some time if you need to paddle to the next access/egress); spare paddle; decent length swim line as the river gets pretty wide (I had 25m).
I had a 2/3man tent so room to bring kit inside, also took a tarp to provide more outdoor shelter (eg you could rig up an outside washing line if you have wet kit). Waterproof map, or at least a map in a waterproof case. (The Harvey Maps Speyside Way map will cover all the section you want to do in one map). Maintaining phone battery is important on a multi day trip, either use as little as possible, take a power bank, and/or a spare emergency phone. Just bear in mind that all this kit makes the boat very heavy! Pack the weight in the middle of the boat and the lighter stuff at the ends so the boat can still pitch over the waves.
Could probably think about it all day!
Have a good trip
@@philswatersports Thanks for taking the time to provide AWESOME info man! Checked out your other videos, yes confirms you are indeed a madman. I agree we all need a bit of crazy. Sub from me :-)
I know exactly what you mean by lower levels making a more technical river. I encountered this on the Eden River this summer. I had done it before in winter in higher water and remembered it as a easy tour. It was much more technical this time around, here is the video:
th-cam.com/video/MzxRSfrQV8Y/w-d-xo.html
-I'm definitely going to take the safest routes possible - dry line preference for sure. I'll scout anything that doesn't look straight forward.
-Definitely taking a midge head net.
-Taking a good time to plan kit, extra clothing etc.
-Food planning essential and undertood.
- OK so I'm thinking of going with my Amok Draumr 5.0 hammock, winter sleep pad and tarp set up. I figured this would give me more versatility for camping if i'm struggling to find flat ground? How did you find the campsite opportunities for your tent? Got you re extra tarp, makes sense.
-Paddles defo an extra one. What do you think about taking a double blade paddle for the stiller longer sections? I thought it may be a good idea to boost speed a bit?
-Taking big battery bank, Garmin inreach mini for satellite messaging and SOS.
- Weight packing makes sense, I'm gonna use some airtight drums I think to keep everything tidy and add some buoyancy too.
-Long swim line makes sense. Also buoyancy bags for the canoe (are a must?)
Thanks once again Philfor the invaluable feedback, it's v much appreciated!
ATB,
Eze
@@EzeAdventurer No worries. Hope you have a great trip. Sounds like you've got a good plan sorted out.
Yes a hammock is probably a good idea, it will open up a lot more camping opportunities. I didn't take mine, wish I had, probably far more hammocking options than nice flat level grass options! I just looked at the map to see where there might be some options and explored when I got there, moving on if not a great spot. Lots of islands as well which are generally just full of trees.
It's personal preference about paddles, I only use single blades myself. I know some canoes come set up to be paddled like a kayak (ie with seat, footpegs and backrest), typically 'Pack canoes' are paddled with a double bladed paddle although they're generally smaller, and the narrower beam allows you to get the paddle more upright to be more efficient.
What you might find in your silverbirch, is that if you're sat in the middle of a wider boat, and the paddle obviously has to go over the gunwhales, it'll be like you're doing sweep strokes the whole way with the boat turning side to side. Might not be as bad as I'm thinking though, canoes generally have more straight line stability than kayaks. I'd imagine a pair of splits will be easier to stow in the boat than a complete paddle.
If you're wanting to boost speed and/or save energy then some kind of sail is probably a good idea, even improvising with a Tarp or something. I did a fair amount of sailing on the flat sections of river. Although pot luck if you get any wind! As you get lower down the river the white water sections become more frequent than in the highlands, so I used the sail less and less as I got further down.
Best wishes
Phil
Please add commentary , otherwise it’s meaningless.
Thanks for your thoughts! 🙂
Great vid, some useful stats, thanks for sharing. Planning similar trip this autumn, so really handy. atb
Hi, Thanks for commenting. It's a great trip. The River Spey canoe guide by Presda Press / Nancy Chambers is useful for info. Also I got a Speyside Way map by Harvey Maps (also waterproof), which has all the river from Newtonmore on one map instead of needing multiple OS maps. Hope this helps and have a great trip.
@@philswatersports Thanks Phil, great tips
Fabulous thanks. Ill invest in that waterproof map.
Yeah I found it really handy. Hope you have a great trip!