And now rogue is a tier 4 class cause Blizzard was too impatient to actually see whether or not spare parts would make auctioneer even more OP. rip most beautiful deck in hearthstone
You just copy/pasted me...to argue my point, against me. The point -- is that rogue is a tier 4 class because a few things that rogue can do well, other decks in the Meta either do better, or outmaneuver too easily. And the reason the entire Meta is the way it is, is because no one wants to put in the effort to play better, more consistent decks, with better win rates. There are even other decks that have a better wins/hour rate. People play face hunter because it's easy and fast. Back to rogues: When I say *a few* things that rogue can do well, other classes can also do, or counter easily, I emphasize the "a few" part. Rogues aren't one dimensional-- at least not in the same way that hunters are. But the fact that you mentioned tempo rogue and life tap highlights an issue-- play style. And life tap. Life tap doesn't mitigate AOE. Life tap is primarily a way to use your life as a resource to generate tempo. It isn't/doesn't/shouldn't be used to mitigate AOE, I.e. by over extending and then just life tapping. And what the issue with that mentality? Well...it primarily has to do with the way the classes we're discussing employ the tempo they generate. Rogues generate tempo via card advantage, the same way combo decks do. Combo also happens to be written on the card. They necessarily have to have cheap removal (sap, sabotage, backstab, flurry), because while the average power level of the cards they hold is high, the level of efficiency is low when the cards are used alone. Warlocks were designed with the opposite in mind. They trade some of their hit points to place minions on the board. But while the average power level of warlock cards is almost extreme, so is the cost to employ any tempo they generate. I.E. they have to play a voidcaller, or spend 2 mana *and* 2 hit points, as well as some card advantage. These are two decks that are quite bursty. Warlocks play from the board, rogues play from the hand. And there in lies the problem. In this specific case, if one is having trouble with warlocks, they're playing wrong, designing their deck wrong, or playing the wrong deck altogether. Because they spend so much health playing aggressively, theyre easily cornered. Sap a flame imp twice, and watch them choose to replay it two times more for a loss of 9 h.p...they'll do it 9 times out of 10, and becahse of it, they'll be forced to reach for a healbot, or an Argus in a round or two. Make sure you've removed what they've played, whether via flurry, or eviscerate, and play two decent sized threats. By doing this, you'll have them playing on the defensive, while you look for your oils/eviscerates. Because rogues exchange health for removal, and warlocks blow their health placing minions on board, you have to find a way to break that cycle. Ensure that he wants to use the board to protect his H.P. instead of the other way around. I bring this scenario up, not as a cure all, but rather, as an example of a way to prioritize tactics. Because most if what you've suggested about rogue isn't true. A class like warlock or Druid can definitely spend a bunch of resources getting a big minion out there early, but what they did in an entire turn, you can remove for just a couple mana. Your way to win is to recognize this, and to pick a specific turn to flip the board, and hold on to it. All games in hearthstone generally work like this. Except hunter (and freeze mage). The game is largely balanced. But the design of ladder rewards those who can't play with rank (and now cards), and incentivises imbalance. Without hunter, uber control decks probably wouldn't be around. Without uber control and fatigue decks, aggro decks wouldn't be so popular. It is because these decks exist that rogue is tier 4. And these decks exist because people are lazy cheats.
not really, she often gave bad advice and was very hasty. in fact if it wasnt for trump keeping his last dagger and not listening to hafu during the last match vs the warrior he would have lost because he would have had 1 less charge for deadly poison and wouldnt have gotten the killing blow. go watch it again.
Actually it wasn't her advice specifically which I was referring to. Rather: the banter between them on which play was appropriate was interesting and provided insight into the thought process needed when playing miracle
CamTheKitty Actually, it's really easy to screw up playing miracle rogue. It's not the hardest one to play, but you really do need to know what you're doing, particularly at high levels of play.
In the last match he could have fan of knived, attacked the sunwalker, blade flurried and then eviscerated the giant, clearing the board, whislt sustaining only 4 dmg and resulting in the opponent drawing two cards, and continued playing
I dont play HS much, nor do I spend money on it, but Harrison Jones was my first legendary [followed by malagos, Illidan, Tinkmaster(FAAILLL card)] and i actually dusted it to start a deck.. but now it's being used );
I don't get why so many people only run one Conceal. Sure, sometimes it's a dead card, but it is so key in getting Cold Blood'ed minions (or VanCleef ) to stick and that = Wins. Plus, it is easier to cycle than the second Fan of Knives.
Hey Trump, I love your vids man keep it up, I just wanted to make a request; could you please make an updated version for the new GVG cards that have came out. It would be great if you could… Thanks!
Wondering why he quit the last turn so soon. He could've hit the Sunwalker, Blade Flurry, Evis the giant, and SI to finish the giant. 2+2+3=7 mana I guess the mage wins at turn 10, but maybe he didn't draw his burn yet.
What you guys think about this ideas for this legendary cards? C'thun "summon 2 tentacles or maybe destroy (eats) a random minion". Yogg-Saron "takes control of a random minion for one turn each turn". ¿Op?
For the Yogg-Saron I'd go crazier like, "Temporarily gain control of a random enemy minion at the start of your turn. During your turn, the controlled minion gains Deathrattle: take 2 damage."
If you consider how Yogg'Saron works in-game (World of Warcraft that is), the idea of Mind-Controll does make sense, but the idea of how taking over multiply enemies would be a bit cray. He would in theory be a better Sylvanas, unless instantly killed.
CorvintusDK Yogg'Saron could switch the owner of a random minion (not himself). C'thun - 5 mana 2/5 with summon 2 1/3 Tentacles with Taunt (stats could be different) or 'swallow a random enemy minion. If C'thun dies next turn, the minion is regurgitated back on the board with half the health it had, if C'thun lives the minion is eaten alive'. Whatcha say?
y u do dis So the Yogg'Saron would be like Millhouse Manastorm, do you have the balls to play it? You would have to be super lucky / have the craziest amount of luck, it would probably only work if you were really far behind, and work as a different Mindcontrol tech. Could be interesting depending on his stats. I would personally use him in some trolly deck. C'thun seems really lagging with the 2/5 for 5 mana. Then what you get is 4 / 11 of stats on 3 minions. Or a bigger Fen Creeper. The other one where he eats a minions sounds like a lot of fun, and might force many decks to wait for him to be popped, in addition he would also be a hard removal card. I must say he should have rather good stats if this was to go through, so he isn't just a "play, dies no matter what" card.
(Copied from the last vid) Dear Trump or Jens or whoever... Would it be possible to put in the description of these videos when they were recorded? I think it would be pretty neat.
***** not until Blizzard makes an API to access data of decks, cards drawn/played, etc in real time. And honestly I doubt they'll do that at all, ever.
trump youve played against the rank 2 player "armads" three times now including the games you played while hafu was coaching you and he always played the control warrior
I suppose you're right seeing as Miracle Rogue doesn't run enough minions to worry about weapons and already has enough card draw for Harrison to be less useful.
people appear so content in nerfing fun in hearthstone >_> if you don't move with the metagame you get left behind and lose alot xD people claimed murlocks were op until people actually started playing around them...play around miracle and you'll be fine :p
why do people concede right before getting killed?? i only ever concede if my enemy has lethal on the board but decides to be a dick and play thousands of other cards before finally killing me
Hello Trump, i wonder why sometimes then you on a better rand you suddenly drop from 85 to 104, or it is just a video cut where you don't show where you had defeat? Nice videos really like them Best Regards Mark Yanovskiy
As the playlist says: these are highlighted games - not all matches are shown. Only those that are worth the time. The term "highlight" is used somewhat loosely but that is how it is. Anyway, this includes both won and lost games we don't just cut out every game where he was defeated. As a result you can notice his rank dropping or rising because games in-between were cut out. ~ Jens
Thank you so much for quick explanation Jens, keep up your videos really like them they teach me a lot. And it was nice that to see you winning the Legendary rank how to see you rank 1. Best Regards Mark Yanovskiy
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Wow, this is a nostalgia trip. 5 Mana Auctioneer! 4 Mana Leeroy! 0 Mana Soulfire!
What a gem of a video
When are we gonna get vintage hearthstone? ;_)
qq from 2021
It'll be here on Friday of this week! Lmao
@@m1rac1e i can't wait!
"Eeh, I've got significant amounts of toast here..."
This is why I love Trump.
The 1 liners are genius!
Hafu has teached Trump.
Now, he has to go to the world on his own feet.
Go on, little Trump...
We believe in you :)
Ahh, Miracle Rogue... the Solitaire of Hearthstone.
Trying to learn Miracle for the new classic mode so here I am!
I constantly hear sax noises in the background.
Thanks trolden...
it's not trolden, it's actually HysteriA -_-
Both naturally
The Muffin approves of Trumps learning.
Hey muffin, can you link me to your channels banner image? I think it looks fancy
Aaron Kuhns i.imgur.com/OGbbZlU.jpg :)
Sami Uusitalo I am the real Muffin ヾ(＾▽＾)ﾉ
***** Thank you kind soul
Sami Uusitalo not really it just means that he can be any muffin you see, so be careful
And now rogue is a tier 4 class cause Blizzard was too impatient to actually see whether or not spare parts would make auctioneer even more OP.
rip most beautiful deck in hearthstone
Rogue was a T4 class because no one wanted to put the effort into playing anything other than a broken face deck.
You just copy/pasted me...to argue my point, against me.
The point -- is that rogue is a tier 4 class because a few things that rogue can do well, other decks in the Meta either do better, or outmaneuver too easily. And the reason the entire Meta is the way it is, is because no one wants to put in the effort to play better, more consistent decks, with better win rates. There are even other decks that have a better wins/hour rate. People play face hunter because it's easy and fast.
Back to rogues:
When I say *a few* things that rogue can do well, other classes can also do, or counter easily, I emphasize the "a few" part. Rogues aren't one dimensional-- at least not in the same way that hunters are.
But the fact that you mentioned tempo rogue and life tap highlights an issue-- play style. And life tap. Life tap doesn't mitigate AOE. Life tap is primarily a way to use your life as a resource to generate tempo. It isn't/doesn't/shouldn't be used to mitigate AOE, I.e. by over extending and then just life tapping.
And what the issue with that mentality? Well...it primarily has to do with the way the classes we're discussing employ the tempo they generate. Rogues generate tempo via card advantage, the same way combo decks do. Combo also happens to be written on the card. They necessarily have to have cheap removal (sap, sabotage, backstab, flurry), because while the average power level of the cards they hold is high, the level of efficiency is low when the cards are used alone.
Warlocks were designed with the opposite in mind. They trade some of their hit points to place minions on the board. But while the average power level of warlock cards is almost extreme, so is the cost to employ any tempo they generate. I.E. they have to play a voidcaller, or spend 2 mana *and* 2 hit points, as well as some card advantage.
These are two decks that are quite bursty. Warlocks play from the board, rogues play from the hand. And there in lies the problem. In this specific case, if one is having trouble with warlocks, they're playing wrong, designing their deck wrong, or playing the wrong deck altogether.
Because they spend so much health playing aggressively, theyre easily cornered. Sap a flame imp twice, and watch them choose to replay it two times more for a loss of 9 h.p...they'll do it 9 times out of 10, and becahse of it, they'll be forced to reach for a healbot, or an Argus in a round or two. Make sure you've removed what they've played, whether via flurry, or eviscerate, and play two decent sized threats. By doing this, you'll have them playing on the defensive, while you look for your oils/eviscerates.
Because rogues exchange health for removal, and warlocks blow their health placing minions on board, you have to find a way to break that cycle. Ensure that he wants to use the board to protect his H.P. instead of the other way around.
I bring this scenario up, not as a cure all, but rather, as an example of a way to prioritize tactics. Because most if what you've suggested about rogue isn't true. A class like warlock or Druid can definitely spend a bunch of resources getting a big minion out there early, but what they did in an entire turn, you can remove for just a couple mana. Your way to win is to recognize this, and to pick a specific turn to flip the board, and hold on to it. All games in hearthstone generally work like this.
Except hunter (and freeze mage). The game is largely balanced. But the design of ladder rewards those who can't play with rank (and now cards), and incentivises imbalance. Without hunter, uber control decks probably wouldn't be around. Without uber control and fatigue decks, aggro decks wouldn't be so popular. It is because these decks exist that rogue is tier 4. And these decks exist because people are lazy cheats.
the hafu video was great for those of use interested in learning how to play miracle
not really, she often gave bad advice and was very hasty. in fact if it wasnt for trump keeping his last dagger and not listening to hafu during the last match vs the warrior he would have lost because he would have had 1 less charge for deadly poison and wouldnt have gotten the killing blow. go watch it again.
Actually it wasn't her advice specifically which I was referring to. Rather: the banter between them on which play was appropriate was interesting and provided insight into the thought process needed when playing miracle
A Mart
"thought process needed when playing miracle"
Snicker
CamTheKitty Actually, it's really easy to screw up playing miracle rogue. It's not the hardest one to play, but you really do need to know what you're doing, particularly at high levels of play.
Here before the classic format release.
Gadgetzan op.
Another awesome video! These videos always give me something fun to do.
wow poor Armads, he have gone up against Trump and lost 3 times in the the last two videos.
Wow...
Great video like always!
I see a patern, everytime the opponent hears "LEEROY JENKINS" they instantly assume they will lose and surrender most likely
What's funny is that you can win by bluffing with Leeroy. You play him while you don't have lethal and sometimes your opponent concedes. Too funny. XD
6:25 Cowardly concede
WOW! This video is relevant again! Hello classic @ 2021
HOTFORM HOTFORM HE'S OUR MAN HIS POWER'S DOUBLED WITH OUR SPAM
Sleep well my Sweet Prince...
Haha the frozen refrences :3 conceal dont feel :333
Thanks for the list bro
I read the description as "this time without his wife Hafu" at first
Triple Leeroy is so broken, it is not even funny anymore. Making Leeroy unable for spells should make rogue less autopilot and more fun imo.
Interesting idea.
Too bad he's fucking awful now
RIP miracle rogue leeroy 5 mana
Thx trump this video has help a lot with me trying to play miracle rogue Thx C:
Well played...
great matches
"ah conceal don't feel."-Trump
Hafu tought thee well.
I miss Hafu, you should do more collab streams/videos.
"Conceal don't feel"
5:40 He could have played leeroy shadowstep leeroy.
In the last match he could have fan of knived, attacked the sunwalker, blade flurried and then eviscerated the giant, clearing the board, whislt sustaining only 4 dmg and resulting in the opponent drawing two cards, and continued playing
I dont play HS much, nor do I spend money on it, but Harrison Jones was my first legendary [followed by malagos, Illidan, Tinkmaster(FAAILLL card)] and i actually dusted it to start a deck.. but now it's being used );
I don't get why so many people only run one Conceal. Sure, sometimes it's a dead card, but it is so key in getting Cold Blood'ed minions (or VanCleef ) to stick and that = Wins. Plus, it is easier to cycle than the second Fan of Knives.
Three Leeroys in one turn should have no place in HS.
Trump senpai, PLEASE ! For the love of your fans upload the Warlock F2P serie !!
Not going to happen, it'll be too out of date and take too long. Then if he starts a new f2p soon that'll also end up too far behind.
just watch the vods on twitch
Pre nerf miracle Rogue FeelsGoodMan
pretty awesome.
So if there is ever an Asian port of "The Office", I vote Trump to play the part of Jim Halpert. xD
Hey Trump, I love your vids man keep it up, I just wanted to make a request; could you please make an updated version for the new GVG cards that have came out. It would be great if you could… Thanks!
I do prefer having hafu, just for the discussions that make it much more interesting.
good old miracle rougge
anyone else noticed he played against armads like 5 time in those two miracle rogue video?
5:37 Was Leeroy, prep, fan, shadow back the Leeroy a bad play there? I don't play miracle so I guess I wouldn't know
25 min in he should have shadowstepped the si7 and hit face with it to get the edwin up to a 14/14
Just got on youtube, saw this :3
How to decide whether to dagger face or keep it?
I am wondering, wouldn't master of disguise not be better than azure drake for miracle?
In the very beginning, why did he replace backstab? I thought it's a really good opening spell for a miracle rogue.
nice teddy bear
how about some of that freeze mage games?
I love miracle :(( i wish i had leeroy to play it :(( it looks so incredibly fun :(
:( :( :(
huurenkind
13:25 Was the video delayed or did he somehow know the survivor of the Brawl ?
Ah shiet, here we go again.
why not shadowstep SI7 at 24:35?
What's this lateral app hi's using to track the cards drawned? Sry for the bad english.
Wondering why he quit the last turn so soon. He could've hit the Sunwalker, Blade Flurry, Evis the giant, and SI to finish the giant. 2+2+3=7 mana
I guess the mage wins at turn 10, but maybe he didn't draw his burn yet.
Miracle Op
What you guys think about this ideas for this legendary cards? C'thun "summon 2 tentacles or maybe destroy (eats) a random minion". Yogg-Saron "takes control of a random minion for one turn each turn". ¿Op?
So C'thun is like a Cenarius with less utility / other stats and Yogg'Saron is a must kill or lose everything? Last one seems a bit stupid.
For the Yogg-Saron I'd go crazier like, "Temporarily gain control of a random enemy minion at the start of your turn. During your turn, the controlled minion gains Deathrattle: take 2 damage."
If you consider how Yogg'Saron works in-game (World of Warcraft that is), the idea of Mind-Controll does make sense, but the idea of how taking over multiply enemies would be a bit cray.
He would in theory be a better Sylvanas, unless instantly killed.
CorvintusDK Yogg'Saron could switch the owner of a random minion (not himself).
C'thun - 5 mana 2/5 with summon 2 1/3 Tentacles with Taunt (stats could be different) or 'swallow a random enemy minion. If C'thun dies next turn, the minion is regurgitated back on the board with half the health it had, if C'thun lives the minion is eaten alive'.
Whatcha say?
y u do dis So the Yogg'Saron would be like Millhouse Manastorm, do you have the balls to play it? You would have to be super lucky / have the craziest amount of luck, it would probably only work if you were really far behind, and work as a different Mindcontrol tech. Could be interesting depending on his stats.
I would personally use him in some trolly deck.
C'thun seems really lagging with the 2/5 for 5 mana. Then what you get is 4 / 11 of stats on 3 minions. Or a bigger Fen Creeper.
The other one where he eats a minions sounds like a lot of fun, and might force many decks to wait for him to be popped, in addition he would also be a hard removal card. I must say he should have rather good stats if this was to go through, so he isn't just a "play, dies no matter what" card.
Why no Hafu? :(
can anyone give me help o how to use rogue really well?
I use he "chansus miracle", no have legendary carts
(Copied from the last vid)
Dear Trump or Jens or whoever... Would it be possible to put in the description of these videos when they were recorded? I think it would be pretty neat.
Hearthstone Classic Pog
Ayyyy so hyped to relive this nostalgia
All you have to do is overload on taunts.. i pkay m rogue and its hard to get around 6-7 taunts...
R.I.P. auctioneer
You could have won that turn 5:10 , if you leeroy'd twice with Shadowstep.
At 21:30 why not edwin coin shadowstep edwin for a turn 3 8/8?
Because your opponent can sap edwin and you feel bad for waisting shadowstep and coin.
It is matter of safe play vs counting on luck.
Whats that Mage deck? Seems pretty solid. Do you know that deck Trump? :)
How does he get the decklist on the leftside?
that's added in video; it isn't there while he plays
Sergey Antopolsky I hope someone makes a mod for it so it can be :D
***** not until Blizzard makes an API to access data of decks, cards drawn/played, etc in real time. And honestly I doubt they'll do that at all, ever.
Rennert Sergey Antopolsky ***** There is a mod, and trump is using it in this video, it's called "HearthDecker", Google it.
ThzZoltek Its his editor jens, he doesnt see the list while playing.
am I the only 1 who sees Armands the warior ALOT
Trump uploaded a miracle rouge? what a miracle
8:45 why was that an error?
He forgot to attack with the elite
Np Trump I block the ads anyways :)
trump youve played against the rank 2 player "armads" three times now including the games you played while hafu was coaching you and he always played the control warrior
"My opponent is at 36 health. I am so close to lethal." - this is exactly what's wrong with the current game balance.
What was the error @ ~ 8:50 ?
He thought he had enough mana for whirlwind.
He forgot to attack with korkron.
Ruben Bomans i see thx
Ruben Bomans he said it was an error after he summoned it o.O
Warriorra can otk too quite well. It only requires 6 cards. not even a rare needed.
Is Earthen ring a throw away card or does it serve some purpose? If the former is true then why not have a card with better utility like ooze?
I suppose you're right seeing as Miracle Rogue doesn't run enough minions to worry about weapons and already has enough card draw for Harrison to be less useful.
NOOO I WANTED HAFFFUUU
people appear so content in nerfing fun in hearthstone >_> if you don't move with the metagame you get left behind and lose alot xD people claimed murlocks were op until people actually started playing around them...play around miracle and you'll be fine :p
noob question but what r the numbers for when u get legend rank?
Top legend rank is number 1. If you win a game your number gets smaller, i.e. closer to 1, if you lose your number starts going up.
Whats the name of the addon on the left side which shows which cards are left in his deck? Pls answer :)
Furyon GG it's not an addon, they edit it on after it's recorded.
Furyon GG its actually called hearthstone deck tracker.
It doesn't seem like Trump to edit out losses for his uploads. I know others do it but I didn't think Trump would.
makes sense
Rogue seems hard to play D: !
what is the perfect hand with this deck ?
Opening hand you mean? There are multiple variants. Thalnos, Backstab, Deadly Poison, Gadgetzan is pretty good.
miricle hard to play?
dat ad money yo.
Whats that thing on the side where it changes when you draw a certain card
+Drakkthar Teemo And how do you do it
it's a tool called Innkeeper
why do people concede right before getting killed?? i only ever concede if my enemy has lethal on the board but decides to be a dick and play thousands of other cards before finally killing me
cuz there's no reason to stay. I always concede when I know I'm lost
Time is money. If youre already lost why to waste any time?
Killing them right before they are able to concede is always the best feeling for me.
Beside freeze giant mage. What else can beat this? Seems really strong.
Handlock, Miracle has slim chances against it
Hunter with traps.
Warrior with Armor Up.
Control Paladin with clear board and heal up.
Shaman with burst.
Priest, similar to Paladin.
Hello Trump, i wonder why sometimes then you on a better rand you suddenly drop from 85 to 104, or it is just a video cut where you don't show where you had defeat? Nice videos really like them
Best Regards Mark Yanovskiy
As the playlist says: these are highlighted games - not all matches are shown. Only those that are worth the time. The term "highlight" is used somewhat loosely but that is how it is.
Anyway, this includes both won and lost games we don't just cut out every game where he was defeated.
As a result you can notice his rank dropping or rising because games in-between were cut out.
~ Jens
Thank you so much for quick explanation Jens, keep up your videos really like them they teach me a lot. And it was nice that to see you winning the Legendary rank how to see you rank 1.
Best Regards Mark Yanovskiy
Hеarthstооone Item Toоl v2.0 is 100% undеtеctаblе, sо уоur aссоunt will bе sаfe. Wе sеt monthlу rеsоurсes limit and we are using the bеst Аnti-bаn script. Yоu сan get a lоt оf gоld аnd аrсanе dust in hеarthstone in 6 minutеs !!★◆ twitter.com/eb0e5cf65bb1bf306/status/754573659260329984 ★◆ Heаrthstonе Miraclе Тrumр Rоguе Constructеd
Wouldn't people prefer to get to a high rank with a deck they've made themselves? Or is that just me?
8:44 why was it an error?
Hooversom He forgot to attack with his charge minion
Daniel Draugsvoll ah he pressed end turn too fast lol
Omg trumps has legs! !!! :P
how does Trump know the result of brawl beforehand ?
The last minion to be drawn into the brawl wins.
TSM!!!
consel dont fiel dont let them knew
SCUUMMP