The Tragic Story Of Handley Page Victor XM714
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 ก.ค. 2024
- The V-Bombers were the United Kingdom's nuclear attack force during the Cold War. They served as the main strike force for if the UK needed to drop a nuclear bomb onto an area. During the time of increased tension against the Soviets this could have very much been a possibility. The V-Bombers were made up of the iconic Avro Vulcan, the Vickers Valiant and also the Handley Page Victor. Each one of these aircraft could have carried and dropped a nuclear warhead should they needed to.
The Handley Page Victor had the largest bomb bay of the three V-Bombers, and could in theory have dropped the biggest payload causing a colossal amount of damage to an area. It's a futuristic looking aircraft but also a devastating one. In this video however we look at the tragic story of a specific Handley Page Victor, XM714.
During the Cold War, many RAF bases around Great Britain had V-Bombers on stand-by at airfields in order to launch them as soon as a possible attack was launched on the nation. Within minutes they could be airborne and ready to drop a nuke. XM714 was one of these aircraft based at RAF Wittering, however on a training mission tragedy would strike this remarkable aircraft.
Join us today as we look at, 'The Tragic Story Of Handley Page Victor XM714.'
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Music by: I am a man who will fight for your honour by Chris Zabriskie
The Victor still looks futuristic, even now 😎
To me it looks more steampunky.
Retro futuristic
Bro it looks straight out of the soviet union
@@Unknown_Ooh The IL-28 from the Soviet Union looks pretty futuristic, so does the M-4 Molot. Cool looking planes can still come from the worst of places.
Looks like it's escaped from an episode of Thunderbirds.
I arrived at Wittering a few months after this accident, spending time with both the active squadrons and also the Victor Training Flight. I was told that the fire/rescue machine went straight through the fence at the end of the runway, down a large dip and straight across the A1 - a dual carriageway, in the rush to get there. The rear seats of the Victor were fixed and the chances of getting out in a hurry were always dubious but it led to these rear seats being later replaced so that they could rotate and improve the chances of the rear crew escaping. You should also note the protective screen as the door opens so the crew would have a chance to fall and not be blown into the wings.
At the time of the Blue Steel stand-off rocket, a team of musically inclined RAF fitters created a pop group called the 'Hedgehoppers' soon after the bombers went into their low level mode. The song, "Its good news week' was in the charts for about 12 weeks during 1965 reaching #5.
Also commenting on the technical specification. The Vulcan got the glamour but was outclassed in almost every other way by the Victor performance.
Hoping my memory is not confused about the above note...
There was quite some controversy surrounding the pilot/co pilot only ejection seats. It was regarded as a classic issue by some. The Vulcan also had the same system of only ejection seats for pilot/co pilot .. with the same outcomes for the rest of the crew. Parachutes are great on their own but need one thing to work effectively.. altitude... the pilots attempts to climb may have been to allow others the chance to escape. And altitude is EVERY crew-mans friend in an air emergency. I drive trucks and regularly park opposite a Shell garage on the A1 just south of Barnack. Suddenly there is a tenuous connection... Thanks for sharing this story. R.I.P those crew members who didn’t make it.
The group were actually called ‘Hedgehog Anonymous”. I was at RAF Wittering when they formed.
I worked at Wittering in the Met Office for seven years from 1967 and never heard any mention of this accident, even though I was there for the last couple of years of the Victors. I watched a Harrier fall out of the sky, in 1972 I believe, killing the American pilot who was training with the conversion unit.
Hedgehoppers not Hedgehog Anonymous!
Although the incident happened over 57 years ago I remember it vividly. 139 Squadron was my first posting out of RAF Halton and I had arrived in January of 1963 and it fell to us (I was a J/T on shift) to form the overnight Crash Guard at Barnack. Not a pleasant experience - that for me continued for I was also part of the Honour Guard for the Crews funeral shortly afterwards. The Crew are buried at RAF Wittering Church. RIP.
My father used to work at Handley Page at Radlett and worked inside the wings of the Victor. Rest in peace dad. You nearly reached 100but died on 8th December 2019
So sad. He must have been a great fella.
My grandpa use to work at handley page also he was there till the end in 1970 he was the resident architect and contract manger for them
I was at Handley Page Colney Street in the 60's in Inspection. What was your dad called?
My grandfather used to work on them in squadron 55 in the 60s.
Outstanding pity post…
This amazing aircraft was ahead of it's time. True that it looks like something from the future even now. No other aircraft comes near it in terms of aesthetics and beauty, even now. Truly amazing form and design. A classic work of art and beauty. Will always be in awe of this magnificent ❤️ flying machine of majesty and grace.
She is my favourite of all the types I worked on, plenty of room to work on her :)
The Victor was by far the best looking V bomber. It will always look like the future.
Very cool.
So different to the American aircraft of the time which seemed to be crudely designed with the use of a straight edged ruler.
True but the ugly B-52s a/k/a BUFF is still flying today
Victor was my favourite of the 3 bombers. It looked a malevolent aircraft, just right for it's proposed intention.
B-52s are still flying, and have ejection seats for the full crew.
Many will not know, that Handley Page Victor's, we're capable of Mach One, in a dive! This was achieved by the design of the wing, which considerable reduced the critical moment of the airflow slowing the aircraft down, when you consider, that the last bomber that Handley Page produced was the Halifax of WW2 vintage, then this unbelievable futuristic aircraft, was flying in 1957,is incredible! The last one that I saw flying, was in West Wales in 1976,as a tanker, with 2 English Electric Lightnings being refuelled, what an absolute fantastic aircraft!
My understanding is that the Victor could fly just AT Mach1 which made it difficult to attack as the attacker had to fly much faster in order to catch it, and because he couldn't 'hover' at Mach 1, would overfly the Victo, using up copious amounts of fuel.
The first prototype flew in 1952, not 1957. The Mark 2 flew in 1959.
It had been rumoured that development aircraft, XA917 (painted silver) hit the sound barrier in a dive. It was claimed that ‘coincidentally’ (?) the plane just happened to be pointed at Chief Designer, Godfrey Lee’s, back garden.
An interesting case was a Victor that I believe lost its pitot tube while at high speed and high level. The aircraft was shaking a lot that combined with the dodgy airspeed reading led the crew to nose down, and that was that. The time of impact was exactly recorded by the marks on the watch face of one of the crew. Initially a boat gave the wrong position of the impact but parts were eventually found.
The last fragment of audio from the aircraft was some conversation and what seemed to be a radio station in the background.
The crash did a lot for flight safety in the RAF and is documented in the RAF Historical Society.
It first flew in 1952, and yes, many knew it could go supersonic just as the cv990 did once.
I’m French and I must admit the brits have a little something that make their aircraft elegant and unusual.
Bravo
@Xavier Ancarno Wait till you see the airmarshal's unusual teeth.
@@trespire But those don’t make an aircraft elegant and unusual.
The Mirage 4 was pretty elegant too :)
Imagine seeing Lancasters during WW2 then 10 or so years later, this.
It must have felt like we'd be on Mars by the 80's for sure. Turned out everything and everyone was full of sh*t.
Haha! Exactly, honestly the V-Bombers when compared with the Lancasters are crazy. Technology shifted extremely quickly during the 1950s.
Then imagine being in 2020 and we have no heavy bombers at all..
Or a P-51D to a F-104A
I feel confident that we would have flown a Mars mission if the Cold War had continued. But it didn't -- thank God -- and there was no longer a military justification for the spending.
That said, knowing what we know now about Mars and about long-duration spaceflight, it's extremely likely that a mission would have ended in tragedy.
@@AubriGryphon
Almost certainly.
In all branches of the British military, the rank 'lieutenant' is pronounced 'leff-tenant'.
Never mind the “leftant”pronunciation, what about “Victaa” or “bommaa” - awful. Nice looking plane though.
Never mind the “leftant”pronunciation, what about “Victaa” or “bommaa” - awful. Nice looking plane though.
@llewellyn evans Incorrect error that needs to be corrected? Not at all. Your name suggests you are Welsh or of Welsh heritage, so you should know more than most that sometimes words are not pronounced exactly as they are written :).
The term 'lieu' is originally French, and the French do not pronounce it 'loo' but 'lyerh'. The German version (and possibly Dutch as well) is leutnant, but it is pronounced 'loitnant', not 'lootnant'.
Like so many things, the pronunciation has historic roots. I had read something to this effect some time back, but could not remember the explanation. But, Google being our friend as ever, a quick search found many suggestions as to the origin, but I think the most likely is this:
"Etymonline indicates that spelling with lef- dates to the 14th century, but that the origins of that spelling (and presumably its associated pronunciation) are “mysterious”. The word comes originally from Old French, and according to the OED, Old French replaced word- and syllable-final [w] with [f]; for the Modern French word lieu, this is shown by an Old French spelling variant luef. Both forms, whyever they exist, just happened to stick."
Not so. Ask anyone in the Royal Navy.
@@jimwoods9551 - agree about the looks but yet another (or ‘anuva’) narrator unable to pronounce ‘Nuclear’ (0:12) instead saying ’nucular’!🤯😳
I worked at Handley Page in the main drawing office. We made submissions to the Air Ministry/MOD to install ejection seats for the entire crew at a cost of £180 per aircraft. This was rejected and a suggestion was received from them “to fit hand hold in the floor, so crew members could pull themselves out of their seats”, wearing their heavy ‘chutes to the port hatch enabling their safe exit. This would assume the avoidance of the port engine intake or the high tail fin. Each crew member had an instrument console on which a small sign announcing “Abandon Aircraft” could be illuminated by the pilot by depressing it. Having done so, his immediate duty might be regarded as discharged due to constraints of time in emergency situation.
Ejection seats for the whole crew would not have been easy to incorporate in the airframe. Tell us more.
There is a plaque on the Aerodrome at Radlett at the entrance to an industrial estate.How lucky I am now in my sixties can remember waiting at the end of the aerodrome for a Victor to take off .
The problems of getting out without an ejection seat were well identified during WW2 because of the g forces present when an aircraft is spinning or diving out of control making it impossible for crew members to get to an escape hatch. . Ejection seats should have been incorporated in the original V bomber design and any excuse on cost grounds is pathetic as such cost compared to the overall cost of each airframe is very low indeed.
I believe the original design incorporated an escape capsule for all the crew similar to the F-111 but it was rejected because it was considered too complex. The complete nose section was the escape module and the parachutes would have been stowed in the plenum chamber above and behind the cockpit.
In the end, the rear crew members and the 6th seat occupant were provided with rotating seats and nitrogen-operated booster cushions to help them rise from their seats and get to the escape door.
Unfortunately as has been previously mentioned, one Victor whose tailplane was knocked off by a Buccaneer in the mid 70's crashed with all but one of the pilots on board because of the g-forces created by the tumbling aircraft prevented everyone else getting out. IIRC it was the captain that survived and he said he saw the copilot trying to reach his seat-pan handle to eject, but he'd been flying with his straps loose and with the g forces throwing him upwards he couldn't reach it.
The Victor was a great aircraft but suffered the usual British neglect. Like the Vulcan it never received the modern equipment it deserved. It, and the Vulcan should have been given modern electronics etc. The Vucan proved it could, ( and did,) penetrate modern air defences in exercises against the US mainland and the Victor could still have been a first rate and very versatile aircraft. Incidentally You seem to suggest the Victor could be used in a low level role, it couldn't but no aircraft can do everything. Both the Vulcan and the Victor make the US B52 look like a biplane, but unlike Britain, he US cared for their machines and constantly updated the B52s.
what are you talking about... it served as a tanker for years
@@storm19802 Yes it served a long while . . as a tanker!
While this is a valuable role it was a waste of such a great machine. The view came about that high and even medium level bombing was no longer viable and as the Victor was not a good low level machine it was adapted for tanker duties, which it performed welll for many years, HOWEVER it was a superb high level machine and had it been updated and retained in that role would have made an excellent stand off bomber carring cruise missiles etc.
Look how much money and effort was put into upgrading the B52 force, the payoff being that the Americans retained a substantial and viable bomber fleet.
Now there is the idea of using the most modern fighters in conjunction with B52s which would carry large numbers of long range weapons controlled by the fighters.(( UK governments have traditionally not paid enough, frequently no, attention to upgrading its assets. The Buccaneer being another example. It continued to serve well in multiple roles but never received any meanigfull upgrade.))
Too bad the UK could not keep the plane upgraded. It’s beautiful.
Absolutely not true, the Victors were switched into the low level role in 1963 and performed this role remarkably well, though they has not been designed for low level operations and this was an interim measure until the later doomed TSR2 came into service. I had first hand experience of this low level flying over the Malayan jungle at treetop height and around the mountains, even into and out of volcanic craters and flying over the sea at wavetop height attacking ships. The Victor was remarkably agile and treated almost like a fighter. They also performed low level attacks on the Australian coast by flying under the radar and only being detected visually when landing at the RAAF Darwin airbase with all the defending Mirages still on the ground. However, within a year of starting this the Mk1s and 1As were recalled to be converted to tankers following the grounding of the Valiants, their role in the Far East being taken over by Vulcans. The B2 Victors continued the bombing role for a few more years before they in turn were converted into tankers and the low level role was taken over by RAF Buccaneers as an interim measure until the Tornadoes became available. The Victors proved their superiory by remaining in active service almost a decade after the last Vulcan.
This thing is awesome, like a UFO, British aircraft are functional and look great, this still looks modern and futuristic
Well this ties in with the story my grandad told me. My grandad was a carpenter, who would do work for the air ministry, in the 50s and 60s, doing work on the Lincolnshire airfields. On his way to Wittering one day, the main road was closed, so him and his workmates had to go through Bainton and Barncack to reach Wittering. Sure enough it was because the above Victor had crashed.
The Victor appears to look as if it came out of a Jules Verne novel.
Art Deco Flash Gordon.
Looks like it was sculpted out of Play-Doh by an 8-year-old.
In my opinion, it was the most impressive-looking of the V-bombers.
I thought exactly the same 😁
Rocket transporter in The Cham Cham designed by Derek Meddings.
A bit of useless trivia. The only v bomber to drop a live test h bomb was the valiant that is now at Cosford air museum.The valiant had a design flaw in its main wing spars and as a result was dropped by the company.The problem lay in its outer underslung fuel tanks which overstressed the main spar. Cracks appeared and couldn't be repaired within tolerance. God I bore myself sometimes?????
Excellent nugget. Not at all boring
Like you, facts are facts.Don't be bored
It’s too bad that the Valiant was short-lived. It was a nice aircraft being the Royal Air Force’s first V-bomber. 🇬🇧
@@spreadeagled5654 It was.The thing was that Vickers did so much of the engineering in designing the "v" bomber that both Handley page and avro learned from.You could argue it was a transition aircraft which makes it to me the more interesting than the Victor or Vulcan.
They made a strengthened faster Valiant long before the fatigue grounded them, but only one was built and flown as the MOD decided....quite rightly for once, that 2 successful V Bomber designs was enough. Look up Valiant B2. There is an irony. The B2 Valiant was faster at low level than either Vulcan B2 or Victor B2, and much beefier than the B1 designed for high level...so when the V force went from high level to low level the B2 Valiant "might" have been the best of the lot in that role....who knows. The B2 was used as a test aircraft from 53-58, then scrapped.
The Victor had an absolutely amazing bomb carrying capacity for its size!
Other nations and organisations may have Bases but the RAF has Stations.
Not sure if that applies to NATO "Bases" like Lakenheath
@@davdave3470 Lakenheath, Mildenhall & Alconbury although designated as RAF Stations they are and always have been USAF Bases. The RAF have Stations commanded by Station Commanders or "Stash"
Both the US Navy and Marines have Air Stations too, such as Naval Air Station Pensacola.
@@impspa3676 Or 'Station Masters'!
Alec Galbraith was my dad's roommate when they were in flight training with Meteors in 1952 and remembered him fondly. Alec was relatively short and was at a disadvantage when it came to applying rudder during single engine exercises in the Meteor and I understand he transferred onto Venoms.
A unique design that looks like something out of a Terminator film.
Looked like something from and 80's manga
As a student engineering apprentice at RAE Farnborough (1958-63), I had an interesting experience during ground-testing of the RAE's Victor B.1. Sitting in the co-pilot's seat beside my Aero-engine maintenance supervisor, I notched up the aircraft's AS Sapphire turbojets in pairs to 95%. It was like a bucking bronco! Located near the perimeter fence of the airfield, I thought for a second or two we'd jump the fence and land on the golf course beyond! Quite a memory. As a 'PS', I later had a flight in the RAF Institute of Aviation's Hunter T.7. But that's another story... I later left engineering behind to become a Christian minister. Both aircraft encounters provided opportunities for sharing my faith in Christ. That too is another story!
Alan, would you recall that Victor's number? it would be XA 9** Anything between 917 and 941, but probably around the 917, 918 mark.
@@paulholyoak5436 XA922 I think.
You need to tell the stories!
@@charlesrussell1764 THANK YOU for your interest. My Hunter flight story is on TH-cam, the Victor one yet to be told.
@@charlesrussell1764 Thanks and best wishes. Did you see this? th-cam.com/video/uLOm6rN1aY4/w-d-xo.html
i love this futuristic and somehow organic look
I highly doubt the crew panicked.
If Darth Vader had an Air Force for Earth the Victor and Vulcan would be the backbone of it. Their looks would match his menacing appearance.
There is a very good book called "The Man in the Hot Seat" by Doddy Hay which documents how he was involved in ejection seat research and testing over many years. He and many others complained in that book that he totally disagreed with the lack of rear ejector seats in the three V bombers, and stated that it was the Labour Government that would not finance the extra cost to fit them. Many good people died because of that cruel decision, too many
Great video, the Victor is my favorite V Bomber. Unique look, and actually great service life makes it one of the best
The Victor and the Vulcan were always top notch stuff.
Gone are the days when they both ruled the roost.
Both are much missed, and shame on the UK neither type are in flying order as of 2020. ( as far as I am aware.)
A static museum piece is fine.
But to see them in action is even better and a fitting tribute to them both.
Er, the Victor at Bruntingthorpe occasionally lifts off...
@@paulholyoak5436 not now it doesn't, infact the type only flew once by accident since it's arrival at Bruntingthorpe in 1993. It used to do fast taxi runs twice a year, but since the runway was bought for Auction car storage, any hope of any aircraft fast taxiing again there is extremely slim. And thus, another chapter closes on British aviation Heritage.
Great info, and subbed! Many thanks 😇👍💪
I left HP in early 1966 and switched to package engineering, when it became very apparent that HP’s days were numbered. There was absolutely no way that the Jetstream project could, along with the sadly not over popular Herald and Military servicing contracts, be able to sustain the Company. It was popularly believed that the downfall was due to Sir Frederick’s attitude, “that nobody is going to tell me how to run my Company”, at a time when the Government was insisting on manufacturers merging. Hence, BAC. So, no more Government projects against which to bid were forthcoming, and the Company policy of enacting a 12 month credit line with suppliers, meant that the latter could read the warning signs and came for their money. Designing a new aircraft is not a five minute task, so even if a project had been secured, would HP have had enough backing to fulfil.
THAT WAS WELL WORTH WATCHING.THANK YOU..MERRY XMAS...HOWARD
Never saw this bomber. But as a child that Vulcan Bomber impressed me and my Dad as a static display at Hickam AFB, Honolulu, Hawai'i.
I was serving on 139Sqn at that time and along with the others of our XL192 team were on the Sqn dispersal near to the tower when 714 took off. The first we knew of the event was the appearance of the smoke. Unless my memory has failed me 714 belonged to and was being operated by 100 Sqn on that training mission.
During 1962 & 1963 QRA was shared alternately on a 28 Day basis between the 2 squadrons with only one aircraft on the QRA dispersal at any one time other than briefly during the few hours of the day 28 handover. The one exception was the weekend of the 'Cuban Missile Crisis' when a second aircraft was prepped, loaded and readied to go. On Friday the 26th of October XL192 completed its 28 day stint along with the 6 erk and 2 crew chiefs that were the aircraft's dedicated (happy days) servicing team. During Friday morning the replacement from 100 Sqn was positioned, prepped, loaded and accepted by the aircrew. As soon as the weapon was unloaded from 192 at midday we towed it back to the hangar parked it and left ready to return Monday when we would begin reroling back to the conventional training configuration.
At 1pm the following day most of us had been rounded up and were back in the hangar getting ready to tow 192 back to the QRA pan where it was again prepped and presumably had the weapon, possibly the same that was removed the day before, winched back into the bomb bay. Fortunately for me as I'd completed the last 48hr stint I was stood down ready to take the next stint on Monday presuming that there would be a next Monday. By the time Monday came we were all still alive, the country was still intact and 192 was back in the hangar.
I joined 139Sqn in March 62 when it was still in the state of being equipped with the Victor B2. At that point only 4 of the eventual complement of 8 had been delivered from Radlett. Eventually in 1963 the first Blue Steel variants began to arrive. Throughout my time at Wittering I don't recall more than one aircraft at a time being routinely committed to QRA. It was always hard to understand, other than for reasons of the prevailing wind ( from the West), why QRA was located less than 300 yards from the A1 which was a very busy road even in those times. It was possible to stand by the aircraft and watch the traffic going North & South. As both squadrons were in the process of being built up and prepared for Blue Steel I suspect there were not sufficient resources to allow double manning in that period. My time at Wittering came to an end in November 63.
Nice post ‘Victor...’ great name also.👍🏻
You forgot one small detail.........your job on 139 sqn was peeling potatoes
We more than likely met. I arrived on 139 Sqdn. as a brand new J/T Air frames in Jan '63
Really well made, thank you. I vaguely remember this as my brother was on leave from RAF Nordhorn in Germany, a TAF Fixer Station and he was upset as Nordhorn was basically a bombing range and he loved the Victors.
And great to hear something in a pure Leicester accent!
You guessed my accent! Its a real issue of debate it seems at the moment, but you are correct! Thanks for the comment mate.
@@TheUntoldPast I was born in Leicester, (Clarendon Park) went to school there, but left decades ago.
I can remember RAF Leicester East.
@@Ystadcop Born Hinckley, the last night the sirens went, or so I'm told.
Good viewing and interesting. But LOOtenant! please pronounce correctly "LEFTtenant". I remember when I joined the Royal Navy in 1973 and a lad in our class called his divisional officer "LOOtenant" whilst on the parade ground and he had to run around the parade ground holding his SLR above his head shouting "It's LEFTtenant not LOOtenant" He pronounced it correctly after that.
Also, 'Blue Steel' was a 'nuclear ' weapon. Why do so many peopls mis-pronounce this as "nucular"? The narrator in this video is inconsistent, pronouncing it incorrectly and then correctly in a number of instances. His vacillation between "bummah" and "bombers" is also highly irritating. The 'script', if there was one for this video, features far too many needless repetitions of elements of this sad story, often with only seconds between them.
I so agree with these two comments. A sad story of a stalling aircraft possibly but the narrator's poor pronunciation and droning voice made me want to turn it off. As a retired RAF officer it is sad to hear of colleagues losing their lives in such an accident. RIP and Per Ardua Ad Astra
This aircraft looks like it's about to lean over and bite your head off. Was there ever a more sinister and purposeful looking plane? Besides being drop dead gorgeous too.
The early military jets were generally very dangerous for their crews, I understand, because escape technology had not kept pace with engine development - sadly a familiar story. So it's no surprise that four of the six crew had to 'bail out' in a very traditional way from so high performance a machine. The early Meteor fighters (and the Me 262 Schwalbe before them) were even more lethal to escape from - ejector seats didn't even exist, and opening the canopy must have been almost impossible.
The Me-262 had an ejector seat
Sounds almost like the British Board of Trade. They did not keep up with lifeboat capacity either as ships got bigger.
As the narator says, the pilot and co piolet of the Victor has ejector seats.
The rest of the crew were to bail out of a side door. At 3.45 you see this door open with a cover to stop the crew from being sucked into the engine intakes.
Im fairly certain crew members never practiced this bail out procedure and it was accepted that they were doomed in the event of trouble
@@jimtuite3451 Perhaps against expectations there were some successful crew evacuations from Vulcans and Victors, but they tended to run against the trend.
@@jamesricker3997 I'm not sure that is true. The Germans did have ejector seats in development for sure, but I don't think the 262 was ever equipped with one.
Very informative. Thank You.
Sad. Condolence to family, friends, squadron mates and the Nation of Great Britain.
All those organic curves, drawn by hand before the days of computerized CAD and modeling. I can imagine all the head scratching going on at the drafting tables!
Whilst in the HP DO training school at Cricklewood, we were give a task to plot the right angle surface intersection of two cones, with the axis non coincidental. The curve plotting was usually carried out in the ‘Loft’ department, on 8’ x 4’ aluminium sheets, painted pale blue. Thin (say) 5mm x 5mm flexible ‘splines’ made from long lengths of Perspex. The splines being held securely in place with purpose designed lead weights, having a wooden base and a metal ‘beak’ to rest on the spline. Once in place, the curve was drawn using something like an aluminium pencil. The plots were full size, and the number of sheets, edge to edge, and on very heavy adjustable height tables was increased depending upon the size of the component.
Etched in my memory. Was a J/T Groundcrew on duty that evening (just a day after my 20th Birthday) on 139 Sqdn. XM714 was with 100 Sqdn. Was on site within an hour and with others from my Squadron stood crash guard until the following morning.
I think this is such a handsome bomber. They are currently restoring one at Duxford.
I was just up the road at Cottesmore, 10 Sqdn Victor B1's from March '63, and I don't remember this accident., not saying of course it didn't happen. Ours was the only B1 Sqdn. Over the runway to us was 15, but they were B1 A's. Witterings's Victors were B2's of course, as was 543 at Wyton with their PR's.
The narrator in the video says it could carry 48, 1,000 bombs. It was actually 35, in 7 pallets of five. During Confrontation with Indonesia in '64, we bombed up our four Mk 1A's with the 35 1,000 pounders, and uplifted engine max RPM to 102.5%. I really really know this last point as I was the scrawny armed engine mech who slid his arm through the engine door fillets to do the adjustment on all four on one aircraft, with the aircrew strapped in on a dispersal, and communicating with the crew chief on a long lead, who communicated to me by raising his hand up or down, me without ear defenders, and receive a modest (very) disability pension for hearing loss as a result. Although on 10, I was on detachment with 15 at Butterworth at the time. There were also four more 1 A's at Tengah likewise prepped. 10 were the first Victor Sqdn to disband and we managed at least nine of our ten aircraft into the air for a flypast at Cottesmore, a truly amazing sight to see, nine Victors in a diamond nine formation. The flypast concluded with one aircraft doing a high speed run at low level down the centreline, with shock waves forming on the leading edges and 'blowing' back over the wings and reforming again. Those days at Cottesmore were truly wonderful, a great time to be alive.
I remember watching those fabulous victor tankers take off from RAF Marham way back in 1975 the sound was absolutely amazing.
One of the most beautiful bombers ever built in my view.
My favourite V bomber.......... One of my all time favourite aircraft.
Saw a Victor land at Goose Bay air base in 1959 while I was en route to Incirlik AB in Turkey. Eerily beautiful, it had crossed the Atlantic on a training mission, very common during the Cold War. The green Aurora Borealis, or northern lights, draped overhead in constantly changing patterns. Totally surreal experience.
Hi friend. In 1964, I was at Goose Bay for 11/2 years in the RAF, handling a much increased through put of both Victors and Vulcans which were training up in Canada on low level attack runs, for anticipated sorties into the USSR. My father served in the first RAF Victor squadron at Cottesmore in 1958 and I followed in his footsteps.
“Slight misjudgment by the Pilot.” This is not a criticism aimed at him as I have no knowledge of the training regime in those days. Nowadays great emphasis is placed on recognition of the impending stall. A prompt recover follows. these salutary lessons were brought about by such accidents. A sad loss of young brave crew.
Great video
Thanks!
I spent months trying to find *any* images at all of XM714. One image from New Zealand that may or may not have been XM714 is all I found.
Then months later I found some very nice high quality colour footage of XM714 (with the serial on show in some angles)
Nice mate :)
join the victor page on facebook and upload it please
For me it is still the most beautiful looking bomber, grace, elegance and futuristic Look.
Brendan Jackson 'understanding what was happening' ejected and lived. It might have been appropriate for him to have elucidated his thoughts to the other crew members. at 4 to 5 thousand feet at stall speed and with the inertia of a Victor-indeed any heavy bomber, there would not have been a great deal of time to discuss problems presenting themselves. I feel confident to assert that the crew would not have panicked. They were well trained in a magnificent aircraft. Indeed the Victor was one of the best aircraft along with the TSR2 and the Buccaneer ever designed by the British aero industry....I suppose I should mention the Spitfire, Hurricane, Lancaster, Mossie, Tempest, Seafury, Hunter, the beautiful Seahawk, plus the Gannet, Provost, Gnat......the list is endless. Heaven forbid that you should think I am enamoured with British aircraft. But quite frankly, such a small country produced the finest aircraft and the best engines- both inline petrol and later, jet engines that the world has ever seen. I saw a Victor fly over me at around 20 thousand feet while cycling in Norfolk many years ago. It was silver and so exquisite that I fell off my bike watching it. it pains me that the new generation will never experience such a sight. You have no idea.
You forgot the harrier and concorde...
@@christianbuczko1481 My apologies, I simply rattled off a few classics. There were some pretty bad designs during the war, some were like the Beaver (though Canadian but it was de Havilland) akin to sitting in a gentleman's club sipping on a fine claret, but lethal when confronted by German fighters. Nice to have good flying characteristics and well harmonised controls but speed and agility is more useful when people are shooting at you They really smartened up their act by 1944 in fairness.
Beautiful Amazing looking aircraft
My all time favourite flying machine. A truly epic design, sinister, yet beautiful.
A very good friend of mine said his job was to toe these types of aircraft for scrap at raf st athens south wales in the earlt 1970,s from one camp across the road to the other camp, sadly he passed away in march due to esophagus cancer at 76, his opinion was he was keeping the peace or arms limitation, in my opinion these aircraft are very strange.
Always preferred these to the Vulcan
Wow, what a beautiful aircraft.
I am surprised that the UK has not come up with a blended wing airliner given their past v-bomber work.
Great video, and really fantastic channel with brilliant content. Thank you for sharing, keep up the amazing work. Do you have a patreon I could contribute to to help with the upkeep of the content?
Hi! Thanks for this amazing comment, i’m taken aback by your kindness. Currently I don’t have a Patreon, I will be launching one of these possibly in February. Thanks:)
I remember this like it was yesterday even though I was a kid of 10 years old..
My Dad also a pilot with 138 squadron Wittering on the Vickers Valiant’s but had retired when the Valiant was grounded & we lived in Greatford near Stamford..
We kids were outside the pub where I lived, when there was an almighty thud & the sky lit up like I’d never seen before.
We got on our bikes & peddled our hearts out to find out just what it was but gave up when we got halfway to Uffington ..
Only later did we find out what had happened..
Yes a fantastic aircraft, 20 years ahead of its time!
I personally witnessed the earlier crash of a Handley Page Victor In July 1960 near Oakley in Suffolk.
That was a beautiful plane!
2:18 Did he just say that Blue Steel was a PILOTED machine?! Where did the alleged pilot sit? 🤔
Haven't read all the comments but it wasn't a complete failure,as I remember it was the Victor that refuelled the Vulcans on their way to the Falklands so they could bomb the runway so the Argentinians couldn't land their Mirages & Pucara's
Great video :) The early B1s were powered by Sapphire turbojets but these were soon replaced in the B2s by more powerful Conway turbofans
Good video, but I do have a comment... The five airmen had families, and all sorts of things go through their minds: "What must it have been like?" We are reminded three times in this video about how horribly frightening it must have been. We get it. The family members have watched and may again see this video. I'd think it empathetic and generous to consider dropping two of the "...it must have been horribly frightening!" Let the audience discover that fearful question themselves.
Fully agree with your comments.
My godfather Ted Vernon was one of the victims of this accident. He was a long standing friend of my father who was also a navigator on XV Sqn at Cottesmore at the time.
RIP to all.
My father investigated bombers for the RAAF. Ultimately settling for the F111.
He once told me the theory behind the V bombers is that they could sit just below the speed of sound for long periods. Which is quite taxing on normal airframes. So any fighters following, trying to match it's speed would shake themselves to pieces.
I am not sure how accurate this is as I have never seen it mentioned anywhere else.
I've a comment further up the page on thistopic.
Never heard this idea before, but interesting. When you read about performance of aircraft, max speed is quoted but never cruise speed. Generally, an aircraft capable of mach 1 or more usually cruises at around 350 knots. Flying any faster would use too much fuel. Your father would be well worth listening to. All of this knowledge is disappearing and it is tragic.
@@charlesrussell1764 Unfortunately he passed away 15 years ago. He worked at the a Woomera rocket range as an engineer. For the Weapons Research Establishment. I think it was regarding Blue Streak, which ultimately a white elephant.
I once snuck a look at his resume and he also worked for Intelligence. "Evaluating Foreign Technical systems" I think it said.
@@HouseholdDog Unfortunately so many really interesting things are being lost because we do not record them. Blue Streak was a shift in philosophy before its time. AI is reintroducing the idea of killing without being killed. The military expends so much effort into enabling destruction that one has to wonder at our sanity as a species.
The victor is such a streamlined beast.
The V bombers were beautiful to behold !
Looks like a like a scaled up bell x1
I was stationed at RAF Wittering at that time, ground crew, nav radar, and ecm. and remember this traagic accident well. I think I'm correct in saying that the enquiry concluded that the engine fire warning light was a spurious indication. On climb out from Wittering , by the time the Victor was above Barnack village it would still have been climbing at a very steep angle, and the crew response of shutting down an engine would have put the aircraft into asymmetric power configuration, which, combined with the attendant reduction of propulsive power, and the aforementioned steep angle of climb, fatally affected air speed and caused the stall and spin, from which it was impossible to recover at such a (relatively) low altitude.
The aircraft exploded on impact in a small field on the edge of the village. The bomb it was carrying did not explode. It was a " concrete" bomb, carried on training flights to simulate the handling characteristics of the plane with a war- load on board. On my first shift of crash guard duty, I was surprised by what seemed to be such a small debris field and how little remained of the aircraft. Of course much had been burned to nothing, but major components such as engines etc would have been taken away for examination in the search for the cause of the crash.
Regarding the aircraft shown in the video, it bears great resemblance to a Victor mk 2 retro-fit which would have carried a blue steel stand-off missile and not a dumb bomb as was carried by xm714.
I could never decide whether the Victor was a thing of beauty or an ugly duckling, or both.
The one thing that was beyond doubt though was that it had a meaty malevolence about it. Without doubt it was the most intimidating looking military plane ever to take to the skies. It had the `dont F with me` factor in spades. In that respect alone it was a real looker.
LOOtenant!!!!!! Ignoramous. But good article, I used to live in the area, remember Victors and Vulcans flying around in anti flash white.
Are you sure about that 0 - in V rotate in 30 seconds? Somehow that sounds a bit too quick - the takeoff roll looks to be about 30 - so there's no allowance for the engines to spin up.
Looks like something Flash Gordon might pilot.
Awesome appearing aircraft.
Very sad. I wonder what was going on with the pilot? Stall shudder is very noticeable and every pilot recognizes it. A shudder should always be followed by a nose down. It's odd that he would want to pull up :(
Thanks for the comment. When making this I thought about that too, it seems he mis-judged his speed thinking he could still climb the aircraft.
Quite possibly he was trying to gain height to allow the guys in the back sufficient time to physically bail out ..not having ejector seats they would need height to give them time to manually climb out to the emergency chute...and time needed for their parachutes to open too ....the pilot.aware that his aircraft was going to down anyway could have been giving his crew this last chance ... afterall he didnt eject himself.
@@stevegolding5523 Having had flying lessons many moons ago there is a basic instinct to climb rather than drop the nose .Height equals safety. In a stall situation the brain panics and by instinct will pull the yoke back not forward.
I think they failed in their Airmanship , two pilots . One should be flying the plane the other should have been dealing with the engine fire , if that had been the case they wouldn't have stalled !!! .
@@glennpowell3444 Im sorry I cannot agree ..I've been a Commercial and Private pilot for 35 years flying light and heavy twins ..accumulating over 9000 hours in command and cannot agree with your argument at all ...... these aren't basic low time pilots with a couple of hours in a Cessna 152 with an instructor sitting next to a nervous novice during stall training and 'quoting' from the flight manual. Height isnt necessarily safety as you quote ..does rather depend on what is above you and for a novice pilot climbing into cloud will probably kill you quicker than anything else in aviation. But these pilots are some the worlds ELITE NUCLEAR BOMBER pilots flying during the Cold War with thousands and thousands of hours flight time in ..at the time ... one of the worlds most powerful aircraft and flying to the demanding regulations and training of the RAF. So no they are not going to pull back cos they might be a bit scared. On the contrary..and if you had had more flight time you would know that the instinctive natural reaction to a stall warning is to LOWER the nose. Look there are different ways of Stall andvStall recovery ..you can lower the nose to gain speed.... but if you are on approach in a stormy night .. at 500feet ..low visibility.. rain ..and a strong blustery cross wind the chances are that you are going to get a "Stall ... Stall " or stall buzzer sounding depending on what you are flying .. then the last thing you would want to do is lower the nose !!!!! ..... THE SIMPLEST THING ...Just add more power.
So the pilots reaction depends on the situation.
All a stall is that there isnt sufficient airflow over the wing to produce enough lift for the aircraft weight, configuration or angle of attack ... so to PREVENT the stall increase the airflow. I'm not going to go into all the different types of stall ...but for instance you can just stall one wing .. you can even stall PART of one wing ..and the recovery methods are very different .. but on this flight they had the complication of a fire ..possibly a compressor stall to cope with as well, a very heavy aircraft and the knowledge of the inability for the rear crew to be able to eject and no doubt the onset of an assymetric stall to contend with. What would you do ? ... he had a choice ... could have simply popped his seat and lived to tell you all about it .... or could have tried to get height to save his crew and die trying. But panic. No way.
Fantastic airplane. "When the airplane was spinning and the crew were plummeting to their death it must have been RAIL-LEE SCAR-EE." I think that is kind of an understatement.
Not to mention totally superfluous. The narration is really terrible, almost as bad as A.I. The Blue Steel was not a "Stand up" but a stand off missile. ffs
What's up with the photo at 2:04? It looks like a Victor K.2 at a US airport (the Chevy Suburban and the Ford fuel truck and various cars in the background) in the late 70's/early 80's but it looks like the photo was taken yesterday! Was this a scene set up in MSFS?
Maybe at Wideawake??
Amazing looking plane
My Grandad father died in an accident involving a hydraulic test on the Victor.
There was a Victor II lost on flight trials in, as I recall, 1958.
My father used to fly these at Wittering! I still have his log books.
His log books are priceless.
@@charlesrussell1764 Interesting. I mentioned them to the team looking after the Victor at Bruntingthorpe and they didn't seem interested.
@@johngreen8693 I am not surprised, but surprised that you mention it. Thoughts change nothing, Having been an instructor, I can relate to the crew on board at the time.
@@charlesrussell1764 Yes, Charles. Not that it matters. Still a lovely aircraft and I can remember them doing a demo QRA with four taking off in a "scramble" Sadly, I still don't know much about day to day life for the crews at the station.
@@johngreen8693 I had a friend in the air force at Cottesmore and stayed there once. I was most impressed at the lovely shine on the lino! Your father's log books are a valuable document, look after them. Incidentally, standing by the runway as 12 Lightnings go past on a full reheat takeoff is an experience I shall take to the grave.
The issue is that the British military always looks at the USA for new technology and ignores those developed in the UK.
At 2:17, what is a 'piloted winged aircraft' ???
Always reminded me of a VC10 !
Both just as noisy lol
@@zeberdee1972 Handley Page was one of the companies that along with Vickers became BAC(British Aircraft Corporation). I think it is well known that quite a lot of the technology about high T tails came from the Handley Page briefcase.
Both powered by Rolls Royce Conway engines. Powerful, fast, noisy, beautiful
You forgot to mentioned the Victors played main part during Falklands war..They refuelled main bomber all way down to South of Globe to destroy only landing strip on the Isles to stop use by Argentinians. Nice dokumentary, Regards from Czech Republic
I don't mean this as any kind of criticism, I'm trying to help you (yes, actually being helpful on the Internet! A strange concept, I know).
When referring to the rank of lieutenant in the British Armed Forces it's pronounced as "Leff-ten-ant" whereas in the United States Armed Forces it is pronounced as you pronounced it in the video, "lieu-ten-ant"
I'm not entirely sure if this rule applies across the board in the Naval services of the United Kingdom but as far as I know, the RAF and Army use the pronunciation I mentioned above. I hope this helps in future videos
I remember one of these coming into Fairchild AFB, WA. What a bizarre looking aircraft I thought, but beautiful in its ugliness. Between the Victor and the Vulcan, the Brits produced some very unique aircraft.
The crescent-wing design evolved from an early 'tailless' concept that was abandoned.
The Victor was menacingly elegant.
One caught fire on the runway at RAF Marham in the 1980, a tanker full of fuel I believe - big blaze but no one killed.
XL232, 15 October 1982
The best looking of the V bombers in my opinion
guess the Handley Page engineers just happen to run out of imagination!!!
Perhaps you can find a better word than "scary" to describe the terror the aircrew must have felt when they realised they had no hope of survival.
I think the phrase might be "...having a laundry experience" 🤔
A map in relation to the airfield and crash site would be appropriate .
Okay thanks for your comment, I'll take this on board and try to include it in my next video. Thanks :)
You clearly know nothing of our RAF pilots. They are the most professional pilots and crews in the world and you say panic will have set in. I can assure you they were all professional to the end trying to work the problem and save the plane. Remember they have families before you start calling them cowards.
This had a Vulcan intake also. Never heard of this British strategic bomber.
Victor, Valiant and Vulcan. Vulcan continued as a bomber, Valiants became air to air refuelling tankers and Victor faded into obscurity. I think they were withdrawn from service.
@@BigLisaFan The Vulcan Bomber seriously bothered the Soviet Union and WARSAW Pact for sure.
@@byronharano2391 The Vulcans could penetrate Soviet air defences, out manoeuvrer Mig interceptors to deliver their nuclear payload. The Soviets didn't have an effective deterrent. On two occasions, the British V-Force penetrated the US continent, "delivering" their nuclear payload on target in training exercises. The US kept it classified until only a few years ago.
@@BigLisaFan they became air to air refuelers
@@michealmatthews9377 Victors as well as Valiants?
Looks like it has already been wounded in battle and is seeking revenge. Scary stuff... 🤔
.... engines embedded in the wings...... just something about that...... hmmm...
In the days when Britain had private companys building aircraft and only with pencil and slide rule. Britain was great then.
it no longer is - ruined by chair farting speculators ..