I agree with what this fellow is saying, but the exercise physiology literature on fasted training is nuanced. There are metabolic benefits -- increased mitochondrial biogenesis and fatty acid oxidation -- to fasted training. This is based on a large body of evidence, not just one study. There are a number of meta-analyses that support this. So it can depend on what your goals are. It might be particularly useful during that time in the season when one is trying to improve base fitness and it could be useful for people who need to lose some weight or who have some metabolic issues. (I teach physiology at a medical school). One other thing I would advise about interpreting studies in exercise physiology and sports medicine is to not place too much emphasis on a single study. This is because they are almost always fairly small in terms of the number of participants (of necessity). The ones that you should rely on are so-called meta-analyses and critical reviews, where statistical analyses of a large number of studies are performed.
One of the points that needs to be emphasized with fasted training is NO hard efforts. Maximum is high Zone 2. That's where your body starts to draw on stored glycogen. One Zone 4 effort can upset the "apple cart" and drive you into areas you don't want to go. Also there's a time limit where your body will start to go into ketosis and that may sound good but it's not.
@@jamesmckenzie3532 you and Stuart hit the nail on the head, the conversation is definitely. NEW wants when it comes to fasted and anyone trying to run at VO to Max while fasted isn’t gonna last very long. I hundred percent disagree with their point on getting sick because of being in ketosis or fasting. Both states increase the sympathetic nervous response which boosts immune system response. I’m not sure what information they are referencing, but they are definitely wrong on this.
@@SteakandChains it's the long-term effects of working out fasted which drains the body. Ketosis is also a state you don't want to be in for long periods of time. Yes, short-term fasted and ketosis will improve your health. I'm thinking they are talking long-term.
@@jamesmckenzie3532 i don't think they specified long or short term. there's no risk in long term ketosis and faster (fasting if done correctly and exited properly). improved immune response - pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/38189135/ improved inflammation response - pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/37940045/ the concern I have is the "expert" (and I'm on no way dismissing his credentials) is likely sharing the same repeated information that the main stream fitness community share rather than looking into the topics in depths and providing a more nuanced answer.
I LOVE the caveat at the end saying that 2 weeks off is not a big deal. I've add way too many athletes that continued training when sick even if I tell them not to.
Im soon 50 and stay ripped year around for over 3 decades. Jan Ullrich used to do fasted training and it made him fat. He was the canary for us all in the 90's on how to stay lean vs blow out in winter from fasting or fearing sugar. I always have some sugar with 10mins of waking up. At least a tablespoon to 50g. Cant deny the results! ZERO of the TDF riders/winners who follow my nutrition advice do fasted training either.
I do pretty much all my training fasted. Anything up to 4 hours, Up to 12hrs per week. Works wells for me around those levels. If I push up to 15hr I start to eat more. If I'm getting ready to race I for the week building up I eat breakfast for that week.
I like fasting. I commute every day and for the last 6 month I either eat 1 or 2 meals only . I fast either 16:8 or 23:1 have fasted 72 hours regularly commuting several times riding 80 miles in that period. My fasted times home u squally occur after 48 hours of fasting. Once you enter ketosis your making your own sugar from fat. I think eating patterns should be adapted to the body type you have as an Endomorph body type my eating and fat storage is very different to my Ectomorph friends. Since fasting the following conditions that I have suffered since child hood have disappeared. Asthma, sleep apnea’s, Athletes foot , psoriasis and afternoon post ride knaps.
@@peterb1783 been a high performing swimmer, back row forward triathlete and waterskier never made it to national level due to body weight issues. Tried everything previously but OMAD really works for me 125kg in February and now 97kg with only performance and health benefits. Despite the NHS thinking fasting was dangerous for a type 1 diabetic and recommended weight loss surgery.
I ride semi-fasted I guess in the morning, only because I don't have enough time to fuel beforehand due to work. I do use Gatorade powder in my water though. It's only about a 90 min ride. I do notice that I definitely have less power than when I ride on an off-day when I had breakfast.
I was suckered in by the red cross through the clif bar and banana, I love a clif bar me, but when my clif bars run out Greggs is my usual stop before i set off, a bottle of water, Greggs cheese bake, packet of caramel shortbread and a full fat coke 🎉
bonk training worked well for Graeme Obree if you read his training book there's a chapter on it. Just ride hard ~90mins until you bonk then get yourself home and eat some pre-prepared quality food
I’ll go for a fasted run from time to time for no real reason but I’m not heading out for a three hour bike ride without some carbs or I’m going to end up limping home.
why are they using keytones if they are supposed to be carbing up during the race? It feels like I have heard less and less about keytones as of late. Is it just because its so expensive or because it doesn't do much unless you are in total ketosis?
Your stomach should be empty when you run. It's what you eat 3-4 hours before your run is what matters and what your muscle and liver glycogen reserves are at the time. Besides a 10 miler takes approx. an hour to finish, so if your glycogen reserves are topped up you won't be hurting yourself.
@@82vitt I finished my marathon last October at 3:19, my last park run this summer I did it in 19:40. My easy pace is 10:00 per mile. 10 miles usually takes me 100 mins to finish. 10 mile run in zone 2 takes more than 1 hour for most people. Even all out 10 miles run, I don't think most runners can finish within an hour.
@@Thezuule1 According to Best Race times percentiles, which youtube doesn't allow me to paste their link, in my age group males, only 3% of runners can finish 10 mile race under 1 hour.
Try as I might, I cannot remember the last time I heard anyone talking up the idea of fasted training. How is it that something no one does anymore is somehow the most overrated thing?
Fasted training is great if you've trained your body to enter ketosis before you start training fasted. However, 90 min+ of intense exercise is very stressful on the body, cycling even at lower intensities is too much energy to be converted through the ketogenic process. Fasted training, apart from long duration aerobic training, is great for weight loss if you've trained your body to use it's fat stores for energy (and have 10%+ body fat). I've personally lost over 80 lbs through intermittent fasting paired with exercise, and have kept it off for years. I don't ride more than about 90 min in a fasted state though, that's a one-way trip to bonk-town! Just stop at the coffee shop 😉
I've never heard that eating whilst riding could be cheating? How many sports are there where the athlete is at a high performance level after 5 or more hours? The average person in an office would eat in that period.
Sugar cravings can be caused by de-hydration, by certain gut bacteria, or by stress when our levels of cortisol are chronically elevated. Have you tried upping your fruit consumption? Are you getting enough good quality sleep?
Really dumb clip. For most of us trying to burn a bit of fat, a pre-breakfast/lunch zone 2 ride for 45-60 min is the best thing you can do. Then do your intense/longer rides, fueled, later or on other days. No one is suggesting you do a 3 hr group ride while fasted.
I lost 120lbs by mostly riding fasted, that included weekend 3-4hr group rides. I was just sucking wheel for the first 60lbs but after that I was rotating like everyone else
Always this confusion between what is good for pro athletes and what is good for the average Joe. Their fat levels are not the same, the optimum opportunity cost to win a few seconds is not the same (for you that is nothing, for them it is the difference between the first and the forth place), the need of a costly upgrade of the hardware allowing them to win 15s in a 100 hours ride is not the same... I never get this idea that what is good for them is good for us. I don't need their 15k€ bike, I don't need their performance enhancing drugs, I don't need their nutritition, they are in a different world. Always sugar, it remembers me what Doctor Robert Lustif used to say "Gatorade is for Athletes. Do you know who drinks Gatorade ? Fat kids"
Humans are not cars. You could think of them as cars that have hundreds of different fuel tanks that can be accessed under different conditions and at different rates, and in which the efficiency of their access depends upon the recent history and the type of fuel.
Bad analogy. Cars don't carry reserve energy sources like bodies. You can't train a car to run on empty. I'm not saying it's ideal or I'd do it...just that it is possible to exercise fasted and on empty
I agree with what this fellow is saying, but the exercise physiology literature on fasted training is nuanced. There are metabolic benefits -- increased mitochondrial biogenesis and fatty acid oxidation -- to fasted training. This is based on a large body of evidence, not just one study. There are a number of meta-analyses that support this. So it can depend on what your goals are. It might be particularly useful during that time in the season when one is trying to improve base fitness and it could be useful for people who need to lose some weight or who have some metabolic issues. (I teach physiology at a medical school). One other thing I would advise about interpreting studies in exercise physiology and sports medicine is to not place too much emphasis on a single study. This is because they are almost always fairly small in terms of the number of participants (of necessity). The ones that you should rely on are so-called meta-analyses and critical reviews, where statistical analyses of a large number of studies are performed.
One of the points that needs to be emphasized with fasted training is NO hard efforts. Maximum is high Zone 2. That's where your body starts to draw on stored glycogen. One Zone 4 effort can upset the "apple cart" and drive you into areas you don't want to go. Also there's a time limit where your body will start to go into ketosis and that may sound good but it's not.
@@jamesmckenzie3532 you and Stuart hit the nail on the head, the conversation is definitely. NEW wants when it comes to fasted and anyone trying to run at VO to Max while fasted isn’t gonna last very long. I hundred percent disagree with their point on getting sick because of being in ketosis or fasting. Both states increase the sympathetic nervous response which boosts immune system response. I’m not sure what information they are referencing, but they are definitely wrong on this.
@@SteakandChains it's the long-term effects of working out fasted which drains the body. Ketosis is also a state you don't want to be in for long periods of time. Yes, short-term fasted and ketosis will improve your health. I'm thinking they are talking long-term.
@@jamesmckenzie3532 i don't think they specified long or short term. there's no risk in long term ketosis and faster (fasting if done correctly and exited properly).
improved immune response - pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/38189135/
improved inflammation response - pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/37940045/
the concern I have is the "expert" (and I'm on no way dismissing his credentials) is likely sharing the same repeated information that the main stream fitness community share rather than looking into the topics in depths and providing a more nuanced answer.
I LOVE the caveat at the end saying that 2 weeks off is not a big deal. I've add way too many athletes that continued training when sick even if I tell them not to.
Im soon 50 and stay ripped year around for over 3 decades.
Jan Ullrich used to do fasted training and it made him fat. He was the canary for us all in the 90's on how to stay lean vs blow out in winter from fasting or fearing sugar.
I always have some sugar with 10mins of waking up. At least a tablespoon to 50g.
Cant deny the results!
ZERO of the TDF riders/winners who follow my nutrition advice do fasted training either.
I do pretty much all my training fasted. Anything up to 4 hours, Up to 12hrs per week. Works wells for me around those levels. If I push up to 15hr I start to eat more. If I'm getting ready to race I for the week building up I eat breakfast for that week.
I like fasting. I commute every day and for the last 6 month I either eat 1 or 2 meals only . I fast either 16:8 or 23:1 have fasted 72 hours regularly commuting several times riding 80 miles in that period. My fasted times home u squally occur after 48 hours of fasting. Once you enter ketosis your making your own sugar from fat. I think eating patterns should be adapted to the body type you have as an Endomorph body type my eating and fat storage is very different to my Ectomorph friends.
Since fasting the following conditions that I have suffered since child hood have disappeared. Asthma, sleep apnea’s, Athletes foot , psoriasis and afternoon post ride knaps.
Same man
@@peterb1783 been a high performing swimmer, back row forward triathlete and waterskier never made it to national level due to body weight issues. Tried everything previously but OMAD really works for me 125kg in February and now 97kg with only performance and health benefits. Despite the NHS thinking fasting was dangerous for a type 1 diabetic and recommended weight loss surgery.
I ride semi-fasted I guess in the morning, only because I don't have enough time to fuel beforehand due to work. I do use Gatorade powder in my water though. It's only about a 90 min ride. I do notice that I definitely have less power than when I ride on an off-day when I had breakfast.
I was suckered in by the red cross through the clif bar and banana, I love a clif bar me, but when my clif bars run out Greggs is my usual stop before i set off, a bottle of water, Greggs cheese bake, packet of caramel shortbread and a full fat coke 🎉
bonk training worked well for Graeme Obree if you read his training book there's a chapter on it. Just ride hard ~90mins until you bonk then get yourself home and eat some pre-prepared quality food
Any tips for eating before early morning sessions timing to avoid spiking blood sugar and crashing
Fasted training makes sens if you train in the range of zone2 and below. Training in Zone3 in a fasted state causes damage.
I’ll go for a fasted run from time to time for no real reason but I’m not heading out for a three hour bike ride without some carbs or I’m going to end up limping home.
Fr
What do you define as a fasted run?
why are they using keytones if they are supposed to be carbing up during the race? It feels like I have heard less and less about keytones as of late. Is it just because its so expensive or because it doesn't do much unless you are in total ketosis?
I lost a good 120lbs on mostly fasted training
How much of it you gain back? Most people gain what they lost plus extra over time.
You would have lost weight regardless if you were that overweight…
I always train fasted up to 2 hrs. Feel great never bonk never Ill. Eating prior or during makes me feel crap. Train empty race full
Fasted running is the best way for me to lose weight. But I won't run for over 10 miles on an empty stomach, that's just asking for trouble.
Your stomach should be empty when you run. It's what you eat 3-4 hours before your run is what matters and what your muscle and liver glycogen reserves are at the time. Besides a 10 miler takes approx. an hour to finish, so if your glycogen reserves are topped up you won't be hurting yourself.
@@82vitt I finished my marathon last October at 3:19, my last park run this summer I did it in 19:40. My easy pace is 10:00 per mile. 10 miles usually takes me 100 mins to finish.
10 mile run in zone 2 takes more than 1 hour for most people. Even all out 10 miles run, I don't think most runners can finish within an hour.
@@82vitt 10 mph is quite the pace.
@@Thezuule1 According to Best Race times percentiles, which youtube doesn't allow me to paste their link, in my age group males, only 3% of runners can finish 10 mile race under 1 hour.
@@82vitt This fellow is obviously different gravy doing a 10 miler in 1 hour fasted, when the good club runners I know run over 1hr normally
Try as I might, I cannot remember the last time I heard anyone talking up the idea of fasted training. How is it that something no one does anymore is somehow the most overrated thing?
I lost 120lbs doing mostly fasted training. If I ever magically gained all that weight back, I'd definitely do it again.
Fasted training is great if you've trained your body to enter ketosis before you start training fasted. However, 90 min+ of intense exercise is very stressful on the body, cycling even at lower intensities is too much energy to be converted through the ketogenic process. Fasted training, apart from long duration aerobic training, is great for weight loss if you've trained your body to use it's fat stores for energy (and have 10%+ body fat). I've personally lost over 80 lbs through intermittent fasting paired with exercise, and have kept it off for years. I don't ride more than about 90 min in a fasted state though, that's a one-way trip to bonk-town! Just stop at the coffee shop 😉
Great clip
Fastest training is great if you have no intentions of being fast.
or lean!
I ride fasted. Longest rides around 4 to 5 hours. I dont even eat carbs. Beef and eggs only forr 99% of my diet.
They didn't discuss the difference between the intensity training and fueling of ketones or not.
One imagines gentle rides in a fastest state is fine
I enjoy cycling my bike. I have no idea what a ketone is though. Do I need to get some?
bruh what, ... nobody thinks that eating while riding prevents you from improving
I've never heard that eating whilst riding could be cheating? How many sports are there where the athlete is at a high performance level after 5 or more hours? The average person in an office would eat in that period.
If there is something special about UAE liquid why do tadej gave one to a child?
Hi there,
What about sugar addiction and cravings? How to replace it with some more natural sources of energy?
Thanks.
Just stop eating BS. Replace your trash with something healthier.
THey're not saying you must have sugar...just that even sugar alone is better than nothing.
Sugar cravings can be caused by de-hydration, by certain gut bacteria, or by stress when our levels of cortisol are chronically elevated. Have you tried upping your fruit consumption? Are you getting enough good quality sleep?
Ummm what?
Sugar while riding and sugary snacks off the bike are very different things.
I feel better fasted because that's how I've trained for years! If you can't ride fasted, or feel bad, that's an issue that needs to be addressed.
Who wants to cycle their bike when they're hungry? It's supposed to be fun.
Who tf doing long rides without eating 😂
Did 70km yesterday fasted
@@hudsoneful 70k? 😆 That's a short ride!
I do. And when I do eat it's meat and eggs.
pepole who want an FTP of 150 and a waistline of 50 inches lol.
Fasting burns out the adrenals from excess cortisol. Just ask Jan Ullrich.
@@durianriders Harley! Couldn't agree more mate.
I’m adding a comment here so I can reply back with studies that show being in ketosis and fasted improved immune system response
We aren't talking about immune system response.
Really dumb clip. For most of us trying to burn a bit of fat, a pre-breakfast/lunch zone 2 ride for 45-60 min is the best thing you can do. Then do your intense/longer rides, fueled, later or on other days.
No one is suggesting you do a 3 hr group ride while fasted.
I lost 120lbs by mostly riding fasted, that included weekend 3-4hr group rides. I was just sucking wheel for the first 60lbs but after that I was rotating like everyone else
Always this confusion between what is good for pro athletes and what is good for the average Joe. Their fat levels are not the same, the optimum opportunity cost to win a few seconds is not the same (for you that is nothing, for them it is the difference between the first and the forth place), the need of a costly upgrade of the hardware allowing them to win 15s in a 100 hours ride is not the same...
I never get this idea that what is good for them is good for us. I don't need their 15k€ bike, I don't need their performance enhancing drugs, I don't need their nutritition, they are in a different world. Always sugar, it remembers me what Doctor Robert Lustif used to say "Gatorade is for Athletes. Do you know who drinks Gatorade ? Fat kids"
Food is fuel. Imagine driving a car and thinking it's cheating to put in gasoline.
Humans are not cars. You could think of them as cars that have hundreds of different fuel tanks that can be accessed under different conditions and at different rates, and in which the efficiency of their access depends upon the recent history and the type of fuel.
Bad analogy. Cars don't carry reserve energy sources like bodies. You can't train a car to run on empty. I'm not saying it's ideal or I'd do it...just that it is possible to exercise fasted and on empty
tsrif
Who is this guy and why should we care about his opinion?
Nutritionist at EF education pro team that just went to the Tour de France 2024 ended a week ago and got stage wins and polka dot jersey 😅
@@Cycleplayer117 Nah it wasn't him that got a stage or the polka dot jersey - it was a wee little Latino man.
@@FT__Bicycling_____-sc7yv you can’t win stages without the importance of sport nutrition
@FT__Bicycling_____-sc7yv someone from the team got the jersey, he's the team nutritionist